vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom piece

[Hera]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

I'm wondering if the orientation of the bracelet is such so that it can be held in place and stay on the forearm.

Despite that, you asked for the piece to fit you and it doesn't. I'm sorry that you're going through this. It seems like some vendors get a start by someone on PS only to get busy, raise prices and eventually alienate the source by which made it famous. I suppose it's the natural progression of things.

I hope you get your piece fixed or some sort of resolution.

 

[arjunajane]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

I am so sorry to read this post. More than that I am sorry the relationship has already deteriorated so badly. It sounds like you had left things with Julia in such a way that you had agreed not to persue any further professional work with her, but that then later you started to seek a further re consideration of the bracelet. Im not saying that I think you are wrong to do so, actually I dont think that, but from her point of view, after agreeing to have no furthers, to come back at her about the bracelet could seem to her just harassment. That may be why she is not responding, she may see your emails as only baiting her.
Undoubtedly, the orientation of the oval shape of the interior of the bracelet is off by 90º. With your arm outstretched on the table before you the oval should be horizontal, in line with the cross-section of your arm (were one to cut it through there) and certainly not vertical. I would think Julia would have caught that long before the fabrication stage began. However, I can imagine situations where a designer and a customer work TOO closely. the designer wants to do the job and humors the customer, trying to give them everything they ask for, and the customer expects the designer to give them all that they ask for, but still to guide them away from the folly of their ideas before it is too late. I know that I would be very afraid to become a professional goldsmith taking on custom projects simply because I cannot do someone else's idea. I am not nor have I ever been a team player. Of course that is me as a hypothetical goldsmith; Julia is a professional and opens her doors to customer's enquiries. I think my point was too much collaboration with each side relying on the other to know what is and isn't right. Almost makes it into a scenario like a no-fault auto insurance claim where neither party is exactly guilty nor innocent either.
It sounds too, like many harsh things have been said on both sides, none of which can be taken back. Klewis's solution sounds most viable and fair to me. have the stones removed by a qualified local jeweler, send the bracelet back for refund and part ways.
Or if you want to be whimsical and absurdist about the whole thing, have her make another exactly like this one and connect the two with a few links at the bottom to make it into the pair of handcuffs it soooo wants to be! Then I guess you could still wear them on your wedding night?

Hi VL,
I appreciate your post - and certainly the bit of humour this thread needs at the end!!

However, there are quite a few large assumptions you have made in your post, which I really I should clarify, at least for others reading this.

Yes, Julia and I agreed to part ways and not enter into any more *new* business with our last emails. However, I can't imagine how a professional jeweller could assume this means they have no responsibility to the piece they have just created as your final project though Please read JKT's store policies above, especially the bolded.
I do see your point - maybe she thinks I am 'picking' on the bracelet due to the meltdown of our r'ship. Not a chance. I do not have the time, energy, thought or stress to commit to a pointless activity such as that. Before this thread, I had been away from PS for months, and didn't have much intention of posting again (no 'bad' reason why..just no free time)
It actually took me a number of weeks and the insistence of a friend, for me to even post this thread, as I simply don't want the drama in my life. However -
If this were a couple hundred $ piece, 100% I would cut my losses, walk away and move on..but its not. Due to countless missed deadlines and broken promises, this project took up 14 months of my attention, with hundreds of emails and a couple international phone calls. Of course, none of that can be gotten back and I have already let it go; but I am not in the tax bracket where I can afford to 'let go' on jewellery that is never to be worn

With regards to your suggestion of how the project came about and developed - this is really very far from reality. As already mentioned - in 2009 I wanted a ring. Julia didn't want to make said ring (whole other story). After some discussion, I agreed to a bracelet. I sent her 5 of my nicest gems in "iris flower" colours, after we had discussed using an Iris flower theme/motif.
The rest, give or take suggestions for small things like brushed vs matte finish, was up to Julia. Fortunately, she came up with a design which is simply beautiful on paper - and looks even more beautiful IRL, but does not seem to work IRL.

I'm sorry, but I can't agree with your insurance analogy. I am a consumer of jewellery; I have tastes, ideas, concepts, influences, ppt scrap books of pieces and things I like or am inspired by However, I don't know the first thing about creating a piece. As you say, JKT is a professional who has done very well opening her business to this kind of 'contributive' custom work. I have worked with her twice before this piece, with outstanding results. Many folks in CS wear variations on JKT rings that she and I designed together as my very first piece from her - before she was "The JKT"

The only time I can see your analogy working is when the client has insisted on including a specific detail, that the jeweller has expressly advised against - than when its finished the client doesn't like that aspect. Absolutely, this is a situation where I would expect the client to take it on the chin.

I gave Julia some inspiration pics (mainly of some bracelets from her own site, and of the floral engraving found on vintage/deco watches); discussed wanting a floral motif with 5 bezeled stones - than the shape, design, construction and function were left 100% to JKT. I do not believe in ever telling a jeweller I know better than them, as I don't. However, with 20/20 hindsight, I do wish I had at least sought a second opinion on the incorrect shape of the bracelet. At the time, it never crossed my mind, as I trusted my friend and jeweller to create something lovely for me - or to fix it if they made a mistake.

As I don't work on jewellery like yourself, I'm not sure whether this would have made any difference -perhaps you can provide some feedback? When the designs and specs were agreed upon, Julia also mentioned in a number of emails she would be adding some gold details to the lower half 'to balance it out' - I perceived this as meaning visually, and agreed that would be lovely. However, some gold on the bottom perhaps could have also counter-acted the top heaviness.
This gold detail never made it to the final piece, despite the fact I was (presumably) charged for it. I won't quote the reason why I was given; but suffice to say I feel most would find it insufficient.

VL, I appreciate your posts - they are always informative and funny.
I think you make some good points and I appreciate you weighing in - however I hope you don't mind my 'corrections'. I feel it t is easy for any of us to imagine and speculate how a project may have panned out between any 2 people, but in this case only Julia and I actually know.

Of course, Julia is more than welcome to share her POV on here if she feels the need, and I would be happy for just the contact/acknowledgement of my complaints.

eta: tried to edit to get rid of bold typeface..

 

[packrat]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Ohhh wow AJ, I'm really sorry! I hope something gets resolved for you w/the bracelet soon. Was it working on the bracelet that caused the falling out in the first place? I remember the stones used in it and the thread about doing the three stone bezel ring..which would have been gorgeous, so I don't get how come she didn't want to do it. What a mess..I'm sorry it's happening, AJ!

 

[FrekeChild]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Hit and run eh? Didn't mean to, but I've been busy and not really paying as much attention to PS as I had been. Seems as though life has gotten in the way.

Not to mention I didn't figure anyone would notice what I said.

I'm sorry you're going through this AJ. Not much else to say I'm afraid...

 

[TravelingGal]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Hit and run eh? Didn't mean to, but I've been busy and not really paying as much attention to PS as I had been. Seems as though life has gotten in the way.

Not to mention I didn't figure anyone would notice what I said.

I'm sorry you're going through this AJ. Not much else to say I'm afraid...

I only noticed on that thread because someone else asked you a direct question about it, and you didn't respond. No big deal, and it seems you'd rather not say, so.....

 

[VapidLapid]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

I do totally see your point, and even ultimately I think you're more in the right. Just trying to see how it could look from her view; not that that would change the validity of yours. The clearest part of this whole thing is that the bracelet was made with a center of gravity ninety degrees askew from what accepted practice, history, and common sense all agree is the standard form for functionality, useability and comfort in a hinged bracelet. I think to get the situation resolved you should limit the discussion to that point. What do you think would be a fair resolution to this? Are there any parts to the backstory that you think maybe aren't important to the reaching of the desired resolution? I guess Im just trying to say that you should chose your battles and negotiate to "YES".

Im glad you weren't mad at me for introducing a little levity. I do think some well placed lightness is healthy.

 

[FrekeChild]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Hit and run eh? Didn't mean to, but I've been busy and not really paying as much attention to PS as I had been. Seems as though life has gotten in the way.

Not to mention I didn't figure anyone would notice what I said.

I'm sorry you're going through this AJ. Not much else to say I'm afraid...

I only noticed on that thread because someone else asked you a direct question about it, and you didn't respond. No big deal, and it seems you'd rather not say, so.....

I responded now that I knew someone asked me why!

I'm barely on PS anymore, and only seem to post sporadically on CS or if someone brings my attention to a thread...as they have with this one.

 

[TravelingGal]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Hit and run eh? Didn't mean to, but I've been busy and not really paying as much attention to PS as I had been. Seems as though life has gotten in the way.

Not to mention I didn't figure anyone would notice what I said.

I'm sorry you're going through this AJ. Not much else to say I'm afraid...

I only noticed on that thread because someone else asked you a direct question about it, and you didn't respond. No big deal, and it seems you'd rather not say, so.....

I responded now that I knew someone asked me why!

I'm barely on PS anymore, and only seem to post sporadically on CS or if someone brings my attention to a thread...as they have with this one.

Thanks for responding. You saved me from writing/nagging on that thread "Yeah, why Freke? Can me you tell us? Please? Huh huh huh?" Poke poke poke...

 

[arjunajane]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Geez AJ, what a bummer.

I remember seeing the photos of the bracelet when you posted them. My thought was "pretty, but that doesn't look very wearable." And at the time, I had completely MISSED the N/S ovoid orientation of the bracelet. As another poster said, it boggles my mind that she would have made it that way. I mean, it looks like it would flip to the "natural" curve of your wrist causing it to sit completely incorrectly.

Did you notice this orientation before she sent it? I can understand if you missed it, because I certainly did.

Always two sides of the story, as we all know, but the basic orientation of the bracelet unless you specifically asked for it (which you say you did not) makes me think it's actually a defective product. A bulky bracelet like that simply should not have been made that way. It didn't have a prayer, even if it didn't slide off your wrist.

I'm curious as to why she couldn't do your 3 stone ring.

And I felt that there might be some disillusionment with JKT around here since Freke did a hit and run on the jewelry trends you hate thread saying she didn't like anything by JKT (if she responded, I missed the response, so apologies if I'm being blind.)

ETA, edited to correct "cents" to "sides"

Hey Tgal, good to chat with you.

You're correct - if I turn the bracelet "sideways", so that the 'top' with the gems faces either outwards or in toward the body, than the bracelet shape fits just fine! This does not, however, combat the bulkiness and incorrect sizing issues (or I may just consider putting up with it that way)..

TBH Tgal, I had the same gut thoughts as yourself when I saw the photos. However, this project was a long slog. All my money was tied up in it.
As I waited and waited, often going weeks without so much as an update, I would watch other PSers commission with JKT, have their pieces designed, created, finished, mailed and posted proudly on PS - all whilst mine was constantly 'on the bench', with little to no progress for months at a time.
So, when the finished photos finally came through, I guess I was just actually happy it was complete, if that makes sense..?

With re to the bulkiness, the difference of the final measurements of the piece in most places are very significant (for example, 22mm at the widest central part on the top section was agreed upon - it is actually 35mm). Yes, I asked for something a little bold and a bit unique - I didn't want tiny and delicate - but I didn't ask for (nor was I consulted on) the other extreme that I received.

With re to the N-S vs E-W orientation of the bracelet's fit - all sketches and designs were done in the E-W orientation. I can re-post these if folks are interested.
The example bracelet that JKT initially used as a basis for mine (the gold and tanzanite one from her official website) is in an E-W oval shape.
My bracelet, was supposed to be in an E-W shape, according to approved designs and all other indications.
Towards the very end of fabrication, Julia mentioned via email she would be changing the shape slightly 'for an improved fit'. I have a number of emails after that where I bring up (question) these proposed changes, saying I would like to discuss them further- but my queries are brushed over.

When the bracelet was complete, Julia has commented repeatedly that the she is extremely happy with the way the bracelet fits, and it doesn't move around at all or slide up and down the arm.
One of my earliest concerns / questions with making the bracelet, was that I don't wear them due to the movement, knocking on things etc - too annoying. We discussed this at length, hence why a (mostly) stationary design was decided upon, in the aims of reducing movement, clanging, knocking, sliding etc - even more important with my precious gems set in top.

AJ, I went to look for the original thread I remember...

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/jkt-5-stone-bracelet-finally-completed.152020/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/jkt-5-stone-bracelet-finally-completed.152020/[/URL]

I still think the bracelet is very pretty - but I remember why I had thought it wouldn't be very wearable. JKT took a photo of the bracelet on her arm and it was HUGE (the bracelet, not her arm)! It was hard to grasp scale it was until I saw that photo, and the bracelet is sitting quite far up her arm. Did this give you pause at all?

Thanks for providing the link TG. The proportions did give me pause - and yes, the area it is sitting on her arm, both. It was the first time I had seen it to any scale too.
However, as I had given detailed measurements of my forearm, I assumed Julia must just be slimmer/smaller than me.
Moreover, as mentioned above, I was just happy and relieved that I finally had an end product, in a project that felt never-ending.
And finally - I never once anticipated that if the bracelet would need re-sizing (an accepted and sometimes expected practice with long-distance custom) - that I would be 'shut out', yanno?

I hope my posts answer your questions, and good to seeya

 

[TravelingGal]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Well, it's a bummer that it was this that brought you back to PS, AJ. You did answer my questions, not that you had to. If I were to guess, I would say the project took as long as it did because this project didn't go quite as planned for her, but that's total speculation.

But it is good to see you around. I hope this gets resolved, as I can't imagine how expensive this piece was for it to turn out this way and be completely useless to you, not to mention I know how much you seek out fantastic stones and love each one.

 

[arjunajane]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

I do totally see your point, and even ultimately I think you're more in the right. Just trying to see how it could look from her view; not that that would change the validity of yours. The clearest part of this whole thing is that the bracelet was made with a center of gravity ninety degrees askew from what accepted practice, history, and common sense all agree is the standard form for functionality, useability and comfort in a hinged bracelet. I think to get the situation resolved you should limit the discussion to that point. What do you think would be a fair resolution to this? Are there any parts to the backstory that you think maybe aren't important to the reaching of the desired resolution? I guess Im just trying to say that you should chose your battles and negotiate to "YES".

Im glad you weren't mad at me for introducing a little levity. I do think some well placed lightness is healthy.

Thanks VL, I think this is very good advice - and if Julia will give me counsel by returning my emails or calls, I will certainly remember it.
I think a fair resolution, and really the only fair one from my POV at this point, would actually be a return for refund, with the expenses of my gems being removed by another jeweller, to be saddled by JKT. How much the refund should be, would depend somewhat on what the breakdown between materials and labour is (I haven't been given this info on my invoices).

Considering the complete lack of communication, and Julia's request we no longer work together, I do not believe a return for remake or exchange is even nearly feasible at this stage.

 

[TravelingGal]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

I do totally see your point, and even ultimately I think you're more in the right. Just trying to see how it could look from her view; not that that would change the validity of yours. The clearest part of this whole thing is that the bracelet was made with a center of gravity ninety degrees askew from what accepted practice, history, and common sense all agree is the standard form for functionality, useability and comfort in a hinged bracelet. I think to get the situation resolved you should limit the discussion to that point. What do you think would be a fair resolution to this? Are there any parts to the backstory that you think maybe aren't important to the reaching of the desired resolution? I guess Im just trying to say that you should chose your battles and negotiate to "YES".

Im glad you weren't mad at me for introducing a little levity. I do think some well placed lightness is healthy.

Thanks VL, I think this is very good advice - and if Julia will give me counsel by returning my emails or calls, I will certainly remember it.
I think a fair resolution, and really the only fair one from my POV at this point, would actually be a return for refund, with the expenses of my gems being removed by another jeweller, to be saddled by JKT. How much the refund should be, would depend somewhat on what the breakdown between materials and labour is (I haven't been given this info on my invoices).

Considering the complete lack of communication, and Julia's request we no longer work together, I do not believe a return for remake or exchange is even nearly feasible at this stage.

AJ, do you even have any legal recourse? I don't know how this stuff works, but I know she's international (I don't recall where she is). I mean, if she just wanted to blow you off, would you just be screwed here?

If so, that alone would make me wary of ever working with someone outside the country!

 

[arjunajane]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

I think perhaps some timeline context here, may be helpful for folks to understand a bit better what went on during this project. As I mentioned earlier, I don't feel its ethical to share contents of client to vendor (and reverse) communications. However, I think the timeline says a lot about this project. Any statements from JKT I have paraphrased, as accurately as possible, without quoting:

by 21/22 Jan 2010 the early designs had been approved.
Feb 1, the final and more detailed designs were approved.
Between Feb 1 and April 29, no work completed.
April 29 - an update pic with the very beginnings of the piece is sent, and approved to continue.
Earlier deadline of end of May is extended to 27 July (my bday).
Various emails between April 29 and start of July, but no progress to report.
July 5 - sends one photo with some marginal changes over the April photo.
July 14 - advises she will not make my 27 july bday deadline, due to other projects. Gives new deadline of first week of August.
Aug 4 - sends a pic of the top and bottom halves - gold work on profile has not been started.
Aug 4 - I advise I am travelling for work for one week. Deadline is extended to my return (15 Aug).
Aug 17 - an update saying progress is being made, no pics.
Aug 25 - advises of some changes to be done to original design, specifically adding some gold design to the bottom half, plus 'tapering the inner and outer' of the silver bottom and top pieces, to make it look 'less like a handcuff.'
Aug 25 - a pic of the centre bezel detail for the purple spinel is sent. I ask for followup and clarification on the mention of changes to the design, shape and fit. I also express my concerns about top-heaviness. None of these concerns are addressed or followed up in subsequent emails.
Aug 28 - deadline extended again, to 'another two weeks perhaps', whilst J makes ready to buy pieces for her etsy store.
8 Sept - receive update the gold profile sides are going in (no pics), with a promise to keep me updated 'throughout the week' as it gets completed.
20 Sept - ask for update as haven't heard anything since the 8th.
22 Sept - reply: 'I have made a little progress but not much to report'.
4 Oct - no relevant contact has come through. Many new items are being shown on PS and on Julia's just re-furbished website.
11 Oct - a surprise email comes through, with significant progress pics (piece almost finished, needs stones set and detail work).
J advises she has scrapped the ideas she mentioned on Aug 25, without any consultation with me, nor asking my approval.
11 Oct - (before I've replied to first email) final invoice sent through with request for payment.
14 Oct - we begin to discuss shipping, insurance, customs etc and the Aus - US Free Trade Agreement paperwork.
18 Oct - I paypal the final balance, over one third of total cost. Piece not yet finished. I ask again about the previous mention of changes to the fit and shape - my questions go unanswered.
26 Oct - J updates that piece is almost finished; says happy to report that it fits and stays nicely on the arm.
27 Oct - some pics sent through.
27 Oct - I enquire (again) after the missing gold on the bottom half of the piece, presumably which I was invoiced for and paid for. I'm told by J 'at this point I can't really afford to put anymore time or materials into it, plus I think it looks very nice as it is, I'm sure you will agree.'
Nov 3 - update that stones will soon be set.
Nov 4 - update that all stones are set, that its finished and looks fabulous.
Nov 5 - 3 sets of photos sent. J states again that 'it fits nicely and stays in place so well.'
Nov 5 - another email where J expresses more things could use tweaking, but brushes over it with humour.

As you can see, over a very long timeline with many setbacks - it was like all the work was actually only done in the last few weeks of the timeline, and once it came close to completion everything (communication, payment requests, any unanswered questions, shipping arrangements) felt *very* rushed. It genuinely seemed Julia could not wait to move past it and move on.

Piece is officially finished on 5 November, paid in full and ready to ship.
Piece is shipped on 9 Nov 2010.
Due to a customs bungle in Australia, it is made 'return to sender' when it reaches Australian customs in December.
Once the package finally makes it back to Julia, than finally back to me, it is March 2011 - the first time I get to see it in person, and of course my heart sinks

 

[arjunajane]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

I do totally see your point, and even ultimately I think you're more in the right. Just trying to see how it could look from her view; not that that would change the validity of yours. The clearest part of this whole thing is that the bracelet was made with a center of gravity ninety degrees askew from what accepted practice, history, and common sense all agree is the standard form for functionality, useability and comfort in a hinged bracelet. I think to get the situation resolved you should limit the discussion to that point. What do you think would be a fair resolution to this? Are there any parts to the backstory that you think maybe aren't important to the reaching of the desired resolution? I guess Im just trying to say that you should chose your battles and negotiate to "YES".

Im glad you weren't mad at me for introducing a little levity. I do think some well placed lightness is healthy.

Thanks VL, I think this is very good advice - and if Julia will give me counsel by returning my emails or calls, I will certainly remember it.
I think a fair resolution, and really the only fair one from my POV at this point, would actually be a return for refund, with the expenses of my gems being removed by another jeweller, to be saddled by JKT. How much the refund should be, would depend somewhat on what the breakdown between materials and labour is (I haven't been given this info on my invoices).

Considering the complete lack of communication, and Julia's request we no longer work together, I do not believe a return for remake or exchange is even nearly feasible at this stage.

AJ, do you even have any legal recourse? I don't know how this stuff works, but I know she's international (I don't recall where she is). I mean, if she just wanted to blow you off, would you just be screwed here?

If so, that alone would make me wary of ever working with someone outside the country!

I'm not sure TG - I haven't looked that far into it yet.
My feeling would be perhaps not automatically under consumer legislation, but I haven't checked..I may do that later today.
Maybe hiring someone would provide different options - but again, I'm not looking for a fight, a time-wasting argument, a legal battle or anything else - just some good old fashioned customer service darn it!

 

[TravelingGal]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Wow AJ. For someone who I always thought didn't take a lot of bullsh*t, you sure were lenient judging from that timeline. I would have called off the project about the 7th line down (July). You guys must have been pretty buddy buddy for anyone to ever think that kind of timeline for a custom piece was OK. That's crazy!

 

[Dancing Fire]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

AJ...sorry to hear about the problems with your bracelet..

let me ask you a nosy Q...all 18k gold? ...did the custom bracelet cost close to $8K?..

 

[arjunajane]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Wow AJ. For someone who I always thought didn't take a lot of bullsh*t, you sure were lenient judging from that timeline. I would have called off the project about the 7th line down (July). You guys must have been pretty buddy buddy for anyone to ever think that kind of timeline for a custom piece was OK. That's crazy!

EXACTLY. ding ding, winner.

We were buddy-buddy, as you say TG - we emailed about life, family, politics etc outside of doing projects. She had macro photos taken by me as the front page of her website; two of her best selling products are named by me..and so on!
But more than that, by say July, I already felt so invested, yanno? I had paid a significant deposit, and really did love the design. I was loyal to Julia and didn't want to hurt her feelings. But you're right, the smart thing would have been to call it off, and you know I'm kicking my own loyal butt right now!

I will admit that, of course, medium to late in the process I was becoming pretty miffed - but I never once had a go at Julia, or harassed her for progress. If Julia told me she was sick and couldn't work on my piece for that week, than two PSers would turn up showing off their brand new just completed JKT pieces - I kept my mouth shut.
Maybe I should have said something? Looking back - or, seeing it through your eyes - it was pretty clear my patience, kindness and 'friendship' were simply being taken advantage of. It upsets me now to look at it this way.

I guess I had to learn that 'friendship and business' lesson the hard way!

AJ...sorry to hear about the problems with your bracelet..

let me ask you a nosy Q...all 18k gold? ...did the custom bracelet cost close to $8K?..

Thanks DF for your thoughts. You may indeed ask your nosy Q - but the bracelet isn't all gold. Its sterling base, with gold accents and details Fortunately, it was not as much as your guess! But is still was by no means cheap.



Julia actually commented at the time it was the most expensive and complex piece she had ever worked on, to date (not sure if that has changed since).


eta: edited to answer Tgal further.

 

[arjunajane]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Hit and run eh? Didn't mean to, but I've been busy and not really paying as much attention to PS as I had been. Seems as though life has gotten in the way.

Not to mention I didn't figure anyone would notice what I said.

I'm sorry you're going through this AJ. Not much else to say I'm afraid...

I only noticed on that thread because someone else asked you a direct question about it, and you didn't respond. No big deal, and it seems you'd rather not say, so.....

I responded now that I knew someone asked me why!

I'm barely on PS anymore, and only seem to post sporadically on CS or if someone brings my attention to a thread...as they have with this one.

Thanks Freke.
Can't say I am glad to hear I'm not alone!

 

[arjunajane]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Ohhh wow AJ, I'm really sorry! I hope something gets resolved for you w/the bracelet soon. Was it working on the bracelet that caused the falling out in the first place? I remember the stones used in it and the thread about doing the three stone bezel ring..which would have been gorgeous, so I don't get how come she didn't want to do it. What a mess..I'm sorry it's happening, AJ!

Hey pack,
yep, I remember your involvement in that thread about the 3 stone ring. How I wish now I had stood my ground on that ring..ah well.
Long story short - some nosy PSer contacted JKT accusing her of copying Meyer designs, after a consumer in my thread (was that you?) helpfully did a photoshop job of my gems on top of a CM ring, just experimenting. Complete nonsense and gossip, basically, but it got to Julia.
Julia subsequently became quite hostile about the project, insisting if I wanted to go ahead I would have to give up many of the elements
I was after in the design - a thick shank and double bezel, basically. I didn't get the issue, as Meyers don't have IP on double bezels, lol - but also didn't want to commit to make an $800 ring that was nothing like I had my heart set on. So, eventually I scrapped the ring idea, and started looking at bracelets
tbh, since then I have seen many designs in Julia's store and on PS that are much more recognisably Meyer-reminiscent than what I had wanted.
(However, don't get me wrong - they are still JKT pieces - I am not implying they are JM or CM imitations. The three have similar, but still distinct styles.)

Actually, surprising as it may be, we had not fallen out at all, all the way up to the final completion of the bracelet, everything was still very friendly and casual. It was what occurred, and mainly what was said, between 5 and 9 Nov that caused the end of our relationship, professional or otherwise.
Its a kinda detailed story, and again, not that comfortable with sharing private correspondence...suffice to say, I hope I never have another vendor treat me with the utter crudeness, disrespect and distrust that was exhibited in those few days.
It was a complete about-face of character

 

[LGK]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Yikes, AJ. I have no helpful suggestions, I'm sorry to say; I'm really not sure what on earth else you can do to fix this on your end. Looking at that time line, you couldn't even try a PayPal claim for *any* of the payments, huh? It's too long ago. It's such a bizarre situation; I mean, looking at the bracelet, who on earth would have made it curve like that? And good lord, WHY?! Was it made to fit an alien? It' just nutty. There's no way anybody could wear that, not without having a really deformed arm!

The hell of it is, the design itself- sizing and scale and the weird off-curve aside- is totally beautiful. Gah. Torturous! I just wanted to say it's good to "see" you again and sorry it's under such crap circumstances. I hope you get some sort of resolution; it's perfectly obvious to looking at it that it's unwearable, with that shape and the obvious hugeness. Good luck, it sounds like you could use some at this point!

 

[Lovinggems]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Was your Paypal payment linked to a credit card account? You might be able to open a dispute claim with the CC company rather than Paypal.

 

[pwendyp]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

oh AJ...

My heart goes out to you - you must be so sad over all this. I had wondered why you hadn't come in to tell of your bangle, once it had arrived back to you. Those weeks of wondering where it had got to...and now, knowing 'things' had broken down with you and JKT, it must have been a tense few weeks.

I can't add anything more, than what has already been said, except to say I so hope you can get some resolution with this. You must be hurting a whole lot right now, on many levels...

You were right to start this thread, and I can only imagine how hard that must have been to do, but ... but for these threads, done with a sometimes heavy heart, how can we know the sometimes bad stuff that happens. It informs, and certainly 'I' can say - gives definite things to think hard about. Thank you for being brave...as it must be for anyone having/needing to face writing a thread such as this one. My thoughts are with you.

 

[arjunajane]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Yikes, AJ. I have no helpful suggestions, I'm sorry to say; I'm really not sure what on earth else you can do to fix this on your end. Looking at that time line, you couldn't even try a PayPal claim for *any* of the payments, huh? It's too long ago. It's such a bizarre situation; I mean, looking at the bracelet, who on earth would have made it curve like that? And good lord, WHY?! Was it made to fit an alien? It' just nutty. There's no way anybody could wear that, not without having a really deformed arm!

The hell of it is, the design itself- sizing and scale and the weird off-curve aside- is totally beautiful. Gah. Torturous! I just wanted to say it's good to "see" you again and sorry it's under such crap circumstances. I hope you get some sort of resolution; it's perfectly obvious to looking at it that it's unwearable, with that shape and the obvious hugeness. Good luck, it sounds like you could use some at this point!

Hiya LGK -
really nice to 'see' you again too
Exactly - I paid off the piece so early, based on false deadlines, that I am way outside the PP claim rules..pretty uncool, right?
When I was excited about receiving the bangle and emailed the final pics to a jeweller friend, that person picked it up straight away about the shape, and told me they were concerned..I assured them she was a quality craftsperson, and we left it there - obviously, they didn't want to burst my bubble or hurt my feelings, as the piece was already in transit. Now, that the cat is officially out, he has expressed similar bewilderment to others in this thread about the decision..
I do not like to speculate, but based on reading back through our emails, it seemed like a kinda rushed decision. Which is all the more baffling, as once the timeline had blown out, I literally and repeatedly gave Julia carte blanche to take as long as she needed to get the bracelet done *properly*.

Julia says repeatedly in her final emails how it fits her arm perfectly - so either JKT has different shaped arms to everyone on this thread (at the minimum) - or that was simply untrue, and she was I guess hoping I would not...notice? complain.?

You're spot on LGK - despite the bad feelings and negative ongoing experience, it is a delightful looking piece, and my hat genuinely goes off to Julia for creating the top section as well as she did, and fulfilling my expectations of how pretty that unique design could become IRL.
I believe the centre bezel would actually make for a really pretty 'signet' type ring. At the moment it holds one of my most treasured gems, a gorgeous purple spinel from Gene F, my first very expensive gem.
If there were a way to change that section into a pendant, or...something..? But I just can't see how, at least with Julia and I working on it together - the trust is simply gone.
If I had a higher income, perhaps I could just walk away and ask a new jeweller to salvage what they can - but thats not an option for me.
Part of this bracelet was paid for by my Fi as a 2010 b'day present - and he hardly even knows I have it. I cannot begin to broach this whole topic with him as I know how disappointed and angry he is likely to get about it all - and I don't like being forced to fib to my guy.

With current circumstances, it seems I certainly could use some luck! Here's still hoping she sees reason and comes to the table, right..?

Cheers for letting me vent and for the support LGK.

 

[Pandora II]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Hmm, having looked at all the photos, is there a possibility that she thought the main design on the bracelet should sit on the top edge part of the arm so you would see it more if you looked down rather than it being flat on the arm where the detailed bit would be to the side most of the time and more prone to damage?

Weird thing to do but it's the only reason I can think of for doing this... and it looks how it is positioned in the photo of her arm. If you wear it that way does it fall down?

 

[movie zombie]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

admittedly, i have not read all the posts on the first page. so here's my question: if you wanted a ring, why did you agree to a bracelet? personally, i would have moved on at that point......... however, you did agree and you're not at all happy about the pricey custom piece. you were buddy/buddy.....and professionally there is a guarantee. and now you're not getting any response. i'd be ticked off.....but more with myself for having agreed to go with a bracelet in the first place. what can you do? its probably going to cost you as much or more than the piece to pursue any legal action. you could have a lawyer write a letter stressing the need for communication to avoid further action. you could file a report with the better business bureau for her town/area. i'm so sorry things went bad for you but i think they went bad from the get-go when you agreed to a project you didn't ask for originally.

MoZo

 

[0-0-0]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

I don't have any advice as to how you can resolve your differences with JKT, but I think there's a relatively easy fix to the shape and fit of the piece.

From the pictures it looks like all the stones and design elements are on one half of the piece, whereas the other half is simply a plain band. I think it should be relatively easy to replace the plain half with a shorter, less round band to make the whole piece have a smaller fit with a better fitting shape. It may not be the perfect fix but it'll reduce some weight and make the piece more wearable.

 

[simplysplendid]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

Hi,

Sorry to hear about the issues with this beautiful bangle. Can the bottom not be resized and reattached to the top half so that the overall shape is round and may fit better (instead of oval)? There are bangles/bracelets out there that are perfectly round (eg: Cartier LOVE bracelet or stacking bangles in Tiffany). Have you tried asking a jeweler? I am not an expert but just thinking that if we can resize our rings, surely we can resize a bangle?

eta: I didn't read all the posts before posting. thbmok's illustration above conveys what I was trying to say.

 

[PinkTower]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

I don't have any advice as to how you can resolve your differences with JKT, but I think there's a relatively easy fix to the shape and fit of the piece.

From the pictures it looks like all the stones and design elements are on one half of the piece, whereas the other half is simply a plain band. I think it should be relatively easy to replace the plain half with a shorter, less round band to make the whole piece have a smaller fit with a better fitting shape. It may not be the perfect fix but it'll reduce some weight and make the piece more wearable.

This is a very good idea. I cannot see how any shape is going to stay pushed up on your arm, as was your original plan. You cannot defy gravity. It would have to be tourniquet like to stay up there. I've read that Jackie Kennedy used to have her bracelets made larger so that she could wear them over her gloves. I've also seen photos where she had a bracelet pushed up on her arm. So, maybe some people have arms that cooperate with the look, just not me.

Your bracelet is really exquisite. I hope you can the modifications made so that you can use it for your wedding.

 

[Aerix]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

I don't really have anything helpful to add to this thread, but I just wanted to offer my sympathy to ArjunaJane. I had a similar problem with an Etsy seller before. A few years ago when I wanted to save a little money, I got the bright idea of having my old gold melted down to make a pair of rings for DH and I. I also didn't have much money then, so I ended up paying the vendor in excess gold essentially... She didn't have a reputation like JKT and she didn't have a whole lot of feedback but I found the seller via Etsy's Alchemy system.

I won't go into too much detail, but to put it shortly, it took over a year and the seller ignored my emails at one point until my husband started contacting her and threatened legal action. The rings turned out horrendous (I have photos if anyone's interested) despite all the photos I showed her of how I wanted the rings to look and painstakingly drawn versions with exact measurements I even provided. This seller claimed to have over 25 years of experience in creating jewelry. Hah!

I was just happy in the end I was able to get the finished 'products' and I ended up reselling the gold that was in them for close to a grand, but it still did not offset the cost for the rest of the gold I gave her that she claimed to use to create the pieces and all the stress over the damn thing. She also gave me deadlines that she frequently would not meet and I would see other custom creations finished in her shop before mine.

So, I can relate with ArjunaJane. I hope you're able to reach a resolution. My heart goes out to you. Oh and also to add, I contacted Etsy about my problem with the seller and they didn't do a thing.

I also have to say that I agree with FrekeChild, JKT is overpriced in my opinion. I once asked for a quote for a silver ring and she quoted me $350 or $370! The most expensive quote I've ever heard of for silver (from an Etsy vendor) was around $200-250, but it was for a heavy, detailed, cast ring. I'd heard many good things about JKT and considered contacting her about a project in the future, but after reading about ArjunaJane's experience, I have to say that I won't be getting in touch with her anytime soon.

Thanks for being honest about your experience. I really hope JKT will contact you and offer a resolution.

 

[jstarfireb]

Re: vent/request for advice-real problems with JKT custom pi

I don't have any advice as to how you can resolve your differences with JKT, but I think there's a relatively easy fix to the shape and fit of the piece.

From the pictures it looks like all the stones and design elements are on one half of the piece, whereas the other half is simply a plain band. I think it should be relatively easy to replace the plain half with a shorter, less round band to make the whole piece have a smaller fit with a better fitting shape. It may not be the perfect fix but it'll reduce some weight and make the piece more wearable.

thbmok, this is EXACTLY what I was going to suggest! It looks to me like a relatively easy fix. If JKT can't/won't do it, can someone else? You'd have to pay, but at least it would be wearable.

AJ, sorry to hear about this and how it's affected your feelings about a beautiful piece of jewelry.

ETA: I agree that JKT's prices are somewhat unrealistic. I love her work but simply can't afford to go to her for custom work anymore now that she's raised her prices.