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HCA score of 3.2

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TempestX96

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 29, 2019
Messages
7
Hi everyone,

I just purchased an engagement ring for my girlfriend.

Here are the GIA specifications
0.7 Carat
Depth: 64%
Table: 57%
Crown Angle: 37.5%
Pavilion Angle: 40.6%
Symmetry: Very Good
5.54x5.58x3.56

Plugged this into the HCA calculator and it returned a score of 3.2.

Paid around 5600SGD for the ring, inclusive of a setting with side diamonds. The whole setup looks beautiful in real life, and that is after seeing other rings and diamonds as well.

However, having a score of 3.2 is really bothering me as it seems like it is a badly cut diamond.

What should I do? I have the option of exchanging it within 10 days and the ring will be ready in a month's time. Should I change it to another ring with a better HCA score? Or are there any other saving factors that are not considered in the HCA score?
 
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HCA score under 2 (up to about 2.5ish is acceptable as well, depending on analysis in detail) indicates the angles of the crown and pavilion work well together.

Your crown angle is very high compared to the Pricescope recommended range of 34-35, with 35.5 or 36 degrees being potentially acceptable with a shallow pavilion (40.6 degrees).

Your stone might have quite a lot of fire (because the facets around the table will be large, thanks to the high crown) but it might also suffer leakage issues, because the crown and pavilion angles do not work as well as they could.


Does the store have an online inventory we could look through?

Have you considered Jann Paul? (although I believe they are quite expensive for their SuperIdeal ranges):
www.jannpaul.com

Find Your Perfect Diamond Engagement Ring | JannPaul SG

For top-quality diamonds, shop at JannPaul Singapore, the premier destination for diamond engagement rings, proposal rings, & customised diamond jewellery.
www.jannpaul.com www.jannpaul.com


The Pricescope recommendations are usually to stick within these guidelines, in order to identify stones that should perform well:

Table 54-58 %
Depth 60-62.4 %
Crown Angle 34 - 35 degrees (up to 35.5 or even 36 with a shallow pavilion of 40.6 degrees)
Pavilion Angle 40.6 - 40.9 degrees

When the pavilion angle increases, the crown angle should decrease, and vice versa.
 
OoohShiny said:
HCA score under 2 (up to about 2.5ish is acceptable as well, depending on analysis in detail) indicates the angles of the crown and pavilion work well together.

Your crown angle is very high compared to the Pricescope recommended range of 34-35, with 35.5 or 36 degrees being potentially acceptable with a shallow pavilion (40.6 degrees).

Your stone might have quite a lot of fire (because the facets around the table will be large, thanks to the high crown) but it might also suffer leakage issues, because the crown and pavilion angles do not work as well as they could.


Does the store have an online inventory we could look through?

Have you considered Jann Paul? (although I believe they are quite expensive for their SuperIdeal ranges):
www.jannpaul.com

Find Your Perfect Diamond Engagement Ring | JannPaul SG

For top-quality diamonds, shop at JannPaul Singapore, the premier destination for diamond engagement rings, proposal rings, & customised diamond jewellery.
www.jannpaul.com www.jannpaul.com


The Pricescope recommendations are usually to stick within these guidelines, in order to identify stones that should perform well:

Table 54-58 %
Depth 60-62.4 %
Crown Angle 34 - 35 degrees (up to 35.5 or even 36 with a shallow pavilion of 40.6 degrees)
Pavilion Angle 40.6 - 40.9 degrees

When the pavilion angle increases, the crown angle should decrease, and vice versa.
Click to expand...

Thanks for your prompt advice!

The store that I purchased the ring doesn't have an online inventory. My main concern is value of the diamond that I purchased (is it worth 5600SGD).
 
www.xe.com is showing the exchange rate as 1 SGD = 0.72542 USD today.

Assuming, say, SGD600 for the setting, that leaves SGD5000 for the stone, which is ~USD3600.

There are 200+ AGS000 stones in the search database at the moment, within the ranges mentioned above, priced at under USD3600, and with HCA scores of 'Excellent' (i.e. under 2, I believe):

Diamond Search Results | Real-time Information on 1,000,000+ Diamonds | PriceScope

PriceScope's Diamond Search is the best place to find the best diamond prices. Search and compare over a million natural, lab and fancy color diamonds.
www.pricescope.com www.pricescope.com

Over 150 of those are in-house 'SuperIdeal' stones!

Would the jeweller be open to you ordering a stone from an internet vendor and then them mounting the diamond?

If so, you could secure a great SuperIdeal from WhiteFlash or another of the recommended vendors (don't forget to check the www.HighPerformanceDiamonds.com site as well), and then mount it into the ring you have already agreed on. :)


If they won't work with you to do that, perhaps they will be able to pull stones from 'virtual inventory'? Many jewellers should have access to these because they are on the open market (f I understand things correctly).

There are 60+ AGS 000 'Virtual Inventory' stones in that link above, which could be somewhere to start, or there are over 9000 (!!) GIA XXX stones in the list with Excellent HCA scores:

Diamond Search Results | Real-time Information on 1,000,000+ Diamonds | PriceScope

PriceScope's Diamond Search is the best place to find the best diamond prices. Search and compare over a million natural, lab and fancy color diamonds.
www.pricescope.com www.pricescope.com


You may have to adjust the filters to your desired colour/clarity ranges.

Do you require / desire high colour and high clarity?


TL;DR - compare the price and specification of your stone against those in the lists above, to see if it is good value (taking into account all the stones in the list have better HCA scores than the stone you currently have). Perhaps the jeweller will be able to order one in from the lists.
 
Your diamond is also cut rather deep (64%). When set in a ring, it will appear smaller compared to other diamonds of the same carat with more shallow depth percentages. Below is an example of how your diamond will look in a ring compared with a .70 carat diamond that has a depth percentage of 60.8.

If you do decide to trade it, try to find one with a depth between 60% - 62.4%. The closer to 60 the bigger it will appear.
 

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Swirl68 said:
The closer to 60 the bigger it will appear.
Click to expand...

The reason the diamond "magically" grows as you move closer to 60 depth is because several other proportions change in relation to that. For instance, the table will be larger and the crown angle will also be shallow. Effectively the change in geometry allows for an increase in spread (size) for the carat weight.

If you happen to get a stone with shallow pavilion and shallow crown, it sizes well but risks becoming dark when viewing close up. Consequently, it will get an HCA score < 1 and most likely a "bigger" rating on the size. The downside is the stone can look dark when viewing up close, but is a good style of stone for pendants or earrings.

So while gaining size, you are also altering the personality of the diamond. Large tables and shallow crowns produce more white light return, whereas smaller tables and steeper crowns help produce more rainbow light return (fire). Of course, getting a complimentary pavilion is essential in the equation, but that is somewhat assumed.

I agree the 64 depth is making the stone appear smaller. In her case, the pavilion is probably around 42.5%. The crown height will be high, probably in the 16.5% range because of the very steep 37.5 crown, despite having a 57 table. And I'm guessing this stone is carrying a little fat in the mid section with a slightly thick to very thick girdle (around 5%).

These factors plus only very good symmetry allow us to find better performing options if it's still possible to return for a refund, or possibly exchange for a better cut diamond.

Capture100.PNG
 
TempestX96 said:
Hi everyone,

I just purchased an engagement ring for my girlfriend.

Here are the GIA specifications
0.7 Carat
Depth: 64%

What should I do? I have the option of exchanging it within 10 days and the ring will be ready in a month's time. Should I change it to another ring with a better HCA score? Or are there any other saving factors that are not considered in the HCA score?
Click to expand...
64% is way too deep. :knockout: exchange it for a shallower stone b/t 61.5 - 62% depth.
 
TempestX96 said:
Hi everyone,

I just purchased an engagement ring for my girlfriend.

Here are the GIA specifications
0.7 Carat
Depth: 64%
Table: 57%
Crown Angle: 37.5%
Pavilion Angle: 40.6%
Symmetry: Very Good
5.54x5.58x3.56

Plugged this into the HCA calculator and it returned a score of 3.2.

Paid around 5600SGD for the ring, inclusive of a setting with side diamonds. The whole setup looks beautiful in real life, and that is after seeing other rings and diamonds as well.

However, having a score of 3.2 is really bothering me as it seems like it is a badly cut diamond.

What should I do? I have the option of exchanging it within 10 days and the ring will be ready in a month's time. Should I change it to another ring with a better HCA score? Or are there any other saving factors that are not considered in the HCA score?
Click to expand...
Do you have any face up photo of the diamond?
 
Ditto.
Report and faceup photos.
An RB with a small-mid table and 37+ crown is my idea of fabulous, and I'll forgive some excess depth... if everything else lines up.
 
Here is a picture of it.

No scope pictures and the ring is being sent for resizing so not possible to view it now :(
 

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The high crown should give a lot of coloured 'fire', so do not worry too much.

How long will it be before the ring is ready? Will you be proposing straight away?

I'm sure your girlfriend will love it because it has come from you and the ring looks very nice :)
 
OoohShiny said:
The high crown should give a lot of coloured 'fire', so do not worry too much.

How long will it be before the ring is ready? Will you be proposing straight away?

I'm sure your girlfriend will love it because it has come from you and the ring looks very nice :)
Click to expand...

1month before ring is ready! Probably proposing sometime early next year!

Thanks Shiny :)
 
A month to resize a ring?

That is quite a long time!

I appreciate that rings with stones on their shank might need extra care though.


Does the store have an upgrade policy? (In writing?)

I am sure she will love it but it is good to know if you might have an option to change it up in the future if she/you wanted to :)
 
Not sure why it takes that long too :P

Yup 2years 100% value, upgrade to any ring 1.5x original ring value.

So at least there's that
 
TempestX96 said:
Here is a picture of it.

No scope pictures and the ring is being sent for resizing so not possible to view it now :(
Click to expand...
The diamond appears somewhat as expected from 37.5/40.6 with clean contrasty arrows.
It also appears to have significant leakage under the table at 5 o clock. You can see your skin thru the diamond. But then, the stone is a bit tilted and some leakage is expected in such case.

I like the diamond's appearance in the photo. It may not be as bad as what you think and HCA 3.2 suggests. As @yssie said, I, too, can forgive 64% depth as long as it is not from extremely thick girdle.
 
flyingpig said:
The diamond appears somewhat as expected from 37.5/40.6 with clean contrasty arrows.
It also appears to have significant leakage under the table at 5 o clock. You can see your skin thru the diamond. But then, the stone is a bit tilted and some leakage is expected in such case.

I like the diamond's appearance in the photo. It may not be as bad as what you think and HCA 3.2 suggests. As @yssie said, I, too, can forgive 64% depth as long as it is not from extremely thick girdle.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the analysis!

Can you explain which part of the diamond is the girdle?
 

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TempestX96 said:
In this case its medium-thick?
Click to expand...
Correct.
The thinnest part is "medium" and the thickness part is "thick". It is at least not "very thick" or "extremely thick".
 
The benefits of a thicker girdle are that it should be sturdier and more resistant to accidental impacts :)

This page under the Knowledge tab at the top of the forum should help explain all the different facets on a MRB diamond :))
www.pricescope.com

Round Cut Diamond in Detail

Modern round brilliant cut diamonds are composed of flat polished surfaces called facets. Learn more about this popular diamond shape here.
www.pricescope.com
 
As always, good info from both @OoohShiny & @flyingpig.

I might add that while a thicker girdle does offer some benefit, it's a slippery slope. You don't want too much thickness either as it will impact light performance.

Thanks for posting the proportions @TempestX96. My earlier guesses weren't too far off. Got the girdle % right, but missed the descriptors.

I also missed the pavilion depth. My understanding is 40.6 can report back as 42.5 or 43 on the GIA report, depending on a few factors.

1. Math gets us to 42.855% which would theoretically be 43 in the rounding world of GIA.

2. However, even if a cutlet is listed as none, I understand it can have small values that when calculated can make the math come back as 42.7xxx% and would round down to 42.5 on the report.

3. Additionally, because of GIA rounds a reported 40.6 would mean an actual value of 40.5 to 40.699. The lower value of 40.5 would make the math also come back at 42.7xxx% which again would be rounded to 42.5.

So it would appear the none cutlet is truly a 0.0% and/or the rounded pavilion is 40.6+.

Sorry for nerding out. Just talking out loud and making sure I am seeing it correctly and why my initial analysis was off a smidge, at least on the pavilion depth. None of the above would effect the girdle, which was a guesstimate on my behalf.


sledge said:
I agree the 64 depth is making the stone appear smaller. In her case, the pavilion is probably around 42.5%. The crown height will be high, probably in the 16.5% range because of the very steep 37.5 crown, despite having a 57 table. And I'm guessing this stone is carrying a little fat in the mid section with a slightly thick to very thick girdle (around 5%).
Click to expand...
 
I'm guessing autocorrect is changing 'culet' to 'cutlet', Sledge ;) :lol:
 
Based on the numbers ASET.... gia grossly rounds so this may not be accurate.
The dark arrow heads and bright arrow shafts with dark zones between them match up however.
resemblespic1.jpg
 
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