GOG AV Cushions vs others...

[littlemissmango]

I have finally found out the right setting for me that my FF will be having our jeweler design, and I know I want a 1:1 (or close) cushion. Having spent a little time on PS, I of course came across GOG and the August Vintage cushion stones. They look spectacular! But my jeweler says they can find me a square cushion, and I would love to give them our business in that, but what are the differences between a square cushion and GOG''s variety? Do most cushions have smaller, more brilliant-like facets? GOG''s also seem to be more rounded, overall, on the sides, than others I''ve seen. What should I tell them I''m looking for, as far as something that looks like those lovely August vintage stones? Or am I really not going to find anything like them elsewhere?

 

[CharmyPoo]

I will be blunt. It is very unlikely that your local jeweler will be able to find a cushion remotely close to GOG''s AV. GOG''s August Vintage are their own so it will not be possible to get it else where. However, there are chunky cushions (8 fat main plots) that may look similar but no where near the AV''s performance. Your jeweler will probably find you a square modified cushion brillant which you can get anywhere. I doubt they even know what to look for - I would be interested to see what they came back with though.

 

[ChunkyCushionLover]

Date: 1/30/2010 8:27:39 PM
Author:littlemissmango
I have finally found out the right setting for me that my FF will be having our jeweler design, and I know I want a 1:1 (or close) cushion. Having spent a little time on PS, I of course came across GOG and the August Vintage cushion stones. They look spectacular! But my jeweler says they can find me a square cushion, and I would love to give them our business in that, but what are the differences between a square cushion and GOG''s variety? Do most cushions have smaller, more brilliant-like facets? GOG''s also seem to be more rounded, overall, on the sides, than others I''ve seen. What should I tell them I''m looking for, as far as something that looks like those lovely August vintage stones? Or am I really not going to find anything like them elsewhere?

Welcome to Pricescope.

Please see below a guide I put together about cushions, pay particular attention to the bottom section about ASET images which are just about the only reliable way we can judge any potential cushion and determine its light performance without a video or seeing it in person. Any vendor who cannot show you an ASET image is not likely to be well versed in finding well cut cushions and we would strongly reccomend going with someone more knowledgeable in the selection of cushions cuts for light performance.

You also mentioned a square outline, in general modern cushion cuts (ie square cushion ha, 4 main modern , 8 main modern thin) will have more square outlines and the antique cuts will be more rounded. However even among the GOG AVC line the more perfect LW ratio of 1 there are some with the near square outline (example http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/6703/).


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ChunkyCushionLover''s Guide To Buying Cushion Cut Diamonds

Step 1 (Choose The Type of Cut)

Decide the look of cushion you like best. (Watching the videos should help you the most with this.)

i) Cushion Brilliant
a) 4 main like this one http://www.octonus.com/oct/projects/foxymovies/round_cushion2_office_fr.phtml or http://www.vimeo.com/2120607 (4 main is on the far left)
b) 8 main modern http://www.vimeo.com/2120607 (stone on the left)
c) 8 main old mine cushion http://www.vimeo.com/5310842
d) BGD modern 8 main cushion (the mains intersect at the corners) https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/bgd-cushion-let-me-know-what-you-think.128493/

ii) Square Cushion Hearts and Arrows http://video.jogiadiamonds.com.au/images/analysis/CXF7266-2.mov http://video.jogiadiamonds.com.au/images/analysis/CXF7266.mov

iii) Cushette http://www.vimeo.com/3164922

iv) Cushion Modified Brilliant (often referred to negatively as the "crushed ice" variety as many in this category have only small flashes and were cut to save weght not to optimize light return),
a) 4 Pavillion main facets (several varieties)
b) 8 mains (several varieties) http://www.vimeo.com/3164922 Pictures and commentary here https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/the-shocking-final-diamond-choice-i-gave-to-my-fiance-which-one-would-you-pick.121154/
c) Square Brilliant (rare seen more in Belgium)

A helpful thread to see the plots and pictures of different types of cushions can be seen here https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/a-cushion-by-any-other-name.36001/ (keep in mind pictures aren''t as useful as videos and can only be used reliably to understand facet structure not light performance)

If you want to learn about cushions a great video by Jon at GOG can be watched here http://www.vimeo.com/7579666 and bonus footage here http://www.vimeo.com/7611843.

Step 2 (Choose the 4Cs)

1) Post your budget, Color, Clarity, Carat Weight, LW(length to width) Ratio (do you like perfectly Square or Rectangular?) and cut preference. We will help find stones in your price range or tell you if your budget is realistic for the specs you have chosen or if you will have to make some tradeoffs. If you would rather go directly to the vendor at this point I suggest you speak to:

i) Mark at Engagementringsdirect.com
ii) Jon at Goodoldgold.com
iii) Bob at Whiteflash.com
iv) Brian at Briangavindiamonds.com

This list is limited to what I beleive are vendors who specialize in cushion cuts designed for light performance there may be others but I haven''t had experiences with them. Some vendors like GOG and BGD have even developed their own cushion signature cut diamonds lines not available for sale by any other vendor. All of these vendors will be able to provide ASET images and pictures of stones to help you decide prior to purchase.

Example:

Budget: $10,000
Color: H and above
Clarity: SI1 and above (Anything Eyeclean from 6 feet away looking faceup)
Carat Weight: 1.3Ct+
Lw Ratio = 1 - 1.05 (I want square) or 1.1 - 1.3 (I want rectangular)
Cushion Brilliant (Modern) either 4 main or 8 main

Than we can help you narrow things down considerably.

Step 3 (View and Post ASET Image and Photographs and/or see in person)

Ask the vendor for a Video and/or ASET image (http://www.ideal-scope.com/1.using_ASET_scope.asp) of your possible choices and we can help you narrow down which of your selections we prefer and why.

Step 4 (View a side by side comparison at a vendor or appraisor for final selection)

If you are still not sure I would send your two or three favourite stones to a PS listed appraisor https://www.pricescope.com/appr_list.aspx close to you, where you can view your final choices in person prior to purchase you will just have to pay shipping. Many PS vendors will send stones to a trusted appraisor without you having to pay first and the appraisor will only release the stone to you only upon payment to and consent of the vendor.
For such an expensive purchase $100 in shipping and $100 in appraisor time seems well worth it to make the most informed choice possible.

Happy Hunting,

CCL

 

[Yee Haw!]

Date: 1/30/2010 11:44:27 PM
Author: ChunkyCushionLover

Date: 1/30/2010 8:27:39 PM

Please see below a guide I put together about cushions, pay particular attention to the bottom section about ASET images which are just about the only reliable way we can judge any potential cushion and determine its light performance without a video or seeing it in person. Any vendor who cannot show you an ASET image is not likely to be well versed in finding well cut cushions and we would strongly reccomend going with someone more knowledgeable in the selection of cushions cuts for light performance.

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Does Mark at ERD show ASETs? I was under the impression that he didn''t, but nevertheless I wouldn''t hesitate to trust his judgement on what''s a strong performing stone.

 

[ChunkyCushionLover]

Date: 1/31/2010 12:31:43 AM
Author: Yee Haw!

Date: 1/30/2010 11:44:27 PM
Author: ChunkyCushionLover

Date: 1/30/2010 8:27:39 PM

Please see below a guide I put together about cushions, pay particular attention to the bottom section about ASET images which are just about the only reliable way we can judge any potential cushion and determine its light performance without a video or seeing it in person. Any vendor who cannot show you an ASET image is not likely to be well versed in finding well cut cushions and we would strongly reccomend going with someone more knowledgeable in the selection of cushions cuts for light performance.

Does Mark at ERD show ASETs? I was under the impression that he didn't, but nevertheless I wouldn't hesitate to trust his judgement on what's a strong performing stone.

He did for me when I bought my stones. When he doesn't I would still question the cut quality as any other vendor. The honus is on the vendor to prove the stone is a good performer and simply saying "a pretty bright stone" is quickly becoming insufficient for the modern educated consumer.

 

[littlemissmango]

Thank you so much for your advise and expertise!! Unfortunately, I cannot view the videos as the only Internet connection I have at the moment is on my iPhone which won''t do flash-based video (in addition to some of the diamond search functions not playing nicely with the phone). However, in the link with the Brian Gavin diamond the poster was interested in, it was good to see those pictures of the three stones (poster wanted the one in the middle), I did not care for the first two, and the one on the right looked great to me. So now I think I can tell that my preference is the more "antique" look, and I''m also starting to think that they might be harder to come by. BGD seemed to have pretty fair pricing, but I wasn''t able to view the actual stones. By the way, would the AV GOG''s be considered a modified brilliant cushion? Or is that the old mine cut?

BTW... I just saw that the GOG stone I had my eye on is sold! Nooo...

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 1/31/2010 12:31:43 AM
Author: Yee Haw!

Date: 1/30/2010 11:44:27 PM
Author: ChunkyCushionLover

Date: 1/30/2010 8:27:39 PM

Please see below a guide I put together about cushions, pay particular attention to the bottom section about ASET images which are just about the only reliable way we can judge any potential cushion and determine its light performance without a video or seeing it in person. Any vendor who cannot show you an ASET image is not likely to be well versed in finding well cut cushions and we would strongly reccomend going with someone more knowledgeable in the selection of cushions cuts for light performance.

Does Mark at ERD show ASETs? I was under the impression that he didn''t, but nevertheless I wouldn''t hesitate to trust his judgement on what''s a strong performing stone.

Yee Haw, I have seen some ASETs from ERD in the past.

 

[hihowareyou]

I went down exactly the same road as you littlemissmango (except I live in australia).

I like to do things locally so picked a local jeweler to make my ring and having seen the GOG AV stones asked him to try and find something similar. Really I had set him up to fail and he was only able to bring in cushion brilliant and cushion modified brilliants. If you have your heart set on an august vintage cushion then save your jeweler the heart ache of searching for the impossible and either go with GOG or see what Mark at ERD can come up with right off the bat. I found it difficult to call our jeweler and tell him that we''d sourced a stone ourselves but even he admitted when he saw it that it was amazing

 

[ChunkyCushionLover]

Date: 1/31/2010 2:22:39 AM
Author: littlemissmango
Thank you so much for your advise and expertise!! Unfortunately, I cannot view the videos as the only Internet connection I have at the moment is on my iPhone which won''t do flash-based video (in addition to some of the diamond search functions not playing nicely with the phone). However, in the link with the Brian Gavin diamond the poster was interested in, it was good to see those pictures of the three stones (poster wanted the one in the middle), I did not care for the first two, and the one on the right looked great to me. So now I think I can tell that my preference is the more ''antique'' look, and I''m also starting to think that they might be harder to come by. BGD seemed to have pretty fair pricing, but I wasn''t able to view the actual stones. By the way, would the AV GOG''s be considered a modified brilliant cushion? Or is that the old mine cut?

BTW... I just saw that the GOG stone I had my eye on is sold! Nooo...

I am not aware of BGD having access to a selection or particular interest in Chunky Faceted Cushions but any vendor can call in virtual stones and we do know he provides ASET images.
That stone on the right is actually a GOG AVC that he had on hand being set from one of his customers they do not sell them.

If you want big bright mirrors under the table and all four leaves of the cross perfectly reflecting bright than only the GOG August Vintage Cushions will satisfy this. While Mark at ERD does source nice cushions they are not up to the cut standards of GOG AVC line but for many they are nice antique cushions.

If you post your specs and budget we might be able to find some suitable stones for you, alternatively you can speak to Jon at GOG about when he can source you an AVC in your size, budget and color preferences.

 

[CharmyPoo]

Date: 1/31/2010 2:22:39 AM
Author: littlemissmango

By the way, would the AV GOG's be considered a modified brilliant cushion? Or is that the old mine cut?

GOG's August Vintage are not modified cushions. They often get "Old Mine Cut" on the GIA certificates.

The BGD cushions have a very different look from the much loved GOG's AV and the modern 8 main cushions.

 

[ChunkyCushionLover]

Date: 1/31/2010 11:36:43 AM
Author: CharmyPoo

Date: 1/31/2010 2:22:39 AM
Author: littlemissmango

By the way, would the AV GOG''s be considered a modified brilliant cushion? Or is that the old mine cut?

GOG''s August Vintage are not modified cushions. They often get ''Old Mine Cut'' on the GIA certificates.

The BGD cushions have a very different look from the much loved GOG''s AV and the modern 8 main cushions.

Unfortunately GIA has very abirtrary criteria for calling some a cushion brilliant. You will normally get Old Mine Brilliant (Not Old Mine Cut) or Cushion Brilliant on the certificate depending on the size of the culet, crown angles and the length of the LGFs.

GIA uses Cushion Brilliant and Old mine Brilliant are used for AVC which are antique style 8 main. AGS unfortunately does call them Cushion Modified Brilliant but most cushions are sent to GIA or EGL so I wouldn''t worry about it.

In any case you don''t have to worry about the naming especially when you can see a photograph and ASET image already, however for an unknown virtual stone you want to avoid stones labeled Cushion Modified Brilliant on GIA certificates as they will have extra facets and mostly will have smaller virtual facets and a crushed ice appearance. However the name on the certificate matters less if you already can see a photograph and an ASET image and this should trump naming on a certificate which is often not worth worrying about.

 

[littlemissmango]

You guys are so helpful!! I am really starting to think that I am not going to be satisfied with any other cushion now that I''ve fallen in love with the AVC. Case in point, that stone on the right being one... haha! Thanks Chunkycushionlover! And you mentioned they can "source" one for me that fits my needs-- so what you see in their inventory online are not necessarily your only options? That''s wonderful! Thank you also or the clarification on the name or certificate label.

I know I mentioned earlier that another vendor seemed to have better prices, but after a simple google shopping search of the specs of a specific AVC I liked, and even comparing a search at Blue Nile (not that I was considering buying from them) the price for the AV was only marginally more, if at all, than others of the same color, size, and clarity, with "ideal" cuts (which as I gather still would not even compare to GOG''s). The specific AVC was 1.3 ct, J color, and SI1, at about $5200 wire priced. Have you all found the prices of most stones around this size or smaller to be very reasonably priced from GOG?

As for what I am looking for with regard to the specs, I would prefer from 1-1.5 ct, J color and up, and probably SI2 and up. Clarity is not as important to me-- as long as you can''t look down and easily see an inclusion, I am fine with the stone having a spot or two in there. As for budget, I am not entirely sure what the FF was planning on. He has said that he wants help in finding exactly what I like, and so I am just trying to gather up all the knowledge I can so I can direct him to just what I want when he''s ready to buy. We are planning on getting engaged within the next 5 months or so. My setting will not be very expensive (rose gold solitaire) so I am thinking around a $5,000 price point seems reasonable. I''m pretty sure he would agree, but I''m really trying to not bother him about the engagement at all, so the next time it comes up, I''ll ask then.

Thank you all again-- I am feeling much more confident in choosing a GOG. Now I guess I''ll have to break the news to the jeweler!

 

[CharmyPoo]

Date: 1/31/2010 3:12:32 PM
Author: littlemissmango

Have you all found the prices of most stones around this size or smaller to be very reasonably priced from GOG?

Apologies for the "cut" typo earlier - didn't mean to misguide you but it really isn't that big of a deal.

I own cushions from both ERD and GOG. GOG will appear to be higher priced but you are looking at their branded cuts which do come with a premium. In fact, branded cuts from any vendor cost more than non branded diamonds. GOG has amazing policies which are unmatched - they even offer a price match policy for virtual stones. What this means is that if you find a diamond cheaper on another vendor's site (the ones that have virtual diamonds - ex. Blue Nile, ERD, James Allen, etc) - GOG will bring in the diamond and match their prices.

ERD has great prices but you won't be able to get the August Vintage from them. You can get other chunky diamond if you aren't that picky.

I think this one is a lovely choice - http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/6474/

 

[sparkle.castle]

Hi littlemissmango! Glad to see you''ve really started looking at these AVCs! On my AGS certificate my AVC is identified as a "Cushion Modified Brilliant". When I was looking for a stone I noticed on most GIA reports they were identified as "Old Mine Brilliant". (Just as ChunkyCushionLover has said.) Based on your specs, price point and desire for a 1:1 ratio, I wanted to point out this stone Click me!. It''s actually the one I had on reserve before I went to GOG and looked at these stones in person. It is absolutely beautiful. I didn''t end up with this stone for two reasons: 1. I wanted a stone that held more of the "square" look. Since this stone is 1:1, it took on a "rounder" appearance when I had it on my finger. 2. I ended up falling in love with a slightly larger stone that held more of the "square" look with a 1:1.03 ratio. Hope that is helpful!

 

[Dreamer_D]

I love AVC cushions. Hopefully you can get access to the internet somewhere on a computer so you can access the videos on GOG''s website. They are awesome!

 

[shimmer]

Date: 1/31/2010 4:00:57 PM
Author: CharmyPoo

Date: 1/31/2010 3:12:32 PM

Author: littlemissmango


Have you all found the prices of most stones around this size or smaller to be very reasonably priced from GOG?

Apologies for the 'cut' typo earlier - didn't mean to misguide you but it really isn't that big of a deal.


I own cushions from both ERD and GOG. GOG will appear to be higher priced but you are looking at their branded cuts which do come with a premium. In fact, branded cuts from any vendor cost more than non branded diamonds. GOG has amazing policies which are unmatched - they even offer a price match policy for virtual stones. What this means is that if you find a diamond cheaper on another vendor's site (the ones that have virtual diamonds - ex. Blue Nile, ERD, James Allen, etc) - GOG will bring in the diamond and match their prices.


ERD has great prices but you won't be able to get the August Vintage from them. You can get other chunky diamond if you aren't that picky.


I think this one is a lovely choice - http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/6474/

I had that stone for a bit, it is absolutely gorgeous

. The most beautiful diamond that I have ever seen, including my other AV cushion, and round ACA.

ETA: Yes, I am a serial upgrader

 

[littlemissmango]

Charmy-- that is the stone I had my eye on!! And Shimmer, you used to own it? How cool is that!? The fact that you've seen it and can vouch for it's beauty is a big plus to me! Does it face up pretty white, as it seems to in the photo? Ahh I hope it stays available long enough for my guy to snatch it up! (it's now my avatar, hope I'm not breaking any rules by taking the image!)
Sparklecastle-- that is a very lovely stone too! I actually would prefer a more rounded shape. When I mentioned a square shape earlier, I suppose I only meant not rectangular in appearance. Thanks for pointing out that stone to me as well!
Edit: Sparkle, I just realized that you are the one with the petite torchiere I am absolutely crazy about! I didn't notice that at first - it's easy to overlook things on a 3 inch screen (my phone)! Thanks again for your inspiration and help!
I'm getting pretty excited now!

 

[ChunkyCushionLover]

Date: 2/1/2010 12:26:46 AM
Author: littlemissmango
Charmy-- that is the stone I had my eye on!! And Shimmer, you used to own it? How cool is that!? The fact that you''ve seen it and can vouch for it''s beauty is a big plus to me! Does it face up pretty white, as it seems to in the photo? Ahh I hope it stays available long enough for my guy to snatch it up! (it''s now my avatar, hope I''m not breaking any rules by taking the image!)
Sparklecastle-- that is a very lovely stone too! I actually would prefer a more rounded shape. When I mentioned a square shape earlier, I suppose I only meant not rectangular in appearance. Thanks for pointing out that stone to me as well!

I''m getting pretty excited now!

Put it on reserve ASAP, many lurkers here may beat you to it.