Mine usually just end up soggyDate: 8/22/2006 3:52:43 AM
Author: Cehrabehra
PS is that culet ''pointed'' or ''none''?Date: 8/21/2006 9:57:29 PM
Author: Pricescope
DramastickDate: 8/21/2006 7:24:18 PM
Author: belle
no ira, that doesn''t help!
we''re talking these drumsticks http://images.google.com/images?q=ice%20cream%20drumstick&sa=N&tab=wi
of course, i don''t know where deco''s ''drumsTUCK''s come from!
i''m afraid to know.
Aussie Babes, this is specially for you! https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/okay-to-settle-the-colorless-vs-the-near-colorless-topic.42520/=
I dunno about in AU but here now they put a wad of chocolate down in the end to keep it from getting drippy - I think it''s now the best part LOLDate: 8/22/2006 3:54:48 AM
Author: Garry H (Cut Nut)
Mine usually just end up soggyDate: 8/22/2006 3:52:43 AM
Author: Cehrabehra
PS is that culet ''pointed'' or ''none''?Date: 8/21/2006 9:57:29 PM
Author: Pricescope
DramastickDate: 8/21/2006 7:24:18 PM
Author: belle
no ira, that doesn''t help!
we''re talking these drumsticks http://images.google.com/images?q=ice%20cream%20drumstick&sa=N&tab=wi
of course, i don''t know where deco''s ''drumsTUCK''s come from!
i''m afraid to know.
"negligible"Date: 8/22/2006 3:52:43 AM
Author: Cehrabehra
PS is that culet 'pointed' or 'none'?Dramastick
devient and F&I ... I read the other thread that Ira linked to which caused this one. Just wanted to share that I totally sympathize with the *why''s* behind your reasonings. devient ... what you had written expresses my exact sentiments lately. I felt you had taken the words right out of my mouth.Date: 8/21/2006 4:06:11 PM
Author: fire&ice
But, what devientrow said actually is why I started this thread. You know I''m not afraid to post a stone just outside of ideal. I''m not afraid to endorse a stone as a possibility. I''m not afraid to post a stone that doesn''t have all the numbers because what GIA had before was plenty to go on and get started. Heck, I would even recommend EGL or IGI stones (both having (IGI sporatic) crown & pav information). But, when I recommended a stone within budget, within the selected vendors inventory that only got a vg/g - literally someone said I proposed it in ''jest''. Something has gone awry.Date: 8/21/2006 1:41:42 PM
Author: aljdewey
I guess I don''t understand that. It''s fruitless why? Because you''re in the minority of opinions? Why is it fruitless because ten other people say the opposite?
Those ten people don''t negate your opinion.....it''s still valid on its own.
Look, I''m clearly in the minority opinion in this discussion, and it doesn''t stop me from sharing my less-popular viewpoint.
I can also appreciate that some folks get tired of trying to promote balance, but if that''s true, then I feel like you can''t complain about the lack of it. If you want balance, do something to make it happen. Balance doesn''t mean an equal number of opinions on either side - it''s not a tug-of-war, and it''s not a popularity contest.
If your opinion is ''follow the eye'' and ten others say ''follow the paper'', your opinion might be the only one that resonates to someone asking.
There are lots of stones that fit people''s criteria. Often, the slight difference in visual optics doesn''t equate to the premium that super duper loupers have.
Too add to that sentiment - some may feel optimum light return could be consrued by their eye as ''chaotic''. I know I feel that way when I look at the Leo stone - more facets for more optics. Maybe not apples to apples - but certainly worth consideration.
Al, I doubt whether you are in the minority reading this thread. You are just bold enough to defend your stance - which is VERY VALID for *you*. I''m sure there are many that won''t post their view here for the very reason why ''we'' the collective un number/super loupers supporters don''t post often in the other threads. Just a perspective.
It''s good to know someone does! hahahaDate: 8/22/2006 11:23:34 AM
Author: Rhino
Just reading through this thread ...
devient and F&I ... I read the other thread that Ira linked to which caused this one. Just wanted to share that I totally sympathize with the *why''s* behind your reasonings. devient ... what you had written expresses my exact sentiments lately. I felt you had taken the words right out of my mouth.Date: 8/21/2006 4:06:11 PM
Author: fire&ice
But, what devientrow said actually is why I started this thread. You know I''m not afraid to post a stone just outside of ideal. I''m not afraid to endorse a stone as a possibility. I''m not afraid to post a stone that doesn''t have all the numbers because what GIA had before was plenty to go on and get started. Heck, I would even recommend EGL or IGI stones (both having (IGI sporatic) crown & pav information). But, when I recommended a stone within budget, within the selected vendors inventory that only got a vg/g - literally someone said I proposed it in ''jest''. Something has gone awry.Date: 8/21/2006 1:41:42 PM
Author: aljdewey
I guess I don''t understand that. It''s fruitless why? Because you''re in the minority of opinions? Why is it fruitless because ten other people say the opposite?
Those ten people don''t negate your opinion.....it''s still valid on its own.
Look, I''m clearly in the minority opinion in this discussion, and it doesn''t stop me from sharing my less-popular viewpoint.
I can also appreciate that some folks get tired of trying to promote balance, but if that''s true, then I feel like you can''t complain about the lack of it. If you want balance, do something to make it happen. Balance doesn''t mean an equal number of opinions on either side - it''s not a tug-of-war, and it''s not a popularity contest.
If your opinion is ''follow the eye'' and ten others say ''follow the paper'', your opinion might be the only one that resonates to someone asking.
There are lots of stones that fit people''s criteria. Often, the slight difference in visual optics doesn''t equate to the premium that super duper loupers have.
Too add to that sentiment - some may feel optimum light return could be consrued by their eye as ''chaotic''. I know I feel that way when I look at the Leo stone - more facets for more optics. Maybe not apples to apples - but certainly worth consideration.
Al, I doubt whether you are in the minority reading this thread. You are just bold enough to defend your stance - which is VERY VALID for *you*. I''m sure there are many that won''t post their view here for the very reason why ''we'' the collective un number/super loupers supporters don''t post often in the other threads. Just a perspective.
Peace,
This is the one post that I keep thinking about. I agree that Beautiful cuts could be different for different people.
Good questions. I will leave the technical explanations to the cutters, perhaps Paul Slegers or Brian Gavin or Bill Bray can drop in and explain those things, as to your question about the rough, I do know that rough varies dramatically from piece to piece and that there are definite limitations to what can be done to each piece on a weight retention basis and on a crystal orientation basis.
Cutting lasers are used in sawing and can be used to shape rough in broad terms (shaping it into a horse''s head for example), but unless there is an application we''re unaware of cross-working and brillianteering is always done at the polishing wheel, which is impregnated with diamond powder.
Yes and while we here might demand a lot out of our stones, most of the people I know are quite content to just go off and get whatever looks purdy in the window and pay whatever is asked of them for it. I''d say that''s quite a demand for "whatever" is maximized from the rough, particularly if they''re shallow and wide so that it looks big on the finger.
This is a great example of balancing yield with demand, and demonstrates the human decision-making component. There are many paths available in the decision-making and execution stages and any weak link in the chain can influence the finished product. After planning the marking - sawing/cleaving - bruting - polishing all require skilled craftsmen, especially if one is going for specific xyz specs.
Well, there are da vinci''s and then there is the guy on the corner pumping out reproductions for barely more than the cost of canvas LOL (and the guys in the mall selling paintings for $1400 that were barely more than pumped out... at quite a profit!!Date: 8/22/2006 8:00:01 PM
Author: fire&ice
Ya know - my tenure here has been quite long - this is the first logical answer.
Makes sense.
I guess at the end of the day - the cutters is where the science, the eye & the skill becomes the art. Not too different in process than Leonardo Da Vinci.
That''s one of the reasons I got my info incorrect w/ the Capt - if the rough is cloudy - how can you cut as such with a visual...? Honestly - just a dopey consumer thought.
I agree with you Lynn (you''ve been a bit quiet lately haven''t you?). But I also feel there''s another reason some expect perfection. These are the same people (myself included) who don''t buy furniture at discount stores. These are people who typically shop at Nordstrom or Nieman Marcus. These are people who drive higher end automobiles, like Mercedes, Audi and BMW. And these are people who expect the best and are intent enough to ensure they''re buying something truly excpetional. The people who shop at Walmart (please no offense to anyone who does, as I''m sure Walmart has some bargains to be sure), and who buys a mass production car, are (and I realize I''m stereotyping) less likely to care about the perfect diamond specifications, nor pay for them.Date: 8/22/2006 8:53:50 PM
Author: Lynn B
Interesting thread... on many levels!
I would like to add my humble two cents here... because, unless I missed it, no one else has mentioned this point.
One reason why I think the *numbers* aspect (particularly as regards super-ideals, etc.) appeals to (or is important to) some people is because knowing that a diamond meets ideal-cut criteria is a VERY GOOD indicator that you have found a beautiful stone. (Not 100%, of course, but pretty darn close.)
This fact can be quite comforting to a newbie (or anyone who has not had the opportunity to view a lot of diamonds) who may not *REALLY KNOW* what a ''good'' diamond looks (or performs) like. They are spending A LOT of money and those ''ideal'' specs add a nice element of security for people who (for whatever reason) are just a little unsure about ''buying with their eyes'' only.
I gotta kinda disagree with the premise that a snob about one things means a snob in all. People can want the best in the things they hold dear, and cut corners in other areas they don't value so much. I don't think it's as cut/dried, black and white as suggested above.
I guess you got me Alj. And I knew I was stereotyping. But even though I didn''t get AGS000, I was most definitely into the pedigree of my stone, I just didn''t go as far as some might. But, I am the kind of guy who shops at Nordstrom, lives in a beautiful new condo on the bay and drives a Mercedes.Date: 8/23/2006 12:31:20 AM
Author: aljdewey
I gotta kinda disagree with the premise that a snob about one things means a snob in all. People can want the best in the things they hold dear, and cut corners in other areas they don''t value so much. I don''t think it''s as cut/dried, black and white as suggested above.
Mara could easily qualify as a diamond snob (has to have the most immaculate specs, etc), but she''ll be the first to tell you she drives a 12-year old ''ghetto car''.
I know people who want the ''best of the best'' in automobiles but couldn''t possibly care less about furniture.
In fact, Rod, you''re likely one of the best examples....you say you don''t shop at discount stores and are label conscious, but that didn''t make you buy an AGS000 stone. There, you bought what your eye liked instead of buying the ''pedigree''.
I''m WAY into ideal diamonds, but I couldn''t possibly care less about handbags. The whole LV thing is totally lost on me!It''s a bag....big deal.
It is indeed
See, and maybe this is just MY opinion - the history of how a diamond came to be as finished diamond is not nano specs. You have people who are ACTUALLY looking at the rough, evaluating broad terms then specific terms - often with consenus. I doubt whether they are thinking - will this 4.2 whatever round to the necessary GIA 4.1 whatever or evaluating what''s the dopey "image" over the internet going to look like.
I gave up membership at Sam''s-while the prices were good, the selection was limited. Since I don''t eat sweets that frequently, I prefer a good bakery that doesn''t mind letting me taste their wares before I make a decision. Ms. Smith makes a very good pie, in a pinch. I dream of having a gourmet chef.Date: 8/23/2006 9:32:29 AM
Author: Rod
It is indeed
Just some people buy their pies at Sams Club. And some buy their pies at bakeries. While others are perfectly satisfied with Ms. Smith''s frozen lemon pies from the grocery store. And finally, some have chefs (NOT ME) in their gourmet kitchens who make lemon pies whenever they want one!!!!!
OK........I do love the piano playing.Date: 8/23/2006 10:45:45 AM
Author: decodelighted
I jus wanna know when NORDSTROMS became the ''go to'' classy store?? Maybe I''m spoiled, living in the Tri-State area ... but I think of Saks & Barney''s and Bendels and Neimans and Bergdorf''s LONG before I think of NORDSTROMS. Nordstroms = Bloomingdales = Macy''s in my book.
But then again, I live in a pre-1800''s cottage, eat grocery store pies & drive a Toyota!
Admit it, Rod. You just go there for the piano playin''!
I agree with the sentiment. It''s a question of balance. Diamonds are about both art and science. Diamond buyers have different needs in terms of getting comfortable with a purchase so that they can truly enjoy their stone. The challenge for the seller is to understand a customer''s needs and desires, and to be able to provide the information and guidance required to satisfy that particular client.
Luv ya Deco!!!..........Also, I don''t know about your Nordstrom, but there''s not a single men''s shoe store in the Tampa area with anything near their selection.Date: 8/23/2006 11:22:43 AM
Author: decodelighted
I forgot about Neiman''s cc policy... prob ''cause I mostly shop at their decidedly unsnobby ''Last Call'' outlets! And the Saks version and the Barney''s version ... LOVE when snooty merch gets the ol'' markdown! Saks is my fave ''cause I think I gained the 50 you lost -- and they have the best selection of ''hip'' plus size Snoot-wear.
And I''m all for good customer svc -- yr. right: Nordstroms is better than some others on that front! The womens depts just aren''t as, um, edgy or ''fashion forward'' as their Snooty counterparts are. Good for ''basics'' ... bad for stopping-traffic.
Ahem ... back to your regularly scheduled PIE-TALK.
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