Mall Diamond Clarity and Suggestions

[farrahlyn]

I just wanted to echo some of the statements above. There have been several convos here about ladies in the medical field and the type of ring that is condusive to being worn with gloves. Many tend to go with a bezel or a very low set ring. another option is to wear her e-ring on a necklace while working and there are necklaces exactly for that purpose (that the ring can slide right on and safely stay on, without taking off the necklace) like these:
https://emilyc.com/

I thought of Victor Canera, his halos are incredible and you have the budget for it, you're not trying to maximize the stone size since her finger is SO tiny and she prefers a halo. I think a 1.2ct stone or around there is a great size for what you need.
https://www.victorcanera.com/rings/engagement?type=halo

 

[LLJsmom]

Please don’t go to Zales or Kay. You’ve got such a nice budget. You could get something that you would both really love and that is worthy of the money that you want to spend. @farrahlyn ‘s suggestion of Victor Canera is a great idea. See this thread for his halos and just call him to talk to him. I have had four rings made by him and have traveled to Los Angeles to meet him in person. He’s super nice and patient and he will be happy to talk to you personally on the phone as well. All his pieces are hand forged, literally hand made, no molds, no casting.
https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/post-your-victor-canera-beauties-here.175281/

There are many more wonderful artists that VERY picky PSers use but in this instance I am recommending only him because he is the only one I have personally met and worked with. He works with people via phone, email, etc. he cuts his own super ideal diamonds and does hand forged platinum settings. The thread above will show many examples of his work and links to individual threads where each owner has showcased the ring. In any case, please consider some of the other online vendors that others have mentioned. Ask any questions about them. If you talk to Victor, better yet ask him yourself.

Here is his website. He is also on instagram. If you call him, ask to speak to him directly. He has an assistant Nicholas who is nice but you get more specific questions answered by Victor. If you call him later in the day, after 4-5 PST, he often answers the phone himself. Give it a try. Won’t cost you a thing.
https://www.victorcanera.com/

 

[JordanM]

Thank you all for your suggestions. I defiantly will not be buying the ring from a mall and I know how pushy the people at Zales can be. Pearlman's got back with me today and this is what they sent me. I will also contact victor and see what he suggests.

Hello Jordan,

We have a ring that is very similar. I have attached a picture.

The ring features G+ color grade diamond with VS clarity

The price for the mounting in 18k white gold is $3,250.
The price for the mounting in platinum is $3,700.


I have found a center diamond that would be great for this ring.
Here are the specs:
Shape Round
Carat size 1.51
Clarity - VS2
Color - G
Measurements 7.38-7.42x4.51
Price - $10,545

I have attached the GIA report for this diamond

Also if you click on this url you can see the diamond in a 360 degree view.
https://v360.in/movie/59_1874

Let me know what you think.
Best regards,
Geoff

 

[redwood66]

I second everyone's thoughts. Please don't spend your very nice budget at Kay's or Jared's. Victor is a wonderful person to work with and will work within your budget. There are other very capable vendors on PS as well and I have used several of them including Victor. Excited to see what you decide.

 

[rockysalamander]

Thank you all for your suggestions. I defiantly will not be buying the ring from a mall and I know how pushy the people at Zales can be. Pearlman's got back with me today and this is what they sent me. I will also contact victor and see what he suggests.

Hello Jordan,

We have a ring that is very similar. I have attached a picture.

The ring features G+ color grade diamond with VS clarity

The price for the mounting in 18k white gold is $3,250.
The price for the mounting in platinum is $3,700.


I have found a center diamond that would be great for this ring.
Here are the specs:
Shape Round
Carat size 1.51
Clarity - VS2
Color - G
Measurements 7.38-7.42x4.51
Price - $10,545

I have attached the GIA report for this diamond

Also if you click on this url you can see the diamond in a 360 degree view.
https://v360.in/movie/59_1874

Let me know what you think.
Best regards,
Geoff

Did Perlman's confirm that they can make the setting, from scratch, in your girls size. That they would NOT resize it down from a 4 or 4.5? I think it is well worth getting a quote from David Klass and Victor Canera to get a custom setting that is the same. As noted by others, the setting is not one that most in the medical field would suggest or be allowed to wear...but your girl must know her work environ.

Its a 60/60 style diamond, but has a poor CA/PA combination and the CA is plain just too low. Given the strong florescence for a G colored diamond, the price is about right. IF you want them to find a diamond, tell they you only want to see diamonds that have the following:

These are the measurements to help stay in Ideal range with GIA stones:
table: 54-58
depth: 60-62.3
crown angle: 34-35 (sometimes 35.5)
pavillion angle: 40.6-40.9

Anything with an HCA score 2 or less, then you'll want an IS (idealscope) or ASET image to look at light return. https://www.pricescope.com/tools/hca

For 60/60 stones, like that posted, you still need a balanced CA/PA within the same ranges as noted above...and know they will tend to have more white light return than rainbow flashes or fire. In addition to performance differences, 60/60 diamonds look a bit different. They tend to have a more prominent culet. You can see it is like someone took the arrows and pulled them outward from the center. But, in my example below, 60/60 on left - ideal on right, you can see they are both still crisp with a clear pattern.

I prefer these, just note that the G color and high clarity are driving this budget such that finding thing in your criteria and budget are quite difficult. I'm showing you a range of options including shifting amount color and clarity:
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...rat-g-color-vs1-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-4297756 {inhouse at JA, Perlman's likely cannot call it}
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...h-color-vs1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-3593410 {dropped color to H to show you some good options}
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...-color-vvs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-4044425
https://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond-search/1.23-Round-EX-AGS-G-SI1-diamond-stock-13702-cert-
https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3947699.htm
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...g-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-3244324

 

[JordanM]

Thank you for all your expertise!
Yes, Pearlmans said that they would have to custom make it.

I will contact David Klass.

Victor Canera said:
Hi Jordan,
I wanted to confirm that you were looking for a round diamond? A round (especial a precision cut Super Ideal - Hearts and Arrows stone) would be much more than $15k just for the diamond. For example, here are some 1.5ct G-VS2 which is your minimum requirement: https://www.victorcanera.com/diamon...nCarat=1.50&maxCarat=1.59&color=g&clarity=vs2
A double halo would add a few thousand to the cost of the diamond.
Some thing we could do to keep this in budget would be to adjust the quality of a 1.5ct diamond OR move slightly below 1.5ct.

 

[redwood66]

Thank you for all your expertise!
Yes, Pearlmans said that they would have to custom make it.

I will contact David Klass.

Victor Canera said:
Hi Jordan,
I wanted to confirm that you were looking for a round diamond? A round (especial a precision cut Super Ideal - Hearts and Arrows stone) would be much more than $15k just for the diamond. For example, here are some 1.5ct G-VS2 which is your minimum requirement: https://www.victorcanera.com/diamon...nCarat=1.50&maxCarat=1.59&color=g&clarity=vs2
A double halo would add a few thousand to the cost of the diamond.
Some thing we could do to keep this in budget would be to adjust the quality of a 1.5ct diamond OR move slightly below 1.5ct.

The G color and the clarity is really what is causing the problem with Victor's stones. What about this one? @rockysalamander is that issue on the edge at 3:00 really an issue?

https://www.victorcanera.com/diamonds/ags104096334006-1.301-f-si1-ideal-hearts-arrows-round

Having used David Klass extensively, I would have him do the setting but not source the stone if you expect to have ideal scope, ASETs, videos, etc.

 

[rockysalamander]

The G color is really what is causing the problem with Victor's stones. It is overkill and money wasted that could be put to size and cut.

https://www.victorcanera.com/diamonds/ags104096334006-1.301-f-si1-ideal-hearts-arrows-round

Having used David Klass extensively, I would have him do the setting but not source the stone if you expect to have ideal scope, ASETs, videos, etc.

Totally agree. We help find diamond if you go to DK.

 

[redwood66]

Totally agree. We help find diamond if you go to DK.

Hey see my edit above.

 

[JordanM]

Victor said if I drop to H these are the options that I have:
https://www.victorcanera.com/diamonds?shape=hearts-arrows-round&minCarat=1.30&maxCarat=1.59&color=h

 

[redwood66]

You are in good hands with the people here and they will help you immensely.

 

[LLJsmom]

I love Victor’s stones, mostly cause they are super ideal. I would consider any one of them and decide based on your budget. His double halos are perfection. If you decide to go with David Klass, I would still consider a stone from Whiteflash, which is also a super ideal. Or you can get one from Victor as well. You have lots of options. If you do decide on getting a stone from Victor you get a slight discount on the setting but I forget how much though you guys probablyndiscussed that.

 

[LLJsmom]

Did Perlman's confirm that they can make the setting, from scratch, in your girls size. That they would NOT resize it down from a 4 or 4.5? I think it is well worth getting a quote from David Klass and Victor Canera to get a custom setting that is the same. As noted by others, the setting is not one that most in the medical field would suggest or be allowed to wear...but your girl must know her work environ.

Its a 60/60 style diamond, but has a poor CA/PA combination and the CA is plain just too low. Given the strong florescence for a G colored diamond, the price is about right. IF you want them to find a diamond, tell they you only want to see diamonds that have the following:

These are the measurements to help stay in Ideal range with GIA stones:
table: 54-58
depth: 60-62.3
crown angle: 34-35 (sometimes 35.5)
pavillion angle: 40.6-40.9

Anything with an HCA score 2 or less, then you'll want an IS (idealscope) or ASET image to look at light return. https://www.pricescope.com/tools/hca

For 60/60 stones, like that posted, you still need a balanced CA/PA within the same ranges as noted above...and know they will tend to have more white light return than rainbow flashes or fire. In addition to performance differences, 60/60 diamonds look a bit different. They tend to have a more prominent culet. You can see it is like someone took the arrows and pulled them outward from the center. But, in my example below, 60/60 on left - ideal on right, you can see they are both still crisp with a clear pattern.

I prefer these, just note that the G color and high clarity are driving this budget such that finding thing in your criteria and budget are quite difficult. I'm showing you a range of options including shifting amount color and clarity:
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...rat-g-color-vs1-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-4297756 {inhouse at JA, Perlman's likely cannot call it}
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...h-color-vs1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-3593410 {dropped color to H to show you some good options}
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...-color-vvs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-4044425
https://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond-search/1.23-Round-EX-AGS-G-SI1-diamond-stock-13702-cert-
https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3947699.htm
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...g-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-3244324

@rockysalamander You Rock. Your analysis is always so thorough.

 

[Gussie]

@rockysalamander have to second that! I always read your thorough explanations and suggestions - learning so much! Thanks!

 

[WillyDiamond]

OP
........
Good luck

 

[rockysalamander]

I've been thinking about your situation. My feeling from her pinterest is that there are a lot of settings she may like, but I'm betting she actually likes only elements of them or does not really know what she wants given the diversity of what I'm seeing. Based on those images, my advise is to NOT buy her a halo now. I would suggest you focus on the diamond and a very pretty solitaire setting. Then, after she says "yes" and you are chatting, tell her that you want her to work with you to pick her dream setting. Let it be something that you do together and make decisions about the overall size on her finger, the type of pave, gallery details, flush wedding band or not, etc. I fear that you could spend a lot of money on a setting that lacks "the" details she is focused on. I know I would much rather my DH did this when he asked me (as I received a lovely, buy wholly impractical setting that I only wore on rare occasions during our engagement and not since).

She won't be disappointed that you "only" gave her a 1.5 carat diamond. Really! I just can't see spending $3k+ on a custom setting that may not be her dream setting. Not matter how well made and crafted, she may not love it. And the settings she likes are all about the details. I think this approach has an added benefit...she will have a chance to actually wear a soli with a substantial diamond at work and come to a informed opinion about what she wants to wear daily. I think this could shift her thinking and change what she wants, or, she'll be 100% sure. Either way, you'll have a clear direction and ensure she gets her dream ring.

The "dream engagement" is you asking her in a meaningful way and offering her a stunning ring that sparkles like mad -- with meaningful even if brief words (while on bent knee if she's traditionally minded).

 

[TreeScientist]

I've been thinking about your situation. My feeling from her pinterest is that there are a lot of settings she may like, but I'm betting she actually likes only elements of them or does not really know what she wants given the diversity of what I'm seeing. Based on those images, my advise is to NOT buy her a halo now. I would suggest you focus on the diamond and a very pretty solitaire setting. Then, after she says "yes" and you are chatting, tell her that you want her to work with you to pick her dream setting. Let it be something that you do together and make decisions about the overall size on her finger, the type of pave, gallery details, flush wedding band or not, etc. I fear that you could spend a lot of money on a setting that lacks "the" details she is focused on. I know I would much rather my DH did this when he asked me (as I received a lovely, buy wholly impractical setting that I only wore on rare occasions during our engagement and not since).

She won't be disappointed that you "only" gave her a 1.5 carat diamond. Really! I just can't see spending $3k+ on a custom setting that may not be her dream setting. Not matter how well made and crafted, she may not love it. And the settings she likes are all about the details. I think this approach has an added benefit...she will have a chance to actually wear a soli with a substantial diamond at work and come to a informed opinion about what she wants to wear daily. I think this could shift her thinking and change what she wants, or, she'll be 100% sure. Either way, you'll have a clear direction and ensure she gets her dream ring.

The "dream engagement" is you asking her in a meaningful way and offering her a stunning ring that sparkles like mad -- with meaningful even if brief words (while on bent knee if she's traditionally minded).

I agree with this. You could pick out a cheap temporary solitaire setting for now and choose the setting that fits her wants/needs together after you propose. Who knows, she may end up wanting a more simple setting once she finds out how high-maintenance a halo setting would be while working in the medical field.

 

[tyty333]

Rockysalamander makes a good point. Proposing with a beautiful diamond in a temp setting then the two of you working on finding a setting that
she loves and looks great on her petite finger would be the ultimate engagement experience for Pricescopers. That way she has input on whether
she gets a Victor Canera () or a David Klass (also lovely) or some other setting. You'll know that she loves it because she helped pick it out.
Something to consider.

Temp setting...
https://www.jamesallen.com/engageme...nife-edge-solitaire-engagement-ring-item-7115
https://www.jamesallen.com/engageme...ld-presentation-solitaire-six-prong-item-7990

 

[SimoneDi]

I have a different perspective on the setting. Based on her Pinterest, to me it is very clear what she wants- she wants a round center in double cushion halo and an intricate shank (braided shank). I bet that if OP goes for a similar design, she would love it. Something like this perhaps:

I would not go for a temp setting. Someone like us (PSers) would love the idea of a temp setting because I find that most of us are very particular about the settings we want. However, “normal” people just want to get an engagement ring similar to what they like and just wear it and show it to their friends. I think that if OP goes for a double halo, braided shank design his SO will be extremely pleased. I would love to see the design executed by VC, but if he is out of budget, I bet that DK will do a fab job!

 

[JordanM]

Thanks for your opinions. I know she would love whatever I get her especially as long as it is similar to the designs. I will decide after we go to Zales for her next cleaning and she sees how high up a double halo with a 1.5 in the center would be if she thinks it will be practical.

Victor came back and said:
Hi Jordan,
The photos you sent had a few different type of halos.
I think this piece would be a very nice option: https://www.victorcanera.com/rings/engagement/the-emilya-with-cushion-two-row-pave-halo
We do very fine pave work here at VC.
Also, we can mix and match different parts of rings together to make the final ring uniquely yours.

And David Klass said:
Hi Jordan,
These are some beautiful ring choices. I can make the mounting in solid 14k white gold with natural G color, VS quality round brilliant diamonds for $2450. The price includes setting your center stone, insured return 2nd day shipping within the US. The ring will take on average 35 days to make. You do not pay anything until a project is complete and you have approved of the pictures. Please let me know if you would like me to draw up any designs or if you need more quotes. For the center diamond, I have found some of the G color, VS2 clarity below choices. I have included the GIA numbers that you can look up online and all triple excellent round brilliants. Thanks David
1.60ct (GIA 2267465057) $12,500
1.51ct (GIA 218573409 $12,000
1.54ct (GIA 1223866487) $12,575
1.58ct (GIA 1182133074) $12,720
1.51ct (GIA 1258817604) $12,315
1.58ct (GIA 725145011 $12,900

Pearlmans said: Hi Jordan,

The head of the ring will sit approximately 6.5mm above the finger.

I hope this helps.
Let me know what you're thinking.

 

[farrahlyn]

I agree with @SimoneDi with the details of what she likes. That really stood out to me in her pinterest photos. And some ladies want to be surprised with a ring so they can brag to their friends, "he picked it out all by himself, didn't he do great?!" IMO, unless she says explicitly that she wants to help choose the setting, do your due diligence and find out specifically what she wants..... If she prefers a larger stone and double halo or if a smaller stone works for her..... double halo vs single halo...... pave band vs a split shank or braided band.... DK or VC are both great options depending on final budget and wants.

LOVE the setting VC suggested, it was one i thought would suit her well too. it's a double row of pave but that second row is just tucked around on the side. I do wish though that the band was a little more intricate based on some of her pinterest photos, like a split shank or a braided shank. And again, i think a 1.2ct size stone is PLENTY big for her tiny tiny finger especially when haloed. Just my $.02!

 

[JordanM]

Thank you for your opinions. That was also my thought. Is VC higher quality work than DK? Or are his cuts just better?
I had already contacted them about doing braided and this is the braided options they have:
https://www.victorcanera.com/search?phrase=braided#cmp=egrt&p_key=j0131m

 

[LLJsmom]

I am biased for VC’s workmanship. But just in comparing his pave work with others, I would be hard pressed to find a vendor that I prefer to him. VC cuts his own stones, and they are considered super ideal cuts, meaning top cut stones. DK does not cut his own stones and sources them from the market, so those are not considered super ideal cuts. You pay a premium for VC’s super ideal cuts but to a cut nut, like me, I would be willing to pay the premium because I feel like I can see the difference. There are others who will not pay the premium for various reasons. Some people can see the difference and don’t think it’s worth it and some can’t see the difference at all. It’s a very personal decision.

I have asked that question before. I will post he thread if I can find it.

 

[rockysalamander]

1.60ct (GIA 2267465057) $12,500. NO. CA too high.
1.51ct (GIA 218573409 $12,000, can't read number
1.54ct (GIA 1223866487) $12,575. NO. CA too low
1.58ct (GIA 1182133074) $12,720. NO. CA too low
1.51ct (GIA 1258817604) $12,315 NO. CA too low
1.58ct (GIA 725145011 $12,900 can't read number

You want to look at diamonds within these ranges for GIA 3X. GIA rounds several angles, so this step #1.
Depth 60-62.3 %
Table 54-58% {I personally prefer the smaller tables}
Pavilion 40.6-41 degrees
Crown 34-35 degrees (sometimes up to 35.5ish with idealscope image)

34 crown pairs better with 41 pav and 35 crown pairs better with 40.6.

Run anything within those parameters in the HCA tool (below). Anything with HCA less than 2 is worth pursuing. I also look at the AGSL Proportion chart to help with 60/60 and some atypical combos. Anything still in the running, you can request and IS or ASET. If you are looking at super-ideals (VC, WF, HPD), don't bother with these ranges. The analysis is really based on preferences.
https://www.pricescope.com/tools/hca

Did you look at the ones posted upthread? Any thoughts on those?

On the setting, if you decided to buy one in the halo style posted, then I agree with others that the shank needs to be more intricate.

 

[JordanM]

Yes, the ones you posted above are really nice, however being a completely newbie and not understanding how the factors play into the table I'm not really sure what I'm looking at. I'm also not really sure what to look for in an idealscope, so I may rely on you guys for that and finding the best center stone once I get the size nailed down. DK is making a drawing and said he can even make a model of it as well. Why do the parameters not apply when dealing with a super ideal cut like VC?
I know with "her" the more sparkle the better. I'm guessing these super ideal cuts have the most sparkle?

 

[HappyNewLife]

IF I was a halo girl, I'd hands-down do the Victor Canera Emilya. The double halo cushion shaped Emilya looks so pretty!

 

[LLJsmom]

Here is the thread on super ideals and whether people would pay for it. There are a number of vendors that cut them, each with their proprietary cut. Victor is one. Whiteflash. Brian Gavin Diamonds. Good old gold. Crafted by infinity. Who did I miss?

I am suggesting Victor because for you it would be a one stop shop if you are seriously considering his halo settings. The discount on the setting is nice too.

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/would-you-spend-extra-on-a-super-ideal.234492/

There must be more threads on super ideals, and really what makes them such. Can some people please help link? Thank you!!

 

[whitewave]

It is my dream to have a VC ring. You can't go wrong working with VC.

(Although I will likely work with DK in the future)

 

[Octo2005]

Then, given her profession and choice of ring style, I recommend a vendor who specializes in this type of work/setting. Lots of vendors sell this multi-stone setting but not all are equivalent.

cheers--Sharon

+1

I second what Sharon said. I am a nurse and there is no way that she could wear a ring like the photos that you posted while at work, unless she is in research/education or some setting that is not clinical. I would suggest that you plan on purchasing a nice chain for her to place her ring on and wear while working. That is what I used to do.

Congrats on your upcoming engagement!

 

[mrs-b]

I think either Victor Canera or David Klass Jewelry would do an excellent job for you. I've worked with both and they are both wonderful companies and extremely easy to deal with.

For workmanship, I think it's now a close run thing. A year ago, I would have said VC was better, but DKJ has recently put on some wonderful setters and 2 bench workers who specialize in micro pave, and the standard of their work is wonderful.

But here's my reservation....

A 1.5ct stone in a double halo will be at LEAST 14mm wide - and possibly more like 15mm. This is a HUGE ring - and I think it would look very unbalanced on her finger, and definitely not something she could wear to work. With all that micro pave (that's all the tiny stones), continual hand-washing and glove putting-on-and-taking-off would likely tear some tiny stones out in prompt order. And did I mention this would be HUGE?

I see a number of split shank bands in your links. There is no way she'd see those on a ring that large, as they would go immediately down the sides of her finger. I think for a 3.5 sized finger, it will be more aesthetically pleasing and more wearable in a work setting if she went with something a little bit...less. 1.5 as a center stone would look fabulous on her hand - but all that pave and bells and whistles? You might end up with the ring wearing her, rather than the other way around.

These rings cost a bunch. So re-making them a year down the track if the style doesn't work out for her would be very expensive. My best suggestion would be to go with DKJ, who will happily make you a wax model of the ring that your girl can try on, so she can check proportions and general size on the finger. Victor doesn't offer this. So - given the sort of ring you're considering, the size of your girl's finger, and the style in which she's interested, I'd be going with DKJ on this one to save some money and to have the opportunity to get some idea of relative size-to-hand.

If you still want to go with VC's stones (and I LOVE VC's stones and have had a couple of them) VC and DKJ are a half a block apart in LA. You can buy a stone at VC, and someone from DKJ will walk around the block to pick it up. So no shipping risk. That convenience is a pretty powerful combo that works in the buyer's favor.

Good luck!