Jewelers mutual claim

[Mallory]

I chipped the tip of my pear engagement ring and filed a claim that was approved. Our jeweler began to look for a replacement diamond. My original stone is a 1.5 H SI2 with dimensions of 10.65 to 6.56. The dimensions make the stone appear to be closer to a 1.7 carat. When replacing the stone, JM is trying to get us to agree to a 1.5 with much smaller dimensions. The new 1.5 allegedly fits my setting, but I am so unwilling to settle for a much smaller looking stone. Our jeweler was able to find a 1.6 with dimensions almost exact to my original stone, but says JM will not agree to replace with this stone. I guess my question is, do I have to settle for this 1.5 stone with smaller dimensions? I know we can always pay the cost difference to upgrade, but if the claim of JM is to produce a new piece of jewelry that is virtually indistinguishable from the old one..they are not living up to that. I could very clearly tell the size difference between the smaller 1.5 and my original 1.5 (despite the broken tip).

 

[Krisking]

You could keep looking for a 1.5 with your more spready dimensions, but insurance won't replace a 1.5 with a 1.7 (or a less expensive stone with a more expensive stone) without compromising on other attributes.

 

[kmoro]

You could keep looking for a 1.5 with your more spready dimensions, but insurance won't replace a 1.5 with a 1.7 (or a less expensive stone with a more expensive stone) without compromising on other attributes.

I was just going to say the same thing. They are obviously hung up on the c’s of the original. I would suggest you shop around until you find one that you think is a good replacement, within the fair market value of your old one. When using a value table, there are no increases/decreases for face up size. Maybe the insurance company will let you pay the difference for the larger carat weight stone.

 

[Bron357]

The problem you have is the insurance coverage that specifies a carat weight not a size. This is the normal business practice. So their obligation is only to replace a 1.5 carat diamond with another 1.5 carat diamond.
Your problem is you had an unusual “spready pear” for its carat weight so all you can really do is continue looking for a 1.5 carat pear that is likewise spready or ask them if you can take a $$$ payout and then spend the time and effort it might take to find a similar pear in size specs to the one you unfortunately damaged.

 

[Mallory]

The problem you have is the insurance coverage that specifies a carat weight not a size. This is the normal business practice. So their obligation is only to replace a 1.5 carat diamond with another 1.5 carat diamond.
Your problem is you had an unusual “spready pear” for its carat weight so all you can really do is continue looking for a 1.5 carat pear that is likewise spready or ask them if you can take a $$$ payout and then spend the time and effort it might take to find a similar pear in size specs to the one you unfortunately damaged.

I thought JM only does replacement and not payout?

 

[ice empress]

I can’t advise on the specifics of your insurance policy, but what the others are saying sounds quite reasonable, in that JM will replace your stone with another with the same carat weight and not a heavier/larger or more expensive one.

In any case, I’m real sorry you’re going through this... doesn’t sound like a pleasant experience. IMO, unless you’re willing to chip in for an upgrade, it might be best to wait for a 1.5 carat with similar dimensions as your original stone to come along. Hopefully that doesn’t take too long...

Any idea how the stone got chipped? I ask because I wonder just how fragile diamonds are, and just how careful I might need to be myself...

 

[SimoneDi]

OP, you can pay the difference to get a larger stone. JM will pay out only the replacement value.

 

[Mallory]

I can’t advise on the specifics of your insurance policy, but what the others are saying sounds quite reasonable, in that JM will replace your stone with another with the same carat weight and not a heavier/larger or more expensive one.

In any case, I’m real sorry you’re going through this... doesn’t sound like a pleasant experience. IMO, unless you’re willing to chip in for an upgrade, it might be best to wait for a 1.5 carat with similar dimensions as your original stone to come along. Hopefully that doesn’t take too long...

Any idea how the stone got chipped? I ask because I wonder just how fragile diamonds are, and just how careful I might need to be myself...

Our jeweler said the new 1.6 replacement would be an additional 2k to upgrade. Neither of us are willing to shell that much out. I’ve only had the ring a little more than a year.

I dropped the ring on our porcelain tile floor. It fell “just right” on the tip of the pear to chip. There is a halo on the setting but no prong on the tip. Pretty awful situation all around lol. My jeweler can’t figure out how it happened. I know it happened in that instance because I was picking up fragments of the diamond from the floor

 

[blueMA]

Wow that's a steep upgrade price for a 0.1 ct size increase, but the diamond could be a much better stone in specs for a better performance. You'd have to decide whether that's worth it or keep looking around that range.

You'd be surprised how many people get shocked by their diamond chipping unexpectedly. They're almost scratch proof, but definitely not shatter/chip proof around the girdle or pointy ends with just right unfortunate impact. Princess cuts for an example is notorious chipping if not set carefully. I also recently returned a pair of round diamonds as soon as they were set because I noticed several chips around both diamond girdles while verifying the GIA numbers. The jeweler was clueless of how that happened but I knew it certainly wasn't caused by me during less than a day of ownership.

 

[SimoneDi]

Can we look for a replacement stone for you? When replacing fancy cuts in a halo, that might also mean replacing your setting to fit the new stone. Also, it seems that the setting wasn’t secure enough for the diamond. I always prefer that there is a v-prong at the tip of the pear. Who is your jeweler?

 

[ccuheartnurse]

That sucks. Sorry to hear this happened. sad
If JM will give you a payout, maybe that would be the best choice for you which would let you look for a new stone. Seems like you're still interested in finding a pear? If you do, ask the jeweller if they can alter the setting to add a V prong on the tip. It's freaky it landed on the tip as it fell, but I wouldn't put a new stone in that setting with an exposed tip.
I hope this gets resolved quickly.

 

[sledge]

This stinks and I'm sorry to hear it is happening to you. Unfortunately I don't think there is much you can do because carat weight is the determining factor on how diamonds are traded in the market. Unless you had the foresight to understand you had a unicorn and had the policy written to say 1.5 carats meeting minimum dimensions of Y x Z. This doesn't seem to be the case though.

Since I started analyzing diamonds, I've found it odd they are traded on weight. The proportions to which a stone are cut will determine final weight & dimensions along with the beauty of the cut. Unfortunately insurance companies stop at carat weight and terms like ideal, excellent, very good, etc that is defined as the "cut" according to a certificate. This is very frustrating because the GIA excellent net is cast pretty wide, but most consider a small percentage of "excellent" stones to really be excellent.

Looking at the attached chart (which is based on rough approximations) it's easy to see there is a vast difference between a normal 1.5 carat pear and the dimensions you have. I have a similar buying experience, but maybe not as extreme as yours. I bought my fiancee a 0.867ct BGD round diamond. It has a larger table and shallower crown than I'd currently pick (if I knew then what I know now sort of deal). One of the benefits is it sizes up well for the weight -- 6.18x6.21. It normally takes a 0.90ct+ stone to reach the same dimensions.

In my case, it takes about 4% more weight to get the normal dimensions of my fiancee's diamond size. By your calculations of it taking 1.7ct to match the spready dimension of your 1.5ct stone, that is about a 13.5% increase!

My point is that even for my small increase, the proportions of the stone is (IMO) to the stretching point of acceptability. If I had to replace my fiancee's stone today I'd be okay with paying a small premium to get proportions more in-line with what I now consider ideal. If I wasn't willing to pay that cost premium but wanted to keep the better proportions I'd have to be willing to sacrifice a little length & width dimension. While I wouldn't like either scenario, I'd rather pay a little more to have a better cut and not sacrifice the size than the other way around. The third option would be to find another stone that is cut spready, which may be hard to find and present it's own set of frustrations.

 

[denverappraiser]

The problem you have is the insurance coverage that specifies a carat weight not a size. This is the normal business practice. So their obligation is only to replace a 1.5 carat diamond with another 1.5 carat diamond.
Your problem is you had an unusual “
spready pear” for its carat weight so all you can really do is continue looking for a 1.5 carat pear that is likewise spready or ask them if you can take a $$$ payout and then spend the time and effort it might take to find a similar pear in size specs to the one you unfortunately damaged.

Your JM policy almost certainly says that they are agreeing to replace with 'like kind and quality', or words to that effect. The definition of like kind is the description in the appraisal report that you submitted at the time the policy was bound. They need to meet or exceed the specs given, and this is not necessarily limited to weight, clarity, and color. They have a copy of it if you don't. Read your appraisal carefully and discuss the matter with your replacement jeweler. Consider discussing it with another JM authorized jeweler as well so you can compare what they say. In most markets there are many. Some jewelers are a lot better at this process than others. Not to sound self-serving but some appraisals are a lot better than others and it would help you to know where you stand.

 

[Bron357]

I used to work in General Insurance claims so my answer was based on that experience.
You need to read what was “specified” on the policy in relation to your diamond.
If it was just shape, weight, colour and clarity as I was used to seeing, you'll be a bit stuck.
If size has been specified, you are would be right to dispute the diamonds offered and insist that the measurements as specified in the policy are met.

 

[Mallory]

Wow that's a steep upgrade price for a 0.1 ct size increase, but the diamond could be a much better stone in specs for a better performance. You'd have to decide whether that's worth it or keep looking around that range.

You'd be surprised how many people get shocked by their diamond chipping unexpectedly. They're almost scratch proof, but definitely not shatter/chip proof around the girdle or pointy ends with just right unfortunate impact. Princess cuts for an example is notorious chipping if not set carefully. I also recently returned a pair of round diamonds as soon as they were set because I noticed several chips around both diamond girdles while verifying the GIA numbers. The jeweler was clueless of how that happened but I knew it certainly wasn't caused by me during less than a day of ownership.

I thought it was a steep increase as well. The only spec difference I can see in them is an excellent polish in the 1.6 vs a very good polish in mine.

 

[Mallory]

That sucks. Sorry to hear this happened. sad
If JM will give you a payout, maybe that would be the best choice for you which would let you look for a new stone. Seems like you're still interested in finding a pear? If you do, ask the jeweller if they can alter the setting to add a V prong on the tip. It's freaky it landed on the tip as it fell, but I wouldn't put a new stone in that setting with an exposed tip.
I hope this gets resolved quickly.

Do they even offer payouts? I thought it had to be replacement. I’m just afraid the smaller 1.5 will leave visible gaps between the stone and halo. I’d love to keep my original setting so I have something original from the engagement, but if I can’t find the right stone for the setting then I prefer to start over

 

[msop04]

This stinks and I'm sorry to hear it is happening to you. Unfortunately I don't think there is much you can do because carat weight is the determining factor on how diamonds are traded in the market. Unless you had the foresight to understand you had a unicorn and had the policy written to say 1.5 carats meeting minimum dimensions of Y x Z. This doesn't seem to be the case though.

This is exactly how I had mine insured, as it's a spready stone. I also indicated the HCA number. OP, once you decide on a replacement stone, you should probably do the same. Include any important details that you feel you wouldn't settle on should you need to replace in the future.

 

[msop04]

I thought it was a steep increase as well. The only spec difference I can see in them is an excellent polish in the 1.6 vs a very good polish in mine.

I hope this isn't the case, but... the jeweler knows you want close to the same dimensions as your original pear, so he may be jacking up the price (if all things are equal, except those listed above).

So, if you and JM cannot agree on a replacement, and you end up getting a payout... I would be hesitant to use this jeweler. You don't have to use him, so I wouldn't.

 

[pearaffair]

Wow that's a steep upgrade price for a 0.1 ct size increase, but the diamond could be a much better stone in specs for a better performance. You'd have to decide whether that's worth it or keep looking around that range.

You'd be surprised how many people get shocked by their diamond chipping unexpectedly. They're almost scratch proof, but definitely not shatter/chip proof around the girdle or pointy ends with just right unfortunate impact. Princess cuts for an example is notorious chipping if not set carefully. I also recently returned a pair of round diamonds as soon as they were set because I noticed several chips around both diamond girdles while verifying the GIA numbers. The jeweler was clueless of how that happened but I knew it certainly wasn't caused by me during less than a day of ownership.

This is my nightmare. I don't have an ideal local jeweller and so for every resize or repair I'm terrified they're going to damage the stone and I won't even notice or they won't tell me etc.!

 

[sledge]

I thought it was a steep increase as well. The only spec difference I can see in them is an excellent polish in the 1.6 vs a very good polish in mine.

Who is the jeweler?

Also, is the $2k price jump between two NEW stones that are both in-stock at the jeweler, or is that the price difference between your original stone value and the in-stock 1.6 stone? If you are comparing against what you paid, perhaps you paid when market prices were lower than they are now and/or you got a really great deal. This would explain the larger gap for such a small carat weight increase.

I did a quick spreadsheet analysis of current JA stock that varies from 1.50 to 1.75 carats, H, SI2. Below are the results.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1SnSj-Apzqnb52O6jICIieK7JqtkjE7p0TdLabkaJM-M/edit?usp=sharing



There was a plethora of stones near the magic 1.5 carat weight, which is no real surprise. If you filter out the 1.58+ carat stones (3 of them total) the average price per carat drops to $5,001.

If I do the inverse and filter out all the stones < 1.58 carats then I get an average price per carat of $5,404.

This tells me a 1.5 carat H SI2 should be in the neighborhood of $5,001 x 1.5 carats = $7,502.

While I didn't have exact comparables for the 1.60 carat range, I think the blended average of the 3 stones we have is close enough. So I'd assess a 1.60ct H SI2 pear would be in the neighborhood of $5,404 x 1.60 carats = $8,646.

We can see there is roughly an $1,100 price difference using the data set I have available.

Truthfully I'd expect this variance to grow if we had a bigger data set. The 3 numbers we have to assess an average per carat price for the 1.60 stone seems low when compared to average prices on the 1.50ct stones. Typically as we go up in size, the average price per carat increases too.

Unfortunately I don't see any stone in this data set that really gets close to your current stone dimensions. I didn't analyze any of the stones for cut quality and I am not recommending any of them FYI.

In fact, I'd be more curious to know the cut quality of your stone. Based on dimensions only it seems you have a real oddball which is good for size, but may have been cut for size and not beauty. So getting a stone of similar carat weight but less spread may provide you a sparkle bomb you didn't previously have.

 

[blueMA]

This is my nightmare. I don't have an ideal local jeweller and so for every resize or repair I'm terrified they're going to damage the stone and I won't even notice or they won't tell me etc.!

I thought at the time that I probably was one of very lucky few who'd catch such chipping around the girdles of the earrings, and the diamond certs certainly didn't include such defects nor natural indents. If a diamond is chipped and not mentioned on a cert, then you'd also have a problem insuring the diamond.

Always check your diamond with high powered loupe before leaving the store who serviced it, or check as soon as you possibly can.

 

[Mallory]

Live and learn. We settled on the 1.5 stone. I don’t love how it sits in the setting but it will do for now. I probably am obsessing over the small details that no one else notices. I just loved my orginal ring’s look and the meaning it held, so nothing will ever replace it perfectly in my mind. Our jeweler has a buy back policy on the diamonds he sells. He will look for a 1.5 stone with a larger spread in the coming months and allow us to trade in as long as any increase in cost is reasonable for us. No guarantees that he’ll find anything with the spread of my old stone, but it was the best and most cost effective option for us at this point.

 

[KKJohnson]

This thread really got me thinking about the policy on my marquise and thinking we need to have it reworded since my current stone has this same issue-large spread for carat weight.

OP hopefully your jeweler can find you a new unicorn that is closer to specs of your original!

 

[Mallory]

This thread really got me thinking about the policy on my marquise and thinking we need to have it reworded since my current stone has this same issue-large spread for carat weight.

OP hopefully your jeweler can find you a new unicorn that is closer to specs of your original!

Yes please do the rewording!!! If anyone can learn something..lol.

 

[msop04]

I'm glad you have a diamond to wear until you can find a replacement. Good to hear about the jeweler's buyback policy as well... I understand that the sentimental value of your original diamond will never be replaced, but I do hope you find another pear that you love just as much (if not more) than your original very soon. Good luck, OP!

 

[Krisking]

I'm glad you have an interim solution and hope you find an amazing long term one. Who knows... maybe you'll end up with something you love even more than you could have thought! (Speaking from experience... it can happen! Although I understand the sentiment cannot be replaced). Good luck!