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Twisted Turn of Events

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VetteGuy

Rough_Rock
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Feb 27, 2009
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Hi,

So, I have a jeweler a friend introduced me to, really nice guy.. Extremely helpful, amazing service.. So I meet with him, tell him my specs.. I originally said I wanted to spend roughly 15k on the stone, and wanted something in the 2.25 range, when I realized that wasn''t going to happened (based on the stones he was coming up with) I upped my budget.. Recently he found me a stone which he said is perfect..

2.20ct
GIA rated
VS1
H color
Good Polish
Good Symmetry
Florescence - None
53% Table
72.3% Depth
Medium - very thick (faceted) girdle
no Culet

Cost - $22k, plus the setting (tiffany dinovo) 3k = $25,000... I went to look at the stone, its nice, under the store lighting I felt it was a little yellow... I live in a different state so a friend (who knows far more about diamonds than me) went back to look at the stone in different lighting conditions.. I spoke with him and he said its a nice stone and outside of the store lighting it was not as yellow as I thought, next to an F, it was difficult to tell the difference.. I was pretty excited, thinking this is the one.. I somehow go on google to read about a few things (table size, depth..etc)... The site I come to is called diamond helpers.. On one portion of the site it has a "diamond price tutorial".. I thought it would be worthwhile to checkout, i follow the instructions, which take me to UnionDiamonds.com.. I run the search for my diamond and SHOCKINGLY come up with MY DIAMOND!!!!!! Im looking at the specs, and Im thinking, wow, this is just like my diamond, i pull out my GIA report, check the GIA report # and sure enough ITS IT.!!!! Price? 16,900... im a little shocked, as well as a little behildered.. How is this possible? I emailed Uniondiamonds for a copy of the GIA report and the nice salesman said he was not sure on the availability but will tell me on monday.. Im not a betting man but im guessing its not available..

Now, my question is what to do? Im spending all this time researching stones, learning about this stuff, and my jeweler bought a stone from a place I could have gotten it then marked it up 5grand!!! 30%?!!! Don''t get me wrong, im all about making money, but 30% on retail pricing? talk about feeling ripped.. I checked out some of the other stones they have available and for the money im spending I can buy a much better stone. (on paper at least)

my question is what should I do?

Im going to meet with my dads jeweler tomorrow to see what he has.. But I just can''t get over this.. Do brick and motar shops really markup diamonds THAT much?

Thanks,

One of the stones they have that seems to be really nice (on paper)
2.21 Cushion Cut
GIA rated
D Color
22,372
8.25x6.9x4.72
1.20 - l to width
68.4% depth
68% table
no culet
very good polish
very good symmetry
girdle - thin to thick
none flourescence

here is where I understand experience is worth a market, how would a diamond with those specs look? On paper its a great diamond, right? or no

any help would be great.. Thank you so much
 

JulieN

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
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Jul 25, 2005
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13,324
30% over Internet is definitely HIGH.

I wonder if you could you have gotten a 2 ct Tiffany Novo for that price?

Paper doesn't tell you anything much about cushions.
 

VetteGuy

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 27, 2009
Messages
14
My friend went to tiffanys right after looking at the stone (i owe this guy so much) and looked at a novo, H, VS2, 1.5ct, price was $30k!
 

VetteGuy

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 27, 2009
Messages
14
Maybe, hes making up for the price of the setting with the stone? Maybe the setting is more like 5k but instead of saying 5k for the setting, he said 3s, brings the price of the stone down to 20? I really have no idea.. What I don''t get is, if I can get the stone from a retailer online, why is he going to the same place?
 

VetteGuy

Rough_Rock
Joined
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i never bought it.. I was about it buy it... Lets put it this way, I was so close to buying it, I emailed my sister "i found the stone"... so much for that..
 

JulieN

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
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13,324
Date: 2/27/2009 7:15:44 PM
Author: VetteGuy
Maybe, hes making up for the price of the setting with the stone? Maybe the setting is more like 5k but instead of saying 5k for the setting, he said 3s, brings the price of the stone down to 20? I really have no idea.. What I don''t get is, if I can get the stone from a retailer online, why is he going to the same place?

There''s no way the Novo setting is anywhere close to 5K. 1.5-3 for a good one sounds about right.

He''s not going to the same place. They just share wholesalers.
 

MissGotRocks

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 23, 2005
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12,183
Date: 2/27/2009 7:16:49 PM
Author: VetteGuy
i never bought it.. I was about it buy it... Lets put it this way, I was so close to buying it, I emailed my sister ''i found the stone''... so much for that..
Well, that''s the good news! There are lots of other stones to consider at pricing that is much more competitive than the friend''s friend.

Who knows? Maybe even buy the same stone from someone else at a much lower price. This guy may not own the stone - he might have just brought it in for you to see.
 

purrfectpear

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 31, 2008
Messages
4,079
Your jeweler most likely did not "buy" that diamond yet. He has it out on memo (spec) for you to look at and he hoped to sell it to you. Tell him you''re not interested and you want to put off a purchase for several months
Watch how fast that diamond goes back into availability. Then buy it through Union Diamond and save $$$. You dodged a bullet didn''t you.
 

arjunajane

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 18, 2008
Messages
9,758
Date: 2/27/2009 7:44:45 PM
Author: purrfectpear
Your jeweler most likely did not ''buy'' that diamond yet. He has it out on memo (spec) for you to look at and he hoped to sell it to you. Tell him you''re not interested and you want to put off a purchase for several months
Watch how fast that diamond goes back into availability. Then buy it through Union Diamond and save $$$. You dodged a bullet didn''t you.
agreed.
 

Brown.Eyed.Girl

Ideal_Rock
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Messages
6,893
Date: 2/27/2009 9:23:58 PM
Author: arjunajane
Date: 2/27/2009 7:44:45 PM

Author: purrfectpear

Your jeweler most likely did not ''buy'' that diamond yet. He has it out on memo (spec) for you to look at and he hoped to sell it to you. Tell him you''re not interested and you want to put off a purchase for several months
Watch how fast that diamond goes back into availability. Then buy it through Union Diamond and save $$$. You dodged a bullet didn''t you.
agreed.
Ditto.

Good thing you found out earlier - kudos for research! Would you prefer to buy at an actual store, or fine with buying something online? If the latter, I think you can get many many options just as good if not better from the posters here
 

Kelli

Ideal_Rock
Joined
May 27, 2008
Messages
5,455
Wow good thing you started doing your research! What a snake!
 

HollyS

Ideal_Rock
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Jul 18, 2007
Messages
6,099
Don''t buy it. That''s what you do. And tell him why.
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
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55,617

Savvymon

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Sep 16, 2008
Messages
120
Both the second and third stone DS posted look great!


they are both ''whiter'' if you could see the warmth in a H.
 

VetteGuy

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 27, 2009
Messages
14
Thanks everyone... Him having the same supplier makes sense, but if he bought it from a supplier that means he got it for even less than 16.9k and was trying to make even more than 5grand on this stone.. I still can''t get over the crazy markup..

The jeweler Im going to see tomorrow told me he has 4 quality Cushion cuts in stock, only problem is they are 2.0s, and i really didn''t want to go smaller than 2.20cts.. Ill go talk with him and see what he says.. I think ill show him the GIA report for the 2.20 and see what he says..

Im fine with buying a stone online and having someone local make me the setting.. One of my major concerns is getting a diamond that is good on paper but not great in person.. Not being an expert, im a little bit susceptible.. Ive done my homework, read tons of articles, but its one thing to read and another to have real world experience.


thanks again
 

JulieN

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
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Jul 25, 2005
Messages
13,324
The usual course of action is to tell your B&M the price you can get the EXACT stone online. Some jewelers dropped the price to match immediately. Others dropped it part of the way. Others insist that they would go out of business if they sold it for that price. Some refuse to negotiate. In this case, you can walk away. After this, sometimes the stone will still be available through another merchant. Sometimes, the jeweler you were working with buys the stone for their own inventory, because they liked it enough (and you would have to pay whatever price they asked if you wanted that stone.)

Sorry if that was long and hard to understand?
 

arjunajane

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 18, 2008
Messages
9,758
Date: 2/28/2009 1:14:45 AM
Author: VetteGuy
Thanks everyone... Him having the same supplier makes sense, but if he bought it from a supplier that means he got it for even less than 16.9k and was trying to make even more than 5grand on this stone.. I still can''t get over the crazy markup..

The jeweler Im going to see tomorrow told me he has 4 quality Cushion cuts in stock, only problem is they are 2.0s, and i really didn''t want to go smaller than 2.20cts.. Ill go talk with him and see what he says.. I think ill show him the GIA report for the 2.20 and see what he says..

Im fine with buying a stone online and having someone local make me the setting.. One of my major concerns is getting a diamond that is good on paper but not great in person.. Not being an expert, im a little bit susceptible.. Ive done my homework, read tons of articles, but its one thing to read and another to have real world experience.


thanks again
If it helps than Jon at GOG will film videos of the cushions for you - they are very helpful tools, and Jon has a good eye for cushions.
Also, there is no need to get your stone set locally - most of the recommended PS vendors also have good benches to work with, and the novo replicas are common.

ERD I think do a nice novo-style, and they are also very good for cushions.
 

Triggerfish

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 11, 2008
Messages
88
I'm no expert on this, but if it were me, I'd try to find out from UnionDiamond if they own the stone. I highly doubt this local jeweler you're dealing with actually owns it, as someone else said. If this jeweler had bought it, it shouldn't be showing up on UnionDiamond's website. Providing this jeweler "friend of a friend" doesn't own the diamond, I'd just call him up and tell him you're no longer interested in the stone, that you've found another somewhere else that you're going to purchase. He'll likely ask questions, but whatever. Make something up! I'm not so sure I'd let him know you found the EXACT same stone at a much lower price advertised elsewhere. If he likes the stone, or has a hunch that YOU really like it, he might just buy it, hoping you'll come back. No way I'd wanna do business with this dude in the future anyway, knowing that he's marking his inventory up THIS much. It seems he doesn't mind ripping off a "friend of a friend" at all! My bet is that after you tell him you're not interested, within days that same stone will be available again though Union. Buy it from them at a much lower price. OR, your other option would be....IF you're "comfortable" paying what this jeweler guy quoted you, ask the fine people here to help you search around. You're likely to end up with a much better diamond at around that same price tag. Definitely a weird situation! LOL. What are the chances you'd just happen to stumble upon the EXACT same diamond when researching?! Consider yourself lucky, and cut ties with this jeweler ASAP. That's my 2 cents. Good luck!
 

VetteGuy

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 27, 2009
Messages
14
An end to the chaos..

Thank you all for your advice, its nice to that I was able to find a group of people who know what Im going through.. A lot of my friends aren't married yet so its difficult to talk with them about this process.. And yes, I definitely feel like I got very lucky with this..

The end came today when I went to my fathers jeweler - Al. I didn't go to him in the beginning because my buddy thought his friend could get me a great deal.. After seeing the 2.20 last weekend I decided to give dads jeweler a call to see what he had to offer.. I went there today to meet with Al and he was great.. I told him what happened which he got a kick out of.. When he showed me the diamonds he had me look at them through the jewelers microscope rather than the loop.. The other jeweler had me look through the loop, BIG difference.. Al told me it would be easier to find the imperfections of the diamond through the microscope than a loop... The first diamond I looked at, I did so through the loop, then he put it under the microscope which was much easier for me.. He pointed out all the imperfections of the 10 or so diamonds he showed me, explained why each one was better than the other.. after 4 hrs I decided on one that looked great.. The stone I chose is a VS2, cushion modified brilliant cut, G color, very good polish, good symmetry, very good cut, florescence none.

I might have been able to find a similar diamond online for a little cheaper, but I liked being able to sit down to compare multiple diamonds at once then decide which one I liked the most.. The two that I finally narrowed it down had the same exact specs on paper but looked so different to the naked eye.. Very very happy that this is finally done with, now I can plan the trip I planned to propose to her on..


Thanks again for all the help..
 

MissGotRocks

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 23, 2005
Messages
12,183
Good for you! Was the stone you bought in the same 2.20 size range? I''m glad you have a stone that you really like and feel comfortable with.

We would love to see pics of the stone and more importantly, the finished product!

Best of luck to you - let us know how it turns out!
 

Brown.Eyed.Girl

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jun 4, 2008
Messages
6,893
Congratulations! I''m glad to hear that you had a positive end to this diamond-buying process
Please post pictures of it - I''d love to see it!
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
42,064
So glad it all worked out for you!
 

Ellen

Super_Ideal_Rock
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24,426
Congrats, I''m glad it turned out well in the end!
 

VetteGuy

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 27, 2009
Messages
14
thanks again every...

With regards to the setting, i asked my jeweler about doing it in platinum and he said he can do it but he recommended white gold, he said thats what he did his daughters setting in (which he''ll bring in for me next weekend).. He actually made her the same setting as the one Im getting, with a very similar diamond and he said he loves it.. he also showed me a tiffany legacy style setting which he did b.c his client wanted it but he said, stay simple, your gf is a small girl (size 4 ring, 5''2" and about 100lbs), a ring like the legacy will be huge on her..

he said platinum looks very similar, is stronger, wears very similar, is more expensive (said 600 more on the dinovo setting) but after a year will look a little more dull than platinum.. He told me what he suggested white gold but he''ll make whatever i want..

whaat do you all think? do girls want to be able to say its platinum?

thanks again,

john
 

february2003bride

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 18, 2005
Messages
3,545
Congratulations on finding your diamond!

I would go with platinum. It has a nice heft to it whereas whitegold is lighter, white gold yellows over time and you don''t have to worry about nickle allergies.

Good luck and please post pictures when you get the finished ring!
 

Deelight

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Oct 4, 2007
Messages
5,543
I prefer plat over white gold - you don''t need to re dip it in rhodium and I like the look of it.

Platnium over time does develop a patina but this can be polished out I have had my plat setting since September last year and it hasn''t developed a patina - it is still really shiny. Also there are different types of platnium alloys to consider as well some are tougher then others.
 

tyty333

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
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21,660
Congrats! Go with platinum...I dont know why the jeweler is stearing you away from it.
 

tmonk

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 15, 2009
Messages
2
Regarding your diamond -

I had a VERY similar thing happen. I knew exactly what I wanted in a cushion -

VS1-2
1.0 - 1.1 carat
Colorless
Smaller table and depth percent
Cutlet medium or smaller
Flourescence medium or less
Girdle within one rating of medium

I found a number of diamonds I liked online.... then went to the local B+M to look at some comparable. He found one that looked PERFECT to me... but around $5800. A bit higher than I wanted.

I found it online the same night (EXACT stats) for $4200. I bought it that night (good return policy) and had the local B+M set it for me. He said the stats looked very similar when he set it for me. I played the fool and told him it couldn't have been - I only paid around 2/3 of the price for the diamond I was interested in.... I told him I figured I'd compromise on the diamond and go with a custom platinum setting.

The diamond was BEAUTIFUL, the dealer recommended it, and I saved a huge chunk of cash.

Being patient and doing your own research can save you a bundle and guarantee you'll be more satisfied.

Ignorance may be bliss.... but so is being rewarded for your time and effort - especially for something so important to you as the engagement ring for the love of your life.
 
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