Hey guys, what do we think here

[SteveScao]

I have two diamonds, and I think they're both gorgeous, and seem to check out with numbers.

Price difference is my biggest concern of $3000...

Diamond 1:

1.5ct
D
SI1



Scores HCA 1 - TIC - triple excellent


Diamond 2:

1.25ct
H
VS 2



Scores HCA 0.9 - TIC - triple excellent

What do you think guys...?

Is a 0.3mm difference in width and height size and the D color worth it?

Opinions?

 

[NY_Resonant]

Comparable Gia XXX 1.5ct D SI diamonds seem to be going for 13k (Medium flour) to 14k (faint flour). Compared to $7700 for the 1.25ct H VS2, it seems like a decent deal for a $3000 difference.

 

[lovedogs]

I don't like the look of the first one.

I'd put both on hold and then let us see the videos

 

[SteveScao]

I don't like the look of the first one.

I'd put both on hold and then let us see the videos

Sure, here they are!

Diamond 1:
The inclusion on this diamond is favorable as it makes it more personal. She has a nevus, or that beauty mark dot in her iris in one of her eyes, which would make this a little more romantic.

But, I'm here for objective options.

1.50 Carat round diamond

This 1.5 carat round diamond D color si1 clarity has Excellent proportions and a diamond grading report from GIA

www.jamesallen.com

Diamond 2:

1.25 Carat round diamond

This True Hearts TM diamond, 1.25 carat H color vs2 clarity has ideal proportions and a diamond grading report from GIA

www.jamesallen.com

 

[Karl_K]

Neither one is that great.
The 1.25 has a largish amount of pavilion lowers twist.
The 1.5 less so but some.
The prosumers can help find you better ones.

 

[tyty333]

I was going to say that neither floats my boat...what is your budget?

There has got to be something better that falls in between the two specs-wise but with a better cut.

 

[SteveScao]

I was going to say that neither floats my boat...what is your budget?

There has got to be something better that falls in between the two specs-wise but with a better cut.

Around 11 for the diamond, really thought I did my research enough here for these to be good enough for this forum's evaluation..

 

[SteveScao]

Neither one is that great.
The 1.25 has a largish amount of pavilion lowers twist.
The 1.5 less so but some.
The prosumers can help find you better ones.

Hmm, what does that mean exactly?

"largish amount of pavilion lowers twist?"

I thought everything checked out.. Decent arrows, HCA, and angles?

Sigh. This is rough.

EDIT:

They even had an ideal scope image of the D diamond that they accidently flashed during inspection and I had them sent to me - even though it's not a JA H&A:


All this info and you guys are giving me it's a "decent?"

So sad

 

[Karl_K]

Hmm, what does that mean exactly?

"largish amount of pavilion lowers twist?"

I thought everything checked out.. Decent arrows, HCA, and angles?

Sigh. This is rough.

Its a newish way to game grading systems.
Well its old but cutting processes have gotten good enough they can pull it off more is newish.
What they do is vary the pavilion angles then twist the lowers in 3d space to save the EX symmetry grade that would not be possible without the twist.
You look for variation between the arrows to see it.
The cutter that does it the most is cutting GIA rounded 55 stars on everything, even stuff they should not.

 

[Kim N]

I would get one of these instead. Super ideal cut with guaranteed light performance and a much better upgrade policy.

Diamond | 1.264 ct H VS2 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4506040

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.264 carat H color VS2 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4506040

www.whiteflash.com

Diamond | 1.28 ct H VS2 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond GIA Certified | 4494033

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.28 carat H color VS2 clarity loose diamond is graded by the Gemological Institute of America (GIA). | 4494033

www.whiteflash.com

 

[Karl_K]

The 1.5 IS shows it was painting/digging that was causing the distortion, with just a video when you see distortions its a guess what is causing them exactly.
I was 60/40 twist or painting digging.

 

[NY_Resonant]

If you don’t mind strong blue Flour, this 1.33ct D color VS2 brian gavin black diamond looks like an option to consider at under 11.5k. They seem to be running an 8% sale right now too?

1.33 D VS2 Black by Brian Gavin Round

Brian Gavin Diamonds

www.briangavindiamonds.com

 

[NY_Resonant]

The 1.5 IS shows it was painting/digging that was causing the distortion, with just a video when you see distortions its a guess what is causing them exactly.
I was 60/40 twist or painting digging.

Does this change/improve your evaluation of the 1.5ct diamond option?

 

[SteveScao]

If you don’t mind strong blue Flour, this 1.33ct D color VS2 brian gavin black diamond looks like an option to consider at under 11.5k. They seem to be running an 8% sale right now too?

1.33 D VS2 Black by Brian Gavin Round

Brian Gavin Diamonds

www.briangavindiamonds.com

Thank you for the suggestion.

I would prefer none.

The D color is also not a MUST, it would just be nice for her to know she has the "best" on some scale which, I know, I know, is a scam. Just bragging rights. She'd be happy with a .50ct I diamond, I just want to do this right the first time, without really considering upgrades.

 

[NY_Resonant]

Another option should be the following H color 1.3ct brian signature, 10% off from their discover the final series sale — so under 11k.

1.3 H VS1 Signature Round

Buy diamonds online - AGS Graded 1.3 carat H VS1 super ideal cut Brian Gavin Hearts & Arrows Round Cut diamond. Lifetime Upgrade Policy!

www.briangavindiamonds.com

 

[MissGotRocks]

Thank you for the suggestion.

I would prefer none.

The D color is also not a MUST, it would just be nice for her to know she has the "best" on some scale which, I know, I know, is a scam. Just bragging rights. She'd be happy with a .50ct I diamond, I just want to do this right the first time, without really considering upgrades.

Not a scam but I would make sure she has the best in terms of cut quality! It makes a difference. Check out the Whiteflash or Brian Gavin diamonds and get superior light performance and cut quality. Makes far more difference than color!

 

[SteveScao]

Not a scam but I would make sure she has the best in terms of cut quality! It makes a difference. Check out the Whiteflash or Brian Gavin diamonds and get superior light performance and cut quality. Makes far more difference than color!

Right, I will do that, but, I'm trying to understand what I did wrong or what's really wrong with the two I have here.

I don't want to just forfeit my cash to ACA, Brian Gavin Black, due to my lack of knowledge of what went wrong here. Essentially, I'd be paying them for the work in selecting the diamonds, as far as I understand it.

Just want to be educated a bit, I suppose. I thought I was when I picked these two.

 

[Karl_K]

Does this change/improve your evaluation of the 1.5ct diamond option?

There is better out there.
If it was the best that was available in someones budget it would be worth considering.

 

[SteveScao]

There is better out there.
If it was the best that was available in someones budget it would be worth considering.

This diamond is 1.5 D without fluorescence at $11,100 is the price asked. My budget is / was ~11k

Give me a ray of hope that I would be impressed with my selection! lol

Or do you think there is similar +- $500 that would be astoundingly better?

 

[Kim N]

Right, I will do that, but, I'm trying to understand what I did wrong or what's really wrong with the two I have here.

I don't want to just forfeit my cash to ACA, Brian Gavin Black, due to my lack of knowledge of what went wrong here. Essentially, I'd be paying them for the work in selecting the diamonds, as far as I understand it.

Just want to be educated a bit, I suppose. I thought I was when I picked these two.

That's not accurate. WF and BGD stones are cut *for* WF and BGD according to their very exacting and stringent specifications, not just in proportions, but also in optical symmetry and light performance.

 

[NY_Resonant]

There is better out there.
If it was the best that was available in someones budget it would be worth considering.

Certainly there is better cut but personally if this one was “very good” with Ideal 0 AGS light performance… at around 11k…

Is it worth it for him to drop from 1.5ct to under 1.3ct and sacrifice the D color to an H… all for a bit better cut and symmetry?

I don’t know the answer to that one. That’s a lot to give up. The biggest issue I had with his 1.5ct D option, which would bother me personally, is the black crystal on the table.

 

[lovedogs]

Right, I will do that, but, I'm trying to understand what I did wrong or what's really wrong with the two I have here.

I don't want to just forfeit my cash to ACA, Brian Gavin Black, due to my lack of knowledge of what went wrong here. Essentially, I'd be paying them for the work in selecting the diamonds, as far as I understand it.

Just want to be educated a bit, I suppose. I thought I was when I picked these two.

It's not that ACAs or BGD are chosen from a pack of stones and therefore cost more. It's that they are cut to exacting proportions and therefore are of a higher quality. The ones you picked just aren't great. The proportions fall into ranges that are good, but if you look carefully and compare them to truly ideal cut stones, neither one measures up.

 

[lovedogs]

I would get one of these instead. Super ideal cut with guaranteed light performance and a much better upgrade policy.

Diamond | 1.264 ct H VS2 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4506040

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.264 carat H color VS2 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4506040

www.whiteflash.com

Diamond | 1.28 ct H VS2 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond GIA Certified | 4494033

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.28 carat H color VS2 clarity loose diamond is graded by the Gemological Institute of America (GIA). | 4494033

www.whiteflash.com

If you look at these vs the two you chose, differences are massive in terms of cut quality and precision

 

[SteveScao]

That's not accurate. WF and BGD stones are cut *for* WF and BGD according to their very exacting and stringent specifications, not just in proportions, but also in optical symmetry and light performance.

It's not that ACAs or BGD are chosen from a pack of stones and therefore cost more. It's that they are cut to exacting proportions and therefore are of a higher quality. The ones you picked just aren't great. The proportions fall into ranges that are good, but if you look carefully and compare them to truly ideal cut stones, neither one measures up.

Understood, are the differences so massive that I would, without fail, be able to pick out the better cut stone if held to me in real life?

If the answer is yes, I'll really consider it, and I appreciate everyone chiming in here. Learning a bit.

 

[MissGotRocks]

Certainly there is better cut but personally if this one was “very good” with Ideal 0 AGS light performance… at around 11k…

Is it worth it for him to drop from 1.5ct to under 1.3ct and sacrifice the D color to an H… all for a bit better cut and symmetry?

I don’t know the answer to that one. That’s a lot to give up. The biggest issue I had with his 1.5ct D option, which would bother me personally, is the black crystal on the table.

In a word, yes. Precision cutting and top performance do cost. There is much more diamond material wasted to cut for performance and not carat weight. There is always truth in numbers and most of the folks here have seen and experienced the difference in top cut. They are not going to recommend settling.

 

[Karl_K]

This diamond is 1.5 D without fluorescence at $11,100 is the price asked. My budget is / was ~11k

Give me a ray of hope that I would be impressed with my selection! lol

Or do you think there is similar +- $500 that would be astoundingly better?

No one looking at the 1.5 in person on someones finger is going to think it is a bad diamond.
Its better cut than a lot of stones out there in the wild even if its not up to the standards here by a bit.

I'm not allowed to recommend diamonds.
That is a challenge left for the prosumers.

 

[NY_Resonant]

Understood, are the differences so massive that I would, without fail, be able to pick out the better cut stone if held to me in real life?

If the answer is yes, I'll really consider it, and I appreciate everyone chiming in here. Learning a bit.

I’ve held an ACA next to an “ideal proportion” good XXX GIA stone and compared them in my own personal search. I do believe I have a very sensitive eye, for what that is worth.

I noticed the arrows being more prominent and symmetrical. I also noticed like a 5%-10% difference in sparkle personally after comparing carefully in a couple of lighting conditions. There IS a difference. My friend who was with me could not see it though (shrug).

But there IS also a difference between a 1.3ct and a 1.5ct diamond in presence on the finger. It’s a noticeable difference.

There is also a difference between a D icy color and an H. I chose not to buy an H personally because I could see the warmth in the stone but i’m color sensitive — many others are perfectly happy with an H.

 

[MissGotRocks]

Right, I will do that, but, I'm trying to understand what I did wrong or what's really wrong with the two I have here.

I don't want to just forfeit my cash to ACA, Brian Gavin Black, due to my lack of knowledge of what went wrong here. Essentially, I'd be paying them for the work in selecting the diamonds, as far as I understand it.

Just want to be educated a bit, I suppose. I thought I was when I picked these two.

Go to Whiteflash.com and look at their extensive explanations of how they arrive at the cut of their diamonds. They go way beyond looking at table, crown and pavilion numbers - although that is a starting point. If the diamonds you are considering met that criteria, they would be sold by super ideal vendors. I understand your frustration - can it really be this complex? The answer is yes. Many of us were where you are at the beginning. Really necessary? Marketing hype? Really? I have now had nine ACA diamonds - some have been traded up - and the performance is remarkably consistent and beautiful. I get lots of compliments which is nice - but the biggest bang for me is the pleasure I get from wearing and admiring them. Just my experience and I always feel it is worth sharing. She won’t notice the size as much as she will the sparkle - lots of reviews here for super ideal cut diamonds and on vendor websites.

 

[SteveScao]

I’ve held an ACA next to an “ideal proportion” good XXX GIA stone and compared them in my own personal search. I do believe I have a very sensitive eye, for what that is worth.

I noticed the arrows being more prominent and symmetrical. I also noticed like a 5%-10% difference in sparkle personally after comparing carefully in a couple of lighting conditions. There IS a difference. My friend who was with me could not see it though (shrug).

But there IS also a difference between a 1.3ct and a 1.5ct diamond in presence on the finger. It’s a noticeable difference.

There is also a difference between a D icy white color and an H. I chose not to buy an H personally because I could see the warmth in the stone but i’m color sensitive — many others are perfectly happy with an H.

Understood. This is a connoisseur website for diamonds and of course you guys are going to be geared with the best as the benchmark.

Go to Whiteflash.com and look at their extensive explanations of how they arrive at the cut of their diamonds. They go way beyond looking at table, crown and pavilion numbers - although that is a starting point. If the diamonds you are considering met that criteria, they would be sold by super ideal vendors. I understand your frustration - can it really be this complex? The answer is yes. Many of us were where you are at the beginning. Really necessary? Marketing hype? Really? I have now had nine ACA diamonds - some have been traded up - and the performance is remarkably consistent and beautiful. I get lots of compliments which is nice - but the biggest bang for me is the pleasure I get from wearing and admiring them. Just my experience and I always feel it is worth sharing. She won’t notice the size as much as she will the sparkle - lots of reviews here for super ideal cut diamonds and on vendor websites.

You have captured my feelings precisely.

This sucks, because I thought I was already in a lot of pain capturing the 1.5D that I have here, thinking I found a deal for an amazing price, but this added information is telling me that it still may not be up to par.

I've lost a lot of sleep researching things about diamonds to make sure my blind website purchase is exactly right and most importantly, she'd be happy. And now I feel like I must go back to the drawing board lol.

I'm feeling like there's no use in trying to "find a diamond in the ruff" on traditional websites in an attempt of getting lucky to come across an accidental steal, and that I need to just check what I can afford from the premium brands like ACA, BGD, etc.

 

[NY_Resonant]

Understood. This is a connoisseur website for diamonds and of course you guys are going to be geared with the best as the benchmark.


You have captured my feelings precisely.

This sucks, because I thought I was already in a lot of pain capturing the 1.5D that I have here, thinking I found a deal for an amazing price, but this added information is telling me that it still may not be up to par.

I've lost a lot of sleep researching things about diamonds to make sure my blind website purchase is exactly right and most importantly, she'd be happy. And now I feel like I must go back to the drawing board lol.

I'm feeling like there's no use in trying to "find a diamond in the ruff" on traditional websites in an attempt of getting lucky to come across an accidental steal, and that I need to just check what I can afford from the premium brands like ACA, BGD, etc.

I suggest you try and take a little bit of pressure off yourself. Ask the people on this forum, do ANY of them still use their first engagement ring 10 years later? 20?

That’s why so many people here stress the upgrade programs in the different vendors. People just make/have a lot more money later in life and suddenly that 2ct, 2.5ct diamond starts looking really good for a 10th anniversary.