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I am so upset right now with James Allen!

rashie81

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 7, 2011
Messages
17
So I started a thread on choosing the right diamond for my proposal, and finally found the one on Jamesallen.com. I posted it on the thread and got the ok by a couple of the members here. Everything seemed to be rolling smoothly, as I had already bank wired the money over and the sale was finalized. Today, on the shipping day, I get an email stating that they had sold the diamond prior to me finalizing the sale. I have no idea what in the world happened there, but I am devastated right now!!! I was speaking with rep as I was purchasing it through the website, and she told me that it was available. Can someone please tell me if they can actually do that?? A whole week, and no one knew that the diamond had already been sold?!!!!

Btw, here was my original thread.
https://www.pricescope.com/communit...th-please-help-a-newbie-with-purchase.160374/
 

Marshalls

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 2, 2011
Messages
51
If you are wondering about the legality behind it (please dont quote me as I am not a lawyer)- but if the stone was offered to you (i.e. had you identified in an invoice) and you tendered payment, thats considered acceptance of an offer. The offer/acceptance creates a contract is binding by law. Should they break the contract, they must pay monetary compensation for not fulfilling their end of the contract. Also, agreements prior to the acceptance of the offer/ creation of contract cannot be used in court. This means even if you have written evidence saying "I'll give you a million bucks if you buy this stone" but then the invoice has nothing on it about this promise, then you are out of luck. The contract starts when you accept the offer. Anything prior to the offer/contract acceptance is inadmissible in court.

Several grounds where you can sue under:
1) If you request from them and they dont give you back the money OR the stone you asked for, thats just basically taking your money... sounds pretty illegal to me!
2) If you paid for the SPECIFIC stone (identifiable by GIA/AGS #), and they give you another stone whether its equal in value or not, you have a choice on whether to accept it in place of your previous purchase. If they force the stone upon you (i.e.- mail you the stone even if you say no, I dont like that one, I want the one I bought), then thats a "bait and switch", which is also illegal.

AGAIN, I am not a lawyer, this is just some basic information for you to know. It is not an advice. If it comes down to this, you should consult a real lawyer or investigate the specifics further.

However, in the mean time, its probably easier if you can just work with them and I doubt James Allen would do anything shady and take your money for nothing. You can try and ask for your money back and seek out another vendor or just get an equivalent stone.

Good luck! :wavey:
 

CharmyPoo

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 10, 2004
Messages
7,007
I have seen posters mention this a few times. It does happen but usually the vendors figure it out before payment is sent.
 

CherryBlossom

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jan 20, 2011
Messages
311
James Allen is a pretty legit vendor, but sometimes these things just happen. Did you by any chance put the diamond on hold prior to purchasing it? you should work w/ them to try to fix the situation and be assertive but fair about what your expectations are and you feel you should be compensated. Sorry about losing the stone, good luck with finding your new one. I am sure that many people here on PS would love to help.
 

kenny

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
28,962
I'd approach this politely in the spirit of understanding, forgivness and cooperation.

I have seen this approach, when the vendor has clearly made a mistake, result in a replacement stone at an unusually good price.
 

rashie81

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 7, 2011
Messages
17
Yes, I did put it on hold. I'm wondering if it was because I made changes to the order by changing the setting, which resulted in me getting this email from another rep. So maybe the person who it was sold to was me to begin with?? I checked the status of the order with the order # they emailed me originally, and it says it will be shipped out tomororrow. If not, their side of the story wouldn't make any sense, because the product was going to be shipped out yesterday, and that would mean the stone would of been mounted on the setting I picked. If it had been sold, why would I get the email saying the product was going to be shipped out? I even signed the international shipping agreement form 2 days ago.
 

CherryBlossom

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jan 20, 2011
Messages
311
rashie81|1305709618|2924655 said:
Yes, I did put it on hold. I'm wondering if it was because I made changes to the order by changing the setting, which resulted in me getting this email from another rep. So maybe the person who it was sold to was me to begin with?? I checked the status of the order with the order # they emailed me originally, and it says it will be shipped out tomororrow. If not, their side of the story wouldn't make any sense, because the product was going to be shipped out yesterday, and that would mean the stone would of been mounted on the setting I picked. If it had been sold, why would I get the email saying the product was going to be shipped out? I even signed the international shipping agreement form 2 days ago.
I don't know. But you have to understand the there is a real possibility for human or computer error. It happens, it's life. I honestly think that you should take Kenny's advice and deal w/ them directly in the nicest (but still assertive way possible) it could end up working out in your favor in the long run... just saying.
 

kelpie

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 8, 2008
Messages
2,362
I'm so sorry! That really stinks. Marshall's advice while true is not quite relevant to your situation. You can have a court force the sale of something (referred to as specific performance) only when the item is specifically unique or irreplaceable like a 1933 Bugati or any piece of real estate is considered unique. While you spent time finding the perfect diamond for you...there are many out there like it. I do think James Allen should be bending over backwards to satisfy you right now. They absolutely need to find a suitable (I should hope better) diamond or return your money and reimburse you the bank fees and interest.
 

tyty333

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
22,491
Unfortunately this has happened a few times but I believe JA has always made it right. They should be willing
to find you a new (usually better) stone for the same price. Talk to JA and keep us posted.
 

minmin001

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 21, 2011
Messages
2,047
Hi, I am so sorry to hear about this. My ring is from JA and everything has been pretty smooth even though I did change my order in the mid way. But mistake happens and trust me, they are not try to screw you over by any meaning. Like most suggest, try to deal with them nicely and it can work to your favor and they have made such a horrible mistake.
 

YoungPapa

Shiny_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jun 18, 2002
Messages
438
rashie81,

I'm sorry to hear about this situation and a bit embarrassed that it took us so long to realize that the diamond was unavailable, despite the fact that you had placed it on hold, wired the funds, and received a shipping date. I'm not sure how helpful it would be to try and explain all of the details of how this happened, but the short and sweet answer is that we screwed up.

What I do want to emphasize, however, is that when this happens we take extraordinary effort to find a replacement diamond that is as good (if not better) and priced equal to (if not less) than your original purchase . I know that your Customer Service representative is already searching for such a replacement and has reached out to you via phone and email to begin this process.

Lastly, I just wanted to say that we try and learn from these mistakes and are constantly improving our processes, technologies and policies to eliminate as many errors as possible. While I know we'll never be perfect, we can always be better.

All the best,
 

rashie81

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 7, 2011
Messages
17
Thanks guys for all your input. Also, thanks to James for replying. I just got off the phone with the sales manager and he was really helpful. I'm sorry if I had sounded a little harsh when I posted this thread last night. I was just really upset and irrational. They offered me a stone of similar specs and a bigger price tag at no extra cost. Can you guys give me a second opinion on this stone? I'm a little concerned about the inclusion at the top right corner (2 o' clock position).

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1370448.asp

Or there's also this one.

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1371017.asp
 

farmer gal

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Mar 26, 2011
Messages
1,063
The top one looks like a nice stone and it scores really well on the HCA, excellent in all catagories. I would have them make sure it is eye clean :appl:

Factor Grade
Light Return Excellent
Fire Excellent
Scintillation Excellent
Spread
or diameter for weight Excellent
Total Visual Performance 0.9 - Excellent
within TIC range
 

farmer gal

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Mar 26, 2011
Messages
1,063
don't even consider the second one, I don't know how they think that one compares to the original diamond.

Factor Grade
Light Return Very Good
Fire Good
Scintillation Good
Spread
or diameter for weight Very Good
Total Visual Performance 3.7 - Very Good - Worth buying if the price is right
 

happybear

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Feb 8, 2011
Messages
302
Glad things are turning for the better for you!

Besides checking with JA whether these are eye-clean, can you get them to give you the IS image of these two stones? The top one does face up larger, so it's a winner if it's eye-clean!
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
One thing I think people don't realize about JA is that the stones on their site are not in house diamonds in the same way that stones that appear at GOG and WF are in house. With the exception of their true hearts line, I believe, the rest are basically virtual stones that JA brings in house breifly to photos graph. That is why it takes a while to get an IS image, and that is how sometimes a diamond up on the site turns out to have been sold already. The wholesalers, who own the stones on thevirtual lists, can be very slow to update their sold status it seems. Clearly in this case JA also messed up because it took them so long to find ou the stone was not available, but these things do happen occassionally with even the best vendors. I can think of a very similar situation with WF, for example.

Anyways, sounds like they are taking care of you and that is what matters.

rashie81|1305730490|2924788 said:
Thanks guys for all your input. Also, thanks to James for replying. I just got off the phone with the sales manager and he was really helpful. I'm sorry if I had sounded a little harsh when I posted this thread last night. I was just really upset and irrational. They offered me a stone of similar specs and a bigger price tag at no extra cost. Can you guys give me a second opinion on this stone? I'm a little concerned about the inclusion at the top right corner (2 o' clock position).

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1370448.asp

Or there's also this one.

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1371017.asp
The first is a nice stone, and something you probably don't know is that it has wonderful spread because of its shallow crown and depth -- it will face up more like a 1.2ct diamond. I think you should request an IS image.

Did JA recommend the second stone? It is not a goodie at all.
 

rashie81

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 7, 2011
Messages
17
I actually just took notice of that too, Dreamer_D. The diamond is on hold for me atm, and they are going to have some IS images for me within the next 24 hrs. *Crossing fingers*

** Just got a call back from JA. Turns out there are IS images on file. I'll post them up as soon as I get them **
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
Dreamer_D|1305735804|2924844 said:
Looks great to me! Is it eye clean to your standards?
I noticed the inclusion you are asking about in the magnified image as well. Can't really know if it is eye clean or not, the JA rep can tell you. If eye clean, I would still ask them to set the stone with that inclusion under a prong, just to be safe :)) I don't think a prong would cover it entirely, but it would still make me happier to know it was partially covered, even if not typically visible.
 

CherryBlossom

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jan 20, 2011
Messages
311
rashie81|1305732767|2924818 said:
I actually just took notice of that too, Dreamer_D. The diamond is on hold for me atm, and they are going to have some IS images for me within the next 24 hrs. *Crossing fingers*

** Just got a call back from JA. Turns out there are IS images on file. I'll post them up as soon as I get them **
sweet! post them when you get them!! I would totally go w/ the 1st one. I'm glad it's working out, and it's okay that you vented a bit, I am sure that most people would that. *crossing fingers* so that it's smooth sailing from here ;-)

EDIT: just saw it, looks good to me too and yeah exactly what Dreamer said about the inclusion & pronging it.
 

tyty333

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
22,491
That IS image looks good...if it is eye-clean than I think you found a winner! Big plus on it facing up larger than it is
(we all should be so lucky!)
 

rashie81

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 7, 2011
Messages
17
Ok! Just got off the phone with the manager. Done!! My ring will be in by next Tuesday at the earliest. I am so relieved now! I asked about it being eye clean, and he said that it is, so I take his word for it. I also told him about having the prong cover the inclusion on the top right as well. Thank-you so much guys!!!
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
rashie81|1305737028|2924861 said:
Ok! Just got off the phone with the manager. Done!! My ring will be in by next Tuesday at the earliest. I am so relieved now! I asked about it being eye clean, and he said that it is, so I take his word for it. I also told him about having the prong cover the inclusion on the top right as well. Thank-you so much guys!!!
Remember that "eye clean" has a technical definition (usually something like you can't see inclusions in normal lighting face up from 10 inches with 20/20 vision :twirl: ). You can count on JA word for sure that this diamond meets their definition of eye clean, they have a good reputation in that respect. Occassionally, consumers with better eye sight will see inclusions that have been deemed eye clean by a vendor. This is an issue that all consumers need to be aware of when looking for the savings in an SI1 diamond. The VAST majority of the time, the vendor's word on eye clean is totally spot on! But sometimes a consumer will be disappointed to see inclusions in their SI1. Just be aware that this is a possibility, though small, and if that happens for you, do not despair and instead just exchange the stone. The savings of an SI1 diamond are worth the small chance of having to exchange a diamond, IMO, but I would hate to see you come back again with "I am so upset right now.. .part two!!" :tongue:
 

yssie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
21,101
Congrats! I'm glad to see everything worked out well :appl:


I think that's a fabulous inclusion to have - perfectly prongable! Even if the prong doesn't completely cover it, with the distracting prong and the neighbouring sparkle you'll have an *incredibly* hard time focusing IRL on whatever tiny bit of inclusion is visible, if at all :sun:
 

marcy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Feb 27, 2007
Messages
24,116
I am glad everyone worked out for you and it looks like you'll be getting a real beautiful diamond. :appl:
 
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