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How closely are you following Trump's trial, and aftermath?

How closely are you following Trump's trial, and aftermath?

  • Not at all

    Votes: 17 25.8%
  • Very little

    Votes: 17 25.8%
  • Little

    Votes: 4 6.1%
  • Averagely

    Votes: 11 16.7%
  • Much

    Votes: 3 4.5%
  • Very much

    Votes: 10 15.2%
  • As much as possible

    Votes: 4 6.1%

  • Total voters
    66
  • This poll will close: .

AGBF

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 26, 2003
Messages
20,745
Military Industrial Complex.

Thank you. I didn't know that it was discussed enough to have an acronym! I do remember that President Eisenhower coined the term, however. He was extremely prescient.
 

redwood66

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 22, 2012
Messages
6,762
Thank you. I didn't know that it was discussed enough to have an acronym! I do remember that President Eisenhower coined the term, however. He was extremely prescient.
You are welcome.
 

Karl_K

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Aug 4, 2008
Messages
9,100
Trump's worst appointee has been DeVos and I said so at the time, nothing like having an heiress who makes her money on pyramid scams to run the education department, of course states should run their own education departments actually, we don't need an education department in the federal government.
I agree 2000% on both counts.
She has no business in the position and the position should not exist in the first place.
The sad thing is that the best teachers I had growing up, who taught me more in 1 year than I learned about a subject in the rest of the years would not be teachers in today's schools.
They taught the students not the book/test and non-conformance is not tolerated today.
Don't get me started on the no student gets ahead law.
 

smitcompton

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Feb 11, 2006
Messages
2,583
Hi,

I see TMT was offended by my last post. I must admit I have gaps in knowledge about many things, some even in our Trump threads. When people correct me, I don't mind. I learn. TMT asked if I had heard the tape, which I had mentioned in a post. TMT went on to say the tape basically showed Trump to be in the right. I concluded TMT had not been aware of what transpired in the past to make the tape a document against Trump.

I am sorry if my conclusion was wrong. Yes, I find your posts rather forceful and wanted to point out what I thought you needed to know. But I also did not want to have to recap the House inquiry for you. I also can't see how this is an attack on you personally. I'm just discussing what you said. I don't want to fight-just talk. Sorry I offended you.

Now Red, I wanted to say something to you dealing with your posts and am now afraid. Too bad.

Annette
 

Daisys and Diamonds

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Apr 30, 2019
Messages
3,145
If he had anything to say about any other subject the media would not give him the the time of day because they have done it for years. I have a vested interest in John Bolton not being in charge of dog catching.

He's not my kind of conservative. Neither was McCain who also became the media darling.
As a fellow conservative may i cordially ask why you didn't like Sen. McCain
He certainly was portrayed well in the media, his concession speech after the 2008 election was one of the most outstanding things i have ever heard in politics
 

redwood66

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 22, 2012
Messages
6,762
Hi,

I see TMT was offended by my last post. I must admit I have gaps in knowledge about many things, some even in our Trump threads. When people correct me, I don't mind. I learn. TMT asked if I had heard the tape, which I had mentioned in a post. TMT went on to say the tape basically showed Trump to be in the right. I concluded TMT had not been aware of what transpired in the past to make the tape a document against Trump.

I am sorry if my conclusion was wrong. Yes, I find your posts rather forceful and wanted to point out what I thought you needed to know. But I also did not want to have to recap the House inquiry for you. I also can't see how this is an attack on you personally. I'm just discussing what you said. I don't want to fight-just talk. Sorry I offended you.

Now Red, I wanted to say something to you dealing with your posts and am now afraid. Too bad.

Annette
@smitcompton You can if you like. My comment wasn't about you and we have always been able to converse. Sorry if it came across that it was toward you. I will try to do better.
 
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redwood66

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 22, 2012
Messages
6,762
As a fellow conservative may i cordially ask why you didn't like Sen. McCain
He certainly was portrayed well in the media, his concession speech after the 2008 election was one of the most outstanding things i have ever heard in politics
Hi Daisy. IMO he spent a very long career in politics advocating military spending and intervening in other countries affairs, which I do not agree with. Many republican politicians do this and it is a pet peeve of mine. My point was more to how much the media and liberals fawned over him once he scuttled attempts to get rid of the ACA which he also hated.
 

Daisys and Diamonds

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Apr 30, 2019
Messages
3,145
Hi Daisy. IMO he spent a very long career in politics advocating military spending and intervening in other countries affairs, which I do not agree with. Many republican politicians do this and it is a pet peeve of mine. My point was more to how much the media and liberals fawned over him once he scuttled attempts to get rid of the ACA which he also hated.
Thank you for your answer
Until very recently i enjoyed following American politics very much - my first election was Ronald Reagan. Ive always tried to like American Presidents no matter what the party -( until now they have been wonderfully charismatic and likeable people) as i have no control over who is the leader of the free world.
The politics in your country is more skued to the right than ours
Im very unhappy with the leadership in my own country right now (NZ) with the 'pretty communist' being such a media darling and like Mr Trump, she won on sound bites

I do even really actually like Hillary but watching the debates i realized she was too liberal for me

We do so little military spending in this country its disgraceful, we have to rely on our big powerful friends and allies so im grateful for any money your government spends on a military presence in the Pacific because my mother raised us to always be greatful to the Americans for winning the Pacific war in WW2 as most of our young fighting men were in Europe and my Grandmother's generation felt defenseless with their husbands so far away
 

Ella

Brilliant_Rock
Staff member
Trade
Joined
Jan 18, 2010
Messages
1,284
Folks, I have received a number of reports on each other today. Please remember that if everyone is unable to participate without veiled or not so veiled attacks at each other, we will close the political threads.

PSers are better than this, please show up that way.
 

redwood66

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 22, 2012
Messages
6,762
Thank you for your answer
Until very recently i enjoyed following American politics very much - my first election was Ronald Reagan. Ive always tried to like American Presidents no matter what the party -( until now they have been wonderfully charismatic and likeable people) as i have no control over who is the leader of the free world.
The politics in your country is more skued to the right than ours
Im very unhappy with the leadership in my own country right now (NZ) with the 'pretty communist' being such a media darling and like Mr Trump, she won on sound bites

I do even really actually like Hillary but watching the debates i realized she was too liberal for me

We do so little military spending in this country its disgraceful, we have to rely on our big powerful friends and allies so im grateful for any money your government spends on a military presence in the Pacific because my mother raised us to always be greatful to the Americans for winning the Pacific war in WW2 as most of our young fighting men were in Europe and my Grandmother's generation felt defenseless with their husbands so far away
Oh I hope I did not come across as not wanting to help other countries if needed. We just can't foot the bill for everyone or get involved in every tribal dispute. I have more of a problem with what we call the Military Industrial Complex that AGBF and I were discussing. Much of the military spending and contracting for military items in the US can be a backdoor affair with companies and politicians greasing each others palms and both getting rich at the expense of taxpayers.
 

JPie

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Feb 12, 2018
Messages
2,647
@Daisys and Diamonds You know what's funny is that the US has veered so far right that Reagan looks like a flaming liberal by today's standards. As California governor, he signed the Mulford Act in 1967 to ban the open carry of firearms in our state, though the reason he did was arguably not very progressive at all. He also signed the Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act in 1986 to make it illegal for hospitals to deny emergency services based on immigration status.

I don't think President Reagan would've recognized his party if he were alive today, and it wouldn't just be because of the Alzheimer's.
 

redwood66

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 22, 2012
Messages
6,762
@Daisys and Diamonds You know what's funny is that the US has veered so far right that Reagan looks like a flaming liberal by today's standards. As California governor, he signed the Mulford Act in 1967 to ban the open carry of firearms in our state, though the reason he did was arguably not very progressive at all. He also signed the Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act in 1986 to make it illegal for hospitals to deny emergency services based on immigration status.

I don't think President Reagan would've recognized his party if he were alive today, and it wouldn't just be because of the Alzheimer's.
:lol: Pretty funny considering middle of the stream democrats are reamed for being too far right by the loonies on the far left. No party is what it used to be which is too bad for all of us.
 
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Daisys and Diamonds

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Apr 30, 2019
Messages
3,145
:lol: Pretty funny considering middle of the stream democrats are reamed for being too far right by the loonies on the far left.
You would all die here !
Bernie Sanders would fit right in
(I can't make my smilies work today so imangine the grumpy one)

We had a really nice prime minister
He was anti abortion but he didn't campaign on that, he was a Cathloic from a farming community from a long established farming family who were heaverly involved in community work
When he was just the local member of parliment he sent his office staff to all the union things so they had all the info to serve his constituents the best they could
I know a person who was heaverly involved in the union movement but had the upmost respect for Bill English because of that
But fiscally he knew how to be a conservative !
Free trade and anti isolationalism

And he was a career politician
Those guys know the ropes, they know how to make things happen and how things work
Now we are governed by a citcus
Although Mr Trump has been nice to her
 

kenny

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
27,740
I guess I don't know what you mean. Something smartass maybe?
Libertarian sounds like librarian to a vocabulary-challenged person ... as in not knowing what libertarian means.

Perhaps you've heard of fake news?
I like to exhibit fake stupidity. :lol-2:

But then, humor explained ain't very funny. :cry2:

Oh, and I'm not a smartass; I'm a dumbass. :lol:
 
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redwood66

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 22, 2012
Messages
6,762
Libertarian sounds like librarian to a vocabulary-challenged person ... as in not knowing that libertarian means.

Perhaps you've heard of fake news?
I like to exhibit fake stupidity. :lol-2:

But then, humor explained ain't very funny. :cry2:

Oh, and I'm not a smartass; I'm a dumbass. :lol:
Oh LOL! Love that. Cute. Sorry for being so dense.
 

kenny

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
27,740
I think, deep down (way way way way way deep down, so deep you'd need the deepest drill used by oil companies) we are both really nice and good people. :))
 
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Dancing Fire

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 3, 2004
Messages
31,055
I don't think President Reagan would've recognized his party if he were alive today, and it wouldn't just be because of the Alzheimer's.
Neither would JFK.
 

OboeGal

Shiny_Rock
Premium
Joined
Mar 22, 2017
Messages
359
Calling politicians by creative nicknames is an age old tradition.
The level of nastiness by the left to regular people is not.

edit:
Reading the list the vast majority of them are funny and not mean or cruel.
Just reminding you that it's irrational and incorrect to make broad-brush statements like "the left". All people of liberal tendencies are not the same, don't think the same way, don't behave the same way. I'm firmly liberal. I'm not nasty. Not to regular people. Not to anyone. Are there people who lean left who are nasty to others? You betcha. Are there people who lean right who are nasty to others? You betcha. Some independents, too. How does it feel to you if people come here and say the right are stupid racists? How accurate is that? I'm guessing it's not accurate for you, and most right-leaning people you know. In fact, it's clear in some of the exchanges here that posters here besides me are feeling hurt and offended because posters on both sides are making these broad-brush characterizations about "the left" and "the right" that aren't really accurate or true, and it does damage.

This was a tactic introduced into broad usage by Newt Gingrich. His idea was to take the views expressed by the very most fringe extremists of the left, and widely portray those views to voters wherever he and his cronies could as being held by ALL on the left, instead of just those relatively few. This of course created great fear and antipathy among voters to those on the left. He was convinced this was the way to "winning" and power. Old guard Republicans such as George H. W. Bush were horrified at this - at the dishonesty, at the focus on winning and power without regard to advancing the nation's interests, and at the damage it could wreak - and rejected the tactic. From what I've heard from political historians, this led to Gingrich and his cronies making it their mission behind the scenes that H. W. not get re-elected. The tactic gained ground, to other politicians focused on winning and power, to right-wing talk radio, to Fox News and various other right-wing media outlets, and eventually to left-wing politicians and media as well. And now damn near everyone is doing this. So we've all demonized one another in each other's eyes, but the fact is, we all have to live together. We can't divorce one another, and just like in a marriage/family, no one gets "my way or the highway"; there has to be compromise to advance the family's interests as a whole, but our politicians, our government, and our civil discourse to one another is all "my way or the highway, and I'll do whatever it takes to make that happen."

Please make it stop. We all can be better than this. We all NEED to be better than this if we don't want to lose our democracy. America has ALWAYS had problems, and when we were at our best as a nation, there were still people for whom it wasn't so great - people of minority ethnicities, the mentally ill, women who wanted power over their own lives, non-heterosexual/non-cisgendered folks, for example - but we were slowly working on those things, we were economically reasonably strong, we were a leader in the world. I believe this occurred because we demanded that our politicians work together during those times, and for the most part, they did. We didn't reward those obsessed with power and "winning", with divisiveness, with refusal to compromise with politicians that represent also a large number of US citizens, with "my way or nothing", by re-electing them. They disagreed, but they didn't demonize. They compromised and collaborated, they realized they and their "side" didn't always have the right answer all the time, and the result?

Greater than the sum of its parts.

I want that again.
 
Last edited:

missy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 8, 2008
Messages
31,246
Just reminding you that it's irrational and incorrect to make broad-brush statements like "the left". All people of liberal tendencies are not the same, don't think the same way, don't behave the same way. I'm firmly liberal. I'm not nasty. Not to regular people. Not to anyone. Are there people who lean left who are nasty to others? You betcha. Are there people who lean right who are nasty to others? You betcha. Some independents, too. How does it feel to you if people come here and say the right are stupid racists? How accurate is that? I'm guessing it's not accurate for you, and most right-leaning people you know. In fact, it's clear in some of the exchanges here that posters here besides me are feeling hurt and offended because posters on both sides are making these broad-brush characterizations about "the left" and "the right" that aren't really accurate or true, and it does damage.

This was a tactic introduced into broad usage by Newt Gingrich. His idea was to take the views expressed by the very most fringe extremists of the left, and widely portray those views to voters wherever he and his cronies could as being held by ALL on the left, instead of just those relatively few. This of course created great fear and antipathy among voters to those on the left. He was convinced this was the way to "winning" and power. Old guard Republicans such as George H. W. Bush were horrified at this - at the dishonesty, at the focus on winning and power without regard to advancing the nation's interests, and at the damage it could wreak - and rejected the tactic. From what I've heard from political historians, this led to Gingrich and his cronies making it their mission behind the scenes that H. W. not get re-elected. The tactic gained ground, to other politicians focused on winning and power, to right-wing talk radio, to Fox News and various other right-wing media outlets, and eventually to left-wing politicians and media as well. And now damn near everyone is doing this. So we've all demonized one another in each other's eyes, but the fact is, we all have to live together. We can't divorce one another, and just like in a marriage/family, no one gets "my way or the highway"; there has to be compromise to advance the family's interests as a whole, but our politicians, our government, and our civil discourse to one another is all "my way or the highway, and I'll do whatever it takes to make that happen."

Please make it stop. We all can be better than this. We all NEED to be better than this if we don't want to lose our democracy. America has ALWAYS had problems, and when we were at our best as a nation, there were still people for whom it wasn't so great - people of minority ethnicities, the mentally ill, women who wanted power over their own lives, non-heterosexual/non-cisgendered folks, for example - but we were slowly working on those things, we were economically reasonably strong, we were a leader in the world. I believe this occurred because we demanded that our politicians work together during those times, and for the most part, they did. We didn't reward those obsessed with power and "winning", with divisiveness, with refusal to compromise with politicians that represent also a large number of US citizens, with "my way or nothing", by re-electing them. They disagreed, but they didn't demonize. They compromised and collaborated, they realized they and their "side" didn't always have the right answer all the time, and the result?

Greater than the sum of its parts.

I want that again.
+1
 

redwood66

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 22, 2012
Messages
6,762
Just reminding you that it's irrational and incorrect to make broad-brush statements like "the left". All people of liberal tendencies are not the same, don't think the same way, don't behave the same way. I'm firmly liberal. I'm not nasty. Not to regular people. Not to anyone. Are there people who lean left who are nasty to others? You betcha. Are there people who lean right who are nasty to others? You betcha. Some independents, too. How does it feel to you if people come here and say the right are stupid racists? How accurate is that? I'm guessing it's not accurate for you, and most right-leaning people you know. In fact, it's clear in some of the exchanges here that posters here besides me are feeling hurt and offended because posters on both sides are making these broad-brush characterizations about "the left" and "the right" that aren't really accurate or true, and it does damage.

This was a tactic introduced into broad usage by Newt Gingrich. His idea was to take the views expressed by the very most fringe extremists of the left, and widely portray those views to voters wherever he and his cronies could as being held by ALL on the left, instead of just those relatively few. This of course created great fear and antipathy among voters to those on the left. He was convinced this was the way to "winning" and power. Old guard Republicans such as George H. W. Bush were horrified at this - at the dishonesty, at the focus on winning and power without regard to advancing the nation's interests, and at the damage it could wreak - and rejected the tactic. From what I've heard from political historians, this led to Gingrich and his cronies making it their mission behind the scenes that H. W. not get re-elected. The tactic gained ground, to other politicians focused on winning and power, to right-wing talk radio, to Fox News and various other right-wing media outlets, and eventually to left-wing politicians and media as well. And now damn near everyone is doing this. So we've all demonized one another in each other's eyes, but the fact is, we all have to live together. We can't divorce one another, and just like in a marriage/family, no one gets "my way or the highway"; there has to be compromise to advance the family's interests as a whole, but our politicians, our government, and our civil discourse to one another is all "my way or the highway, and I'll do whatever it takes to make that happen."

Please make it stop. We all can be better than this. We all NEED to be better than this if we don't want to lose our democracy. America has ALWAYS had problems, and when we were at our best as a nation, there were still people for whom it wasn't so great - people of minority ethnicities, the mentally ill, women who wanted power over their own lives, non-heterosexual/non-cisgendered folks, for example - but we were slowly working on those things, we were economically reasonably strong, we were a leader in the world. I believe this occurred because we demanded that our politicians work together during those times, and for the most part, they did. We didn't reward those obsessed with power and "winning", with divisiveness, with refusal to compromise with politicians that represent also a large number of US citizens, with "my way or nothing", by re-electing them. They disagreed, but they didn't demonize. They compromised and collaborated, they realized they and their "side" didn't always have the right answer all the time, and the result?

Greater than the sum of its parts.

I want that again.
Maybe Don Lemon should read this. Yes please stop. Everyone. I won't hold my breath though.
 
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