our own John Pollard in a AGS podcast advertisement

[Allison D.]

Date: 8/18/2008 6:18:10 PM
Author: whatmeworry
I think we''re glossing over an important point that Serg made.
Telling consumers to buy a certain brand (lab or diamond manufacture or vendor) imparts no real knowledge on how to buy a diamond with confidence. It''s telling consumers to swim in my pool and you''ll be safe from the sharks, instead of really teaching them to SWIM on their own. Teaching them what to look for when evaluating a diamond. my little rant.

This would be a persuasive argument to me IF it was true that everyone WANTS to know and WANTS to learn enough.

Sadly, that''s not true. Case in point: friends of mine knew I was avidly into diamonds and could help them get a stunning ring. He bought a ring at Macys!!!!!!! To them, they just didn''t care about the things we do here.

There seems to be a thought that all consumers would be willing pupils if only someone would teach them. That''s just not true.

Some ARE willing pupils (just like the students who really DO want to read the entire book prior to a quiz in school for the experience of having done it right) and others just want enough info to skate by (those who buy the Cliff''s notes in place of the book so they have just enough information to pass the test and nothing more.)

 

[Allison D.]

Date: 8/18/2008 7:20:45 PM
Author: Wink

Date: 8/18/2008 6:55:27 PM
Author: DiaGem


I understand..., rounds, Princesses or other cuts....

I wish I had clients for all the things you think I should have clients for. I wish people were standing in line waiting for me to find them something special.

I have tried. I sold Jubilees, so few sold in the US that the company eventually quit making them. I sell Richard Homer cuts in colored gemstones, unique and often one of a kind cuts, about 1/10th of what I think people should be buying.

I will be happy to show some of Storm''s cuts should they make it to market, but I am not holding my breath that there will be long lines of people demanding them. Like it or not the market is driven more by consumers than by producers and they are demanding rounds and princesses today. Tried to sell a marquise lately? Used to be one of my top sellers 25 years ago. Have not sold one recently that I remember.

I really don''t think you understand my business any better than I understand yours, I understand being talked down to though. Come play in my backyard, then tell me I am not playing the game right.

Wink

Therein lies the real problem.

I think, Diagem, that YOU think the market would want tons of other options.....if only those options were available. I have to somewhat disagree.

Look at women''s fashion......every year the designers come out with things that look WAY over the top. They are designed to be daring, but you don''t see most people wearing these fashions in everday life. Why? Because they aren''t practical for daily activities. Because they only look good on a very specific body type. Because they are done in outrageous colors that don''t look good on many women. Etc, etc. etc.

What happens in that industry? Things that appeal to several market segments become staples, like the little black dress and the comfy pair of jeans. Other things (elaborate dresses adorned with feathers, etc.) appeal to a SMALL piece of the market, but they can''t get traction with the majority as a staple piece.

Now, that''s CLOTHES.....which are typically considerably less expensive than diamonds. Bring it to the level of diamonds, and you''ll see shopping trends are MUCH more conservative. People may appreciate ''different'', but because diamonds are such a significant financial purchase, people tend to prefer styles that are "timeless" and "classic". Read through the many pages of Pricescope to find this for yourself. The overwhelming majority of women talk about building a wardrobe of ''classic'' pieces. Stud earrings, solitaire pendant, anniversary/eternity band......women tend to gravitate toward pieces that will ''fit'' them through a lifetime.

As much as you''d like to see something different, it''s a small majority of women who want to go against the grain and pick something that makes a hugely bold statement. There is *a* market, sure, but it''s not a *significant* enough market segment to incent producers to dedicate time/resources to it.

In the ''lack of variety'' argument, the culprit isn''t AGS/GIA or labs that strive for top-make stones. It''s the fact that the product has a high price-point, and most people feel less comfortable taking risks in large purchases than in small ones.

 

[whatmeworry]

Date: 8/19/2008 3:33:28 PM
Author: Allison D.

Date: 8/18/2008 6:18:10 PM
Author: whatmeworry
I think we''re glossing over an important point that Serg made.
Telling consumers to buy a certain brand (lab or diamond manufacture or vendor) imparts no real knowledge on how to buy a diamond with confidence. It''s telling consumers to swim in my pool and you''ll be safe from the sharks, instead of really teaching them to SWIM on their own. Teaching them what to look for when evaluating a diamond. my little rant.

This would be a persuasive argument to me IF it was true that everyone WANTS to know and WANTS to learn enough.

Sadly, that''s not true. Case in point: friends of mine knew I was avidly into diamonds and could help them get a stunning ring. He bought a ring at Macys!!!!!!! To them, they just didn''t care about the things we do here.

There seems to be a thought that all consumers would be willing pupils if only someone would teach them. That''s just not true.

Some ARE willing pupils (just like the students who really DO want to read the entire book prior to a quiz in school for the experience of having done it right) and others just want enough info to skate by (those who buy the Cliff''s notes in place of the book so they have just enough information to pass the test and nothing more.)

Alj, I agree not everyone wants to learn. But I think most of the people who will listen to the podcast are in search of knowledge. If your frend did go to you for help, I would hope your advise would be more than "buy at Whiteflash".

 

[WinkHPD]

Date: 8/19/2008 4:24:25 PM
Author: whatmeworry

Date: 8/19/2008 3:33:28 PM
Author: Allison D.

Date: 8/18/2008 6:18:10 PM
Author: whatmeworry
I think we''re glossing over an important point that Serg made.
Telling consumers to buy a certain brand (lab or diamond manufacture or vendor) imparts no real knowledge on how to buy a diamond with confidence. It''s telling consumers to swim in my pool and you''ll be safe from the sharks, instead of really teaching them to SWIM on their own. Teaching them what to look for when evaluating a diamond. my little rant.

This would be a persuasive argument to me IF it was true that everyone WANTS to know and WANTS to learn enough.

Sadly, that''s not true. Case in point: friends of mine knew I was avidly into diamonds and could help them get a stunning ring. He bought a ring at Macys!!!!!!! To them, they just didn''t care about the things we do here.

There seems to be a thought that all consumers would be willing pupils if only someone would teach them. That''s just not true.

Some ARE willing pupils (just like the students who really DO want to read the entire book prior to a quiz in school for the experience of having done it right) and others just want enough info to skate by (those who buy the Cliff''s notes in place of the book so they have just enough information to pass the test and nothing more.)

Alj, I agree not everyone wants to learn. But I think most of the people who will listen to the podcast are in search of knowledge. If your frend did go to you for help, I would hope your advise would be more than ''buy at Whiteflash''.

Why?

If you come to me for help at my office, I will tell you many things, but "go somewhere else to buy" will not be one of them.

Since Allison works for Whiteflash she should absolutely suggest they go to WhiteFlash to get a complete education. If you have looked at their site you know that they offer a TON of information.

Wink

 

[Allison D.]

Date: 8/19/2008 4:24:25 PM
Author: whatmeworry

Alj, I agree not everyone wants to learn. But I think most of the people who will listen to the podcast are in search of knowledge. If your frend did go to you for help, I would hope your advise would be more than ''buy at Whiteflash''.

Yes, but HOW MUCH knowledge? Enough to become an avid enthusiast, or just enough to make a fairly sound purchase?

I''ve been on PS for nearly six years now, and what drives most people here is "I want to understand what constitutes a fair price so I don''t get ripped off." THAT is the motivation. They have no idea at that point that there are different makes of stones and that they''ll have to learn a bit more about cut in order to understand what is a fair price.

Not everyone on a quest for knowledge wants to become an accomplished scholar. Some just want enough to get by for a specific event (engagement) and that''s all. So the fact they find the podcast doesn''t mean they are in the former group; they may be just looking for the ''cliff''s notes'' synopsis akin to cheat notes.

As a ''cheat notes'' vehicle, it does accomplish what John is hoping to......to help people easily understand that not all diamonds are created equal (or in this case, ''ideal'') and helps explain that the mere label ''ideal'' isn''t a guarantee of great performance.

If the viewer doesn''t really care about performance, the message will likely miss its mark anyway; it won''t stick. For those people who DO care about top-make stones and didn''t realize that all ''ideals'' aren''t the same, I believe it does hit the mark and does serve a purpose.

And no, I wouldn''t just say "buy at Whiteflash".

I''d prefer to find out what their priorities are and help that way. In my friend''s case, they didn''t really care about performance. They are pretty basic folks; they''d rather make their own coffee than purchase one at Starbucks. They are fairly frugal, and despite knowing that a diamond''s sparkle is directly related to performance, their attitude was ''we aren''t looking for a mercedes-equivalent diamond.'' They wanted something ''noticeable'' and finance-able. There was no point in trying to suggest they learn about stones; they knew enough to know there was something to know, but didn''t care enough. To each their own.

 

[Allison D.]

Date: 8/19/2008 6:27:24 PM
Author: Wink

Date: 8/19/2008 4:24:25 PM
Author: whatmeworry

Date: 8/19/2008 3:33:28 PM
Author: Allison D.

Date: 8/18/2008 6:18:10 PM
Author: whatmeworry
I think we''re glossing over an important point that Serg made.
Telling consumers to buy a certain brand (lab or diamond manufacture or vendor) imparts no real knowledge on how to buy a diamond with confidence. It''s telling consumers to swim in my pool and you''ll be safe from the sharks, instead of really teaching them to SWIM on their own. Teaching them what to look for when evaluating a diamond. my little rant.

This would be a persuasive argument to me IF it was true that everyone WANTS to know and WANTS to learn enough.

Sadly, that''s not true. Case in point: friends of mine knew I was avidly into diamonds and could help them get a stunning ring. He bought a ring at Macys!!!!!!! To them, they just didn''t care about the things we do here.

There seems to be a thought that all consumers would be willing pupils if only someone would teach them. That''s just not true.

Some ARE willing pupils (just like the students who really DO want to read the entire book prior to a quiz in school for the experience of having done it right) and others just want enough info to skate by (those who buy the Cliff''s notes in place of the book so they have just enough information to pass the test and nothing more.)

Alj, I agree not everyone wants to learn. But I think most of the people who will listen to the podcast are in search of knowledge. If your frend did go to you for help, I would hope your advise would be more than ''buy at Whiteflash''.

Why?

If you come to me for help at my office, I will tell you many things, but ''go somewhere else to buy'' will not be one of them.

Since Allison works for Whiteflash she should absolutely suggest they go to WhiteFlash to get a complete education. If you have looked at their site you know that they offer a TON of information.

Wink

LOL, Wink!

I''ve been a consumer for much longer than I''ve been on the vendor side, I guess. Perhaps more important, I''ve been in sales for the last 22 years. I realize that ''buy at Whiteflash'' as the sole answer wouldn''t be as compelling as "here''s the difference between a good stone and a GREAT stone, and we are one of those who carry those GREAT stones".

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Date: 8/19/2008 3:54:37 PM
Author: Allison D.

Therein lies the real problem.

I think, Diagem, that YOU think the market would want tons of other options.....if only those options were available. I have to somewhat disagree.

Look at women''s fashion......every year the designers come out with things that look WAY over the top. They are designed to be daring, but you don''t see most people wearing these fashions in everday life. Why? Because they aren''t practical for daily activities. Because they only look good on a very specific body type. Because they are done in outrageous colors that don''t look good on many women. Etc, etc. etc.

What happens in that industry? Things that appeal to several market segments become staples, like the little black dress and the comfy pair of jeans. Other things (elaborate dresses adorned with feathers, etc.) appeal to a SMALL piece of the market, but they can''t get traction with the majority as a staple piece.

Now, that''s CLOTHES.....which are typically considerably less expensive than diamonds. Bring it to the level of diamonds, and you''ll see shopping trends are MUCH more conservative. People may appreciate ''different'', but because diamonds are such a significant financial purchase, people tend to prefer styles that are ''timeless'' and ''classic''. Read through the many pages of Pricescope to find this for yourself. The overwhelming majority of women talk about building a wardrobe of ''classic'' pieces. Stud earrings, solitaire pendant, anniversary/eternity band......women tend to gravitate toward pieces that will ''fit'' them through a lifetime.

As much as you''d like to see something different, it''s a small majority of women who want to go against the grain and pick something that makes a hugely bold statement. There is *a* market, sure, but it''s not a *significant* enough market segment to incent producers to dedicate time/resources to it.

In the ''lack of variety'' argument, the culprit isn''t AGS/GIA or labs that strive for top-make stones. It''s the fact that the product has a high price-point, and most people feel less comfortable taking risks in large purchases than in small ones.

Great analogy

Aldj, what % of $'' sales do you think comes from high end leading edge fashions, and what comes from generic clothes?

What would happen to clothes if there was not a strong high end Milan, Paris catwalks and fashion industry?

 

[jasontb]

Date: 8/19/2008 7:54:52 PM
Author: Garry H (Cut Nut)

What would happen to clothes if there was not a strong high end Milan, Paris catwalks and fashion industry?

AGS would tell me which jeans were ideal and retailers would work to convince me I should only buy ideal jeans?

 

[Allison D.]

Date: 8/19/2008 8:59:05 PM
Author: jasontb

Date: 8/19/2008 7:54:52 PM
Author: Garry H (Cut Nut)

What would happen to clothes if there was not a strong high end Milan, Paris catwalks and fashion industry?

AGS would tell me which jeans were ideal and retailers would work to convince me I should only buy ideal jeans?

Not exactly.

Calvin Klein will tell you, for example, how to tell you which jeans are authentic Calvin Klein jeans. That isn''t to say you have to like that particular design of jeans, but it IS meant to tell you how to recognize if the jeans being represented as equivalent to high-end designer jeans really ARE high-end designer jeans.

If you feel more comfortable in Levis, no amount of Calvin Klein asserting their brand is going to make you like their jeans more than Levis. HOWEVER, it certainly IS going to help those who DO like/want high-end designer jeans to know if the jeans they are getting ARE in fact worth the high-end designer price they are paying.

Explaining to you why all steak isn''t Kobe steak won''t influence you to prefer steak over hamburger. It will simply help steak-lovers who DO like steak to make sure they aren''t paying $150 for a steak that''s being represented as exclusive beef when it''s not.

 

[stone_seeker]

amazing all the analogies in this thread to make the same point....

have anything been solved? no one owns the word "ideal" so sans diamond education, people will believe what they are told.

 

[jasontb]

Date: 8/19/2008 9:42:52 PM
Author: Allison D.

Not exactly.


Calvin Klein will tell you, for example, how to tell you which jeans are authentic Calvin Klein jeans. That isn''t to say you have to like that particular design of jeans, but it IS meant to tell you how to recognize if the jeans being represented as equivalent to high-end designer jeans really ARE high-end designer jeans.


If you feel more comfortable in Levis, no amount of Calvin Klein asserting their brand is going to make you like their jeans more than Levis. HOWEVER, it certainly IS going to help those who DO like/want high-end designer jeans to know if the jeans they are getting ARE in fact worth the high-end designer price they are paying.


Explaining to you why all steak isn''t Kobe steak won''t influence you to prefer steak over hamburger. It will simply help steak-lovers who DO like steak to make sure they aren''t paying $150 for a steak that''s being represented as exclusive beef when it''s not.

Oh, I think I get it. Calvin Klein is just a brand. And Calvin Klein''s are not necessarily the ideal jeans. Just like AGS000 is a brand. And it is not necessarily the ideal diamond. These analogies always help me tremendously.

 

[risingsun]

Date: 8/19/2008 8:59:05 PM
Author: jasontb

Date: 8/19/2008 7:54:52 PM
Author: Garry H (Cut Nut)

What would happen to clothes if there was not a strong high end Milan, Paris catwalks and fashion industry?

AGS would tell me which jeans were ideal and retailers would work to convince me I should only buy ideal jeans?

If branding doesn''t mean anything to you, why did you choose a "Cut By Tolkowsky" diamond, which was further described as an ideal cut H&A graded by GIA. The highest grade by GIA is excellent, not ideal. Your stone wasn''t graded by AGS. I don''t understand the nature of your posts or why you have singled out AGS as an issue. We all have our own branding irons in the fire

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 8/20/2008 12:22:47 AM
Author: risingsun

If branding doesn't mean anything to you, why did you choose a 'Cut By Tolkowsky' diamond, which was further described as an ideal cut H&A graded by GIA. The highest grade by GIA is excellent, not ideal. Your stone wasn't graded by AGS. I don't understand the nature of your posts or why you have singled out AGS as an issue. We all have our own branding irons in the fire

1: In my opinion the Tolkowsky family has much more right to the title ideal cut than AGS.
2: If the stone was from GOG he has a license to the AGS software and can use the title AGS Ideal if he so chooses.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Date: 8/20/2008 1:44:28 AM
Author: strmrdr

Date: 8/20/2008 12:22:47 AM
Author: risingsun

If branding doesn''t mean anything to you, why did you choose a ''Cut By Tolkowsky'' diamond, which was further described as an ideal cut H&A graded by GIA. The highest grade by GIA is excellent, not ideal. Your stone wasn''t graded by AGS. I don''t understand the nature of your posts or why you have singled out AGS as an issue. We all have our own branding irons in the fire

1: In my opinion the Tolkowsky family has much more right to the title ideal cut than AGS.
2: If the stone was from GOG he has a license to the AGS software and can use the title AGS Ideal if he so chooses.

Actually only AGS can do that because they currently also require their gemologists to grade the sym and polish as ''ideal''. GOGare not even affiliated AGS members or appraisers are they?
GOG could put an AGS light performance qualification on any stone, but not confer any AGS grading.

 

[risingsun]

Date: 8/20/2008 1:44:28 AM
Author: strmrdr

Date: 8/20/2008 12:22:47 AM
Author: risingsun

If branding doesn''t mean anything to you, why did you choose a ''Cut By Tolkowsky'' diamond, which was further described as an ideal cut H&A graded by GIA. The highest grade by GIA is excellent, not ideal. Your stone wasn''t graded by AGS. I don''t understand the nature of your posts or why you have singled out AGS as an issue. We all have our own branding irons in the fire

1: In my opinion the Tolkowsky family has much more right to the title ideal cut than AGS.
2: If the stone was from GOG he has a license to the AGS software and can use the title AGS Ideal if he so chooses.

My point, strm, is that Jason followed the same process that most consumers use in choosing a diamond. He is now very critical of branding and AGS, in particular, and I would like to understand how this happened. He has periodically made comments in these threads without much personal disclosure of his experience. I really find it difficult to understand his POV.

 

[risingsun]

Date: 8/20/2008 4:46:32 AM
Author: Garry H (Cut Nut)

Date: 8/20/2008 1:44:28 AM
Author: strmrdr

Date: 8/20/2008 12:22:47 AM
Author: risingsun

If branding doesn''t mean anything to you, why did you choose a ''Cut By Tolkowsky'' diamond, which was further described as an ideal cut H&A graded by GIA. The highest grade by GIA is excellent, not ideal. Your stone wasn''t graded by AGS. I don''t understand the nature of your posts or why you have singled out AGS as an issue. We all have our own branding irons in the fire

1: In my opinion the Tolkowsky family has much more right to the title ideal cut than AGS.
2: If the stone was from GOG he has a license to the AGS software and can use the title AGS Ideal if he so chooses.

Actually only AGS can do that because they currently also require their gemologists to grade the sym and polish as ''ideal''. GOGare not even affiliated AGS members or appraisers are they?
GOG could put an AGS light performance qualification on any stone, but not confer any AGS grading.

Thanks, Garry. I thought this was the case and appreciate your clarification.

 

[diagem]

Date: 8/19/2008 3:54:37 PM
Author: Allison D.

Date: 8/18/2008 7:20:45 PM
Author: Wink

Date: 8/18/2008 6:55:27 PM
Author: DiaGem


I understand..., rounds, Princesses or other cuts....

I wish I had clients for all the things you think I should have clients for. I wish people were standing in line waiting for me to find them something special.

I have tried. I sold Jubilees, so few sold in the US that the company eventually quit making them. I sell Richard Homer cuts in colored gemstones, unique and often one of a kind cuts, about 1/10th of what I think people should be buying.

I will be happy to show some of Storm''s cuts should they make it to market, but I am not holding my breath that there will be long lines of people demanding them. Like it or not the market is driven more by consumers than by producers and they are demanding rounds and princesses today. Tried to sell a marquise lately? Used to be one of my top sellers 25 years ago. Have not sold one recently that I remember.

I really don''t think you understand my business any better
than I understand yours, I understand being talked down to though. Come play in my backyard, then tell me I am not playing the game right.

Wink..., sorry you feel this way..., it was not my intentions

I am not telling you anything..., you are probably playing "your" game right and definitely "safe"

.
Wink

Therein lies the real problem.

I think, Diagem, that YOU think the market would want tons of other options.....if only those options were available. I have to somewhat disagree.

Alj..., maybe in your neck of the woods you might be correct..., but the world is much larger (than you might think) and I will disagree with your narrow way of looking at the market!

Look at women''s fashion......every year the designers come out with things that look WAY over the top. They are designed to be daring, but you don''t see most people wearing these fashions in everday life. Why? Because they aren''t practical for daily activities. Because they only look good on a very specific body type. Because they are done in outrageous colors that don''t look good on many women. Etc, etc. etc.

What happens in that industry? Things that appeal to several market segments become staples, like the little black dress and the comfy pair of jeans. Other things (elaborate dresses adorned with feathers, etc.) appeal to a SMALL piece of the market, but they can''t get traction with the majority as a staple piece.

Now, that''s CLOTHES.....which are typically considerably less expensive than diamonds. Bring it to the level of diamonds, and you''ll see shopping trends are MUCH more conservative. People may appreciate ''different'', but because diamonds are such a significant financial purchase, people tend to prefer styles that are ''timeless'' and ''classic''. Read through the many pages of Pricescope to find this for yourself. The overwhelming majority of women talk about building a wardrobe of ''classic'' pieces. Stud earrings, solitaire pendant, anniversary/eternity band......women tend to gravitate toward pieces that will ''fit'' them through a lifetime.

Alj..., question for ya..., do you classify a Princess cut as a "Classic" shaped Diamond? Secondly..., with all do respect to PriceScope traffic..., its still a drop in the Ocean if compared to the jewelry/Diamond consumer world...

As much as you''d like to see something different, it''s a small majority of women who want to go against the grain and pick something that makes a hugely bold statement. There is *a* market, sure, but it''s not a *significant* enough market segment to incent producers to dedicate time/resources to it.

In the ''lack of variety'' argument, the culprit isn''t AGS/GIA or labs that strive for top-make stones. It''s the fact that the product has a high price-point, and most people feel less comfortable taking risks in large purchases than in small ones.

 

[Allison D.]

Date: 8/20/2008 2:26:16 PM
Author: DiaGem

Date: 8/19/2008 3:54:37 PM
Author: Allison D.


Therein lies the real problem.

I think, Diagem, that YOU think the market would want tons of other options.....if only those options were available. I have to somewhat disagree.

Alj..., maybe in your neck of the woods you might be correct..., but the world is much larger (than you might think) and I will disagree with your narrow way of looking at the market!

DiaGem.....with due respect, since AGS/GIA happen to play IN 'my neck of the woods', it makes sense that they'd develop information/tools that apply to 'my neck of the woods.'

I agree with you that what flies outside the U.S. might be far broader/bolder than what flies within, but if that's your argument, then why the heck are you blaming grading reports from an American lab for stifling a world-wide market for other shapes? Heck, most of the people WITHIN the U.S. don't even know that AGS exists.....I'd imagine that percentage drops even more considerably for non-U.S. consumer markets.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. If you're saying that U.S. grading labs are influencing demand (or lack thereof) for other cuts, then the U.S. market (which drives the U.S. lab) has relevance. If you're arguing that the *majority* of the world outside the U.S. *does* want/demand other cuts and is willing to pony up the $$ for them, it's hard to imagine how a national lab in the U.S. would have the power override the inherent economic incentive that non-U.S. demand would represent.

IF there were a significant demand outside the U.S. for other shapes (as you seem to be claiming there is) AND that demand represented an economic win for cutter, they'd be cutting for it. If they aren't, I have to imagine it's because there's not enough MONEY in it for them. What people WANT and what they are willing to PAY FOR are sometimes different things.

Date: 8/20/2008 2:26:16 PM
Author: DiaGem

Alj..., question for ya..., do you classify a Princess cut as a 'Classic' shaped Diamond? Secondly..., with all do respect to PriceScope traffic..., its still a drop in the Ocean if compared to the jewelry/Diamond consumer world...

No, actually, I don't consider a Princess cut as classic. Yet apparently, there has been enough demand for that cut to make it economically worthwhile for cutters to produce it, right? Oh, and let's point out........princess cuts were in demand because the *MARKET* liked them/wanted them/were willing to PAY for them.

All of that, by the way, happened well before AGS offered an AGS0 grade for princess stones and only offered grading reports for rounds.

By your argument (American lab calling certain shapes ideal stifles innovation of other cuts), that should never have been possible because after all, AGS0 was touting only round stones as 'ideal'. How, then, did it become worthwhile to cut princess stones despite not having the "ideal" label from AGS??????? Because there were enough people willing to PAY for them, and that made it economically worthwhile for cutters to produce them.

The market demand wasn't shaped by a lab report (or lack thereof); it was shaped because enough people saw them, liked them, and were willing to buy them. Same holds true for other innovative cuts.

If you're going to blame labels, you should be blaming MARKETING labels. It's easy to see why a gal might want a diamond called PRINCESS. I don't think most gals consider the terms ASSCHER

or Emerald to imply romantic connotations.

 

[strmrdr]

Can a 85%+ deep round diamond be beautiful and high performance?

 

[Allison D.]

Date: 8/20/2008 3:44:14 PM
Author: strmrdr
Can a 85%+ deep round diamond be beautiful and high performance?

To someone who has never seen anything else? Sure.

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 8/20/2008 3:59:45 PM
Author: Allison D.

Date: 8/20/2008 3:44:14 PM

Author: strmrdr

Can a 85%+ deep round diamond be beautiful and high performance?

To someone who has never seen anything else? Sure.

bzzzzt but thanks for playing...
First dispersion...

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 8/20/2008 3:59:45 PM
Author: Allison D.

Date: 8/20/2008 3:44:14 PM

Author: strmrdr

Can a 85%+ deep round diamond be beautiful and high performance?

To someone who has never seen anything else? Sure.

bzzzt performance

 

[strmrdr]

bzzzt shopco lighting

It looks even better in Marty lighting.

 

[WinkHPD]

Date: 8/20/2008 3:44:14 PM
Author: strmrdr
Can a 85%+ deep round diamond be beautiful and high performance?

Traditional round brilliant or one of yours? Asked as a trick question, I bet some will not catch that and shoot back a quick, "No".

Since you asked the question, I will gladly accept all bets that you have developed one that does. I will also bet that it is NOT a traditional round brilliant.

Wink

 

[strmrdr]

c: angle is 40 degrees
p: angle is 75.49

 

[WinkHPD]

Date: 8/20/2008 3:44:14 PM
Author: strmrdr
Can a 85%+ deep round diamond be beautiful and high performance?

Further follow up before I read further down the page.

Is this relevant to the conversation at hand. If you have developed one that is, it is not one for which AGS has yet developed a grading system, so how are you stifled. Also, where will you get the rough to cut this without excessive waste?

Just curious.

Wink

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 8/20/2008 4:19:14 PM
Author: Wink

Date: 8/20/2008 3:44:14 PM

Author: strmrdr

Can a 85%+ deep round diamond be beautiful and high performance?

Traditional round brilliant or one of yours? Asked as a trick question, I bet some will not catch that and shoot back a quick, ''No''.


Since you asked the question, I will gladly accept all bets that you have developed one that does. I will also bet that it is NOT a traditional round brilliant.


Wink

No its not exactly an RB but the top is.

 

[WinkHPD]

Date: 8/20/2008 4:08:23 PM
Author: strmrdr
bzzzt shopco lighting


It looks even better in Marty lighting.

Nice, very nice. How is this relevant to talking about John in the Podcast? How did AGS stifle your creativity? Where do you get the rough?

I want one.

Will I ever get one? Different discussion.

Wink

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 8/20/2008 4:21:35 PM
Author: Wink

Date: 8/20/2008 3:44:14 PM

Author: strmrdr

Can a 85%+ deep round diamond be beautiful and high performance?

Further follow up before I read further down the page.


Is this relevant to the conversation at hand. If you have developed one that is, it is not one for which AGS has yet developed a grading system, so how are you stifled. Also, where will you get the rough to cut this without excessive waste?


Just curious.


Wink

The CH ~17% is within a range that it could be cut from the same rough as an rb.
The yield would be much better than an RB.

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 8/20/2008 4:24:58 PM
Author: Wink

Date: 8/20/2008 4:08:23 PM

Author: strmrdr

bzzzt shopco lighting



It looks even better in Marty lighting.

Nice, very nice. How is this relevant to talking about John in the Podcast? How did AGS stifle your creativity? Where do you get the rough?


I want one.


Will I ever get one? Different discussion.


Wink

I mainly did this for fun but it does show why limiting diamond design in a box is a bad thing.
If everyone wants THE Ideal cut there is no room for designs like this one.
I asked myself how deep could I design a diamond that was high performance and beautiful.
Talk Paul into cutting one and you can have it :}