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Fluorescence in D-E-F color Diamonds

Discussion in 'RockyTalky' started by Big Fat Facets, Jul 3, 2019.

  1. Big Fat Facets
    Shiny_Rock

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    by Big Fat Facets » Jul 3, 2019
    Hi!
    I understand that fluorescence in warmer diamonds can be desirable as long as it does not cause the diamond to appear hazy, milky, oily, filmy. But is it desirable in colorless diamonds?? will fluorescence in a colorless stone have an adverse affect??
    o_O
     
    


    


  2. whitewave
    Ideal_Rock

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    by whitewave » Jul 3, 2019
    Generally speaking, no, unless it is one of a very few that may give it a hazy appearance, but with PS vendors, this shouldn’t be an issue.

    Did you find one you want us to look at?
     
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  3. Morenita21
    Shiny_Rock

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    by Morenita21 » Jul 3, 2019
    Not usually an issue even in DEF ranges, but be sure to look at it in the sun or have someone you trust with a trained eye. You get a discounted diamond!
     
  4. PrismBaby
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    by PrismBaby » Jul 3, 2019
    I always see fluorescence as a beautiful natural phenomena in any color grade, as long as it doesn’t have any negative impact on the stones transparency. I do agree price should be reflected in D/E/F diamonds. :cool2:

    Check out phosphorescence when you get a chance.. gets me glowing!
     
    


    


  5. marcy
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    by marcy » Jul 4, 2019
    I don’t feel it has any negative impact on colorless diamonds. As long as it doesn’t look milky it should look fine.
     
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  6. Big Fat Facets
    Shiny_Rock

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    by Big Fat Facets » Jul 4, 2019
    Thanks so much, whitewave!!
    don't have a particular one to look at just yet...but very very soon...=)2
     
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  7. Big Fat Facets
    Shiny_Rock

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    by Big Fat Facets » Jul 4, 2019
    thanks so much morenita21!! yes, will definitely be sure to examine in the sun.
     
  8. Big Fat Facets
    Shiny_Rock

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    by Big Fat Facets » Jul 4, 2019
    Thanks very much prismbaby!! So appreciate your help!! and will look up phosphorescence!!
     
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  9. Big Fat Facets
    Shiny_Rock

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    by Big Fat Facets » Jul 4, 2019
    Thank you very much marcy! really appreciate your help!!
     
  10. ALRAAA
    Rough_Rock

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    by ALRAAA » Jul 4, 2019
    One of the diamonds I am considering is a 3 carat D colored stone with localized medium blue fluorescence.
    I inspected it under just about every light condition available. One could never see fluorescence unless under direct black light in the lab. Not in the sun, in direct and strong sunlight, not in office environments, not in elevators, not by windows, etc.

    No haziness - All of that is bs.

    Seeing truly is believing.
     
    


    


  11. OoohShiny
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    by OoohShiny » Jul 4, 2019
    Localised fluor is quite unusual, it seems! :))
    https://www.gia.edu/gems-gemology/summer-2017-labnotes-diamond-unusual-fluorescence-distribution
     
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  12. Wink
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    by Wink » Jul 4, 2019
    The biggest disadvantage to fluorescence in colorless diamonds is how badly the market devalues them. When such a diamond appears slightly blueish in the sun that is a diamond that many years ago would have been called a blue-white and were for a while the most sought after diamonds. The term came to be so badly used by jewelers selling to an uneducated public that eventually the FTC made it illegal to use that term. (Many jewelers used it to describe any diamond with fluorescent, including stones that were obviously yellow, clearly not what the term was originally used to describe.)

    In recent years, the fluorescent diamonds are more and more discounted to the point where they are difficult to sell at any price because of the unwarranted fear of fluorescence.

    Wink
     
  13. Dancing Fire
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    by Dancing Fire » Jul 4, 2019
    I don't discriminate. :praise:. I'll wear a VSB to none.

    IMG_2765.JPG IMG_0067.jpg
     
  14. Big Fat Facets
    Shiny_Rock

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    by Big Fat Facets » Jul 4, 2019
    Thanks alraaa! i too am looking at 3+ carat stones. The wonderful people here are extraordinarily knowledgable and so kind to offer their help. i am finding it a bit overwhelming... Hope you are enjoying yourself.
     
  15. Big Fat Facets
    Shiny_Rock

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  16. Big Fat Facets
    Shiny_Rock

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    by Big Fat Facets » Jul 4, 2019
    So appreciate you taking the time wink!! massive thanks! and Happy Fourth!!
     
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  17. Big Fat Facets
    Shiny_Rock

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    by Big Fat Facets » Jul 4, 2019
    Wow. Absolutely Gorgeous!! Who needs fireworks when you've got bigger spectacular diamonds?!
    Thanks so much for sharing these, dancing fire!! the colorful sparkles on your round brilliant is so alluring!! Happy Fourth!!
     
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  18. Garry H (Cut Nut)
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    by Garry H (Cut Nut) » Jul 4, 2019
    The GIA was over grading color of fluoro diamonds up till 20 years ago. Since then they changed their lights and distance to the lamp which stopped the over grading.
    The biggest single factor was a TV journalist expose in Korea which resulted in thousands of fluoro diamonds being returned to the jewellers because they were over graded for color. That caused the current pricing differential along with the fact that D F 'investment diamonds' should not have fluoro because the need to be examined to check for deleterious effects and that reduces their fungability or ability to be sold sight unseen. Running away from bad govt's etc - very popular purchases in a lot of Asian countries.
    All pretty stupid. Personally I would not have any loved ones not have a strong blue fluoro diamond that I have check for negative effects.
     
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  19. Texas Leaguer
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    by Texas Leaguer » Jul 4, 2019
    As @Wink explained, the most adverse effect, aside from potential transparency issues, is the impact on price. A colorless diamond can't ever benefit from the color masking effect that can happen under intense UV light, therefore the market only punishes the trait in DEF colors. But this may be an advantage if you like fluorescence, enabling you to get a significantly lower price.

    There can be a liquidity issue if you ever want to sell the diamond as a result of these market perceptions, so that is something to consider as well.
     
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  20. Garry H (Cut Nut)
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    by Garry H (Cut Nut) » Jul 4, 2019
    Please note this:
    in the medium term there will be (more) research published that debunks the current perception and high color fluorexcent diamonds will again be sold at a premium.
    You heard it from me.
    Any one want to bet on this - with 5 years to completing the bet?
     
  21. Texas Leaguer
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    by Texas Leaguer » Jul 4, 2019
    fluorexcent? Is that a triple excellent with fluorescence? :D

    I think you just coined a new term G-man.
     
  22. Garry H (Cut Nut)
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    by Garry H (Cut Nut) » Jul 4, 2019
    Sorr
    Sorry for musspullin
    fluorexcellent

    hahahaha
     
  23. AV_
    Brilliant_Rock

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    by AV_ » Jul 4, 2019
    How consistent is this discount?
     
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  24. Big Fat Facets
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    by Big Fat Facets » Jul 4, 2019
    I don't know AV...
    hopefully, the experts will once again chime in...
     
  25. AV_
    Brilliant_Rock

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    by AV_ » Jul 4, 2019
    @Big Fat Facets Just on some limited search, there seem to be quite a few exceptions to the rule - that is to say, fluorescent, colourless diamonds not priced less than counterparts with the same color / clarity / weight. I was playing with listings of step cuts, not rounds, so there is no standard cut to speak of. How many exceptions? I am not counting.
     
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  26. ALRAAA
    Rough_Rock

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    by ALRAAA » Jul 4, 2019
    I looked at a 3 carat, D colored diamond. Medium Fluorescence had absolutely no effect. Except for an interesting glow under black light, I was never able to see under any other light conditions.
     
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  27. Big Fat Facets
    Shiny_Rock

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    by Big Fat Facets » Jul 4, 2019
    Was it somewhat discounted in price in comparison to a non fluorescence d colored 3 carat??
     
  28. ALRAAA
    Rough_Rock

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    by ALRAAA » Jul 4, 2019
    Yes, ~ 15%
     
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  29. Wink
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    by Wink » Jul 5, 2019
    Garry,

    You are on. I will bet you $100 that one carat D, E, F color diamonds with strong to medium blue fluorescence will not sell at a premium as per Rap pricing within 5 years of this date, 7/4/2019.

    It is $100 that I would be happy to lose, as I have been wanting what you are betting on to be true since 1978. It was true when I got in the market in 1970 and as late as 1975 I paid a premium for nice diamonds with a blush tint out of doors on a sunny day. By 1978 the diamond investment craze was in full swing, and fluorescent diamonds, in all of their beauty were no longer welcome to play with the big boys.

    Who shall we have hold the money?

    Wink
     
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  30. headlight
    Brilliant_Rock

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    by headlight » Jul 5, 2019
    I can’t get enough of seeing these extraordinary rings!!!
     

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