Question for the Color Sensitive Ladies/Gents.

[longtimelurker]

Date: 8/17/2005 12:57:06 AM
Author: aljdewey
And here? Same? Different? Which is the J here?

This message is for Aljdeway. In my opinion, based on my eyesight and the way these pictures appear on this computer monitor--the J is on the left in the first picture, on the right in the second picture.

The third picture - it''s two different pictures; which probably have different lighting exposures AND it''s two different angles. However, the one on the left appears warmer in that picture set (the J). BUT, it could also be they''re the same stone with a yellowish light exposure in the left picture....

So, how''d I do?

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 8/17/2005 4:07:40 PM
Author: lmurden
The last time we got together and compared our diamonds no one could tell the difference until we compared them side by side and the diamond colors ranged from E-K.

Thanks....that''s exactly what I''ve been trying to say. No one could tell the difference UNTIL you compared them side by side. So yes, in that way, you can see the difference, but not under *everyday* viewing conditions, and *everyday* viewing conditions are what most folks worry about when they thinking about what they want to see in their ring, I believe.

 

[cutes814]

Date: 8/17/2005 12:57:06 AM
Author: aljdewey
And here? Same? Different? Which is the J here?

I think the first picture, the one on the left appears warmer.

The second picture, the one on the right appears warmer.

The 3rd picture, the one on the left appears warmer.

It is a little hard to tell in the pics with the sparkles in the way!

For all we know, it can be the same color stone!

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 8/17/2005 2:44:03 PM
Author: sjz

here''s my final answer...lol

The stone on the left in the first two pictures appears to be smaller, less sparkly, and warmer than the stone on the right. It''s harder to tell from the earlobe pictures, because the earring is tilted differently in the two pictures. The diamond on the right appears to be brighter in all of the pictures, but that could be because there is more glare from the diamond on the right in all three pictures. Or it could just be coincidental. Whatever, they don''t look the same in the pictures, regardless.

The diamond on the left in the first two pictures looked darker as opposed to warmer on his computer screen, but the glare or reflection or whatever it is coming off the diamonds looked pretty much the same.

Regarding the pictures...

In the first set, the stone on the left is not warmer.....it''s actually 2 color grades better than the one on the right. In person, there is *no* visible color difference.

In the second set of pictures, the stone of the left is not warmer....both the left and right stones are the same color grade.

In the third set of pictures, it''s the same stone--photographed more from the side and then face-up, mounted and worn......the way most diamonds are viewed.

And throughout this thread, you''ve been arguing that pictures aren''t the same as real life....a point with which I agree, by the way. But if that''s so, then it diminishes relative value of ALL pictures, so putting up a picture of your rings and pointing to them as evidence that visible differences in color grades are *readily* noticeable is also not representative of real life either.

 

[sjz]

Date: 8/17/2005 4:32:21 PM
Author: aljdewey

Date: 8/17/2005 2:21:30 PM
Author: sjz
I get what you are saying, Mara, and for the record, I feel the same way. I don''t usually take someone else''s opinion as gospel, either. I do think that the experts are more likely to have a more ''trained'' opinion, though. They see a lot more diamonds than the average consumer, so I would think by sheer numbers alone most of them are better at judging diamonds than average people.

At the risk of repeating myself, you''re trying to tie together two things that are completely different and treat them interchangably when they aren''t.

On the one hand, there is trained opinion that gives a credentialed, learned opinion of what color a diamond is. While subjective, it''s an educated opinion based on years of seeing diamonds and training. That opinion has MUCH value when you are purchasing a stone and trying to assess the fairness of the price associated with that grade. It also means that folks who are trained to recognize these subtle differences will possibly also see them under daily wear conditions....just like folks who train for years at Julliard can hear the same music on the elevator that I do, but they hear far more distinct elements than I do because of their training.

On the *other* hand...and this is the hand we''ve been speaking to since the inception of this thread (or trying to), there is the consumer PERCEPTION of whether or not those distinctions are visibly noticeable to them in non-lab settings. This opinion doesn''t have to be educated; it is simply meant to reflect how a consumer perceives the warmth or lack thereof in his/her stone. This opinion ALSO has value because folks who truly don''t see the color difference between an F and a G can save a ton of money......which can be saved or applied to a better clarity or more size....whatever turns them on.

There is a purpose and a value for both opinions.

There are those who read PS, a lot of them ony lurk for the most part, that do take a lot of what you and other consumers give as their opinions very seriously. To them, a lot of PS regulars are ''experts''. That''s why I think it''s a good idea once in a while to throw out that little disclaimer that what we as consumers are stating really are our opinions, which are formed by a lot of variable factors, including the fact that some people claim to be more color sensitive than others.

Oh my goodness.....SJZ, that''s exactly what folks have been doing! They''ve been saying ''I find my J to look the same as my H, but that''s just how I see it, and you may not see it the same way. You need to see stones yourself...you may be more sensitive to color than I am.''

I just don''t get it....on the one hand, you tell everyone how important it is to add disclaimers that it''s just their opinion (which they already have done), and yet when/if they do that, then they ''aren''t being honest with themselves, or they are deluded about the real color of their stone and have to make excuses for it so they can feel better about it.''

Honestly, for the folks who choose to buy lower colored stones, there''s just no way to satisfy the masses, is there? I''m sure they feel anything but enthusiastic now about the prospect of actually trying to help others and give feedback.

If we''re really worried about the newbies and being misled, that''s certainly one way to solve it....make it so no one feels comfortable sharing an honest, individual opinion because their damned if they do and damned if they don''t.

Hey, for the record, not everyone adds that little disclaimer along with their opinion. And many of the opinons expressed on PS ARE misleading to the "masses". I''m not the only one who thinks so, either. Other people have made their feelings known on the subject and agree with me. I''m just the ony one who has chosen to argue this point with you and Mara, and at this juncture, there is no reason for me to continue to do so. I have to hand it to you two, you both will "beat the dead horse" until most people agree with you, then proclaim the horse to be dead, as if that''s all there is to it! The funny part is, once again, no one is really even arguing with the two of you. You just seem to keep on wanting to "prove" your point until everyone else who thinks there is life in the horse walks away. Please, please, please, read ALL of my posts, not just the parts you highlight and skew your replies to....

I was saying that I AGREE AGREE AGREE that it''s a good idea that people to remind people once in a while that it''s only their OPINION. I WASN''T arguing the position that people DON''T do it. And I never said that anyone who doesn''t add a disclaimer that it is their opinon is fooling themselves. My point was that other people might take those opinions and give them more weight than they should sometimes if the person stating the opinon seems to have enough conviction, or argues better, or posts more often or whatever. You seem to be trying to argue points that I wasn''t even trying to make for some reason.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 8/17/2005 4:33:22 PM
Author: ltl

This message is for Aljdeway. In my opinion, based on my eyesight and the way these pictures appear on this computer monitor--the J is on the left in the first picture, on the right in the second picture.

The third picture - it''s two different pictures; which probably have different lighting exposures AND it''s two different angles. However, the one on the left appears warmer in that picture set (the J). BUT, it could also be they''re the same stone with a yellowish light exposure in the left picture....

So, how''d I do?

You actually did VERY well.....extremely close.

In the first set, the stone on the left is actually two grades higher than the one on the right.

In the second set, neither stone is warmer....they are the same grade.

In the third set, it''s the same diamond in the same lighting condition; they were taken literally seconds apart.
BUT.......your observation that it appears warmer in the picture ont he left is HUGELY relevant, because that''s what some of us having been trying to convey all along. Color differences are much easier to see in profile, and less easy to see face up. So if you''re going to be viewing a stone face-up at least 80+% of the time, some folks won''t see the warmth as an issue.

 

[sjz]

Date: 8/17/2005 4:46:40 PM
Author: aljdewey

Date: 8/17/2005 2:44:03 PM
Author: sjz

here''s my final answer...lol

The stone on the left in the first two pictures appears to be smaller, less sparkly, and warmer than the stone on the right. It''s harder to tell from the earlobe pictures, because the earring is tilted differently in the two pictures. The diamond on the right appears to be brighter in all of the pictures, but that could be because there is more glare from the diamond on the right in all three pictures. Or it could just be coincidental. Whatever, they don''t look the same in the pictures, regardless.

The diamond on the left in the first two pictures looked darker as opposed to warmer on his computer screen, but the glare or reflection or whatever it is coming off the diamonds looked pretty much the same.

Regarding the pictures...

In the first set, the stone on the left is not warmer.....it''s actually 2 color grades better than the one on the right. In person, there is *no* visible color difference.

In the second set of pictures, the stone of the left is not warmer....both the left and right stones are the same color grade.

In the third set of pictures, it''s the same stone--photographed more from the side and then face-up, mounted and worn......the way most diamonds are viewed.

And throughout this thread, you''ve been arguing that pictures aren''t the same as real life....a point with which I agree, by the way. But if that''s so, then it diminishes relative value of ALL pictures, so putting up a picture of your rings and pointing to them as evidence that visible differences in color grades are *readily* noticeable is also not representative of real life either.

Oh, for pete''s SAKE! I wasn''t using my picture as "evidence" or to argue points. I posted a picture and I clearly stated that one was an H and one was J. I wasn''t challenging anyone to choose which was which, or prove that you can see any difference. I just thought it was interesting and relevant to the thread. I was mostly curious to see if anyone else could see the color difference that I could see. For someone who probably doesn''t care what I think, you have gone to a lot of effort to "prove" me wrong, though. You get points for that.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 8/17/2005 4:38:46 PM
Author: Milly

Date: 8/17/2005 12:57:06 AM
Author: aljdewey
And here? Same? Different? Which is the J here?

I think the first picture, the one on the left appears warmer.
The one on the left is actually the higher color stone.

The second picture, the one on the right appears warmer.
The right and left stones are identical in color.

The 3rd picture, the one on the left appears warmer.
In this set, it''s the same stone in both pictures, but because it''s seen in profile on the left, it shows the tinge more. Face up (as it''s seen on the right), it doesn''t show the warmth the same way....which is seems everyone agrees with.

It is a little hard to tell in the pics with the sparkles in the way!

For all we know, it can be the same color stone!
You''re absolutely right, and that''s the important part to take away....that it''s the sparkle that matters more than anything else, and in most cases, people won''t appreciate subtle differences in color when stones are a grade or two different.

 

[moremoremore]

OMG. I wanted to come see what was going on with this thread LOL...Too much reading for my taste!

Scint- what did you decide? Did you decide to keep it? I have definite color pref's. I want an icy white stone. Partly b/c mentally I like it and partly b/c I can pick up color. If I couldn't pick it up, I wouldn't care for the *most* part. But also, I'd do a lot lower for misc. jewelry items than for an e-ring.

But, I'd still so a G round! (but I'd look for an F first

)

My first e-ring was a 1.77 european EGL H *(princess*). I used to sit here at my desk in disguist looking through the pavillion and face up under different lighting conditions. Now that I've done an E I'm so spoiled.

 

[sjz]

OK, no evidence or point proving. Just a couple more pictures for comparison. I wish I had more RB''s of the same size to use, but I''ve only got the two. I just ran across the street and borrowed my neighbor''s F colored marquise. I think it''s close to 1.5 carats, and I''m not sure of the clarity. But here it is next to my F and my J. Picture taken just a few minutes ago, on my deck in the full sun from about 2 feet away. I think they all look white, but they don''t look the same to me.

 

[sjz]

And here is a picture of my F and my J with my 1 carat 5 stone ring. The jeweler estimated the stones to be G-H color grade in the 5 stone ring. I think that the 5 stone looks equally good with both the F and the J. Same conditions, taken a few minutes ago, full sun from about 2 foot distance.

 

[sjz]

Last one. Same three rings as the first picture, this time with my shadow blocking the full sun. One J and two F''s.

 

[moremoremore]

OK, I think it's so funny that you knocked on the door, Hi, Can I borrow your diamond LOLOL!!!!

I don't think most pictures are accurate unless it's like a pic mara posted where the color difference is very visible. The slighest angles can throw everything off ...

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 8/17/2005 4:52:42 PM
Author: sjz

Hey, for the record, not everyone adds that little disclaimer along with their opinion. And many of the opinons expressed on PS ARE misleading to the ''masses''. I''m not the only one who thinks so, either. Other people have made their feelings known on the subject and agree with me. I''m just the ony one who has chosen to argue this point with you and Mara, and at this juncture, there is no reason for me to continue to do so. I have to hand it to you two, you both will ''beat the dead horse'' until most people agree with you, then proclaim the horse to be dead, as if that''s all there is to it! The funny part is, once again, no one is really even arguing with the two of you. You just seem to keep on wanting to ''prove'' your point until everyone else who thinks there is life in the horse walks away. Please, please, please, read ALL of my posts, not just the parts you highlight and skew your replies to....

I was saying that I AGREE AGREE AGREE that it''s a good idea that people to remind people once in a while that it''s only their OPINION. I WASN''T arguing the position that people DON''T do it. And I never said that anyone who doesn''t add a disclaimer that it is their opinon is fooling themselves. My point was that other people might take those opinions and give them more weight than they should sometimes if the person stating the opinon seems to have enough conviction, or argues better, or posts more often or whatever. You seem to be trying to argue points that I wasn''t even trying to make for some reason.

There''s no need to get rattled; it''s not an argument, it''s just a discussion.

dis·cus·sion ( P ) Pronunciation Key (d-skshn)
n.
Consideration of a subject by a group; an earnest conversation.

I did read all of your posts.....maybe you should go back and do so also. Start from the very beginning. You''d see that you did assign motives to why people made disclaimers......and then called for disclaimers to be made. Honestly, SJ, it''s a *consumer* diamond forum, not a symposium for world peace. I suspect most folks are astute enough to realize that the opinions expressed in the editorials are not necessarily those of management, blah, blah, blah. Many folks (not ALL, but MANY) regularly exercise care in saying "this is what my experience is, but that doesn''t mean you would see it the same way. You need to see diamonds for yourself to decide what''s right for you." It''s a really consistent theme throughout these forums.

Who''s arguing? We''re having a discussion.....where is the problem with that? Further, where did I say others had to agree with me? No one has to agree with me at all. I''m happy being a lone dissenting voice when it applies.

Just because I don''t discard my viewpoint and agree with yours doesn''t mean I expect you or others to agree with me....just having a discussion, a sharing of ideas and sometimes information. That''s what forums are for. Just because I offer an opinion you don''t agree with doesn''t mean I''m arguing with *you* individually.....it means I''m expressing an *alternate* opinion for consideration by *anyone* who wants to read/participate in the thread. If you believe the purpose of my posting is to argue, though......what is it, then, when *you* continue to post?

Others agree with you? That''s great......but so? Does that make your opinion more or less valuable than anyone elses? If six people agree a nickel is worth 3 cents and only one person says it''s worth 5 cents, is the consensus by the six people more relevant simply because they all agreed? With opinions, there IS no right or wrong.....it''s just "how I see it" and "how you see it" and "how John Smith sees it", etc......a discussion hopefully bears a collection of VARYING opinions. Maybe that''s the disconnect for you......I''m not here with the goal of getting everyone to agree. It seems pretty important to you.

The goal of Pricescope has never been to offer one unanimous opinion that everyone agrees with. Rather, the goal has been to create a place where many different opinions can live together. This gives visitors plenty of different perspectives. In the end, though, it''s up to the masses to decide what works for them, and that''s not your responsibility or mine. If someone is giving blatantly WRONG information (i.e. diamonds with a 60% table fit AGS0 paramaters), then sure, the masses could get hurt. But on subjective information, it''s just that....subjective and subject to individual interpretation.

If I were experiencing a health problem, I might choose to consult an online forum, but I certainly wouldn''t consider any information I might gain as a substitute for seeing a licensed doctor. Similarly, Pricescope is clearly identified as a *consumer* forum. Those who want *opinions* of other consumers can come here and get them. It''s up to them to exercise a little common sense in recognizing that such input isn''t a substitute for culling information from learned sources (appraisers, etc.) in the jewelry business.

All of the above is just my two cents.

 

[sjz]

Date: 8/17/2005 5:22:05 PM
Author: moremoremore
OK, I think it''s so funny that you knocked on the door, Hi, Can I borrow your diamond LOLOL!!!!

I don''t think most pictures are accurate unless it''s like a pic mara posted where the color difference is very visible. The slighest angles can throw everything off ...

Oh, my neighbor knows I''m weird...lol. She borrows eggs and sugar from me, I borrow her diamonds! I was just nervous that I''d drop it through the cracks in my deck floor

. She did kind of wonder why I needed to borrow her ring for a few minutes, but she was nice enough to let me do it.

I agree, most pictures aren''t totally accurate. I tried to line the stones up as perfectly as I could, and I put them all on the same finger. I couldn''t get my neighbor''s past my knuckle, though, because her ring size is like a 5 and I wear a 6 I think. I think you can get the idea though, that there is some variation in the color between the diamonds. Especially in the second picture where the J is between the two F''s. I would agree with most people, if you didn''t have two stones of different colors to compare, it is pretty hard to tell the difference by just eyeballing it. But when you can line them all up on one finger, you can see it I think whether you are color sensitive or not. Espeically when there is more than one or two levels of difference between the stones. I thought there was a slight difference between the H and the J for the couple of months that I wore the H, and I can see a bit more difference between the F and the J. I have to say, it''s more difficult with the 5 stone ring, because the diamonds are so much smaller, and they tend to "pick up" the color of which ever stone I put them next to, so they look "whiter" next to the F, and warmer next to the J. That kind of surprised me, because I would have predicted it to go the other way, where the F might make the G-H stones look warmer by comparison, but they don''t. I guess that''s why people can get by with having one or two grades warmer side stones when they have a three stone ring.

 

[Mara]

Date: 8/17/2005 4:52:42 PM
Author: sjz

Date: 8/17/2005 4:32:21 PM
Author: aljdewey

Date: 8/17/2005 2:21:30 PM
Author: sjz
I get what you are saying, Mara, and for the record, I feel the same way. I don''t usually take someone else''s opinion as gospel, either. I do think that the experts are more likely to have a more ''trained'' opinion, though. They see a lot more diamonds than the average consumer, so I would think by sheer numbers alone most of them are better at judging diamonds than average people.

At the risk of repeating myself, you''re trying to tie together two things that are completely different and treat them interchangably when they aren''t.

On the one hand, there is trained opinion that gives a credentialed, learned opinion of what color a diamond is. While subjective, it''s an educated opinion based on years of seeing diamonds and training. That opinion has MUCH value when you are purchasing a stone and trying to assess the fairness of the price associated with that grade. It also means that folks who are trained to recognize these subtle differences will possibly also see them under daily wear conditions....just like folks who train for years at Julliard can hear the same music on the elevator that I do, but they hear far more distinct elements than I do because of their training.

On the *other* hand...and this is the hand we''ve been speaking to since the inception of this thread (or trying to), there is the consumer PERCEPTION of whether or not those distinctions are visibly noticeable to them in non-lab settings. This opinion doesn''t have to be educated; it is simply meant to reflect how a consumer perceives the warmth or lack thereof in his/her stone. This opinion ALSO has value because folks who truly don''t see the color difference between an F and a G can save a ton of money......which can be saved or applied to a better clarity or more size....whatever turns them on.

There is a purpose and a value for both opinions.

There are those who read PS, a lot of them ony lurk for the most part, that do take a lot of what you and other consumers give as their opinions very seriously. To them, a lot of PS regulars are ''experts''. That''s why I think it''s a good idea once in a while to throw out that little disclaimer that what we as consumers are stating really are our opinions, which are formed by a lot of variable factors, including the fact that some people claim to be more color sensitive than others.

Oh my goodness.....SJZ, that''s exactly what folks have been doing! They''ve been saying ''I find my J to look the same as my H, but that''s just how I see it, and you may not see it the same way. You need to see stones yourself...you may be more sensitive to color than I am.''

I just don''t get it....on the one hand, you tell everyone how important it is to add disclaimers that it''s just their opinion (which they already have done), and yet when/if they do that, then they ''aren''t being honest with themselves, or they are deluded about the real color of their stone and have to make excuses for it so they can feel better about it.''

Honestly, for the folks who choose to buy lower colored stones, there''s just no way to satisfy the masses, is there? I''m sure they feel anything but enthusiastic now about the prospect of actually trying to help others and give feedback.

If we''re really worried about the newbies and being misled, that''s certainly one way to solve it....make it so no one feels comfortable sharing an honest, individual opinion because their damned if they do and damned if they don''t.

Hey, for the record, not everyone adds that little disclaimer along with their opinion. And many of the opinons expressed on PS ARE misleading to the ''masses''. I''m not the only one who thinks so, either. Other people have made their feelings known on the subject and agree with me. I''m just the ony one who has chosen to argue this point with you and Mara, and at this juncture, there is no reason for me to continue to do so. I have to hand it to you two, you both will ''beat the dead horse'' until most people agree with you, then proclaim the horse to be dead, as if that''s all there is to it! The funny part is, once again, no one is really even arguing with the two of you. You just seem to keep on wanting to ''prove'' your point until everyone else who thinks there is life in the horse walks away. Please, please, please, read ALL of my posts, not just the parts you highlight and skew your replies to....

I was saying that I AGREE AGREE AGREE that it''s a good idea that people to remind people once in a while that it''s only their OPINION. I WASN''T arguing the position that people DON''T do it. And I never said that anyone who doesn''t add a disclaimer that it is their opinon is fooling themselves. My point was that other people might take those opinions and give them more weight than they should sometimes if the person stating the opinon seems to have enough conviction, or argues better, or posts more often or whatever. You seem to be trying to argue points that I wasn''t even trying to make for some reason.

I would appreciate it if you would NOT accuse me of beating the dead horse here, I quit this morning when I realized you (sjz) would not get my point and I was tired of speaking into the wind.

What cracks me up SJZ is that you say things but then later say ''oh that''s not what I meant''...even though you actually WROTE it. I can''t argue with that. When people quote something you say and respond to it, they are responding to a specific point on something you actually wrote. How can that be not what you meant or a point you weren''t trying to make? I totally don''t get that one.

And for the record, I could care less if others agree or disagree with what you think or I think, it''s MY opinion. Saying ''well others agree with me'' gives no more credence to an opinion IMO.

Done now..I won''t respond to this again...it''s seroiusly white off rice and no I don''t feel like anyone ''agreed'' with me. I''m just bored with this topic and am finding another horse to ride.

 

[sjz]

"I could care less if others agree or disagree with me" "beating a dead horse" "white off rice"

Where have I heard those phrases before?

 

[Kaleigh]

I saddled up my horse a long time ago, Lol!!!!!

 

[Scintillating]

OK OK OK !!!!!
Sheesh!!!!
Everyone to your own corners.

I know this isn't really my thread anymore, but I thought I'd just share with you all.

I guess what I've learned from this is that photographs and the internet won't really help me decern color.
Photographs aren't true to life! I looked very carefully through as many G photos as I could find, and read as many comments as I could find, and was surprised when I saw one in person. It was VERY different from what I expected. I guess I'm very sensitive to color, and I was VERY surprised by this!

It's tough, where I live I can't just go out and see 5 ideal stones to compare.
Shipping can gradually chip away at your budget.
If you go to a BM you can't see anything because of the damn jewelers lights.
It's frustrating...

We purchases the G this afternoon.
We're going to sit with it for a week and see how we feel.
Apparently, 5 minutes after I put the hold on it someone else called to put a hold on it.
And - today when we called to tell them we're going to purchase it, they said that someone was lined up to buy if we passed. Tim said I picked a Cherry, and it would take a long time and more $$$ to find one of the same quality cut and size.

So.... I'll take some photographs and get back to you all when "she

" comes home.

Thanks everyone!

Scintillating....

Oh* Mara and Aljdewey I think you both can declare yourselves very proudly non-colorsensitive ladies.
That's a good thing!
There's room for everyone.

 

[sjz]

Scintillating! I'm excited for you. I think you will probably be very happy with the diamond. Even though you have decided that you are color sensitive. I'm still wondering if I qualify for that distinction

. Oh, well...I guess I have enough to be worried about being clarity sensitive...lol. Can't wait to see your pictures when you get the diamond!

ETA: Oh, and btw...it IS your thread again! I think everyone got off the dead horse and went somewhere else. Sorry about it getting so highjacked, but it was very interesting there for a while. I think I learned a thing or two. I still give you free reign to flog me if you want.

 

[mrssalvo]

Scintillating, Congrats...I can''t wait to see pics of your new stone. It sounds fabulous

 

[Dancing Fire]

Scintillating, congrat on your purchase.

 

[Maxine]

Hope you are happy with your stone.....please keep us posted....

 

[valeria101]

Date: 8/17/2005 5:14:25 PM
Author: sjz

I just ran across the street and borrowed my neighbor''s F colored marquise.

OMG! Talk about dedication! These forums are such a pest...

Is the neighbor a Pricescoper too ?

 

[sjz]

Date: 8/17/2005 7:22:32 PM
Author: valeria101

Date: 8/17/2005 5:14:25 PM
Author: sjz

I just ran across the street and borrowed my neighbor''s F colored marquise.

OMG! Talk about dedication! These forums are such a pest...

Is the neighbor a Pricescoper too ?

LOL...no, but she wanted to know why I needed to "borrow" her ring. After I explained what I was going to do, she just laughed and rolled her eyes and told me I needed to "get out" more. She''s probably right

. I have told her about PS in the past before, and she knows I''m a jewelry nut. I have told a lot of people about PS, but so far, I haven''t seen any posts from anyone I know. I do happen to know that a few people I''ve told have checked it out and lurk here occasionally. They can''t believe I post pictures of my rings, here!

. And I did get my neighbor''s permission to post her ring. I''m going to email a copy to her so that she can save it on her computer.

I keep asking my mom if I can post some pics of her rings...talk about serious blingage! But she''s too afraid. She thinks someone will track her down and rob her if she "advertises" her rocks on the internet.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Date: 8/17/2005 5:57:24 PM
Author: sjz
''I could care less if others agree or disagree with me'' ''beating a dead horse'' ''white off rice''

Where have I heard those phrases before?

i agree with all 3 girls here.so....lets call this match a draw,unless someone cry UNCLE

sjz...i agree, a J doesn''t look like G.
Alj...i agree, without a side by side comparison,it''s hard to tell within one color grade.
Mara...i agree,if a J is what you like,that''s fine too.

 

[sjz]

Date: 8/17/2005 7:55:34 PM
Author: Dancing Fire

Date: 8/17/2005 5:57:24 PM
Author: sjz
''I could care less if others agree or disagree with me'' ''beating a dead horse'' ''white off rice''

Where have I heard those phrases before?

i agree with all 3 girls here.so....lets call this match a draw,unless someone cry UNCLE

sjz...i agree, a J doesn''t look like G.
Alj...i agree, without a side by side comparison,it''s hard to tell within one color grade.
Mara...i agree,if a J is what you like,that''s fine too.

Thanks DF, you are too sweet (especially for calling me a girl...

)

It''s also nice that everyone has the kind of diamond they really want. That''s the most important thing! Now that you''ve mentioned "cry uncle", all the cliche''s have been used, so I guess it''s really over.

Now, back to our regularly scheduled program...

 

[cflutist]

Diamond graders do not just pull colors out of a hat. There is a method to their madness.

For those of you who are interested, here is a brief overview on the subject.

If you disagree with what you read, please take it up with the GIA as I am only
the messenger here.

Note that the colors are a range, and that the ranges get wider as you go down the scale.
Also notice that the colors become more visable as the stones get larger.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 8/17/2005 6:11:00 PM
Author: Scintillating


Oh* Mara and Aljdewey I think you both can declare yourselves very proudly non-colorsensitive ladies.
That''s a good thing!
There''s room for everyone.

See, I think so, too, and I''m glad you do also.

What I hope hasn''t gotten lost in this....for Scintillation or anyone else: Every person needs to find what makes her happy. If your tolerance is an F or a G, that''s what it is, and it''s good to know that. People here just help because they want others to be happy with their ultimate choices, too.

I''m glad to hear you''re giving the G a chance, because you will either decide you can love it, or you can learn that G is just a smidge lower than you can handle. Eitehr way, it''s all good.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 8/17/2005 9:05:30 PM
Author: cflutist
Diamond graders do not just pull colors out of a hat. There is a method to their madness.

For those of you who are interested, here is a brief overview on the subject.

If you disagree with what you read, please take it up with the GIA as I am only
the messenger here.

Note that the colors are a range, and that the ranges get wider as you go down the scale.
Also notice that the colors become more visable as the stones get larger.

No one suggested diamond graders pulled colors out of a hat. God, what does it take to get this through.......what a GRADER sees in a lab and what a customer sees in every day aren't the same thing. They just aren't. That doesn't mean the lab "pulls grades out of a hat", but it doesn't mean that the AVERAGE JOE can discern the difference between an H and J stone in everyday lighting. I don't know why this is so hard to grasp.....BOTH are relevant, and both have their place.

I find it interesting, though, the quotes you posted from the book.......gee, it seems that the GIA Jeweler's Manual actually backs up what Belle said anecdotally in the first place....notably:

"In weights less than .25 carat, E and F diamonds appear colorless. G, H, and many Is appear colorless face-up when mounted." (As in...not how they appear in the lab.)

So, G, H, and I diamonds appear colorless face up, and E/F diamonds are colorless, then gosh, they would appear the SAME in face-up position. Imagine that!

"Face up and mounted in yellow gold, (not in a white tray under Kelvin lighting

) J, K, and L diamonds weighing less than .50 look nearly colorless. But customer can usually see some color in larger stones, and in those mounted in white metal."

So GIA must think it's relevant to comment on what people might see when looking at a diamond face-up, not just in the lab-grading position. Interesting.

"SUBTLE color differences are usually more visible when they are seen through the pavilion."

Yet again, right in line with some of the disclaimer-ed opinions shared in this thread.

I have to refresh my memory now on what Belle said in the beginning....what was it? Oh yeah: "If you find an ideal cut diamond of lower color (h-j) it will face up similarly as 'white' as a colorless (d-f) stone. in low light conditions where there is not a lot of light to be reflected back to the eyes, these stones may appear warmer (much less with a 'g' than with a 'j' of course) and if you view the stone from the side through the pavilion, you may notice some warmth as well."

Seems like the GIA agrees with ya, Belle, and you with them. Ya done good!

Kudos! Great information for the masses to have---thanks for sharing.

It's kind of ironic that the person who respectfully disagreed with Belle's above assessment (which matches that of the GIA) was the "credentialled expert" contributor. I guess it goes to show that even experts can disagree.