Boy Soon

[blue_chica]

This guy is 32 and has been in a few LTR, is currently in one. The girl is itching to get married, so I was particularly curious what he would say...

Anyway, are you sure you want insight to a guys'' psyche? Just general
answers based on what the "typical" guy might think.

All the questions really are about the same thing. Some guys, and I''m
sure it goes for girls, are ready to be in that long term relationship and
some aren''t. I think part of it is human nature that women want the
security of that "bond" of marriage, that this guy won''t leave and she
won''t grow old and lonely while some guys are afraid of that "bond" cause
they still want to be "free". I know older guys that are happy with the
woman they are with but afraid of marriage for the finality, and also for
the financial reasons, especially without a pre-nup. I think alot of it
has to do with societal perceptions. I think sometimes its the biological
clock with women that might make them rush a bit more where men don''t
necessarily have that. And sometimes men, and I would guess women too,
are afraid of marriage because of the fear they are marrying the wrong
person. I''ve seen a nmumber of friends marry the wrong person, even
though it seemed right at the time. The rest of your life is a long time,
you should do all you can to make sure everything is right before you
"take the plunge", and that means being ready for it. Age has very little
to do with that. Some are ready at 21, some aren''t ready at 41, so the 31
year old has a 50-50 chance I know of a guy, upper 20''s, who didn''t say
"I love you" for almost 2 years of dating a girl, but eventually he did, I
guess when he was ready. It''s maturity, and it comes down to each
individual, so you just gotta take each person as they come.

Anyway, dont'' know if that helps at all, but just some observations I''ve
seen in my 32 years

 

[blue_chica]

This guy is 35, single, has had LTR in the past, but not currently.

I''ve got a wicked case of insomnia.

Okay here goes...

1. Men aren''t driven by the same biological imperative to procreate. As a result, we are less marriage minded and more averse to commitment.

2. As for men that are eager to enter into the next phase in life… A lot of aspects of dating and being single suck so a lot of guys prefer life long companionship.

3. Marriage represents the formalization of a commitment that’s a bit scary. After all, why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free!

4. Your question seems to suggest that a man at 31 has entered a stage in his life where he ought to commit to a formalized relationship. The idea that life has defined stages is questionable to me. I’ve lived in other countries where the same calculus for what constitutes a responsible life doesn’t exist. Our base ten system of seeing life as a series of age based mile stones that require a certain level of material and social acquisition is disguised conformity—perhaps the worst kind of conformity because it’s not self reflective. As a result, maybe the man in question is unsure whether or not he wants to embark on house payments, children, and a life of living for the other. …So recognize that any apprehension your boyfriend might feel toward marriage is more related to lifestyle choices and less related to how he feels about you. To be honest, you might evaluate the reasons why marriage is so important to you.

 

[wcitygirl]

You know, I''m noticing an interesting pattern. From your friends, at least, Blue Chica, it seems like marriage is just not that important to them and in fact they want us to re-evaluate why we "need" it so badly. Hm. That IS a good question. The fact that it just isn''t important to them, strangely enough, makes me feel not so bad about really wanting to bring the issue up. That probably doesn''t make sense. But, it just seems like if I didn''t bring it up, then boys wouldn''t either...?

 

[ammayernyc]

I feel like I could have written all of these responses myself!

We''ve just recently started looking at rings -- right before I joined PS -- around the end of December. I''ve now become obsessed.

My bf and I have been dating for 3.25 years, living together for almost 6 months. He was the one who initiated looking at rings. I never brought it up. Literally. Even our living together was a 10 minute conversation. Sort of like this:

AM: My lease is up at the end of next month (September 2004). Your lease is not up until March 2005. What are WE going to do?

BF: I don''t know.

AM: Well, WE need to do something since I''ll be homeless soon.

BF: Well, what do you want to do?

AM: I don''t think it''s a me question anymore... it''s a WE question. (This took more guts and many months of therapy to actually say... have many abandonment issues... whole other story...)

BF: Well, I can call my management company about my lease and see if there are any other apartments in the building. (He was dead set on staying in the same building. Fine with me... it''s very nice).

AM: I don''t belive you. We went through this last year. (Another story as well, but basically I had to move and he ''agreed'' to let me move into his apartment but I had to agree to still look for another place. No thanks. I moved somewhere else and patiently stuck by him).

BF: I promise, I''ll call tomorrow.

Miracle of all miracles, he called the next day and we looked at two apartments in his building that night. His management company agreed to let him break his lease and we signed a new lease for OUR apartment the next week. YEAH!

All that nervousness for a 10 minute conversation that we only had because I needed to make a decision and had a couple of glasses a wine. Now we are happily cohabitating...

So, after all that... I''m now going to have to have a similar conversation about getting engaged. We just went to a wedding of one of his best friends this weekend and I have never seen him more freaked out. He kept saying, ''I can''t believe my boy is getting married. I can''t believe he''s married.'' Even this morning, ''So, M & T are really married.'' He also commented on that he has like two single friends left... and that was only the first of FIVE weddings we have this year.

I have an event tonight where there will be a bar, so I''m hoping some liquid courage will help me bring up the topic tonight. Usually I give him a warning: ''I want you to start thinking about this... we will have to talk about it soon...'' when I get nervous. I''m hoping that won''t happen.

Whew... that was long!

 

[Erin]

So far these guys think I''m a self-centered b!tch who is looking for a tax deduction without a pre-nup, who thinks everyone should have the same life values as me (and they''re nuts if they don''t), who would feel insecure and alone without marriage, who sees marriage as a status symbol, and am horribly desperate to get married, and if my bf doesn''t feel the same way I should just get over it and keep giving the milk for free

 

[blue_chica]

wcity - I agree, I think that''s an interesting point. I do wonder why it seems there''s more interest in marriage on the female side. I don''t believe it''s just conditioning, because I''ve bucked what a girl is "supposed" to do in so many other ways. Sometimes, as I get older and slightly more self-aware, and aware of the world around me...it really depresses me that so many stereotypes really do seem to be based on something.

Erin - I''m totally unimpressed with the responses so far. Want me to keep posting them?

 

[Erin]

Sure - I''m able to pull fragments out of most of them

Still find it pretty interesting - especially as a collection

 

[wcitygirl]

I want you to keep posting them!!

 

[jlc0604]

There is a book called "The Starter Marriage" that I have been meaning to read for a year or so now. It chronicles the relationships of several couples that have had these ''starter marriages'' - which they define as a marriage of less than 5 years, with no kids. I glanced through it briefly at the bookstore and have been meaning to finally get around to buying it.

An interesting point I picked out of it during my brief glance was that for a lot of people, marriage is viewed as simply the next life step. We graduate high school, then go to college, and after that, our lives aren''t defined so clearly anymore. People see getting married and having kids as the next steps in this ladder to define themselves. I guess the point is that these marriages fail because they''re not done for the right reasons.

The book got me thinking - there is a societal pressure to get married, and I think it''s a lot worse for women than it is for men. Being a single guy in his 30s is viewed in a much better light than being a single woman in her 30s. Most of my girlfriends have had family nag about when they''d get married, but NONE of my guy friends have. And, for some reason, as we get older, it seems like there are LESS single men now than there were in our early 20s. Not sure why this is, but I remember in the early 20s almost every guy I knew was single, and now I know very few who aren''t in a long term relationship or married. (I''m 27).

And of course, there is the biological issue of child bearing. And I feel we''re under new pressure with this now because infertility is getting so much press. With all the in-vitro procedures available now, we''re hearing a lot more about how waiting later to have kids could make it hard to conceive. While this has always been true to an extent, I feel now us ladies have one more added pressure constantly in our face! It''s ironic - there are more options available to us now which allow us to have children at a later age, yet the publicity of these options only add to the stress and make people want to start sooner.

 

[blue_chica]

It is true that it''s worth questioning the validity of most assumed choices/steps etc, and examining why you want something. I certainly see a range of folks in my daily life - the couple that started dating in college, lived together for 15 years, bought a house together, then got married on a whim in vegas. The couple that got married after 4 years of dating, but isn''t going to have kids, and keeps finances almost completely separate. The couple that got married after 3 months, bought a house, lived there for a year, decided they were getting divorced, finalized and sold the house within 3 months. (Nice symmetry there, huh?)

Different things work for different people.

 

[nytemist]

Hi,

I''m new to the site, although I''ve been reading it for about 2 months. I came looking for other people''s point of view on how to handle a BF dragging his feet.

My BF and I just had out 4 year anniversary in Feb. I promised myself back in Oct that if he didn''t do anything to move things forward by our anniversary, I would have to start taking time away from him. Which I have for the most part.

A little history: in Oct of 2003, my best friend got married. BF came to the wedding with me (I was in it) and had a good time. HE actually started saying all the right things... like what kind of wedding he wanted with me, where to go on a honeymoon and the like. He also said that he knew exactly what kind of ring he was getting me, blah, blah, blah. In the following year, there have been many times he has brought up the topic I finally told him, "don''t talk about it unless you are ready to do it." Fine.

March of last year he finds out that his sister is getting married. He lives with his sister, so now he had to face the fact that he now has to move on his own. Of course, he first asked if we could find a place together. I said no. I refuse to be just a roommate with benefits. He swears that''s not how he would treat me. I said that''s fine, but for me to live with you, things would have to be different( meaning being engaged and planning our wedding and future) I would not live in a constant state of wondering if he actually loved me, or still had to ''think about it''. I said to him that if I''m good enough to share a home with and sleep with, then he should have no problem standing before people we are close to and saying he respects our relationship and can be committed to it. He said he understood.

Fast forward to New Year''s Eve 2004-New Years Day 2005. That morning I asked him what were his goals for the year (he doesn''t make resolutions) He said that wanted to find an apartment he could afford and be comfortable first. Then he wanted to work on getting engaged. He was about to get into a discussion about it, but a stopped him and reminded him if he wasn''t going to do it, not to talk about it. Our Feb anniversary came and went, but nothing, of course. Valentine''s Day came and went, but nothing, not that I was really expecting it.

I know I''m skipping over parts, but lately he has been bringing up this topic again. It hurts because obviously he has no intention of doing it yet. I understand it''s not an easy time for him right now (having to move and everything) But I also don''t think it''s fair to keep dangling this in front of me without saying when it going to happen, or just finally asking me. My self-imposed deadline has come and gone and I don''t see him as often as I used to. Also I went back to school so sometimes I can''t see him. Now that''s it''s Mid-March, I''m wondering how to bring up that topic that I feel strung along and I''m ready to take a break. I figure after four years, if he doesn''t know by now, it not going to happen. But of course he assures me that he wants to get married, saying this as recently as last week. I''m beginning to think it''s time for the proverbial ''cutting bait''. I think you all could help me get my head together. I''m still planning for my future, no matter what. I would love for him to be with me, but if this goes on, I just doubt if he''s really in this for good.

 

[MissAva]

Date: 2/23/2005 12:22

6 PM
Author: jlc0604

And of course, there is the biological issue of child bearing. And I feel we''re under new pressure with this now because infertility is getting so much press. With all the in-vitro procedures available now, we''re hearing a lot more about how waiting later to have kids could make it hard to conceive. While this has always been true to an extent, I feel now us ladies have one more added pressure constantly in our face! It''s ironic - there are more options available to us now which allow us to have children at a later age, yet the publicity of these options only add to the stress and make people want to start sooner.

Just a thought but you know sperm starts to go bad as well, not as quickly as eggs. I was shocked when I found out that chances for big problems (trisomy 21, deafness, misscarriage) went up and 27, then again dramtically at 35 and after 40 you need to see a high risk OB/GYN......maybe we ought to remind guys they have issues too. I know not as many and we dont know why (we have a set number of ovums and do not make more while males continue to produce them but something changes and they stop being as healthy after a certian point)
As for everything else I have read....WOW! I guess things are not as bad for me as I had thoguth they were. My BF (together just over 4 years) is saying he wants to get married soon...but again boy soon? His mother calls me her "favorite daughter" which is okay since she had two boys.
Some of those answer really shocked me. I am in AL and my bf is in NY (college students) and thus we have never had to consider living together. So I asked him what he would think of that. He laughed and replied of course we will live together when we are married.... I clarified what I had meant and he siad it was really up to me but didnt sound excited. We are botht the sort who would want to wait until marriage. I have seen too many girls move in with a guy and then be heart broken becuase the guy broke things off, or becuase they changed their minds about marriage to avoid messing with a good thing. (One actually said why change what we have now everything is perfect...beh she is better off with out him)
To reply to mytemist... I know jsut how you feel four years no ring and it stings at times. I am blunt girl so I asked Jeffrey why he hadnt proposed yet? He brought up marriage long before I ever did. He gave a long explination about "that perfect moment" and what my father once said "You can have her when you can afford her". My BF wants to make sure that I get the perfect ring and the perfect moment. I am willing to wait until he is ready. When I am with him I am just calmer more level. He makes me try harder and is always there with jsut he right comment. If you love someone give them time, maybe he is upset you wont talk about it and is afriad you will say no.
I could be totally wrong.

 

[nytemist]

It''s not that I won''t talk about our future, I just don''t see the point in getting into all these details about a wedding and marriage when he hasn''t made any move toward making it happen. A couple of weeks ago we got into yet another discussion about our future. I plan on moving to NY when I''m done with school, He knows this. He doesn''t love the city as much as I do, but he wants to stay with me. I have brought up the topic of what we plan on doing come the fall (when I''m finished) and he has no idea; he hasn''t really made any plans for his future. He has been getting worried hearing me talk about what I want to; when to move, how to get money together to do so, finding a job and the like. He is worried because I make it sound like I''m not including him. So I said, well, let''s sit and work this out... I do better trying to achieve goals when I plan, he is happy going along and letting life happen to him, claiming ''don''t worry, everything will work out''. I asked point blank what do you want? What are your expectations? He says, ''well get a job and be with you. Don''t ever doubt that I want to get engaged and get married.'' So I asked him when. He says well at least by 40, I''m 37 soon so that''s not that long. I was fuming, but held it in check. I asked, so you need another 3 years- why torture me with marriage promises if you have no intention of doing so anytime soon? I guess that you aren''t into this relationship as much as I am. He assures me that he is, and it''s not that he wants ''the perfect moment'' or ''the perfect ring'', all he can say is that it''s happening ''soon''. I said ok, but I''m not going to just wait around and see if you finally want to put your all into this relationship. I want to discuss things, but if all I get from him is shrugs and ''I don''t knows'', what are my choices? It does get really trying on the nerves when every family gathering (his family) his sisters, his mom or other are asking are we engaged yet. At one of his sister''s bridal showers, I was asked how long had BF and I been together. I said 4 years. She says, ''Oh, they''ve been together the same amount of time, so you two should be walking down the aisle soon, too!'' At her wedding in Oct, so many people were like, ''Oh, you''re his fiance?'' I would have to say no, just girlfriend. And he would get upset with me. Saying why did I have to say that, since we wil be definately gettied married... I said because we aren''t engaged- you haven''t asked me to marry you, no plans have been made, nothing. You want me to lie to people? This is what I mean by don''t bring it up if aren''t going to officially ask me. All the planning conversations can happen after that, when I know it''s really going to happen, not when it''s fantasy land.

 

[MissAva]

Wow! Three years, I dont know if that even counts as boy soon. Where do ya''ll live now? Does he have a good job that he might be afraid to leave? Why doesnt he like the city? Sorry I am being nosy. *hug* I am sorry things are so stressful for you I think I would just cry all of the time. Jeffrey and I have been together four years and people ask us constanly I just smile, tightly, and say I havent graduate from college yet and there is always my PhD. I do get frustrated becuse I every time I see him I think it is this time. I have planned the perfect proposal inmy head and thought I would rather be shot then tell him this there is no ring in my fantasy. All I want is a scrabble board. Thism ight sound silly but we play all the time just us and with my family. It has become a long running joke with us. So now I want him to make up a scraqbble board with all wedding words. Silly I know but that is my dream proposal. The ring can wait so we can pick and work on it together. I am flying up to see him again on the 24th and yes once agian I am hoping in my heart of hearts that he will ask this time. I know he wont cuase he is a ring there for the proposal kind of guy but that is allright. I will be happy just to hold him. Oh Lord I am getting sappy again. I need to go and do my homework.

 

[Bagpuss]

nytemist

I''m afraid that I agree with you - your guy doesn''t seem to be taking your position and how you feel seriously.

The same situation happened to my nephew. He had been with his g/f for seven years. They''d bought a house together and were living as a married couple. Family kept remarking on the fact that they weren''t married too.

Last year she got a new job and from what I''ve gathered, was having a wonderful time with new friends, lots of travelling and suddenly found a whole new lease of life. She then told him that she wanted to split up with him and sell the house.

He, realising he was going to loose her, wanted to get married and have a family straight away. No deal, it was too little too late. She''s gone now and, at the age of 30 years, he''s now single and back living with his Mum and Dad. He''s not a happy bunny, but I''m afraid that I have little sympathy for him. IMO, he brought it on himself.

Some guys do think that they can have it all and never pay the piper. I hope that you girls show them that they''re wrong.

 

[nytemist]

We live in Boston. He doens''t have a job that he loves, so leaving it wouldn''t be that hard on him. He would be more worried about finding another one and being able to pull his own weight. He does like NY, but nearly as much as I do. He doesn''t have that love for certain cities like me. I love NY, Montreal, Miami, New Orleans, San Fran and Rome. hehehehe

Baggpuss (sp?), it''s unfortunate about your nephew. It is a shame that most men don''t seem to get it- after a while, a woman starts to feel like she isn''t good enough, or worse, starts feeling used. I mean, both his sisters have people in the lives that knew this is what they wanted to do. Now they look at him and basically say ''ok, now it''s you''re turn.'' He''s like, yeah, I know.'' I''m the more outgoing of the two and he definately knows that I won''t sit around forever. A whiile ago he said he wanted a spring or fall 06 wedding. I reminded him of that, saying it takes a while to plan. His other sister''s wedding is in April and it''s been in the works since getting engaged last March. I don''t bug him, I don''t nag, I don''t threaten and haven''t given an ultimatum. I did tell him once (after a few too many drinks) that if he didn''t want to be in this, to have the balls to tell me and not waste my time. It shocked him to the point of near tears and he begged me not to leave him and he wasn''t wasting my time.

 

[allycat0303]

Hey everyone!

I thought I would share the worst story I ever heard. My boyfriend''s hockey buddy told me his very sad story:

He had been dating his girlfriend for 10 years. They live together and have a son but are not married. She has always wanted to be married, but he told her it really wasn''t in his plans. He was adament about not getting married. In any case, she was having trouble accepting all this and decided that they should meet with a priest to talk about his reservations about marriage. So he shows up at the church and *gasp* the priest starts talking to him about he wants the ceremony to be because his girlfriend had already told her entire family that they were getting married (she''d sent out invitations, booked the reception hall + church and everything). He was totally shocked and furious since he had A) NEVER asked her to get married B) Had made it totally clear that he didn''t want to get married, but felt so cornered that he went along with it. And even went through with the WEDDING. Of course everytime he sees me he tells me about his lying girlfriend who tricked him into marrying her. Now that''s what I call extreme measures. I think we can all agree that all of the LIW are much better off then she is.

 

[icekid]

wow ally- it takes some serious guts to pull that one off. is he still married to that girl?? i feel for her... but errr that''s probably not the best way to go about things! yikes...

nytemist- grrrrrrr... men! they want it all, and on their terms it seems. i think your bf needs a good kick in the butt! i definitely commend you for having the restraint not to bring it up rrequently- i don''t think i would have that much self control. if i were you, i would go through with your plans to move to NY. if he wants to go with you, i think a proposal would be in order. you shouldn''t change your plans or modify your life for someone who cannot seem to commit to you for the long term. he should definitely understand that.

i feel very blessed. my bf can''t wait to get married, and sings me silly songs about it (perhaps he was meant to be a girl

)

 

[nytemist]

Ally- that has to be the worst trapping story I''ve ever heard. I honestly don''t think I would have gone through with, and just the girlfriend live with the embarassment. Women like that give the rest of us good ones a bad name (not to sound like I''m judging all others)

Ice- I definately plan on going ahead with what I want to do. I don''t mean to sound insensitive or like I don''t care about how he feels, but there are two people in this, you know?

 

[MissAva]

Date: 3/13/2005 6

0:41 PM
Author: nytemist
Ally- that has to be the worst trapping story I''ve ever heard. I honestly don''t think I would have gone through with, and just the girlfriend live with the embarassment. Women like that give the rest of us good ones a bad name (not to sound like I''m judging all others)

Ice- I definately plan on going ahead with what I want to do. I don''t mean to sound insensitive or like I don''t care about how he feels, but there are two people in this, you know?

You are not being insensitive at all! You have set out a life plan for yourself and that is awsome, I think you sound strong and level headed. No one could doubt that you love him (otherwise you wouldnt care about marrying him) but you have to think about yourself too and what is right for you. Otherwise you might end up looking back in five or ten years and hating him because you didnt go or wondering how things would be different if you had stuck with your original goals. I hate to sound cold but sometimes you have to think logically about the long term and to be honest it sounds like you are. No matter what you decide just be sure it is right for you not anyone else. *hug*

 

[nytemist]

Thanks Matatora- This past weekend we didn''t see each other, but talked on the phone for about an hour. He asked if I was upset about the last talk we had. I said of course I was, but what could I do? He waits to deal with a situation when he gets to it, instead of planning for things. I said that''s your personality and I can just accept it or not. I choose to for now but things have to change. We are going to NY Easter weekend and we''ll have the chance to iron some things out. He is upset that I told him that I''m going to Montreal in July and he can''t come with me. He says, ''but wait, I may have plans for your summer break.'' I said ok, if by the time we get to July and there is a reason to cancel my reservations, I will.'' I''m not jerking him around- there are so many other things going on with me now; school, crazy work situations, having five wedding to go to this year... the list goes on. Then I have to find time to study, time to see friends and time for myself. He gets pouty when I live my life, thinking I''m just moving on without him. Quite honestly, I''m enjoying more time away from him, because now I''m not getting myself worked up thinking every time we see each each other, it will turn into a bad discussion. I''ve been looking back at some of things I''ve written in my journal and maybe this just another dimension of being together. I am his first serious, long-term relationship and maybe he''s still trying to adjust. But when do I stop being a learining experience and become the person he claims to love so much and want be with?

 

[LAJennifer]

This is just my take on things, but I''ve seen many of my girlfriends go through these types of situations - and a few have pulled the plug on the relationship. I feel that there comes a point in the relationship where you know each other well enough to make a decision as to wether you''re willing to roll the dice or not. It is a simple yes or no. Yes, marriage is a big step and we ladies have our own reservations as well - it can be scary for all of us. But once you truly know your partner, its time to ask yourself that question - if you''re willing to take the gamble. Do you want to be together or not. I think both women and men get to that point at the same time, but some men who hesitate (let''s face it) may, in fact, be keeping their options open. And some others just don''t "get it" - the longer they wait, they are just increasing the chances that the woman will say "no". And as for the fellows who say that "marriage just isn''t important" to them - well, let''s break that one down, shall we: "making the ultimate, personal lifelong commitment to you just isn''t important to me". Like it or not, that''s what they''re saying.

 

[NoonersMom]

LAJennifer, I couldn''t agree with you more. I think once you reach a certain age & experience in life, you either know or you don''t know if you would like to be with someone. If you don''t know after two years, then you shouldn''t be together.

Nytemist, make your plans! Until there is a commitment, you have no obligation to him (sorry, obligation may be the wrong word, but it''s the only one that I can think of at this moment). It truly is about what two people want. As my friend always states "Caroline does not leave her job, girlfriends and home for a boyfriend"! You have to be a priority in your own life! I don''t mean that in a selfish way, but you have to look out for yourself!

 

[appletini]

I just finished actually reading this thread for the first time b/c all the posts are so long, that I usually skip it. But really why are boys so wierd? I feel like sometimes its kind of like "he''s just not that into you", but maybe more along the lines of "he just doesn''t want to marry you."

Also I tend to obsess more when I have PMS (like I do right now), so I''m trying very hard to just keep me mouth shut on the whole "future" topic with the BF, just in hopes, that he might make some commentary on his own....I''m going to attempt this until 4/1 and see if he remembers the date he set to make a purchase.

Oh and we had dinner tonight with all the married and engaged couples...I''m so out of the loop just being the girlfriend.

Enough whining for now, I need to go to bed.

p.s. I still can''t get over the girl that tricked the BF into marrying her, but its his fault for going through with it.

 

[MissAva]

Wow tricking your husband into becoming your husband, there is a romantic story for the granchildren. Oh wait no. Anyway I am having an odd moment. I just realized that I graduate next may (Bach in Pyschology and Human Development I get to tell others why they do what they do...

) and that Jeffrey expects me to return to New Jersey/New York and wait to get engaged. I had always planned on graduating and then starting either my PhD or Masters at least ASAP meaning next fall. So I wont be returning to the North (its cold and everything costs more) unless that is where I am chosing to attend school. Oops! I cant belive this hadnt occured to either of us before. He was seeing us married at 23/24 I was thinking more like 27. Which made me wonder should I really be getting engaged right now? Or is it unfair to him to expect that. Plus poor thing his internship puts him within about 30mins of both of our parents homes which means he would be the one getting all the wedding questions and then I will be stuck with a huge fuffy wedding cuase he cant say no.... POINT OF THIS should I tell him to wait like things are boy soon?

Should I not go look at settings with him? It seems unfair to say yes but wait five years.

PS I dont actually know that he is planning on asking soon but he has talked to my parents about it in the past and I think they like him better then they like me. And lately he has been very attentive when I babble on about whatever "pretty shiney" I saw that day. Help Please!

 

[appletini]

matadora: I think the two of you should evaluate your life goals. He could always get a job where you are going to school or vice versa. Just b/c you are in school doesn''t mean you have to wait 5 years to get married, but you don''t have to rush either. And let your parents know what kind of wedding *you* want, but at the time, if they are paying for it, they will want some say on the guest list, but when you have a daughter and she gets married...her wedding will really be yours.

 

[MissAva]

I know...but my mother has three daughters, why cant she go harrass my older sister (24 in may) or play with dress up with the four year old. We know he will work in the NE that is where the highest paying jobs are for what he does h (it is about a 40% diffrence and it isnt reasonable to take that big of a pay cut). But though I am an Air Force brat both of my parents are southern and I feel more at ease here. I know I will be forced to bite my tounge and not call people Yankees for my adult life but while I can I am going to stay in Alabama or Georgia. (BF should have been born in Ga he is a true southern gentlemen, minus the whole growing up in NJ thing). All of the programs I am looking at, I want to get my masters while earning my PhD, are in the south east or farthest our was Texas also warm and friendly. NE programs are larger and more competative and I want to pick a school where the prof I would be working under/with would be studying a feild I am intreasting in. So we will likely be about 1200 miles apart for the next few years. I wont mind living in the north too much as an adult there are nice things there too and we will just have to spend oddles of money to keep our place at a soothing 80*. Even though it will sort of be my mothers wedding too the thing is my parents are Catholic I converted so I know there will be Questions Comments Thoughts about that. At least my Daddy is with me, he keeps saying if I elope he will make the down payment on our first house... I wish my Bf would agree to that.

PS I hate being the center of attention and getting married makes it hard to avoid.

 

[nytemist]

LA, Nooner and Apple-

Thank you for your encouraging words. I''ve was away for a couple of days and wasn''t able to get to the site. I''ve been busy with school and such so BF and I haven''t talked a lot since Saturday. He''s now calling me and asking when can we get together and talk. I said well, since we''re going away Easter weekend, we can talk then. He says not, we need to talk sooner and that he wants to rush from work and come over to talk to me this coming Saturday. Hopefully he realizes that there is a problem- that I feel like something is missing, namely his dedication. When we chatted for a short time the other day, he kept asking what was going on and so forth. I didn''t get into detail and said his own words of I''m talking about too many details about the future and he can''t handle that.

In my head, I know that I''m much more important than to put up with being strung along. That is why I''m not going to be like friends of mine who have moved in with their BF, hoping that will make them propose, waiting around and being a doormat, hoping that will make then propose... Nope, sorry. If you want this relationship, you better mean it and act like it. I''m trying not to dwell on the fact that he may not be as in love as he claims to be and that''s why he can''t be motivated- who knows? I''m keeping a short distance and maybe missing me will will get his butt into gear. Not to mention the sister he lives with who is getting married next month is giving him all her wedding organizer books and the like to help when we are ready to start planning! I love it that she is blunt about him wasting time. (I don''t have to do it and look like a nag!!!)

 

[LAJennifer]

NYTemist - sounds like he is attempting some damage control. He''s had the realization that he isn''t the only one in the driver''s seat, and that you too are capable of deciding the fate of this relationship (something men seem to forget). I wouldn''t advise accepting a proposal right now. Please make sure that this is something you still REALLY want, and not just something you THINK you want because you''ve been waiting for it to happen. I think women tend to grieve for the end of the relationship, long before the relationship actually ends. Its a wonderful coping mechanism nature has given us. That way, when the relationship does actually reach its end - we are so DONE, that it is easy for us to move on with our lives. Men don''t have it as easy - they never saw the end coming and are left with the feelings of "should of, could of, would have . . ." If you have already started the grieving process (and I suspect you have), then really do some soul searching to determine if you really want to be with this man, or would your life be better without him. If you stay with him, then you may resent him later for making you wait so long, or for being so indecisive and never making real plans. That also is probably the way he will live out the rest of his life - just going with the flow and ending up wherever. Is that something you can live with? Only you can decide that. Or would you be happier with someone more like yourself - someone who is strong, can stand on their own feet and know what he wants and how to get it.

Five years ago, I ended a 4 and a half year relationship that was going nowhere. There wasn''t anything "wrong" per se, but it wasn''t moving forward. I "gave" until their was nothing left to give. When I decided to "walk" - I actually "ran" 2600 miles away. I can honestly say that the best thing that ever happened to me was what "didn''t happen". That was 5 years ago and I still get emails from him, pining away. I''m certain he never saw it comng. I''m now with someone who appreciates my time and values, and my quality of life is soooooo much better. I now know what "real love" is.

 

[nytemist]

I do truly love the man, as he loves me. I went through the period of being in a relationship where I though I was, or though he did and have it fail miserably. I have grown, had bad dating experiences, became a cynic (which I think may be part of the problem) was single by choice for six years after finishing college (boy, was college dating bad) and really learned what I was looking for. BF and I worked for the same retailer in different stores. He was aware of me when I was in his store for a manager''s meeting. He was taken form day one, though I had no idea who he was until two years later he asked a mutual friend for my number. He was so painfully shy that it took so much for him to invite me out. He accepts me as I am (not 105lbs) and loves the fact that I got him out of the shell he has lived his life in for so long. Plus, we are dealing with a mixed relationship. Believe it or not, he does have excellent qualities and is so far away from being a game-player. This matter of saying we''re getting engaged and having nothing happen is relatively new and I''m trying to nip it in the bud before it gets to the point where I''m pulling my hair out. I do really want to be with him. It takes a long time to find that person that really makes your inner soul happy. That''s what he does for me. I can''t count the number of times he was told me he never wants to be without me. Also, time has gotten so hard to come by since going back to school, that we haven''t really had a period where nothing interrupts us and we can have a very deep 2-3 hour conversation. I haven''t been able to really delve into the ''why'' he hasn''t done it yet. I know when we talked a few weeks ago, he admitted that hearing me talk about future plans and moving and starting over in NY did scare him. Not the being with me part, but moving to a new city. He does still have a level of his shyness and he is afraid of the adjusting and job hunting aspect. I know that I would be happy witth him, but if it comes down to him not feeling as passionate about this relationship, then I have to move on. it would hurt like hell, and I probably would be single for a long time again, but it would have to happen. I know that''s not what he wants, but again, I haven''t had the time to really explore his mindset. I''m more upset that I don''t know what is really stopping him yet. Maybe he doesn''t want me to deal with the stress of engagement/wedding planning while I''m in school. That I understand. We really need the chance to get everything out in the open, I think, and then we''ll see what happens from there. I don''t want this to end. I don''t want to start grieving a lost relationship. I want to have that drama movie moment where we both open up the floodgates and all the words and tears come pouring out. (yes, I know that sounds so junior high

On the other hand, he knows that I do not put up with any bull and my patience will run out real quick if he can''t explain himself.