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Obamas, Clintons, and CNN Targeted after George Soros

cmd2014 said:
Did you even read that quote? He clearly said:

“When I say we kick them, I don’t mean we do anything inappropriate, we don’t do anything illegal...”
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Kicking people is very appropriate.
kick-in-nuts.gif
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the_mother_thing said:
@cmd2014 If you want to stick to 'the facts' then leave Chump out of it as well. You have a nut job who committed acts of terrorism against people. And if the cops have the right guy, it's a done deal. Nothing more to say about it.

If you are going to blame Chump because his face is on the vehicle, then the others are to be considered as well because their faces are on the vehicle as well.

We can go back and forth as much as you want, but you can't lay blame at one person's feet who was not involved in the crime if you refuse to lay blame at the others as well unless you are just a biased mouthpiece for the left and refuse to consider ALL parties fairly.

Did you call for Bernie Sanders resignation when his rhetoric fueled Scalise's gunman?
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The fact is that the shooter here testified under oath at his murder trail that he was heavily influenced by Trump’s words (and the words of other right wing propaganda mouthpieces backing Trump, all of whom have at one point or another alluded to the use of violence as a ‘solution’ to their imagined problems and fear-mongering that is a central tenet in their rhetoric). And people in power do have influence over the actions of other people. That is what leadership means. Trump is abusing that power and his words are having consequences. You talk about personal responsibility a lot, but not when it comes to holding your leaders accountable for the effect that any reasonable person would predict might occur as a result of their actions. Words are powerful. Ideas are powerful. Words and ideas from a powerful leader even more so. Nut jobs are vulnerable to following what they believe their idols are telling them to do. It makes them commit acts of violence. If you can’t believe this, then I guess you can’t believe that Osama Bin Lauden was responsible for inspiring people to crash planes into the World Trade Center or that Isis inspires people to commit acts of terrorism by spreading their rhetoric over the Internet. Responsible leaders understand this. Trump does not.

So you can talk about Bernie (although again, I’m not sure what he has to do with Trump, nor do I recall him saying anything remotely inciting of violence), or Obama, or lord knows who else, but the fact is that Trump regularly spews rhetoric that encourages violence. And it has had consequences. You can choose to ignore this if you wish, but it doesn’t change the facts.
 
Did anyone mention that Senator Kamala Harris and Tom Steyer were also sent bombs? The news about their having received bombs came out after the bomber was identified, so it wasn't huge news. I did read through this thread, but I wasn't participating in it in real time this afternoon so I may have missed some of its finer points.

AGBF
 
cmd2014 said:
The fact is that the shooter here testified under oath at his murder trail that he was heavily influenced by Trump’s words (and the words of other right wing propaganda mouthpieces backing Trump, all of whom have at one point or another alluded to the use of violence as a ‘solution’ to their imagined problems and fear-mongering that is a central tenet in their rhetoric). And people in power do have influence over the actions of other people. That is what leadership means. Trump is abusing that power and his words are having consequences. You talk about personal responsibility a lot, but not when it comes to holding your leaders accountable for the effect that any reasonable person would predict might occur as a result of their actions. Words are powerful. Ideas are powerful. Words and ideas from a powerful leader even more so. Nut jobs are vulnerable to following what they believe their idols are telling them to do. It makes them commit acts of violence. If you can’t believe this, then I guess you can’t believe that Osama Bin Lauden was responsible for inspiring people to crash planes into the World Trade Center or that Isis inspires people to commit acts of terrorism by spreading their rhetoric over the Internet. Responsible leaders understand this. Trump does not.

So you can talk about Bernie (although again, I’m not sure what he has to do with Trump, nor do I recall him saying anything remotely inciting of violence), or Obama, or lord knows who else, but the fact is that Trump regularly spews rhetoric that encourages violence. And it has had consequences. You can choose to ignore this if you wish, but it doesn’t change the facts.
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So now it's Trump's fault as well that this shooter shot up a game full of Republicans? What pray tell is not Trump's fault at this point? At what time is anyone responsible for their own actions? This is getting too ridiculous to even discuss and a total waste of time.
 
And the cops killed him right? They did their duty. Is there a democrat that didn't support the way this thing went down? Who said democrats weren't shocked? Did Bernie Sander's speak of violence? https://www.cnn.com/2017/06/14/politics/bernie-sanders-baseball-shooting/index.html

Both the shooter and the bomber are obviously mentally ill. Rather than defund mental health services in America, let's FUND them.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Congressional_baseball_shooting

What else should the democrats have done? GMAFB.


redwood66 said:
The only ones who have been shot are Republicans. But we can't talk about him because that is whataboutism. GMAFB. None of it is good by anyone.

By this guy:
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ng-raged-against-trump-republicans/102846780/

'It's time to destroy Trump & Co.': Scalise shooter raged on Facebook
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redwood66 said:
So now it's Trump's fault as well that this shooter shot up a game full of Republicans? What pray tell is not Trump's fault at this point? At what time is anyone responsible for their own actions? This is getting too ridiculous to even discuss and a total waste of time.
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:clap::clap::clap: It’s clear the left doesn’t believe in personal responsibility and accountability; it’s ALWAYS someone else’s fault ... everyone is a victim ... there’s a hashtag for that ... SSDD. Where’s the cheese?
 
Tekate said:
And the cops killed him right? They did their duty. Is there a democrat that didn't support the way this thing went down? Who said democrats weren't shocked? Did Bernie Sander's speak of violence? https://www.cnn.com/2017/06/14/politics/bernie-sanders-baseball-shooting/index.html

Both the shooter and the bomber are obviously mentally ill. Rather than defund mental health services in America, let's FUND them.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Congressional_baseball_shooting

What else should the democrats have done? GMAFB.
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The comment was to those who complained about whataboutism.
 
the_mother_thing said:
:clap::clap::clap: It’s clear the left doesn’t believe in personal responsibility and accountability; it’s ALWAYS someone else’s fault ... everyone is a victim ... there’s a hashtag for that ... SSDD. Where’s the cheese?
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Apparently I can act like a complete loon and get away with it because TRUMP!
 
redwood66 said:
Apparently I can act like a complete loon and get away with it because TRUMP!
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Well, yea ... it’s been on display here nonstop since the 2016 election. :whistle:
 
Tekate said:
IYO what does Holder mean by when Holder says 'WHEN THEY' go low? what is he referring to and whom? before I can answer your question.
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They = Reps.
 
redwood66 said:
So now it's Trump's fault as well that this shooter shot up a game full of Republicans? What pray tell is not Trump's fault at this point? At what time is anyone responsible for their own actions? This is getting too ridiculous to even discuss and a total waste of time.
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I’m talking about the shooter here in Canada who shot people in a mosque. But under this argument you’d also be saying that you don’t think Bin Lauden is responsible for the actions of Al Qaeda members who committed acts of terrorism inspired by his words or that the leaders of Isis aren’t responsible for the actions of their followers, also inspired by their words...except that you have no problem with the US sending drone strikes and seal teams to execute them. Presumably because you believe on some level that people should be held responsible for inciting violence through the words they speak as a leader of people.
 
cmd2014 said:
I’m talking about the shooter here in Canada who shot people in a mosque. But under this argument you’d also be saying that you don’t think Bin Lauden is responsible for the actions of Al Qaeda members who committed acts of terrorism inspired by his words or that the leaders of Isis aren’t responsible for the actions of their followers, also inspired by their words...except that you have no problem with the US sending drone strikes and seal teams to execute them. Presumably because you believe on some level that people should be held responsible for inciting violence through the words they speak as a leader of people.
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Talk about red herrings and diversionary arguments ... :doh:
 
the_mother_thing said:
Talk about red herrings and diversionary arguments ... :doh:
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No, I’m talking about Trump. And the effect of his words. You and Red want to distract away from this with your argument about personal responsibility and the idea that only the actor matters (ie the person who carries through the idea), not the leader who created the idea and encouraged others to put it into action. I’m pointing out the hypocrisy of this argument when you clearly don’t apply it to anyone but Trump. The difference is that some leaders accept responsibility for their actions; others claim ignorance (or might in fact be too ignorant to understand the power of the position). Trump is not behaving in a responsible manner in regard to his rhetoric. I have not heard a single argument from you or Red or DF to dispute this. There’s been a lot of dodging and weaving and finger pointing at others, but no actual argument to support that he has not, in fact, said many things on multiple occasions that have encouraged violence (because he has). He has also clearly inspired people to put his ideas into action. Intentionally or not. So perhaps he should be held responsible for his actions, the way you suggest everyone else should be held accountable for theirs.
 
cmd2014 said:
No, I’m talking about Trump. And the effect of his words. You and Red want to distract away from this with your argument about personal responsibility and the idea that only the actor matters (ie the person who carries through the idea), not the leader who created the idea and encouraged others to put it into action. I’m pointing out the hypocrisy of this argument when you clearly don’t apply it to anyone but Trump. The difference is that some leaders accept responsibility for their actions; others claim ignorance (or might in fact be too ignorant to understand the power of the position). Trump is not behaving in a responsible manner in regard to his rhetoric. I have not heard a single argument from you or Red or DF to dispute this. There’s been a lot of dodging and weaving and finger pointing at others, but no actual argument to support that he has not, in fact, said many things on multiple occasions that have encouraged violence (because he has). He has also clearly inspired people to put his ideas into action. Intentionally or not. So perhaps he should be held responsible for his actions, the way you suggest everyone else should be held accountable for theirs.
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So this thread was about what we now know is one person/terrorist (who is not Trump) who targeted 10 (+/-/not including the duplicates) people with potentially explosive devices. I’m pretty sure we are all on the record as ‘in agreement’ that terrorism = bad, mmkay?

Then the discussion transitions into speculation as to why this person/terrorist did what he did. Naturally, the majority on here blame Trump’s rhetoric because ... well, TRUMMMMMPPP. :eek2:

So we have one ‘Republican’ and 10 or so Dems spewing hateful rhetoric, but we’re supposed to just ignore the 10 or so (some of which Dems are propping up for President in 2020 and one they already did in ‘16 and lost ‘bigly’) and only focus on the one because ‘Trump Triggers’ or some other liberal nonsense talking point hashtag? Even though those same 10 or so dems were also targets of the person/terrorist that started this whole shebang?

:hand: If you’re going to blame ‘rhetoric’, you don’t get to cherry pick the rhetoric being blamed when you don’t like the facts being laid out in such damning force.
 
cmd2014 said:
I’m talking about the shooter here in Canada who shot people in a mosque. But under this argument you’d also be saying that you don’t think Bin Lauden is responsible for the actions of Al Qaeda members who committed acts of terrorism inspired by his words or that the leaders of Isis aren’t responsible for the actions of their followers, also inspired by their words...except that you have no problem with the US sending drone strikes and seal teams to execute them. Presumably because you believe on some level that people should be held responsible for inciting violence through the words they speak as a leader of people.
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I absolutely have a problem with drone strikes and have said so, especially against the drone king Obama. I believe actual people who have been found to have committed crimes should be held responsible and nothing else so don't put your words in my mouth.

Are you seriously comparing Trump to Bin Laden with a straight and serious face? Bin Laden planned terrorist acts with other terrorists. I can no longer take anything you say with any kind of respect or seriousness. At this point it is all Trump Derangement Syndrome.
 
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cmd2014 said:
No, I’m talking about Trump. And the effect of his words. You and Red want to distract away from this with your argument about personal responsibility and the idea that only the actor matters (ie the person who carries through the idea), not the leader who created the idea and encouraged others to put it into action. I’m pointing out the hypocrisy of this argument when you clearly don’t apply it to anyone but Trump. The difference is that some leaders accept responsibility for their actions; others claim ignorance (or might in fact be too ignorant to understand the power of the position). Trump is not behaving in a responsible manner in regard to his rhetoric. I have not heard a single argument from you or Red or DF to dispute this. There’s been a lot of dodging and weaving and finger pointing at others, but no actual argument to support that he has not, in fact, said many things on multiple occasions that have encouraged violence (because he has). He has also clearly inspired people to put his ideas into action. Intentionally or not. So perhaps he should be held responsible for his actions, the way you suggest everyone else should be held accountable for theirs.
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I said there is plenty to go around but you refuse to acknowledge that fact. :hand:
 
redwood66 said:
Are you seriously comparing Trump to Bin Laden with a straight and serious face?
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Of course not. Bin Laden knew what he was doing and did it on purpose. I think Trump’s just an irresponsible narcissist who will do or say anything to keep himself in power. But both have pushed rhetoric that has resulted in people getting killed. I think Trump should at least own that. And his supporters should acknowledge it. Because those who keep voting for him will own a part of it too.
 
Tekate said:
And the cops killed him right? They did their duty. Is there a democrat that didn't support the way this thing went down? Who said democrats weren't shocked? Did Bernie Sander's speak of violence? https://www.cnn.com/2017/06/14/politics/bernie-sanders-baseball-shooting/index.html

Both the shooter and the bomber are obviously mentally ill. Rather than defund mental health services in America, let's FUND them.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Congressional_baseball_shooting

What else should the democrats have done? GMAFB.
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The bomber is obviously mentally ill? How? Do we have his mental illness history?

I haven’t heard anything that alludes to mental illness and until any of us do, comments such as these are stigmatizing.
 
Fixed things for ya MT.

the_mother_thing said:
So this thread was about what we now know is one person/terrorist (who is not Trump) but was influenced and inspired by Trump who targeted 10 (+/-/not including the duplicates) people with potentially explosive devices. I’m pretty sure we are all on the record as ‘in agreement’ that terrorism = bad, mmkay?

Then the discussion transitions into speculation as to why this person/terrorist did what he did. Naturally, the majority on here blame Trump’s rhetoric because ... well, TRUMMMMMPPP inspires his brethren to make fun of disabled people, inspires his acolytes to attack reporters, grab their pussy, punch them out, he told audience members he would pay their legal fees if they engaged in violence against protesters at his 'rally's, try not to hurt him. If you do, I'll defend you in court. Don't worry about it.", Any guy that can do a body slam, he is my type!" . :eek2:

So we have one ‘Republican’ and 10 or so Dems spewing hateful rhetoric (10 or more? facts or you are BSing), but we’re supposed to just ignore the 10 or so (some of which Dems are propping up for President in 2020 and one they already did in ‘16 and lost ‘bigly’ define bigly? oh you mean your candidate lost the people's vote, yes HE lost bigly) and only focus on the one because ‘Trump Triggers’, yes Trump triggers and it's very dangerous obviously because we now have nutcase right-wing idiots sending pipebombs thru the mail, some other liberal nonsense talking point hashtag?(eek this is a non sequitur) Even though those same 10 or so dems were also targets of the person/terrorist, right wing terrorist inspired by Trump to commit murder that started this whole shebang?

:hand: If you’re going to blame ‘rhetoric’, you don’t get to cherry pick the rhetoric being blamed when you don’t like the facts being laid out in such damning force,. NOR DO YOU, you don't get to use illogical thinking because it suits YOUR narrative.
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So in your little manifesto of defending the indefensible you are saying Trump does not encourage violence against democrats, that he's a swell fella! Also you add viperous ad hominem attacks for no reason other than I suppose it makes you feel 'bigly and good'.. Fact are facts, you can't change them, you can't spin them and you can't defend them with opinion.
 
We don't know for sure, but I surmised anyone who would do such a heinous crime is nutzoid, but he may be right as rain, but it seems crazy to me, as did the shooter who was killed at the baseball game in DC, or anger management issues for sure.

Not everyone who attempts murder is mentally ill for sure, but when something goes so totally out of the range of normal, it seems to me that they are mentally ill. I have a mentally deranged brother so I have seen attempted murder up close.

House Cat said:
The bomber is obviously mentally ill? How? Do we have his mental illness history?

I haven’t heard anything that alludes to mental illness and until any of us do, comments such as these are stigmatizing.
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And you refuse to acknowledge that Trump is the leader of the free world, the leader of the republican/conservative party, he's a LEADER.. Trump started this hate, yet you refuse to acknowledge this fact.

redwood66 said:
I said there is plenty to go around but you refuse to acknowledge that fact. :hand:
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Tekate said:
Fixed things for ya MT.



So in your little manifesto of defending the indefensible you are saying Trump does not encourage violence against democrats, that he's a swell fella! Also you add viperous ad hominem attacks for no reason other than I suppose it makes you feel 'bigly and good'.. Fact are facts, you can't change them, you can't spin them and you can't defend them with opinion.
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2F9388B5-035E-4F32-96E7-4CEA2C9E6198.jpeg
 
Tekate said:
We don't know for sure, but I surmised anyone who would do such a heinous crime is nutzoid, but he may be right as rain, but it seems crazy to me, as did the shooter who was killed at the baseball game in DC, or anger management issues for sure.

Not everyone who attempts murder is mentally ill for sure, but when something goes so totally out of the range of normal, it seems to me that they are mentally ill. I have a mentally deranged brother so I have seen attempted murder up close.
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There is bad character and there is mentally ill. You are not a psychiatrist who has met with this individual, therefore you are not qualified to diagnose him. Your comments are stigmatizing to those of us who have mental illness.

His actions reach far beyond what we consider normal. This does not automatically make him mentally ill.
 
Tekate said:
And you refuse to acknowledge that Trump is the leader of the free world, the leader of the republican/conservative party, he's a LEADER.. Trump started this hate, yet you refuse to acknowledge this fact.
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I refuse nothing of the sort, he is the leader of the free world whether you like him or not. He's also an ass who says stupid shit at times, which he should back off doing. He does not incite or direct people to make bombs, or wear masks while beating people in the streets, or harass people in public. People do this of their own volition and should be held accountable for it when they break the law. Trump made me do it is not a defense for acting like an idiot or doing illegal things. To use it sounds like a 5 year old blaming his brother. This goes for any person of any political party blaming another person for stupid shit they do.
 
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