Diamond question

[yssie]

Really? Because their nearest jewelry shop won't have any skin in the game?

OP, if you want a truly neutral assessment, then you could have the stone inspected by an INDEPENDENT appraiser. We'd recommend a PS one, which you could find in the resources section up at the top of the PS page.

Ditto. Do not take your stone to a local jeweller for inspection and with any expectation of receiving a knowledgeable or unbiased opinion.

 

[yssie]

@OoohShiny I hope I did not mis-speak! I just reread this thread:
https://www.pricescope.com/communit...han-rhino-for-his-exciting-news.234130/page-2

And I believe that is true, but let’s strike it from the record until someone else confirms!

 

[KingKuda]

OP, just to reiterate my point again.

It seems as though there is a never ending cycle with regular every day people who can't spend an arm and a leg on a diamond.

If you put a diamond on here with any inclusions on the table, even though it is likely to be far more durable, you will get told by most posters to look for something else that is eye clean and has inclusions closer to the edges.

When you find a diamond with inclusions on the edges, in 90% of the cases these inclusions will include feathers and then you will be scared into thinking that these are a durability concern.

The only solution is to keep going up on the clarity scale which in turn results in big jumps on the price scale as well. Before you know it, you’ve increased your budget by 30% for a diamond smaller in size based on a questionable belief that a feather will snap your diamond in half.

I’ve researched feathers like crazy over the last week, it’s become an obsession. What I am finding is that a lot of ‘experts’ steer clear of them because they see them as a crack and assume that a crack has to be an issue right? Most of them have made statements that are entirely wrong and contradict what others, with the same qualifications, are saying.

As I pointed out in my earlier post, a month ago when I first began this journey, I walked into a jeweller in the City that all my friends have bought their rings from and got a quote for a 1.5 carrot engagement ring. Like all my friends with fiancées that love their rings, I didn’t look at the GIA certificate, I didn’t look at dimensions, etc I just left it all in the jewellers hands. Being inquisitive, I got bored one night and started researching which is how I ended up here. What I found was that the diamond I was about to put a deposit down for was an F/SI2 with several questionable inclusions that I’d never choose now knowing what I know.

While my research has now seen me end up with an E/SI1 diamond with inclusions I am far more comfortable with, the reality is that had I not of done any research I still would have ended up with a ring I was over the moon about and I’d never have known a thing about any of the inclusions and the potential ‘durability’ issues some might say these have.

Every ring can chip and get damaged, regardless of how perfect it is. This just reiterates the need for insurance which in turn gives you complete peace of mind. I’d prefer to pay $15k for a diamond with feathers that ‘may’ break then $30k for a diamond without feathers that ‘may’ still break. Both will look stunning in most cases and both will require insurance.

 

[yssie]

@KingKuda You are, by your own admission, new to this industry. Newcomers - even newcomers who have investigated a given topic intently for a week - are predisposed to oversimplification; there are several oversimplifications in your last post and sometimes - not always, but sometimes - nuances do matter.

I happily owned a 2.7ct SI2 for several years - my engagement ring. To correct a few of your assertions:

1. Buyers are neither blindly nor blithely advised to find stones with inclusions off to the side instead of under the table. Buyers who post options with inclusions that more experienced eyes can definitively determine will be visible in many lighting conditions are advised as such, and are also usually informed that inclusions under the crown are often less visible and/or may be prongable. When it is unclear how visible inclusions will be, or when there are questions about durability or effects on light return, the most common (and most appropriate) recommendation you will see here on PS is to have the stone shipped out for inspection in-person - or, if that isn’t feasible, to solicit an objective authority. You’ll note this is exactly what @ac117 recommended.
2. Feathers are one type of inclusion amongst dozens. It is absolutely not the case that 90% of the time feathers will be present - and even if they are, there is a marked difference between grade-making crown-breaching feathers in an SI2 and, say, feathers listed third in an SI2, or grade-making feathers in a VS2.

No one is advocating for increasing the budget by any amount - I’ve seen nothing of the sort in this thread thus far, at least. As I and others have explained - absolutely everyone has a budget and priorities, and no one has a spare arm or leg PSers freely give of their time and experience to help new consumers understand the pros and cons of their choices; often there are ways to mitigate some concerns (like bezelling this stone rather than introducing pressure-point stress with prongs, as @Sunstorm suggested).

I agree that insurance is invaluable. However, should irreparable damage occur, an insurance replacement may not wholly satisfy a woman for whom the diamond with which she was proposed to has sentimental value. I’m not saying this is the case here - I’m saying that it could be. Making an insurance claim may affect one’s premiums and provider eligibility for years moving forward. Insurance is a safety net for when things go disastrously wrong - and keep in mind that the more particular one is about his stones, the more painful the claim process is likely to be.

Whilst it is true that many people are perfectly happy with diamonds they know little to nothing about (and care to know little to nothing about), people who come to PS are looking for information. They’re looking for help translating their priorities into a small handful of diamond selections, and they’re looking for help making educated decisions about what to demand and what to compromise on. From that perspective this thread has done its job admirably: OP has been given a selection of stones that meet his primary criteria, has been enlightened to the benefits and concerns associated with his current choice, and has been given actionable paths forward should he decide to pursue those concerns. Since he now has all the context he needs to make an informed decision about what, if anything, to do next, whatever decision he does make will be the correct one for him - because it is informed. To simply denounce concerns about any stone as “paranoia of the experienced” because contemplating the nuances is inconvenient, or more effort than you desire to put into the task, does everyone else a disservice.

 

[KingKuda]

Please don't take my post the wrong way, this place is amazing. I genuinely don't know where I'd be without it.

I'm just trying to put things into perspective for those who have diamonds that aren't perfect. You should always try to get the best that you can get for your budget and that's where this place is amazing, however once you have purchased something you need to move on and enjoy what you have. All diamonds can break, chip, split and get lost, that's the reality of is. So enjoy what have and don't stress about imperfections once you've made the decision to proceed.

 

[KingKuda]

Durability issues.. The feather ( break ) it's damm huge.. this will cause your diamond turn in two pieces.. so please be very careful

It's posts like this that scare most people off feathers and it's plain wrong.

 

[yssie]

Ah. It seems that part of the discord surrounds what stage of completion this project is in!! SMTB is obviously hands-off for any critiquing, but I personally consider any active RT threads to be fair game for raising questions, concerns, comments. I do, however, take your point: as someone who went through this exercise for the first time recently it is very plausible you have a better feel for how far into “I’m exhausted, time to wrap this up, stop worrying, stop questioning” OP is than I do!

I would still say that the discussion here in RT benefits PS, even if it’s at the cost of extra stress OP didn’t want - but I know many people will probably disagree with me! That’s okay - the arguing keeps things interesting

Agree with the above: a simplistic black and white assertion sans situational awareness is misinformation that is of no value.

 

[YoLaL]

I dont think this post is wrong . As saying goes " Truth Hurts ".

It's posts like this that scare most people off feathers and it's plain wrong.

 

[KingKuda]

I dont think this post is wrong . As saying goes " Truth Hurts ".

It's got nothing to do with truth hurting at all. You have no idea what so ever whether that diamond will split into 2, so it's a stupid comment.

 

[YoLaL]

Hmmm is not a stupid comment but theres a big chance this diamond will chip off.Its a SI2 diamond and majority inclusions is Feather. You know feather is a break right. But this big feather its not acceptable and the worse there that the feather its look really touching on the surface which makes so scary.... just saying

It's got nothing to do with truth hurting at all. You have no idea what so ever whether that diamond will split into 2, so it's a stupid comment.

 

[OoohShiny]

@YoLaL - please tell us your experience of assessing diamonds.

 

[YoLaL]

Im just a diamond enthusiast. 9yrs in this Diamond Trade.

@YoLaL - please tell us your experience of assessing diamonds.

 

[Lorelei]

@flashstep ofcourse vendor wont tell you about the issues. I suggest that once you receive the ring you can go to your nearest jewellery shop and ask help to check the feather inclusions .

I think you mean an independent appraiser.

 

[Lorelei]

Im just a diamond enthusiast. 9yrs in this Diamond Trade.

If you are in the trade, you are required to disclose that here.

 

[Lorelei]

Hmmm is not a stupid comment but theres a big chance this diamond will chip off.Its a SI2 diamond and majority inclusions is Feather. You know feather is a break right. But this big feather its not acceptable and the worse there that the feather its look really touching on the surface which makes so scary.... just saying

Stop scaremongering please.

 

[Rhino]

Wait... what?

Have I missed some news??!

While I do not speak for GOG I'm confident this isn't the case. The primary difference now is that they are no longer operating under Rhino.

 

[YoLaL]

Yup

I think you mean an independent appraiser.

 

[flashstep]

Yes!!

Yayy!! I got my hands on the diamond today!!
Testing it out on my pinky finger.

The diamond is brilliant, thank you everyone!!

Stupid question: Realised it will not shine at every angle. Rightfully, does it have to?! Is this alright?





And thanks for all your concerns on the feather issue. I will bring it to a local gemologist to have it examine before deciding on my options.

 

[OoohShiny]

Im just a diamond enthusiast. 9yrs in this Diamond Trade.

If you are in the trade, you are required to disclose that here.

Do you work in the diamond trade, @YoLaL?
Have you made money selling diamonds or advising other people?
Do you have a website?

 

[Lorelei]

It looks beautiful and let us know the result of your appraiser's evaluation.

 

[Lorelei]

Yes!!

Yayy!! I got my hands on the diamond today!!
Testing it out on my pinky finger.

The diamond is brilliant, thank you everyone!!

Stupid question: Realised it will not shine at every angle. Rightfully, does it have to?! Is this alright?





And thanks for all your concerns on the feather issue. I will bring it to a local gemologist to have it examine before deciding on my options.

Just to address the sparkle question, diamonds need light to perform and you won't see them sparkling in all lighting conditions, this is normal. In some lights they'll look just white, others you'll see the fire, others white light, sometimes a mix and from the side angle, you won't see as much going on as where the action is will be on the top of the stone. This is perfectly normal behaviour of a diamond.

 

[yssie]

While I do not speak for GOG I'm confident this isn't the case. The primary difference now is that they are no longer operating under Rhino.

Thanks for clarifying this!! I misspoke earlier in this thread!

 

[skypie]

You've got some hairy fingers, lady! JK jk, sir.

 

[Rhino]

Just to address the sparkle question, diamonds need light to perform and you won't see them sparkling in all lighting conditions, this is normal. In some lights they'll look just white, others you'll see the fire, others white light, sometimes a mix and from the side angle, you won't see as much going on as where the action is will be on the top of the stone. This is perfectly normal behaviour of a diamond.

Just to add to Lorelei's excellent input...

Think of a diamond's facets as a series of

• grabbers of light (via the crown facets) ie. Input
• reflectors of what the crown grabs (via the pavilion facets). Ie. Output

When crown angles are positioned in such a way as to grab it's "input" from around the head of the observer and above the horizon (specifically that 45-75 degree angular spectrum), you've got the input working as it should.

When the pavilion is working in synergy with the crown it will take those reflections the crown had drawn in and push them back into the eyes of the observer.

Now ... since a diamond isn't a nuclear furnace it is dependent upon the existing light in the atmosphere we are in. If there is little to no light ... there will be little to no brilliance even in the rarest and most beautiful diamonds. Ie. Two diamonds will look equally non-brilliant in a dark room with no lights.

The ideal cut however will do the best job of grabbing any inkling of existing light and reflecting it back to the eyes.

All the best,
Rhino

 

[YoLaL]

Wow!!! Looking forward of your appraiser's evaluation.
Asside from the feather issues also ask the appraiser if the diamond is not milky ( coz sometimes milky stone affect the brilliance of the diamond ).
If the result is good and happy with your purchase, then move on and All the best on your proposal .

Yes!!

Yayy!! I got my hands on the diamond today!!
Testing it out on my pinky finger.

The diamond is brilliant, thank you everyone!!

Stupid question: Realised it will not shine at every angle. Rightfully, does it have to?! Is this alright?





And thanks for all your concerns on the feather issue. I will bring it to a local gemologist to have it examine before deciding on my options.

 

[foxinsox]

Yes!!

Yayy!! I got my hands on the diamond today!!
Testing it out on my pinky finger.

The diamond is brilliant, thank you everyone!!

Stupid question: Realised it will not shine at every angle. Rightfully, does it have to?! Is this alright?





And thanks for all your concerns on the feather issue. I will bring it to a local gemologist to have it examine before deciding on my options.

Looks awesome! Is there engraving on the shank? It’s a really lovely bright stone. Great work! Please come back with handshots after she says yes