Super ideal cut appearing yellow in some lighting

[Dancing Fire]

I DID read the entire thread.
The main point is that AGS does tend to grade color a little more loosely, as was the case not only in this thread, but in many others.

Both are H color...one is GIA and the other one is AGS. Which one is whiter IRL?

 

[Texas Leaguer]

This is a very interesting discussion and many good points have already been made. My comments below will repeat some of them.

A diamond is basically a system of mirrors composed of facets and ‘virtual’ facets. As the diamond scans the hemisphere, the light it finds is that which is in the environment. Where it finds a bright source it returns a bright flash, where light is obstructed from entering the diamond (such as head shadow) it reflects black, where it finds light reflected off surfaces such as clothing or walls, it mirrors them back to the eye. The color temperature and intensity of actual light sources it finds will also influence the brightness and color appearance of the diamond. A yellow or beige room combined with warm white light sources would significantly intensify the yellowish appearance of a diamond.

The body color of the diamond itself has an effect on what we see as well. Color is perceived because certain wavelengths are being absorbed by the material and not transmitted back to the eye. For instance, a yellow appearance is an indication that wavelengths in the blues and greens are being absorbed.

In terms of face-up appearance, the impact of the environment far exceeds the impact of body color in a well cut diamond in the near colorless range. This is why you see the diamond perform very differently in certain lighting and physical environments. Therefore going up a color grade or two will not result in nearly the visual improvement as changing the environment will.

To the extent you have control over the environment (at home for instance), the color of the walls and furnishings and the color temperature of the lighting can make a dramatic difference in the appearance of diamonds. Although changing your interior design and lighting may seem like too much effort and cost, in some cases it may be a more realistic option than upgrading one’s diamonds! It clearly is a matter of priorities.

 

[Dancing Fire]

To the extent you have control over the environment (at home for instance), the color of the walls and furnishings and the color temperature of the lighting can make a dramatic difference in the appearance of diamonds. Although changing your interior design and lighting may seem like too much effort and cost, in some cases it may be a more realistic option than upgrading one’s diamonds! It clearly is a matter of priorities.

Not really, That depends on the size of the stone and how many color grades higher,so it might be less expensive to change the interior design...

 

[Wewechew]

My stone looks the most tinted in my office at work... I wonder if they would let me remodel

 

[cflutist]

Has anyone considered the Kevin degrees temperature of their light source? This can impact the color seen in any object.
Ever wonder why the tomatoes look so red in the store but so crappy at home?



I forgot what diamond color grading K degrees was, but was traditionally by a north facing window.

 

[MissGotRocks]

If a diamond was very yellow, it would remain so to a certain degree even in outside daylight (not strong sunlight). You can see from OP’s pictures that there is a vast color difference from inside to outside. I think that speaks volumes to what TL is saying. I think we have all experienced that to certain extents and have ‘favorite’ places and lighting where a diamond looks much whiter. They truly are mirrors reflecting back environment or clothing and while we wish they would be bright white in every instance, it just isn’t possible. You can eliminate tone in a diamond by choosing a few color grades higher but it will still reflect its environment - no matter what.
I think your diamond is beautiful so you might want to live with it a bit longer before investing more money in an upgrade. If an upgrade could guarantee you a diamond that was always blazing white, it would be worth it. To upgrade and see the same effect could be very disappointing.

 

[LilAlex]

ACAs don’t have fluorescence.

What's an ACA? Is that a brand name? I would check for myself

 

[daydreamer24]

Daydreamer24, the H you chose does look a little messy under magnification. If you have good eyes, you might see the long threadlike inclusions. I have bad eyesight and I notice the scattered tiny inclusions in my E SI2 superideal when I look carefully in bright light. It is “eye clean” at 10 inches per superideal standards. The explosive light play of a superideal will likely totally outshine internal, very fine inclusions. Only you can determine if this is acceptable to you. I would try to look at more than one H side by side.

Also, I just wanted to say that your current I ACA is amazing. I love the faceting pattern, what a bright personality! I hope you can find what you are looking for because you chose a beautiful cut the first time.

Last, can you share what setting you chose? That tapered setting is really nice, is it a WF setting?

Are u referring to the G I posted?
https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4109152.
I do see the threads.... and it does bother me but was hoping I wouldn’t see it with the naked eye.

Thank you. I do love the pattern of my current diamond. All the images were perfect, but obviously colour is the one thing I perhaps wasn’t able to fully evaluate myself based on pictures.

Yes. It’s the Whiteflash elegant solitaire setting with 6 prongs. My fiancé asked for it to be really delicate so they “thinned” the prongs and had them as claw prongs.

I do love the diamond and setting and would feel sad to return it. I am hopeful I can resolve the “yellow” issue and find a way around it somehow.

 

[cflutist]

What's an ACA? Is that a brand name? I would check for myself

A Cut Above sold by Whiteflash. They are considered superideal cut diamonds.

 

[AV_]

I am hopeful I can resolve the “yellow” issue and find a way around it somehow.

I hope you can get to play with a few equally well cut rounds of different color grades, to see how they play with light. Diamonds do not hold colour, unless they have allot of it - toward 'Fancy', and this is surprising!

 

[distracts]

To me it just looks like it's picking up color from the environment... and in all the pics where it looks yellowy, the lighting is very warm and your hands look much warmer than they do in the other pics, as does the band of the ring. (For instance in the first pic posted, the band of the ring is the same yellow color as the diamond - a sure sign it is environmental rather than diamond color! I am sure you didn't slap it in a yellow gold setting just for that picture.) I personally wouldn't worry about it... nothing looks the same in all lighting situations to me, and in my experience warm indoor lighting is the least flattering. But ymmv.

 

[AV_]

Has anyone considered the Kevin degrees temperature of their light source? This can impact the color seen in any object.

I wonder how GIA color grades correspond to light temperature, eg. F at 9pm versus OP at high noon.

 

[tigertales]

Both are H color...one is GIA and the other one is AGS. Which one is whiter IRL?

the one on the right

 

[headlight]

We did ask a lot of questions on the H before deciding on the I. This was one of the responses from the WF SA:

Thanks for your email. I completely understand, it can be difficult deciding between two diamonds that visually are very comparable.
The trouble is, that even when evaluating the diamond side by side in person with the naked eye (even a trained eye), they appear almost as twins.

When evaluating the light performance and sparkle of the diamonds, the light performance images will be of most help. They provide technical proof of how the diamond reacts to light, and how intense the light return will be.
Things that perhaps the human eye would not be able to pick up on its own, the light performance images can and will show.

In person, the main difference between the two will be the color difference but it is really only noticeable from the side view.
As you can see in the images we have provided, the difference is noticeable from the side but not really from the top view. I would not say it is significantly whiter, but it is indeed whiter.

Also, the clarity features cannot be seen to the naked eye.

So whether in a side by side image, or a video, the answer is the same = these are two absolutely gorgeous, top tier diamonds, which are virtually identical.

At this point, I may ask yourself…if you woke up tomorrow and one of these diamonds were sold, which one would you be upset to have lost?
—————

On that basis we decided to proceed with the I. Now I’m worried even a H may not work for me.....
I had no idea I was so colour sensitive. I guess most ppl aren’t under jewellery store lightings !!

While I appreciate the SA's input, it sounds like a SA. She is essentially saying both are great but clearly there is a difference or there wouldn't be a color grade differential nor would there be a price difference. It is honestly, coming from my position of being married 30 years this Fall, ridiculous to ask a woman on the verge of being proposed to "which would she be upset to have lost"... listen, we've all been there. I was there many years ago. We started dreaming of that proposal from as far back as we can remember so when that ring is like literally mere breaths away, we are like WE WANT IT! At that point of the journey, we could care less about H vs I... we don't even hear what the SA is saying to us. The only thing we hear is the voice in our head saying, "Get that ring on my finger STAT!".
Just tell your wonderful fiancé that it was very overwhelming and this was just something that isn't something one can conceptualize until it is experienced. So you didn't know what the I color would actually be like, ESPECIALLY GIVEN you selected the diamond over the INTERNET. Just be honest and say that you saw IMMEDIATELY when he presented you with the ring that it screamed "yellow". And then go into the whole thing about that this is THEEE ring, the beginning of your starting your lives together and it just has to be right. "We can never get this moment back", so we need to make it "right" from the get-go. Bottom line: The SA clearly made it sound as if the difference was negligible yet it clearly isn't IRL.
As for your mounting, as long as a new diamond is of relatively similar measurements they should be able to mount the new diamond in it. Gosh, you sound like me... I always have some "special situation"... I completely get you!

 

[Dancing Fire]

the one on the right

The one on the right was graded by AGS.

 

[tigertales]

Nice! But the question was, which one faces up whiter in real life?
Would love to see them both face up side by side.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Nice! But the question was, which one faces up whiter in real life?
Would love to see them both face up side by side.

Both H colors...GIA on top AGS on bottom.

 

[Dancing Fire]

AGS G on top, GIA H in the middle and AGS H on the bottom.

 

[daydreamer24]

The stone in my avatar picture is I color. I really wanted higher than I color, but there just never was one in this cut available in the size I wanted in a higher color. This stone is cut for light return and it is very white most of the time. It is AGS graded but I believe it to be a true I color. All color grades are a range from high to low, anyway, and it's the borderline stones that may be the ones that grade lower by GIA. My diamond looks great in a lot of lighting environments. It looks the absolute worst in my car that apparently has smokey brown tint to the windows! I can handle the I color because this is an antique cut, but I prefer G color for ideal cut rounds in a ring. I do have ACA's for my studs in H color, and I love them and never see tint on my ears! But I think you need to go ahead and upgrade to G or possibly H color. The H stone in that comparison picture definitely looks whiter. But I think you may be color sensitive and really need the G.

My I also looks great in most environments (some indoors I can see a slight tint that I find tolerable, but in a few lightings it looks YELLOW).

 

[daydreamer24]

A yellow or beige room combined with warm white light sources would significantly intensify the yellowish appearance of a diamond.

Do you mean to say, it will intensify the existing true yellow appearance of the diamond colour it possesses already?

Sorry, what I am struggling to get my head around is whether the yellow that I clearly see and captured in pictures (in some lighting) is due to
(1) the diamond showing its true colour as there isn’t bright natural/day light for the diamond to reflect and therefore mask the yellow, or
(2) the environment lighting is being reflected in the diamond and therefore the yellow I see is from the “yellow” light/walls, etc.

Or a combination of both of the above?

 

[tigertales]

Daydreamer...you know what, I'm on your side with this. I see the yellow. I don't care if it's because of the walls, your shirt, the light here or there. That diamond is not for you. Return it.

 

[distracts]

Do you mean to say, it will intensify the existing true yellow appearance of the diamond colour it possesses already?

Sorry, what I am struggling to get my head around is whether the yellow that I clearly see and captured in pictures (in some lighting) is due to
(1) the diamond showing its true colour as there isn’t bright natural/day light for the diamond to reflect and therefore mask the yellow, or
(2) the environment lighting is being reflected in the diamond and therefore the yellow I see is from the “yellow” light/walls, etc.

Or a combination of both of the above?

It's the environment. You can tell because in the pictures where the diamond is yellow, your white metal band is also yellow. If it was the color of the diamond, then the band of your ring would remain white.

 

[Texas Leaguer]

Do you mean to say, it will intensify the existing true yellow appearance of the diamond colour it possesses already?

Sorry, what I am struggling to get my head around is whether the yellow that I clearly see and captured in pictures (in some lighting) is due to
(1) the diamond showing its true colour as there isn’t bright natural/day light for the diamond to reflect and therefore mask the yellow, or
(2) the environment lighting is being reflected in the diamond and therefore the yellow I see is from the “yellow” light/walls, etc.

Or a combination of both of the above?

What I was trying to say is that the appearance of the diamond in real life is affected by the body color of the diamond, the lighting environment, and the physical environment. A well cut diamond returns the majority of light that enters it back to the eye. Since what is being returned is mainly mirroring the environment, the lighting and physical objects in the space have the greatest impact on appearance.

The body color has significantly less impact on appearance in the face up direction. Therefore, increasing the color grade will have less impact on what you see face up than changing the environmental inputs.

That said, there is a wide range of color sensitivity between people. And until you have tested yours carefully, as you are in the process of doing, you may not fully understand where you are on that spectrum. And, as I know from my own personal preference, a person's color sensitivity and 'taste' may evolve over time.

As to trying to judge color from photographs, the number of variables increases significantly and is much less reliable than in-person viewing.

 

[lovedogs]

The stone isn't yellow, and this is mostly an environment thing. However, if this is a "mind clean" issue for you to the point that you are going to worry about your stone being yellow, I'd get a higher color.

 

[mellowyellowgirl]

I have an I (not from Whiteflash). It can be lovely and white in most lights but under a certain light.....aiiiiiii it shifts yellow instantly. Looks like a different stone!

The E colour (which cost the earth) is either very white or throws pink sparkles and is outright superior but it cost so much more. I almost feel like out of the two diamonds one leans to yellow and the other one is white but leans pink (it's not pink but when it is in weird lighting it throws pink rather than the yellow that the I turns into).

 

[tigertales]

You don't have to be "color sensitive" to know that an I color is classified as having tint. It's a fact. How it "faces up" has nothing to do with it. The body color will be the TRUE color of the damond.

The best way to purchase a diamond is NOT sight unseen and/or mounted in a setting. You need to see it loose, in your own environment and go from there. The mounting can play a part, too, either partially masking or enhancing the color depending on the metal and prongs.

 

[beigenarwhal]

@tigertales my understanding of the term "color sensitivity" is akin to "color tolerance" - while you can be aware a near colorless diamond is not icy white, it might not bother you (ie. You are tolerant of the color). I don't think the term is used to suggest that people cannot tell it has a tint.

For example, I can tell that my sister's 2.5+ ct diamond in the GHI range has a yellow tint, but I'm not color-sensitive or color-intolerant towards it to where I wouldn't own it. In fact, I'd love to steal it one day!!


Luckily, the OP has the benefit of the 30 day return period to evaluate her own sensitivity or tolerance in different situations and backgrounds. It may be that she is color sensitive or intolerant and needs to return for a different stone, but that's a decision (and judgment call) she'd need to make on her own. As we all know, bumping up one of the Cs means you'll need to go down on another to stay in the same price range!

Best of luck to OP!! You're in good hands with WF, whichever decision you make!

 

[cflutist]

I wonder how GIA color grades correspond to light temperature, eg. F at 9pm versus OP at high noon.

You could buy a GIA Diamond Grading lamp

https://store.gia.edu/GIA-DiamondDock-p/156000.htm

 

[Dancing Fire]

The best way to purchase a diamond is NOT sight unseen and/or mounted in a setting. You need to see it loose, in your own environment and go from there. The mounting can play a part, too, either partially masking or enhancing the color depending on the metal and prongs.

I wear my H color loose..



Here's an I color loose (top pic).

 

[tigertales]

@tigertales my understanding of the term "color sensitivity" is akin to "color tolerance" - while you can be aware a near colorless diamond is not icy white, it might not bother you (ie. You are tolerant of the color). I don't think the term is used to suggest that people cannot tell it has a tint.

For example, I can tell that my sister's 2.5+ ct diamond in the GHI range has a yellow tint, but I'm not color-sensitive or color-intolerant towards it to where I wouldn't own it. In fact, I'd love to steal it one day!!


Luckily, the OP has the benefit of the 30 day return period to evaluate her own sensitivity or tolerance in different situations and backgrounds. It may be that she is color sensitive or intolerant and needs to return for a different stone, but that's a decision (and judgment call) she'd need to make on her own. As we all know, bumping up one of the Cs means you'll need to go down on another to stay in the same price range!

Best of luck to OP!! You're in good hands with WF, whichever decision you make!

Yes WF will definitely understand the color in the stone. Their quality control knows all about it no doubt
What a shame OP has to go through this disappointment and re-do her whole engagement ring.