And the drama continues...

[iota15]

I don't think this was some cockamamie test for her FI. It seems like a bad confluence of circumstances - a) her fiance wanted to find the second diamond on his own, and do right by her; and b) she didn't go see the stone for herself because again, her fiance wanted to give it another shot. I mean - I wouldn't have thought that both my jeweler (who seems trustworthy and was told in detail about the last non-eyeclean stone that had to be returned) AND my fiance would both miss an inclusion that ends up bothering me. The jeweler doesn't want the stone returned. I'm sure he would have gladly sold the husband a VS stone before confirming the Si's eye cleaniness.

Of course, it's always possible they can BOTH miss an inclusion, and they did in these circumstances. It is a small inclusion but it seems to be bothering her immensely. I'm sure more than a few of us here understand that feeling. For all the crazy diamond talk we have around here - whether G sidestones are going to match an H center, whether the melee in a halo should be 1 pointers or 1.5 pointers, etc. - we should understand what it's like to just want to be satisfied with the shiny, expensive something on our finger.

Personally, I understand your plight. I agree with Gypsy that you might as well discuss this with your fiance sooner rather than later. Rip the band-aid off. You're not starting over, you're starting smarter this time. You need to be there and you understand what you want/need now.

 

[iota15]

When you go next time, once you're down to the last few stones - look at them in all types of lighting. From the side, the top - inside and outside the store or by a window. Cup it inside your hand (to shade it from the store's lights) and look again. You might feel like a crazy lady, but better to do this right than have to repeat this process.

Look at the stone under a loupe. Identify all the inclusions and see whether you can spot them again in different viewing conditions.

Then, this is important, make the stone dirty. Rub it in your palms and rub it in your husband's palms. A sparkly stone, freshly cleaned makes it difficult to spot inclusions. However, if you don't clean your stone everyday, this isn't a real life picture of your stone (which is sometimes covered in moisturizer, soap residue, hairspray, etc.). You may see inclusions after it's dirty that you wouldn't otherwise see in the store.

As some posters mentioned, there are NON-eye clean VS stones out there too. There are also eye-clean Si stones. Just check everything over thoroughly. For me, any type of black inclusion, which looks to be what you have now, is a deal-breaker.

If you need a break from this process, go get a coffee, and play with the stones again. Ya'll want to be sure this time.

 

[Hospatogi]

Oy-yoy-yoy! Oh, how unfortunate - I'm sorry he's hurt by it, and I'm sorry you're feeling guilty (but still unsatisfied). I think different people have different attitudes towards gift-giving, and until you figure out a way to navigate those differences ... troubled waters ahead!

See, I'm very much of the "if it's a gift, you should appreciate it" school (even if you secretly don't, to the giver's face you do): my husband is of the "blunt" school. That's just it: blunt. We both had our little come-to-Jesus moments on this: with him, it was when he got me a pendant that, while it had a nice thought behind it - as he put it, it's swirly, like that Art Nouveau stuff you like, right? - turned out to be a v. 80s heart (happily, he came in while I was eye-balling it suspiciously, realized something had gone wrong, and we returned it). With me, it was when I got him a nice - a really nice! - pocketknife of the sort he'd admired on our honeymoon - black mother-of-pearl handle, damascene steel blade - only to have him look at me blankly and say, "I fly every week for work." Seriously, it was like a messed up version of "The Gift of the Magi."

So now I choose my own gifts, and he provides a little more in the way of guidance.

I think the important thing, no matter what the individual vagaries might be, is communication, communication, communication. At the end of the day, you love one another madly, you're making a commitment to spend the rest of your lives together, and you're going to live happily ever after. The ring? Is just a ring. But, if you're shelling out 20K or so, it should be a ring you both really like. Me, I'd try to learn to love the inclusion (or try reorienting it in a different setting - I wonder if a bezel could help to disguise it a little - post macro pics, maybe?), just because I would find it hard to resist the value of a stone just under the 2 carat jump ... but either way, if his feelings are hurt now, you still have to talk about it. This isn't about anything but the ring - you're not comparing him to your ex, who, obviously, is not as cool as this guy, since you left the ex and are marrying him, you're not angling for him to spend more money, etc., etc. - it's just about finding the thing that will make you happiest for the next 60 years. So, get him to talk about his feelings, you do the same, and see where it lands you ....

Trust me, it will make things so much easier in the years to come!

I appreciate this advice a lot. I do believe that it's a gift and you should appreciate it - thus the guilt (plus, I'm Irish Catholic, so naturally I am always guilty). I do think I'm just not going to look at it for a while. And you are completely correct. My ex somehow got a very wonderful ring on the first try, but he wasn't even remotely the man my current guy is. He is absolutely wonderful, and it is absolutely killing me that our otherwise fantastic relationship is overshadowed by this ridiculous thing. I can;t believe I feel this way about the ring, I am fighting it with everything I can muster.

I'd like to post macro pics and see if maybe anyone has a suggest on how to reset it, but I do think it's far enough from the edge where it's probably impossible. I'm not sure I know how to take a good picture, but I do have a good camera so hopefully I can figure it out.

I think in your heart if you dont exchange this diamond you are always going to be comparing it to your last engagement ring. You are always going to keep looking down at that inclusion thinking your ring isnt as nice as the one your ex gave you and that is such a shame because your guy seems to be a wonderful person. I know you dont want to hurt him but I think he would feel worse knowing that you are completely disappointed with your ring. Be honest with him and go to the jeweler and create that " wonderful" ring you are dreaming of together .

 

[suchende]

I still don't get why he didn't buy the stellar diamond the first time.

 

[kenny]

I still don't get why he didn't buy the stellar diamond the first time.

His near vision is not as good as hers, perhaps because he's older.
Perhaps the jeweler is older too and does not notice inclusions as much as a younger person.

I'd also work this out with your man and get a diamond you will be happy with.
Sure his feelings are important but so is your diamond.
I do not share the viewpoint that you have to chose one or the other.
"What do you love more, me or the diamond?", is the way a narcissistic 15-year old might think.

You can love him, care about his feelings, AND get the diamond that makes you happy.
Them being mutually exclusive is a mind game.

Perhaps part of his hurt feelings is he's being reminded that he's getting old since reduced near vision is often age-related.
Nobody likes to learn he/her body is aging.
Maybe part of this solution could include reassurance from you that you love and accept him as he is, and will be.

 

[AmeliaG]

I actually care MORE about the relationship than I do the ring. Does it bother me? Yes. Does my fiancee being hurt bother me more? YES.

You're on the right track. Take care of the relationship and the diamond will take care of itself. Its an emotional purchase with feelings and egos on the line - not like buying a right hand ring or a pair of diamond studs. FWIW, it looks like your FI loves you and knows you love him. He's just not feeling the love right now because all he can see is that you're bothered by the damn inclusions.

So I think you're doing the right thing by giving it a rest. You've got a lifetime together to work things out. The only downside of waiting is taking a financial hit if you want to exchange the diamond after the exchange period is over. But honestly, he's 40 years old, he can afford to get you a 2 carat diamond, it looks like he's doing pretty well financially, so I think he'll be able to take a financial hit if both of you later decide this diamond isn't for you. If he were 24 years old and broke, I'd say something different but he's not. He may not be able to take the emotional hit now if you both try to get it fixed perfect right now.

 

[monarch64]

300, I read about half of your last topic and almost all of this one. That said, I want you to know that I have total respect for you but this is what I would do: return or sell this current ring and start all over.

I was married previously. I had a beautiful engagement ring and a beautiful wedding band. I ended up selling my e-ring when I divorced to produce money for living expenses (I left a marriage that was detrimental to my well-being with basically nothing) and it sold for about half of what my former husband paid for it, thanks to my brother's fabulous ebay skills, and luck. I was left with the wedding band, and several years later after much patience, I have managed to turn that into something of a gain as well. I have also since become engaged, and this man of mine would NEVER have accepted my previous e-ring as payment or trade-in towards another ring for me. He actually took a low-paying, PT job (he went to an Ivy League grad school) to save up for my e-ring while working full time at his "good enough for now" day job. He and I will get around to nice wedding bands for ourselves when we have the time; currently he is in the midst of a job transition and we are due to close on our first home together this week.) When I went to finally rid myself of my old wedding band, he asked me if it could be traded towards new wedding bands for both of us for our upcoming nuptials. I said "absolutely not." I am of the mind that I don't want anything from my last marriage "paying forward" anything into my upcoming one. Period.

This is just my opinion, and I don't mean to sound judgmental at all. I just think maybe you are harboring some ill will towards your current fiance because he accepted your old e-ring as payment towards the ring he gave you. I am perhaps completely off my rocker and I apologize if I'm out of line at all, because that's not my intention...but honestly if I were you, I would start all over and go shopping with your man and get what you both want out of this without using your former e-ring. Wishing you the absolute best luck...

 

[Ickeymouse]

Oh. Hey, I missed all that on the old ex husband's ring vs the new FH's ring. Yep, will have to agree, he is probably mad about the comparison to the old one. It pisses him off to think about you and your ex. Hmmmm, this is a quandary. Maybe he won't "get over it" that easily after all.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I think people are getting off track on this. We covered all that on the old thread, and the old ring is not the problem here. The fiance is just disappointed he didn't perfectly please her on the first try and now he didn't meet her requirement of eyeclean on the second try (and there was just no way she could know he AND the jeweler had bad near vision!!!). I can understand the disapppointment, However, giving someone a gift should be about pleasing HER since she is the one who has to wear it the next 50 years. And I think he needs to put her feelings first and do whatever it takes to make her happy, because it really is not a big deal to exchange the diamond while in the return period.

 

[Lightfoot]

I think it's important to realize that what he wants and what she wants just are not safely compatible in this scenario. He wants to surprise her with something she will love, and she does want him to have his surprise but wants a ring that she will love even more (which is fine).

So 300 has 2 choices - accept the ring he picks for what it is and be happy or go with him to pick out one together. I know this is Pricescope and all but both really are perfectly valid options, no one better than the other, and she needs to decide which one is right for her.

True story - a friend of mine received an e-ring from her now husband that is unanimously considered the most ugly e-ring on the planet. The husband, at the time, was told by family + friends to go with something else but it was the one he decided he really wanted to give her and he stuck to his guns and went with it. She realizes how ugly it is but it has more meaning to her beyond that. Even when he offered to have the diamond put in a different setting, she declined because she knew/felt that he might have gotten a little sad if she had. And she does wear it, and we're always surprised when she does but that is how that scenario played out based on what was important to her.

That's not to say going that route is better than 300 going and finally picking out the ring herself BUT it's not worse either. It just depends on what's important here and how the relationship is. This happens all the time and some relationships go the first route and some go the second route and I wouldn't cast stones at either of them. (And don't think that picking something out TOGETHER that you BOTH love isn't romantic - it can be very romantic and fun - if that's what you feel is right, then do it).

As some others have suggested, I would take some time, let things cool off, and go from there...

 

[rosetta]

Your ring is beautiful!

I'm sure it bothers you, but I'm not bothered by inclusions myself. Hey, theyre there whether I can see them or not, so what's the big deal? Even if I can't see them, some eagle eyed person will one day.

Also, I like doing a quick check to make sure it's my stone returning from the jewellers. Bugs me that I can't do that for the VVS1 stone I have!

That's my take on inclusions. Laid back.

I also am in the "it's a gift, not a right, so just roll with it" camp.

Not judging you. Interesting to see a different viewpoint from mine.

Good luck finding your perfect stone.

 

[Karl_K]

Can you post a scan or picture of the clarity plot portion of the grading report please?

Do you have a loupe? Check the entire diamond for a glob of polishing compound.

edit:
I am not saying that it is polishing compound that is impossible to tell just from the picture but by how it looks it could be polishing compound on the diamond rather than an inclusion.
It does not have to be on the area you see it from the top, the opposite side on the pavilion is very possible.

 

[AmeliaG]

I can understand the disapppointment, However, giving someone a gift should be about pleasing HER since she is the one who has to wear it the next 50 years. And I think he needs to put her feelings first and do whatever it takes to make her happy, because it really is not a big deal to exchange the diamond while in the return period.

FWIW, I'm like you in regards to gift giving. Not everybody treats gifts the same way though. It's easy to say what he should or shouldn't do but we can't even influence HIM, he didn't start the thread. Its pretty clear, though, he is hurt regardless of whether he should be or not and she's having trouble navigating the waters. That's an understandable problem and in my experience when people are hurt when they shouldn't be, the problem takes a bit longer to solve. It may not be a big deal for the diamond to be exchanged within the return period but it may be a big deal for her to resolve this thorny issue with him during a short exchange period. But I think she needs to make that call - dealing with the diamond is easy; dealing with the relationship isn't always so clearcut.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I can understand the disapppointment, However, giving someone a gift should be about pleasing HER since she is the one who has to wear it the next 50 years. And I think he needs to put her feelings first and do whatever it takes to make her happy, because it really is not a big deal to exchange the diamond while in the return period.

FWIW, I'm like you in regards to gift giving. Not everybody treats gifts the same way though. It's easy to say what he should or shouldn't do but we can't even influence HIM, he didn't start the thread. Its pretty clear, though, he is hurt regardless of whether he should be or not and she's having trouble navigating the waters. That's an understandable problem and in my experience when people are hurt when they shouldn't be, the problem takes a bit longer to solve. It may not be a big deal for the diamond to be exchanged within the return period but it may be a big deal for her to resolve this thorny issue with him during a short exchange period. But I think she needs to make that call - dealing with the diamond is easy; dealing with the relationship isn't always so clearcut.

Well said, Amelia!

 

[Ickeymouse]

Well put, AmeliaG. Hurt feelings are tough to navigate. That is what I was trying to say, but not as well. I empathize with her plight.

Let's hope Karl K is right, and it is a wee bit of polishing compound! We will all be relieved!

 

[MyDiamondSparkles]

I'm so sorry to hear all of this, espeicially when this should be an exciting and joyous time in your life.

My story pertains to diamond size more than diamond clarity: When I got married it was the custom that the guy pick out the ring and the girl be totally surprised. My now husband went shopping and phoned me to ask if I would prefer a larger diamond with inlcusions or a smaller diamond with no inclusions. I went for smaller and no inclusions. I have to say when he surprised me with the ring I was a little disappointed in how small it was, even though it was a standard size for the time. Most of all, I knew he was shopping within his very limited budget and he certainly got me the biggest and best that he could afford. I knew if I said anything he would be extremely hurt, so I said nothing (even to this day I have never mentioned it) and kept the ring and treasured it. It will always be very special to me. Later, when we had more money, he wanted to upgrade the size of the diamond and by then the size of it didn't matter to me anymore--busy with the kids, the house, etc. I finally did upgrade, and again it was a joyous occassion for the both of us.

I think you know your fiance better than most of us, so only you can make the decision of what to do. I do believe honesty is always the best thing in a relationship, but in my case, I needed to be honset with myself. Honest about being disappointed in the diamond size was more about me needing to get a grip on what my husband could reasonably afford--and learning to live within our means. In this case I think I made the right decision. Sometimes when I am feeling a certain way I ask myself what is this feeling really about. Does that make sense. Like I do this:

(and please bear with me, because the dishwasher part seems stupid right now, but I am hoping you will see where I am going with this)

I am really (steaming mad) upset with my husand today because he didn't empty the dishwasher.

Why am I upset because he didn't empty the dishwasher? Because I always have to do it and I don't have time! Doh!

Why am I upset because I don't have time? Because I feel pulled in all directions.

Why am I upset because I am pulled in all directions? Because I never say no to people when I should.

So really I am upset not because my husband didn't empty the dishwasher, I am upset bcause I don't have enough time, I am pulled in all directions and I never say no when I should. With the saying no part having the most emphasis because it really is the "root" of the entire problem with being steaming upset over a silly dishwasher.

So maybe this could work for you too. Just start this way: I am upset with my fiance because (fill in the blank) and keep asking your self the question until you realy find out what the root of the problem is. Because, more than likely the root of the problem is more than the size of the diamond and the clarity of the diamond. It may even be that your expections this time around are greater than they were for your first marriage and the diamond needs to be a "This is it!" diamond to represent how amazing this realtionship is to you and how you feel so blessed. It's amazing the things I've discovered about myself by asking these questions.

Anyway, I hope this helps....I know you will make the right decision for your relationship too and this will be a small bump in the road and nothing but a distant memory one day.

Hugs,
MDS

 

[Circe]

I'm so sorry to hear all of this, espeicially when this should be an exciting and joyous time in your life.

My story pertains to diamond size more than diamond clarity: When I got married it was the custom that the guy pick out the ring and the girl be totally surprised. My now husband went shopping and phoned me to ask if I would prefer a larger diamond with inlcusions or a smaller diamond with no inclusions. I went for smaller and no inclusions. I have to say when he surprised me with the ring I was a little disappointed in how small it was, even though it was a standard size for the time. Most of all, I knew he was shopping within his very limited budget and he certainly got me the biggest and best that he could afford. I knew if I said anything he would be extremely hurt, so I said nothing (even to this day I have never mentioned it) and kept the ring and treasured it. It will always be very special to me. Later, when we had more money, he wanted to upgrade the size of the diamond and by then the size of it didn't matter to me anymore--busy with the kids, the house, etc. I finally did upgrade, and again it was a joyous occassion for the both of us.

I think you know your fiance better than most of us, so only you can make the decision of what to do. I do believe honesty is always the best thing in a relationship, but in my case, I needed to be honset with myself. Honest about being disappointed in the diamond size was more about me needing to get a grip on what my husband could reasonably afford--and learning to live within our means. In this case I think I made the right decision. Sometimes when I am feeling a certain way I ask myself what is this feeling really about. Does that make sense. Like I do this:

(and please bear with me, because the dishwasher part seems stupid right now, but I am hoping you will see where I am going with this)

I am really (steaming mad) upset with my husand today because he didn't empty the dishwasher.

Why am I upset because he didn't empty the dishwasher? Because I always have to do it and I don't have time! Doh!

Why am I upset because I don't have time? Because I feel pulled in all directions.

Why am I upset because I am pulled in all directions? Because I never say no to people when I should.

So really I am upset not because my husband didn't empty the dishwasher, I am upset bcause I don't have enough time, I am pulled in all directions and I never say no when I should. With the saying no part having the most emphasis because it really is the "root" of the entire problem with being steaming upset over a silly dishwasher.

So maybe this could work for you too. Just start this way: I am upset with my fiance because (fill in the blank) and keep asking your self the question until you realy find out what the root of the problem is. Because, more than likely the root of the problem is more than the size of the diamond and the clarity of the diamond. It may even be that your expections this time around are greater than they were for your first marriage and the diamond needs to be a "This is it!" diamond to represent how amazing this realtionship is to you and how you feel so blessed. It's amazing the things I've discovered about myself by asking these questions.

Anyway, I hope this helps....I know you will make the right decision for your relationship too and this will be a small bump in the road and nothing but a distant memory one day.

Hugs,
MDS

MDS, your post is very eloquent, and, I have to admit, I'm sort of torn on it: part of me thinks that it's very intelligent and emotionally savvy to explore the underlying causes and motivators which drive our anger, which frequently do come down to "I" ... and part of me think it's really unhealthy to internalize all that anger and blame it all on oneself! Sometimes, our anger at other people is entirely valid. I think the case with the ring that you describe was a case of the former ... and the dishwasher is a case of the latter, or, at least, a split decision (you can be angry at yourself for saying "yes" to too many things, after all, while simultaneously being angry at your husband for not saying it enough).

But I'm not getting too much anger off of 300 - more frustration and a little bit of that good ole' cultural guilt (I have it too, 300, even if mine is of the Jewish variety). Her fiance might be angry, but it's hard to tell from her posts - as someone who comes from the "it's a gift, say thank you" school of thought and has had gifts rejected, I'm going to guess his feelings are a combination of "I tried really hard" meeting "most people would love X!" I know it got easier for me once my husband explained that he was just really, really picky, and it was just practical to be honest about gifts, and, hey! It was just stuff, and this wasn't his way of saying my love wasn't good enough. I think for the materially oriented (of whom I am one), it can sometimes seem that way, so having it spelled out made it a lot easier.

E-rings are inherently symbolic, which contributes to a lot of the psychoanalyzing we do around here, but at the end of the day, it's just stuff. 300, I hope you guys have had/will have a good talk (and I'm also hoping Karl's right, and it's polishing compound). Let us know!

 

[300GCP]

I think it's important to realize that what he wants and what she wants just are not safely compatible in this scenario. He wants to surprise her with something she will love, and she does want him to have his surprise but wants a ring that she will love even more (which is fine).

So 300 has 2 choices - accept the ring he picks for what it is and be happy or go with him to pick out one together. I know this is Pricescope and all but both really are perfectly valid options, no one better than the other, and she needs to decide which one is right for her.

True story - a friend of mine received an e-ring from her now husband that is unanimously considered the most ugly e-ring on the planet. The husband, at the time, was told by family + friends to go with something else but it was the one he decided he really wanted to give her and he stuck to his guns and went with it. She realizes how ugly it is but it has more meaning to her beyond that. Even when he offered to have the diamond put in a different setting, she declined because she knew/felt that he might have gotten a little sad if she had. And she does wear it, and we're always surprised when she does but that is how that scenario played out based on what was important to her.

That's not to say going that route is better than 300 going and finally picking out the ring herself BUT it's not worse either. It just depends on what's important here and how the relationship is. This happens all the time and some relationships go the first route and some go the second route and I wouldn't cast stones at either of them. (And don't think that picking something out TOGETHER that you BOTH love isn't romantic - it can be very romantic and fun - if that's what you feel is right, then do it).

As some others have suggested, I would take some time, let things cool off, and go from there...

I have had a ROUGH few days with this. We have discussed it. There have been tears. There has been anger. We need to cool off. That said, I would LOVE if you would indulge me with a description of the ugliest e-ring on the planet, so that maybe I can laugh.

 

[300GCP]

I'm so sorry to hear all of this, espeicially when this should be an exciting and joyous time in your life.

My story pertains to diamond size more than diamond clarity: When I got married it was the custom that the guy pick out the ring and the girl be totally surprised. My now husband went shopping and phoned me to ask if I would prefer a larger diamond with inlcusions or a smaller diamond with no inclusions. I went for smaller and no inclusions. I have to say when he surprised me with the ring I was a little disappointed in how small it was, even though it was a standard size for the time. Most of all, I knew he was shopping within his very limited budget and he certainly got me the biggest and best that he could afford. I knew if I said anything he would be extremely hurt, so I said nothing (even to this day I have never mentioned it) and kept the ring and treasured it. It will always be very special to me. Later, when we had more money, he wanted to upgrade the size of the diamond and by then the size of it didn't matter to me anymore--busy with the kids, the house, etc. I finally did upgrade, and again it was a joyous occassion for the both of us.

I think you know your fiance better than most of us, so only you can make the decision of what to do. I do believe honesty is always the best thing in a relationship, but in my case, I needed to be honset with myself. Honest about being disappointed in the diamond size was more about me needing to get a grip on what my husband could reasonably afford--and learning to live within our means. In this case I think I made the right decision. Sometimes when I am feeling a certain way I ask myself what is this feeling really about. Does that make sense. Like I do this:

(and please bear with me, because the dishwasher part seems stupid right now, but I am hoping you will see where I am going with this)

I am really (steaming mad) upset with my husand today because he didn't empty the dishwasher.

Why am I upset because he didn't empty the dishwasher? Because I always have to do it and I don't have time! Doh!

Why am I upset because I don't have time? Because I feel pulled in all directions.

Why am I upset because I am pulled in all directions? Because I never say no to people when I should.

So really I am upset not because my husband didn't empty the dishwasher, I am upset bcause I don't have enough time, I am pulled in all directions and I never say no when I should. With the saying no part having the most emphasis because it really is the "root" of the entire problem with being steaming upset over a silly dishwasher.

So maybe this could work for you too. Just start this way: I am upset with my fiance because (fill in the blank) and keep asking your self the question until you realy find out what the root of the problem is. Because, more than likely the root of the problem is more than the size of the diamond and the clarity of the diamond. It may even be that your expections this time around are greater than they were for your first marriage and the diamond needs to be a "This is it!" diamond to represent how amazing this realtionship is to you and how you feel so blessed. It's amazing the things I've discovered about myself by asking these questions.

Anyway, I hope this helps....I know you will make the right decision for your relationship too and this will be a small bump in the road and nothing but a distant memory one day.

Hugs,
MDS

MDS, your post is very eloquent, and, I have to admit, I'm sort of torn on it: part of me thinks that it's very intelligent and emotionally savvy to explore the underlying causes and motivators which drive our anger, which frequently do come down to "I" ... and part of me think it's really unhealthy to internalize all that anger and blame it all on oneself! Sometimes, our anger at other people is entirely valid. I think the case with the ring that you describe was a case of the former ... and the dishwasher is a case of the latter, or, at least, a split decision (you can be angry at yourself for saying "yes" to too many things, after all, while simultaneously being angry at your husband for not saying it enough).

But I'm not getting too much anger off of 300 - more frustration and a little bit of that good ole' cultural guilt (I have it too, 300, even if mine is of the Jewish variety). Her fiance might be angry, but it's hard to tell from her posts - as someone who comes from the "it's a gift, say thank you" school of thought and has had gifts rejected, I'm going to guess his feelings are a combination of "I tried really hard" meeting "most people would love X!" I know it got easier for me once my husband explained that he was just really, really picky, and it was just practical to be honest about gifts, and, hey! It was just stuff, and this wasn't his way of saying my love wasn't good enough. I think for the materially oriented (of whom I am one), it can sometimes seem that way, so having it spelled out made it a lot easier.

E-rings are inherently symbolic, which contributes to a lot of the psychoanalyzing we do around here, but at the end of the day, it's just stuff. 300, I hope you guys have had/will have a good talk (and I'm also hoping Karl's right, and it's polishing compound). Let us know!

In terms of the feelings that we are both having, I think it's complicated. Without even touching the prior ring or the experience with the prior jeweler (which my fiancee says made him feel like he made a 'stupid' decision), the choosing of this diamond came with a lot of excitement. My fiancee is a trusts and estates attorney at a large law firm. He ultimately ended up using the firm's jeweler - the same jeweler that the firm uses for all of its estate appraisals and sales, etc. The jewelers get business from the firm and obviously have an incentive to make someone like my fiancee, who is a partner, happy. Why didn't he go with them the first time? Because he just joined this firm in February after 13 years with the same law firm that I work at! Which is how we met. So this connection is long standing for his firm, but new for him. That said, everyone at the firm trusts these guys. When he originally met with them to tell them the story, they were VERY understanding. They bought the other stone back from my fiancee. They said they had this 1.92 carat stone and they thought it might be just what he was looking for. BUT, they also showed him other stones as well, so he was not pigeonholed into this. I was VERY excited at the thought of this size - which was FAR beyond my expectations. I never thought I would receive something like that. I think my excitement further made him VERY excited. We were both happy and the jeweler gave him a great price on it. When he was looking at the stone an additional time right before purchasing it, he was apparently really scrutinizing it and the jeweler even asked him, are you looking for something specific? He said I just need to make sure this is eye clean, it's important to her. The jeweler and him looked at it together and the jeweler even said "I would not sell you something that I knew was not eye clean." This story was relayed to me and I (obviously mistakenly) though, GREAT!!! I anticipated getting the ring and couldn't wait. When I got the ring, it was probably a few hours before I noticed the spot. When I did, I obviously felt like OOOOHHH NOOOOOOO, after the way I behaved so excited, NOW I spot THIS?!?! I told him right away I saw it but kept saying "it's like a freckle" because I was TRYING to convince myself this was OK. Finally on Sunday I said basically what all of you said I should say - this is all my fault, my vision is really good with my contacts in (overcorrected, 20/15), I am so sorry. Because the inclusion actually appears to be towards the bottom and the side, I said maybe we can just cover it up with the prong and somehow that will block the reflection. He was VERY pessimistic about that, and I asked if he would please be more optimistic about fixing it. He started getting halfy teary/half angry and sort of yelling (and he doesn't yell) "I've been doing everything I can to make this better. I screwed this up AGAIN." Obviously, this broke my heart. I started profusely apologizing, saying I was horribly sorry and should never have even mentioned it and that I was so appreciative of all he has done to try to make me happy. I was really devestated by his reaction, cried for a lot of yesterday. This morning before he left he said "everything will work out." Maybe he is softening on the idea of doing something, but I think his immediate reaction was to be a) upset and b) in disbelief that after he inspected it so many times, it has a black spot. And yes, someone said maybe he is upset about realizing his eyesight is worsening with age - that is DEFINITELY part of it. DEFINITELY. He said so.

 

[300GCP]

Can you post a scan or picture of the clarity plot portion of the grading report please?

Do you have a loupe? Check the entire diamond for a glob of polishing compound.

edit:
I am not saying that it is polishing compound that is impossible to tell just from the picture but by how it looks it could be polishing compound on the diamond rather than an inclusion.
It does not have to be on the area you see it from the top, the opposite side on the pavilion is very possible.

If it were polishing compound, would it just look like a black dot like that somewhere on the outside of the stone?

 

[Lightfoot]

I have had a ROUGH few days with this. We have discussed it. There have been tears. There has been anger. We need to cool off. That said, I would LOVE if you would indulge me with a description of the ugliest e-ring on the planet, so that maybe I can laugh.

I'm sorry to hear it's been a rough few days. Let me see if I can do "justice" to this thing... (and before I continue, I sincerely do not mean to offend anyone if they have a ring that they feel looks like this)

I had never, and still have yet to, see anything like this ring and how it is setup. Some descriptions that have been used are "mini Eiffel Tower" or "the bursting nipple" (not meant to be vulgar, just descriptive). Essentially it's a halo, but the center stone is raised up so high above the halo ring that from the side it looks like the ring just has a halo ring, and then bursting through it, a yard higher, the center diamond.

Now the design is the design and I guess he liked it (to date, he has been the ONLY one) but on top of that - the quality of the diamonds is very obviously poor - very very yellow - all of them, including the center stone. The center stone itself, if I had to guess, MIGHT be 0.4 carats - very yellow, and no optics whatsoever. I'm honestly not sure if the diamonds are that low in color or if they are actually just tiny, low quality, fancy colors. So the design I could chalk up to preference, but the ring quality is really bad. It has no weight or heft to it. It honestly looks and feels like it came out of a Cracker Jack box or some Super Hero cereal. It's so bizarre looking that you just assume it has some connections to a super hero. No joke - she held it up to the sky once and I could have sworn I saw Captain Planet fly by and wave to us.

So imagine if you will, a completely yellow, including the diamonds, .001 ounce flimsy ring, with a mini-Eiffel Tower looking sculpture on it jutting up an inch off your finger and you'll get an idea of what I'm trying to convery. I guess it has some use as a weapon if she punched someone square in the eye with it or something (*ouch*).

(And again, this is really all for laughs - yeah the ring is attrocious in our opinions, but it gives us some good laughs and we're never out to upset them).

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Oh, I have JUST the thread for you!

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/unique-and-unusual-post-them-here.18524/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/unique-and-unusual-post-them-here.18524/[/URL]

 

[kenny]

Can you post a scan or picture of the clarity plot portion of the grading report please?
Do you have a loupe? Check the entire diamond for a glob of polishing compound.
edit:I am not saying that it is polishing compound that is impossible to tell just from the picture but by how it looks it could be polishing compound on the diamond rather than an inclusion.
It does not have to be on the area you see it from the top, the opposite side on the pavilion is very possible.

If it were polishing compound, would it just look like a black dot like that somewhere on the outside of the stone?

No, because diamonds are not opaque.
Gunk on the bottom can be visible on the top.
Get a loupe and get familiar with using it and look at the bottom of the diamond when it is not clean.
Focus on the surface dirt and see if the black spot is also in focus there at the surface; if so then it is on the surface and most likely polishing compound.
If not, and you have to focus deeper in the diamond, then it IS an inclusion.

I have pink diamond that had a stubborn film (which I was told may have been polishing compound) on the table, see pic.
GIA still graded it VVS1, even with the gunk there.
In my case it was more of a film than a blob.
Perhaps GIA knew what is was and did not downgrade the clarity for it.
BTW, the gunk was NOT plotted or mentioned on the GIA report.

I took it to a local jeweler to have it cleaned and they were astonished that they could not clean it off.
I contacted the seller and they made arrangements and paid for it to be boiled in acid, the standard procedure for cleaning off polishing compound.
Now it's perfect.

Like Karl said check the inclusion plots on your report.
If it is listed as an inclusion then it is not something on the outside of the diamond that can be cleaned off.

 

[300GCP]

I have had a ROUGH few days with this. We have discussed it. There have been tears. There has been anger. We need to cool off. That said, I would LOVE if you would indulge me with a description of the ugliest e-ring on the planet, so that maybe I can laugh.

I'm sorry to hear it's been a rough few days. Let me see if I can do "justice" to this thing... (and before I continue, I sincerely do not mean to offend anyone if they have a ring that they feel looks like this)

I had never, and still have yet to, see anything like this ring and how it is setup. Some descriptions that have been used are "mini Eiffel Tower" or "the bursting nipple" (not meant to be vulgar, just descriptive). Essentially it's a halo, but the center stone is raised up so high above the halo ring that from the side it looks like the ring just has a halo ring, and then bursting through it, a yard higher, the center diamond.

Now the design is the design and I guess he liked it (to date, he has been the ONLY one) but on top of that - the quality of the diamonds is very obviously poor - very very yellow - all of them, including the center stone. The center stone itself, if I had to guess, MIGHT be 0.4 carats - very yellow, and no optics whatsoever. I'm honestly not sure if the diamonds are that low in color or if they are actually just tiny, low quality, fancy colors. So the design I could chalk up to preference, but the ring quality is really bad. It has no weight or heft to it. It honestly looks and feels like it came out of a Cracker Jack box or some Super Hero cereal. It's so bizarre looking that you just assume it has some connections to a super hero. No joke - she held it up to the sky once and I could have sworn I saw Captain Planet fly by and wave to us.

So imagine if you will, a completely yellow, including the diamonds, .001 ounce flimsy ring, with a mini-Eiffel Tower looking sculpture on it jutting up an inch off your finger and you'll get an idea of what I'm trying to convery. I guess it has some use as a weapon if she punched someone square in the eye with it or something (*ouch*).

(And again, this is really all for laughs - yeah the ring is attrocious in our opinions, but it gives us some good laughs and we're never out to upset them).

LOL!!!I give your friend a ton of credit for being such a good sport. Love the "bursting nipple!"

 

[Circe]

In terms of the feelings that we are both having, I think it's complicated. Without even touching the prior ring or the experience with the prior jeweler (which my fiancee says made him feel like he made a 'stupid' decision), the choosing of this diamond came with a lot of excitement. My fiancee is a trusts and estates attorney at a large law firm. He ultimately ended up using the firm's jeweler - the same jeweler that the firm uses for all of its estate appraisals and sales, etc. The jewelers get business from the firm and obviously have an incentive to make someone like my fiancee, who is a partner, happy. Why didn't he go with them the first time? Because he just joined this firm in February after 13 years with the same law firm that I work at! Which is how we met. So this connection is long standing for his firm, but new for him. That said, everyone at the firm trusts these guys. When he originally met with them to tell them the story, they were VERY understanding. They bought the other stone back from my fiancee. They said they had this 1.92 carat stone and they thought it might be just what he was looking for. BUT, they also showed him other stones as well, so he was not pigeonholed into this. I was VERY excited at the thought of this size - which was FAR beyond my expectations. I never thought I would receive something like that. I think my excitement further made him VERY excited. We were both happy and the jeweler gave him a great price on it. When he was looking at the stone an additional time right before purchasing it, he was apparently really scrutinizing it and the jeweler even asked him, are you looking for something specific? He said I just need to make sure this is eye clean, it's important to her. The jeweler and him looked at it together and the jeweler even said "I would not sell you something that I knew was not eye clean." This story was relayed to me and I (obviously mistakenly) though, GREAT!!! I anticipated getting the ring and couldn't wait. When I got the ring, it was probably a few hours before I noticed the spot. When I did, I obviously felt like OOOOHHH NOOOOOOO, after the way I behaved so excited, NOW I spot THIS?!?! I told him right away I saw it but kept saying "it's like a freckle" because I was TRYING to convince myself this was OK. Finally on Sunday I said basically what all of you said I should say - this is all my fault, my vision is really good with my contacts in (overcorrected, 20/15), I am so sorry. Because the inclusion actually appears to be towards the bottom and the side, I said maybe we can just cover it up with the prong and somehow that will block the reflection. He was VERY pessimistic about that, and I asked if he would please be more optimistic about fixing it. He started getting halfy teary/half angry and sort of yelling (and he doesn't yell) "I've been doing everything I can to make this better. I screwed this up AGAIN." Obviously, this broke my heart. I started profusely apologizing, saying I was horribly sorry and should never have even mentioned it and that I was so appreciative of all he has done to try to make me happy. I was really devestated by his reaction, cried for a lot of yesterday. This morning before he left he said "everything will work out." Maybe he is softening on the idea of doing something, but I think his immediate reaction was to be a) upset and b) in disbelief that after he inspected it so many times, it has a black spot. And yes, someone said maybe he is upset about realizing his eyesight is worsening with age - that is DEFINITELY part of it. DEFINITELY. He said so.

This is probably a dumb question, but on the off-chance that it is gook of some sort - polishing compound, a speck of whatever - have you tried cleaning it? If you soak it in warm water with a little dishwashing liquid and then apply a baby toothbrush to it, it should dislodge most surface grime, unless it's something like what Kenny is describing. Given the kind of jeweler you're describing, I just cannot imagine him selling a stone with visible inclusions to a partner - it's just not politic! Alternately, if you drop by almost any jeweler and ask them to steam-clean your ring, most will oblige for free (though some will ask a nominal fee). Fingers crossed that the solution is as easy as that ... and, at any rate, a jeweler with a loupe would be able to tell you if it's an inclusion or schmutz.

 

[300GCP]

I have cleaned it. Honestly, it does look to be inside of the stone but I would be willing to look into anything.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Can you post the inclusion plot part of the GIA report?

 

[slg47]

I have cleaned it. Honestly, it does look to be inside of the stone but I would be willing to look into anything.

it might take a steam cleaning by a jeweler and not a regular cleaning. I would just take it to some other jeweler (without your FI) and ask for them to clean your ring for you, and ask their opinion on the black spot!

 

[kenny]

I have cleaned it. Honestly, it does look to be inside of the stone but I would be willing to look into anything.

Polishing compound can not be cleaned off by you or I, or even a jeweler.
It requires boiling in acid by a qualified facility that polishes diamonds.
I assume they will remove the diamond from the setting before doing this.

To determine if it is an inclusion, which by definition are internal, or gunk on the surface use a loupe or microscope.
They use focus to establish if it is internal or on the surface.
Because of diamond's high index of refraction (their ability to change the angle of light a great deal) they can play tricks with where we think inclusions are.
Sometimes they can even make one inclusion appear several times.

 

[300GCP]

Can you post the inclusion plot part of the GIA report?

Unfortunately I can't. I don't have the GIA report - fiancee has it at his office and he is in North Carolina for work today.