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Lost Lad. Help me find my way to my unicorn

gm89uk said:
The best bang for buck, if you are happy to go with H, this is an amazing deal!

https://enchanteddiamonds.com/v/7Z7414317
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WOW.

OP, the fluorescence will most likely make the diamond appear more like a colorless/bright white diamond than a typical H. This might be a great compromise for you if you're open to not having a D/E/F on your actual cert.

I'd recommend seeing if you can get a video of it and evaluating it for yourself.
 
I agree regarding fluor, it can be overblue in D-E-F, in an H it can be beneficial in the right lighting environments. It does need some little bit of vetting but the cut looks fantastic as well.

I think in your situation it seems to tick most of the boxes (particularly to stay in budget). If you like any of the diamonds here suggested, I would put them on hold (for free, without commitment) while you consider your options. Having been around for a couple years and looking at lots of diamonds online, this is very well priced.
 
The 1.92 looks really really good. Particularly because the scope images are all there to examine. All this stuff about cultural issues got me thinking about something though. OP has a Korean last name. One of the reasons he and his girlfriend may prefer no fluorescence is the big blue over-grading scandal in Korea in the 90s: https://www.pricescope.com/journal/blue_fluorescence_diamonds
 
HI:

If color and size are the most important criteria--then look to those parameters. I have a suspicion there are more than a few D, E and F colored (not "super ideal", etc etc) diamonds out there that are pretty darn nice. Maybe a 60/60?:)) And no flouro.

http://diamonddealfinder.com/enquiry.php?id_field=7419465

cheers--Sharon
 
I would avoid fluorescence. If she values specs typically fluor is not looked on favorably. You can ask her and confirm, but if you're looking to keep it a surprise I wouldn't buy one
 
I wouldn't usually go so far off track but... if size, setting (halo w pave) and brag factor are important (more important than a white stone?) would she be happy with a coloured diamond? Diamonds by Lauren have several options under $15k that would get you everything but D/E/F, but do put you (her!) in a whole 'nother category of wow!

My other suggestion would be to compromise on the setting and go for a classic Tiffany style, proposing an upgrade at a later anniversary. This leave you with more $$ for the main stone.

Another factor to consider is your budget for the future wedding band: if she'd like a diamond band you'll be up for $1k+ more. Does that reduce your budget for the engagement ring? (Not sure how quickly you'd like to get married, just another thing to consider ;)2)
 
If you do ask about the stone with strong fluorescence and this applies to lurkers as well always as if the stone is negatively impacted by it at all. There is ALWAYS a reason why some diamonds are lower priced than others.... and in this case it could be that it does have some impact ie it will look like it is straining to sparkle or it could look slightly milky or cloudy in some lighting situations which is the last thing anyone wants.
 
This is the SI2 I just bought for myself from HPD:

Find the inclusion. It's a G color.

And this setting is $3500.00 at HPD. This is an H color.
 
That surname of the OP is also a Chinese one as well. And like Koreans, there is a mistaken belief that high colour high clarity equals better quality in these two cultural settings. Having seen some high colour/high clarity stones in person recently here in Australia with only good cut grades, it's only reinforced for me that the typical Asian view of diamonds is so full of BS due to salesmanship of sales associates who are badly trained with little to no understanding of what actually makes a diamond beautiful and then the passing on of those views from one person to the next.

I am hoping that the OP's fiancée is not one of those types who will insist on him getting her those high specs on the stone along with an expensive setting with no consideration for his (and their) financial situation. If her social circle is going to belt her verbally for not having as "nice" a diamond ring as what the rest of them have, I think she needs to get some new friends. *just sayin'...*

That Steven Kirsch setting and 1.67 G VS1 on Loupe Troop is unbelievable for that price. If he was open to pre-owned, I'd be snapping that one up quicksmart!
 
Well, how does she know they are telling the truth that they all have D color flawless diamonds? An untrained person can't tell, especially when it is set and especially in a halo.

Why pay for things you can't see or show?
 
In the past there have been Asian posters who had to show the certificate to the family to prove the "worth" of the diamond. I'm sure the D color and good clarity are very important. Size would be what I think would have to go.
 
AprilBaby said:
In the past there have been Asian posters who had to show the certificate to the family to prove the "worth" of the diamond. I'm sure the D color and good clarity are very important. Size would be what I think would have to go.
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Oh, well if this is the case, then yes, size has to go and I would go with a super ideal.
 
AprilBaby said:
In the past there have been Asian posters who had to show the certificate to the family to prove the "worth" of the diamond. I'm sure the D color and good clarity are very important. Size would be what I think would have to go.
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Buy the G and then recertify with EGL? :-)
 
bmfang said:
That surname of the OP is also a Chinese one as well. And like Koreans, there is a mistaken belief that high colour high clarity equals better quality in these two cultural settings. Having seen some high colour/high clarity stones in person recently here in Australia with only good cut grades, it's only reinforced for me that the typical Asian view of diamonds is so full of BS due to salesmanship of sales associates who are badly trained with little to no understanding of what actually makes a diamond beautiful and then the passing on of those views from one person to the next.

I am hoping that the OP's fiancée is not one of those types who will insist on him getting her those high specs on the stone along with an expensive setting with no consideration for his (and their) financial situation. If her social circle is going to belt her verbally for not having as "nice" a diamond ring as what the rest of them have, I think she needs to get some new friends. *just sayin'...*

That Steven Kirsch setting and 1.67 G VS1 on Loupe Troop is unbelievable for that price. If he was open to pre-owned, I'd be snapping that one up quicksmart!
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This is why I think he should get a branded diamond-- either Crafted by Infinity or A Cut Above. Hers will outperform theirs and even if it is smaller, she will have bragging rights with the goods to back it up.
 
John Yi said:
Thank you for all your help!!!! Set the reality straight.
What do think of this ring?

https://www.gia.edu/report-check?reportno=2185501543
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Getting back on topic:

This stone is 2 carats. The dimensions look good. If you can get a gemologist opinion that says it's OK, I say you go for it. Worst case, you find out that it's slightly milky and you have to use your return policy. Not the end of the world.

And as for her friends, she might get a little teasing because of the "low" color, but guess what, once they see that she has a 2 carat stone, you're going to be the one getting dirty looks from their husbands because they'll be at home bugging their husbands about an upgrade, which will end up costing 35K because they want "the best specs."

People on this board might be stone snobs, but let me tell you something: for all of the judgment, for all the "I rather pay for quality"-isms, I have not yet to come across a post where a woman was considering upgrading to a smaller size.
 
HDer said:
Getting back on topic:

This stone is 2 carats. The dimensions look good. If you can get a gemologist opinion that says it's OK, I say you go for it. Worst case, you find out that it's slightly milky and you have to use your return policy. Not the end of the world.

And as for her friends, she might get a little teasing because of the "low" color, but guess what, once they see that she has a 2 carat stone, you're going to be the one getting dirty looks from their husbands because they'll be at home bugging their husbands about an upgrade, which will end up costing 35K because they want "the best specs."

People on this board might be stone snobs, but let me tell you something: for all of the judgment, for all the "I rather pay for quality"-isms, I have not yet to come across a post where a woman was considering upgrading to a smaller size.
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On the other hand, if she has a giant dog diamond, they will talk about her behind her back.

So OP has to carefully consider what direction in which to go.

(I know we all know this.. just trying to help him think it out)
 
HDer said:
Getting back on topic:

This stone is 2 carats. The dimensions look good. If you can get a gemologist opinion that says it's OK, I say you go for it. Worst case, you find out that it's slightly milky and you have to use your return policy. Not the end of the world.

And as for her friends, she might get a little teasing because of the "low" color, but guess what, once they see that she has a 2 carat stone, you're going to be the one getting dirty looks from their husbands because they'll be at home bugging their husbands about an upgrade, which will end up costing 35K because they want "the best specs."

People on this board might be stone snobs, but let me tell you something: for all of the judgment, for all the "I rather pay for quality"-isms, I have not yet to come across a post where a woman was considering upgrading to a smaller size.
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Boo, you just got here.

Numerous of us either don't wear our poor performers or had them made into pendants and got better performing diamonds. It is a common theme here.
 
whitewave said:
This is why I think he should get a branded diamond-- either Crafted by Infinity or A Cut Above. Hers will outperform theirs and even if it is smaller, she will have bragging rights with the goods to back it up.
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If his fiancée's social circle have their rings from Tiffany and Co or have stones from Hearts on Fire, a Crafted by Infinity or ACA branded stone will likely not mean anything to them (unless they bother to actually do their research in which case they may become jealous, hehehe :evil2:;)2).

But if they just have mall jeweller quality larger stones, then certainly, a CBI or ACA stone would definitely have some brand cachet to it (or heck, a setting from VC, DK or SK, that would also score brownie points as it's "custom" rather than off-the-rack [so to speak]).

I too would also suggest that the OP purchase from a vendor with a very good upgrade policy (like Whiteflash for the ACA or HPD for the CBI stones). While he may not have the funds now to get her that bigger stone, it will be a LOT easier for him to upgrade to a much larger stone in the future [though if his fiancée has petite Asian fingers [like my wife has], she may end up finding that a 2ct+ stone looks gaudy on such petite fingers).
 
HDer said:
People on this board might be stone snobs, but let me tell you something: for all of the judgment, for all the "I rather pay for quality"-isms, I have not yet to come across a post where a woman was considering upgrading to a smaller size.
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I've posited this question to my wife before (though she is adamant she needs no more diamond jewellery!). If I had $25k to blow on a diamond, would she prefer:
  • the largest stone possible for that amount of dough (cut quality, clarity and colour be damned) or
  • a smaller stone with better quality characteristics (smaller carat weight but something within G-K colour range, SI1-VS1 clarity with AGS Ideal cut quality [or cherry picked GIA XXX with AGS Ideal proportions])?
HDer, you may be surprised at this, but she's said to me that she'd prefer the quality smaller stone over the large carat weight. Everytime I've asked her. She's said if she wants big (with near perfect clarity and colour), she'd rather buy costume cubic zirconia or glass jewellery instead.

Then again, that's her philosophy with most of her purchasing: she'll buy expensive work shoes [without naming the brand, they are from what would be considered a luxury Italian brand based out of Florence] rather than cheap ones that she'll have to replace every year, because she recognises that the expensive ones will last much longer. She's had cheap work shoes (around AUD$100) die on her within 6 months of purchase (soles have unglued themselves from the last) whereas her expensive dress slip-ons (AUD$600) have lasted since our wedding (6 years ago) and they are far more comfortable now than when she first purchased them: the leather footbed and last have moulded around her foot now and I've only had to replace the Topy on the leather sole once in that time.

Not all women go for size over quality. Then again, maybe my wife is one of those women who think differently to most women on diamonds (and other purchases).
 
It's all find and dandy to have one stranger on the internet tell you that ingrained cultural values are dumb; however, I'd bet they sure are not irrelevant to your future fiance, her friends, her family, and etc.

If she wants a colorless diamond you propose with a g -h and say "well the internet told me you need to think cut is more important"- that'll go over really well.

This isn't important if you've talked to her and she's ok with lower colors. But I'd she isn't, you may have to talk to her about other expectation.

Would she take a simpler setting and spend all your money the diamond? Will she compromise on a 1.5-1.6 CT (I mean you did say her circle of friends wears 1.5s)?

Of you don't want to have the conversation due to surprise- do you want to save up and spend more money ?

Things to consider. But I'd be very wary of telling you that shell be perfectly fine with a g -h in a branded cut- because honestly your very first post really didn't sound like it.
 
whitewave said:
Boo, you just got here.

Numerous of us either don't wear our poor performers or had them made into pendants and got better performing diamonds. It is a common theme here.
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You are terribly rude, here.

Parroting the same cookie cutter advise to everyone here is not helpful. If someone with a fresh perspective wants to give his opinion maybe telling him to know his place isn't the best approach.
 
@Niel so you want to pretend that people don't upgrade poor performers and post about it on PS? That I shouldn't correct his error? That it is "rude" to give factual information?
 

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Niel said:
It's all find and dandy to have one stranger on the internet tell you that ingrained cultural values are dumb; however, I'd bet they sure are not irrelevant to your future fiance, her friends, her family, and etc.

If she wants a colorless diamond you propose with a g -h and say "well the internet told me you need to think cut is more important"- that'll go over really well.

This isn't important if you've talked to her and she's ok with lower colors. But I'd she isn't, you may have to talk to her about other expectation.

Would she take a simpler setting and spend all your money the diamond? Will she compromise on a 1.5-1.6 CT (I mean you did say her circle of friends wears 1.5s)?

Of you don't want to have the conversation due to surprise- do you want to save up and spend more money ?

Things to consider. But I'd be very wary of telling you that shell be perfectly fine with a g -h in a branded cut- because honestly your very first post really didn't sound like it.
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@Niel, very valid points you've made there. Re: the comment about fine and dandy to have a stranger on the net talk about ingrained cultural values being dumb, I am presuming that is in reference to my earlier post. And what you've written is also valid. Just my opinion as one who is in one of those cultural groups with those values (I'm Chinese).

But I am really hoping that the OP is able to have a chat with his fiancée about what her expectations for a stone and ring are given his budget. Your point about him finding out if she'd be ok with a simpler setting (maybe even a simple solitaire) so that more dough could be spent on the stone is one that I think he should definitely follow up on (either directly with her or via more surreptitious means like checking Pinterest or Instagram).

If she is deadset on him providing her with a halo setting with pave on the shanks and with a high colour-clarity (i.e. D-F VVS-IF) center stone, I'd be suggesting that maybe he should wait a little longer until his budget is more in line with her expectations (and to avoid any unpleasantness if he proposed with a ring that didn't meet her expectations).

Otherwise, there is always the option of buying a high colour-clarity combo stone at the desired carat weight that has been graded by a second (or even third) tier lab. If the OP is going to do so just so he can meet his budget, it has to be an informed decision by him and the rest of us should let him do so provided that he has informed himself properly prior to such a purchase. Granted, this is NOT an option that I'd recommend.
 
whitewave said:
@Niel so you want to pretend that people don't upgrade poor performers and post about it on PS? That I shouldn't correct his error? That it is "rude" to give factual information?
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It was rude to belittle him for how long he's been here. I thought me bolding that bit was clear.
 
bmfang said:
@Niel, very valid points you've made there. Re: the comment about fine and dandy to have a stranger on the net talk about ingrained cultural values being dumb, I am presuming that is in reference to my earlier post. And what you've written is also valid. Just my opinion as one who is in one of those cultural groups with those values (I'm Chinese).

But I am really hoping that the OP is able to have a chat with his fiancée about what her expectations for a stone and ring are given his budget. Your point about him finding out if she'd be ok with a simpler setting (maybe even a simple solitaire) so that more dough could be spent on the stone is one that I think he should definitely follow up on (either directly with her or via more surreptitious means like checking Pinterest or Instagram).

If she is deadset on him providing her with a halo setting with pave on the shanks and with a high colour-clarity (i.e. D-F VVS-IF) center stone, I'd be suggesting that maybe he should wait a little longer until his budget is more in line with her expectations (and to avoid any unpleasantness if he proposed with a ring that didn't meet her expectations).

Otherwise, there is always the option of buying a high colour-clarity combo stone at the desired carat weight that has been graded by a second (or even third) tier lab. If the OP is going to do so just so he can meet his budget, it has to be an informed decision by him and the rest of us should let him do so provided that he has informed himself properly prior to such a purchase. Granted, this is NOT an option that I'd recommend.
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I did understand you said you were Chinese. However, I think you'll agree your opinion probably doesn't speak for the entirety of Asians. My point is only the op made it very clear she has told him her priorities and that's size and color. To assume really she doesn't know her priorities and we know what they SHOULD be is arrogant. And though I'm quoting you I'm not saying you're being arrogant it's just always how these threads seem to go.

To that bolded bit that's not an option anyone should even consider as that is essentially buying paper to lie to you. If you're doing that but a CZ and call it a diamond. The whole point is to get her what she values and she values high color, not a piece of paper that tells you the diamond is high color when it isn't.
 
Niel said:
However, I think you'll agree your opinion probably doesn't speak for the entirety of Asians. My point is only the opposite made it very clear she has told him her priorities and that's size and color. To assume really she doesn't know her priorities and we know what they SHOULD be is arrogant.
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Agreed. No beef with you there Niel. :) I just have a personal mission that when friends (who are Asian) ask me in person about diamonds, to try and impart some of the knowledge that I've gained from places like PS so that they don't fall into those near-ingrained cultural assumptions about diamond quality re: colour and clarity. Some are more receptive than others.

Re: your bolded part of my post. Agree with you there as well. But there are some people out there that will end up pursuing this option even though it isn't one that us PS-ers would even consider!
 
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