.48 ags0 or sacrifice to go bigger?

[Jake113]

Hey all,

I've been lurking for a while trying to put together the perfect ring for my (future) fiance. She is fairly petite with a size 4 finger so I have been trying to put something together that is nice, but not overly large. After some input from her I've decided on a 3 stone band with .3ctw pears on the sides and roughly a .5-.6 center stone.

Here's a picture of the setting I'm looking at now:
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-vbrex9hMb1NGpyd0ExenBSSEE/edit?usp=sharing

I've been looking at a lot of center stones at local shops, and so far have not been very satisfied with what they're offering for what their asking. (The side stones come with the band.) This has given me a good feel for what I'm looking for in the stone, which coupled with her input has helped me narrow down the search a lot.

The stone I am currently looking at is:
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2970622.htm

It's a little smaller than my goal of .5, but I've looked at a .42 GIA3X in store and was pretty happy with the size overall. I think .48 should be fine, but the longer I look at stones the more I find myself wanting to go bigger and bigger! (I'm sure I'm not the first person with this problem )

The other thing that has me worried is the number of inclusions that are very visible in the H&A image. (The report isn't up yet but should be coming soon) It is an SI1 which would lead me to believe that the inclusions shouldn't be detectable to the naked eye, but the number and location of them is a bit alarming. Is this something I should be worried about?

The best part is that the stone is less than my max price of about $1750. I've tried looking for other stones that are similar cut quality but are maybe slightly larger or have less inclusions, but from what I've seen the extra $450 or so doesn't get me all that much.

I should also add that color is fairly important to her, so I'm a bit hesitant to look at anything lower than G, though H would probably be okay as well.

What do you guys think?

 

[AprilBaby]

If WF says its eye clean I'm sure it is. How much more could you get in a G color?

 

[Niel]

What's your total budget? And are you set on that specific ring or just that style?

The only think I'll say is a g/h is still going to be white, and I think that design is more flattering the larger the center stone.

 

[GoSounders]

Here's one at $1833 wire price that's a bit bigger, though H color:
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/0.581-h-si1-round-diamond-ags-9408409

Another 58 pointer H color that's not a branded cut, but GIA excellent and looks good: $1500
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.58-carat-h-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-183186

Yet another H color, 62 points, larger at 5.56mm, not quite perfectly cut but still GIA excellent, strong blue flouro (not sure if that's a deal-breaker), $1720
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.62-carat-h-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-160093

JA also has a PS discount, I believe.

 

[msop04]

Here's a picture of the setting I'm looking at now:
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-vbrex9hMb1NGpyd0ExenBSSEE/edit?usp=sharing

The stone I am currently looking at is:
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2970622.htm

It's a little smaller than my goal of .5, but I've looked at a .42 GIA3X in store and was pretty happy with the size overall. I think .48 should be fine, but the longer I look at stones the more I find myself wanting to go bigger and bigger! (I'm sure I'm not the first person with this problem ) <---

The best part is that the stone is less than my max price of about $1750. I've tried looking for other stones that are similar cut quality but are maybe slightly larger or have less inclusions, but from what I've seen the extra $450 or so doesn't get me all that much.

I should also add that color is fairly important to her, so I'm a bit hesitant to look at anything lower than G, though H would probably be okay as well.

Hey Jake113!

I'll try to be organized when I answer...

1) Setting - I like this setting, classic and beautiful. With the size stone you are considering (0.5ct-ish), I would try to find a setting where the diamond sits up a little higher than the side stones. This will make the center look a little larger. (That is, unless your GF specifically asked for a more flush to the finger setting). Do you know the color/clarity of the pears? They (at least the color) will need to be such that there isn't a contrast with the center stone. Do you know the size of the center stone in the photo? The reason I ask is that it looks much larger than a 0.5 ct round if the pears are 0.3. I may be wrong, but just asking.

2) Stone - I like the stone you linked. Is the $1750 the total budget or just for the diamond? I absolutely think you can go to an H without any tint whatsoever -- and you can maximize your budget. I wouldn't worry so much about the inclusions shown on the H&A plot. They will most likely not be seen at all (remember that image is blown up huge). WF will check it out for you if you are concerned about it being eye-clean.

Are you open to other vendors?

I know that some will probably disagree with me, but... at the size stone you are considering, I would not pay the premium for H&A. I would be looking for stones that "just missed the mark" and still look great -- it is nearly impossible to detect the difference in those and H&A). This will allow you to "go bigger" and still have not compromised anything that will be noticed. So... if you drop to EX(non-H&A) and H, you may have a lot more options -- every 0.1mm counts and will be noticable at this size range.

Hope this helps!!

 

[yssie]

These sorts of questions are always tough, because take ten people and you're liable to get ten different sets of priorities! You've got some good input - here's my 2c:

1. Do you live in the US? In the US - moreso than in many other countries, it seems - size does matter. To the vast majority of women. Up to a point, and assuming some balance of other specs, of course... but since it's gauche to openly indicate that size matters - quality over quantity and all that - not wanting to look materialistic leaves the (many) women for whom size is a high priority in rather a pickle. My question (there's obviously no wrong answer): are you confident that she would rather have a three-stone than one larger centerstone?

2. Are any others in your social circle(s) engaged/married? If so, what sorts of rings have they chosen? Again, that's not to suggest that you should choose based on what they've chosen - her tastes could be completely different - but it can be something of a baseline for comparison.

3. What exactly do you mean when you say that colour is fairly important to her? Have you both gone out and looked at some decently cut ~0.5ct RBs and she's discovered that she can spot colour differences easily, and is turned off by lower colours? Does she work in a field that requires a particular eye for colour? I ask because
A) body colour in stones of this size is going to be much less noticeable than in a larger stone, and
B) small increases in carat weight in this size translate into much larger increases in mm diameter than in larger stones

If your goal is a 0.5ct center then you're dead on with a 0.48! If, however, you're contemplating the quality vs. quantity question, I would urge you to talk to her and see if you can't get a better feel for whether she'd prefer a larger, lower-coloured (but still unquestionably "white" to anyone admiring it) stone.

4. Will you be buying stone and setting from the same vendor? If not, does your chosen vendor for the setting charge a fee to set stones purchased elsewhere (many do), and if so does the budget of $1750 exclude this fee?

Ditto msop - I would not generally pay a premium for H&A in this size, but if you're buying the whole thing from WF it is likely more cost/time-effective to choose an in-house stone... Something to discuss with your SA.

 

[msop04]

You bring up some very good points, Yssie.

 

[Jake113]

Thanks for all of the great responses! I'm at work but here are some quick answers:

1) My total budget is 4k, I have a local vendor that will make the band for me but it'll cost around $2250 in 18kwg. This leaves ~1750 for the stone. Since I am having it made I will be able to incorporate feedback about the band such as msop's suggestion to place the center stone a bit above the sides.

2) I'm not sure about the color of the side stones, I'll have to ask.

2) She really wants a 3-stone ring. We spent a few days going to a lot of different stores and those were the ones she liked the most.

3) It sounds like there is room to negotiate on color. She has said to me "I really don't want it to be yellowy," but never quantified that in terms of an actual rating. When I was in the stores it seemed that "yellowy" started around I, so being an engineer I rounded up to be safe.

4) I am open to whatever vendor has the right diamond for me. Getting the band and diamond all in one place would be nice, but is not a necessity.

5) Size is a hard call. We're still young so not many people in our social circles are married, and those that are got married early into or before their carriers and have rings that reflect that. (Though they seem to still be perfectly happy! ) She has mentioned to me several times that she doesn't want to go overboard on size (overboard to her being 1ct or greater) but there is a large range between .5-1. It may be that I need to take her with me to a few more jewelers to double check that I'm in the right ballpark with sizing.

It sounds like I should slow down and keep my eye on pricescope for a while longer to make sure that I've really found the best diamond for me. Thanks again for all the feedback!

 

[marymm]

OP - just so you get an idea of proportions, here's C.P's thread about her BGD three-stone ring with a 0.485ct center stone and two 0.20ct pear side-stones - her ring size is 5.25 - super gorgeous, right?: https://www.pricescope.com/communit...-3-stone-e-ring.185109/#post-3371199#p3371199

I do really like the three-stone ring design your jeweler came up with - it seems fluid and graceful and low-profile - I do wonder though, for proportionality, if the side pears should be more like 0.20ct each or even 0.25ct each, rather than the 0.30ct you are proposing? And I also wonder, if you are talking about raising the center stone above the side-stones, aren't you losing some of the "flow" of the original ring design? For that matter, if you are considering changing the ring design, BGD has several three-stone rings with pear side-stones and if you were to also buy the center stone from BGD, you'd be saving on the center stone setting fee I am presuming your local jeweler would charge if you bought the diamond online.

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/e...estones-with-shoulders-18k-white-gold-5367w18
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/e...ne/grace-3-stone-pears-18k-white-gold-5557w18
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/engagement-rings/three-stone/the-summer-18k-white-gold-5371w18

 

[Jake113]

marymm,

Thank you so much for the picture, it helps me out a lot!

For clarity I've been considering .3ctw for the sides, so .15 each. Though that ring looks so nice I might have to consider .2 each. I'll check out BGD when I get home tonight.

 

[msop04]

Thanks for all of the great responses! I'm at work but here are some quick answers:

1) My total budget is 4k, I have a local vendor that will make the band for me but it'll cost around $2250 in 18kwg. This leaves ~1750 for the stone. Since I am having it made I will be able to incorporate feedback about the band such as msop's suggestion to place the center stone a bit above the sides.

2) I'm not sure about the color of the side stones, I'll have to ask.

2) She really wants a 3-stone ring. We spent a few days going to a lot of different stores and those were the ones she liked the most.

3) It sounds like there is room to negotiate on color. She has said to me "I really don't want it to be yellowy," but never quantified that in terms of an actual rating. When I was in the stores it seemed that "yellowy" started around I, so being an engineer I rounded up to be safe.

4) I am open to whatever vendor has the right diamond for me. Getting the band and diamond all in one place would be nice, but is not a necessity.

5) Size is a hard call. We're still young so not many people in our social circles are married, and those that are got married early into or before their carriers and have rings that reflect that. (Though they seem to still be perfectly happy! ) She has mentioned to me several times that she doesn't want to go overboard on size (overboard to her being 1ct or greater) but there is a large range between .5-1. It may be that I need to take her with me to a few more jewelers to double check that I'm in the right ballpark with sizing.

It sounds like I should slow down and keep my eye on pricescope for a while longer to make sure that I've really found the best diamond for me. Thanks again for all the feedback!

I'm going to be really honest... I would not spend more on the setting than the diamond... not at this size... well... never.

You can get her a MUCH larger solitaire and a nice band with smaller diamonds. That setting is totally eating up your budget. You can always upgrade the band to a three stone later on. I may be wrong, but I'm betting she'd rather have a diamond almost twice the size in a solitaire than the smaller three stone. I would take her to try some on...

An H (or even an I) color stone with EX cut will NOT be "yellow-y". At. all. Where you looking at GIA EX or AGS 0 stones? If not, then you'd be comparing apples to oranges... or lemons.

I think you're making the best decision by hanging out a bit longer on PS - you will be surprised at what these ladies (and gents) can find for you.

 

[msop04]

This diamond from JA looks really nice. It has an inclusion on the outer edge that can be pronged so you won't see it.

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.80-carat-h-color-si1-clarity-sku-227745

 

[yssie]

We're talking about a basic three-stone wire casting, right? I recommend seriously considering 14k WG. It'll look exactly the same once plated, and you can save/re-assign a couple hundred more.

Ditto msop again! If her requirement is that she "doesn't want it to be yellowy" then a reputably graded (GIA/AGSL in the US) H/I will be just fine - say H to be safe. F is total overkill per her requirement.

There's a HUGE difference between a 0.5ct and a 1ct and I would definitely suggest you confirm which end of that range she's expecting/dreaming about/hoping for! For me a 6ct RB is probably "overboard" but I'd be perfectly happy to be surprised with a 5.95

 

[mr.ingocnito]

I think for an engagement ring, an excellent cut diamond is very important. Also remember that the better the cut, the less notable the yellow. Although every eyes are different my wife has a round AGS000 BGD Signature 1.7 RB that is I in color. At times I can see a slight yellowish tint, mainly in extremely poor lighting. When it sparkles it looks like a D with a nice balance of brilliance and fire. Some people can't even notice any yellow, others can see a little. My wife's bestfriends sister and husband are diamond enthusiast and thought it was a D! They even busted out a loop and knew it was an H&A diamond. I wasn't there, but I'm guessing the lighting was amazing wherever they were ..If I could go back and increase my budget a litlte I probably would have went H or G too. Like Yssie mentioned with a smaller diamond you won't be able to see the yellowish tint as obviously compared to a bigger one. If you're not sure about the color I would go and check out some stores out for similiar cut diamonds in that size range and colors. You could bring you're GF too and compare H and G color diamonds. We actually checked out some store beforehand and looked at some H&A cut diamonds, HOF and Jareds peerless diamond.

Anyway just my 2 cents from another male perspective... good luck!

 

[Niel]

I would use 14k, get an ideal cut but not pay for a brand H&A... H to be safe, but an I is very white. And I worry if you were actually looking at a gia I or a egl or something. Some grading labs are softer than others.

I would contact Idjewelry and see what they can do for you. They work magic with a budget and do lovely work!


I've never looked at a stone and been jealous of how white it is. I have been jealous of size..... just food for thought.

 

[msop04]

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-dia...-g-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-205070 GORGEOUS

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-dia...-h-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-201758 Have JA check to make sure it's eye-clean.

 

[GoSounders]

I'm going to be really honest... I would not spend more on the setting than the diamond... not at this size... well... never.

You can get her a MUCH larger solitaire and a nice band with smaller diamonds. That setting is totally eating up your budget. You can always upgrade the band to a three stone later on. I may be wrong, but I'm betting she'd rather have a diamond almost twice the size in a solitaire than the smaller three stone. I would take her to try some on...

Not everyone agrees that more is more. Jake's girlfriend has given him input and he's confident that she'll be happy with a 3-stone with a round flanked by pears, even if it means the round has to be smaller.

That said, I do agree that spending more than 50% of a ring budget on the setting isn't appropriate. I believe the custom work for a setting is too expensive in this price range. Thus, the challenge becomes finding a cheaper, ready-made setting that fits her tastes.

Example:
http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/three-stone/14k-white-gold-vintage-fluted-pear-engagement-ring-item-9216

Would that work? it would save over $1300 compared to what your custom setting would be. If you get a stone from JA, you'll save the setting fee, as well.

Now, if there's nothing out there that fits her tastes, then you'll have to go with the pricey BGD or custom settings.

 

[msop04]

I would use 14k, get an ideal cut but not pay for a brand H&A... H to be safe, but an I is very white. And I worry if you were actually looking at a gia I or a egl or something. Some grading labs are softer than others.

I would contact Idjewelry and see what they can do for you. They work magic with a budget and do lovely work!


I've never looked at a stone and been jealous of how white it is. I have been jealous of size..... just food for thought.

AMEN, SISTER!!

 

[bunnycat]

I would totally agree with msop about spending more on the setting than the stone. Have you looked at available rings online through the stone vendors people have suggested here and getting it all done in one place? You might be able to get a better pricing for the setting that could then be reallocated to the center.

Here's another center stone to look at:

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2953053.htm

 

[bunnycat]

I would use 14k, get an ideal cut but not pay for a brand H&A... H to be safe, but an I is very white. And I worry if you were actually looking at a gia I or a egl or something. Some grading labs are softer than others.

I would contact Idjewelry and see what they can do for you. They work magic with a budget and do lovely work!


I've never looked at a stone and been jealous of how white it is. I have been jealous of size..... just food for thought.

AMEN, SISTER!!

+++100

 

[msop04]

Not everyone agrees that more is more. Jake's girlfriend has given him input and he's confident that she'll be happy with a 3-stone with a round flanked by pears, even if it means the round has to be smaller.

That said, I do agree that spending more than 50% of a ring budget on the setting isn't appropriate. I believe the custom work for a setting is too expensive in this price range. Thus, the challenge becomes finding a cheaper, ready-made setting that fits her tastes.

Example:
http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/three-stone/14k-white-gold-vintage-fluted-pear-engagement-ring-item-9216

Would that work? it would save over $1300 compared to what your custom setting would be. If you get a stone from JA, you'll save the setting fee, as well.

Now, if there's nothing out there that fits her tastes, then you'll have to go with the pricey BGD or custom settings.

You are absolutely right, GoSounders - everyone is different with different priorities. He mentioned that he might be interested in "going bigger," so I just wanted to throw out some options. Like some others, I feel a three stone looks best with a larger stone and one that is in proportion to the side stones. Again, it's all about what she likes. This is why I encouraged OP to have her try on some larger solitaires, just to be sure.

 

[ecf8503]

Just my 2 cents here -

I have a 0.75ct RB solitaire and a 0.5ct RB in a 3 stone with baguettes. The 3 stone gives better coverage, and from arms length, you really can't tell the centers are different sizes since the smaller stone is flanked with bling. I'm a sucker for size too, and honestly if she wants the pear setting then get it, but please don't sacrifice on cut quality while still maximizing size of the center. I'd stick with H or above, but that depends on what color the pears are too.

 

[SB621]

Honestly I agree with yssie and Msop- they have given you great advice so here is 1 other option.

Spend 97% of your budget on the diamond and get the best 1ct you can within your budget and set it in a solitare. Then for your 1 year anniversary get the 3 stone. I know some women love to keep the ring that they are proposed to with but for me I would rather have the 1ct then the .5ct. And when my DH proposed at 22yo I wish he would have asked me what I wanted vs. trying to figure it out himself. Now that we are older my jewelry taste has signifcantly changed. The ring he proposed with I don't care for at all. I have gone through several different settings to find the one I have currently and love. So be forwarned that what she loves now might change. For that reason I would spend more money on the the dimond then setting.

 

[msop04]

Honestly I agree with yssie and Msop- they have given you great advice so here is 1 other option.

Spend 97% of your budget on the diamond and get the best 1ct you can within your budget and set it in a solitare.

Then for your 1 year anniversary get the 3 stone.

I know some women love to keep the ring that they are proposed to with but for me I would rather have the 1ct then the .5ct. And when my DH proposed at 22yo I wish he would have asked me what I wanted vs. trying to figure it out himself. Now that we are older my jewelry taste has signifcantly changed. The ring he proposed with I don't care for at all. I have gone through several different settings to find the one I have currently and love. So be forwarned that what she loves now might change. For that reason I would spend more money on the the dimond then setting.

I'm glad you said this, SB... This would be what I would want, personally. And... it gives her something else to look forward to for the anniversary!!

 

[yssie]

Well... Some people are just not solitaire people. If my DH had gone out and bought a solitaire after I'd explicitly told him that I wanted a three-stone I'd have been thoroughly tee'd off.

But... I knew our budget and I fully acknowleged that the compromise was a smaller centerstone, and I can't tell if my scenario is a fair comparison to Jake's because I agree that most women here in the US would prefer the larger center!

So... Looks like Jake's got homework

 

[msop04]

Jake113,

I found these four on IDJ... They are all G-H/VS2 and Triple X & Ideal cut. There are no images on the site, so that's why I went with VS2. If you were to call IDJ, they could probably find you a very nice eye-clean SI1/SI2 in a larger size for the same price point.

(couldn't get the link to work, but used the folling parameters: 0.80-1.1 ct, G-H, IF-VS2, Ideal, GIA, <$4K)

0.80 H/VS2 $3774
0.81 H/VS2 $3980
0.81 H/VS2 $3980
0.83 G/VS2 $3853

Sorry for posting a thousands times - please don't feel like we're pushing you!! I think I can speak for other PS members when I say that we really just want to help you get the best deal for your money.

 

[msop04]

Well... Some people are just not solitaire people. If my DH had gone out and bought a solitaire after I'd explicitly told him that I wanted a three-stone I'd have been thoroughly tee'd off.

But... I knew our budget and I fully acknowleged that the compromise was a smaller centerstone, and I can't tell if my scenario is a fair comparison to Jake's because I agree that most women here in the US would prefer the larger center!

So... Looks like Jake's got homework

Yep, he sure does!

 

[SB621]

Well... Some people are just not solitaire people. If my DH had gone out and bought a solitaire after I'd explicitly told him that I wanted a three-stone I'd have been thoroughly tee'd off.

But... I knew our budget and I fully acknowleged that the compromise was a smaller centerstone, and I can't tell if my scenario is a fair comparison to Jake's because I agree that most women here in the US would prefer the larger center!

So... Looks like Jake's got homework

My point was more talk to your SO and see if they are good with compromise. Hence 1ct now with 3 stone setting of your dreams at 1 year anniversary vs. .5ct now with 3 stone setting of your dreams now.

 

[yssie]

Well... Some people are just not solitaire people. If my DH had gone out and bought a solitaire after I'd explicitly told him that I wanted a three-stone I'd have been thoroughly tee'd off.

But... I knew our budget and I fully acknowleged that the compromise was a smaller centerstone, and I can't tell if my scenario is a fair comparison to Jake's because I agree that most women here in the US would prefer the larger center!

So... Looks like Jake's got homework

My point was more talk to your SO and see if they are good with compromise. Hence 1ct now with 3 stone setting of your dreams at 1 year anniversary vs. .5ct now with 3 stone setting of your dreams now.

Yup, totally agree with that.

 

[Niel]

let me ask you this... is she particularly sentimental? Because if she isnt and will want to upgrade, then this wouldnt work, but if, in the future, she plans to upgrade but keep her original ring interacted, this might be a good idea....These stones dont have an upgrade policy, so they arent for everyone but would wirk nicely for you i bet!

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/0.700-i-vs2-round-diamond-gia-46652310
with this
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/engagement-rings/three-stone/the-summer-18k-white-gold-5371w18