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Help with engagement diamond

Diamondite

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 3, 2016
Messages
5
I finally made the decision to pop the question although I have known for quite sometime that I wanted to do so. The wheels are in motion as I reached out to her sister for recommendations.

We went shopping together and her sister loved this double halo cushion setting for a round stone that looked amazing when the jeweler put a 1.66ct stone in the center setting. Thankfully I didn't make the purchase right then and there as I have spent the past week researching info on diamonds and now know it was not a good deal. I took a picture of it in the store and after looking at the pic a few times it was painfully clear that it was not eye clean. It seems that each day I find something new that I now need to consider. I know terms beyond the 4 cs, have been using the HCA calculator, and have spent hours rotating diamonds on James Allen.

I think at this point I could choose a fairly decent diamond but I don't want to leave anything to chance. I would greatly appreciate if the forum could help me find a great diamond. She definitely deserves it.

My budget for the diamond is $9000. I was sold on a 1.5ct stone but can't seem to find an eye clean one with an excellent cut in that price range. I want the diamond to sparkle so cut is paramount. My initial searches have been for H color and above and SI1 clarity and above. Excellent cut, HCA 2 or lower. I still haven't figured out the whole fluorescence thing yet. I was sold on just looking at GIA certified diamonds but now I am not sure if AGS or others should be considered.
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225
I would expand to I color and eyeclean SI1 clarity. In a halo you will be fine with a 1.4 carat as well. And that will discount the stone.

And yes, I would consider AGS.

As for fluorescence it is fine, and will discount the diamond, as long as the stone is not overblue. The gemologist at the vendor should be able to tell you if a particular stone is overblue.

Additionally if you can find a good 60/60 style stone (CA: 33.5-34.5 PA:40.6-40.8 and HCA under 2) that will discount the stone as well, and give you more bang for buck.

If anything I've seen here is over your head, let us know and we'll explain or link you to explanations.
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225
I didn't check the crown angles above or the depth. Make sure the crowns are above 33.5 and the depth is less than 62.4.
 

Diamondite

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 3, 2016
Messages
5
I must be on the right track because the first diamond was on my wish list at James Allen. It seemed like a great value until I saw the Medium Blue fluorescence. After seeing that I googled and read something saying that blue fluorescence can enhance the color of G, H, and I color diamonds. How would I know if something is overblue?

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.40-carat-h-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-789734

The second diamond wasn't showing in my searches because of the depth being 62.5. I saw some chart indicating 62 was the limit for very good to excellent diamonds but I have also seen the 62.4 in these forums. HCA is 1.9 though so it is one to consider but that first one seems to draw me back.

I didn't realize that you can request images or IS (Ideal Scope?) on stones from these sites. Will all of them do that? I have been sticking to James Allen solely because they provide pics.

That stone from brilliantlyengaged is a very nice price for those specs. I will have to request image and video on that one.

The last diamond has a dark inclusion on the table. Things like that are what I seem to be fixated on when viewing the images. They open at 20x, I see the inclusion, and then no matter how small I make it, 5x, 2x, my eye is stuck staring at that spot.

Thank you very very much for helping me out. I know I am on the right track and have some additional weapons in my arsenal now that I know that I can request images. Plus I learned the term 60/60 and read up on it. Thanks a ton Gypsy
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225
You would ask them to check it to see if it's overblue. They only way to know is to understand what to look for (haziness) and have the stone in hand.
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225
Yeah, you are on the right path. JA used to provide IS images for every stone they offered, but recently it's only at stones at certain locations. That one is safe enough you can buy without. Put it on hold, we have lurkers that steal.

:wavey:
 

Diamondite

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 3, 2016
Messages
5
That stone you suggested Gypsy is beautiful and in my budget but I did some contemplating over the weekend.

My initial idea was to pick the setting and I had a double halo setting / band picked out that was $5500 from a local jeweler. I was then going to pick the diamond and have them place it in the setting. I just can't force myself to do that since I am not 100% sold that she will love that setting. She may like it a lot but there may be something better that she will truly love. So I have decided to find the perfect diamond and have it placed in a temporary solitaire setting. Then after the proposal we can shop for the setting and bands together. Best of both worlds.

Because of this shift in thought, I have upped my budget to $10,500 and I am sold on a 1.5ct stone with H or better color. I can't force myself to drop below 1.5 ct or to an I for some reason. Still going with S1 clarity and eye clean. You have opened me up to potential medium to strong fluorescent diamonds. After searching I am down to these 3.

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.50-carat-h-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-805163
Nice diamond that scores 1.9 on the HCA but shows as n/a on the pricescope search. Somehow I stumbled onto it.

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.50-carat-h-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-827798
The GIA report states that the clarity is based on clouds that are not shown. I opened up a chat and got a stock answer that for S1 the clouds may or may not show some cloudiness on certain spots of the diamond. That was off-putting to me.

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.50-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-755326
I absolutely love this diamond. The specs are amazing for my price range and it is a beauty to behold. It has strong blue fluorescence which I assume is why the price is so low on it. I had 2 separate chat inspections with the first giving me the stock answer that it may affect 1% of diamonds but the second inspection from a separate individual was that it would not affect performance at all. That answer made me immediately request an ideal scope image so it is on hold until that comes back.

How did I do? The blue stone the best of the 3 like I think? Any reservations or better recommendations?
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225
Okay so. Your starting to get the hang of this, but as you know there are a lot of techinicalities that can trip you up, and you have hit a few. I'll post my comments on each stone in turn, and then look to see if there is anything out there I recommend. Are you set BTW?

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.50-carat-h-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-805163 Really pretty 60/60 style stone. The crown angle is great and compliments the pavilion angle. With a 41 pavilion you must get an IS though. Still, I think this is the strongest of your picks. And it's a nice find. My questions on this stone for the gemologist are about the feather. Is it a durability concern? If not, and the IS works out, you are good to go on this one.

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.50-carat-h-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-827798 60/60 style stone with really low crown. Anything under 33.5 is a no. So this one is out. Clouds aside. But, for the record, I agree with you. Grade setting clouds are a turn off.

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.50-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-755326 I know this is your favorite but it's got a few issues. And I'm not talking about the flourescense, though you should check to see if it is overblue, if you still think it is a contender. The crown is higher than the last stone, but still very low. That's part of why the price is so low. Also the girdle is thin. Those are probably the reasons, coupled with the fluorescence and a black inclusion on the table, that the price was so low. For me personally, the crown would disqualify it, especially coupled with that girdle as I would be concerned about durability. You can ask the gemologist their opinion.

I will look to see what else I find.

As for the setting. I agree with you 100% it is folly to spend 5k on a setting that your lady may not like. Also, double halos are VERY HIGH maintanence settings and can have restrictions on wearing them 24/7 which some folks like to do, and also on sizing, in case of weight loss or gain. So I think holding off on that is a wise choice. Also, if you are going for a halo of any sort you are best of with a platinum handforged setting by someone like Steven Kirsch, Victor Canera, or by Brilliantly Engaged's handforged bench. http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.50-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-755326

Here's a guy who is looking for a similar ring as you: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/having-buyers-remorse-after-shane-co-purchase.218378/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/having-buyers-remorse-after-shane-co-purchase.218378/[/URL] You might find his thread an interesting read. :wavey:

I'll see if I can find any stones I like for you. Okay?
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225
http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-7859706-1.59-carat-Round-diamond-H-color-VS2-clarity.aspx This one you would have to ask if it is eyeclean. It is 300 over budget, but you can ask if there is a PS discount. Numbers and ASET are solid on this one.


These are from Enchanted Diamonds. Ignore the vendor's cut rating. It's meaningless (they would argue, but that's neither here nor there).

Probably overblue, and very strong blue is not for everyone (though I would jump on it personally): https://enchanteddiamonds.com/diamonds/view/Round/GIA-Certified-1-5-Carat-E-Color-VS2-Clarity-Diamond-28T4L9 Nice stone though.

https://enchanteddiamonds.com/diamonds/view/Round/GIA-Certified-1-51-Carat-F-Color-SI1-Clarity-Diamond-A961DX if eyeclean (there's a good chance it's not) it's my favorite so far.

Overbudget beauty: https://enchanteddiamonds.com/diamonds/view/Round/GIA-Certified-1-5-Carat-F-Color-VS2-Clarity-Diamond-71HNH6 Ask for an IS if you can stretch to afford it. It's a nice one if it's not overblue.
 

Downsy

Shiny_Rock
Joined
May 22, 2014
Messages
122
Just an FYI: I don't think you can get an IS image on any diamonds at James Allen that aren't in their own inventory. The ones that are in their inventory have a little butterfly image at the bottom right of the rotating video photos.

I found after dealing with James Allen they will not do an IS image if the stone isn't carried directly by JA. They stopped doing them during the busy holidays and said they'd pick it back up in January. However I don't believe they will do them if the diamond isn't already owned by them. (virtual stock). I bought a stone and setting before Christmas and then found another diamond I wanted to evaluate and ordered it before Christmas as well. I looked at them both for several days and decided to go with the loose stone instead of the one they already set. I returned everything to JA and called to ask to include an IS image of the loose diamond - and they said they can't do it. I don't quite understand that because they have the diamond in their possession but she said it's their policy not to do an image on stock that came from elsewhere.

I like the stone regardless and its' probably better for me not to get the IS!!! It is one that has a shallow crown and a deep pavilion angle but scores well on the HCA and not too bad on the ACA. I've seen it in person and love the brightness and flashes of light. So I will keep it and not know if there is light leakage!
 

Diamondite

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 3, 2016
Messages
5
The girdle on the blue diamond I have off for review is thin to slightly thick. I read somewhere that thin, medium, and slightly thick are ideal with 2 deviations being acceptable. I think the article even mentioned thin to slightly thick as being acceptable. Is that not the case?

I have not spent much time researching crown or pavilion angles as I just assumed an HCA under 2 took those into account. Is there any reading that is recommended for crown and pavilion angles?

I have that 1.59 ct diamond that you recommended from B2C off for review to determine if it is eye clean.
 

Downsy

Shiny_Rock
Joined
May 22, 2014
Messages
122
If you search on here for the desired parameters for a Tolk diamond - you'll see the ranges that most here seem to consider respectable. I know that the crown angle on my diamond is 33, which is shallow. However, after all my reading, if you have a shallow crown angle the pavilion angle must be complimentary. Mine is just over the line of what most say is acceptable, but it falls within acceptable HCA ranges.

I looked at the crown angle of the JA blue fluorescent diamond you listed and it is a 33 crown but the pavilion looks complimentary (I think!) However, it would be best for the others who know what they're talking about to comment.
 

Diamondite

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 3, 2016
Messages
5
I have gotten to the point where I think I prefer a diamond with medium to strong blue fluorescence. The ones that I have found are on James Allen so I do the inspection chat thing and ask if they are over blue. The inspector rotates the diamond and so far they have always said that the fluorescence will not detract from the diamond. Is that all that is needed for me to rest assured that the diamond is not milky/oily/etc over blue? Is there anything else I should be requesting?
 
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