Questions for PSers who've sent stones to Leon

[arjunajane]

Lovestreet,
I'm sorry but I agree with the others - all of those detailed powerpoints and mockups are much to much for a LM transaction, and will either take you directly to the PITA pile or end up in confusion and disappointment. I would even say you have a bit much there for many of the more accommodating vendors, tbh.

You've been given good advice - I would use the diamond mockups, sticking to your 3 top top favourites (more than that is too confusing, if Leon thinks they won't work I'm sure he'll tell you), than include the style number of the design you like and ask how they would work together. I would think sending that via email, with a follow up call to discuss would be the easiest way forward for both.

I have no doubt that if you sent even half of those documents to Leon, they would simply be ignored - sorry, you've clearly put in a lot of effort and thought

 

[AnneinGA]

Lovestreet,
I don't have a Leon and don't want a Leon, have never talked to him, and am basing everything below on what I've readon this board, so take it with a large grain of salt. And I don't want a Leon. Here's why:

In many threads there seems to be some blame on the original poster for not giving enough detail. Even those in this thread state that you have to be very specific on the work order, speak in detail, and leave nothing out. Yet when you go to the trouble of putting together PowerPoint slides (quite nice) of the specifics of what you want and the details, you are told that they are probably "too specific" and will put you in the PITA pile (absolutely horrific). What's a customer to do? Either way the blame will fall to you on your lack of specificity or way too much.

Charmy up top said it very well:

I can tell you that Leon will not be reading anything you wrote. You have to call him and explain it to him and discuss it with him. He will then translate it to a work order. Review the heck out of the work order and make sure it includes every little detail that has been discussed. If for whatever reason, something goes wrong - the work order is the only recourse.

You seem like a very detailed oriented person and not too different from me. It will be very hard to relinquish control and be completely pleased with the final product.

This is akin to someone commissioning a painting for their foyerand giving carte blanche to the artist to do the painting. They want a piece of art from an artist - and will give free reign to the artist himself. I believe, even though on another thread he denied he was an "artiste"- only a jeweler - that he puts himself up there as a Picasso in jewelry, and that he does accept -some- direction in his work, that he is offended that someone not of his caliber would make suggestions about their piece when he knows best.

For the cost of the ring, I would want to be sure I was COMPLETELY PLEASED - over the moon in fact. Why go with someone who potentially will not read all the work you've done. My opinion is most people who like their LM like it FIRST because it's a LEON, not necessarily because they love every element of the design. Can you live with someone not being appreciative of you knowing what you want and telling you that

Charmy - I came up with a new crazy idea. Discussed over the phone and he essentially told me I was on crack and it wouldn't work.

?

 

[CharmyPoo]

Charmy - I came up with a new crazy idea. Discussed over the phone and he essentially told me I was on crack and it wouldn't work.

?

To be fair, my idea was not technically feasible. It was feasible as a drawing on paper but can't be executed.

 

[AnneinGA]

Charmy, of course not being technically feasible is a reasonable explanation for a design not being executed. I just take exception to the crack comment.

 

[missydebby]

Charmy, of course not being technically feasible is a reasonable explanation for a design not being executed. I just take exception to the crack comment.

What wrong with crack?!? I especially like it after a night of trolling jewelry websites....

 

[AnneinGA]

MissyDebby, I know, right, it allows you to stay up and cuts down on the keyboard drooling....

 

[bgray]

I have chosen to not give the specifics of the my transactions and communications with LM for privacy issues. However, in my experience he does want to provide the stones because he makes money there too and in fact has had major problems with more than a few diamond vendors because of this. He has a reputation for pooh poohing stones that are brought too him and he doesnt like things in writing for a reason. He will simply just not do it (in my case as well as others) saying send me a deposit before I do anything more. I am highly specific and clear and he simply ignored the specs of my original ring. Fortunately there were others involved in that process who backed me up (the order details)otherwise I would have been stuck with something that I didn't want for almost twice the quote. The next time around I repeatedly asked for a DETAILED quote and it was never provided. I think he is enormously talented and I wish I could do business with him but I dont trust him. For those of you who have worked with him successfully --that's great. I do take umbrage at the inference that it was some communication issue or lack of specificity that cause my issues--in fact in was his unwillingness to do business in a straightforward manner. I have had custom work done by several places of superior reputation and have never had a problem with any of them.

 

[arjunajane]

I just wrote a mega long post on my phone and lost it I'll try again later.

 

[bgray]

I just wrote a mega long post on my phone and lost it I'll try again later.

how frustrating!

 

[Dancing Fire]

Goodness.


Here is a thread in which 'veterans at successfully navigating a transaction with' a given vendor have given advice on

-How not to irritate this vendor, and ensure he wants to work with you on this project
-How not to irritate this vendor, and ensure that you don't wind up with an inexplicably exorbitant quote
-How to ensure this vendor actually pays attention to what you, the paying customer, want


I truly fail to understand why on earth would anyone would want to work with someone who makes him/her so nervous that he/she starts a thread on how to 'deal with' the impending project to soothe the nerves

and then after all said and done...these rings weren't made by Leon's own two hands.

 

[Matthewmon]

is that true because if i get him to make my ring I want him to do it himself....



and charmypoo where can I see pics of your fiance's ring? thanks!

 

[rosetta]

i'm not going to comment on my own situation any further, because i didn't end up going with Leon. if i do run with him, i will post a blow-by-blow account.

Rosetta - I didn't want to call anyone out but I was actually referring to bgray. She claimed people shut her out a few times and she had a horrible experience with Leon. Yet, no one really knows what happened or what was so horrible about it other than she didn't like her ring and she paid a lot.

I understand.

 

[Dancing Fire]

is that true because if i get him to make my ring I want him to do it himself....

use some common sense...how can one man with only two hands make all these rings by himself? yes,in the old days he probably work on the rings himself,but not since his business out grew his pair of hands...JMO

 

[Dreamer_D]

I think it is very clear, whether he will look at is or not... *shrug*.

I suspect he might tell you the design will not work with your size center stone, though. The blue gem in the inspiration is about, what, 6 ct? And Bebe's ring is about 4ct I think. So why not call him before you get too far down the road?

 

[rosetta]

I don't know about Leon, but I get your slide completely.

My vote goes to baguettes and carre only.

 

[arjunajane]

hey lovestreet, I personally think the new diagram is great-I would send it without another worry. I also just wanted to say you have been very responsive and courteous to all in this thread, so cheers for keeping an open mind
And thankyou to yourself and bgray about the eaten post, it is terribly frustrating-it was basically some observations regarding my own leon experience, but its probably redundant at this stage

 

[Aoife]

Arjunajane and bgray, I would be interested to hear your experiences, although perhaps in another thread. As someone who is relatively new to PS, I don't think people who have been members for a long time realize how important it is to have a broad range of experiences and feedback posted for any and every vendor. There have been numerous times when I've read a series of threads burbling on about how wonderful a vendor is, then all of a sudden a newbie has a not-so-great experience, posts about it, and a PS veteran responds with a comment something along the lines of: Oh yes, I think xyz-scoper had a similar experience, I don't know if there was a thread for that.

And Love Street, I am keeping my fingers crossed that all goes well with your interactions with Leon, and that the end result is the ring of your dreams, within the budget you had planned!

 

[CharmyPoo]

Charmy, of course not being technically feasible is a reasonable explanation for a design not being executed. I just take exception to the crack comment.

Sorry - those were my words Charmy humor but perhaps not funny. He just said it wasn't techncially feasible.

 

[AnneinGA]

Charmy, glad to hear that it was your interpretation. I get it now.

 

[missydebby]

hey lovestreet, I personally think the new diagram is great-I would send it without another worry. )

Ditto... well executed and concise. Dayum, you're good!

 

[Imdanny]

Best of luck!

 

[arjunajane]

Arjunajane and bgray, I would be interested to hear your experiences, although perhaps in another thread. As someone who is relatively new to PS, I don't think people who have been members for a long time realize how important it is to have a broad range of experiences and feedback posted for any and every vendor. There have been numerous times when I've read a series of threads burbling on about how wonderful a vendor is, then all of a sudden a newbie has a not-so-great experience, posts about it, and a PS veteran responds with a comment something along the lines of: Oh yes, I think xyz-scoper had a similar experience, I don't know if there was a thread for that.

Aoife, I completely understand - I was also a newbie not too long ago, and the new search function makes finding history difficult.

Lovestreet,
I don't have a Leon and don't want a Leon, have never talked to him, and am basing everything below on what I've readon this board, so take it with a large grain of salt. And I don't want a Leon. Here's why:

In many threads there seems to be some blame on the original poster for not giving enough detail. Even those in this thread state that you have to be very specific on the work order, speak in detail, and leave nothing out. Yet when you go to the trouble of putting together PowerPoint slides (quite nice) of the specifics of what you want and the details, you are told that they are probably "too specific" and will put you in the PITA pile (absolutely horrific). What's a customer to do? Either way the blame will fall to you on your lack of specificity or way too much.

Anne, your observations are largely correct that the advice in this thread appears contradictory. I would like to say my take on that is due in very large part to what I mentioned at the start of the thread - Leon's behaviour with any one consumer is unpredictable. So a well meaning client could believe they are following all the 'rules of engagement' correctly, only to be shut out, overcharged or what have you.

Because Aoife asked and it has relevance to the thread, I will share (one of) my negative experiences with LM - although it doesn't stack up against a lot of the bad treatment mentioned in this thread, this exchange and other reviews have lead me to decide they are a company that will never receive my business.

Firstly, no I will not risk sending my diamond all the way from Australia at a very high expense, just so you can decide if you feel like taking on the project, and potentially modify your half-as**d quote by thousands of $$.
I was basically given the 'no soup for you' treatment via email with a very vague and incomplete quote; than after a phone call there was some slight concession, but still way too much attitude and uncertainty for me to have any confidence to ship off my diamond. For the record, I wanted an exact copy of a setting on his site, no changes or innovation or difficulties needed.

Out of curiousity, and because I had observed through PS that men usually have an easier time of it with their LM transactions, a couple weeks later I asked my fiance to email about the same quote, with the same questions and inquiries. Everything about Leon's response was different - his demeanour, tone, willing to supply information and to compromise, and even the quote were all vastly improved over the treatment I had received from Leon. It was like reading email exchanges from a completely different person.
Take this information for what you will, but the experience basically confirmed for me my previous observations that LM has a 'loose canon' approach to his clients, with no rhyme or reason to who he treats well or not, very poor interpersonal skills and a terse manner (if he doesn't 'like' you). On the other hand, when communicating to my fiance he was jovial, helpful and I can certainly see how some PS'ers come away with a completely different impression of his personality than others.
I was also left with the impression based on this experience that he is somewhat of a chauvinist, a suspicion I had already held.
Suffice to say, if I had originally received the respect - and the better price - offered my Fiance for exactly the same ring I had asked about, I may have been a LM owner; but now, never.

(I have been fortunate to find an excellent goldsmith who do every last detail by hand, go out of their way with exemplary customer service at every corner, and imo their work easily rivals -and surpasses- Leon's.)

I would also like to point out that what DF has mentioned earlier in the thread is correct - a large majority of the rings are not actually made by Leon, but his staff. I feel this is important for consumers to know, as I realize many want to specifically own "a Leon", which is basically just a brand like any other. I feel some statements on his website mislead consumers into believing Leon makes every single piece for every client.





Lovestreet, I sincerely hope you don't mind me posting this. I completely support you sending your revised Ppt to LM and have nothing but the best wishes for you and your project. I haven't discussed my experience before either, so I figured while this thread is here, perhaps it will provide extra info for others who are facing the same decisions as yourself, but I am in no way attempting to influence your decision

 

[bgray]

interesting to hear this. I have thought there was a gender issue as well.

 

[arjunajane]

interesting to hear this. I have thought there was a gender issue as well.

hi bgray-glad to hear I'm not the only one, although tbh I have restrained from posting as much in the past out of concern of being told I was jumping to conclusions. Based off all I have read on PS and my own experiences, I no longer have a doubt this plays at least some part in his unpleasant behaviour-which is very disappointing, more so considering his industry

 

[athenaworth]

I've been stalking this thread because I was thinking of sending my stone out to Leon to be re-set (glad this came along). When I read that old thread about gap between the stone and the halo and then Leon's reply of "my heart goes out to your husband," my first thought was, "what a sexist." I figured it was just my emotions, but it looks like other have that hunch too.

 

[Love Street]

Thanks for all the opinions on the revised diagram. We'll see how it goes. I think I will send it without any of the other mockups and instead just mention on the phone that I'm open to multiple configurations of staggered step cuts, although R377 is my favorite. (If the need arises after conversation, I can email one or more to him.)

I have thought there was a gender issue as well.

bgray]- I had thought the same thing - in fact, I had originally responded to Rupp in this thread by musing "it seems like he gets along better with men for some reason..." but then decided to delete it, because I didn't want to speculate on the reasons... but I think AJ has something... While there have also been some men that have had bad experiences (Reggie's & Vetchecker'sexperiences come to mind), it also seemed to me that men seemed to get along with him better.

And ArjunaJane - your story abcolutely confirms this, at least in your instance. That is pretty galling. Grrr... I should have had the DH contact him initially, but that ship has sailed. I should say for the record that I hope everyone who wants to talk about their Leon experience should feel free to post in this thread without worrying about "threadjacking" or evolving in that direction or parade raining - I'm asking for it, it is all helpful & related and I'm really glad that, for example, Uppy felt she could share her previously untold [horror] story - so AJ thanks for sharing yours here too. I also remember in a past thread one PSer joking about Leon vs his evil twin, since peoples' impression of his personality and demeanor have varied so widely.
But I'm so glad you were able to find a goldsmith who's work is comparable or better! What a good feeling that must be.

I do have the unpleasant feeling that I probably got a bit of finger wagging the number in both my quote requests - one for R1321 for $3k and then another $3,500 for R377 (the current inspiration - though it is a 7-stone rather than 5-stone - but $500 to bezel two more baguettes? Maybe it includes the added time to search for a third pair of matching bags? Who knows..). I wonder if I would have asked for a simple solitaire next the quote would be $4k

Dreamer - you're right, the inspiration sapphire in the photo is 6 cts. So this is part of the problem in dealing with Leon. Do I call him to see whether that design would work with my stone size? Pro: I find out if it won't ahead of time and can start thinking about other options. Con: I annoy him and get a PITA-markup on whatever alternative design we end up doing instead. Do I just send the diamond in without further inquiry? Pro: *Maybe* that buys me points in the "low maintenance client" department; I know I want one of his designs anyway. Con: What if he gets the stone and then tries to push me in a completely different direction, giving me a PITA price if I don't comply (like Gypsy's experience where he pushed a pave halo when she only wanted a baguette halo). Argh. <Insert smiley pulling its hair out>.

I have to say I take absolutely no offense to everyone who has said they will not work with Leon for whatever reason. It's partly about personal tolerance. As Charmy said, I personally can suck up customer service issues for quality and price. But with Leon it does seem that "price" is inconsistent, so on top of sucking up service issues one has to mitigate arbitrary, untransaparent pricing if it's even within one's control - and it may not always be.

Rosetta - thanks! I'm leaning more toward just trying to add carres and leaving the design as is with just baguettes too. We'll see...

ImDanny - thanks for the luck - it really sounds like I will need it.

KMissyDebby - thanks for commenting on the diagram! Love your humongous new gem

Aoife - thanks. I agree also that it's not always easy to find past threads and experiences - so where possible I've tried to link to the older threads in this one (for posterity ). And as I mentioned, I hope people will feel comfortable enough to share stories in this thread if they want to.

Andelain - thanks for sharing your WF custom experience -it does sound like it went perfectly and your pendant is beautiful! I guess insome ways I almost don't want to be overseeing my ring project every step of the way - it would somewhat stress me out to feel like I had to make lots calls on the design one way or the other. That's why it seems Leon might not be as bad a fit for me as my @nal powerpoints might indicate. Once I feel like he knows those five elements above that I want, I want the actual design calls to be mostly his - heck, I still don't have any idea if traps or baguettes for the first stone would be better. I've seen both in person with a cushion, I like both - it's too fine a line for me to call. Having said all this, it makes me even more impressed by you and others who really do design your own pieces almost entirely - kudos!

Athenaworth - I hear you! Keep us posted on your future project when the time comes.

 

[Dreamer_D]

interesting to hear this. I have thought there was a gender issue as well.

hi bgray-glad to hear I'm not the only one, although tbh I have restrained from posting as much in the past out of concern of being told I was jumping to conclusions. Based off all I have read on PS and my own experiences, I no longer have a doubt this plays at least some part in his unpleasant behaviour-which is very disappointing, more so considering his industry

Ever since he told Boom that he pities her fiance for putting up with her I have thought this.

 

[Aoife]

interesting to hear this. I have thought there was a gender issue as well.

hi bgray-glad to hear I'm not the only one, although tbh I have restrained from posting as much in the past out of concern of being told I was jumping to conclusions. Based off all I have read on PS and my own experiences, I no longer have a doubt this plays at least some part in his unpleasant behaviour-which is very disappointing, more so considering his industry

Ever since he told Boom that he pities her fiance for putting up with her I have thought this.

I had suspected it before that, but it was really reading about Boom's experience that made me positive. I'm old enough to have been around when this kind of attitude and comment (LM's pity-your-husband comment) was not uncommon. It was meant as a put down directed at an uppity woman then (40+ years ago), and there's really no other way to take it now. Each person who is contemplating working with Leon Mege has to decide whether or not the end result is worth dealing with the potential for that kind of treatment. Thinly veiled contempt is not exactly my idea of a good basis for a working relationship. But that's just me.

 

[missydebby]

You know, this makes for an interesting ethical dilemma. To be honest, had I read this thread before having done my initial project with him, I think there is no way in h-e-double hockey sticks I would dare spend my money with sucha a$$hole. I mean, I'm from the Dr Phil school, where I don't like rewarding bad behavior.

And yet...

I did my project way before, and I had no issues - got the best kind of unique ring I wouldn't have gotten anywhere else (who else might have had perfectly cut little french cut beauties or would have even suggested them to me considering my first ideas for a design?), that's exquisitly made, and continues on a daily basis to floor me. I got a deal on my center stone and paid far less than many a non custom ring.

And yet...

After hearing Boom's story, don't feel - as a past satisfied customer - that I'll necessarily get the same experience this time...

And yet...

Thus far they have already saved me at least 2.5K on my center stone...

I have come to a conclusion.

For me, it's worth it.

And it's a crapshoot.

 

[Love Street]

You know, this makes for an interesting ethical dilemma.

MissyDebby- Indeed! I feel the same way. It feels more like I'm making a difficult work-related decision than anything else. Or even closer - I have that sort of icky, slightly dirty feeling that I used to get when I was a paid political staffer (especially having come from a place of innocence as an idealistic volunteer and actually felt good about what I was doing).

And yet...

I have come to a conclusion.

For me, it's worth it.

And it's a crapshoot.

I think I too am going to roll the dice nonetheless. I feel like the end product is probably worth it... and I think if I went with another jeweler (at least right now), I'd be inspecting it daily wondering how Leon would have done it... and as [bCharmy][/b] said I'd be thinking about the Leon ring I passed up. Hmph.

I still can't decide if I should sent a deposit check for the full amt of labor with the stone (maybe it would indicate I'm serious enough to be dealt with evenly - and encourage him to start working on it instead of letting it sit for weeks like poor Uppy's spinel), or whether I should wait until after we talk... Thoughts on this?