Please give me your thoughts...

[derbygal]

Just have to say I love bezels and this one is hideous. I would have been crying if that is what I received. Also want to add that I appreciate threads like this one for pointing out the good, bad and ugly from vendors. Without information on what others have experienced, how are we to make our own fully informed buying decisions?

PS-- Agree that a Scholdt semi bezel would be fantastic with the Octavia. I hope Woofmama doesn't mind me posting hers (not sure if hers is just a regular asscher or an Octavia):

 

[FrekeChild]

Hugs (((MayK)))

I'm sure your ring will be lovely.

I agree, some people have definitely been blood thirsty on this thread. Can you imagine how different it would have been if it were the beloved BGD or WF or Victor Canera?

Probably VERY different, because none of those vendors would have pulled this to begin with. Not to mention that they're all professional and respectful. Unlike David.

Maybe so, but they've all had their fair share of boneheaded customer snafus, too. If it were one of those vendors, I'm guessing more people would have said to just wait to see it in person.

In any case, glad DBL is doing the right thing finally, and I hope cygnet can find a ring she loves.

I'm going to note here that cygnet did not "out" Diamonds by Lauren until page 4, and only TGal brought up seeing it in person at that point.

I am also glad that DBL is doing the ring thing, and I hope that cygnet can find a ring she loves and get on with that overdue proposal!

 

[Laila619]

I'm upset... the reason I'm upset was because I had the misfortune of being on the back boards so to speak and watching this thing play out... then watching the "set up".

So Tgal's hunch was right and most people already knew who the vendor was?...interesting.

 

[Catmom]

This thread really pains me. I have a few DBL pieces which I really love. David has been nothing but gracious with me in all of our interactions. I've been around for a long time though on many jewelry boards and I have seen him get into trouble numerous times because of his temper. I usually just shake my head but I have to say that if this situation had been my situation I would have reacted exactly the same as cygnet. It really is a shame that it took this firestorm before David would do what he should have done in the first place. I hope he has finally learned from this and we can move on.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Every vendor has an unhappy customer at some point. And there are vendors here who have had 10 or 50 times more pieces produced and shown here than DBL. But it is how they deal with the problem that shows integrity or not. Sometimes the complaints are warranted and sometimes they are not. But the vendor still has to deal with it in a way that does not damage their reputation even when they are right and the customer is in the wrong. And certainly when the customer is justified with the complaint, it should be swiftly and effectively handled. James (Jim) Allen is a great example because he certainly comes on here and graciously posts problem solving ideas when there is a complaint against his company. And he is always appreciated by other posters when he does that.

 

[iheartscience]

Every vendor has an unhappy customer at some point. And there are vendors here who have had 10 or 50 times more pieces produced and shown here than DBL. But it is how they deal with the problem that shows integrity or not. Sometimes the complaints are warranted and sometimes they are not. But the vendor still has to deal with it in a way that does not damage their reputation even when they are right and the customer is in the wrong. And certainly when the customer is justified with the complaint, it should be swiftly and effectively handled. James (Jim) Allen is a great example because he certainly comes on here and graciously posts problem solving ideas when there is a complaint against his company. And he is always appreciated by other posters when he does that.

Exactly. I've been here a while and the vast majority of well known PS vendors calmly and professionally fix it when customers are unhappy.

 

[RockyRacoon]

Every vendor has an unhappy customer at some point. And there are vendors here who have had 10 or 50 times more pieces produced and shown here than DBL. But it is how they deal with the problem that shows integrity or not. Sometimes the complaints are warranted and sometimes they are not. But the vendor still has to deal with it in a way that does not damage their reputation even when they are right and the customer is in the wrong. And certainly when the customer is justified with the complaint, it should be swiftly and effectively handled. James (Jim) Allen is a great example because he certainly comes on here and graciously posts problem solving ideas when there is a complaint against his company. And he is always appreciated by other posters when he does that.

James Allen has done a great job of addressing public problems.

Many vendors could take a note from JA on customer service.

 

[pinkjewel]

Cygnet, I am happy for you that it looks like your issue has been resolved. The ring was definitely not up to DBL standards- especially from his uber bench- very confusing.

Mayk- please do not leave over this. I, too, have been a happy customer of DBL and have purchased two items from him. David has always gone out of his way to make sure I was happy, being extremely patient with me,too. I can't understand how his customer service changed with this transaction- I feel like I'm missing something somewhere.
I have been disillusioned with the way a few of the threads have gone recently on Pricescope, and also was debating whether to still attend the GTG in Vegas. Please come and we can stand in the corner together and look at each other's DBL bling.

 

[bigdiamondtinygal]

Regardless of whether the impetus for this thread was a personal or professional, I have to say that as an PS member I’m glad that I got to see it play out here. I want to hear about peoples’ experiences with various vendors – especially ones that get used around here a lot (like DBL, Leon Mege, VC, SK, etc). I’m very sorry that Cygnet experienced the troubles that she did with this custom project and with DBL (and I really hope that she ends up with a ring she loves!). And if I were her, I’d be very upset as well. I’d certainly want to share my experience here so that I could hopefully prevent some other PS member from having a similar experience – or at the least to allow PSers who make a choice to proceed with that vendor to make a fully informed decision (in part based on the experience of other PSers who have used that vendor) before doing so.

I also think that how a vendor responds to such posts speaks volumes about them. I think seeing those vendor responses is also very important from a consumer perspective. After seeing all of it (regardless of who the subject vendor is), we, as consumers, have the choice and the power to choose to work with that vendor for an upcoming project or not. If someone chooses to proceed with a vendor that may have been criticized here – that it 100% their choice! If they choose not to proceed with a criticized vendor because of what they read here that is their choice as well! It is the ability to access all such information here that seems so very important to the PS community.

 

[brellymom]

Yeah, I can see why you don't love it. But I gotta say...from your pics, the lines on that ring are much sharper than the pics you received (meaning, I can clearly see an octagonal outline on the bezels. And it definitely looks like two bezels.)

I agree with you that the edge of the bezel touching the diamond looks much straighter and crisp in cygnet's photos and that there are two distinct bezels. It's the disgusting trough of unpolished metal between the two that is utterly offensive (I know I mentioned this further back but I feel like it's so terrible it merits mentioning again).

OK, but go back and look at the original inspirations pieces. Don't they look...well...the same?

***********************************

+1

Lots of weird things about this whole transaction, but it just seems to me that the final product - perhaps not perfectly aligned with the inspiration pics, looks very similar. I see why you might not want to keep it, but all the suggestions that that the final product is "shoddy" and so far off from the original seems somewhat overdramatic. I did a custom project with DBL some time ago and was very pleased with the outcome, but I do wish they'd just unset the stone so everyone involved could move on.

 

[Rockdiamond]

I honestly can't believe the same bench that executed my design so perfectly and painstakingly also made this ring. I can say with certainty that in Cygnet's place I would be just as disappointed and upset. The outline of the outer bezel is asymmetric, the windmills meet the straights at different angles, the unpolished trench with (again asymmetric) gouges is an eyesore, and the overall lack of proportionality of the various elements is unflattering and bizarre.

I don't know what happened here. I've just been scratching my head thinking "WTF" over and over. But I think it's pretty clear that someone dropped the ball, and that the post-ball-drop fallout was handled very poorly.

I think the original inspiration (the yellow radiant in yg double bezel) is beautiful - it melds sharp angular precision and "molten metal" beautifully. What Cygnet received is IMO most definitely not representative of the aesthetic of the inspiration, and again IMO most definitely not a credit to the vendor.

I'm very glad to hear that Cygnet will be sent a return label and that David will unset the stone with no more drama.

I will respond here- as a few people who have seen what's possible from our factories have questions:
We asked our Uber guys to reproduce a less costly ring, and they did as we asked.
Any reasonable minded person who's looked at rings and photos of rings knows photos really can't tell the whole story- especially with shiny metal. Especially if the photo is to be used to check alignment- to see it everything is straight, the camera would have to be completely parallel to the camera, which is impossible in practicality.
The ring we made is as close a copy as possible to the lower priced ring- except the metalwork is way better when you loupe it. I agree that the trench would have needed re-working if the client had allowed us to work on it- but when looking at the way the metal is finished on the broader smooth surfaces- it's amazing- getting 18kt unplated white gold to look like that is truly a feat.
There would be no way for all the dimensions to be identical, as the stones are different sizes.

I have already said that I did not feel the results were expected. However I can't fault our guys for copying something faithfully.
If given the opportunity, we would have welcomed the opportunity to address the issues, and correct them- even if it meant changing to a different style- possibly a much thinner bezel would be best- but the original design has a lot of metal. NO factory gets by without a problem ring occasionally.
Our money back guarantee says "for any reason" - therefore people are not required to give a reason- we can afford to offer it that way because most people will let us know what they don't like- and give us the opportunity to address it.
We will not change that aspect of our policies- I don't like it when a money back guarantee is "linked' to something.
Still, I don't ever see us making a ring for a stone we did not sell again.

Mayk- I've got a bottle of seltzer ready to douse my trousers

 

[InnaR]

I had one interaction with David. I remember that I made an impulse ebay buy and asked him to cancel the transaction and he did it in such gracious manner that it made me to remember his name. It was few years ago, and I was not on PS yet.

I am very suprised that a customers can order custom setting and if they don't like it they are entitle to a full refund - no questions asked. I might be new at it, but can anyone point me to another vendor who has the same policy? I was under impression that if you go custom, you need to accept the risks that even if it's not 100% matches your expectations, you are still stuck with it. AS IS. No vendor want to go through process of creating custom piece and to take it back and issue a full refund if it doesn't fully satisfies customer expectations. How is he going to pay his bench for the work done? It also gives customer an option of ordering another custom piece, and returning it, then another and so on...

I personally don't like this setting, but I would never put any stone in the bezel. Especially double bezel.

 

[LibbyLA]

FREE OCTAVIA!!!

I was doing a quick scroll-through, saw that, and was trying to figure out where to get in line to get my free Octavia! Then I realized that it was "Free Octavia" (as in "Free Bates"), set it free.

Boy, was I disappointed. I'm not normally drawn to step-cuts, but the Octavia is a beauty. I'd love to get a free Octavia.

liz

 

[diamondseeker2006]

FREE OCTAVIA!!!

I was doing a quick scroll-through, saw that, and was trying to figure out where to get in line to get my free Octavia! Then I realized that it was "Free Octavia" (as in "Free Bates"), set it free.

Boy, was I disappointed. I'm not normally drawn to step-cuts, but the Octavia is a beauty. I'd love to get a free Octavia.

liz

Bahahahaha!!!! I thought of that after I posted it but no one noticed it until YOU! Oh, what a HAPPY day that would be to get a free Octavia!!! But maybe we can redo the sticker to say "Free Cygnet's Octavia!!!"!

 

[CopperTop]

This is very dramatic and I think it was made moreso by the telephone game played from the start. I think both sides have cause to be frustrated. That being said, DBL needs a dedicated customer service rep because the replies I've seen in this thread are really unprofessional in their tone and content.

On the topic of the ring... a double bezel is not really my thing... but this one certainly looks too wide both in the trench and the inner bezel. The inspirations with four corners a bit rounded is one thing, but 8 just looks too... round. I hope you find a good home for your stone!

 

[LibbyLA]

FREE OCTAVIA!!!

I was doing a quick scroll-through, saw that, and was trying to figure out where to get in line to get my free Octavia! Then I realized that it was "Free Octavia" (as in "Free Bates"), set it free.

Boy, was I disappointed. I'm not normally drawn to step-cuts, but the Octavia is a beauty. I'd love to get a free Octavia.

liz

Bahahahaha!!!! I thought of that after I posted it but no one noticed it until YOU! Oh, what a HAPPY day that would be to get a free Octavia!!! But maybe we can redo the sticker to say "Free Cygnet's Octavia!!!"!

Well, darn! I would have been the first in line, then.

liz

 

[Christina...]

I had one interaction with David. I remember that I made an impulse ebay buy and asked him to cancel the transaction and he did it in such gracious manner that it made me to remember his name. It was few years ago, and I was not on PS yet.

I am very suprised that a customers can order custom setting and if they don't like it they are entitle to a full refund - no questions asked. I might be new at it, but can anyone point me to another vendor who has the same policy? I was under impression that if you go custom, you need to accept the risks that even if it's not 100% matches your expectations, you are still stuck with it. AS IS. No vendor want to go through process of creating custom piece and to take it back and issue a full refund if it doesn't fully satisfies customer expectations. How is he going to pay his bench for the work done? It also gives customer an option of ordering another custom piece, and returning it, then another and so on...

I personally don't like this setting, but I would never put any stone in the bezel. Especially double bezel.

Greenlake in Washington is the only one that I can think of, they will re-do the setting if you don't like the end result for any reason the first time around but I'm not sure that they do an out and out refund. Someone else may know. So in that regard DBL's policy seems very consumer friendly. However, in a situation where the end result was not what was contracted, as I feel was the case here, I believe that any PS vendor would remove the stone and refund payment without requiring the client to take possession of the ring.

 

[Christina...]

Regardless of whether the impetus for this thread was a personal or professional, I have to say that as an PS member I’m glad that I got to see it play out here. I want to hear about peoples’ experiences with various vendors – especially ones that get used around here a lot (like DBL, Leon Mege, VC, SK, etc). I’m very sorry that Cygnet experienced the troubles that she did with this custom project and with DBL (and I really hope that she ends up with a ring she loves!). And if I were her, I’d be very upset as well. I’d certainly want to share my experience here so that I could hopefully prevent some other PS member from having a similar experience – or at the least to allow PSers who make a choice to proceed with that vendor to make a fully informed decision (in part based on the experience of other PSers who have used that vendor) before doing so.

I also think that how a vendor responds to such posts speaks volumes about them. I think seeing those vendor responses is also very important from a consumer perspective. After seeing all of it (regardless of who the subject vendor is), we, as consumers, have the choice and the power to choose to work with that vendor for an upcoming project or not. If someone chooses to proceed with a vendor that may have been criticized here – that it 100% their choice! If they choose not to proceed with a criticized vendor because of what they read here that is their choice as well! It is the ability to access all such information here that seems so very important to the PS community.

I 100% agree with this. I'm usually the first to suggest that consumers attempt to work out issues with vendors behind the scenes before posting on the boards. The majority of the time both parties come to a mutual and satisfactory agreement and everyone is happy. However since this is a consumer forum, when problems can't be resolved off the boards and a consumer needs a place to receive advice and recommendations, shouldn't PS be that place? People come here looking for guidance and hearing only the good things about a particular vendor isn't doing them a service. PS should feel like a safe place to post both the positive and the negative without feeling attacked by other members or by the vendors themselves. This forum is great because it allows both the client and the vendor to state their case, we can then draw our own conclusions from that.

Cygent: I'm so sorry that this happened, and that this thread caused so much pain and stress for both you and others. I'm happy though that it appears to be resolving itself. For what it's worth, I would have felt the same as you, and admire you for trying to work it out with the vendor first and then seeking validation and insight from other members off the boards when you questioned whether or not you were being treated fairly. I believe that you weren't. I hope that you will feel differently about your diamond and engagement once you have the stone back and can begin to look at it with fresh eyes and new ideas. It's a beautiful stone and I can't wait to see what you decide to do.

 

[Rockdiamond]

I had one interaction with David. I remember that I made an impulse ebay buy and asked him to cancel the transaction and he did it in such gracious manner that it made me to remember his name. It was few years ago, and I was not on PS yet.

I am very suprised that a customers can order custom setting and if they don't like it they are entitle to a full refund - no questions asked. I might be new at it, but can anyone point me to another vendor who has the same policy? I was under impression that if you go custom, you need to accept the risks that even if it's not 100% matches your expectations, you are still stuck with it. AS IS. No vendor want to go through process of creating custom piece and to take it back and issue a full refund if it doesn't fully satisfies customer expectations. How is he going to pay his bench for the work done? It also gives customer an option of ordering another custom piece, and returning it, then another and so on...

I personally don't like this setting, but I would never put any stone in the bezel. Especially double bezel.

Greenlake in Washington is the only one that I can think of, they will re-do the setting if you don't like the end result for any reason the first time around but I'm not sure that they do an out and out refund. Someone else may know. So in that regard DBL's policy seems very consumer friendly. However, in a situation where the end result was not what was contracted, as I feel was the case here, I believe that any PS vendor would remove the stone and refund payment without requiring the client to take possession of the ring.

Christina, these two aspects of the sale are directly related. The presence of a money back guarantee makes a HUGE difference to the entire deal.
If he vendor knows he's keeping the money from the sale, he'll be thrilled to remove the stone.
Having a client, under these circumstances tell me to destroy a ring they'd never even seen first hand , and also allowing no possibility of us fixing whatever they didn't like...yes it's wrong in my opinion.
But we offered a money back guarantee, and we have NEVER shirked our responsibility in that regard. I got roasted here for enforcing one aspect of the guarantee.
There's minimal risk in us removing the diamond- but not zero risk.
After what could reasonably be seen as a client who backed out of a deal- costing us thousands of dollars already, can you blame me for not wanting to take even a minuscule risk for this person?
Of course, looking at this thread, that lapse was a screw up. I hope reasonable people reading this will better understand why.


I feel worst for the person who was hurt the worst in this.
I'm pretty much an open book- finding a way to get me to loose my cool, in this area, was easy for the group privately advising our client. That it completely spoiled any shot of allowing us to make her a great ring- and we certainly can make a ring as good as ANY of the favored vendors here- is irrelevant to these "advisers"

 

[heididdl]

I have been re ding 12 pa ges of this thre ad nd wnt to know Why is D vid is dousing himself with seltzer. Did he wet himself fter his pology. missing letter on my computer sorry no aa

 

[Laila619]

I have been re ding 12 pa ges of this thre ad nd wnt to know Why is D vid is dousing himself with seltzer. Did he wet himself fter his pology. missing letter on my computer sorry no aa

LOL! It was just a joke, he was responding to MayK who said people wanted to set his pants on fire over this.

Now that David has explained his reasoning more, I do feel bad for both parties involved.

 

[morgin]

As an entirely disinterested party who is a new poster here, while the whole affair is sad that it happened, I think it's admirable that the vendor is here to explain, and on reflection, I can see why he'd at least want the customer to see the thing in person before having it sent back and that explanation makes a lot of sense. There is obviously some disagreement over whether the initial quality of the setting was on par with client expectations, and I can also see the client's perspective on having an initial gut reaction that it looks nothing like what you had asked for. Sucks for all.

Anyway, the great part is that it seems resolved, and having been a member of many other communities online, it's pretty rare for vendors to be in the trenches responding on a forum like this to what at the time was a pretty one sided story and not giving entirely canned PR responses. I'm very glad to see the client ended up with the outcome she wanted, but I'm also glad my initial reaction to the vendor is tempered after reading his replies. Would have been great if the whole matter was avoided, but the outcome would likely have been a lot worse for all parties involved if this dialogue didn't exist.

 

[Circe]

... these two aspects of the sale are directly related. The presence of a money back guarantee makes a HUGE difference to the entire deal.
If he vendor knows he's keeping the money from the sale, he'll be thrilled to remove the stone.
Having a client, under these circumstances tell me to destroy a ring they'd never even seen first hand , and also allowing no possibility of us fixing whatever they didn't like...yes it's wrong in my opinion.
But we offered a money back guarantee, and we have NEVER shirked our responsibility in that regard. I got roasted here for enforcing one aspect of the guarantee.
There's minimal risk in us removing the diamond- but not zero risk.
After what could reasonably be seen as a client who backed out of a deal- costing us thousands of dollars already, can you blame me for not wanting to take even a minuscule risk for this person?
Of course, looking at this thread, that lapse was a screw up. I hope reasonable people reading this will better understand why.


I feel worst for the person who was hurt the worst in this.
I'm pretty much an open book- finding a way to get me to loose my cool, in this area, was easy for the group privately advising our client. That it completely spoiled any shot of allowing us to make her a great ring- and we certainly can make a ring as good as ANY of the favored vendors here- is irrelevant to these "advisers"

David. With all due respect, as I actually do hope to do business with you in the future - I like your stock, I like your prices, and I like the majority of the work I've seen your guys produce - this is ridiculous.

I'm not part of whatever the group in question is - and I'm actually startled to discover this was a real thing (TGal, I owe you an apology, and should have known better: of course you wouldn't pull something like that out of thin air ... that, or your radar is mucho better than mine. Either way, owe you an apology AND a drink). But I've just had a similar experience, and been strongly encouraged by multiple posters to do everything from walk away to litigate, and at the end of the day, THEY DO NOT HAVE AN AGENDA. Or, for that matter, mind-control powers. People here are generally really altruistic in their desire to help fellow jewelry aficionados. Cygnet, as the customer, recognized that the ring wasn't what she wanted? Unfortunate, but it doesn't make her FB friends a cabal of Machiavelli's for not instructing her to go against her best instincts.

It really sounds like buck-passing, from where I'm standing. I have a dreadful temper myself, I've lost it with great frequency, and when I've cooled down, I've owned it, because I'm a grown up, and ain't nobody capable of making me do anything. It's called agency. You have it. I would suggest owning it.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Circe, Please look at the entire thread, in context.
I truly do feel worst for Cygnet- and I have a whole lot at stake, given we are an internet seller.
Any reasonable person reading this thread would have to notice the tone.
First, it was not started by the Cygnet.
It started with a group assuredly telling us how horrible it was.
IMMEDIATE REFUND they demanded.
Yet, at that point, way back on pages 1 and 2 there were no photos- how could people rush to such judgment?

Then, I want to chain all females to washing machines because I'm trying to diffuse a situation, by asking to speak to the person who paid us.
We always confirm deals in writing- and I accept that any email I write is both a legal contract, as well as potential fodder to be posted on the internet- and I'm quite sure they were.
Then we "forced" someone to pay with a check.
Huh?
We did not offer the option of credit card- and the client could have refused.
Who was forced?

It goes on and on.
The word "lynching" comes to mind.

ETA- you made me blush way back when I was first "outed"- aw shucks.....

 

[SB621]

Circe, Please look at the entire thread, in context.
I truly do feel worst for Cygnet- and I have a whole lot at stake, given we are an internet seller.
Any reasonable person reading this thread would have to notice the tone.
First, it was not started by the Cygnet.
It started with a group assuredly telling us how horrible it was.
IMMEDIATE REFUND they demanded.
Yet, at that point, way back on pages 1 and 2 there were no photos- how could people rush to such judgment?

Then, I want to chain all females to washing machines because I'm trying to diffuse a situation, by asking to speak to the person who paid us.
We always confirm deals in writing- and I accept that any email I write is both a legal contract, as well as potential fodder to be posted on the internet- and I'm quite sure they were.
Then we "forced" someone to pay with a check.
Huh?
We did not offer the option of credit card- and the client could have refused.
Who was forced?

It goes on and on.
The word "lynching" comes to mind.

David get a PR person. Period- end of story! This is the best advise anyone will ever give you!

 

[TravelingGal]

... these two aspects of the sale are directly related. The presence of a money back guarantee makes a HUGE difference to the entire deal.
If he vendor knows he's keeping the money from the sale, he'll be thrilled to remove the stone.
Having a client, under these circumstances tell me to destroy a ring they'd never even seen first hand , and also allowing no possibility of us fixing whatever they didn't like...yes it's wrong in my opinion.
But we offered a money back guarantee, and we have NEVER shirked our responsibility in that regard. I got roasted here for enforcing one aspect of the guarantee.
There's minimal risk in us removing the diamond- but not zero risk.
After what could reasonably be seen as a client who backed out of a deal- costing us thousands of dollars already, can you blame me for not wanting to take even a minuscule risk for this person?
Of course, looking at this thread, that lapse was a screw up. I hope reasonable people reading this will better understand why.


I feel worst for the person who was hurt the worst in this.
I'm pretty much an open book- finding a way to get me to loose my cool, in this area, was easy for the group privately advising our client. That it completely spoiled any shot of allowing us to make her a great ring- and we certainly can make a ring as good as ANY of the favored vendors here- is irrelevant to these "advisers"

David. With all due respect, as I actually do hope to do business with you in the future - I like your stock, I like your prices, and I like the majority of the work I've seen your guys produce - this is ridiculous.

I'm not part of whatever the group in question is - and I'm actually startled to discover this was a real thing (TGal, I owe you an apology, and should have known better: of course you wouldn't pull something like that out of thin air ... that, or your radar is mucho better than mine. Either way, owe you an apology AND a drink). But I've just had a similar experience, and been strongly encouraged by multiple posters to do everything from walk away to litigate, and at the end of the day, THEY DO NOT HAVE AN AGENDA. Or, for that matter, mind-control powers. People here are generally really altruistic in their desire to help fellow jewelry aficionados. Cygnet, as the customer, recognized that the ring wasn't what she wanted? Unfortunate, but it doesn't make her FB friends a cabal of Machiavelli's for not instructing her to go against her best instincts.

It really sounds like buck-passing, from where I'm standing. I have a dreadful temper myself, I've lost it with great frequency, and when I've cooled down, I've owned it, because I'm a grown up, and ain't nobody capable of making me do anything. It's called agency. You have it. I would suggest owning it.

First, the apology is unnecessary (what do you have to apologize for?), but I'm always happy to have a drink with a cool chick.

Second, I don't doubt anyone's intentions. I believe everyone genuinely wanted to see cygnet get a proper resolution. We can all see here that David's temper got the better of him.

I don't have great radar - but I can sense when something is off. And yes, I can sense that because while I'm not a part of it, I know offline groups exist with PSers. My spidey senses went up when because knowing what I know about Freke - she knows enough about PS vendors to not recommend someone who could screw up this bad (although everyone effs up once in awhile). Hence I asked her if this friend got her input before committing to the vendor. And when she said no, I thought...hm, weird.

I don't think it was a "cabal of machiavelli's" (I just wanted to say that phrase too, awesome!) I guess I just don't understand why come here and frame it the way it was. With some people knowing who the vendor was, and pretending they didn't. Why not say, "A PSer who shall go unnamed is having a problem with this vendor who for now shall not be named" and then other people could say "I know the situation/vendor, and here are more details, and my opinion."

Yeah, done with good intentions, but it did smell of a plot to me.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Circe, Please look at the entire thread, in context.
I truly do feel worst for Cygnet- and I have a whole lot at stake, given we are an internet seller.
Any reasonable person reading this thread would have to notice the tone.
First, it was not started by the Cygnet.
It started with a group assuredly telling us how horrible it was.
IMMEDIATE REFUND they demanded.
Yet, at that point, way back on pages 1 and 2 there were no photos- how could people rush to such judgment?

Then, I want to chain all females to washing machines because I'm trying to diffuse a situation, by asking to speak to the person who paid us.
We always confirm deals in writing- and I accept that any email I write is both a legal contract, as well as potential fodder to be posted on the internet- and I'm quite sure they were.
Then we "forced" someone to pay with a check.
Huh?
We did not offer the option of credit card- and the client could have refused.
Who was forced?

It goes on and on.
The word "lynching" comes to mind.

Oh, my gosh!!!! This is why some of us who are on Rocky Talky are absolutely sick and tired of these kinds of posts from David. He acts totally unacceptably and then turns things all around to where HE is the VICTIM!!!! This is a pattern and it is really of concern to some of us who have seen it multiple times.

I am NOT on any outside groups, for the record. The first I knew of this was here on this thread. Others who came into this late and even a customer of yours in the last page or two says she has seen you lose your temper on other forums, David! These are patterns that people have observed. I honestly think you could do more business if you stayed OFF forums! Let your customers post beautiful rings and you might gain new customers. But you do the most damage to your reputation, not an occasional poorly made ring.

 

[TravelingGal]

Circe, Please look at the entire thread, in context.
I truly do feel worst for Cygnet- and I have a whole lot at stake, given we are an internet seller.
Any reasonable person reading this thread would have to notice the tone.
First, it was not started by the Cygnet.
It started with a group assuredly telling us how horrible it was.
IMMEDIATE REFUND they demanded.
Yet, at that point, way back on pages 1 and 2 there were no photos- how could people rush to such judgment?

Then, I want to chain all females to washing machines because I'm trying to diffuse a situation, by asking to speak to the person who paid us.
We always confirm deals in writing- and I accept that any email I write is both a legal contract, as well as potential fodder to be posted on the internet- and I'm quite sure they were.
Then we "forced" someone to pay with a check.
Huh?
We did not offer the option of credit card- and the client could have refused.
Who was forced?

It goes on and on.
The word "lynching" comes to mind.

Oh, my gosh!!!! This is why some of us who are on Rocky Talky are absolutely sick and tired of these kinds of posts from David. He acts totally unacceptably and then turns things all around to where HE is the VICTIM!!!! This is a pattern and it is really of concern to some of us who have seen it multiple times.

I am NOT on any outside groups, for the record. The first I knew of this was here on this thread. Others who came into this late and even a customer of yours in the last page or two says she has seen you lose your temper on other forums, David! These are patterns that people have observed. I honestly think you could do more business if you stayed OFF forums! Let your customers post beautiful rings and you might gain new customers. But you do the most damage to your reputation, not an occasional poorly made ring.

DS, this has been going on for as long as I can remember. I have had my opinions about David (sometimes it changes for the worse, sometimes for the better), but he's still around, and he still gets business. I think PSers who blow their tops over him just need to ignore. Several do, and are probably better off for it.

There's no need to chastise him. If people have a vendetta against David, just let him keep on talking. It's the best way for people to see for themselves if they want to work with him or not.

 

[FrekeChild]

I am not "a group", for one.

For two, Cygnet and I had a PRIVATE, multiple day long conversation in which I offered to post a thread with her questions, so she would not expose David and Diamonds By Lauren as the vendor in question. Anything I said before she interjected was with her explicit permission and guidance, as well as fact checking and her going through her emails.

David, as per usual, you cannot keep your mouth shut, even after you say you will.

 

[iheartscience]

Circe, Please look at the entire thread, in context.
I truly do feel worst for Cygnet- and I have a whole lot at stake, given we are an internet seller.
Any reasonable person reading this thread would have to notice the tone.
First, it was not started by the Cygnet.
It started with a group assuredly telling us how horrible it was.
IMMEDIATE REFUND they demanded.
Yet, at that point, way back on pages 1 and 2 there were no photos- how could people rush to such judgment?

Then, I want to chain all females to washing machines because I'm trying to diffuse a situation, by asking to speak to the person who paid us.
We always confirm deals in writing- and I accept that any email I write is both a legal contract, as well as potential fodder to be posted on the internet- and I'm quite sure they were.
Then we "forced" someone to pay with a check.
Huh?
We did not offer the option of credit card- and the client could have refused.
Who was forced?

It goes on and on.
The word "lynching" comes to mind.

Oh, my gosh!!!! This is why some of us who are on Rocky Talky are absolutely sick and tired of these kinds of posts from David. He acts totally unacceptably and then turns things all around to where HE is the VICTIM!!!! This is a pattern and it is really of concern to some of us who have seen it multiple times.

I am NOT on any outside groups, for the record. The first I knew of this was here on this thread. Others who came into this late and even a customer of yours in the last page or two says she has seen you lose your temper on other forums, David! These are patterns that people have observed. I honestly think you could do more business if you stayed OFF forums! Let your customers post beautiful rings and you might gain new customers. But you do the most damage to your reputation, not an occasional poorly made ring.

DS, this has been going on for as long as I can remember. I have had my opinions about David (sometimes it changes for the worse, sometimes for the better), but he's still around, and he still gets business. I think PSers who blow their tops over him just need to ignore. Several do, and are probably better off for it.

There's no need to chastise him. If people have a vendetta against David, just let him keep on talking. It's the best way for people to see for themselves if they want to work with him or not.

TRUTH. David should keep on talking and "lynch" ( ) himself with his own rope.