Hope the President does a good job for USA

[soxfan]

Google "Uncle Tom." I think you might find that interesting. Or not......

 

[Bluegemz]

I highly doubt that this forum prevents the right to freedom of speech. People chose to post or not to post. It’s called personal choice.

It’s nothing like cartoonists getting fired because of their visual commentaries about Trump.

 

[Bluegemz]

Also, you just keep spewing sewage out of your mouth with no knowledge of ANYTHING

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...amilies-at-the-border/?utm_term=.8ff0635b4fe0

This is typical....make a crisis, expose people’s vulnerabilities, outrage, switch positions and/or blame others in order to leverage the situation as to make himself indispensable, feed blind followers.= new narcissistic supply created.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Totally. They are stealing all the jobs. DF- do you want to pick all the fruit?? I don't want anyone to be deprived of a job that illegals are stealing!!

http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-fi-farms-immigration/

FYI, yes I have had work on a farm sorting tomatoes during the summer times when I was a teenager.

 

[Dancing Fire]

I highly doubt that this forum prevents the right to freedom of speech. People chose to post or not to post. It’s called personal choice.

b/c you haven't been here long enough to notice. The OP who started this thread (AnnaH) a conservative who got ran out of town so fast it would made your head spin. I'd dare any conservatives to post on this thread. I would advise them to put on a bullet proof vest before they post here.

 

[Dancing Fire]

You wonder why no other "conservatives are talking because they've been driven away on PS?" It's because they have NO way of defending this crap and are smart enough to know it. It's nothing ever even seen before. You are the last "man" standing, and you are certainly standing on the wrong side of history.

I immigrated to the US in 1966, so I can not be easily fooled by today's Dem. political agendas. The great JFK is turning over in his grave after looking down from heaven seeing what his party have had become today.

 

[JPie]

Did someone post this here before? Even so it’s worth repeating.

 

[Calliecake]

"Familes Belong Together" is the organization coordinating rallies against the separation of families seeking asylum in the United States. Here is a link to its website. There were rallies/marches all over the country yesterday.

Families Belong Together...https://www.fastcompany.com/4058500...st-the-separation-of-immigrant-families-today

@AGBF , Thank you Deb. I realize we are not all bad. I’m disgusted by this administration. I’ve made a donation to the UCLA.

@Dancing Fire , Taking children from their parents is morally wrong.
These children are going to complete strangers. Can you not imagine how tramatic this is for these children and their parents? I will never understand people who lack empathy and compassion.
I seriously doubt JFK would rolling in his grave because of the democrats.

 

[Bluegemz]

Empathy is what makes us human...the ability to step into another’s shoes for a moment. It is essential for true communication, to understand the needs, fears, hopes, choices, preferences of each other. It is the very basis of social cohesion and moral integrity.

The immigration issue is complex, and certainly more so than the ‘Shrodinger’s Immigrant’. Another side of a multi faceted story is that ome major industries depend on them and that they therefore also contribute to growth. However, subjecting children And families through this cruelty is primitive and unacceptable. If we can do so, then we have divorced ourselves from the capacity to be human. Once empathy has been sacrificed culturally, everyone will fall victim to this kind of atrocity. the end can not justify the means, or else we’ve lost at being civil and being human. That is a big price to pay.

 

[Dancing Fire]

CC, please read my post #1676 above..

I am in favor of issuing a 5 yr temporary green card to all the dreamers who are already in this country, however at the same time we must stop more illegals from entering the US. I had to wait till I turned 18 yrs old (1977) before I can apply for citizenship. IOW, 11 yrs after I immigrated here in 1966. I didn't received a free pass.

 

[AGBF]

These children are going to complete strangers.

It's worse than that. They are not "going to" anyone, as to a foster family. I just saw Maria Teresa Kumar on MSNBC. Children are being placed in locked institutions where it is against policy for the staff to touch them. (Some of them are now being housed in tents outdoors in the Texas heat.) Siblings are deliberately being separated. Some of these "institutions" house them in crates/cages. In none of them can crying babies be touched to soothe them. As I am sure most of you know, at least one breastfeeding mother was separated from her baby, too. That is the new policy.

AGBF

 

[Bluegemz]

It's worse than that. They are not "going to" anyone, as to a foster family. I just saw Maria Teresa Kumar on MSNBC. Children are being placed in locked institutions where it is against policy for the staff to touch them. (Some of them are now being housed in tents outdoors in the Texas heat.) Siblings are deliberately being separated. Some of these "institutions" house them in crates/cages. In none of them can crying babies be touched to soothe them. As I am sure most of you know, at least one breastfeeding mother was separated from her baby, too. That is the new policy.

AGBF

We should all know the depth of trauma which this causes, and it’s unnecessary.

 

[Calliecake]

How is this country going to come together when we can’t even agree about things that qualify as human decency? Everyone should be outraged at what is happening to these children.

 

[Dancing Fire]

This is a pic from 2014...guess who was the POTUS then?

 

[AGBF]

This is absolutely brilliant. I am so glad that I read it. I hope that all of you who are interested in how trump really ticks will read it in its entirety, too. I am posting an excerpt. It is from a column in today's issue of "The New York Times".

"I’ve just watched footage of Donald Trump saluting a North Korean general, and it occurs to me that what’s really going on here is that the president is envious of Kim Jong-un, who has the absolute authority to execute his uncle with antiaircraft machine guns, consign tens of thousands of people to the gulag, and rule through a personality cult based on ruthless indoctrination.

This, the last hangover of Stalinist totalitarianism, must be the society for which Trump yearns as, remote control in hand, he wanders the corridors of the White House searching for Melania or a late-night burger. It’s one in which prostration to the leader is the norm, critical thought is punishable with death, and the whole tedious apparatus of American constitutional democracy — checks and balances, the rule of law, a free press, an independent judiciary — has been relegated to history’s trash heap.

The real enemy, you see, is not the North Korean general Trump saluted, or Kim himself, the erstwhile 'rocket man' turned 'great personality' and 'very smart guy.' No, it’s the forces within American society working to limit Trump’s power and so keep the Republic. As he tweeted upon his return from the summit with Kim in Singapore, 'Our country’s biggest enemy is the Fake News so easily promulgated by fools.'

Biggest enemy! A monstrous regime, still armed with nukes, gets a pass because Trump dreams of building condos on its deserted beaches and seeing a Trump Boulevard in Pyongyang, but no pass for CNN or The New York Times if they refuse to kowtow. A Russian attempt to subvert the last election also goes ignored.

The evidence is now overwhelming that Trump cannot resist a dictator. Kim is 'funny.' (You read that right.) Rodrigo Duterte, the Philippine president, is doing 'an unbelievable job on the drug problem' through mass arrests and extrajudicial killings. Xi Jinping is just 'great.' Vladimir Putin’s human rights violations are not worth a mention because, 'What do you think, our country’s so innocent?'

By contrast, America’s democratic allies are a bunch of losers. Canada’s prime minister, Justin Trudeau, is 'dishonest and weak.' Germany refuses to pay up and is 'bad, very bad.' Trump even seems to have lost patience with his one European buddy, President Emmanuel Macron of France. The trouble with these wimpy leaders is they don’t starve their citizens or execute troublemakers with antiaircraft guns.

Asked by Greta Van Susteren, in an interview with Voice of America, what he would like to say to North Korean citizens, Trump said: 'Well, I think you have somebody who has a great feeling for them. He wants to do right by them, and we got along really well. We had a great chemistry — you understand how I feel about chemistry.'

We understand. Chemistry supplants facts and is an excuse for laziness. Trump has no interest in reality. When allies, the leaders of democratic nations, try to speak to him about reality, his eyes glaze over.

Dictators can make up their own worlds. They can make words mean the opposite of what they were intended to mean. They can turn 'fake news' into propaganda that’s impossible to contest.

...​

"






https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/15/opinion/trump-kim-north-korea-dictator.html

 

[Bluegemz]

This is absolutely brilliant. I am so glad that I read it. I hope that all of you who are interested in how trump really ticks will read it in its entirety, too. I am posting an excerpt. It is from a column in today's issue of "The New York Times".

"I’ve just watched footage of Donald Trump saluting a North Korean general, and it occurs to me that what’s really going on here is that the president is envious of Kim Jong-un, who has the absolute authority to execute his uncle with antiaircraft machine guns, consign tens of thousands of people to the gulag, and rule through a personality cult based on ruthless indoctrination.

This, the last hangover of Stalinist totalitarianism, must be the society for which Trump yearns as, remote control in hand, he wanders the corridors of the White House searching for Melania or a late-night burger. It’s one in which prostration to the leader is the norm, critical thought is punishable with death, and the whole tedious apparatus of American constitutional democracy — checks and balances, the rule of law, a free press, an independent judiciary — has been relegated to history’s trash heap.

The real enemy, you see, is not the North Korean general Trump saluted, or Kim himself, the erstwhile 'rocket man' turned 'great personality' and 'very smart guy.' No, it’s the forces within American society working to limit Trump’s power and so keep the Republic. As he tweeted upon his return from the summit with Kim in Singapore, 'Our country’s biggest enemy is the Fake News so easily promulgated by fools.'

Biggest enemy! A monstrous regime, still armed with nukes, gets a pass because Trump dreams of building condos on its deserted beaches and seeing a Trump Boulevard in Pyongyang, but no pass for CNN or The New York Times if they refuse to kowtow. A Russian attempt to subvert the last election also goes ignored.

The evidence is now overwhelming that Trump cannot resist a dictator. Kim is 'funny.' (You read that right.) Rodrigo Duterte, the Philippine president, is doing 'an unbelievable job on the drug problem' through mass arrests and extrajudicial killings. Xi Jinping is just 'great.' Vladimir Putin’s human rights violations are not worth a mention because, 'What do you think, our country’s so innocent?'

By contrast, America’s democratic allies are a bunch of losers. Canada’s prime minister, Justin Trudeau, is 'dishonest and weak.' Germany refuses to pay up and is 'bad, very bad.' Trump even seems to have lost patience with his one European buddy, President Emmanuel Macron of France. The trouble with these wimpy leaders is they don’t starve their citizens or execute troublemakers with antiaircraft guns.

Asked by Greta Van Susteren, in an interview with Voice of America, what he would like to say to North Korean citizens, Trump said: 'Well, I think you have somebody who has a great feeling for them. He wants to do right by them, and we got along really well. We had a great chemistry — you understand how I feel about chemistry.'

We understand. Chemistry supplants facts and is an excuse for laziness. Trump has no interest in reality. When allies, the leaders of democratic nations, try to speak to him about reality, his eyes glaze over.

Dictators can make up their own worlds. They can make words mean the opposite of what they were intended to mean. They can turn 'fake news' into propaganda that’s impossible to contest.

...​

"






https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/15/opinion/trump-kim-north-korea-dictator.html

Absolutely what I’ve been noticing...it’s becoming very clear. The need for constantly greater adulation means that he aspires to dictators. Such people with narcissistic PD, without exception, always bring destruction with them as they create and then inevitably destroy, taking people and societies down with them. They are missing a part of cognitive ability, can create their own reality To keep the false self going, while failing true reality tests, and are in essence , delusional and dangerous. They are unable to empathize, except in a ability to sense frailties and vulnerabilities in others, which they then use as a way to hook into others for narcissistic supply. Once a person no longer serves as a supply, the narcissist is quick to trash them. How many examples Of this have we seen so far? Too many to count.

Those who ctriticize, have different opinions, or worse, laugh at him, or even make statements at his expenses are subjected to a narcissistic rage,( different than normal anger) which is always vastly disproportionate. Again, the source of this anger is frustration, resentment generated internally by the need to protect the false image created, and to shield against narcissistic injury. Any opposition is distorted, warped, etc.. This mechanism among others, demonstrates how cognitive ability is impaired.

For DT, there is only one direction, which is moving towards greater, authoritarian power. Thankfully it is predictable. I see now that that he will constantly try to create crises, then leverage things to make himself indispensable along the way, take everyone for a ride....but there’s no mistaking what he hopes ‘accomplish’

 

[Bluegemz]

Thank you, @AGBF , for posting that excerpt, and the link. I am grateful to feel that I’m not alone in my impressions, as freightening as this situation is. That is is apparent to others, and published widely, gives me hope.

 

[redwood66]

You wonder why no other "conservatives are talking because they've been driven away on PS?" It's because they have NO way of defending this crap and are smart enough to know it. It's nothing ever even seen before. You are the last "man" standing, and you are certainly standing on the wrong side of history.

Oh some of us are still here. But why would any conservatives want to post on these threads? There is no discussion, there is derision even when there are things we might agree on. No thank you.

Edit - I don't believe anyone that posts here regularly of the liberal persuasion is interested in what conservatives have to say. Well maybe a few but not many.

 

[Matata]

I don't believe anyone that posts here regularly of the liberal persuasion is interested in what conservatives have to say.

And you're correct about that if those conservatives are following the party line and think trump is competent or that the GOP has any dignity left. If they want to discuss ways to limit refugees coming here in a humane way or stop illegal entry in a humane way or any other topic that melds ideas from left and right and middle of both parties into reasonable workable solutions for this country's challenges, I'm game.

 

[redwood66]

And you're correct about that if those conservatives are following the party line and think trump is competent or that the GOP has any dignity left. If they want to discuss ways to limit refugees coming here in a humane way or stop illegal entry in a humane way or any other topic that melds ideas from left and right and middle of both parties into reasonable workable solutions for this country's challenges, I'm game.

That works both ways. Who decides what is reasonable or humane? I won't get dragged into this with you. You have proven my point.

 

[AGBF]

Oh some of us are still here. But why would any conservatives want to post on these threads? There is no discussion, there is derision even when there are things we might agree on. No thank you.

I'm not sure how conservatives like Joe Scarborough would feel if they were on Pricescope and faced with the threads here, so I do not want to pretend that I can put myself in your place. However, I do want to say that where he is, in his own forum, that is on his own television show, he manages very nicely to be a conservative who hates many things that Donald Trump stands for. And he discusses them with with people who are derisive about Trump. He manages to to hold the values he grew up with in Georgia and Alabama as a lifetime Republican and a Baptist who can quote scripture by heart and a conservative and a member of the Freedom Caucus when he was in Congress. I really enjoy him because I disagree with him so much and yet respect him so much because he is totally unbowed by the need to please Trump when pleasing Trump goes against his old, regular values. He just hasn't changed his old values because Trump came into power and it is enormously refreshing to see. So when he says that it would be his preference to see all the football players stand for national anthem, but.... I really listen.

 

[redwood66]

I'm not sure how conservatives like Joe Scarborough would feel if they were on Pricescope and faced with the threads here, so I do not want to pretend that I can put myself in your place. However, I do want to say that where he is, in his own forum, that is on his own television show, he manages very nicely to be a conservative who hates many things that Donald Trump stands for. And he discussed them with with people who are derisive about Trump. He manages to to hold the values he grew up with in Georgia and Alabama as a lifetime Republican and a Baptist who can quote scripture by heart and a conservative and a member of the Freedom Caucus when he was in Congress. I really enjoy him because I disagree with him so much and yet respect hims so much because he is totally unbowed by the need to please Trump when pleasing trump goes against his old, regular values. He just hasn't changed his old values because Trump came into power and it is enormously refreshing to see. So when he says that it would be his preference to see all the football players stand for national anthem, but.... I really listen.

He gets paid to do it. Not worth it one iota anymore to me. Just look what this thread turned into when it started as an attempt to give a glimpse into other people's thoughts outside the majority here. The whole country has turned into a hate fest from both sides. Disgusting.

 

[Matata]

That works both ways. Who decides what is reasonable or humane? I won't get dragged into this with you. You have proven my point.

You are a master at prevarication. What do you mean who decides what is reasonable or humane? Do we not have laws and moral and ethical precedent upon which to gauge our own as well as others' ideas? Critical analysis and debate of ideas is the foundation that forged those laws and moral and ethical precedents. I have not proven your point because you did not express one. You expressed an opinion that no liberal here wanted to hear what conservatives had to say and when I said I would listen you come back on the defensive.

 

[redwood66]

You are a master at prevarication. What do you mean who decides what is reasonable or humane? Do we not have laws and moral and ethical precedent upon which to gauge our own as well as others' ideas? Critical analysis and debate of ideas is the foundation that forged those laws and moral and ethical precedents. I have not proven your point because you did not express one. You expressed an opinion that no liberal here wanted to hear what conservatives had to say and when I said I would listen you come back on the defensive.

You don't want discussion unless it is on your terms which you laid out in your previous post. Please don't act like you were not being passive aggressive as well, we have been down this road before. I am not interested.

 

[Jambalaya]

I think people should stop being rude to DancingFire. He is entitled to his opinion and his politics. He expresses himself clearly without ever being rude back. And as an immigrant who came here from a very different culture and worked his way up, and having waited many years for citizenship, he has obviously had life experiences that have shaped his outlook - like all of us. And his experiences have been quite different from many of us here. I'm thinking of that line about walking a mile in someone else's shoes.

DF has been a humorous and constant presence here for many years and it's not fair to be so rude, IMHO.

 

[Jambalaya]

I agree with Redwood that Conservatives are dealt with too harshly on this thread.

People are allowed to be Conservative. People have a right to their politics. We Dems think we're right, of course, but to assume that we're right on all matters regarding this country is to reject a growth opportunity to put ourselves in another's shoes and see the world through their eyes.

As an example, DF made an excellent point about putting food on the table being an absolute priority for many Trump voters. We, with our many jewelry purchases, may not readily understand that. But if you're desperate for the economy in your area to improve, and you're past an age or a stage of life where you need the services of Planned Parenthood, to take an example, then your priority would be a promise to help revitalize your area economically.

In this case, that doesn't make a Trump voter wrong. It just makes them someone who wants to get their local economy in better shape so that they can then improve from there.

Sure, there are Trump voters who are racist, homophobic, anti-Semitic and all the rest of it. But I believe the vast majority simply want to improve our economy and want more of our resources poured into America instead of policing the world. This is a difference of ideology with Democrats, and it's just that - a difference. It isn't wrong, not like racism etc. is clearly wrong.

I say all this as a far-left liberal.

 

[Matata]

You don't want discussion unless it is on your terms which you laid out in your previous post.

You have taken exception to my suggestion that discussion participants attempt to be non-partisan as much as possible? If you are that deep into your bias against me then it appears that the two of us will be unable to engage in civil discussion in this particular thread. So be it.

 

[Jambalaya]

Hi Matata and Redwood

I'm going to try to mediate here between the two of you because it makes me feel sad and ill to see two PSers arguing so badly.

Just one moment while I write a post...

 

[redwood66]

You have taken exception to my suggestion that discussion participants attempt to be non-partisan as much as possible? If you are that deep into your bias against me then it appears that the two of us will be unable to engage in civil discussion in this particular thread. So be it.

We have a history you and I. I don't trust you to have a discussion without derision. Sorry but there it is.

 

[Matata]

I'm going to try to mediate here between the two of you because it makes me feel sad and ill to see two PSers arguing so badly.

Please don't. It's not your place. Red and I have history. I actually like her and would enjoy knowing her personally. We are prickly with each other and that's ok. We're more alike than either of us would care to admit.