Swap-A-Roo = Not for You?

[sapphirering]

I feel terrible for MP. Because of this thread, and for purposes of "consumer education", things got escalated way too quickly and irrationally, to the point where she decided to refund a stone that I personally had very little doubt that she would have LOVED once she got her hands on it. jbEG, who IMO did not do anything wrong throughout this entire transaction, got their name dragged through the mud. I'm glad that jbEG had a chance to air their side of the story, and in my eyes their stock has gone up dramatically after this whole debacle.

I personally thought it spoke volumes about the type of people Grace and Erica are for MP to feel comfortable enough to ask for the stone back. And I also thought MP showed maturity in trying to get the stone back because it honestly made the most financial sense at this point. I'm really sorry about how things turned out. MP, if you're reading this, I wish you all the best.

 

[indecisive]

I do feel for MF. I remember how I was when we bought my e-ring and also when we built our house. Emotions can run high with large, important purchases. I think she let the cost and hassle of international shipping get in the way of her seeing the stone in the ring, which I really think she needed to do. Just sad.

I wasn't the biggest fan of the update post by JbEG because right or wrong I do hold vendors to a higher standard than customers. I think the way they handled things before were respectful, though, so this would not rule out a purchase from them. If I am ever lucky enough to have a child I think they have some great "push presents" there!

 

[iheartscience]

I do feel for MF. I remember how I was when we bought my e-ring and also when we built our house. Emotions can run high with large, important purchases. I think she let the cost and hassle of international shipping get in the way of her seeing the stone in the ring, which I really think she needed to do. Just sad.

I wasn't the biggest fan of the update post by JbEG because right or wrong I do hold vendors to a higher standard than customers. I think the way they handled things before were respectful, though, so this would not rule out a purchase from them. If I am ever lucky enough to have a child I think they have some great "push presents" there!

The thing is, JbEG offered to pay the shipping costs both ways so MF could inspect it before sending it to VC to have it set, and MF chose not to do this. Honestly that just baffles me. I would have at least looked at the diamond in person before choosing to either set it or return it.

 

[rosetta]

I would buy from JBEG after this little revelation. I think they went above and beyond to make things right in the end and I didnt read gloating in that post at all, more a sense of disbelief as in "wtf can you believe after all that SHE WANTED THE STONE BACK??!!!" Which frankly, as they're only human, I'm gonna allow to slide.

No harm to their reputation in my eyes. Other opinions are available.

 

[MissStepcut]

wow, just wow

I do think the decision to return the stone was in haste, because it will be very, very hard to find a replacement at that price that will exactly fit a setting that is already made. I wonder if the new owner could contact Victor and see if they want to sell the setting at a discount??? Starting over would be faaaaarrrr easier than trying to find another 8.6mm OEC in a higher color at a comparable price (or at any price).

I think JBEG bent over backwards in this situation. I wouldn't hesitate to buy from them.

And I would venture a guess that's why she decided she wanted the stone back after all, not because of the sticker shock, necessarily.

 

[Kaleigh]

People talk about piling on... Not this thread, but in general...

Imagine if this was your business..

And Tgal. I am not dancing with you, cause I would lose...

But I see this very differently. The older stones are art to me... I am saying me not anyone else. I truly appreciate them . I recently bought a 3 stone OEC ring and my center stone got chipped while it was sized. How often do you find a .90 OEC VS1??? Needle in the hay stack for sure. I could have been a bitch , but when my jeweler told me?? I said oh come now. I have known you for 20 years. Please relax. We will find another, and you can have the chipped stone and have it recut and sell it.. So you are not out tons of money.
THEN I find out this happend on his 40th birthday. I went and bought him a great Pen and said lets write this whole thing off...


I do believe this is the first time I have ever disagreed with you. It feels good.. Kidding..

 

[TravelingGal]

I do feel for MF. I remember how I was when we bought my e-ring and also when we built our house. Emotions can run high with large, important purchases. I think she let the cost and hassle of international shipping get in the way of her seeing the stone in the ring, which I really think she needed to do. Just sad.

I wasn't the biggest fan of the update post by JbEG because right or wrong I do hold vendors to a higher standard than customers. I think the way they handled things before were respectful, though, so this would not rule out a purchase from them. If I am ever lucky enough to have a child I think they have some great "push presents" there!

The thing is, JbEG offered to pay the shipping costs both ways so MF could inspect it before sending it to VC to have it set, and MF chose not to do this. Honestly that just baffles me. I would have at least looked at the diamond in person before choosing to either set it or return it.

I don't know Maplefemme's history here, except from her sign on date, that she is relatively new. I also know this was to be her e-ring. I could assume from these two things that this is their first gem transaction. And based on that, I could say then, that she's and her SO are simply not as seasoned as some of us here. Many of us have been here for years, are above average in knowledge and have seen a lot play out.

I just reread the thread, as I was mostly skimming it the first time. Honestly, the whole thing is just really sad. As Sharon said, a lose/lose thread if I ever saw one. Maplefemme answered the OPs question and just said she had a bad experience with preloved. Another posted then ASKED her, if she didn't mind sharing, what the details were. And of course mayhem, so to speak, followed.

PSers are an opinionated bunch, which I've always liked. I really didn't see where plenty of seasoned posters opinions for a refund based on color could be called "vitriolic." I even posted halfway through that I believed it seemed like both sides were being very civil. I really didn't see that MF herself bullied Erica and Grace for a refund. But public opinion definitely seemed like it was pushing for that, with Erica and Grace firmly on the defensive

But putting myself in a newbie's situation, I might just not know how to proceed with these things! Or maybe I'm not a savvy consumer to begin with. Erica said she wasn't going to OFFER a flat out refund because they wanted to keep the business (understandable, to me, coming from a sales perspective) and MF didn't think refunds were an option, so never requested one specifically during the transaction. Meanwhile, we have this newbie gettings all sorts of opinions and advice from seasoned PSers, and emotions are running, high, the drama is being played out on stage and then perhaps she thought she REALLY SHOULD be getting a refund. With such a thread, as a newbie, I just might want OUT...and the good advice to sit back and research it a bit more seemed to come too late in the thread.

Now she has a custom made setting that needs a new stone with a specific size? People are taking sides, we haven't even heard MF's final side of the story, and everyone's speculating. Sadly, we have a consumer who came here, trying to learn about diamonds for an e-ring purchase and looks like she ended up possibly confused about what off this really now means for her, both emotionally for her engagement and financially to them both.

 

[kenny]

I do feel badly for MF but frankly, she's a grown up who made her decisions.
Nobody at PS held a gun against her head.

I'm afraid she will now pay more for a lesser stone, if she can even find one that fits in her expensive setting which should not have even been commissioned before the stone was firm.

Sorry MF, but . . . live and learn.

 

[TravelingGal]

People talk about piling on... Not this thread, but in general...

Imagine if this was your business..

And Tgal. I am not dancing with you, cause I would lose...

But I see this very differently. The older stones are art to me... I am saying me not anyone else. I truly appreciate them . I recently bought a 3 stone OEC ring and my center stone got chipped while it was sized. How often do you find a .90 OEC VS1??? Needle in the hay stack for sure. I could have been a bitch , but when my jeweler told me?? I said oh come now. I have known you for 20 years. Please relax. We will find another, and you can have the chipped stone and have it recut and sell it.. So you are not out tons of money.
THEN I find out this happend on his 40th birthday. I went and bought him a great Pen and said lets write this whole thing off...


I do believe this is the first time I have ever disagreed with you. It feels good.. Kidding..

Kaleigh, through the mess of this thread, I really didn't post an opinion. I thought the whole thing sounded messy, and only when Erica posted that they were thinking of leaving the PS community because it was becoming personal, did I just post that what I took away from this thread was that I wouldn't buy from a vendor who was so personally tied to their transactions. Then the update got me going again.

Anyone who has been on this forum for any length of time knows that PSers are a smart AND opinionated bunch. As a small business, if you be part of PS (and assuming you use it partially to increase your business), I think you take the good with the not so good. This was the first time, in my recollection, that dissatifaction with jbeg came up. IMHO, no one was out to get them, burn them at the stake, or anything else. There were strong opinions both ways about what happened, and opinions on how to remedy the situation.

Yes, I do feel at this point, that it's personal to Grace and Erica. And I feel it shows. And whether it's justified or not, all I am saying is that as a business, even a SMALL business, it could have been handled better. Many disagree, but it's just my opinion as a businesswoman and a saleswoman.

Kenny said this this is an anti-seller forum, but I don't think that at all. I've always thought that consumers have a harder time here airing any bad stories against vendors, because a lot of vendors do have very avid supporters who will drill and drill and drill the consumer (not to mention send letters of love and support to the vendor). That's not a bad thing either. But when you're an unseasoned amateur, that's a tough spot to be in too. Just as tough as a vendor dealing with PSers and their pitchforks.

But yeah, whoever said hot potato, had no idea they were onto something. It's possible MF acted too rashly, and now will have to pay for it, instead of pulling back and taking the drama away from here. This has been a hot potato thread, for sure.

 

[kenny]

Kenny said this this is an anti-seller forum, . . .

No.
I said, "...the anti-seller bias on PS..."

Quite different meaning.
Please don't twist my words.

Word-twisting and exaggeration to make someone else's words more inflammatory than intended is one reason threads like these gets out of hand.

 

[TravelingGal]

Kenny said this this is an anti-seller forum, . . .

No.
I said, "...the anti-seller bias on PS..."

Quite different meaning.
Please don't twist my words.

Word-twisting and exaggeration is one reason threads like these gets out of hand.

Forgive me Kenny. I realized I wrote differently but didn't go back to correct as I meant it how you meant it, that this is a forum (PS) that has an anti seller bias. Please understand that I didn't intentionally mean to twist your words, and that people vary.

 

[Circe]

Gotta say, I'm with T-Gal on this, all the way through ... and I feel terrible for MapleFemme, who seems to have gotten stuck between a rock and a hard place, rock being JBeG and hard place being her fiance. I know I've felt dreadful on the occasions when I've gotten the go-ahead on a Big Present purchase and it's turned out other than as expect, and rather more so than if I were simply buying something with my own hard-earned money: it feels, oddly, somehow demeaning, to make a bad call in front of a loved one when they're being generous. Taking the refund must have felt like a weight off her shoulders, making it so the engagement wouldn't be tainted by the bad experience and the purchase colored so that every time her fiance looked at the ring, she'd have to wonder what he was thinking: getting the chorus of "you should look at it before you pull it out of a custom setting!" like a yank from her sensible diamond-loving side.

So. While I'm going to avoid getting into the she-said she-said of JBeG's actions (y'all have got it covered!), MapleFemme, if you're reading, a) you've got my sympathy, b) you've got my good wishes in finding a replacement, and, c) you've got my utter confidence you can find something that works. Either you have Victor modify the setting - stone too small? put in a bezel. too big? well, congratulations, and then you build up the prongs - or you use a colored stone or a modern RB and wait for the perfect 8.6 old cut to come along.

And, getting back to the original topic - yikes! This is making me rethink my policy on buying through a medium without any built-in protection.

 

[LALove]

I'd buy from JbEG in a heartbeat and this thread has only solidified my convictions of how I feel about them as vendors and individuals.
Looks like their part in this transaction is done and over with as the stone has now sold (unless of course this new buyer returns it- in which case- GRACE PLEASE EMAIL ME FIRST!!! ).

MF - I hope you find a stone that makes you feel over the moon and, with some patience, I'm sure you will. Here are some possible candidates:

http://oldworlddiamonds.com/detail.php?ID=1701&SHAPE=EU

http://oldworlddiamonds.com/detail.php?ID=2867&SHAPE=EU

You may also want to check out EBay, ruby lane and I'd give Singlestone a call.

I'd definitely check with Victor on any stone before you buy it to make sure it will work with your setting.

(Also, you said earlier you wanted an L color store - do you mean GIA L color? If so I'd probably look at higher colors if they're graded EGL. But one thing I've personally noticed with these old cuts is not all colors graded the same actually look the same- color wise. So I wouldn't rule out a potential stone without seeing it in person first despite its color grade...)

 

[HeartingDiamonds]

Someone mentioned this thread being a lose-lose thread/situation. It most certainly has been.

In MF's defense, she had been very gracious in her email correspondence asking about the possibility of having the stone back, which she also followed up with an equally gracious phone call. I'm sure that was NOT an easy thing to do.

I wish things had started differently, and certainly ended differently. Nobody won this one.

 

[Aoife]

Someone mentioned this thread being a lose-lose thread/situation. It most certainly has been.

In MF's defense, she had been very gracious in her email correspondence asking about the possibility of having the stone back, which she also followed up with an equally gracious phone call. I'm sure that was NOT an easy thing to do.

I wish things had started differently, and certainly ended differently. Nobody won this one.

Well, the new owner of the stone certainly benefitted.

I truly feel for MF, and hope she is able to find the diamond that makes her heart flutter, whether it fits in the VC setting or not. However, the way both Erica and Grace have conducted themselves on this thread has really cemented my positive opinion of them, and I not only won't hesitate to do business with them, but have every intention of doing it sooner rather than later.

 

[Laila619]

I'm with armywife here-I don't see JbEG's post as gloating. It seems relevant to me given the unusual circumstances that spurred this entire mess.

And honestly, if I were JbEG, I would be very leery of working with MF again. JbEG thought the transaction was complete and all parties were happy until several months later, when they were publicly called out on PS as misrepresenting a stone's color.

Ditto.

Makes me wonder if after MF got the refund* and went shopping for a new stone, sticker shock set in and she realized what a bargain the JbEG stone was.

ETA: *A better way of phrasing it might be "bullied a refund out of JbEG."

Wow. More like they bullied her into keeping a crap stone.

Also, Maple never originally even brought up the situation with JbEG; I asked her if she minded sharing what happened. Maple never once named JbEG by name.

 

[iheartscience]

I'm with armywife here-I don't see JbEG's post as gloating. It seems relevant to me given the unusual circumstances that spurred this entire mess.

And honestly, if I were JbEG, I would be very leery of working with MF again. JbEG thought the transaction was complete and all parties were happy until several months later, when they were publicly called out on PS as misrepresenting a stone's color.

Ditto.

Makes me wonder if after MF got the refund* and went shopping for a new stone, sticker shock set in and she realized what a bargain the JbEG stone was.

ETA: *A better way of phrasing it might be "bullied a refund out of JbEG."

Wow. More like they bullied her into keeping a crap stone.

I think the new owner probably begs to differ, as does anyone who has looked at the photos and videos. It's a stunning diamond!

 

[movie zombie]

you did read that she wanted the stone back, right? must not have been too crappy.....

 

[Mayk]

Wow. More like they bullied her into keeping a crap stone.[/quote]


WOW that was uncalled for... Your should be reported for that comment.

MF got her refund, and JbEG sold the stone almost immediately. Obviously NOT a crap stone.

 

[Laila619]

you did read that she wanted the stone back, right? must not have been too crappy.....

I don't blame her. The setting is already done and paid for. It'll be quite difficult to find another stone to fit it. Still doesn't mean it's a stone she truly wanted.

 

[Laila619]

Wow. More like they bullied her into keeping a crap stone.

WOW that was uncalled for... Your should be reported for that comment.

MF got her refund, and JbEG sold the stone almost immediately. Obviously NOT a crap stone. [/quote]


Um, it's definitely uncalled for to accuse poor Maplefemme of bullying a vendor. She did NOTHING wrong here. I was just sticking up for her. She is being treated very unfairly here. I wouldn't blame her if she doesn't post here again after this turn of events.

Maybe 'crap stone' is a poor choice of words (a better choice of words would be 'misrepresented stone'), but so is attacking Maplefemme.

 

[Mayk]

Wow. More like they bullied her into keeping a crap stone.

WOW that was uncalled for... Your should be reported for that comment.

MF got her refund, and JbEG sold the stone almost immediately. Obviously NOT a crap stone.

Um, it's definitely uncalled for to accuse poor Maplefemme of bullying a vendor. She did NOTHING wrong here. I was just sticking up for her.[/quote]


How do you figure... You are sticking up for someone who got exactly what she "thought" she wanted... A refund. So now JbEG are bulllies... I don't think so.. Sorry to have a different opinion.... I would thing MF was happy she has a handful of cash to go find exactly what she wants and she has a ton of priceless knowledge about shopping for her perfect stone...

 

[Laila619]

Wow. More like they bullied her into keeping a crap stone.

WOW that was uncalled for... Your should be reported for that comment.

MF got her refund, and JbEG sold the stone almost immediately. Obviously NOT a crap stone.

Um, it's definitely uncalled for to accuse poor Maplefemme of bullying a vendor. She did NOTHING wrong here. I was just sticking up for her.

How do you figure... You are sticking up for someone who got exactly what she "thought" she wanted... A refund. So now JbEG are bulllies... I don't think so.. Sorry to have a different opinion.... I would thing MF was happy she has a handful of cash to go find exactly what she wants and she has a ton of priceless knowledge about shopping for her perfect stone...[/quote]


Maybe so, Mayk, but it's also bad timing now, as the custom setting is already made.

I'm the one who asked Maple if she could share what happened, and now that people are judging her unfairly, I feel so bad for even asking her. If Maple had any intentions of 'bullying' JbEG into a refund, she would have done it before a custom setting was made. Come on. Let's at least be fair to her here.

 

[ericad]

Wow. More like they bullied her into keeping a crap stone.

We bullied MF? Yes, we very meanly agreed to the trade she wanted. Then had the gall to agree to the credit she wanted after offering to pay round trip shipping for her to see the stone BEFORE starting the setting. And then, to add insult to injury, we forced a refund on her. Bullied, indeed...not bad for a couple of wussies...

 

[Mayk]

Wow. More like they bullied her into keeping a crap stone.

WOW that was uncalled for... Your should be reported for that comment.

MF got her refund, and JbEG sold the stone almost immediately. Obviously NOT a crap stone.

Um, it's definitely uncalled for to accuse poor Maplefemme of bullying a vendor. She did NOTHING wrong here. I was just sticking up for her.

How do you figure... You are sticking up for someone who got exactly what she "thought" she wanted... A refund. So now JbEG are bulllies... I don't think so.. Sorry to have a different opinion.... I would thing MF was happy she has a handful of cash to go find exactly what she wants and she has a ton of priceless knowledge about shopping for her perfect stone...

Maybe so, Mayk, but it's also bad timing now, as the custom setting is already made.


Don't get me wrong I feel for her (MF).... But not at the expense of JbEG. I myself have a setting and two bands for sale because of the things I learned here after buying our first ering and bands soI know what it's like...granted I didn't have the same amount of money involved but I still had a substantial amount we had to reinvest to get my ring the way i wanted it I think the term "bullied" being used about this situation is wrong be it talking a out MF or JbEG... This was a business transaction that headed south...way south... It is sad. But in the end when it was settled tossing JbEG under the bus wheels

 

[Mara]

I'm with armywife here-I don't see JbEG's post as gloating. It seems relevant to me given the unusual circumstances that spurred this entire mess.

And honestly, if I were JbEG, I would be very leery of working with MF again. JbEG thought the transaction was complete and all parties were happy until several months later, when they were publicly called out on PS as misrepresenting a stone's color.

This. I didn't see it as gloating at all. I appreciate the update to bring closure to the thread for this particular transaction.

I'm not surprised this thing sold like a hotcake. I was actually emailing with JBEG about another stone, and in my next email was planning on asking about this stone as well, because based on the images and video, there is no freaking way that is S/T. But even if it is, it looks really amazing.

MF, I very much hope you find a stone that makes your heart sing for your new ring.

 

[iheartscience]

Wow. More like they bullied her into keeping a crap stone.

We bullied MF? Yes, we very meanly agreed to the trade she wanted. Then had the gall to agree to the credit she wanted after offering to pay round trip shipping for her to see the stone BEFORE starting the setting. And then, to add insult to injury, we forced a refund on her. Bullied, indeed...not bad for a couple of wussies...

Your commitment to customer service is truly offensive!

 

[Laila619]

Wow. More like they bullied her into keeping a crap stone.

We bullied MF? Yes, we very meanly agreed to the trade she wanted. Then had the gall to agree to the credit she wanted after offering to pay round trip shipping for her to see the stone BEFORE starting the setting. And then, to add insult to injury, we forced a refund on her. Bullied, indeed...not bad for a couple of wussies...

Erica, I was replying specifically to another poster who accused Maplefemme of bullying you. I don't think a customer can bully a vendor when they hold all the cards and they have the customer's money. If anything, it'd be the other way around. THAT's what I was trying to say.

Tgal is spot on that some people will defend their favorite vendors at all costs. I have nothing against JbEG, I just think we need to be fair to Maple.

 

[ericad]

Going back to sitting on my hands (not in a fun way) with visions of petrified zoo-poo engagement rings dancing in my head ("crap" stone, get it?)

I think I'm cracking up...

 

[TravelingGal]

Wow. More like they bullied her into keeping a crap stone.

We bullied MF? Yes, we very meanly agreed to the trade she wanted. Then had the gall to agree to the credit she wanted after offering to pay round trip shipping for her to see the stone BEFORE starting the setting. And then, to add insult to injury, we forced a refund on her. Bullied, indeed...not bad for a couple of wussies...

I was replying specifically to another poster who accused Maplefemme of bullying you. I don't think a customer can bully a vendor when they hold all the cards and they have the customer's money. If anything, it'd be the other way around. THAT's what I was trying to say.

Tgal is spot on that some people will defend their favorite vendors at all costs. I have nothing against JbEG, I just think we need to be fair to Maple.

I don't have anything against them either...a couple of my favorite posters currently have projects with them and I figured at some point I'd look into them.

I don't think anyone bullied anyone. I do think jbeg didn't want to give a refund but was backed into a corner with the tide of PS opinion as well as a series of miscommunications. At that point, if I were both parties, I would want to extricate myself and be done with it.

And, finally, it is possible that GIA misgraded, right? After all, we recently had a colored stone graded differently by two labs. Stuff happens. If it isn't an S/T (as Mara said, and honestly by the video, I agree that it didn't look like it to me), then someone's getting lucky. But the GIA grading isn't to be scoffed at, right...it does mean something? Because don't the experts often say they're "it?"

ETA, still wouldn't do business now with them now, but my loss, I'm sure.