Tiffanys: here we go again....

[tweddy]

ok,

well, i went to tiffanys again. two main questions should have been answered. now here the results. taking the ring out of the store....no way. taking it out of the fancy lighting sure wherever you want...within the store, though. Cut proportions...surprise...they provide you up front with a sarin report and all the specifics you request, if you choose so.
and another pricing information: I, VS1, 0.9, ideal (i know, i know) incl this lovely setting $7000 tax incl.

tweddy

 

[pqcollectibles]

Hi Tweddy~

I ran the Price Scope Price Stats for you on the top 4 non-H&A cuts. These are average prices PS Vendors are selling similar .9 carat, I, VS1 diamonds for. Of course you have the setting and taxes to figure in there too. But, this will give you some idea of the package price/premium? less the diamond.

1A: $3875
1B: $3444
2A: $3133
2B: $3319

Everyone is right. You can't get that setting anywhere else. You just gotta decide if it's worth $3125 to $3867 to you.

 

[Mara]

Hee!

http://www.whiteflash.com/acut/diamond_details.asp?ItemCode=440107
.93c I VS2 A Cut Above SuperIdeal AGS 0 Hearts and Arrows (some may consider this ideal

) for $4000.

So if the .90 I VS1 Ideal at Tiffanys is $7k, that's almost DOUBLE the cost for the Tiffany stone and is actually a 75% markup. 30-40% markup? Nooo.

Yes--you cannot get the setting elsewhere but when confronted with #'s like these...that setting better be darn worth it!

Tweddy, I am so glad you ventured into the store and imparted this valuable information to us. Just out of curiousity...what is your feel now that you have visited the Holy Grail of all jewelry stores?

 

[pqcollectibles]

One upped by Mara again!

LOLOLOL

Tweddy said Ideal, Mara. She didn't say SUPER Ideal!

Oh do tell, Tweddy! Did you remember to plug the air meter at the door so you could breathe while you shopped??? Do they put out fancy rich people's candies??? Did you sink to your knees as you stepped onto ultra plush carpet????

Is it all decorated in Blue-Dah-Bah-Dee-Dah-Bah-Doo? Is it BLUE???

 

[Mara]

PQ--Me one-upp you? NEVER!!! I particularly liked your touch on posting regular old non H&A stones though I guess that would be a Tiffanys stone since they never tout H&A but rather just 'ideal'. Sorry I got a little carried away with the SuperIdeal but I couldn't resist.

Did I mention the 75% markup? Just making sure.

The important question is not if the interior of Tiffany's is blue...but is it the RIGHT blue? I believe they called it 'Robins Egg Blue'.

 

[pqcollectibles]

At 75%, yes Mara you said it, then you said it again, Tiffany's should change the color to GREEN. A nice shade of $$$$$ Bills. And they should hang pictures of DEAD PRESIDENTS like Lincoln, Grant, and Jackson. Maybe throw in a pyramid or two and some clock towers for good measure. A miniature replica of Monticello would add a nice touch as well.

Money, Money, Money, Mooonnnney. Sounds like a song doesn't it?

 

[jlim]

What's up with you women on this board? The poor guy just wants to buy an e-ring for his gf. Regardless of whatever he decides, be happy for him and congrats him even if he's paying a premium for a premium well establish brand for 166 years.

One day, when the other brands here gains recognition that reaches the heights of Tiffany or Coca Cola, I can assure you, the savings will not be as drastic anymore.

He realizes he's paying a premium and if he so decides it is worth the premium, let it be 40% or 70%, it is his call.

I wasn't going to be roped into this discussion but someone got to stand up for a fellow Detroiter and Michigander and a fellow man

We are all friendly people here. Give us a break for trying to make our women, your fellow species happy.

On the other hand, I've decided I'm not willing to pay the premium for the brand but I do not post condescending remarks.

How would you feel if you just bought a car and a neighbor down the road says he/she just bought the same car but for thousands less than you on the same week? No one likes people like that. JMHO. Peace.

 

[pqcollectibles]

Jlim~

Who pulled your chain??

If Tweddy wants to buy Tiffany's, BE MY GUEST!!!

But, aren't you the same person who posted a 20% premium chart in a thread, and cautioned someone else about the $3K difference in diamonds they were considering??? Mara and I just pointed out the true premium of Tweddy's Tiffany's ring.

You can't go around speaking out of both sides of your mouth just because you're in love with the IDEA of Tiffany's. Tiffany's doesn't sell jewelry. They sell prestige. No matter how you look at it, you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear just by putting it in a blue box.

And, BTW,.... Just because the Vendors on Price Scope aren't household names doesn't mean people in the know aren't aware of them. The PS vendors sell to movers and shakers.... Hollywood, top level execs from major firms; "high profile" attorneys, doctors, architects from the US and all over the world.

Life is more than what's next door or across the street. It's what's in the world. Open your mind and you might be able to see Chicago from Detroit.

 

[jlim]

pq - no one pulled my chain. It just annoys me personally to see so many detracting post on tweedy's choices. He hasn't even bought the it yet, I don't believe.

Paying a premium is up to you. I can't decide if paying 20% is worth it BUT it is because paying 20% more is breaking my budget.

If by paying 20% more, I'm still under my budget, then I've no problem deciding. Unfortunately, do I get something I really really want and pay 20% more, or just stick to my budget and get something I really want.

On the other thread, for the poster, it was $3000 more or about 30% more. Even he can't decide if it is worth the premium. You and I may be able to decide that it is not worth 30% or $3000. But everyone has his or her own decision making process.

Perhaps tweedy doesn't mind paying 20%, 30% or even 70% as Mara put it.

I just think if tweedy decides to buy the Tiffany ring, we should just congratulate him and wish him all best on his proposal rather than posting several links to what he could have bought for him money. Don't you think he would have done the comparison already?

 

[pqcollectibles]

I wish Tweddy all the best as well. Like I said, if Tweddy still wants to buy Tiffany's be my guest!

But let me see if I understand you about mark-up and the "feel good" factor, Jlim. Since you are in Detroit, I'll put this in Motor City terms.

Say I wanna buy a Ford Explorer that sells for $40K, but I appreciate the status that comes with the Lincoln name. Then I should just run right out and buy a Lincoln Navigator for $60K. Keep in mind now, Ford makes both vehicles. Engines, drive trains, the parts that really matter to get you from one place to another are exactly the same. The Lincoln name really is worth $20K??? I don't think so.

Now in conversation with friends and coworkers, you mention that you really like the Explorer, but you had to have the Lincoln name. If you told anyone you paid that much more just to have the Lincoln name, they would think you were crazy.

So true the old saying, "A fool and his money are soon parted."

 

[jlim]

pq - I wish it is that simple. The underlying hardware may be similar or the same but you cannot pass the Explorer for a Navigator. Maybe you could, because it is a Ford

But a better example would be Toyota/Lexus.

Camry vs. ES300
Highlander vs. RX300
4Runner vs. GX430
Land Cruiser vs. LX470

One buying the Lexus version of the Toyota is not merely buying the same car. The material appointment is vastly different, not to mention the warranty as well as service you get is different.

So, why would someone pay a 10%, 20% premium for the premium brand? Well, this is America. People pay more for brand.

Lexus as you know it was concocted for Americans. Americans who wouldn't pay a premium for a Toyota. But it is not like Toyota re-badged the cars. The Lexus version do have additional content and have premium materials in them. Plus the better warranty and service you get. So, who really know how much more premium one is paying for a Lexus over a Toyota.

Also, in your case, an Explorer is not $40k and Navigator is $60k.
I know you were just throwing out numbers. But realistically, w/ all the massive discounts, I'm sure one can get into a similarly equipped Navigator over the Explorer for $5000-$7000 more.

Try doing that at a Lexus dealership

 

[fire&ice]

----------------
On 5/15/2003 7:34:54 AM jlim wrote:

How would you feel if you just bought a car and a neighbor down the road says he/she just bought the same car but for thousands less than you on the same week? No one likes people like that. JMHO. Peace.



----------------

I would say thank you for the head's up. Take the overpriced car back & buy the same car from the same source my neighbor did.

 

[Mara]

F&I--agreed!

Jlim--AGAIN...here we go. Don't you ever get tired of opening your mouth on this subject? Aren't you supposed to be shopping for your lucky lucky fiance-to-be?

If Tweddy posts sometime in the near future saying..hey I got that I VS1...I can pretty much guarantee you 99% of the posts (including mine!) would be CONGRATS, awesome choice, post pictures, very cool, oooh nice, and on and on. But if Tweddy is still in the decision making process, it is completely our perogative to suggest other options, esp since Tweddy has posted in the past on the confusion between buying Tiff or another brand or just another stone. Once someone has made a decision, if they appear happy with it, us board members are happy too. But during the process, if someone comes looking for help and/or god forbid an actual opinion, we give it. You don't like it? Too bad. I'm SO tired of seeing your bad attitude disguised as trying to 'help' your fellow man/woman so that people don't actually call you out for what it is...bad attitude and closedmindedness. Tweddy doesn't seem to be in need of ANY assistance from you.

Plus to be honest, I just posted the ACA stone for ANYONE interested in seeing the markup from Tiffanys vs. a branded superideal. It isnt 20. It isn't 30. So all of these car analogies are useless. It's 75%. As in ALMOST DOUBLE. Just making sure we all get that.

Is it Friday yet?

 

[pqcollectibles]

Jlim~

You may live where they build cars, but like diamonds, you only know what you read.

I have first hand experience with Research Engineering for General Motors. Same vehicle line, be it Pontiac, Buick, Chevrolet, or Oldsmobile, have exactly the same mechanical parts, and interchangeable body and interior parts. Don't believe me? Ask an auto parts sales person. They will tell you. You can buy the Chevy part for the Olds, the Buick part for the Pontiac, the Pontiac part for the Chevy. From light bulbs to fenders, it's all the same.

The "Phoo Phoo" differences you call "Appointments" cost Auto Makers very little to upgrade yet they charge you out the wazoo for them. I am not talking Research Engineering and change in tool and dye for a new model/line. Those are the hidden costs to buy a Lexus over a Toyota. I am talking actual costs for similar car parts.

Leather seats as opposed to fabric.
They're laminated on the same line. Run fabric on one grade foam, change over to thicker foam and run the leather. Poof. Posh seats. Less than a dollar for the coverings. Send the laminates off to the seat manufacturer. Assembly is the same. Add lumbar support in this one. Switch over the line. Stiffer springs in the seat of that one. Less than a dollar again. Switch over the line and throw in a heater and electic motor for power, heated seats. Couple of bucks. Wanna talk names people on the street don't know but sit on every darn time they drive a car?? Johnson Controls. They assemble almost every seat for every car in the US.

Stereo systems.
Minor cost differences on the reciever/amp. Pennies for extra wiring. Couple bucks for extra speakers and Poof you have the Chrysler Infinity Stereo System.

Climate controlled interior heating/cooling, a 30 cent processor chip.

The list goes on and on.

How much a vehicle sells for depends on geographical location. The gas guzzling 4x4's are the standard in my part of the country. SUV, Pick-up truck, doesn't matter. People want their 4 wheel drive. And as it happens, I was at the dealership the other day. A "Well Appointed" Explorer or Durango MSRP Sticker is nearly $40K here. Not many foreign vehicles either in my neck of the woods. Can't get parts or service for them. This is "fly over country", heartland USA.

Obviously, I am a "little" older than you with a lot more life experience. It's one thing to read an article in an auto magazine/trade paper or on the net. It's another thing entirely to actually deal with the brass tacks personally. You really need to get off the sofa, get out, and learn more about real life instead of reading so much.

 

[aljdewey]

----------------
On 5/15/2003 7:34:54 AM jlim wrote:

How would you feel if you just bought a car and a neighbor down the road says he/she just bought the same car but for thousands less than you on the same week? No one likes people like that. JMHO. Peace.

---------------

Well, that can be answered two ways:

1) I'd feel like an imbecile because I would obviously have not done my homework or not heeded a plethora of sage advice here in order to make such a huge faux-pas. If this were the case, I'd deserve to pay more for being too lazy to do the legwork.

2) If I, or Tweedy, or anyone else, really cared about the brand and was willing to pay a premium for it, then it shouldn't matter how much less someone else paid for the same thing. Some minority of posters here believe that the brand is worth a mark-up of 30/40/70/whatever percent, and they are aware of that mark-up even as they make their purchase, so why should it bother them later that someone else got the exact same thing for less? They *knew* that would happen. Those people will be able to comfort themselves by responding to the neighbor, "Yes, but MINE's a TIFFANY or a LEXUS" or whatever.

Unless I missed a post, it doesn't appear Tweedy has actually *made* the purchase yet. I'm sure if he were to make it, NO ONE here would say "What an idiot" or "you could have gotten it for thousands less". Lighten up.

 

[aljdewey]

Mara,

HA HA HA HA. That post just made my day! Couldn't have said it any better.

P.S. Hang on, Friday's coming!

 

[pqcollectibles]

Mega Dittos, Mara and ALJD! I know how thrilled I was that everyone shared my joy. If/when Tweddy buys, and if/when it is a Tiffany's ring, we will all oooooo and aaaahhhh, and wanna see pics, and congratulate!

 

[jlim]

pq - you crack me up with your post about cars. You may have more life experience than me and I'll never catch up with you coz' if you are older, you'll always have more *life experience*. I'm 31 but I've been to quite a few places around the world and let me assure you my life experience is not just limited to sitting on a sofa.

What do you know? I used to work at GM too. 7 years ago I was an engineer at the GM Tech Center at Warren. Were you in the Research Lab at the Tech Center?

In anycase, it is all irrelevant. I know it cost them very very little to make another car upscale. But you got to admit in the case of Toyota/Lexus is very different from GM in the Chevy, Buick, Pontiac, Caddy. Or Ford with the Ford/Lincoln.

Let me assure you I do not like the marketing strategy of Toyota/Lexus. Just like you said, for a little more luxury, they want a much higher price than an equiv. Toyota. But you know what, if it only cost just a few dollars here and there why aren't they putting it in all their cars? Well, the bean counters obviously got the ultimate say. A dollar here and there could very well translate to $5-10 million over the length of that platform, typically 4 years for Japanese automaker. It is usually 5-6 years for American car makers.

If you are trying to tell me the Pontiac Grand Prix / Buick Regal / Chevy Lumina / Monte Carlo is the same as Toyota Highlander / Lexus RX300, I suggest you visit a Lexus dealership ASAP.

My point is this. Why is the RX300 the best selling small sports utility in the market? That thing is small and it doesn't even look half as good as any other small SUV and it cost bet. $38-$42k loaded. Now with its replacement, the RX330, you can be sure more and more Americans are buying into it.

Well, not me. I'm a Honda/Acura guy. If I've money to waste, I would pay more to get the better service and better material, however small, in a Lexus. But since I work for a living, I'll have to settle for a Honda/Acura. Mind you, I find parts shared all the time bet. the Acura TL line and the Civic.

But I can bet you'll find less parts in the Lexus bin compared to Acura.

That's the reason why an Acura is cheaper than a comparable Lexus.

Btw, correct me if I'm wrong tweedy. What's the reason you post the price and specs of the diamond you found at Tiffany?

I suspect you did it is because you wanted the people here to know that it is not as outrageous as it seem and they seem to have more information about the cut and what not which the people here have said otherwise.

And finally pq, why did Toyota created the Lexus brand?? It is for American buyers who wouldn't pay more for a Toyota. But since the success of the Lexus brand, Toyota is actually selling a Lexus branded Toyota out of US. I might be wrong in this, but instead of premium material that is found in the US Lexus, it is actually a re-badged Toyota. Only difference is, the Toyota version is assembled in the foreign country and the Lexus ver. is imported.

 

[jlim]

----------------
On 5/15/2003 12:26

3 PM Mara wrote:

F&I--agreed!

Jlim--AGAIN...here we go. Don't you ever get tired of opening your mouth on this subject? Aren't you supposed to be shopping for your lucky lucky fiance-to-be?

----------------

Is she lucky or not? Well, I assume since we are together and happy, we are both lucky to have found each other.

I'm suppose to be working to pay for the ring that I'm buying for my gf. But I'm under the weather today. So, it is kinda hard to concentrate on work.

So, what are you doing on the board all day if I may ask.

Aren't you tired of opening your mouth disagreeing with everything I write?

Why don't you be a doll and answer my question on the Diamond Hangout forum?

 

[DiehardSearcher]

jlim,

I hope you make a choice that will make both you and your lucky lucky finace-to-be both very happy. If you choose to spend the money on Tiff's, so-be-it.

Tiff purchase
You will not be making a wise choice by any knowledgeable person's interpretation of the value of the 4 C's. Regardless of your difference of opinion on which C should be focused on, the value of the stone once those criteria are set is more in line with the price you will find from vendors such as Pricescope's than Tiffany's.

Analogies
You automobile, purse, handbag, RX300, RX330, etc... analogies are quite cumbersome. You will be better served to stick to diamonds when discussing diamonds.

Good luck.

 

[fire&ice]

----------------
On 5/15/2003 2:51:45 PM DiehardSearcher wrote:

Analogies
You automobile, purse, handbag, RX300, RX330, etc... analogies are quite cumbersome. You will be better served to stick to diamonds when discussing diamonds.

Good luck.
----------------

Amen to that. Analogies about cars are not *pearls* of wisdom.

I'm still interested in what Tweedy has to say. And, what he chooses. He actually has done some "eyes on" research.

 

[guslik]

----------------
On 5/15/2003 2:17:16 PM jlim wrote:

My point is this. Why is the RX300 the best selling small sports utility in the market? That thing is small and it doesn't even look half as good as any other small SUV and it cost bet. $38-$42k loaded. Now with its replacement, the RX330, you can be sure more and more Americans are buying into it.

----------------

Who said RX300 IS small?? It is big enough for SUV. And in my eyes (and I hope a lot of people will agree with me) it looks MUCH BETTER THAN 99% OF SUV out there. I LOVE THIS CAR!
Hey Jlim, try to get it finally, DIAMONDS ARE NOT cars, bags OR stereo systems; they mined from the earth and Tiffany’s diamond looks exactly the same as any other diamond with the same parameters. I just don’t get it, how stubborn you must be in order to act like you do on this forum. IF YOU DISSAGREE WITH EVERYONE HERE , WHY YOU KEEP POSTING??? GET YOURSELF A LIFE!

 

[jlim]

Lucky me I didn't start the car analogy. PQ is quilty for that. I can only imagine the kind of roasting I'll get if I had started going off on a tangent. But I welcome car discussion anytime.

DiehardSearcher - I think you didn't read one of my post. I've decided to not pay the premium for the Tiffany ring. Yes, I made this decision on behalf of my gf. as well. Hopefully it is the right one.

Money is tight.

 

[jlim]

guslink - the same can be said for all of you anti-Tiffany too. If you disagree so much with all the people who wants Tiffany, why don't all of you get a life and leave them alone.

How stuborn must you be??

It is very simple. I can easily not click on any Tiffany link as you could have. So that way we don't bump heads. Maybe in the future Tiffany post should be worded as such:

"Tiffany Question - only Pro-Tiffany replies welcomed"

"Tiffany Question - only anti-Tiffany replies welcomed"

Again guslik, for your sake, I already said I am passing on the Tiffany ring coz' I've decided it is not worth the premium esp. when money is tight.

But I'm not going to tell every Tiffany lover they should shop some where else.

Looks are subjective. If you think the RX300 looks good, I won't disagree with you. If you like to think RX300 is not small, well, since this is not an auto forum like some posters suggested, I won't comment on it further.

You won't hear another word about stereo, cars, handbags, watches, dogs, cats from me on this forum unless it is under the Off Topic Diamond Hangout forum.

Anyone else care to follow suit?

 

[DiehardSearcher]

jlim,

This is not a group of friends attempting to comfort and console one another. This is a forum whose purpose is to inform and provide education to consumers to assist them in making the best decision.

That purpose requires providing good and bad recommendations.

If someone makes a bad decision, they should be told. Not just for their sake, but for every other perspective customer reading this.

Please keep us informed of your process as you are living proof of the transition from the uninformed to the informed. Your purchase will be proof of the value of this forum.

Good luck.

 

[pqcollectibles]

Guilty as charged!

I did bring up the car analogy. Trying to make a point, which evidently fell on deaf ears. Why buy a name you don't own when you can buy equal or better quality elsewhere??

If you look back to the top of this page, Mara and I were pointing out pricing differences for Tweddy. Bottom of previous page, Tweddy said .9 carat, "Ideal", I, VS1, ring, and taxes, $7K out the door. I posted average Price Scope prices for the top 4 non-H&A cuts. Mara posted a link to a comparable ACA at White Flash. All the numbers are significantly less than the price Tweddy quoted. From there, Mara and I were joking and having fun. But in the jokes were tidbits of info and jabs at the overhead/premium of a Tiffany's purchase.

If anyone reading this absolutely, positively wants to go Tiffany's, then by all means do it. Congrats and Enjoy! At least you know what you're actually paying for and making an informed choice.

 

[Mara]

----------------
On 5/15/2003 2:30:50 PM jlim wrote

Is she lucky or not? Well, I assume since we are together and happy, we are both lucky to have found each other.

Yes, this definitely goes to show that there truly is someone for everyone.

I'm suppose to be working to pay for the ring that I'm buying for my gf. But I'm under the weather today. So, it is kinda hard to concentrate on work.

So, what are you doing on the board all day if I may ask.

If you really must know, I'm actually working all day, evidenced by my infrequent spurts of posting when I am so fried I need a non-marketing break. If you are so under the weather, there's the notion that rest actually does a body good. The mind..well there's another matter entirely.

Aren't you tired of opening your mouth disagreeing with everything I write?

Not really. I keep hoping maybe something will sink in.

Why don't you be a doll and answer my question on the Diamond Hangout forum?

Thanks, but no. As evidenced by your many posts and repeated mantras, you need much more than assistance from me or the others on this board to figure things out.

Please do hurry and make your diamond purchase. In fact I think you really should buy from Tiffany. Put your money where your mouth is. Literally.

Hope you feel better!

----------------

 

[tweddy]

good evening folks,

i always appreciated this forum for many reasons. The obvious - the information but also for the nice tone amongst the users. And let me say, I truely thank everyone of you for your comments and stories. Howeve, I do not think it is necessary to convince anybody to do anything. What I mean is, lets share thoughts and facts, lets leave the approach: WE HAVE TO CONVINCE HIM/ HER, behind.

It was in deed pretty nice in the store, but not blue. The lighting was quite high and did not look state of the art...store is 12 yrs old. But the sales man took his time and seemed to enjoy talking to me, although i asked some hard questions. For me its down to one thing...the setting. I fell for it and thats my destiny. Being able to say..its from Tiffanys...nice to have, blue box...nice to have...setting...MUST HAVE. Thats for me. I would never ever say or even think, people buying online are cheap or whatever or even people buying at the mall are lets say uneducated...lets try to make as much information as possible available to as many people as possible. And believe me...before I buy this ring, the sarin report better looks like how I want it to be

Good night everyone.
TW

 

[dimsummy]

Hi Tweddy,

Great job! You obviously did your homework, actually went to look at and compare stones/settings, instead of just arguing from a chair. And you were courteous in accepting differing viewpoints.

Which setting? Lucida?

Congrats!

Post pictures when you get it!

 

[fire&ice]

Re: the setting. I find it hard to accept that a mastercraftsman could not replicate that exact setting.