shape
carat
color
clarity

Need Urgent Advice.

Cr3rApes

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 26, 2015
Messages
2
I used the info from this site to obtain what I thought was a nice diamond. GIA triple EX 1.53ct H SI1 eye clean. HCA was .6 with a 34/40.6 55% table. I proposed on Christmas Eve in front of her family and everything went well. Then she inquired about the details of the diamond and I told her. The shock on her face when she heard it was an SI1 was crushing. Her family members were also taken aback at that clarity. I tried explaining how it was a perfectly fine clarity grade and that GIA standards are well above those of others so it's more like a VS1. They simply disagree and insist I buy her a VS or better diamond.

I'm past my return window so the vendor only offers an upgrade policy but it requires the new diamond to be double the cost. This was a $10,000 diamond and I simply cannot afford to spend $20,000. I simply don't know what to do at this point. Do I try and sell it? How much could I get for it? If I could realistically get $7500 for so then I could get a loan for another $2500 and hopefully buy a slightly smaller VS2 diamond. I'm so dejected right now I just don't know what to do.
 

marymm

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 21, 2010
Messages
4,830
Gosh, I really feel for your situation.

Since you are past your return period, I wonder if it might be worthwhile to book an appointment for you and your GF with an independent professional appraiser in your area (one unconnected with a jewelry store/diamond sales) - https://www.pricescope.com/appraisers - so the professional can objectively evaluate your diamond and (hopefully) reassure both of you that your chosen diamond is eye-clean and a keeper?

Is the clarity issue a cultural and/or family thing for your GF? If so, it is too bad you weren't made aware of it prior to your proposal. If it is a nonnegotiable prereq for her/them, perhaps email some of the top PS diamond vendors to see if they would be willing to accept your diamond in trade towards another diamond with higher clarity? Not all upgrade policies are the same...
 

VRBeauty

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
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Apr 2, 2006
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10,636
marymm|1451172670|3966563 said:
Gosh, I really feel for your situation.

Since you are past your return period, I wonder if it might be worthwhile to book an appointment for you and your GF with an independent professional appraiser in your area (one unconnected with a jewelry store/diamond sales) - https://www.pricescope.com/appraisers - so the professional can objectively evaluate your diamond and (hopefully) reassure both of you that your chosen diamond is eye-clean and a keeper?

Is the clarity issue a cultural and/or family thing for your GF? If so, it is too bad you weren't made aware of it prior to your proposal. If it is a nonnegotiable prereq for her/them, perhaps email some of the top PS diamond vendors to see if they would be willing to accept your diamond in trade towards another diamond with higher clarity? Not all upgrade policies are the same...

Ditto everything marymm said. And maybe you and your fiancee need to have a conversation about size/color/clarity tradeoffs involved if you remain within your original budget, and the impacts on what will be your joint wedding/school/housing etc. costs if you decide to increase your ring budget.

PS has a "sell your diamond" option that allows you to post information about your diamond and then get offers from any jewelers or brokers who might be interested in buying it. Be sure to specify that your diamond has not been set (if that's the case). https://www.pricescope.com/sell-your-diamond

Good luck!
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225
Oh no. I'm sorry. Sounds like you ran into some cultural preconceptions.

I assume the vendor is JA?

How far past your return policy are you?
 

Travelgal

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 12, 2013
Messages
322
I would call the vendor you bought the stone from, explain your situation and see what they can do for you before I did anything else. They may be able to work with you on a solution that is better than taking a hit on the price you paid for the stone. I am so sorry to learn of her reaction and I wish you an successful remedy/outcome.
 

LLJsmom

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Oct 24, 2012
Messages
11,670
Can you talk to her about doing an ugrade at your first anniversary? Explain about the refund policy and that you would lose a lot of money to buy a higher clarity diamond now and you want to save as much as you can to not only buy a higher clarity diamond but a much larger one too. And then plan on tightening the belt significantly for the first year.
 

Gem Queen

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Mar 26, 2008
Messages
523
Maybe because it was a Christmas present, they will give you more time for a return or trade in without having to pay double.
I can't imagine how you must be feeling with the reaction of the family. Kind of takes away the excitement away about what the meaning was behind the ring. So sorry.
 

LLJsmom

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Oct 24, 2012
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11,670
And it will be so impressive for you to upgrade her significantly at the first anniversary. You need to buy yourself some time. It would be best if the vendor would make an exception in your situation. However if they don't, explain in as much detail to her family as you can the financial dilemma you find yourself in. Enlist their understanding and sympathy so they will be more reasonable with their demand for a higher clarity diamond right now. If they are that materialistic, then they will understand when you break it down into dollars. I don't mean to hurt your feelings by calling them materialistic (and I am too, I admit) but for them to demand this now after everything you spent five digits on a engagement ring is really BAD. I am so sorry you have been put into this position.
 

Andelain

Ideal_Rock
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Mar 10, 2010
Messages
3,525
OP, are you sure you want to marry into this family? I'm sorry to say this sort of thing, but this seems like a major red flag to me.
 

flyingpig

Ideal_Rock
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Nov 7, 2015
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2,941
Some cultures and families simply don't accept anything below 1.0 carat / I color / VS2 clarity. For some, it has to be from Tiffany or Cartier. My culture is similar; I heard many stories.

To avoid any disappointment, after I proposed, I reviewed all contents with her, including the AGS report and appraisal. The main purpose was to share my story with her, the search for the perfect diamond. At the same time, I wanted to ensure that she and her family were fine with the diamond's spec, especially 0.9 carat and J color. The parents were a bit surprised that the ring was bought online, but I explained. They were, and still are, just happy with the beauty of the diamond.

I would not call the family materialistic. I don't know what culture they are from. At least in my culture, we demand such things from each other, rather bluntly. At the time, you are obligated to give as well.


I really hope you find a good solution.
 

Sphene

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jan 4, 2015
Messages
666
Cultural what a load of lol - Cultural is when the hands of a marrying couple are bound with cloth - when a couple jump a broom - when a centuries old rain dance is performed - not an ungrateful GF and family insisting on a diamonds specifications lol

Dump her plain and simple save you a lot of hassle in the future
 

alamana

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Sep 18, 2015
Messages
195
Andelain|1451201137|3966689 said:
OP, are you sure you want to marry into this family? I'm sorry to say this sort of thing, but this seems like a major red flag to me.

+1 to this. I'd advise anyone I know to trade her in (along with her whole family) instead of the diamond.
 

gm89uk

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
May 26, 2015
Messages
1,487
Just send the diamond to egl for a precert and get the vs1. The GIA can be your little secret
 

packrat

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 12, 2008
Messages
10,614
Then get her a smaller diamond w/the exact specs they demand. If you have a certain amount to spend, and there are stringent requirements for her and her family's acceptance, get what they demand, in the price point you have. They have their requirements, and you have yours--your *budget*. Goes both ways, yes?

I would also find out if there are other requirements/expectations/demands for the wedding, honeymoon, home, vehicles, etc. If their culture demands she drive a Mercedes rather than a BMW or the Toyota or heaven forbid, Chevy, of the common, lesser thought of folk, it would behoove you to be aware of this.

Sorry to be a smartass about it but jeezalou... "I love you but that's not to OUR standards, you must do this and that and the other to be worthy" kinda frosts me.
 

Gem Queen

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Mar 26, 2008
Messages
523
I'm so glad we are all on the same page.
I think I would ask the parents to buy her the ring themselves!
 

tyty333

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Dec 17, 2008
Messages
24,614
Maybe someone has a smaller stone with the specs you need that they would be willing to trade for your bigger stone.
Its a far stretch but you could ask in the pre-loved forum. I wonder what is the smallest your setting could handle.

If you bought from JA (you didnt say), I thought they had extended returns through the holidays?

I would certainly go back to your original vendor and beg, plead, grovel...whatever it takes to get the specs you need.
I certainly would go down in size though. That demanding thing works both ways in that it should fit into your original budget
as someone stated above.
 

yennyfire

Ideal_Rock
Trade
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Jun 6, 2010
Messages
6,760
I'm so sorry that what should have been a joyous occasion was ruined. It sounds like you hadn't discussed diamonds with your GF at all and had no idea that she and her family felt this way? Either way, I think it's terrible that they responded this way. The stone sounds like a beauty.

I agree that I'd call the vendor and ask to speak to a manager and see if they can help you out. Explain to your GF that to go up in clarity, you'll have to go down in size. She needs to understand that going in.
.

Good luck with everything....for what it's worth, I too would hesitate to marry into this family.
 

pyramid

Ideal_Rock
Premium
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Nov 10, 2002
Messages
4,607
Run. It is between you and her and nothing to do with the family, at least in the UK it is. No way would I want to marry that.
 

mrs-b

Ideal_Rock
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Aug 18, 2013
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9,793
Hmmmm.

As people have noted, some cultures simply have these requirements. To them, anything less is an insult. However, I'm guessing that this is a cross-cultural marriage since her requirements aren't the same as yours. So compromise will have to ensue. And if this ISN'T a cross-cultural marriage and this is just 'I want what I want because I want it', then a great deal more compromise will need to occur. So this is a pretty good test case of how things will be for the future.

You bought her a lovely diamond. The diamond in my profile photo is also an H SI1, and it's a GORGEOUS diamond. You can't return it and you can't afford to upgrade it at this point. Taking out a loan or trying to sell for a hefty price drop is a mug's game, and I definitely wouldn't recommend it. So - you tried to meet HER expectations, and failed. YOU also had expectations as to what her response would be - and SHE failed. So we're 50/50 so far. And here's where the compromise kicks in....

Make it clear to her that she didn't meet your expectations any more than you met hers. Explain you have no options at this point to upgrade her stone. Ask if she has any suggestions. As I see it, you could do one of 4 things without decimating your bank account; 1) do nothing and she could grow to appreciate the effort and hard work that went into her ring, 2) put in money herself since she has her own, personal, extra requirements above and beyond a certifiably beautiful stone, 3) get her onto Pricescope so she can learn rather more about diamonds than she currently does, or 4) offer her an upgrade in 2, 3, 4 (substitute the timeframe of your choice) years when you've both had the time to save for it.

At this point in life, what you want should be more important to her than what her parents want. If this is not the case, and if she is unwilling to work with you on a reasonable compromise, do consider that in whatever you do next. And I definitely agree with the poster who suggested you find out what other expectations may be attached to your married life by her and/or her family; you don't want to go through your entire marriage feeling exactly the way you do right now.

In summary - be kind, be respectful, be willing to work on a compromise - but remember the effort you made and that engagement rings are a gift - not a requirement, and expect the same kindness, respect and flexibility in return. If you don't get it, consider it a preview to your future.
 

mrs-b

Ideal_Rock
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9,793
Pyramid|1451242019|3966868 said:
How is an H acceptable then?

I suspect it isn't. And I'm guessing that VS2 won't cut it either. I think the lady in question wants something more in the colorless range and VVS clarity, probably at the same size. I'm guessing the OP will be on the hook for exactly what he expects money-wise; something in the 20k range with colorless VVS stats - probably around 1.75/1.8ct.

Ergo I think upgrading in some years is probably the way forward.
 

marcy

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Feb 27, 2007
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24,886
Cr3rApes, I am sorry this happened to you. I am sure the diamond you picked is a beautiful and eye clean diamond. I think you've been given some good advice here to sift through and think about. If I was in your situation I'd contact who you bought it from and see what they can do for you. If they agree to let you exchange it without going up in price then I'd let your fiance pick her own diamond sticking to your price range. If that vendor won't work with you then I'd tell your fiance you tried but unless you can find somewhere else to get 10K back out of that diamond that is all you can give her right now. I'd also level with her how you feel about their harsh reaction to you diamond. I hope things work out for you.
 

sonice

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 27, 2015
Messages
42
I'm so, so sorry this has happened to you. I agree that this diamond sounds beautiful - it's actually nearly exactly what I'm looking for currently. As others have said, maybe the return window can be extended (or even already is for the holidays). If not, losing money selling it to someone isn't ideal, so maybe your fiancé is willing to accept the stone for a bit and wait until you're able to trade in and purchase a different diamond, willing to contribute funds for the purchase of a new diamond, etc.. Best of luck to you!
 

LLJsmom

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
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Oct 24, 2012
Messages
11,670
Dear OP, your situation is one of the most heart breaking stories I have heard on PS. I shared your post with my DH, and here is his response. I thought maybe a man's perspective might be helpful.

I sympathize with you greatly and no one should be placed in such a position when it comes to matters of the heart. You were robbed of your moment especially when you consider the time, energy, and care that you put into finding the right stone and setting. This is not to mention your thoughtful proposal during Christmas Eve. What's even more amazing is your immediate response -- your desire to fix the situation. That is very telling of your genuine love for this woman. Most people would be enraged with anger, but you feel dejected and are taking it upon yourself to remedy the situation.

Although I do not know the entire context of your relationship, are you able to get past this situation? Whether you're able to upgrade now (or later), the question is whether this experience puts a blemish on your relationship that can never be fully healed. I get it. There's eye clean and there's mind clean. Some people can't get past the GIA grading which is fine; it's being OCD with your bling. You can't blame a girl for that. If it's just that -- mind clean -- then there's for sure a path for an upgrade.

The real issue is the response you received in return for your sincerity. There may be larger ramifications as the years go by. You need to think if you are able to get past this for the sake of yourself and for your marriage. If not, it's going to hover over your relationship for a very long time preventing the relationship from growing and thriving. If you can move forward, you can figure out the upgrade plan because that's just a tactical process.
 

Andelain

Ideal_Rock
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Mar 10, 2010
Messages
3,525
^^^ Great post!

The thing that stands out to me is that nothing the OP does is likely to ever bee good enough for her and her family. He'll be treated that way time and time again.
 

gr8leo87

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Apr 24, 2015
Messages
381
I'd never give this advice to anyone but since you already have a GIA - May be an EGL certificate can save you (A).
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
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57,957
This may be the most important lesson you ever learn about communication in marriage. It is hard for me to understand proposing to someone who has such stringent requirements for a diamond yet you two never even discussed the subject (even in general)??? From here on out, never buy her anything unless you have attained her approval or asked her requirements first (just letting her pick it out is best). (I actually have very stringent requirements for diamonds myself! But my husband knows not to buy me a diamond without my approval first!)

I have to think the vendor will work with you if you are just slightly past the return period. (I hope newbies here read this a realize the importance in proposing before the end of the return period!) If they don't, then use 75% buyback from your vendor and start over...making sure she understands that the budget is smaller and a diamond with higher color and clarity will mean closer to 1 ct rather than 1.5 cts.
 

HegemonyCricket

Shiny_Rock
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282
mrs-blop|1451241932|3966866 said:
So - you tried to meet HER expectations, and failed. YOU also had expectations as to what her response would be - and SHE failed. So we're 50/50 so far. And here's where the compromise kicks in....

In summary - be kind, be respectful, be willing to work on a compromise - but remember the effort you made and that engagement rings are a gift - not a requirement, and expect the same kindness, respect and flexibility in return. If you don't get it, consider it a preview to your future.

This is good relationship advice in general.
 
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