whitby_2773
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Nice and rich or ZaZING! and poor.
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phoenixgirl
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This is a very thought provoking question. My simple answer would be ZaZing.
I've fallen in love twice, both in my teens. The first boy broke my heart. The second one married me. DH and I have been together 10.5 years, married for 4.5. I am programmed so as to only open to potential suitors if I am already gaga for them. I wonder if as an adult I could date and eventually marry someone whom my instincts didn't initially take to. Perhaps, though I hope never to have to find out.
10.5 years after the ZaZing I've got the nice man who provides for me. Those endorphins that early love produces are gone, of course, but they are replaced by simpatico, by respect, by not just being lovers but being each other's family. I love my husband. I love to giggle with him. I love that I can tell him anything, that he accepts me no matter what. I hate when we are apart. I whine a little if he stays downstairs when I want him upstairs snuggling, and up he comes. But I don't feel those tremors that I once did. I don't blush when he talks to me. That's what ZaZing means to me -- the magnetic pull of two compatible people who find each other intriguing and attractive. So if that's what we're talking about, if we're supposed to marry some unintriguing, unattractive nice man with money, then no thanks.
I know what I like. I like tall, dark, thinnish men who are ESFPs or ENFPS. My husband isn't the only one in the whole world, so if he had different goals than I did, if we were looking for different things, then I'd need to sign up for eHarmony or something to find a replacement
. By the nature of their being Ps the men I find attractive may find the monotony of a career stifling, and I need to understand this. But it also doesn't mean they are doomed to being starving artists. Just as one's religion or desire (not) to have children might make us incompatible, so also could where his financial priorities lie. DH doesn't love his career, but it should one day provide quite nicely for us. He recently said to me that he doesn't love his job, but he loves me, and he loves our baby (scheduled to make her debut in October), and that's more important.
I also think this question depends upon what we think of as poor. Is poor just never quite having the car or the house or the savings we want, or does it mean actually suffering from lack of necessities? Again, I find it hard to believe that I could be ZaZing for someone who would be absolutely incapable of helping provide the necessities. If he is capable yet chooses not to, then that would go back to the shared life goals discussion.
So I guess my real answer is this:
I would not marry a man without ZaZing.
I would not marry a man who chose art/passion/whim over financial stability.
And he would preferably be a tall, dark, handsome ESFP or ENFP.
And he would need to be smart enough to do things like: get his news from NPR, The Economist, real newspapers, etc.; solve crossword puzzles; speak a foreign language; read nonfiction books and/or great literature for pleasure; and/or enjoy watching Jeopardy.
Yay, my husband fits the bill!
I've fallen in love twice, both in my teens. The first boy broke my heart. The second one married me. DH and I have been together 10.5 years, married for 4.5. I am programmed so as to only open to potential suitors if I am already gaga for them. I wonder if as an adult I could date and eventually marry someone whom my instincts didn't initially take to. Perhaps, though I hope never to have to find out.
10.5 years after the ZaZing I've got the nice man who provides for me. Those endorphins that early love produces are gone, of course, but they are replaced by simpatico, by respect, by not just being lovers but being each other's family. I love my husband. I love to giggle with him. I love that I can tell him anything, that he accepts me no matter what. I hate when we are apart. I whine a little if he stays downstairs when I want him upstairs snuggling, and up he comes. But I don't feel those tremors that I once did. I don't blush when he talks to me. That's what ZaZing means to me -- the magnetic pull of two compatible people who find each other intriguing and attractive. So if that's what we're talking about, if we're supposed to marry some unintriguing, unattractive nice man with money, then no thanks.
I know what I like. I like tall, dark, thinnish men who are ESFPs or ENFPS. My husband isn't the only one in the whole world, so if he had different goals than I did, if we were looking for different things, then I'd need to sign up for eHarmony or something to find a replacement
I also think this question depends upon what we think of as poor. Is poor just never quite having the car or the house or the savings we want, or does it mean actually suffering from lack of necessities? Again, I find it hard to believe that I could be ZaZing for someone who would be absolutely incapable of helping provide the necessities. If he is capable yet chooses not to, then that would go back to the shared life goals discussion.
So I guess my real answer is this:
I would not marry a man without ZaZing.
I would not marry a man who chose art/passion/whim over financial stability.
And he would preferably be a tall, dark, handsome ESFP or ENFP.
And he would need to be smart enough to do things like: get his news from NPR, The Economist, real newspapers, etc.; solve crossword puzzles; speak a foreign language; read nonfiction books and/or great literature for pleasure; and/or enjoy watching Jeopardy.
Yay, my husband fits the bill!
waxing lyrical
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somethingshiny
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I''m all for the ZaZing. Of course I HAVE been married to him for 10 years!! (I''m 29, he''s 31). Obviously it takes more than love to make the world go round, so if the sex is good, it''s bound to go further!
I think another question would be "how much passion do you want/like/need?" I love passionate people. All of my close friends and DH are very passionate in their actions and words. It''s something I just need in my life so I will always choose a little hardship with a passionate person rather than easy street with a nice guy. My mother who does not like very passionate people would choose the nice rich guy. Recently, my sis just came to terms with what she needs, which happens to be the ZaZing.
I think another question would be "how much passion do you want/like/need?" I love passionate people. All of my close friends and DH are very passionate in their actions and words. It''s something I just need in my life so I will always choose a little hardship with a passionate person rather than easy street with a nice guy. My mother who does not like very passionate people would choose the nice rich guy. Recently, my sis just came to terms with what she needs, which happens to be the ZaZing.
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Though I chose the ZaZing, you can go overboard with it and I''m sure most posters know of some girlfriend who has, heart over head. My sister always fell in love and dated men who were extremely charismatic, good looking artist/musician types, who were used to going from one thing to the next in their lives. (Except for maybe one of them) NONE was marriage material. There was alot of ZaZing but no stability. I think that''s one of the reasons why my sister never got married; she never went out with someone who would be a good marriage risk in that early to mid 20''s critical period.
gwendolyn
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Hmm, seems like people are answering two different questions, really--some people seem to think you don''t love the nice and rich guy, and other people seems to think you do love him, but not that crazy-go-nuts passionate love that the other guy has.
So, to answer, if I love the nice and rich guy and he loves me but we''re missing sexual passion, I would choose that option. If it''s not sexual passion but something else, not sure. If he''s a nice and rich dude who loves me but I feel very ''meh'' about him, I wouldn''t marry him just for stability and luxuries. If neither of us loves each other, we definitely wouldn''t get married.
Am currently in the ''struggling'' camp and would rather not be. I feel like I spend my life stressing and worrying and, in this hypothetical, would not choose more of the same (assuming there is love all ''round, that is).
Age 31, engaged, been together 4 and something years.
So, to answer, if I love the nice and rich guy and he loves me but we''re missing sexual passion, I would choose that option. If it''s not sexual passion but something else, not sure. If he''s a nice and rich dude who loves me but I feel very ''meh'' about him, I wouldn''t marry him just for stability and luxuries. If neither of us loves each other, we definitely wouldn''t get married.
Age 31, engaged, been together 4 and something years.
LadyBlue
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Yes, something like this.Date: 6/15/2009 4:19:53 PM
Author: Mara
having done the ''nice'' guy thing previously, i would not marry someone who i didnt have very strong feelings for. IMO, unless you have been in THAT relationship, with a guy who treats you great, loves you, adores you, whatever...but that you just cannot quite reciprocate the same feelings for... you don''t really know if that is what you would choose. i felt so guilty that i could not reciprocate his feelings even though i tried...like i was cheating him.
after dating this guys for 3 years, i had the opp to date another nice guy who was very rich, but he just did not do it for me....and my friend said ''but he''s rich''...well SO? money can not make up for everything that is lacking.
if as someone else said the passion was real passion for who the person was and a TRUE heart attachment, and not just simple lust... then i would def take that and try to make our way together. you don''t know that someone will ALWAYS be struggling just because they are when you met them, and i have been quite successful in my own right, so even if he never was a breadwinner, i could take care of us.
if i couldn''t do the above, i''d be alone.
eta: 34 married for 5 years, together for 9.
I''ve seen money come and go with couples, especially in the past year or so. What happens then? I think you need a true heart attachment to get through those times.
Poor and ZaZing for me.
Getting married in April, Been together for 8 years, 34 years old, 4 kids.
vespergirl
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I would - and did - pick nice "rich" guy (rich is an overstatement - let''s call him upper-middle class good provider
)
I''ve been in those super-passionate type relationships before, but for me it''s only led to eventual drama, fighting, and eventually, resentment. I think that passion fades over the years, but a guy that you genuinely like and that takes good care of you is a great guy to have - especially once kids enter the picture.
I''ve been in those super-passionate type relationships before, but for me it''s only led to eventual drama, fighting, and eventually, resentment. I think that passion fades over the years, but a guy that you genuinely like and that takes good care of you is a great guy to have - especially once kids enter the picture.
vespergirl
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mysterylover
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Richard Sherwood
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I want to clarify that I'm not talking about sexual passion when I speak of "life chemstry".
It's more than that. Many of you have mentioned it in these posts.
It is just adoring your mate. Wanting to be with them more than not. Looking forward to seeing them rather than "oh no, I've got to put in time with the mate, I'd rather be reading a book or out with my friends".
It's that increasing beat of your heart when they enter the room. It's seeing how they light up that very room with their presence. It's how their loving touch makes your eyes kind of glaze, and you purr.
It's how you can both be in the same room without saying a word to each other, but you are companions.
The sexual passion just follows naturally, or not. If it doesn't you don't freak out, but give the other person space, until it comes back.
It's letting the other person be free, and they always choose to come back to you.
It's relaxing in the commitment you've made to each other, knowing that you are safe in that commitment, and that they are not going to leave you.
I'd love to have that again. I tried to make it work with this woman I had the (intimate) relationship with this past 8 months. She wanted to get married, and I tried to make it work because she was so nice, and I wanted to make her happy.
But one day I woke up and realized that I wouldn't be happy, because that "chemistry" wasn't there. It was comfortable, yes, but it wasn't exciting. Her money was very attractive (we're talking a seriously rich woman here), but it just couldn't compensate for that lack of chemistry.
Believe me, I tried.
Rich is nice, and if you fall in love with a rich person, great. But if you marry for money, you will never be happy. What if, as somebody mentioned earlier, that person loses all their money? It happens all the time. Then you're locked into a relationship with a person who no longer has the allure which originally attracted you.
But what usually happens in these relationships is that you emotionally mature past the "money" stage. Other things begin to be more important to you. Your heart grows, and you are able to love deeper than the shallower stages you were originally at. The person with the money is often married to it, and stays at that emotional level because it is key to their identity, and emotional and physical survival. They can't survive without the money.
But you can, and you can see a life and love deeper than what you are trapped in. Because that's often what the money becomes, a trap.
It is a very critical point in your life. Because if you follow one route, you settle, and your soul dies. If you follow the other route, freedom from the entrapment of money (and the control which often accompanies it), allows you to become free, and alive! The whole world feels like an adventure again.
It's more than that. Many of you have mentioned it in these posts.
It is just adoring your mate. Wanting to be with them more than not. Looking forward to seeing them rather than "oh no, I've got to put in time with the mate, I'd rather be reading a book or out with my friends".
It's that increasing beat of your heart when they enter the room. It's seeing how they light up that very room with their presence. It's how their loving touch makes your eyes kind of glaze, and you purr.
It's how you can both be in the same room without saying a word to each other, but you are companions.
The sexual passion just follows naturally, or not. If it doesn't you don't freak out, but give the other person space, until it comes back.
It's letting the other person be free, and they always choose to come back to you.
It's relaxing in the commitment you've made to each other, knowing that you are safe in that commitment, and that they are not going to leave you.
I'd love to have that again. I tried to make it work with this woman I had the (intimate) relationship with this past 8 months. She wanted to get married, and I tried to make it work because she was so nice, and I wanted to make her happy.
But one day I woke up and realized that I wouldn't be happy, because that "chemistry" wasn't there. It was comfortable, yes, but it wasn't exciting. Her money was very attractive (we're talking a seriously rich woman here), but it just couldn't compensate for that lack of chemistry.
Believe me, I tried.
Rich is nice, and if you fall in love with a rich person, great. But if you marry for money, you will never be happy. What if, as somebody mentioned earlier, that person loses all their money? It happens all the time. Then you're locked into a relationship with a person who no longer has the allure which originally attracted you.
But what usually happens in these relationships is that you emotionally mature past the "money" stage. Other things begin to be more important to you. Your heart grows, and you are able to love deeper than the shallower stages you were originally at. The person with the money is often married to it, and stays at that emotional level because it is key to their identity, and emotional and physical survival. They can't survive without the money.
But you can, and you can see a life and love deeper than what you are trapped in. Because that's often what the money becomes, a trap.
It is a very critical point in your life. Because if you follow one route, you settle, and your soul dies. If you follow the other route, freedom from the entrapment of money (and the control which often accompanies it), allows you to become free, and alive! The whole world feels like an adventure again.
atroop711
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atroop711
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elrohwen
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Umm, probably the nice rich guy, honestly. I''ve never really bought into the whole super passionate relationship thing and I think all of that fades with time anyway. If the rich guy was really nice and I enjoyed being with him and spending time with him, that would be good for me. Actually, the passionate thing kind of scares me because I would worry that it would be gone as soon as it started.
I''m in my mid-20s and engaged.
I''m in my mid-20s and engaged.
atroop711
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I think many ppl are reading too much into the "passionate" word. I think Richard summed it up perfectly when he said life chemistry. The passion one feels when you''re in your honeymoon period does change over time but it turns into something better. Unconditional love and respect. It''s great to still feel that pitter patter in my heart for my husband even after 17 yrs together when he walks into a room. Still nice to have that smile that comes out immediately when I see him in the street, ect. That''s passion! (well that''s Rated G passion lol). You know what I''m getting at
Mara
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Linda W
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Date: 6/19/2009 1:06:45 PM
Author: atroop711
I think many ppl are reading too much into the ''passionate'' word. I think Richard summed it up perfectly when he said life chemistry. The passion one feels when you''re in your honeymoon period does change over time but it turns into something better. Unconditional love and respect. It''s great to still feel that pitter patter in my heart for my husband even after 17 yrs together when he walks into a room. Still nice to have that smile that comes out immediately when I see him in the street, ect. That''s passion! (well that''s Rated G passion lol). You know what I''m getting at
I Adore Richard Sherwood!!! He summed it up perfectly what my hubby and I feel for each other after 28 years of marriage. When you are married this long, you know each others hearts and thoughts.
If we are at a large gathering and I see my hubby across the room talking to his friends, our eyes will connect and my heart still melts.
Richard: I hope and pray you again, will find the kind of love you had with your late wife.
Linda
xoxox
Black Jade
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I''d need more info.
When you say ZAZING and poor, do you mean in some way irresponsible or showing some bad character poor? Or decent and responsible and caring and thoughtful but not well off?
All things being equal (that is, that the poor guy is not irresponsible or some kind of sexy ''bad boy''), I''d pick the one who made me feel ZAZING.
I''m shocked at all you young people saying passion fades, I''m over 50 and married over 25 years, 3 kids, and when I look at my husband, I still want to jump his bones. And he feels the same. (And my best friends who are all my age or older, also feel the same about their husbands. Yet this is the second Pricescope thread I''ve seen this week, implying that being together a long time means that lack of romance is inevitable in a long relationship).
If passion DOES fade, I would think you would then want to make sure there was SOME to start out with, if you start out with zero ZAZING then what''s left in 3 or 4 years? Sexless marriage? If that''s not an oxymoron, it ought to be.
When you say ZAZING and poor, do you mean in some way irresponsible or showing some bad character poor? Or decent and responsible and caring and thoughtful but not well off?
All things being equal (that is, that the poor guy is not irresponsible or some kind of sexy ''bad boy''), I''d pick the one who made me feel ZAZING.
I''m shocked at all you young people saying passion fades, I''m over 50 and married over 25 years, 3 kids, and when I look at my husband, I still want to jump his bones. And he feels the same. (And my best friends who are all my age or older, also feel the same about their husbands. Yet this is the second Pricescope thread I''ve seen this week, implying that being together a long time means that lack of romance is inevitable in a long relationship).
If passion DOES fade, I would think you would then want to make sure there was SOME to start out with, if you start out with zero ZAZING then what''s left in 3 or 4 years? Sexless marriage? If that''s not an oxymoron, it ought to be.
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Linda W
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Steel
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princesss
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I think a lot of this hinges on the way we think about passion and compatibility, as well as what "struggling" means.
I can care a lot about a nice guy but not feel what I would consider "strong" feelings. We can be close friends and companions, and I think chemistry can grow from there. Many marriages have started with less, and have gone on strong for years.
And while ZaZing! is nice, in my experience when that is the overriding emotion in the relationship (and ZaZing to me implies sexual chemistry and little else), it''s masking other flaws. On top of that, I am not certain I could respect somebody that would be truly *struggling* all his life. It''s not about being able to provide for me, because I am capable of providing for myself, it''s about feeling like he could also provide for himself. Whether we as a couple choose to live on one income or two, I feel like for me to have a *partner* in life, they need to be totally capable of supporting themselves.
In reality, I have somebody that makes me feel ZaZing, and who I love and trust more every day. He''s not wealthy, but he is working and supporting himself. He''s got good money management skills and a strong work ethic, and I respect him enormously. And for me, that''s what it comes down to. I need to respect the person I''m with. And that''s why I chose the nice, rich guy. Not because passion fades, not because I''m a money-grubbing harlot (
lol), but because I''m not sure I could respect a partner that could not stand on their own two feet.
I can care a lot about a nice guy but not feel what I would consider "strong" feelings. We can be close friends and companions, and I think chemistry can grow from there. Many marriages have started with less, and have gone on strong for years.
And while ZaZing! is nice, in my experience when that is the overriding emotion in the relationship (and ZaZing to me implies sexual chemistry and little else), it''s masking other flaws. On top of that, I am not certain I could respect somebody that would be truly *struggling* all his life. It''s not about being able to provide for me, because I am capable of providing for myself, it''s about feeling like he could also provide for himself. Whether we as a couple choose to live on one income or two, I feel like for me to have a *partner* in life, they need to be totally capable of supporting themselves.
In reality, I have somebody that makes me feel ZaZing, and who I love and trust more every day. He''s not wealthy, but he is working and supporting himself. He''s got good money management skills and a strong work ethic, and I respect him enormously. And for me, that''s what it comes down to. I need to respect the person I''m with. And that''s why I chose the nice, rich guy. Not because passion fades, not because I''m a money-grubbing harlot (
mysterylover
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Black Jade
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Linda W, you''re my soulmate.
RIchard, your post makes me want to cry. Thank you for sharing that.
Question: I''m wondering why Newsweek thinks all these rich guys want to marry women who don''t them and what THEY"RE supposed to get out of it. In my experience, rich guys are very good at smelling out gold-diggers and avoiding them. I went to an Ivy League, plenty of trust fund, old money, very wealthy guys--very careful and suspicious where women were concerned (they HAVE to be). Two of my good college friends, poor girls, did marry into money. Both married multi-multi-millionaires, not Wall Street types on a salary whose money is here today and gone tomorrow (as we have have seen since last year). Both their husbands chose them because they are independent, interesting, intelligent women, not into flash and trash, who clearly loved these guys for THEMSELVES, not the bank account. Both couples live quietly and are still happily married, 25+ years, with plenty of ZAZING still going on there.
Favorite diamond related story about one of them--husband is very hard-working, sometimes overdoes and is sorry for not having been with the family as much as possible. I went to visit after one of these times, and in remorse, he had given her 5 carat solitaire diamond. She''s not even wearing it, it''s in the jewelry box--she''s in a real temper. She said she told him she didn''t want or need the ''guilt rock'' and he had better spend some time with the family.
And he WAS. (Tail between legs, too).
RIchard, your post makes me want to cry. Thank you for sharing that.
Question: I''m wondering why Newsweek thinks all these rich guys want to marry women who don''t them and what THEY"RE supposed to get out of it. In my experience, rich guys are very good at smelling out gold-diggers and avoiding them. I went to an Ivy League, plenty of trust fund, old money, very wealthy guys--very careful and suspicious where women were concerned (they HAVE to be). Two of my good college friends, poor girls, did marry into money. Both married multi-multi-millionaires, not Wall Street types on a salary whose money is here today and gone tomorrow (as we have have seen since last year). Both their husbands chose them because they are independent, interesting, intelligent women, not into flash and trash, who clearly loved these guys for THEMSELVES, not the bank account. Both couples live quietly and are still happily married, 25+ years, with plenty of ZAZING still going on there.
Favorite diamond related story about one of them--husband is very hard-working, sometimes overdoes and is sorry for not having been with the family as much as possible. I went to visit after one of these times, and in remorse, he had given her 5 carat solitaire diamond. She''s not even wearing it, it''s in the jewelry box--she''s in a real temper. She said she told him she didn''t want or need the ''guilt rock'' and he had better spend some time with the family.
And he WAS. (Tail between legs, too).
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