Protests To Trump's Anthem Slurs Grow To Nationwide Rebuke

[redwood66]

If most American's feel they have it better now than they did in 1960, why is your President trying to take the country back to 1960?

I watched the movie "The Help" with a 26 year old neighbor when it was playing in theaters. When we were driving home she asked me if that was what really happened in the early 60's. When I said yes, she said it made her feel ashamed to be white. Here we are all these years later and one of the biggest racists In our country is the President. SAD

He is our president whether you claim him or not. Knowledge of how it was and how it still in some areas is a good thing. It is too bad your neighbor feels ashamed for something she has no control over and things she did not and hopefully does not do. One can only do what is in their power to do as Molly did for her neighbor which was an awesome thing. I make a difference where I have the power to do so. Complaining on a forum does nothing to further anything. Casting aspersions doesn't either. None of this is meant to be disrespectful to you.

 

[smitcompton]

Hi,

Yes, the players are talking to America. On bended knee, like supplicants in prayer, they hope some people hear. Their cause is simple. Please stop shooting my people. Nothing more, nothing less. They have been heard. People who wouldn't dream of standing when the National Anthem is played on TV, now turn off the TV until the supplication is over. Non violent protest infuriates. I respect the flag and my protesting fellow citizens. They are quite compatible to me.

Annette

 

[Dancing Fire]

I watched the movie "The Help" with a 26 year old neighbor when it was playing in theaters. When we were driving home she asked me if that was what really happened in the early 60's. When I said yes, she said it made her feel ashamed to be white. Here we are all these years later and one of the biggest racists In our country is the President. SAD

Really sad to hear from anyone who is ashamed b/c the color of their skin...

 

[minousbijoux]

Hi,

Yes, the players are talking to America. On bended knee, like supplicants in prayer, they hope some people hear. Their cause is simple. Please stop shooting my people. Nothing more, nothing less. They have been heard. People who wouldn't dream of standing when the National Anthem is played on TV, now turn off the TV until the supplication is over. Non violent protest infuriates. I respect the flag and my protesting fellow citizens. They are quite compatible to me.

Annette

Beautifully said.

 

[Tekate]

I have read that young Germans still fee a sense of shame of their grandparents and parents. Complaining or discussing Red? The girl friend a sense of responsibiity albeit she had no part in it because she is white, we have the right to speak our minds and this forum and others allows us to do it although we should and must follow the terms of each forum. People go to forums because they look for like minded or try to influence others or just to vent and discuss. When I was a kid I saw judgemet at nuremburg and I felt ashamed that my great grand parents were German. We need to learn from the past and its mistakes.

He is our president whether you claim him or not. Knowledge of how it was and how it still in some areas is a good thing. It is too bad your neighbor feels ashamed for something she has no control over and things she did not and hopefully does not do. One can only do what is in their power to do as Molly did for her neighbor which was an awesome thing. I make a difference where I have the power to do so. Complaining on a forum does nothing to further anything. Casting aspersions doesn't either. None of this is meant to be disrespectful to you.

 

[Tekate]

When my older son was in 1st grade many moons ago in Raleigh NC his best buddy, Marcus asked him if my son thought he was ugly. My son said no and why would Marc think that, he replied because I am black and black is ugly. SO... this little sweetheart of a kid felt shame at 6. That taught me a thing or two back in 93 and it still teaches my son. Marc is a teacher today. Still a sweetheart of a kid to me. Marcus felt white privilege at 7. Think DF. THINK outside the loop of Me and think about how THEY feel.

Really sad to hear from anyone who is ashamed b/c the color of their skin...

 

[redwood66]

I have read that young Germans still fee a sense of shame of their grandparents and parents. Complaining or discussing Red? The girl friend a sense of responsibiity albeit she had no part in it because she is white, we have the right to speak our minds and this forum and others allows us to do it although we should and must follow the terms of each forum. People go to forums because they look for like minded or try to influence others or just to vent and discuss. When I was a kid I saw judgemet at nuremburg and I felt ashamed that my great grand parents were German. We need to learn from the past and its mistakes.

My post is an observation and opinion to someone who quoted to me directly. Everyone has the right to speak their minds and not everyone sees things the same. That should be ok should it not? The complaining is about Trump and is constant - meh whatever. I don't think anyone should be ashamed of things they have no control over. I am certainly incredibly sad, even angry, by the behavior of people in our past and wish desperately that things had been different. But I do not have shame for it because that would indicate that I had some hand in it or could have changed the outcome personally.

a·shamed
[əˈSHāmd]
ADJECTIVE

1. embarrassed or guilty because of one's actions, characteristics, or associations

 

[redwood66]

When my older son was in 1st grade many moons ago in Raleigh NC his best buddy, Marcus asked him if my son thought he was ugly. My son said no and why would Marc think that, he replied because I am black and black is ugly. SO... this little sweetheart of a kid felt shame at 6. That taught me a thing or two back in 93 and it still teaches my son. Marc is a teacher today. Still a sweetheart of a kid to me. Marcus felt white privilege at 7. Think DF. THINK outside the loop of Me and think about how THEY feel.

This is not the same situation as Callie's post. Please see my post above. DF did say it was sad that anyone would feel shame because of the color of their skin. This would apply to the little boy as well.

 

[Ella]

Folks, act like adults and no name calling please.

 

[azstonie]

She'll probably add you to her A$$hole Club. I think I'm the first member so I'm more special than you

I'm the founding member and I'm also the chair of the Sunshine Committee! I'm processing RAC applications as fast as I can, please be patient and during the interim, one may amuse themself reading The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, HuffPo, The New Yorker, and The Atlantic ---->all on the RAC Unapproved Reading List.

 

[azstonie]

It takes a lot of guts to say this on HO.... Liberals here will skin you alive...

DF, those Working Woman Lunches aren't going to make themselves!

 

[Tekate]

Well Red, saying you think one shouldn't feel bad about actions they have no control over is a nice thing, but it doesn't happen often. The If and Only if's of life. I think everyone should be able to speak their mind and often, when I get fuzzy and when people speak their mind with no basis in fact or truth, then I get a bit gobsmacked by all I have read in the last 2 years, the BS etc. Say if my greats had owned slaves, I would feel bad about that, I couldn't change it, it wasn't my fault, but the sin's of the fathers shall be visited upon the children sort of thing. The best thing we can do imho is to try and not repeat the sins of the past.

My post is an observation and opinion to someone who quoted to me directly. Everyone has the right to speak their minds and not everyone sees things the same. That should be ok should it not? The complaining is about Trump and is constant - meh whatever. I don't think anyone should be ashamed of things they have no control over. I am certainly incredibly sad, even angry, by the behavior of people in our past and wish desperately that things had been different. But I do not have shame for it because that would indicate that I had some hand in it or could have changed the outcome personally.

a·shamed
[əˈSHāmd]
ADJECTIVE

1. embarrassed or guilty because of one's actions, characteristics, or associations

 

[redwood66]

Well Red, saying you think one shouldn't feel bad about actions they have no control over is a nice thing, but it doesn't happen often. The If and Only if's of life. I think everyone should be able to speak their mind and often, when I get fuzzy and when people speak their mind with no basis in fact or truth, then I get a bit gobsmacked by all I have read in the last 2 years, the BS etc. Say if my greats had owned slaves, I would feel bad about that, I couldn't change it, it wasn't my fault, but the sin's of the fathers shall be visited upon the children sort of thing. The best thing we can do imho is to try and not repeat the sins of the past.

What doesn't often happen? I am trying to understand what you are saying. And what did I say that had no basis in truth? Feeling bad is not the same as feeling ashamed in my mind. Maybe we see it differently because I am pretty literal when it comes to what things mean. Shame is a personal feeling to me because of what someone has personally done. I can feel bad or empathetic about a lot of things I think are unjust or terrible. That is where I was coming from in my response to Callie. Maybe it is a misunderstanding.

I agree totally with your last thought.

 

[lovedogs]

I think I feel more similar to @Tekate , but definitely see where @redwood66 is coming from as well. I do often feel guilty/bad about not having to deal with issues that POC (especially women of color) face regularly. I hate that there are so many people who are greeted in stores as though they might steal something, and it makes me feel guilty that I don't have to bear any of that burden. So maybe the right word isn't "shame", but more akin to "guilt" or "painful awareness of privilege". I've never had anyone see me at night and purposefully cross the street out of fear, but I know this happens regularly to others, and makes them feel like they are somehow "bad" or "dangerous". I've never thought that the police might shoot me because they erroneously feared for their lives. I guess just knowing that I've never faced those challenges sometimes makes me feel bad. I wish the burden of prejudice was shared more 'equally' sometimes, because I'd like to take some of that burden from others.

 

[Calliecake]

Red and Dancing Fire, The young women I was talking about said she was ashamed she was white because of the way white people in the past had treated black people. I thought after I mentioned we were watching the movie "The Help" it would be clear that was what I meant.

There should be constant complaining about Trump. I never thought I would see what happened in Charlottesville in my lifetime. He has made it clear to more than half our population that he has no intention of being our president. I imagine I will be complaining about him for the next 3 years. Please put me on ignore if it bothers you.

I loved your post @smitcompton

 

[redwood66]

I think I feel more similar to @Tekate , but definitely see where @redwood66 is coming from as well. I do often feel guilty/bad about not having to deal with issues that POC (especially women of color) face regularly. I hate that there are so many people who are greeted in stores as though they might steal something, and it makes me feel guilty that I don't have to bear any of that burden. So maybe the right word isn't "shame", but more akin to "guilt" or "painful awareness of privilege". I've never had anyone see me at night and purposefully cross the street out of fear, but I know this happens regularly to others, and makes them feel like they are somehow "bad" or "dangerous". I've never thought that the police might shoot me because they erroneously feared for their lives. I guess just knowing that I've never faced those challenges sometimes makes me feel bad. I wish the burden of prejudice was shared more 'equally' sometimes, because I'd like to take some of that burden from others.

I think we all should say or do something if we see any kind of injustice toward anyone, POC or not. That is difficult because many people don't want to get involved but how else do you change the way things are? @lovedogs you are a kind and decent person who would likely give someone the shirt off your back.

 

[redwood66]

Red and Dancing Fire, The young women I was talking about said she was ashamed she was white because of the way white people in the past had treated black people. I thought after I mentioned we were watching the movie "The Help" it would be clear that was what I meant.

There should be constant complaining about Trump. He has made it clear to more than half our population that he has no intention of being our president. I imagine I will be complaining about him for the next 3 years. Please put me on ignore if it bothers you.

I loved your post @smitcompton

Why would you bother me and why would I put you on ignore for complaining about Trump? I would have everyone but about 3 people on PS on ignore. That would make for a lonely place. LOL. But I can voice my opinion to you and have a conversation with you can't I? We don't have to agree in order to discuss something as long as we are respectful. I did explain my thoughts on "shame" upthread.

 

[Tekate]

I'm saying because you don't feel guilty about the past or ancestors bad actions that others may and do.

I am sorry if I said you had 'no basis in truth' truth is, we all have our own story to tell, yours is as valid as mine. Yes I think you are more literal and I am more esotoertic in my thoughts. When I reply to you it is to show you there is another opinion as valid as your own, when I read what you write I hear and
(see ) a different perspective than my own, I can learn and sometimes I can disagree.

I feel the future is more my kids and their kids (maybe I will have a grand kid?). But I want them to have choices and not be forced to live someone else's idea of the the country and world.

You know Red, you more than anyone else in the past year made me think, you said last year that you did not like having to be governed by a group (democrats) who did not have the same ideas of what made a good America, I thought about that long and hard, especially Red when Trump was elected and I have seen my country go red! I do not like it at all to be governed by conservatives, but yet I thought, how to ensure people like you have a voice? It was quite the thought process for me, I always remember what you said and how you felt because I had NEVER felt that way. So I changed a bit. When I reply to you I am trying to let you in on my narrative and my thoughts

What doesn't often happen? I am trying to understand what you are saying. And what did I say that had no basis in truth? Feeling bad is not the same as feeling ashamed in my mind. Maybe we see it differently because I am pretty literal when it comes to what things mean. Shame is a personal feeling to me because of what someone has personally done. I can feel bad or empathetic about a lot of things I think are unjust or terrible. That is where I was coming from in my response to Callie. Maybe it is a misunderstanding.

I agree totally with your last thought.

 

[redwood66]

I'm saying because you don't feel guilty about the past or ancestors bad actions that others may and do.

I am sorry if I said you had 'no basis in truth' truth is, we all have our own story to tell, yours is as valid as mine. Yes I think you are more literal and I am more esotoertic in my thoughts. When I reply to you it is to show you there is another opinion as valid as your own, when I read what you write I hear and
(see ) a different perspective than my own, I can learn and sometimes I can disagree.

I feel the future is more my kids and their kids (maybe I will have a grand kid?). But I want them to have choices and not be forced to live someone else's idea of the the country and world.

You know Red, you more than anyone else in the past year made me think, you said last year that you did not like having to be governed by a group (democrats) who did not have the same ideas of what made a good America, I thought about that long and hard, especially Red when Trump was elected and I have seen my country go red! I do not like it at all to be governed by conservatives, but yet I thought, how to ensure people like you have a voice? It was quite the thought process for me, I always remember what you said and how you felt because I had NEVER felt that way. So I changed a bit. When I reply to you I am trying to let you in on my narrative and my thoughts

I so appreciate all of this from you because I realize that my entire perspective probably does not come across well enough here on PS. It is very hard to even try to portray a different POV here. So hard. But I learn so much about someone else's POV so it is important to stay. I like that I can talk to a few here who try to keep it civil. There is a collective thought that conservatives cannot be empathetic or care about anyone but this is so far from the truth it is ridiculous. The internet makes nuance difficult in conversations, especially when one's speaking and writing style is matter-of-fact and literal.

As far as how others feel or their opinions, it is a given in my mind that others have a different POV and don't have to see everything like me. I would never expect or demand that anyone to see it like I do. That is why your first sentence is baffling to me because I assume that you know that. Perhaps this is the problem in my communication here. I do not need anyone to agree with me rather just respect that I have a different POV than you. Because I absolutely and automatically respect everyone here on PS's right to have their opinion without question. I guess I expect everyone else to be the same. Is that wrong? Do I need to clarify everything I write with an "I understand but"? Because I do understand that others feel differently by default, especially on PS. And their opinions are automatically valid even if I disagree, but so are mine no? Thank you so much.

Edit - I had another thought about myself that probably comes across different. I am not an overly emotional person which is not the same as not having empathy. I don't let things in the world get me worked up. Even when Obama said he was going to fundamentally transform my America.

 

[redwood66]

When I reply to you I am trying to let you in on my narrative and my thoughts

BTW so am I. I thought that is what PS is about. You or I don't have to agree but we can discuss it respectfully.

I am a serial editor here on PS btw.

 

[Tekate]

OMG serial editor - girl I thought I was the worst. I can never write without having to edit the nice thing here is, they give a bit of time Red and then I'm stuck with the find when I meant FINE!

I did mean what I said, b4 you said you didn't want to be governed by the coasts liberals, I had to think 'dang' I thought hmm.. I never had to feel that way because some to at least 1/3 of my life has been under a democratic prez's - I lived in the north east till I was 38. Many years (although I wish was 38 )

It all goes back to meeting and trying to find common ground.

all love on this beautiful fall Sunday in Maine BTW!

BTW so am I. I thought that is what PS is about. You or I don't have to agree but we can discuss it respectfully.

I am a serial editor here on PS btw.

 

[jaaron]

I am certainly incredibly sad, even angry, by the behavior of people in our past and wish desperately that things had been different. But I do not have shame for it because that would indicate that I had some hand in it or could have changed the outcome personally.

a·shamed
[əˈSHāmd]
ADJECTIVE

1. embarrassed or guilty because of one's actions, characteristics, or associations

I'm genuinely curious, Redwood - when you say that, what specific things/behaviors in the past make you sad or angry and make you wish they were different? Because I personally feel that we are now at one of those moments in history where we are at a similar crossroads when it comes to making decisions about personal responsibility.

Not aimed at you, but in general- there's a quote going around along the lines of - if you've ever wondered what you would have done in the face of slavery, the holocaust or the civil war, you're doing it right now. I've thought about that a lot lately and tried to convert it into action.

 

[redwood66]

I'm genuinely curious, Redwood - when you say that, what specific things/behaviors in the past make you sad or angry and make you wish they were different? Because I personally feel that we are now at one of those moments in history where we are at a similar crossroads when it comes to making decisions about personal responsibility.

Not aimed at you, but in general- there's a quote going around along the lines of - if you've ever wondered what you would have done in the face of slavery, the holocaust or the civil war, you're doing it right now. I've thought about that a lot lately and tried to convert it into action.

Slavery, holocaust, and any other human suffering for which another party was responsible to name a few. Why do you ask? Are you reading something into my definition of shame in this scenario? I really thought I explained that actions are the best way to change any injustice.

 

[Arkteia]

During this week I saw how many whites are not racist, how many are ashamed that racism exists. This is very positive.

 

[Calliecake]

During this week I saw how many whites are not racist, how many are ashamed that racism exists. This is very positive.

Thank you for saying this @Arkteia . Thank you for pointing out the positive.

 

[MollyMalone]

This is what CK should be doing.

A majority of people at the time didn't think so:


Poll taken 2 years earlier

-- and 2 weeks after firebombing of Greyhound bus with Freedom Riders aboard & mob beatings of those Riders and others on different buses:

 

[E B]

I was just listening to a podcast where they were playing clips of RW TV, and one clip was Tucker Carlson talking to his audience about the kneeling. Here’s a write up:

TUCKER CARLSON (HOST): We're only two weeks in the NFL preseason, already many of the league's richest players have gone out of their way to let you know how much they hate your country. On Monday, a dozen members of the Cleveland Browns refused to stand for the national anthem because racism or something.

This is the hot garbage the “can’t trust any source but Fox” crowd is inhaling on a daily basis. And that’s what stokes the fire. This is much, much more to blame for division than every single instance of a player kneeling.

 

[Dancing Fire]

 

[Dancing Fire]

I guess just knowing that I've never faced those challenges sometimes makes me feel bad. I wish the burden of prejudice was shared more 'equally' sometimes, because I'd like to take some of that burden from others.

LD
Then you should go walk around on the southside of Chicago after dark maybe you can become one of the statistics. Seriously, The liberal left here kept on talking PC., but none of you would have the guts to walk around the block on the dangerous side of Chicago with or w/o your jewelry.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/...0th-homicide-tribune-data-20170917-story.html

 

[Tekate]

Yup, putting the flag up to support FREE SPEECH. The flag is a symbol. The flag does not breathe. The right has co-opted my flag to be something it isn't. I don't like it one bit. My husband and I feel the flag now symbolizes the right and hate. I used to love to wave the flag when I was kid. I was proud of my dad and grandfather.

Here's a good and true song by Everlast.

If we don't walk in others shoes we cannot feel what they feel.