Indicolite, Paraiba, Cuprian...?

[klewis]

Date: 7/29/2009 9:01:15 AM
Author: tourmaline_lover
Klewis,

I thought you might be interested in this pic. Here''s a far away picture of the violet cuprian next to a box with two Afghani tourmalines and a minty cuprian. Can you spot the cuprian on the left? There''s also a little orange spessartite in the box as well. Photo taken in indirect sunlight.

That''s interesting TL. I find it hard to say from the photo which stone is cuprian although it might be different in real life. They all look vibrant.

 

[T L]

Date: 7/30/2009 1:40:50 AM
Author: klewis

Date: 7/29/2009 9:01:15 AM
Author: tourmaline_lover
Klewis,

I thought you might be interested in this pic. Here''s a far away picture of the violet cuprian next to a box with two Afghani tourmalines and a minty cuprian. Can you spot the cuprian on the left? There''s also a little orange spessartite in the box as well. Photo taken in indirect sunlight.

That''s interesting TL. I find it hard to say from the photo which stone is cuprian although it might be different in real life. They all look vibrant.

Thanks Klewis, but the brightest stone, the pear, is the cuprian. It also has the least amount of grey in it.

 

[klewis]

Date: 7/30/2009 3:10:41 PM
Author: tourmaline_lover

Date: 7/30/2009 1:40:50 AM

Author: klewis

Date: 7/29/2009 9:01:15 AM

Author: tourmaline_lover

Klewis,


I thought you might be interested in this pic. Here''s a far away picture of the violet cuprian next to a box with two Afghani tourmalines and a minty cuprian. Can you spot the cuprian on the left? There''s also a little orange spessartite in the box as well. Photo taken in indirect sunlight.

That''s interesting TL. I find it hard to say from the photo which stone is cuprian although it might be different in real life. They all look vibrant.

Thanks Klewis, but the brightest stone, the pear, is the cuprian. It also has the least amount of grey in it.

Yes, I see that now.

 

[Barrett]

Pulled this off of Richard Wises' blog...
[paraiba tourmaline]"Prices have, indeed, escalated and the hierarchy has been established. Regardless of the quality of the stone, genuine Brazilian stones from the Paraiba mining region will bring the highest prices followed by Mozambique followed by Nigeria. Problem is, areas such as Afghanistan are producing vivid blue green non-cuprian gems that are superior to some of the cuprian stones. What determines the price, beauty, oh no, its all about the copper. We have become inured to such absurdities in the ruby, sapphire and emerald markets but Virgina its only a tourmaline. So at every booth in Hong Kong showing a pretty blue green tourmaline. What was the first question? “Is it copper bearing?” Without asking that question is was impossible to price the stone"

 

[Barrett]

Now here are two mozambique copper bearing tourmalines....

 

[Barrett]

Here is a 3.97 carat Afghan non-copper bearing blue tourmaline (this pic and the one above are from his blog article)
R.W.: "Stones that compare in beauty but are not copper bearing bring hundreds of dollars while copper bearing look-alikes command prices into the low thousands of dollars per carat."

 

[LD]

It''s a nonsense really. People should buy with their eyes and beauty should be the over-riding factor to commanding a premium - not the chemical make-up. Don''t get me wrong, I would never apply this to say a heated sapphire and a treated (beryillium) sapphire - that''s a different story. However for Paraiba/Cuprian/Tourmaline it seems that logic has flown out of the window!

 

[T L]

The original Brazilian paraibas have no peer in regards to neon vivid turquoise color in a tourmaline. However, many dealers use the "paraiba" term to their advantage in setting high prices for mediocre stones. The Afghan material is still very lovely, but the true vivid colors are just not coming out of Afghanistan anymore, so their prices are skyrocketing.

This is my all time favorite Afghan tourmaline, and very reminicent of a paraiba. It is extremely rare for an Afghan stone, even some of the best quality, to not have a grey modifier, but there is none in this one.

http://www.litnon.com/viewgem.php?gemid=1598&id=4811

 

[Barrett]

Holy moly TL..look at that color..dang..the term paraiba and cuprian are used to loosely..should you use the term cuprian if the copper chromophores don''t impart color to the stone? There are a list of different elements in tourmaline..shouldn''t the term cuprian or paraiba only be used when those elements impart color to the stone? So what if the stone is "cuprian" if copper does not give it that color then it''s just a name used to drive the price up on an other wise ordinary tourmaline. Love that afghan TL..wow

 

[chrono]

Am Guy,
Sometimes what makes sense to us doesn’t make sense to others, especially to those vendors who use the name to sell at a higher price or to be able to make a quicker sale. Or perhaps they do because they resort to such trickery.

 

[klewis]

Date: 8/3/2009 8:43:37 AM
Author: Chrono
Am Guy,

Sometimes what makes sense to us doesn’t make sense to others, especially to those vendors who use the name to sell at a higher price or to be able to make a quicker sale. Or perhaps they do because they resort to such trickery.

But who would pay a higher price except the uninformed? If a person buys a stone regardless of how it performs only because it is called Cuprian , aren''t the buyers at fault?

 

[chrono]

Date: 8/4/2009 2:00:37 AM
Author: klewis
But who would pay a higher price except the uninformed? If a person buys a stone regardless of how it performs only because it is called Cuprian , aren''t the buyers at fault?

I have no issues with anyone willing to buy a cuprian regardless of the glow. I have issues when a non glowing cuprian is priced comparably to a glowing cuprian.