Leon Mege owners - did you get a LM box?

[TravelingGal]

Date: 8/2/2008 3:16:07 PM
Author: Elegant

Date: 8/2/2008 2:57:07 PM
Author: Green with Envy
For goodness sakes- I am just pointing out that I am disappointed to read snide comments Leon is rude, stingy, a jerk, etc when we are talking about the BOX. It came up before in the thread about the emerald cut for sale on his website. I said it there and I say it here... no one ever goes to LM for the box.

Hi!

My question is - why does Leon make such a big deal about the box himself...?

You referred to the emerald cut ring that he had for sale and he mentioned that the Leon box wouldn''t be included...I think that just in and of itself makes people question things because he is making a big deal out of it. I think he referred to the ring as one he was testing out for HW, so I just assumed since that was the case, he didn''t want that ring associated with his name, therefore no box...

Just asking...no attitude involved, just sheer curiosity...

He''s an ARTISTE (say with flamboyant flair). Zerefore I must belivf he ees a craaahzee pehrson!

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 8/2/2008 3:17:50 PM
Author: Ellen
Green, this is what you said in your previous post:

''I think it is so very sad that there has been so much LM trashing when there are two sides to every story and Leon does not post on PS to defend himself''


THAT comment is not about boxes. That comment can only be about others stories (and yes, I assumed mine was in there, as you did not post about what you thought of my review until now), and implies there are things not getting told. Which implies some aren''t telling the truth. There''s no other way to read that.

And as I said before, it really isn''t about the box in the big picture. Yes, in here we have certainly questioned the box, along with comments from some other folks about Leon. So what? I think the average person can filter through this thread and take away what''s important.

Lastly, you are dead wrong about my intent to discourage people from working with Leon. I said in my thread, it was not a ''don''t use Leon'' thread, and it wasn''t. I have not said anything in this thread to infer that''s my intent. I think most people understand exactly where I''m coming from.

In closing, it might interest you to know that someone emailed me the other day about them using Leon, after everything I''ve been through. And ya know what? I told them yes, on a couple of conditions.

I know that it isn''t your intent to do that Ellen, and I do understand where you are coming from.

 

[Elegant]

Date: 8/2/2008 3:19:58 PM
Author: TravelingGal

Date: 8/2/2008 3:16:07 PM

Author: Elegant

Date: 8/2/2008 2:57:07 PM

Author: Green with Envy

For goodness sakes- I am just pointing out that I am disappointed to read snide comments Leon is rude, stingy, a jerk, etc when we are talking about the BOX. It came up before in the thread about the emerald cut for sale on his website. I said it there and I say it here... no one ever goes to LM for the box.

Hi!

My question is - why does Leon make such a big deal about the box himself...?

You referred to the emerald cut ring that he had for sale and he mentioned that the Leon box wouldn't be included...I think that just in and of itself makes people question things because he is making a big deal out of it. I think he referred to the ring as one he was testing out for HW, so I just assumed since that was the case, he didn't want that ring associated with his name, therefore no box...

Just asking...no attitude involved, just sheer curiosity...

He's an ARTISTE (say with flamboyant flair). Zerefore I must belivf he ees a craaahzee pehrson!

I know, but I think it makes people feel "less than" because their piece wasn't worth the box...you know?

 

[Ellen]

Date: 8/2/2008 3:12:33 PM
Author: TravelingGal

Ellen, to be fair, there ARE two sides to every story. I thought your story was very fair and tactfully written, especially considering that you were obviously not happy about the situation (and that is HIGHLY obvious, by the way). However we never heard Leon''s side of the story, and that is a fact. I''d be willing to bet though, that his side would probably sound a lot like your side (meaning I don''t think you were being unreasonable).

I don''t think GWE was insinuating you or anyone else wasn''t being honest. Just that we haven''t heard the other side, is all, and that is a fair and correct statement.

It seems that LM is a sensitive topic these days and you shouldn''t have to take umbrage at anything.

Would you be Tgal?

And I wish Leon did post here, though I wonder, would anyone believe the customers side if he did?

 

[Ellen]

Date: 8/2/2008 3:20:40 PM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 8/2/2008 3:17:50 PM
Author: Ellen
Green, this is what you said in your previous post:

''I think it is so very sad that there has been so much LM trashing when there are two sides to every story and Leon does not post on PS to defend himself''


THAT comment is not about boxes. That comment can only be about others stories (and yes, I assumed mine was in there, as you did not post about what you thought of my review until now), and implies there are things not getting told. Which implies some aren''t telling the truth. There''s no other way to read that.

And as I said before, it really isn''t about the box in the big picture. Yes, in here we have certainly questioned the box, along with comments from some other folks about Leon. So what? I think the average person can filter through this thread and take away what''s important.

Lastly, you are dead wrong about my intent to discourage people from working with Leon. I said in my thread, it was not a ''don''t use Leon'' thread, and it wasn''t. I have not said anything in this thread to infer that''s my intent. I think most people understand exactly where I''m coming from.

In closing, it might interest you to know that someone emailed me the other day about them using Leon, after everything I''ve been through. And ya know what? I told them yes, on a couple of conditions.

I know that it isn''t your intent to do that Ellen, and I do understand where you are coming from.

Thank you.

 

[neatfreak]

Just a random note about the "boxes are only for stock pieces" thing. I believe that Leon IS starting to make more stock pieces, and it appears to me from the outside that he is starting to go for the more mass marketed thing. I could be totally wrong, but he's had a few mentions of it on the website that certain rings were made with mass marketing in mind?

Here is a ring that he says is from his first "production line":
http://www.artofplatinum.com/4images/details.php?image_id=393

Could be that he is trying to move away from custom to something more lucrative for him...

So maybe the boxes are a new venture for him, like his mass marketing thing, and that is what they are for? Like when you go to buy a Tacori ring at a jeweler you get a Tacori box...

Not that he shouldn't give out the boxes to everyone, but it might explain why only "stock" pieces get one.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 8/2/2008 3:22:49 PM
Author: Ellen

Date: 8/2/2008 3:12:33 PM
Author: TravelingGal

Ellen, to be fair, there ARE two sides to every story. I thought your story was very fair and tactfully written, especially considering that you were obviously not happy about the situation (and that is HIGHLY obvious, by the way). However we never heard Leon's side of the story, and that is a fact. I'd be willing to bet though, that his side would probably sound a lot like your side (meaning I don't think you were being unreasonable).

I don't think GWE was insinuating you or anyone else wasn't being honest. Just that we haven't heard the other side, is all, and that is a fair and correct statement.

It seems that LM is a sensitive topic these days and you shouldn't have to take umbrage at anything.

Would you be Tgal?

And I wish Leon did post here, though I wonder, would anyone believe the customers side if he did?

Of COURSE I would not be happy.

What I meant by what I said is that you shouldn't have to hide the fact that you aren't happy with him (not sure if you feel thatthat you have to temper your feelings). You should be able to be as snarky as you want, as long as your story was factual to the best of your ability and fair.

If I were you, I would not have ANY problem being snarky, and not pretend to be otherwise nor apologize for nor defend the way I felt.

And yes, I believe plenty of people would believe the customer's side. But at least then we would have an opportunity to form a more balanced opinion, because whether we like it or not, we are only hearing the customer's side of the story.

ETA, It just seems Ellen that you are sensitive to others thinking your story isn't an honest representation and that you have some kind of underlying motive. You posted what you thought was best, it was helpful, and if I were you I wouldn't read into other people's comments too much.

 

[Elegant]

Date: 8/2/2008 3:25:27 PM
Author: neatfreak
Just a random note about the ''boxes are only for stock pieces'' thing. I believe that Leon IS starting to make more stock pieces, and it appears to me from the outside that he is starting to go for the more mass marketed thing. I could be totally wrong, but he''s had a few mentions of it on the website that certain rings were made with mass marketing in mind? I can''t find the ring now but there was a plain solitaire that had this message below it for awhile...

So maybe the boxes are a new venture for him, like his mass marketing thing, and that is what they are for? Like when you go to buy a Tacori ring at a jeweler you get a Tacori box?

Not that he shouldn''t give out the boxes to everyone, but it might explain why only ''stock'' pieces get one?

But you would think that ANY piece he was involved in, even custom rings, etc. would get a Leon box - because he made it...

 

[RxTechRN2b]

I don''t think this thread is about the physical box itself. I don''t care about boxes and don''t keep them -- and I got very nice ones from T&Co, Longines, etc. This thread is talking about the value Leon places on the very people who contribute to his wealthy livelihood. How does he treat them on the phone and when they want to work out a detail on THEIR ring? Does he have a condescending attitude that says "Who are you to ''micromanage'' and tell me how the ring will look?" Who does he feel deserves a nice box, and who gets a baggie or "made in china" cheapy? If the ring does not turn out as expected and the PAYING customer says so, does he change it to meet what was originally agreed upon, or does he rant and rave over the phone until the customer is left in tears? So what if he does pretty work -- he''s not the only fish in the sea! I don''t care about the box per se, but I do care about the entire presentation package. And that''s what this is about.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 8/2/2008 3:26:28 PM
Author: TravelingGal

Of COURSE I would not be happy.

What I meant by what I said is that you shouldn''t have to hide the fact that you aren''t happy with him (not sure if you feel thatthat you have to temper your feelings). You should be able to be as snarky as you want, as long as your story was factual to the best of your ability and fair.

If I were you, I would not have ANY problem being snarky, and not pretend to be otherwise nor apologize for nor defend the way I felt.

And yes, I believe plenty of people would believe the customer''s side. But at least then we would have an opportunity to form a more balanced opinion, because whether we like it or not, we are only hearing the customer''s side of the story.

Ok, gotcha, thanks. Misunderstood your post!

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 8/2/2008 3:29:59 PM
Author: RxTechRN2b
I don''t think this thread is about the physical box itself. I don''t care about boxes and don''t keep them -- and I got very nice ones from T&Co, Longines, etc. This thread is talking about the value Leon places on the very people who contribute to his wealthy livelihood. How does he treat them on the phone and when they want to work out a detail on THEIR ring? Does he have a condescending attitude that says ''Who are you to ''micromanage'' and tell me how the ring will look?'' Who does he feel deserves a nice box, and who gets a baggie or ''made in china'' cheapy? If the ring does not turn out as expected and the PAYING customer says so, does he change it to meet what was originally agreed upon, or does he rant and rave over the phone until the customer is left in tears? So what if he does pretty work -- he''s not the only fish in the sea! I don''t care about the box per se, but I do care about the entire presentation package. And that''s what this is about.

You are correct Rx. Which is why this thread is so helpful.

So now we now you will most likely get a crap box and may be POSSIBLY get a crap BAG. Is this someone you want to do business with? You decide.

But if you DO decide to do business with him, you know what you are getting. Leon is what he is. While I think it''s kind of lame to do business the way he does it, it''s his business to run how he chooses. You don''t like it? Go somewhere else. You''ll be happier and most likely so will he.

 

[Green with Envy]

Ellen- maybe it is better for me to address my thoughts of your aqua review on that thread instead of this BOX thread. I will do that when I get a chance. In short- I appreciate that you spoke to Leon directly about his tone on the phone and he apologized. Done. Yet you go on about the scratch and I understand anyone would be sad about a scratch... but this could happen with ANY vendor and he did offer to polish and reset. Sucks, but that is the risk the CUSTOMER assumes.

In THIS thread, you make it pretty clear that you are disappointed with the overall experience with Leon. You say it is not really about the damn box, but the whole package. or lack of.

it does not mean a hill of beans to me that you encouraged someone in a private email to use Leon under certain conditions. It just matters to me what is said in this public forum when others read and do no consider the OTHER SIDE of the story.

I am not saying one story is truthful and correct when the other side is dishonest. I just mean that each person's story and interpretation is seen with different eyes or viewpoint. The FACTS might be the same... but the interpretations can be very different. Maybe YOU insulted Leon and he thought YOU were rude when you called him in the final hour about the width because your need for clarification and reassurance sounded to him that you were questioning/ insulting his artistic judgment.



One of the posts above is a perfect example of someone who, in my own opinion, has negatively judged Leon due to the overall recent reviews that, in my opinion, crosses the line of objectivity to trashing. CR's crying and insistence that LM re-do her ring is just ludicrous and obviously her one sided drama influenced others.

I find the box debate to be ridiculous because the box doesn't mean anything. If you get a nice one- you are important and if you get a plastic bag you are not? gee wiz. How insecure can some people be. I agree that LM just does not CARE about the box. he only cares about the jewelry.

It is just frustrating when PS gets all catty and bitchy about a box or whatever because originally people think they are sharing their opinions objectively... yet it digresses. it happened in this thread and it has happened in many others.

i do not mean to offend anyone and, like I said, I should probably be specific in individual threads and not make blanket statements that can so easily be misinterpreted.



I DO see that some people expect a nice box and if you do- don't go to Leon. And don't go to LM if you want some style that is NOT represented by the pictures on his website. Like I said- no vendor can please all.

 

[Elegant]

Date: 8/2/2008 4:43:47 PM
Author: Green with Envy
I find the box debate to be ridiculous because the box doesn't mean anything. If you get a nice one- you are important and if you get a plastic bag you are not? gee wiz. How insecure can some people be. I agree that LM just does not CARE about the box. he only cares about the jewelry.

But he does care about the box - and cares who he gives it to and why - and that was evident on the old EC ring he advertised. I don't think it has to do with people being insecure or not. I think with people's experiences in general, when you buy a piece of jewelry, it comes in a nice presentational (is that a word?

) box...it is just expected over years and years and years of purchasing from other vendors...but, now we all know, thanks to the OP, that if you buy from Leon, you will not receive a nice presentation box, so while you are waiting for your piece to be made or be shipped, go to some other site and pay additional cashola for a nifty box...if you want one, but don't expect it from him. That's all, case closed, right?

And of course, the box may mean nothing to you, but apparently it means something to other people, which is fine either way...just know what to expect, and if the box does mean a lot, then maybe he isn't the vendor for that particular person. Right?

The OP started this thread as a way to determine if others had received their pieces in a crappy box, as per her experience. As we all have come to find out, all but one person received either a bag or cheap box. So, buy from Leon = no nifty box.

 

[CrookedRock]

Date: 8/2/2008 4:43:47 PM
Author: Green with Envy

One of the posts above is a perfect example of someone who, in my own opinion, has negatively judged Leon due to the overall recent reviews that, in my opinion, crosses the line of objectivity to trashing. CR''s crying and insistence that LM re-do her ring is just ludicrous and obviously her one sided drama influenced others.

Did you even read my thread? I think you are out of line Green.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 8/2/2008 4:43:47 PM
Author: Green with Envy
Ellen- maybe it is better for me to address my thoughts of your aqua review on that thread instead of this BOX thread. I will do that when I get a chance. In short- I appreciate that you spoke to Leon directly about his tone on the phone and he apologized. Done. Yet you go on about the scratch and I understand anyone would be sad about a scratch... but this could happen with ANY vendor and he did offer to polish and reset. Sucks, but that is the risk the CUSTOMER assumes.

In THIS thread, you make it pretty clear that you are disappointed with the overall experience with Leon. You say it is not really about the damn box, but the whole package. or lack of.

it does not mean a hill of beans to me that you encouraged someone in a private email to use Leon under certain conditions. It just matters to me what is said in this public forum when others read and do no consider the OTHER SIDE of the story.

I am not saying one story is truthful and correct when the other side is dishonest. I just mean that each person's story and interpretation is seen with different eyes or viewpoint. The FACTS might be the same... but the interpretations can be very different. Maybe YOU insulted Leon and he thought YOU were rude when you called him in the final hour about the width because your need for clarification and reassurance sounded to him that you were questioning/ insulting his artistic judgment.

Wow.

No need to respond, I'll just let this sit on its own.

But you really do need to read more thoroughly and get all your facts straight before responding. My post and CR's both.

 

[Kaleigh]

Date: 8/2/2008 3:24:22 PM
Author: Ellen

Date: 8/2/2008 3:20:40 PM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 8/2/2008 3:17:50 PM
Author: Ellen
Green, this is what you said in your previous post:

''I think it is so very sad that there has been so much LM trashing when there are two sides to every story and Leon does not post on PS to defend himself''


THAT comment is not about boxes. That comment can only be about others stories (and yes, I assumed mine was in there, as you did not post about what you thought of my review until now), and implies there are things not getting told. Which implies some aren''t telling the truth. There''s no other way to read that.

And as I said before, it really isn''t about the box in the big picture. Yes, in here we have certainly questioned the box, along with comments from some other folks about Leon. So what? I think the average person can filter through this thread and take away what''s important.

Lastly, you are dead wrong about my intent to discourage people from working with Leon. I said in my thread, it was not a ''don''t use Leon'' thread, and it wasn''t. I have not said anything in this thread to infer that''s my intent. I think most people understand exactly where I''m coming from.

In closing, it might interest you to know that someone emailed me the other day about them using Leon, after everything I''ve been through. And ya know what? I told them yes, on a couple of conditions.

I know that it isn''t your intent to do that Ellen, and I do understand where you are coming from.

Thank you.

Add me, yes I know that wasn''t your intent Ellen. Hope all is well with you. I am away, so am out of the loop so to speak.

 

[Green with Envy]

Out of line, CR? It would be fair to make comments on your thread- but since a poster mentioned it here... I objected to it here.

Honestly, i got tired of reading your thread for a ton of reasons that are quite obvious to others so it is not even worth explaining.

Anyone who has no idea why I would call some of the CR drama ludicrous can just ignore my post.

So, yes, ellen, I have enough of the facts and then there is all the drama and bitching and whining that gets fueled by all sorts of other posters who may or may not have a clue.



Or one talks from one side of their mouth in one thread and then joins some other band wagon in another. I understand you did your best to be fair and objective with an emotional issue around your aqua and maybe you just were side tracked by the box topic.



Thus... explains why so many are lurkers...a stated opinion can be exhausting!

 

[Harriet]

I don't care about the freaking box. I do care about quality and price (to me, Leon's prices are reasonable). If I'd wanted a fancy schmancy experience, and box, I'd go to Cartier/Graff/HW and overpay. Then, I'd kick myself for a long time.

El,
Green is not implying that you weren't telling the truth. She's just stating that there are two sides to every story. For what is worth, I believe you.
P.S. I'm not defending Green because she's my pal. We disagree a lot.

 

[purrfectpear]

Leon''s prices are indeed reasonable. When I first started lurking here I just assumed he was mega expense since some posts alluded to that. In spite of it, I did ask him to quote two different styles, and I also asked Whiteflash to quote. I was amazed to discover that Leon was less expensive. I ended up putting the whole mount off and now I''m used to my tiffany style solitaire so it''s moot.

Now I have a new EC that I want to have reset. I''m still trying to decide on style (I''m all over the place, you should see my picture file

) but Leon is still under consideration. I would tell him I''m not having the ziplock baggie thing though, and if he got offended...too bad. If I go with Leon I would expect to have a terrific ring and I''d post here. If for some reason I had a negative experience, I would post about it. If GWE had issues with that...well, that would be too darn bad too

I really, really love Leon''s artistry. I am disappointed to hear when others have bad experiences (colored by drama or not), no one should have to fight it out with their jeweler.
I suspect that with Leon it''s vitally important to have everything, and I mean every SINGLE thing written on the work order. Then there is no room for interpretation. It either IS or it ISN''T. Just my .02

 

[MonkeyPie]

Date: 8/2/2008 6:17:06 PM
Author: Green with Envy
Out of line, CR? It would be fair to make comments on your thread- but since a poster mentioned it here... I objected to it here.


Honestly, i got tired of reading your thread for a ton of reasons that are quite obvious to others so it is not even worth explaining.

Then you shouldn''t have read it.
Or if you felt you absolutely must, then you should actually READ it, as opposed to just getting annoyed by blatant honesty, which, btw, is VERY appreciated by the majority. You not included.

I kind of feel like the box thread has gotten out of hand, though I understand why it was started. It seems weird that Leon picks and chooses who gets a box, and who doesn''t. It obviously has little to do with the amount of money spent, and more to do with personalities. I figure if you send him a picture and let him have free reign over the design, then you get a nice box...because he seems to loathe "discussing" anything.

 

[Harriet]

Purr,
You are right. Every detail should be on the final work order. Leon constantly receives calls and e-mails adding or changing details, and his assistants may not always be on top of things.

MonkeyPie,
The infamous box has nothing to do with amount spent or personality, as I stated above. Also, Leon is not averse to discussion. I'm not infrequently in his office bouncing ideas off him for long-term projects.

 

[Deelight]

Date: 8/2/2008 10:19:55 PM
Author: Harriet
Purr,

You are right. Every detail should be on the final work order. Leon constantly receives calls and e-mails adding or changing details, and his assistants may not always be on top of things.

Ditto, I worked for a company that specialised in custom work and our orders had to be meticulous and list every final little detail, from when it left my hands (at order stage) at least 5 other her people would have some kind of hand in the production so if it was not written on that original order it was not done and the customer would have no recourse to get it changed.

 

[littlelysser]

I've followed all of the threads regarding Leon...because I am absolutely in love with his artistry and just dismayed at the way he treats his customers. I'm not sure I'd ever use him. But that isn't why I'm posting here.

I've stayed out of the discussions, but I feel as though I have to say that the argument that PSers are only hearing one side of the story is of very little value.

This is a public forum. If Leon wanted or cared to tell his side of the story, well, he would. The only person who could possibly tell the "other side of the story" has simply chosen not to do so. I'm sure you are aware that Whiteflash, Good Old Gold and several other merchants have representatives that are active posters on this site. They address customer concerns and provide information.

I'm not saying that Leon needs to do that. But the fact that he has not come on PS, or asked another to represent him on PS, should not impact the way Ellen, CR, and others discuss their experience with Leon.

We are only hearing one side of the story because Leon has chosen not to tell the other.

 

[Harriet]

You''re right. Unfortunately, Leon is understaffed. Also, he refrains from reading PS because he doesn''t want to be upset. I''m not saying that''s the correct approach. Maybe it should be chalked up to his "artistic temperament."

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 8/2/2008 11:20:39 AM
Author: Green with Envy
I flew through this thread and appreciate there are a few people who understand that you do not go to LM for the BOX. I think it is so very sad that there has been so much LM trashing when there are two sides to every story and Leon does not post on PS to defend himself. If you want to be wined and dined and marketed to and pay the price- buy your ring at Harry Winston''s and get an awesome box. I understand that some people want the luxury experience of the presentation and that is fine. However that has never been the reason why anyone past or present has done business with Leon. If you go through pics and reviews over the years... Leon hands down has the most amazing and beautiful works of art. Sure, there are other great vendors on PS, but no one else has their own thread in SMTR with as many consistently jaw dropping masterpieces.

I have had Leon make 3 pieces for me and I would go back to him in a heart beat if the look I wanted fell in line with his classic style and/or micropave. I have also purchased from WF, GOG, Maytal Hannah, Ari at Single Stone so I believe I have an experienced voice. No vender can be all things to all customers so those who find it at the top of their priority list to get a rockin'' box- personally I love the red ones from Cartier!

If you find yourself dreaming about a LM Piece de Resistance seen here on PS or his website.... try to filter all the stories and reconsider if the BOX is what matters.

Please actually read the thread and the people you are berating before posting such sweeping comments.

Since I am one you seem to be replying to, I will clarify:

My post was MY opinion - and I felt I explained my motivations clearly.
For ME, not having a simple photo before having a piece shipped to Australia is inconvenient. Having the chance of a piece damaged in shipping as it was packaged in a baggie or cheap box is also inconvenient.
And having a hard time while spending my/my partners'' hard earned money on a luxury item is just plain unattractive.!

This doesn''t mean I need to be "wined and dined" or am insecure or any of what you have suggested. It simply means I, as the customer, do expect and appreciate a certain amount of respect and consistency.

This thread is not simply about "the Box" as an inanimate object as you imply - Elegant makes an excellent point - why does Leon himself make such a big deal about it?

You are right in one thing - one vendor can not be all things for all customers, agreed whole heartedly. I don''t recall anyone suggesting that LM should or could be?
Which is why *I* said that unless there are signs of change, or we can come to agreement as vendor and consumer what is suitable, *I* am no longer that keen on using LM.
I fail to see how this constitutes bashing?

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 8/2/2008 2:46:14 AM
Author: babysteps

Date: 8/1/2008 9:53:22 AM
Author: arjunajane

Babysteps, I did read the reasoning before I posted.


May I please ask your opinion then, for someone like myself - if I were purchasing a ring from Australia - would you think it fair then that I pay $75 for his choice of professional photographer, just so I can see what *my* ring looks like before having it shipped across the world?

I would think an amature 5 min pic, not a ''week long photo shoot'' would suffice for that purpose, and I''m just saying that perhaps leaving that as an option would''ve been more practical and customer-friendly..?

Arjunajane - I can totally understand wanting a photo, especially from a distance, and agree it''s definitely more customer-friendly. But also see the viewpoint (and practical reasons) for not wanting to provide one - an amateurish photo potentially creates problems, a great photo is potentially time-consuming, and time is money. I think it''s not a question of fairness so much - more a question of whether the services being offered by a vendor will meet an individual''s needs, and if not, it''s a mismatch. JMO, though

ETA: sorry, can''t get the quote box to work!



Babysteps, TY for your reply. As per what I''ve highlighted I think we''re essentially in agreement, just with differing POV

I guess I just thought that a book deal and your customer services could be easier separated than merged, but hey who am I to say so!

Just for the record, does anyone know if Leon has changed his website to using the new photos yet? Because if so, personally I can''t tell the difference.!
I thought the old photos looked awesome, and never would''ve known they were amature had this issue not come up.

And I couldn''t get the quote to work either, lol!

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 8/3/2008 12:26:35 AM
Author: littlelysser
I''ve followed all of the threads regarding Leon...because I am absolutely in love with his artistry and just dismayed at the way he treats his customers. I''m not sure I''d ever use him. But that isn''t why I''m posting here.

I''ve stayed out of the discussions, but I feel as though I have to say that the argument that PSers are only hearing one side of the story is of very little value.

This is a public forum. If Leon wanted or cared to tell his side of the story, well, he would. The only person who could possibly tell the ''other side of the story'' has simply chosen not to do so. I''m sure you are aware that Whiteflash, Good Old Gold and several other merchants have representatives that are active posters on this site. They address customer concerns and provide information.

I''m not saying that Leon needs to do that. But the fact that he has not come on PS, or asked another to represent him on PS, should not impact the way Ellen, CR, and others discuss their experience with Leon.

We are only hearing one side of the story because Leon has chosen not to tell the other.

well said.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 8/3/2008 12:26:35 AM
Author: littlelysser
I''ve followed all of the threads regarding Leon...because I am absolutely in love with his artistry and just dismayed at the way he treats his customers. I''m not sure I''d ever use him. But that isn''t why I''m posting here.

I''ve stayed out of the discussions, but I feel as though I have to say that the argument that PSers are only hearing one side of the story is of very little value.

This is a public forum. If Leon wanted or cared to tell his side of the story, well, he would. The only person who could possibly tell the ''other side of the story'' has simply chosen not to do so. I''m sure you are aware that Whiteflash, Good Old Gold and several other merchants have representatives that are active posters on this site. They address customer concerns and provide information.

I''m not saying that Leon needs to do that. But the fact that he has not come on PS, or asked another to represent him on PS, should not impact the way Ellen, CR, and others discuss their experience with Leon.

We are only hearing one side of the story because Leon has chosen not to tell the other.

No, it should not. I feel badly for anyone who feel they can''t share their story without being torn or analyzed to shreds (although I can understand sometimes why that happens too).

But regardless of why Leon hasn''t chosen to tell his side, we are only hearing one side of the story, period. Potential customers should keep that in mind.

(Hm...Littlelysser, did I just take what you wrote and essentially just say the same thing backwards? You know what I mean, right?

)

 

[RxTechRN2b]

Controversial threads like this make me think, and that''s always a good thing. So I''ve been thinking about this Leon fellow and what he would say if he made an appearance on this thread. Here is what I''ve come up with:

Leon is an artist. When he creates a piece of jewelry that bears his name, he wants the end result to look like HIS style and HIS work. When the customer commissions him but then micromanages every little last tiny detail, the finished piece might bear little resemblance to what HE finds balanced and beautiful. In other words, he might not be very proud to put his mark on it. And that could be the customer who does not receive an LM luxury box. That could also be the customer who is on the receiving end of a Leon temper-tantrum. As for the photos, he might not want to release them due to possible theft of his creative ideas.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 8/3/2008 12:26:35 AM
Author: littlelysser
I've followed all of the threads regarding Leon...because I am absolutely in love with his artistry and just dismayed at the way he treats his customers. I'm not sure I'd ever use him. But that isn't why I'm posting here.

I've stayed out of the discussions, but I feel as though I have to say that the argument that PSers are only hearing one side of the story is of very little value.

This is a public forum. If Leon wanted or cared to tell his side of the story, well, he would. The only person who could possibly tell the 'other side of the story' has simply chosen not to do so. I'm sure you are aware that Whiteflash, Good Old Gold and several other merchants have representatives that are active posters on this site. They address customer concerns and provide information.

I'm not saying that Leon needs to do that. But the fact that he has not come on PS, or asked another to represent him on PS, should not impact the way Ellen, CR, and others discuss their experience with Leon.

We are only hearing one side of the story because Leon has chosen not to tell the other.

Great point, thank you. One of many which I have wanted to make, but have refrained for a couple reasons. Just because Leon chooses not to come here, should people not tell their side? What kind of picture would that paint, if all we heard were glowing reports? I do realize that it is only one side, and while I tried extremely hard to be fair in my post because of that, I have to also realize that doesn't make it so. Even though I know I did tell the entire truth, I guess I am the only one who truly knows that.


Harriet said Leon doesn't post here because he doesn't want to be upset. Well for heavens sake, all he has to do is treat all his customers with some respect, and he wouldn't even need to read here. If he treated his customers the way other vendors do, there WOULD be nothing but glowing reports here. For the very few who don't want to believe many of these reports where he's rude/arrogant for no apparent reason, why would everyone make it up? There is not a single post I've read where someone said Leon didn't make the most stunning settings, and aside from possibly being cost prohibitive, there's probably not a lady on here who wouldn't own one of his pieces. So my question is, to those few who may not believe all the negative comments about him, why would they get made up? What would be the point of someone saying they called to get a quote and were turned off by his arrogance?

As I said to someone last night, If it looks like a duck, and walks like a duck.....And I am not saying this to "trash" Leon. I just wish he was a joy to work with for everyone, and I could easily recommend him to anyone who asked about him. His work speaks for itself. Unfortunately, his attitude does as well.


Kaleigh, thank you.


pp, I would love to hear your story should you use him, and I truly hope it's nothing but praise.


Harriet, thank you.


MonkeyPie, you made a great point as well.