Whiteflash ACA selection help

[Justin_P]

Hi,

Finally starting to narrow down my search some. Decided to go with Whiteflash ACA diamond. After talking sizes, clarity over with her we decided on. Around 1.6-1.75 Color G-I and Clarity VS1- VS2 for eye clean

Do any of these look promising or concerning? I've looked at the ASET, Ideal scope, etc. but I just can't make out enough of a difference to make a guess. Any others I should consider on WF?

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-di...65449,3965475,3858601,3982387,3838493,3978034

Thanks,

 

[ac117]

They are all super ideal ACAs so they will certainly all be gorgeous. You're picking from the cream of the crop so everything else is personal preference - I'd choose the middle of the road 1.683 H VS2. I'd ask about the visibility of the crystal inclusion (at what angle/distance it could be seen) but I had a 1.81 VS2 with a couple of black crystals under the table and could never see them from the top, only from the side at like 3 inches away. Other people prefer 'mind clean' stones but I prefer putting my money into things I can see, like color. I've found that I'm fine with I color as earrings but not looking at it in my ring bc I do see tint and it does bother me!

All of your choices are great, but I will throw this one into the mix because it looks very clean and is marked as such, it's the highest color, less expensive than the G VS2 but the same dimensions: https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3978024.htm

 

[HappyNewLife]

I LOVE my big honkin' I/VS2, so I'd vote for the 1.734

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Lots of great choices, but I personally would go for the largest H VS2 (or the H VS1 if you like higher clarity) followed by the 1.7 I VS2.

 

[Justin_P]

Thanks for the help!

 

[tyty333]

My next step would be to narrow it down to say 3 stones and ask WF for a picture of them side-by-side to get a comparison of size and color.

Also, once you narrow it down they can talk you though 2 or 3 stones and let you know what they are seeing when they compare
the stones side-by-side.

 

[Justin_P]

Thanks everyone, took your advise and WF helped me narrow it down. Now I'm down to these two would like to go ahead tonight or in the early am. Any experts care to weigh in? Most interested on which looks like a better performer? H VS1 or F SI1 (They confirmed it was eye clean) both 1.65

They sent me a video and they both look great for different reasons.

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3978024.htm

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3965475.htm

 

[diamondseeker2006]

It would be the H VS1 for me, as VS2 is my bottom clarity level.

 

[ac117]

Thanks everyone, took your advise and WF helped me narrow it down. Now I'm down to these two would like to go ahead tonight or in the early am. Any experts care to weigh in? Most interested on which looks like a better performer? H VS1 or F SI1 (They confirmed it was eye clean) both 1.65

They sent me a video and they both look great for different reasons.

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3978024.htm

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3965475.htm

Did they tell you anything when they compared the stones together? Could you ask them which one catches their eye/sparkles more when they compare them? Did they provide any pictures or video of them side by side?

It's a tough call especially only being able to go by the individual videos taken in artificial light but *I* would take the higher color and $500 savings so my vote goes to the F SI1, which twinkles at me more in the video anyway. Even though it's an SI1, the inclusions are off to the side - when I look at the video of the H VS2, I do see the clouds under the table (although these videos are obviously under magnification and I'm positive it won't be noticeable in person, but if we're picking them apart....). I do like the slightly smaller table on the H VS2 but I'd still prefer a whiter stone. The only way I'd change my vote is if WF says the H VS2 outperforms the F SI1 (and keep in mind, this will always be subjective bc people and their preferences obviously vary).

 

[Justin_P]

They are sending pics for color. They thought the H maybe caught their eye more, but it was really close just seemed to catch their eye a little more. She said the co-workers she asked were split.

Thanks for the opinions. Leaning H, but it's kinda a coin toss. Hopefully, when I get the pictures it helps the decision.

 

[sledge]

I like the VS stone better, but mainly because the SI looks really ugly on the cert. Did you ask them about being eye clean? Also, did you ask if either stone was affected by the clouds noted on the certs?

See below for WF standard definition of "eye clean". If you are picky like me, they will tighten their standards to be 6" away from the stone and include views from the top and sides.

https://www.whiteflash.com/about-diamonds/faq/what-is-your-definition-of.htm

The Whiteflash baseline definition of eye-clean is:

No inclusions visible to the naked eye of a person with 20/20 vision when viewing the diamond in the face-up position at a distance of approximately 10 inches under normal overhead lighting .

Distance, lighting and human vision all influence this judgment. There is no universally agreed upon definition of eye-clean in the trade so we developed this one in order to communicate meaningfully with our customers. 10 inches is the ‘distance of most distinct vision’ as defined by the field of optometry. It is also a basis used by the AGS Laboratory in light performance grading, and so this is a logical standard and a practical baseline.

Diamonds graded by AGS and GIA with clarities of VS or above are almost always completely eye-clean by the above standard. On our website diamond detail pages Si clarity diamonds include an icon indicating when the diamond is eye-clean.

*For practical guidance see our page on diamond clarity. For more in-depth information see our page on clarity grading at the lab.

 

[Justin_P]

Here are the pictures, they included an I to help compare. I just emailed about the clouds in the H.

Thanks

 

[Tekate]

to me the from the above I would take the 1.734 I, I LOVE the F but you pay for it. What a wonderful problem to have!

 

[TweetyBird23]

I value color over clarity (as long as both are eye clean to your standards) and love a lower price tag so if both choices are comparable size-wise, I would pick the F. That being said, I have an H and am very happy with the color, or lack thereof!

The H looks warmer in my eyes from the top than the I.

 

[ac117]

Here are the pictures, they included an I to help compare. I just emailed about the clouds in the H.

Thanks

I have to say, while I know we can't truly judge color from pics, that I stone looks whiter than the H in both views! What does your SO value most?

 

[TweetyBird23]

I pulled up an old comparison that came to mind when I saw OP's picture because it's possible that the position of the lighting in the room has something to do with the way the stones are reflecting. Notice how the J stone on the right also looks a hair whiter than the I in the middle. I would ask WF to tell you what they see in person.

 

[sledge]

I pulled up an old comparison that came to mind when I saw OP's picture because it's possible that the position of the lighting in the room has something to do with the way the stones are reflecting. Notice how the J stone on the right also looks a hair whiter than the I in the middle. I would ask WF to tell you what they see in person.

It's nice to have the pictures, but the problem is that even though it was meant well, the reality is that each diamond is picking up slightly different amounts and angles of light; therefore, making it difficult to do a side-by-side comparison. Mainly because in this case even though they are in the same room, they are sitting far enough away they are picking up different elements, shadows, etc.

I know it's hard to explain, but it's a similar effect to seating positions and TV viewing angles. Everyone can be in the same room, but each person has a slightly different view depending exactly where they are sitting. For those with sensitive eyes like mine, you can start to see less stellar images as you get off a perfect alignment. The extreme of this is looking at a TV from the far side (approximately 179 degree angle) and you will see the image is real faded or maybe non-existent depending on the viewing angle of the TV set in question.

 

[Justin_P]

I sent a follow up email asking about the H color.

Not sure it's a coincidence or not, but when looking at smaller diamonds they sent a picture of 3 different diamonds and the middle stone did look the most yellow by a good margin. It was an I stone compared to an H and G, but now I'm wondering if it's something in the room. Or the H above just happens to look more yellow...

Thanks everyone! Hard choices, but I think she'll love the choice!

 

[sledge]

I would agree in the pics the I stone looks more white. Odd that it keeps repeating that pattern in @TweetyBird23's pictures she posted. I wonder if it's an issue where the overhead lights are spaced where the outside diamonds get hit directly and the middle is getting an overlap of two lights?

Sort of like this:


I think the only way to know is to have one of the WF gemologist verify what we are talking about. Either way, I think the differences are marginal. And while we can see the difference in a side by side comparison I don't think you will notice the marginal difference in real life.

Ignoring cut & clarity, I liked the video of the H myself.

Is the 3rd stone with the I color even a consideration, or in your budget? I didn't see any specs on it.

 

[Lorelei]

You can't go wrong here, I'd go for the H VS personally as it's a lovely mix of size and quality but you could choose any ( providing the SI is eye clean to your standards), all are superb.

 

[Justin_P]

Ok, giving myself a 2-3 hour deadline then I'm making my decision.

Here are WF's answers (FYI, They've been awesome very helpful and friendly!):

1. Can you have them check both stones for clarity. Can they tell me how they look better than eye clean at say 6 inches? Clouds an issue? -

Both diamonds are completely clean from the top view from as close as the eye can focus. The H VS1 is clean from both top and side and needs at least a 10X loupe in order to find any inclusions (the average person may require higher magnification dependent upon their vision). The F SI1 does have inclusions that are visible upon close inspection (from about 6-8”, though our GG was able to find them from 10”). The clouds do not impact performance in any way.

2. In the pictures the H looks more yellow than the I next to it. Thoughts on the color too? -

In person the H is definitely a solid H and is whiter than the I color when side by side but the color difference between the F & H is also pretty apparent when viewed side by side. We did note that the F SI1 does have very faint blue fluorescence, but it does not impact performance in any way. (The AGS term negligible will encompass none to faint fluorescence as in the lab’s opinion it will not be visually impactful at that level.)

3. Overall opinions and anything to note -

Ultimately both diamonds are really beautiful and it came down to a preference of color versus clarity, of the 4 people who have now inspected the diamond it’s a 50/50 split with some preferring color where others prefer the higher clarity. J I know that is not decisive but I just want to give our honest feedback. J

 

[Lorelei]

That all sounds good Justin, I suppose it's a choice between the crisp F colour or the softer but still white H or the I colour which is a tiny bit larger ( although no difference visually). Which one are you leaning towards?

 

[ac117]

I'm still team whiter stone!

 

[sledge]

Agree with @Lorelei.

And glad WF gave you some good feedback -- it sounds like you have some excellent choices.

When making any tough decision, you need to first define what is the most significant and determining factor to YOU. I think you have some solid choices, and I could support arguments for each diamond. For me, it breaks down as this:

- F for the color
- I for the size
- H for the cut & clarity

I gave the cut to H because that's what I preferred, but I'm not sure there was really a horrible choice in that mix. Just that one spoke more to me. Also, because I know me and my eyes, I also know there is a real chance I might see the imperfections by not choosing the VS stone.

And if I were to see those imperfections I'd always think I made the wrong choice. Without placing another stone beside the H, it would be very unlikely I'd ever see a color or size difference in daily life.

So for me, cut & clarity are my significant and determining factors. But as I say this, I can also see how others might support an argument for better clarity or size if they are wired a little different than me.

Regardless, my vote is for the H -- if it matters.

 

[TweetyBird23]

“Both diamonds are completely clean from the top view from as close as the eye can focus. The H VS1 is clean from both top and side and needs at least a 10X loupe in order to find any inclusions (the average person may require higher magnification dependent upon their vision). The F SI1 does have inclusions that are visible upon close inspection (from about 6-8”, though our GG was able to find them from 10”). The clouds do not impact performance in any way.”

Well, which one is it? Is the F completely clean from the top from as close as the eye can focus or does it have visible inclusions from 6-10” away?

OP, from the specs you discussed with your lady, the H VS seems to be in line with her preferences.

 

[blueMA]

This may be the toughest choices for me to give an opinion. I am both color and inclusion sensitive, so it's pretty much a toss up on the given selection.

However, I always draw a line on the Color, and personally would never go below G, which is within the colorless range. On the direct face-up view, many people can't tell the difference between G/H of very well cut stones, but I certainly can at an angle which is the common view.

The people who saw it live are 50/50 split, so if you're not particular on the clarity, I'd go with the F stone given the expertly cut stone, especially since I can no longer focus well within 10", and now it's more of a mind-clean thing when I go for a higher clarity.

 

[Lorelei]

“Both diamonds are completely clean from the top view from as close as the eye can focus. The H VS1 is clean from both top and side and needs at least a 10X loupe in order to find any inclusions (the average person may require higher magnification dependent upon their vision). The F SI1 does have inclusions that are visible upon close inspection (from about 6-8”, though our GG was able to find them from 10”). The clouds do not impact performance in any way.”

Well, which one is it? Is the F completely clean from the top from as close as the eye can focus or does it have visible inclusions from 6-10” away?

OP, from the specs you discussed with your lady, the H VS seems to be in line with her preferences.

I took it to mean the eye clean comment refers to the VS clarities the way I read it, I could be wrong though.

 

[blueMA]

“Both diamonds are completely clean from the top view from as close as the eye can focus. The H VS1 is clean from both top and side and needs at least a 10X loupe in order to find any inclusions (the average person may require higher magnification dependent upon their vision). The F SI1 does have inclusions that are visible upon close inspection (from about 6-8”, though our GG was able to find them from 10”). The clouds do not impact performance in any way.”

Well, which one is it? Is the F completely clean from the top from as close as the eye can focus or does it have visible inclusions from 6-10” away?

OP, from the specs you discussed with your lady, the H VS seems to be in line with her preferences.

Lol, just until not so long ago, I was able to detect slightest inclusions in supposedly eye-clean SI1 stones through naked eye, but I had 20/20 sharp vision with no need for reading glasses then, so I could understand why some people can detect inclusions while others can't especially when they know exactly where to look.

 

[Lorelei]

Lol, just until not so long ago, I was able to detect slightest inclusions in supposedly eye-clean SI1 stones through naked eye, but I had 20/20 sharp vision with no need for reading glasses then, so I could understand why some people can detect inclusions while others can't especially when they know exactly where to look.

I've joined the club too after snickering at Garry's wisdom many years ago about our ability to see inclusions once our eyesight starts to go....Serves me right.

I was wondering though, if we buy SI clarities because we can no longer see any inclusions, might our worry then be ' what if someone with younger eyes sees one??'

You can't win.

 

[blueMA]

I was wondering though, if we buy SI clarities because we can no longer see any inclusions, might our worry then be ' what if someone with younger eyes sees one??'

You can't win.

Only if they're allowed to get close enough and strain to find the tiny inclusion. At a casual view, no way.

In my case, I'm just obsessive and it's a mind/pride thing, but still never shy away from a good SI1 stone.