Question for the Color Sensitive Ladies/Gents.

[Boom]

This is my 0.96ct G color stone.
My original e-ring is an 0.51ct E VVS2 Lazare and side by side, the difference is quite obvious. On its own though, the G color doesn''t bother me at all. But yes, definitely not as icy white as the E stone.

 

[Scintillating]

Boom,
That's a Beauty, I've admired that ring for a while now.
I never would have guessed that's a G.
(It's on pg. One of the Eye Candy folder.)
Mark Morrell?
Is that an Eighternity or a H&As?
Can you post some more photos for us? Please

.

Scintillating...

 

[Boom]

Thanks Scintillating. It''s an Eightstar in a Mark Morrell setting. Too bad it might not be mine anymore soon.
Anyway, I have some photos I took myself. Maybe they''ll pick up more of the color.

 

[Boom]

Another one indoors.

 

[Boom]

Sideview.

 

[Scintillating]

Boom,
It''s really lovely - looks like a very High G.
I don''t see any tint.
I love the delicate slim setting.
What''s your finger size?
And the Carat weight?

Scintillating...

 

[jaysonsmom]

Date: 8/15/2005 7:44:41 PM
Author: diamondlil
Well, I have an E color pear, and I do consider myself somewhat color sensitve. In a RB though, I would definitely consider going to a G or possibly H to get the size I want as long as it''s an ideal cut.

.

I have a E color princess e-ring and 2 rb''s (one "H" average cut, the other"G" ideal, not H&A cut) and they are H and G. I think the faceting of a rb does make the color show less ideal or not. In most lighting my rb''s are as white as my princess, but under regular sunlight (while driving) I can see body color...I don''t think the color is quite enough of a turn off for me to turn down them down though, they were gifts from my mom

 

[Boom]

Date: 8/16/2005 7:54:42 PM
Author: Scintillating
Boom,
It''s really lovely - looks like a very High G.
I don''t see any tint.
I love the delicate slim setting.
What''s your finger size?
And the Carat weight?

Scintillating...

I was a 6.5...
The stone is a 0.968 G VS1.

 

[Maxine]

Date: 8/16/2005 10:08:33 PM
Author: Boom

Date: 8/16/2005 7:54:42 PM
Author: Scintillating
Boom,
It''s really lovely - looks like a very High G.
I don''t see any tint.
I love the delicate slim setting.
What''s your finger size?
And the Carat weight?

Scintillating...

I was a 6.5...
The stone is a 0.968 G VS1.

????? Do you still have it?????

 

[Jennifer5973]

Date: 8/16/2005 2:00:01 AM
Author: sjz
I'd love to see an M or an R, too. Maybe someone should start another 'show me your...' thread with some of those colors?

I think Sarita has a lovely M color EC: Sarita's Rings

I agree with the comments re: color. There is a reason D-F stones have a premium-they are truly icy white, best of the best on the colorless scale. It's great some are happy with G+ stones to get size but it's also okay to prefer a D. While we can all agree cut is the most important "C," the ranking of the other Cs is personal to each of us.

As I always say, A D is a D is a D, and a J is a J is a J.

 

[Maxine]

If they all looked the same, there wouldn''t be different color grades!!!!! Some people prefer different colors.......and that''s OK......... Personally, I love my stone. (E-F)..but I wouldn''t object to getting another stone in a lower color (in addition to, not instead of what I have!!).

 

[noobie]

Date: 8/10/2005 12:50:30 PM
Author: cflutist

Date: 8/10/2005 11:57:55 AM




Just last week I saw D, F, H, I, and J diamonds, all 1.5ct RBs, all side by side in a white grading trough under 6500 degree Kelvin lighting (what the GIA uses for color grading). Paviliion up, definitely a difference between the colors, especially from I to J. Face up, the differences were more subtle but still there.

I just did this today and I would agree. I limited it to G,H,I though. I could see differences face up and had personal preferences. Some may not see the difference face up between D and J but I sure can.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 8/10/2005 12:50:30 PM
Author: cflutist

Date: 8/10/2005 11:57:55 AM
Author: belle
if you find an ideal cut diamond of lower color (h-j) it will face up as ''white'' as a colorless (d-f) stone..

Belle, just curious, have you personally seen examples of this?

Just last week I saw D, F, H, I, and J diamonds, all 1.5ct RBs, all side by side in a white grading trough under 6500 degree Kelvin lighting (what the GIA uses for color grading). Paviliion up, definitely a difference between the colors, especially from I to J. Face up, the differences were more subtle but still there.

I have to respectfully disagree with your comment.

I''m sure you''re right, CF, that there are subtle differences.....just as their are subtle differences between an IF and a VVS stone even if they cannot be discerned by the naked eye.

I appreciate these distinctions insofar as they will affect the ultimate price of the stone, so of course I''d want them to be accurate.

However, I have to say.....it seems the poster''s question goes to whether or not folks who are color sensitive are satisfied with a G in real-life lighting conditions. As a consumer, I can''t think of a situation where I''d anticipate wearing my diamond under a 6500 degree Kelvin light or in a white tray, so it''s hard to appreciate the relevance of such distinctions outside of a lab setting.

Just speaking to this consumer''s opinion, I''m likely more interested in perceptible/appreciable differences that can be appreciated in real life situations--how the diamond would face up to the average, non-GG viewer when mounted and worn during outdoor daylight or muted indoor lights, etc.

 

[Boom]

Date: 8/16/2005 10:13:50 PM
Author: Maxine

Date: 8/16/2005 10:08:33 PM
Author: Boom

Date: 8/16/2005 7:54:42 PM
Author: Scintillating
Boom,
It''s really lovely - looks like a very High G.
I don''t see any tint.
I love the delicate slim setting.
What''s your finger size?
And the Carat weight?

Scintillating...

I was a 6.5...
The stone is a 0.968 G VS1.

????? Do you still have it?????

Yes, but I just gave birth a couple of months ago and haven''t lost the extra weight yet, so I''m up to a 7.
The ring was made when I was a 6.5. Technically though, Mark says it''s a 6.25 but he made it ever so slightly oval to fit the finger. Confusing, isn''t it?

When I went to Tiffany''s to get a simple platinum band, the guy helping us took my ring, put it over the mandrel and handed us a 6.25 band. He looked so confused when the band wouldn''t fit my finger. A 6.5 fit fine, but I ended up with a 7 to wear with my MM ring.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 8/15/2005 9:37:48 PM
Author: sjz
Same goes for the people who tend to go for the diamonds in the H,I,J,K range. Why do they need to keep saying how 'white' their stones look?

Well, I can only speak for myself, but when I say it, it's because I truly mean it. My J looks white to me. You can believe that or not as you choose, of course. I can't say that it faces up as white as any other color or not, because my J is a .55 earring, and the only thing I've put it next to is my 1.25 H e-ring stone. Face up in natural lighting conditions we live in during a day, I don't see a difference between them. I do see a slight warmth in the J from the side.

I sort of feel like some people are afraid they will be critisized for sacrificing color to get a bigger stone, so they try to make up for it by saying how white their near colorless stone is.

I think you presume what isn't there. I personally don't feel the need to "justify" my selection criteria to anyone, and I know many others don't either. They are simply sharing what *they* found worked for them. They try to "make up" for sacrificing color? Who has to make up for anything? Speaking for myself, I don't worry at all what other people think, so I don't feel the need to "make up" for anything.

Different people value different things. On an unlimited budget....with a $32million lottery winnings in hand to get any size I wanted with no problem.....I still wouldn't choose a D stone. That's me. You may choose differently, which I also respect. But believe it or not, some folks DO prefer the look of a J......Brian (at WF) has seen this several times when customers come in and select what their eye likes when their mind doesn't KNOW what it's supposed to be.

I don't feel the need to apologize about not liking the taste of foie gras or caviar either. I'm not into liking something just because it's supposed to be the best according to others. I'm much more independent minded than that.....and I have no problem selecting what I like without apology.

Just my two cents.

 

[Scintillating]

Date: 8/16/2005 11:14:04 PM
Author: aljdewey

Date: 8/15/2005 9:37:48 PM

Author:

Well, I can only speak for myself, but when I say it, it's because I truly mean it. My J looks white to me.

I don't see a difference between them. (H&J) I do see a slight warmth in the J from the side.

No one is trashing J's here.
There is a place for D's and J's, people who love each, and people who love both.

That your J looks white to you, but it won't look white to me.
Perceptions of color are very different and individual.
It's okay to have preferences in color and warmth.

Let's try to keep things constructive. The comment about warmth from the side is constructive.

Anyone have more images of their G they'd like to share?

Scintillating...

 

[Mara]

Date: 8/16/2005 11:22:46 PM
Author: Scintillating

Date: 8/16/2005 11:14:04 PM
Author: aljdewey

Date: 8/15/2005 9:37:48 PM

Author: sjz

Well, I can only speak for myself, but when I say it, it's because I truly mean it. My J looks white to me.

I think this is what we're trying to communicate here.
That your J looks white to you, but it won't look white to me.
Perceptions of color are very different and individual.

Scintillating...

Of course they are, so there should be no need to justify anything...nor do I think that is what PS'ers are doing.

From my perspective if people say something like 'my J faces up white' or 'I'm not color sensitive'...those are FACTS to them. Not a justification of anything, but I think they are trying to explain how it looks to them so that others can 'see' through their eyes.

For what it is worth I had a G VS and then an H SI and now a J SI. To be honest, the G looked exactly like the H. The J looks a very very tiny bit off-white compared to the H but still very close. I don't perceive myself as being color-sensitive, to me that's a FACT. But when people ask about color, it is so personal that someone saying 'I'm not color sensitive' means that to me, being not color sensitive, an E looks like an I and that is probably very true. My husband's E ACA looks almost exactly like my J when we compare it in 9 out of 10 lighting situations. To us that is fascinating.

And I would venture to say that my J would look 'WHITE' to you because you would be viewing it face down on my hand.

No one believes my stone is a J because of the real-life viewing situation they see it in. But I always tell people to go into stores and see things for themselves because there no color perception like your very own.

ETA: I will find my old stone which is a G VS and post it later!

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 8/16/2005 11:22:46 PM
Author: Scintillating

Date: 8/16/2005 11:14:04 PM
Author: aljdewey

Date: 8/15/2005 9:37:48 PM

Author:

Well, I can only speak for myself, but when I say it, it's because I truly mean it. My J looks white to me.

No one is trashing J's here.
There is a place for D's and J's, people who love each, and people who love both.

I think this is what we're trying to communicate here.
That your J looks white to you, but it won't look white to me.
Perceptions of color are very different and individual.

Let's try to keep things constructive.

Anyone have more images of their G they'd like to share?

Scintillating...

Who said anyone was trashing Js? I didn't. SJZ asked "why do people keep saying their Js look white?" I answered that question, and in fact I bolded the part that I was answering so it would be clear.

I'm not defending J stones, or any others for that matter. I don't believe any color choice needs defending. I'm saying that people who share their appreciation for something don't do so in defense of their choices. Even if you *were* trashing J stones, I wouldn't care.....but it's important to clarify that I didn't think you were trashing J stones in the first place. I can appreciate that we all have our tolerances for what our eye likes. Why is that so hard to believe?

As far as why people say "it looks white *to me*"....I think that's because they are trying to be cognizant of the fact that everyone does perceive color individually.....so they aren't trying to justify their own choices so much as they are trying to say "it works for me, but that doesn't mean it will work for you." Just like I know my J wouldn't work for you, and that's fine. No offense taken at all.

Noobie is a great example. He bought a J stone, tried to embrace it for a few weeks, realized that he did indeed see a tinge and that it bothered him. That's great - different strokes for different folks. I'm not offended he didn't like a J....I'm happy he was able to define his tolerance levels. He knows what works best for him, and that's the goal for each shopper.

Where did things become less than constructive, by the way? You're asking for input on color, and several folks (myself included) have given thoughtful responses. No one has said "oh that's WRONG".....we are all offering opinions, albeit varying ones. Where is the "non-constructive" coming from?

 

[sjz]

Date: 8/16/2005 11:29:11 PM
Author: Mara

Date: 8/16/2005 11:22:46 PM
Author: Scintillating

Date: 8/16/2005 11:14:04 PM
Author: aljdewey

Date: 8/15/2005 9:37:48 PM

Author: sjz

Well, I can only speak for myself, but when I say it, it''s because I truly mean it. My J looks white to me.

I think this is what we''re trying to communicate here.
That your J looks white to you, but it won''t look white to me.
Perceptions of color are very different and individual.

Scintillating...

Of course they are, so there should be no need to justify anything...nor do I think that is what PS''ers are doing.

From my perspective if people say something like ''my J faces up white'' or ''I''m not color sensitive''...those are FACTS to them. Not a justification of anything, but I think they are trying to explain how it looks to them so that others can ''see'' through their eyes.

For what it is worth I had a G VS and then an H SI and now a J SI. To be honest, the G looked exactly like the H. The J looks a very very tiny bit off-white compared to the H but still very close. I don''t perceive myself as being color-sensitive, to me that''s a FACT. But when people ask about color, it is so personal that someone saying ''I''m not color sensitive'' means that to me, being not color sensitive, an E looks like an I and that is probably very true. My husband''s E ACA looks almost exactly like my J when we compare it in 9 out of 10 lighting situations. To us that is fascinating.

And I would venture to say that my J would look ''WHITE'' to you because you would be viewing it face down on my hand.

No one believes my stone is a J because of the real-life viewing situation they see it in. But I always tell people to go into stores and see things for themselves because there no color perception like your very own.

ETA: I will find my old stone which is a G VS and post it later!

Mara,
Do you have a picture of your J next to your husband''s E that you could post? I would be interested to see how close they look.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 8/16/2005 11:42:38 PM
Author: sjz


Mara,
Do you have a picture of your J next to your husband's E that you could post? I would be interested to see how close they look.

This would be interesting.

I think side by side, a difference of some kind would be evident in that instance.

But then again, it's hard to know how much of that difference would be attributable to one of two things: the E stone is a .39; the J stone in a 1.6x, and we all know that body color is more evident the larger the stone. Also, of course people can more readily make out distinctions when objects are side by side.......and less so when they aren't.

It would be a very interesting test to plant two women among other patrons in a restaurant or among coworkers in an conference room.....one wearing a .50 J and one wearing a .50 E in identical type settings but not directly side by side. It would be interesting to see what differences could be observed then, and whether or not folks could readily pick out the E-wearer and the J-wearer.

Maybe Storm could set that up.

 

[sjz]

Date: 8/16/2005 11:30:11 PM
Author: aljdewey


Who said anyone was trashing Js? I didn''t. SJZ asked ''why do people keep saying their Js look white?'' I answered that question, and in fact I bolded the part that I was answering so it would be clear.

I''m not defending J stones, or any others for that matter. I don''t believe any color choice needs defending. I''m saying that people who share their appreciation for something don''t do so in defense of their choices. Even if you *were* trashing J stones, I wouldn''t care.....but it''s important to clarify that I didn''t think you were trashing J stones in the first place. I can appreciate that we all have our tolerances for what our eye likes. Why is that so hard to believe?

As far as why people say ''it looks white *to me*''....I think that''s because they are trying to be cognizant of the fact that everyone does perceive color individually.....so they aren''t trying to justify their own choices so much as they are trying to say ''it works for me, but that doesn''t mean it will work for you.'' Just like I know my J wouldn''t work for you, and that''s fine. No offense taken at all.

Noobie is a great example. He bought a J stone, tried to embrace it for a few weeks, realized that he did indeed see a tinge and that it bothered him. That''s great - different strokes for different folks. I''m not offended he didn''t like a J....I''m happy he was able to define his tolerance levels. He knows what works best for him, and that''s the goal for each shopper.

Where did things become less than constructive, by the way? You''re asking for input on color, and several folks (myself included) have given thoughtful responses. No one has said ''oh that''s WRONG''.....we are all offering opinions, albeit varying ones. Where is the ''non-constructive'' coming from?

Actually, my question wasn''t "why people keep saying their J''s look white"...I was more wondering why some people *seem* to need to qualify their color preference as being white, or looking the same as a more colorless grade of stone. I have to say I''ve never heard the term "color sensitive" until I read it on PS. If I''m getting this right, color sensitivity relates to the color or tint in a diamond being more noticable to some people than to others? As if it''s some kind of visual thing? I just think it''s more of a mental thing. Same as clarity. Some people say they can''t see the inclusions in an "eye clean" SI stone. Other people (I''m one of them) can see inclusions in not only supposed "eye clean" SI stones, but can often see inclusions in VS stones as well. Does that make me "inclusion sensitive"? Once I''ve spotted an inclusion with a loupe, I can always *see* it. So I have had to come to terms with the fact that I need to have a diamond that has no inclusions that are visible to me with a loupe. Or at the very least...VERY hard to find with a loupe.

 

[sjz]

I hope I can get this picture to post. I haven't been having the best of luck posting pictures here lately. A while back when I had the .74 H ACA stone, I posted a picture of it side by side with my .75 J. I think you can see some difference between the two stones. Tomorrow I will try to get a picture of my .76 F next to the .75 J for comparison. To me, they all look white, but I can't in all honesty say that the J looks as white as the H, or the F.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 8/16/2005 11:58:11 PM
Author: sjz

Actually, my question wasn't 'why people keep saying their J's look white'...I was more wondering why some people *seem* to need to qualify their color preference as being white, or looking the same as a more colorless grade of stone.

Gotcha. I was answering what you actually asked (in writing) instead of what you meant.

I have to say I've never heard the term 'color sensitive' until I read it on PS. If I'm getting this right, color sensitivity relates to the color or tint in a diamond being more noticable to some people than to others? As if it's some kind of visual thing? I just think it's more of a mental thing.

I really don't believe it's just a "mental" thing. It is indeed a visual thing. Senses are individual, and not everyone is wired the same way.

I have light blue eyes, and there are times when I literally cannot sit in a bright room without my eyes watering like I'm bawling. Other people who aren't as sensitive to light....even some who also have light blue eyes......don't have that problem.

Sense of smell is another great example. Two of my friends (Tina & Nancy) have never smoked, and neither grew up in a smoking household. The three of us were standing together outside a departmetn store during a sale weekend waiting for a 4th friend (Tracy) to arrive. When she arrived, Nancy could smell cigarette smoke; Tina couldn't.....and Tracy hadn't had a cigarette in more than 30 minutes (because she doesn't smoke in her car.) We call Nancy the "narc nose". She's the only one of us who gets a headache going into the scented candle store too.

We don't all perceive things the same way. Some folks are color blind; others aren't. Not everyone's experience is identical, and I think that's why you hear things like "color sensitive", etc. It's a way of saying "this is my perception, but it may not be yours." I really don't think it's offered as an excuse so much as it is a disclaimer-----I find it this way, but that doesn't mean everyone will.

When people ask about color or inclusions, they are *subjective* topics. Some descriptors are subjective, like "loud". What I find loud....what makes my head pound, may not bother you.

It's not like asking how much is left if you subtract 2 cents from a dollar. There is no interpretation there.

 

[aljdewey]

Oh, this will be fun....

What are these stones? Are they the same, or are they different?

 

[sjz]

Date: 8/17/2005 12:36:39 AM
Author: aljdewey

Date: 8/16/2005 11:58:11 PM
Author: sjz

Actually, my question wasn''t ''why people keep saying their J''s look white''...I was more wondering why some people *seem* to need to qualify their color preference as being white, or looking the same as a more colorless grade of stone.

Gotcha. I was answering what you actually asked (in writing) instead of what you meant.

I have to say I''ve never heard the term ''color sensitive'' until I read it on PS. If I''m getting this right, color sensitivity relates to the color or tint in a diamond being more noticable to some people than to others? As if it''s some kind of visual thing? I just think it''s more of a mental thing.

I really don''t believe it''s just a ''mental'' thing. It is indeed a visual thing. Senses are individual, and not everyone is wired the same way.

I have light blue eyes, and there are times when I literally cannot sit in a bright room without my eyes watering like I''m bawling. Other people who aren''t as sensitive to light....even some who also have light blue eyes......don''t have that problem.

Sense of smell is another great example. Two of my friends (Tina & Nancy) have never smoked, and neither grew up in a smoking household. The three of us were standing together outside a departmetn store during a sale weekend waiting for a 4th friend (Tracy) to arrive. When she arrived, Nancy could smell cigarette smoke; Tina couldn''t.....and Tracy hadn''t had a cigarette in more than 30 minutes (because she doesn''t smoke in her car.) We call Nancy the ''narc nose''. She''s the only one of us who gets a headache going into the scented candle store too.

We don''t all perceive things the same way. Some folks are color blind; others aren''t. Not everyone''s experience is identical, and I think that''s why you hear things like ''color sensitive'', etc. It''s a way of saying ''this is my perception, but it may not be yours.'' I really don''t think it''s offered as an excuse so much as it is a disclaimer-----I find it this way, but that doesn''t mean everyone will.

When people ask about color or inclusions, they are *subjective* topics. Some descriptors are subjective, like ''loud''. What I find loud....what makes my head pound, may not bother you.

It''s not like asking how much is left if you subtract 2 cents from a dollar. There is no interpretation there.

Subjectively speaking, that''s why I think that TPTB should just decide to sell diamonds by the pound...that way we could just throw all that stuff about color and clarity affecting price out the window. All we would have to worry about then is finding a diamond that is cut to our specifications and just choose what color and plot pattern we like, and we are all set! But that''s just my fantasy, I guess.

 

[Demelza]

Alj -- I totally agree. I don''t think being "color sensitive" is only a psychological phenomenom. I guess I would be considered "inclusion sensitive" in that I have a very good eye for picking out inclusions, but I don''t have a very good eye for seeing slight variations in diamond color. What that says about my eyesight (which is very good as far as I know) I don''t know, but I do think it''s a real thing. I would imagine it takes some aspiring gemologists a long time to be able to make the subtle distinctions between a G and an H and for some it comes naturally. The psychological aspect of this issue comes in when a lower color stone looks perfectly good to your eyes yet you still have a hang up about having a lower color stone. I, for instance, am upgrading in size from a G to an I. I don''t perceive the difference visually, but I have been struggling with it psychologically.

 

[aljdewey]

........and what do you see here? Are they the same? Different?

 

[sjz]

There''s a little too much glare on the picture for me to tell much, to be honest.

 

[Mara]

I don''t have a picture of the two rings side by side but I will see if I can get something. However, I think you may not see a difference in the picture, because they are both set into rings, and there is a large size difference.

I will post a side by side of my original G and my H and then my J though, once I get a chance. All in the same setting.

 

[aljdewey]

And here? Same? Different? Which is the J here?