I had an I diamond appraised today, and was told that it was a K.

[strmrdr]

Date: 12/28/2006 9:55:29 PM
Author: alamb
https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/gia-vs-appraiser-what-do-you-think.14886/=

It looks like this issue has come up before with David.

thanks for hunting that down.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Date: 12/28/2006 9:55:29 PM
Author: alamb
https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/gia-vs-appraiser-what-do-you-think.14886/=

It looks like this issue has come up before with David.

Excellent Allison! This explains a LOT!!! Hope Harriet reads this link!

 

[Harriet]

Thanks for your input. I''ll have to wait and see what David Atlas says tomorrow. Will keep you updated. I thought I''d found the stone, and am so disappointed.

 

[Kaleigh]

Date: 12/28/2006 11:56:39 PM
Author: Harriet
Thanks for your input. I''ll have to wait and see what David Atlas says tomorrow. Will keep you updated. I thought I''d found the stone, and am so disappointed.

I know you are dissapointed, I would be too.

Hang in there and see what David Atlas has to say. Either way, good luck, hope all goes well for you!!!

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 12/29/2006 12:04:41 AM
Author: Kaleigh

Date: 12/28/2006 11:56:39 PM
Author: Harriet
Thanks for your input. I''ll have to wait and see what David Atlas says tomorrow. Will keep you updated. I thought I''d found the stone, and am so disappointed.

I know you are dissapointed, I would be too.

Hang in there and see what David Atlas has to say. Either way, good luck, hope all goes well for you!!!

ditto
at this point it is too soon to give up imho.

 

[Rags]

I guess all of this means that Mr Wolf is a "hard" appraiser.

 

[coda72]

I hope everything turns out well for you. I recently purchased an AGS graded I stone from Whiteflash, and I am very happy with it. I held it next to my F colored diamond, and I could barely see the difference. Of course, I am not an expert or an appraiser, just a consumer that loves diamonds. My diamond is also much smaller than yours, so I''m sure that makes a difference too.

 

[Harriet]

This diamond has probably been on the market since last year (the cert is dated June 2005). Is that a long time?

 

[mrssalvo]

Date: 12/29/2006 12:22:44 AM
Author: strmrdr

Date: 12/29/2006 12:04:41 AM

Author: Kaleigh

Date: 12/28/2006 11:56:39 PM

Author: Harriet

Thanks for your input. I''ll have to wait and see what David Atlas says tomorrow. Will keep you updated. I thought I''d found the stone, and am so disappointed.

I know you are dissapointed, I would be too.

Hang in there and see what David Atlas has to say. Either way, good luck, hope all goes well for you!!!

ditto

at this point it is too soon to give up imho.

I agree, i wouldn''t give up just yet. did you really love the stone when you saw it? if Mr. Wolf whould have graded it an I would you be happy? You have to remember that his is just one opinion, you have opinions and a grade from AGS and WF that say it''s and I, now you''ll have to wait and see what Dave''s opinion is, but bottom line did you like the stone, no matter what the paper says? if so, WF said they will adjust the price for the new grade if necessary so you wouldn''t be out any money and you still get to keep you stone. Now, if you didn''t like it and it looked yellow to you, then that''s another story and by all means you should return it for something else. An I is where I personally start to see some color in stones so I wanted to stay above an H for my stone (which is a lot smaller than yours). So, you also might want to consider going up in color a bit. anyway, rambling now but you''ve never said what you think of the stone personally?

 

[mrssalvo]

Date: 12/29/2006 8:38:30 AM
Author: Harriet
This diamond has been on the market since June. Is that a long time?

I don''t think so, especially for a stone that size and that price

 

[Harriet]

When I walked into the appraiser's office and heard what he had to say, I couldn't look at the stone objectively. I'd never seen it before.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 12/29/2006 8:40:47 AM
Author: mrssalvo

Date: 12/29/2006 8:38:30 AM
Author: Harriet
This diamond has been on the market since June. Is that a long time?

I don''t think so, especially for a stone that size and that price

Yep, I agree. Not everyone can afford a stone this size, so they don''t move as fast.

Harriet, really curious to see what Dave says!

 

[mrssalvo]

Date: 12/29/2006 8:47:58 AM
Author: Harriet
When I walked into the appraiser''s office and heard what he had to say, I couldn''t look at the stone objectively. I''d never seen it before.

ok, I understand. So after you heard what he had to say and looked at the stone, you didn''t like it, is that right? You know my stone was originally and AGS0 under their old guidelines. They changed how they grade recently. I bought my stone in the summer on consignment and the owner had lost the original cert so we had to send it back to AGS. I knew there was a good chance that my stone wouldn''t make the new grade and I really wanted an AGS000. I loved it so much that I''d decided to keep it no matter what it came back as. I guess I''m getting the feeling that you loved what you saw on paper but then after your appraiser giving you his opinion you never really formed one for yourself about the stone. The good news is that you are in the drivers seat on how to proceed once the new appraisel comes in from Dave

 

[Harriet]

Date: 12/29/2006 8:59:16 AM
Author: mrssalvo

Date: 12/29/2006 8:47:58 AM
Author: Harriet
When I walked into the appraiser's office and heard what he had to say, I couldn't look at the stone objectively. I'd never seen it before.

ok, I understand. So after you heard what he had to say and looked at the stone, you didn't like it, is that right? You know my stone was originally and AGS0 under their old guidelines. They changed how they grade recently. I bought my stone in the summer on consignment and the owner had lost the original cert so we had to send it back to AGS. I knew there was a good chance that my stone wouldn't make the new grade and I really wanted an AGS000. I loved it so much that I'd decided to keep it no matter what it came back as. I guess I'm getting the feeling that you loved what you saw on paper but then after your appraiser giving you his opinion you never really formed one for yourself about the stone. The good news is that you are in the drivers seat on how to proceed once the new appraisel comes in from Dave

When was the change made? The cert for this stone is dated June 2005.

 

[mrssalvo]

Harriet, I think was in 2004 (i''d have to read up on my date), not sure if they started grading at that same time. Anyway, the changes had nothing to do with color, it was a grade for light performance. Your stone has a new cert so was graded under the new grading guidelines. My stone''s original grade came 6 years ago..

 

[JohnQuixote]

 

[strmrdr]

Thank you for being upfront with us Brian, I expected no less.
Thank you John for passing on the info.

I looking forward to getting Dave A. results.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

John, everything you are saying is perfectly plausible. There is a range for all colors, and this one, as Brian has stated, is probably a low I. I certainly trust his judgment. The link posted above shows that many people have had a problem with that appraiser. I am betting Dave will come back with a color rating close to what Brian has estimated. It sounds like the excellent clarity on this stone is a bonus. Ultimately Harriet will have to determine what her color preference is, but I am sure it is a gorgeous stone. It''s just too bad we didn''t know there were problems with that appraiser so we could have referred her to another one before this happened.

 

[Harriet]

The verdict is in: Solid J.

 

[elmo]

Date: 12/29/2006 10:35:55 AM
Author: strmrdr
I looking forward to getting Dave A. results.

And to SAS2000 results. I may trust Dave to make a better judgment call but even if someone wants to disagree with SAS2000 color grading accuracy it's harder to argue with a machine

.

Edit - just saw the verdict

.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 12/29/2006 10:56:24 AM
Author: Harriet
The verdict is in: Solid J.

So, now what?

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 12/29/2006 10:56:24 AM
Author: Harriet
The verdict is in: Solid J.

kewl
now you have enough info to decide.
Im looking forward to hearing your decision on the diamond.
sorry this has been such an ordeal for you.

 

[Harriet]

I''m waiting for WF to arrive at a fair conclusion re the price. Any reason I shouldn''t?

 

[Londonchris]

It just goes to show how problematic it gets when one goes delving into the world of what colour it is f,g,h,i, k .....plus the vvs,vs,si....... everyones eyes see different stuff.
Machines may give more regular results,but it`s easier too make a judgement wether you like the stone or not.
Comparing the stone with a d will obviously show a difference,though how often do people compare stones with master stones?
Interesting to see if Mr.Atlas or anyone can give an unbiased opinion by eye and then see what machine says.
Every tiny movement of eyes,weather,ect affects what we see.
Sometimes it`s best to just say yeh i like the stone it`ll do me.

 

[Harriet]

Date: 12/29/2006 11:22:54 AM
Author: Londonchris
It just goes to show how problematic it gets when one goes delving into the world of what colour it is f,g,h,i, k .....plus the vvs,vs,si....... everyones eyes see different stuff.
Machines may give more regular results,but it`s easier too make a judgement wether you like the stone or not.
Comparing the stone with a d will obviously show a difference,though how often do people compare stones with master stones?
Interesting to see if Mr.Atlas or anyone can give an unbiased opinion by eye and then see what machine says.
Every tiny movement of eyes,weather,ect affects what we see.
Sometimes it`s best to just say yeh i like the stone it`ll do me.

Mr. Atlas used both the machines and his eyes (and those of several others).

 

[Ellen]

Date: 12/29/2006 11:21:15 AM
Author: Harriet
I''m waiting for WF to arrive at a fair conclusion re the price. Any reason I shouldn''t?

No.

If you love the stone, and don''t/won''t have a "mental" problem with it, and a fair accomodation is made, I see absolutely no reason not to buy it.

 

[ellchris]

DiamondSeeker2006, the part where you wrote "It''s just too bad we didn''t know there were problems with that appraiser so we could have referred her to another one before this happened."
That''s a harsh statement to make. There have been many happy customers
that used Just Appraisers and if you do a search here, they far outweigh
the negatives.
I''m sure there have been times in any appraisers career where they differ with the clarity/color on a cert, David Wolf is no different.
I would still recommend someone looking for an appraiser in nyc to "Just Apprasiers" based on my own as well as a friends experience.

elle

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 12/29/2006 11:21:15 AM
Author: Harriet
I''m waiting for WF to arrive at a fair conclusion re the price. Any reason I shouldn''t?

if you love the stone there is no reason to move on in my opinion.
take your time WF will understand the need for time.

I am curious about the individual results of the different tools.
Dave cant post it unless you tell him too and its understandable if you just want to put it behind you.

 

[Harriet]

Can anyone estimate the price difference between an I and a J, all things equal?

 

[SKR]

Date: 12/29/2006 11:25:06 AM
Author: Harriet

Date: 12/29/2006 11:22:54 AM
Author: Londonchris
It just goes to show how problematic it gets when one goes delving into the world of what colour it is f,g,h,i, k .....plus the vvs,vs,si....... everyones eyes see different stuff.
Machines may give more regular results,but it`s easier too make a judgement wether you like the stone or not.
Comparing the stone with a d will obviously show a difference,though how often do people compare stones with master stones?
Interesting to see if Mr.Atlas or anyone can give an unbiased opinion by eye and then see what machine says.
Every tiny movement of eyes,weather,ect affects what we see.
Sometimes it`s best to just say yeh i like the stone it`ll do me.

Mr. Atlas used both the machines and his eyes (and those of several others).

So looks like 4 professionals (Dave Atlas, David Wolf, Toby Smart and Brian) and a machine think that AGS got it wrong. More to the point, some of the negatives said about Mr Wolf were clearly unfair. Ok he graded it a J/K, but he had the integrity to stick to his guns even though he probably knew that by disagreeing with the AGS report, all hell would break lose. The easiest thing in the world for him to have done was to agree with the AGS grade - he gets his money, Harriet's happy and he doesnt get his name negatively plastered on this thread. I dont know about the rest of you but I would rather prefer an appraiser who is prudent in his conclusions than one who is not.

Regarding the stone itself, it seems the J color is offset by the fact that per Brian it could be a solid VS1 (more like a VVS2). Brians opinion counts for a lot in my book and he was pretty upfront in grading it an I/J himself - AGS gave it a favourable color grading but dinged it negatively on the clarity. If it doesnt bother you Harriet you should go for it, otherwise keep looking.