NEED Help to see if diamond purchase is good for d/fl/3x diamond

[bmfang]

My wife has to wrestle control of the Chromecast when I'm watching on the big TV lest I end up on one GOG video and then it just continues autoplaying to the next, and the next, and the next, and the...

 

[whitewave]

I'm really going to have to work with @Rhino one day.

 

[bmfang]

I'm really going to have to work with @Rhino one day.

I'm thinking the same. I love the Octavias that they have in their inventory.

 

[foxinsox]

lol I was going to make that comment. Everyone loves GOGs videos

I subscribed to their channel and whenever I have time, I watch the old european ones

 

[whitewave]

Those would be good for me to watch next!

 

[OoohShiny]

I'm thinking the same. I love the Octavias that they have in their inventory.

They haven't got many, unfortunately, but I guess most are custom-cut?

I wish they had more so I could drool over them lol

 

[lucida]

Hello again all,

So I've been doing more research and trying to learn more. Although you all suggested to go to only those few sites, there's this diamond that has caught my eye. I have a few concerns, the top of my list is that they are located in Australia. I don't know how the paypal/ebay laws and protection works internationally and if I'm protected. So here's the link to the diamond on Ebay (I hope none of you beat me to it). I want to be as honest about it to see if there are any red flags. I'm going to try to negotiate it down if it's worth it.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/FLAWLESS-2-...E-EX-GIA-CERT-BEST-MONEY-CAN-BUY/162516354619
with this description:
THE DIAMOND IS A 2.47 CARAT BRILLIANT CUT, COLOR IS 'D' THE CLARITY IS FLAWLESS AND THE CUT,SYMMETRY AND THE POLISH ARE ALL GRADED AS TRIPLE EXCELLENT, FLUORESCENCE NONE, WE ARE PROVIDING THE ORIGINAL GIA CERTIFICATE AND A CURRENT JEWELRY VALUATION.


I was looking for AGS only diamonds, but the specs on this seem to be pretty good and an HCA score of 1.1. I requested the ASET image and waited a week. He said he's have it last week, however he just sent me the following message:
"
Hi there, i have talked to 3 other jewelers about getting a ideal scope done and they all told me the same thing and that is once the stone has a GIA cert thats as good as it gets a GIA cert is the highest regarded cert you can get, that is why they laser inscribe them, i have spoken to my partner and he will drop the price to $102,000 and cover postage and insurance with fed ex, and we guarantee the diamond is as described or your money back, Thanks Grant"

By the way the currency he's stating is in Australian dollars I am not so sure he's correct on his statements.
My other reservation about this that I asked him about the diamond being FL and the fact that it was mounted might have damaged it or will with some wear down to an IF, he gave me this response:
"Hi there, yes we had the diamond valued as an unmounted stone, then we made the new setting for the ring,the clarity remains as Flawless as we have taken the utmost care with it,yes i will let you re. the ideal scope tommorow thanks Grant"
So is there anything else I can ask or be careful about? It is slightly smalled (looking at it with the naked eye about 1mm smaller and over half a carat smaller for about the same price), hopefully he can go down a little, however the specs look wonderful to me, but that's why i'm here. I'm sure I'll be educated now with all the problems of this diamond and/or transaction. Have you heard of this seller before? Any ideas as to yes/no on this transaction? Thank you all and I'm sorry for the lengthy post...

 

[whitewave]

Hello again all,

So I've been doing more research and trying to learn more. Although you all suggested to go to only those few sites, there's this diamond that has caught my eye. I have a few concerns, the top of my list is that they are located in Australia. I don't know how the paypal/ebay laws and protection works internationally and if I'm protected. So here's the link to the diamond on Ebay (I hope none of you beat me to it). I want to be as honest about it to see if there are any red flags. I'm going to try to negotiate it down if it's worth it.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/FLAWLESS-2-...E-EX-GIA-CERT-BEST-MONEY-CAN-BUY/162516354619
with this description:
THE DIAMOND IS A 2.47 CARAT BRILLIANT CUT, COLOR IS 'D' THE CLARITY IS FLAWLESS AND THE CUT,SYMMETRY AND THE POLISH ARE ALL GRADED AS TRIPLE EXCELLENT, FLUORESCENCE NONE, WE ARE PROVIDING THE ORIGINAL GIA CERTIFICATE AND A CURRENT JEWELRY VALUATION.


I was looking for AGS only diamonds, but the specs on this seem to be pretty good and an HCA score of 1.1. I requested the ASET image and waited a week. He said he's have it last week, however he just sent me the following message:
"
Hi there, i have talked to 3 other jewelers about getting a ideal scope done and they all told me the same thing and that is once the stone has a GIA cert thats as good as it gets a GIA cert is the highest regarded cert you can get, that is why they laser inscribe them, i have spoken to my partner and he will drop the price to $102,000 and cover postage and insurance with fed ex, and we guarantee the diamond is as described or your money back, Thanks Grant"

By the way the currency he's stating is in Australian dollars I am not so sure he's correct on his statements.
My other reservation about this that I asked him about the diamond being FL and the fact that it was mounted might have damaged it or will with some wear down to an IF, he gave me this response:
"Hi there, yes we had the diamond valued as an unmounted stone, then we made the new setting for the ring,the clarity remains as Flawless as we have taken the utmost care with it,yes i will let you re. the ideal scope tommorow thanks Grant"
So is there anything else I can ask or be careful about? It is slightly smalled (looking at it with the naked eye about 1mm smaller and over half a carat smaller for about the same price), hopefully he can go down a little, however the specs look wonderful to me, but that's why i'm here. I'm sure I'll be educated now with all the problems of this diamond and/or transaction. Have you heard of this seller before? Any ideas as to yes/no on this transaction? Thank you all and I'm sorry for the lengthy post...

If you want to give your money to someone who just totally lied to you, then I suppose that is you business. I personally wouldn't do business with a liar.

 

[lucida]

If you want to give your money to someone who just totally lied to you, then I suppose that is you business. I personally wouldn't do business with a liar.

Which part are you referring to?

 

[whitewave]

Why wouldn't you buy this diamond? https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3839970.htm

 

[whitewave]

Which part are you referring to?

"Hi there, i have talked to 3 other jewelers about getting a ideal scope done and they all told me the same thing and that is once the stone has a GIA cert thats as good as it gets a GIA cert is the highest regarded cert you can get, that is why they laser inscribe them"

This is a lie.

The number 3 is also the "liar's 3". Liars lie in 3's. He didn't speak to 3 jewelers-- that is also a lie.

 

[Tophat1]

The cut is no good (crown angle too shallow) and the seller is either a liar or an idiot

 

[bmfang]

Sorry, this guy is just BS'ing you. You still seem to be looking for "a deal" and haven't learnt anything of what we have been trying to say to you over the last few weeks). And this guy's eBay handle (getsmartloan) gives me an impression that he is a pawnbroker.

Proportions on the stone are off in my books. Very shallow crown (32.5) by super ideal standards with a slightly deep pavilion (41). Trying to be a 60/60 stone as well (59 table, 60 depth).

AUD105k works out to be around 70-75k USD at current exchange rates using my head. You can do far better. You will not have any upgrade options with this and who knows if the stone he is selling actually matches up with the photos he has posted.

Can I ask why you @lucida are hesitant to shop with a PS approved vendor but yet you seem more than willing to drop your cash with an eBay vendor?

 

[lucida]

"Hi there, i have talked to 3 other jewelers about getting a ideal scope done and they all told me the same thing and that is once the stone has a GIA cert thats as good as it gets a GIA cert is the highest regarded cert you can get, that is why they laser inscribe them"

This is a lie.

The number 3 is also the "liar's 3". Liars lie in 3's. He didn't speak to 3 jewelers-- that is also a lie.

You're probably right. I didn't quite like this amateur explanation. I haven't responded to this yet. Where would one get the ASET image? I'm assuming it's it select facilities.

 

[whitewave]

Why would you expect a liar to send you the actual IS image?

 

[lucida]

Sorry, this guy is just BS'ing you. You still seem to be looking for "a deal" and haven't learnt anything of what we have been trying to say to you over the last few weeks). And this guy's eBay handle (getsmartloan) gives me an impression that he is a pawnbroker.

Proportions on the stone are off in my books. Very shallow crown (32.5) by super ideal standards with a slightly deep pavilion (41). Trying to be a 60/60 stone as well (59 table, 60 depth).

AUD105k works out to be around 70-75k USD at current exchange rates using my head. You can do far better. You will not have any upgrade options with this and who knows if the stone he is selling actually matches up with the photos he has posted.

Can I ask why you @lucida are hesitant to shop with a PS approved vendor but yet you seem more than willing to drop your cash with an eBay vendor?

Yes he said he was a pawnbroker. I'm not hesitant to work with those vendors, I'd love to, while I'm learning I'm also searching, however the prices are so high. For that 3.11 carat, WF price was about $63k for G/VS quality - wire price. Although I probably can't tell the difference between this and a D color with my naked eye, knowing that it was perfect in every respect is another thing. This would be much more elsewhere.

 

[lucida]

Why would you expect a liar to send you the actual IS image?

that's true too... He was willing to hand deliver it, although I am against that because I'm not a jeweler and having it in my hands won't do me any good. I was to take it to a well known local jeweler for confirmation.

 

[Tophat1]

Yes he said he was a pawnbroker. I'm not hesitant to work with those vendors, I'd love to, while I'm learning I'm also searching, however the prices are so high. For that 3.11 carat, WF price was about $63k for G/VS quality - wire price. Although I probably can't tell the difference between this and a D color with my naked eye, knowing that it was perfect in every respect is another thing. This would be much more elsewhere.

The whiteflash stone that whitewave linked is way less expensive than the Australian stone, similar carat weight, and WAY better cut (and therefore more beautiful to the eye). VS will be eye clean and F colorless, so no need to get D IF

 

[bmfang]

If you expect a pawnbroker to tell you decent gemological advice, you are sorely mistaken in the vast majority of cases. The extent of his knowledge is that the higher the colour and clarity, the better the "quality" and more "stunning" the diamond will be (the listing notes reflect that type of thinking). It will not be. Cut overrules the other 3 C's because the other three are natural but the last is (for the most part) entirely at the discretion of man-/woman-/human-kind. And a large number of cutters work to retaining weight rather than cutting for beauty.

Most Australian jewellers will not have even heard of an IdealScope or ASET. Those that do know about these two tools, would tell you to use them and not just rely on a Triple Excellent grading from GIA.

Yes, you will be "mind clean" having a stone that is IF. But if it is NOT cut well, it will look like sh*t compared to a stone that has more "flaws" but is cut properly to super-ideal standards. The photos he has taken of the ring look half decent under the jewellery store lighting he has the stone sitting under. More than likely once you view it in diffused lighting conditions, it will not be anywhere near as brilliant as he describes it as being.

 

[Gussie]

Lucida, you seem to want to play the haggle game and fool yourself onto thinking you got a good deal. If you buy from a reputable ps vetted/recommended vendor you WILL GET good deal and you won't be scammed by these ebayers who are less than forthcoming with the truth.

 

[LLJsmom]

@whitewave @bmfang @Tophat1 @ceg You guys have the patience of saints. So patient to explain and reason. @lucida yiu seem like a nice and sincere person which is why I hate to see you get taken. But to read about you considering these sketchy sellers for a 5-6 digit purchase makes me want to gouge my left eye out with a rusted spoon. I'll say it one more time only. Go with a PS trusted vendor. Given your propensity to wander off on your own, that is the safest route for you. I've said my piece and will do my best to only spectate on this thread, and continue to applaud the efforts of some PSers who have been very generous with their time and energy. All the best to you.

 

[SimoneDi]

I haven't been really involved in this thread, but I just wanted to say that I 100% agree with everything LLJsmom said. I literally wanted to pull my hair when I saw your latest eBay "find" - please just DONT. WF, BDG, GOG, CBI, IDJewelry are your best and only options for getting a fair value. If pre-loved, then - jewels by grace, loveaffairdiamonds. If preloved and WF, BDG or CBI only, then maybe you can do loupetroop or diamondbistro. Delete the eBay app from your phone and just stop thinking that you will get a good deal. You are killing the majority of people on this thread! Or just get a nice big shiny D/flawless CZ from wink and call it a day!

 

[whitewave]

@whitewave @bmfang @Tophat1 @ceg You guys have the patience of saints. So patient to explain and reason. @lucida yiu seem like a nice and sincere person which is why I hate to see you get taken. But to read about you considering these sketchy sellers for a 5-6 digit purchase makes me want to gouge my left eye out with a rusted spoon. I'll say it one more time only. Go with a PS trusted vendor. Given your propensity to wander off on your own, that is the safest route for you. I've said my piece and will do my best to only spectate on this thread, and continue to applaud the efforts of some PSers who have been very generous with their time and energy. All the best to you.

I am fatigued and am hopping off of this post now. Lucida, good luck with your purchases!

 

[december-fire]

lucida,

Please spend $2,000 on a plane ticket and hotel for a couple of nights, and go visit Whiteflash.

Phone them in advance, and let them know you'd like to see their ACA diamonds in various colours (e.g., F, G, H, I) and sizes (perhaps in the 2 carat and 3 carat range).

This relatively small expenditure will let you:
- see their ACA diamonds in person so you can see the performance of a top-cut diamond;
- determine your personal preference regarding diamond colour, and
- decide what carat weight looks best to you on your own hand.

Purchasing an ACA diamond (Whiteflash's top-of-the-line brand of diamond), ensures that you are getting a top-quality diamond, from a trusted and reputable source, with a return period, a buy-back period, an upgrade policy, and valid documentation certifying the specifications of the diamond.

However, whether or not you purchase from Whiteflash, you will learn a lot by taking two or three days to go visit them. Hopefully, you'll see that their prices are justified for the quality of product and service they provide.

Checking out ebay or pawn dealers is not part of the learning process.
It is a waste of time, adds misinformation or 'noise' to the learning process, adds unnecessary stress, and presents a serious financial threat to you.

So, please, call WF and book flights and hotel.

Like other PS members (other than those with 'Trade' appearing in their posts), I have no business association of any kind with WF or any of the other recommended vendors. I gain or lose nothing based on your decision. I just want you to get value for your money.

 

[MollyMalone]

Hello again all,
So I've been doing more research and trying to learn more. Although you all suggested to go to only those few sites, there's this diamond that has caught my eye. I have a few concerns, the top of my list is that they are located in Australia. I don't know how the paypal/ebay laws and protection works internationally and if I'm protected. * * *

that's true too... He was willing to hand deliver it, although I am against that because I'm not a jeweler and having it in my hands won't do me any good. I was to take it to a well known local jeweler for confirmation.

May I ask where you live, lucida; I didn't think it was Australia until the post saying that the pawnbroker in Kensington, Australia was willing to make a hand delivery, so now I'm confused.

If you give us a more particularized idea of where you live (e.g., city and state, if in the US), we might be able to steer you to one or more relatively convenient bricks-and-mortar stores that carry both "super ideal" cut diamonds and those that are well cut, but don't fall into that highly elite category. At this juncture, you're obviously not thinking there's a distinguishable difference worth paying for. After you've spent a fair amount of time viewing a variety of stones -- in a variety of lighting conditions -- the difference should not be abstract.

Of course, it's possible that after seeing the difference, you still won't be impressed enough to buy a super ideal. Although that's nigh heresy on this forum, it is your money. At least then, your decision to not purchase a super ideal would be a more considered, informed (as in see-for-yourself) one.

 

[SimoneDi]

Yes he said he was a pawnbroker. I'm not hesitant to work with those vendors, I'd love to, while I'm learning I'm also searching, however the prices are so high. For that 3.11 carat, WF price was about $63k for G/VS quality - wire price. Although I probably can't tell the difference between this and a D color with my naked eye, knowing that it was perfect in every respect is another thing. This would be much more elsewhere.

No, no, it wouldn't - you don't even know what you are buying!!!! Crayyyyyyy-ziness! Please define "perfect"? "Perfect", when it comes to diamonds, means different things to different people. Some favor size, some favor color, others want "mind clean", what you seem to be after is D/IF. Ok, fine, here is one- https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3204378.htm please buy this and not the eBay scam you are considering. You don't even seem to care about size. If you want a D/IF, then please get it from a reputable vendor with a great trade up policy, so that if you ever change your mind regarding D/IF, you can trade it up because, I am sorry to say this, but no one will buy it on the secondary market, most people are after "value", not attributes which cannot be appreciated by the naked eye. I seriously wish you all the best, but know that you are better off buying a Birkin bag than that "deal" of a diamond.

 

[MollyMalone]

Another thought... maybe you shouldn't spend most of your savings on a diamond? Here's why I'm tossing out this possibility for your consideration. The latest eBay diamond is a GIA-graded D, Flawless: the same 2 basic characteristics that feature in your header for this thread, and where you said fairly early on that you viewed the would-be purchase largely as an investment. So I'm thinking you're still of that high color, high clarity mindset because you're still thinking "investment," as you viewed it more than a month ago.

In the weeks since, what's seemed to excite you is the (very remote) possibility of getting a great deal, not manifest pleasure in diamonds themselves. So perhaps there's something else that would give you greater, true joy -- and that's where more of your money should be allocated?

 

[lucida]

Wow, 100% of you have the same negative response. I don't go searching. I have a few searches on EBay and when the keywords are met, the items are emailed to me. That's how this came about. I sort of looked at the parameters and the Hca performance and saw it was also d fl. I don't know how much this type of diamond would cost as the only d/fl diamond on WF is 1.1 ct for $25k! As I said I'm learning and cut is above everything else, but I thought this cut was really well and the icing is that it was d/fl. Sorry to be causing pain for some of you and I seem really amateur (which I am compared to the rest of you). I don't trust people anymore and I rely on this community. I really want to maximize my purchase and get the best that I can. I can't blow off this money I worked so hard for. Please excuse me... I'll continue my research. I haven't had much time to see those YouTube videos. Matter what though, I'll never be as good as any of you. I'll try not to sway off and search anywhere but the trusted sites.

 

[lucida]

I'm in the Los Angeles area btw. That seller wanted to hand deliver it

 

[LLJsmom]

I'm in the Los Angeles area btw. That seller wanted to hand deliver it

I am so weak!!! I said I wouldn't respond!! Lucida, go visit Victor Canera because he cuts precision cut diamonds. He is in downtown LA. I am NOT saying buy from him. But go look at his diamonds cause those are very well cut. Look at his website and you can see the ASET images for his stones. Call and make an appointment.
https://www.victorcanera.com/

His settings are stunning but that is beside the point.