Good Old Gold Clarity Enhanced diamond

[Rhino]

Hi Gypsy,

Thanks for your suggestions and please accept my apology. As you pointed out I am human and make mistakes and perhaps I try and read between the lines when I shouldn't be. I did take that too personal so thanks for understanding. I get your point regarding what Laila619 quoted below but as she pointed out these are not going to be a regular offering.

I respect Brian, WF's, etc. to seperate lines based on non-cut reasons but in my professional opinion, as a gemologist who inspects diamonds for cut daily "Hearts & Arrows" is a feature that is strictly related to the subject of cut. Not color. Not fluoroescence. Not clarity. Not anything but the skill of the cutter. The same with Octavia, Solasfera, Star129 etc. Just because one has faint, medium, strong fluoro shouldn't seperate it as a different line. To me that makes no sense unless of course you're looking to target a particular market ... say H&A specifically with fluoroescence. Along those lines I could understand perhaps begining a line of AVC/AVR Gold and AVC/AVR Platinum. The "Gold" line being the warm colors and "Platinum" line being the whites or something along those lines. In either case it is however the cut that differentiates the line. No other gemological reason.

Thanks for your input and I do appreciate your feedback.

Kind regards,
Jonathan

I will use an example to make my point, maybe it will help. The majority here loves fluorescent stones, right? And they are considered a good value. But they are discounted by the powers that be and considered by some to be inferior. Now take BGD. They COULD have decided to include Fl diamonds in their Signature line. No one would have objected too strongly on PS. BUT-- BGD knows that some people (right or wrong) would have considered that to cheapen his Signature line. So what did he do? He created a new line. BGD Blue. The lesson: If you want to carry CE stones-- don't cheapen your AV line with them. The solution is to create a new line: AVCE for example. That way you keep your AVC/AVR's safe, but are able to offer CE stones.

The big difference is that Jon is not going to be 'carrying' CE stones. If anything, this was a completely rare occurrence.

 

[Rhino]

I will use an example to make my point, maybe it will help. The majority here loves fluorescent stones, right? And they are considered a good value. But they are discounted by the powers that be and considered by some to be inferior. Now take BGD. They COULD have decided to include Fl diamonds in their Signature line. No one would have objected too strongly on PS. BUT-- BGD knows that some people (right or wrong) would have considered that to cheapen his Signature line. So what did he do? He created a new line. BGD Blue. The lesson: If you want to carry CE stones-- don't cheapen your AV line with them. The solution is to create a new line: AVCE for example. That way you keep your AVC/AVR's safe, but are able to offer CE stones.

The big difference is that Jon is not going to be 'carrying' CE stones. If anything, this was a completely rare occurrence.

I know Laila. My original post, and one I still stand by, is that a single 'one off' the CE stone branded as an AV stone, while not what I personally would have done in GOG's place, doesn't cheapen entire the line for me. It happened, it sold, it's over. BUT going forward, I wouldn't have any other CE AV stones. I don't think it's a good idea even occasionally. It was a mistake (IMO), but that happens, learn from it and don't do it again. If it happens again that a stone comes back from cutting with very visible inclusions, don't brand it as an AV line stone. Just use it for a promotion OR sell it as a one off CE -- BUT NOT as an AV branded CE stone. AND if GOG thinks they are on to something with precision cut CE stones and want to keep selling them-- create a different line for them.

That's right. *If* we regularly featured them I would. Since it's only a once in while thing and the diamond still meets our strict criteria for cut why call it anything different than what it is, is my thinking. It's either an AVR or it isn't. It's strictly a cut related thing and really has nothing to do with clarity or color.

All the best,
Jon

 

[kindred]

GOG listed two more fracture filled AV's today, both with 30 day guarantees.

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9076
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9077

For a similar price they have a non-enhanced traditional cut round 0.51ct K VS2
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8484/

 

[Rhino]

Jon, I mean no harm and no offense in my comments, just providing my honest impression and opinion on the cuts.
I'm in minority here and by no means a highly respected veteran of the forum, so i beleive my comments won't steer many potential buyers from your branded cuts.

Hi Inna,

No offense taken whatsoever. By all means if you are unhappy please trade your diamond. It's why we have lifetime trade up on this brand and if you really enjoy the appearance of generic OEC/OMC over AVR/AVC I have access to those as well!

On a personal note, if we found your opinion to be in the grand majority I would most likely cease to cut AVC and AVR and just feature the standard cuts that are offered. I've always had access to the EGL graded OEC's and generic OMC's and when we show clients in side by side examinations, not knowing which is which the grand majority do in fact pick the AVC/AVR in side by side linesups under even illumination, indoor diffuse lighting, spot lighting and natural daylight like we show in our videos.

When I do a presentation in our store on the subject of cut we'll teach exactly what we do on our website regarding FireScope & ASET and we'll utilize different cut qualities as well as cutting styles. After we've taught about brightness, contrast, fire & sparkle and have shown that between various 57 facet modern rounds we'll then introduce other diamonds designed for a specific optic, ie. Solasfera, Star129, August Vintage & Eighternity. After we have shown these in multiple lighting my simple question to my client is ... what is it your eyes prefer most?

AVR/AVC is not for everyone. We do however see a good number of consumers who have never seen the cuts in their life and end up purchasing them because they do in fact prefer them. Should majority consumer taste change I can and will always adapt to the market as necessary. It would certainly save me a lot of capital outlay not to cut them but we have seen hundreds come to love and enjoy them. As long as they do they will always be cut and featured as an option.

While I do have a personal sentiment towards the AVC/AVR line and they are constructed based on our experience showing people face to face (as well as through optical sciences) I do feature a wide variety of appearances because every person's taste is different. Some love them some don't care for them. Honestly I don't care either way. In eithere scenario it is the goal of GOG to make our clients happy.

Kind regards,
Jonathan

 

[Rhino]

Danny, kindred, Gypsy, Yssie..

I get ya. I will pray and ponder on this. I appreciate all the input that has been offered and will weigh it out over the weekend. The input from ALL OF YOU really does mean a lot to me.

kindred, nothing you said did I take personal. I understand where you're coming from as I do from the others. I mistakenly did take Gypsy's comment personally but that was my own mistake.

One thing I do know for a fact is if the August Vintage line ever went International to the point where we setup distributorships in jewelry stores around the country/world and the information of the diamond was dependant upon the distributor and not GOG I would NOT include CE diamonds in the brand as I would want to eliminate any chance of non disclosure. We publish as much as we can on each but if it were left up to another I wouldn't entrust that on the few stones that did get CE.

Kindest regards,
Jonathan

I can't really quote everything here, but I'll just say that yes, it is positively a mind clean issue for me. [1] Branding deals heavily with perception. People who seem to have taken this personally and seem intent on believing that I am telling GOG what they can and can't do are absolutely wrong. I am just stating my opinion about it. There have been many previous threads asking if Tiffany was hurting their brand, and I don't remember them getting so personal.

Where were all of you "live and let live" folks on every other thread about clarity enhanced diamonds? Do a search and you will find many threads with people asking about them and every single follow up post saying that fracture filled diamonds are not worth purchasing. GOG already sells diamonds in every budget. They don't need to sell fracture filled diamonds in order to offer lower priced diamonds. I wonder what the folks who say that August Vintage branding is just about cut would say if GOG started selling CZ AVs. To my mind, fracture filled diamonds are the only diamonds that pretend to be something they're not. CZs (pretending to be diamonds) would be the next step down that path.


ETA: [1] There is also the secondary market issue (a potential buyer needing to check if the AV they are thinking of buying is fracture filled) that Imdanny mentioned above.

 

[Imdanny]

GOG listed two more fracture filled AV's today, both with 30 day guarantees.

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9076
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9077

For a similar price they have a non-enhanced traditional cut round 0.51ct K VS2
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8484/

The thoughts offerred by us in this thread are just feedback. Jonathon is certainly free to disagree with us and to disregard what we've said. This has been a very enlightening thread. Thank you for starting it, OP.

 

[Rhino]

One day I would like to meet you face to face.

Yssie ... what would you call a CE AVR if not an AVR?

Jon, thank you for your reply, I appreciate the responses. I think quoting and replying yet again will make things totally incomprehensible so I'll try it this way instead:

No arguement however they are generally not valued differently. An I2 is an I2 no matter which way you slice it CE or not. What I take offense is being accused of "heavily upcharging" the consumer for the AV line. Just because I take a piece of rough and end up with a .85ct instead of a 1ct does not mean I am "heavily upcharging" for the .85ct when the piece of rough cost the same. To be accused of that on a public forum paints me as someone who is out to purposely take advantage of people which I do not do nor appreciate.

That's true. I don't see CE by filling as adding value... I personally would have no problem with a stone that was drilled and bleached and I'd even pay a premium for it post-enhancement, but maybe I'm in the minority there! The difference of course being that the treatment is permanent.

We often hear that a clever cutter will find ways to preserve weight - sometimes at the risk of lowering the cut grade - because they can find a consumer to buy that weightier less well-cut stone for more. You've taken offense to the "heavily" description - but from the perspective of that consumer, or anyone who would choose the 1ct rather than the 0.85, you are indeed *heavily upcharging*, as is anyone selling stones on the upper range of that 30% EX spread! But they aren't your niche customers, and the fact of the matter is that all PSers would pick the 0.85 in a heartbeat!

Pricing comes back to the point of branding. We have nothing to compare the AV lines with so as consumers we can't know what premiums, if any, may be attached solely because they're branded stones. As I said earlier I have no issue with Brand premiums as long as they stay clear of the realms of the absurd, so I'll save "heavily upcharging" for the likes of HoF and EightStar

I don't assume for one moment that you and some of the folks here are Yssie. I greatly respect your opinion and input. I just don't appreciate blanket statements regarding lines of diamonds when there is no understanding why they cost what they do.

Thank you, I appreciate that. Everything in Gypsy's post history suggests that she understands these nuances as well as any of us can - in terms of industry mechanics and machinations we consumers are largely working from similar knowlegde and we may well have similar gaps and misunderstandings - including regarding the specifics of pricing. So if there's something we're missing please do educate us!

They will not be a regular offering. The exceptions to the rule for GOG would always be this ...

a. A recut stone whose feather is just too noticeable.
b. A mistake happened on the wheel.
c. A diamond cut from rough that was an SI2 or even I1 and the inclusion, visible to the eye prevents it from being sold.

This is good info to have.

n those rare instances when we are faced with a diamond that has eye visible inclusions and those inclusions prevent it from being sold I can do one of 2 things.

1. Let it sit and collect dust.
2. Make the inclusion invisible and see someone enjoy it at no extra cost to them.

I sincerely don't see the harm in the latter as long as there is full open disclosure.
I am open minded to hearing why people would suggest the former though.

This is the heart of it: we are not suggesting you do the former, and we fully support the latter. We are suggesting that in the future you find some alternative for these rare stones that does not involve diluting the quality of the AV brand with goods of indisputably inferior quality, because it's clear that *Some* people do consider selling CE AVs to be diluting the brand, and Some is more than none, and none is better than Some! I think the suggestions of just selling it without AV brand name or using it for a promotion are excellent - you move the stone for either the payment or the visibility, the customer is happy with an visually enhanced rock at a fantastic price, and you ensure that you're keeping the AV brands completely "safe". The downside is that that consumer won't feel good about owning a piece of the AV brand, but hey, like I said before, you want the goods, well, gotta pony up for it, that's life!


Cheers

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Wow, I had lost track of this thread as I was actually looking for a new diamond at GOG. One thing that Jonathan has is integrity. He totally discloses more information on his diamonds than any other jeweler by far. Probably more than any other in the world. He has had a few low clarity AV stones that he thought might sell and be enjoyed if the inclusions were reduced by enhancement. They have the name AV because of their CUT, not because he is trying to make money off a brand name! As he said, the diamonds aren't priced like they are because of the NAME, they are priced that way because more rough is used for the CUT!

The key factor here is that he did not charge a premium price for this stone. It sold for a very low price at the original I clarity. You probably won't ever see me here recommending CE stones, but I think someone who wants an inexpensive stone for a pendant or earrings certainly can decide between a smaller, better clarity rb or a CE AVR on rare occasions.

And for the record, I did order 2 .60 each AVR's one time for earrings. I did not keep them because they were not in my color comfort range (they were I-J and I just prefer H and higher). But they were gorgeous stones and certainly beautifully cut. I hope to have a larger AV someday and it does not concern me in the least that he might sell a handful of CE AV stones.

And speaking of AVR's, I asked Jon to compare ideal cut rb's, an AVR, and a Solasfera for me. All beautiful with different personalities. I am sticking with the traditional ideal cut for my e-ring because that is what I have always had. But I love that AVR, though!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwiM3COzjFM&list=UUEV7slr-i-VduBBnfv9MxhA&index=1&feature=plcp

 

[yssie]

One day I would like to meet you face to face.

Something about the wording of that is distinctly ominous

Yssie ... what would you call a CE AVR if not an AVR?

August Vintage CE?
CE-AVR?
So long as CE is in the name to differentiate it from non-CE IMO


Okay I'm off to celebrate my beloved NINERS with a barrel of wine and a xanax or ten - they just had to make it oh so interesting

 

[Gypsy]

Jon, the board is a dialog, as you well know. And in the same way your triumphs are celebrated by us, your rare mistakes are going to be dissected as well. And I'm sure that's uncomfortable when it happens. Actually, you fumble here is, IMO, a result of your inexperience in dealing with criticism-- and that's because GOG rarely gets anything but positive comments on here. You are a valued vendor for the reason that you are very good at what you do. And I have noticed you seem to be very emotionally invested in your AV line-- it's your baby. And I hope you realize that both sides of the discussion in this thread had the same goal-- the preservation of the AV line reputation. We want what's best for you.

 

[Rhino]

One day I would like to meet you face to face.

Something about the wording of that is distinctly ominous

LOL! No no ... I mean that strictly in a positive sense. What I'm saying is we're 110% on the same frequency. I'm glad you at least understand where I'm coming from even though I may not have used the most tactful words to express myself. We're also on the same page with regards to the use of the word "heavily up-charging". If what we were cutting could be sold at the same price of generics they would most definitely be. What is interesting Yssie is before we were cutting we'd always teach *why* H&A's and premium cuts cost what they do in relation to other more commonly cut diamonds but now that I am more directly involved in the process and more "hands-on" in that spectrum of the pipeline I have grown more sensitive and more appreciative of what we have been teaching over the years. The difference we make on a branded diamond between many diamonds sold on the web is no earth shattering difference percentage wise, in relation to cost. On our new site (a work in progress) part of our tutorial will be actually teaching more about the cutting process and I have plans on flying overseas to do a video with Yoram in his factory to help familiarize the public with the actual cutting process and the extraneous steps that are taken to cut the AVC/AVR products. It will help people better understand what I have been trying to communicate here about them.

Yssie ... what would you call a CE AVR if not an AVR?

August Vintage CE?
CE-AVR?
So long as CE is in the name to differentiate it from non-CE IMO

That sounds like a fair compromise. I say lets call a spade a spade. I'm not looking to call it something it isn't but do want to clearly communicate precisely what it is. Just have to think of the right way to properly identify.

Okay I'm off to celebrate my beloved NINERS with a barrel of wine and a xanax or ten - they just had to make it oh so interesting

Not sure what the NINERS are but it sounds like you're going to have a good time. Enjoy and thank you kindly for your input dear.

Warm regards,
Jonathan

 

[Rhino]

Thanks Gypsy. You're a dear and after rereading I see the heart behind what you wrote. I'm feeling a little verklempt.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDXEgBh0TF0

 

[SweetAsscher]

One day I would like to meet you face to face.

Something about the wording of that is distinctly ominous

LOL! No no ... I mean that strictly in a positive sense. What I'm saying is we're 110% on the same frequency. I'm glad you at least understand where I'm coming from even though I may not have used the most tactful words to express myself. We're also on the same page with regards to the use of the word "heavily up-charging". If what we were cutting could be sold at the same price of generics they would most definitely be. What is interesting Yssie is before we were cutting we'd always teach *why* H&A's and premium cuts cost what they do in relation to other more commonly cut diamonds but now that I am more directly involved in the process and more "hands-on" in that spectrum of the pipeline I have grown more sensitive and more appreciative of what we have been teaching over the years. The difference we make on a branded diamond between many diamonds sold on the web is no earth shattering difference percentage wise, in relation to cost. On our new site (a work in progress) part of our tutorial will be actually teaching more about the cutting process and I have plans on flying overseas to do a video with Yoram in his factory to help familiarize the public with the actual cutting process and the extraneous steps that are taken to cut the AVC/AVR products. It will help people better understand what I have been trying to communicate here about them.

Yssie ... what would you call a CE AVR if not an AVR?

August Vintage CE?
CE-AVR?
So long as CE is in the name to differentiate it from non-CE IMO

That sounds like a fair compromise. I say lets call a spade a spade. I'm not looking to call it something it isn't but do want to clearly communicate precisely what it is. Just have to think of the right way to properly identify.

Okay I'm off to celebrate my beloved NINERS with a barrel of wine and a xanax or ten - they just had to make it oh so interesting

Not sure what the NINERS are but it sounds like you're going to have a good time. Enjoy and thank you kindly for your input dear.

Warm regards,
Jonathan

Yssie, yes! I think I had like five anxiety attacks during the last 30 seconds of the game!

Jon!? Maybe you'll know who the Niners are when we beat the Giants next Saturday. Assuming the Giants even make it that far

 

[armywife13]

One day I would like to meet you face to face.

Something about the wording of that is distinctly ominous

LOL! No no ... I mean that strictly in a positive sense. What I'm saying is we're 110% on the same frequency. I'm glad you at least understand where I'm coming from even though I may not have used the most tactful words to express myself. We're also on the same page with regards to the use of the word "heavily up-charging". If what we were cutting could be sold at the same price of generics they would most definitely be. What is interesting Yssie is before we were cutting we'd always teach *why* H&A's and premium cuts cost what they do in relation to other more commonly cut diamonds but now that I am more directly involved in the process and more "hands-on" in that spectrum of the pipeline I have grown more sensitive and more appreciative of what we have been teaching over the years. The difference we make on a branded diamond between many diamonds sold on the web is no earth shattering difference percentage wise, in relation to cost. On our new site (a work in progress) part of our tutorial will be actually teaching more about the cutting process and I have plans on flying overseas to do a video with Yoram in his factory to help familiarize the public with the actual cutting process and the extraneous steps that are taken to cut the AVC/AVR products. It will help people better understand what I have been trying to communicate here about them.

Yssie ... what would you call a CE AVR if not an AVR?

August Vintage CE?
CE-AVR?
So long as CE is in the name to differentiate it from non-CE IMO

That sounds like a fair compromise. I say lets call a spade a spade. I'm not looking to call it something it isn't but do want to clearly communicate precisely what it is. Just have to think of the right way to properly identify.

Okay I'm off to celebrate my beloved NINERS with a barrel of wine and a xanax or ten - they just had to make it oh so interesting

Not sure what the NINERS are but it sounds like you're going to have a good time. Enjoy and thank you kindly for your input dear.

Warm regards,
Jonathan

Yssie, yes! I think I had like five anxiety attacks during the last 30 seconds of the game!

Jon!? Maybe you'll know who the Niners are when we beat the Giants next Saturday. Assuming the Giants even make it that far

Pshhhhhh packers all the waaaaay!

 

[Laila619]

Pshhhhhh packers all the waaaaay!

Green and gold!!!!! Woo hoo!

 

[armywife13]

Pshhhhhh packers all the waaaaay!

Green and gold!!!!! Woo hoo!

Yay, a fellow green and gold fan! The one good thing that came out of me spending age 5-19 in Wisconsin. Are you excited for the game tomorrow? I. CAN'T. WAIT.

 

[Imdanny]

Danny, kindred, Gypsy, Yssie..

I get ya. I will pray and ponder on this. I appreciate all the input that has been offered and will weigh it out over the weekend. The input from ALL OF YOU really does mean a lot to me.

Hi Jonathan,

We posted at the same time. Thanks for your note.

Cheers,

Danny

 

[marymm]

Good Old Gold posted a link to this diamond on Facebook: http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8753

I am really surprised to see them listing a clarity enhanced diamond, especially in an August Vintage cut, and I feel that it cheapens the brand. I'm also surprised to see that the AGS report does not mention the clarity enhancement. Would a GIA report have listed it?

GOG listed two more fracture filled AV's today, both with 30 day guarantees.

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9076
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9077

For a similar price they have a non-enhanced traditional cut round 0.51ct K VS2
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8484/

Why the inconsistency in guarantees on these CE AVRs? The 1st stone comes with GOG's lifetime guarantee, but the newly-listed two stones have 30-day guarantees. If GOG believes these CE AVRs belong within the August Vintage brand, wouldn't logic dictate they be sold with the Lifetime Guarantee that AVRs come with?

 

[madelise]

Has one wondered how that new owner, if a PSer, must feel? What if they wanted to post on SMTB but this thread rained on their parade?

 

[winternight]

Has one wondered how that new owner, if a PSer, must feel? What if they wanted to post on SMTB but this thread rained on their parade?

Well by that logic every thread on clarity enhanced diamonds should be edited so that none's feeling are hurt? I don't think anyone would be rude on a SMTB thread, but it is what it is. You're getting a big look for less money for a reason. Just like none says "OMG you paid too much" when people post a Tiffany or Cartier ring, but in the main rockytalk thread you'll see those criticisms.

 

[smitcompton]

Hi,

Jon, you are one lucky guy. I don't think you could have gotten better advise on branding than from Gypsy, Yisse, and Danny if you had paid a consulting firm. Branding is extremely important. I would make a new line with a 3 letter prefix. CVE, Clarity Value Enhanced or something else with 3 letters.
vintage Value Enhanced--VVL--Vintage Value Line.

Ask for more suggestions

Annette

 

[Rhino]

Good Old Gold posted a link to this diamond on Facebook: http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8753

I am really surprised to see them listing a clarity enhanced diamond, especially in an August Vintage cut, and I feel that it cheapens the brand. I'm also surprised to see that the AGS report does not mention the clarity enhancement. Would a GIA report have listed it?

GOG listed two more fracture filled AV's today, both with 30 day guarantees.

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9076
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9077

For a similar price they have a non-enhanced traditional cut round 0.51ct K VS2
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8484/

Why the inconsistency in guarantees on these CE AVRs? The 1st stone comes with GOG's lifetime guarantee, but the newly-listed two stones have 30-day guarantees. If GOG believes these CE AVRs belong within the August Vintage brand, wouldn't logic dictate they be sold with the Lifetime Guarantee that AVRs come with?

Thanks for pointing this out marymm. An input error from my assistant who did the publish.

 

[kindred]

Jon, the board is a dialog, as you well know. And in the same way your triumphs are celebrated by us, your rare mistakes are going to be dissected as well. And I'm sure that's uncomfortable when it happens. Actually, you fumble here is, IMO, a result of your inexperience in dealing with criticism-- and that's because GOG rarely gets anything but positive comments on here. You are a valued vendor for the reason that you are very good at what you do. And I have noticed you seem to be very emotionally invested in your AV line-- it's your baby. And I hope you realize that both sides of the discussion in this thread had the same goal-- the preservation of the AV line reputation. We want what's best for you.

I completely agree with Gypsy's post! If it weren't for Good Old Gold's education through their web site and videos, as well as their stellar reputation here and their great policies, I don't know if I would have ever dared to purchase a diamond online. I think Jon and GOG are totally first rate!

 

[Rhino]

Hi,

Jon, you are one lucky guy. I don't think you could have gotten better advise on branding than from Gypsy, Yisse, and Danny if you had paid a consulting firm. Branding is extremely important. I would make a new line with a 3 letter prefix. CVE, Clarity Value Enhanced or something else with 3 letters.
vintage Value Enhanced--VVL--Vintage Value Line.

Ask for more suggestions

Annette

Danny ... thanks man. Although we've chatted here on occasion I feel like I know you a long time and wanted you to know I appreciate your comments.

Thanks Annette. I agree. As I've been around on these forums since 2001 I can tell you the Internet has been largely responsible for how our Internet business, and our own business model was shaped and formed. This very line we're talking about (the AVR/AVC) was born out of the voices you see here and many in the past who used to participate. It was listening to their ideas/needs/desires that formed it and I'd be foolish to not pay attention to my friends here now. I'll always keep an open mind to the kind people here. Whether I agree or disagree is irrelevant really because at the end of the day it is the voice of the consumer that rings loudest and since it is they whom we serve, I'll take all their input to heart and act on it in a way that will work to serve them. I do like your suggestion too. I'll implement these changes in the coming week.

Warm regards,
Jonathan

 

[risingsun]

GOG listed two more fracture filled AV's today, both with 30 day guarantees.

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9076
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9077

For a similar price they have a non-enhanced traditional cut round 0.51ct K VS2
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8484/

The thoughts offerred by us in this thread are just feedback. Jonathon is certainly free to disagree with us and to disregard what we've said. This has been a very enlightening thread. Thank you for starting it, OP.

This post indicates to me that the CE-AVC in the original post was not a one-off effort to correct a problem. I would strongly urge you to find another brand name for the CE-AVC/AVR diamonds. At this point they are no longer random, but are becoming a presence in this line. When we purchase branded H&A RB diamonds, it is not strictly for the cut. We are also looking for a fine stone. I fail to see this distinction in the August Vintage line. If I wanted to a true antique cushion or round, there a number of fine vendors who can provide them. I expect more from AV. Cut is only a part of the beauty of a diamond. I hope, Jon, that you can hear what I am saying to you without a quick reaction. I do believe that there is cause for concern.

"This is not personal, it's business..." sayeth The Godfather

 

[diamondseeker2006]

GOG listed two more fracture filled AV's today, both with 30 day guarantees.

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9076
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9077

For a similar price they have a non-enhanced traditional cut round 0.51ct K VS2
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8484/

The thoughts offerred by us in this thread are just feedback. Jonathon is certainly free to disagree with us and to disregard what we've said. This has been a very enlightening thread. Thank you for starting it, OP.

This post indicates to me that the CE-AVC in the original post was not a one-off effort to correct a problem. I would strongly urge you to find another brand name for the CE-AVC/AVR diamonds. At this point they are no longer random, but are becoming a presence in this line. When we purchase branded H&A RB diamonds, it is not strictly for the cut. We are also looking for a fine stone. I fail to see this distinction in the August Vintage line. If I wanted to a true antique cushion or round, there a number of fine vendors who can provide them. I expect more from AV. Cut is only a part of the beauty of a diamond. I hope, Jon, that you can hear what I am saying to you without a quick reaction. I do believe that there is cause for concern.

"This is not personal, it's business..." sayeth The Godfather

Oh, Rising Sun..you must read through to the more recent posts on this page to see that Jon has said he will make some changes! It is very good to see you here, by the way!

 

[Maisie]

Agreed in entirety. If you are buying an AVC/R on the secondary market, I assume that you would take the time to obtain the certificate and note the documented color and clarity ratings. A quick comparison of this stone's visual appearance and the AGS cert. would indicate that it had been clarity enhanced. And if CE stones aren't your cup of tea, you can pass on it. I don't believe that having a few CE AV stones on the market, when the vendor is open and honest about the enhancement, should have any effect on the brand. I would, however, be rather disappointed if GOG started manufacturing CZ AVCs & Rs...

The last time I spoke to Jonathon he was considering this.

I wonder how that will affect the brand....

 

[risingsun]

GOG listed two more fracture filled AV's today, both with 30 day guarantees.

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9076
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9077

For a similar price they have a non-enhanced traditional cut round 0.51ct K VS2
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8484/

The thoughts offerred by us in this thread are just feedback. Jonathon is certainly free to disagree with us and to disregard what we've said. This has been a very enlightening thread. Thank you for starting it, OP.

This post indicates to me that the CE-AVC in the original post was not a one-off effort to correct a problem. I would strongly urge you to find another brand name for the CE-AVC/AVR diamonds. At this point they are no longer random, but are becoming a presence in this line. When we purchase branded H&A RB diamonds, it is not strictly for the cut. We are also looking for a fine stone. I fail to see this distinction in the August Vintage line. If I wanted to a true antique cushion or round, there a number of fine vendors who can provide them. I expect more from AV. Cut is only a part of the beauty of a diamond. I hope, Jon, that you can hear what I am saying to you without a quick reaction. I do believe that there is cause for concern.

"This is not personal, it's business..." sayeth The Godfather

Oh, Rising Sun..you must read through to the more recent posts on this page to see that Jon has said he will make some changes! It is very good to see you here, by the way!

I will go back and read the more recent posts, diamondseeker. It's very good to see you, too

 

[risingsun]

Hi,

Jon, you are one lucky guy. I don't think you could have gotten better advise on branding than from Gypsy, Yisse, and Danny if you had paid a consulting firm. Branding is extremely important. I would make a new line with a 3 letter prefix. CVE, Clarity Value Enhanced or something else with 3 letters.
vintage Value Enhanced--VVL--Vintage Value Line.

Ask for more suggestions

Annette

Danny ... thanks man. Although we've chatted here on occasion I feel like I know you a long time and wanted you to know I appreciate your comments.

Thanks Annette. I agree. As I've been around on these forums since 2001 I can tell you the Internet has been largely responsible for how our Internet business, and our own business model was shaped and formed. This very line we're talking about (the AVR/AVC) was born out of the voices you see here and many in the past who used to participate. It was listening to their ideas/needs/desires that formed it and I'd be foolish to not pay attention to my friends here now. I'll always keep an open mind to the kind people here. Whether I agree or disagree is irrelevant really because at the end of the day it is the voice of the consumer that rings loudest and since it is they whom we serve, I'll take all their input to heart and act on it in a way that will work to serve them. I do like your suggestion too. I'll implement these changes in the coming week.













Warm regards,
Jonathan

At diamondseeker's suggestion, I reread the recent posts. As it turned out, I missed this one. My feedback remains the same, but I am relieved you have already decided to make changes in the branding of the CE diamonds. This is excellent customer service and you placed the PS comments as an important component of your actions. Well done!

 

[jstarfireb]

Agreed in entirety. If you are buying an AVC/R on the secondary market, I assume that you would take the time to obtain the certificate and note the documented color and clarity ratings. A quick comparison of this stone's visual appearance and the AGS cert. would indicate that it had been clarity enhanced. And if CE stones aren't your cup of tea, you can pass on it. I don't believe that having a few CE AV stones on the market, when the vendor is open and honest about the enhancement, should have any effect on the brand. I would, however, be rather disappointed if GOG started manufacturing CZ AVCs & Rs...

The last time I spoke to Jonathon he was considering this.

I wonder how that will affect the brand....

He could sell them through Wink like they do with the Octavia, and people looking for a diamond would never come across the CZs (and vice versa). I don't think producing CZs affected the Octavia at all, for that matter.