Opinions on JA Oval

[Rockdiamond]

Of course but it is not the primary factor when determining overall "ideal" or even the goal of the designer. Karl and Yoram know exactly what I'm talking about. Spread had little to do with the design of the Octavia. Beauty of the cut had everything to do with it. You see ... we live in a world of shallow ovals Dave. You may not think so and probably disagree but I look at oval after oval over the course of my life, and in the past decade ASET after ASET after ASET (which I know you don't care for) but I look at diamonds in this fashion and with my experience & background ask myself ... what is it I can do to make this radically more beautiful? In fact a new product completely? In the case of ovals (and other cuts for that matter) it's because of extraneous light leakage among other factors I wanted to see changed.

Hi Jon!
In the interest of an informative discussion- I don't think it's fair for you to speak for Yoram or Karl- each of us has our own way of looking at things.
And not to speak for him- but Yoram does an amazing job on stones with depths in the 40's
Octavia does indeed compare favorably with other square emeralds in terms of spread. I can't speak for Karl or Yoram in this- but I can't imagine they didn't consider it.
Some of the most amazing cutters I know are extremely concerned with making sure spread is good for a given stone- without sacrificing beauty.
Let's agree most ovals on the market are NOT well cut. I also look at thousands of stones in a given month.
Truly well cut ovals are indeed rare. But then again, in the sea of ovals, shallow ovals are not more common than deep ones, in my experience.
I'd also ask that you not attempt to tell me how I feel
For example- we spent a pretty penny to buy a camera that takes the best ASET pics. Do I like ASET? Sure, now that I can take the pictures.
Do I agree with some often stated conclusions about what the ASET is telling us? Not necessarily.
I have the advantage of looking at the diamond and the ASET so it makes it far more informative.
If one is "afraid" of leakage, you close yourself off to some amazing and super well cut diamonds.

Spread as compared to what? Do you realize the same can be said for *any* ideal cut Dave including the Octavia? Imagine if the cutting fashion during the early 20th century was primarily all shallow rounds with depth % of 50% then Tolkowsky comes along and introduces the most beautiful rounds with a 62% depth. The world would say the same thing.
Plus your statement isn't true because the AVC's have the best spread possible in cushion brilliant cuts... ESPECIALLY AGS IDEAL. And insofar as spread goes for a diamond, that is not the reason for it's being invented or even brought to market. Again the Octavia is a great example of what I'm talking about. If a diamond is exhibiting adverse optical effects because it is cut too shallow, the first step towards a positive solution is making it the proper depth.

Have an awesome day.

Jon- the AGSL does indeed have a single minded way of looking at "Ideal" cut. I don't work for them.
I know you want to portray your brands in the best possible light. That's what advertising is for. But here on an open forum claims can be questioned. For example your claim about having the best possible spread.
There are many super well cut antique style cushion/OMB style diamonds that spread exceptionally well. I will admit I have not done a case study- but you'd need to do so to prove to me or any well-seasoned diamond professional that your stones spread better than any others. In advertisments, sellers are free to make any claim they want ( if it's legal)- again advertising is different than an objective discussion on an open and informative forum.
I understand Ideal cuts as defined by AGSL don't really place a high emphasis on physical size.
A lot of buyers do- and this is part of what AGSL is missing. There's a reason they have a miniscule market share Jon.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Been thinking a bit about this discussion -thanks, and I'm glad we could have it Jon.
I think we're both committed to beauty, as we perceive it.
My background is so heavily associated with the finest made diamonds where I learned- which were in fact 60-60's when I learned at Winston.
When I first saw "Ideal" cut diamonds, they were Lazaare Kaplan stones- amazing. But very different from what I cut my teeth on. I loved the look- but they did appear a bit smaller in spread than 60-60's.
To this day, I love both looks ( Ideal vs 60/60)- but I still feel like the diamond is....choking when the table goes below.... maybe 57%. I don't see how the difference between the two is anything more than preference.
You're right that I disliked ASET for a long while- but the truth is, it was because I disagreed with the AGSL interpretation.
I greatly respect AGSL- but I do feel they are missing the mark in some important ways.
This discussion goes right to the heart of it. By eliminating a whole class of super well cut, yet shallow diamonds, you lose a nice slice of the market for well-cut diamonds. As AGSL has.
We're all losers because it just cements GIA's dominance.

Anyway, like I said- I think we have far more in common than our differences in taste.
Peace my brother.

 

[fige]

Jaimem123, I’m not sure if you saw but just wanted to post that OOs are now 10% off. The 2.4 is now discounted by $3k. You said that price wasn’t really a determining factor for you but thought I’d alert you to the sale anyway.

 

[SparklenHue123]

Thanks @fige !! yes i saw that . I have decided that the OOs - while they are gorg - are not for me - I want the spread and I don't want to give it up! I am 99% i've made my decision but I have to wait for a few more things to finalize. I want to show the finished product when all is said and done .. I have already started working with the designer and I want to show the final piece.

 

[Starfacet]

So @jaimem123 does that mean you have chosen a diamond?

 

[SparklenHue123]

So @jaimem123 does that mean you have chosen a diamond?

yes - i'm 99% sure this is the one !

 

[Maggiemeans]

Oh dear! Can we start getting excited jaimem123???? I have enjoyed your journey thus far and really am looking forward to the reveal. Surprisingly.. checking these threads gets me through my day.... good thing there is no computer monitoring at work....

 

[SparklenHue123]

Oh dear! Can we start getting excited jaimem123???? I have enjoyed your journey thus far and really am looking forward to the reveal. Surprisingly.. checking these threads gets me through my day.... good thing there is no computer monitoring at work....

Almost time to get excited. This diamond had to go back to manufacturer for one inspection (there was a natural that wasn't listed on the GIA report and we want to be absolutely certain). I can't say with 100% certainty until we have purchased it and I have it in hand but it's looking good !!! And I'm super excited about the setting !!!! Thank you so much Maggie !!!

 

[Starfacet]

Is it one you have already posted here?