Help me decide - Looking for <0.5ct
- Thread starter jlim
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On 4/30/2003 65:57 PM jlim wrote:
I'm of Asian heritage. I value quality over quantity so to speak. For the same price, I would get a higher quality stone over a larger stone EVEN IF you can't tell the difference bet. a D/E/F & IF/VVS1/VVS2 over a G/H & VS1/VS2 through the naked eye. Maybe it is a cultural thing.
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But, it really doesn't matter what *you* want. *She* will be the receipient who will be *wearing* it.
Hest88
Ideal_Rock
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I'm of Asian heritage too, and I have a large circle of friends and acquaintances, all in their late 20s, early 30s, who are Chinese-American, Japanese-American, and Korean-American and either married or talking about it. Many of the women seemed to have learned about jewelry at the feet of their mothers, would never wear costume jewelry, and know a bad gem from a great gem. Believe me, size still matters and while they won't compromise on quality, neither will they compromise on size. Unless you know she likes a small diamond, and you're *not* in a metropolitan area, a .5 is going to look small-- especially as her girlfriends start getting engaged. I'm about the same size as your GF--in fact, I weigh even less--and a .5 looks very small on me.
Anyway, you know your GF better than we do, so whether you end up with a .5 or a 1.5 it doesn't matter. The point is that there's a lot of emotional baggage riding on an e-ring. She's going to expect it as the ultimate testimony of your love, and if you end up getting her something that's not what she wants, no matter how happy she is a part of her is going to wonder how well you really know her.
Anyway, you know your GF better than we do, so whether you end up with a .5 or a 1.5 it doesn't matter. The point is that there's a lot of emotional baggage riding on an e-ring. She's going to expect it as the ultimate testimony of your love, and if you end up getting her something that's not what she wants, no matter how happy she is a part of her is going to wonder how well you really know her.
I feel like I have to reply to couple of previous posts....
Size of diamonds are in NO WAY related to the way or the amount
of love you have for your sweety. This is simply bull****.
Americans are known for their desperate attraction for material stuff.
(yes, i love to generalize... it put some spice in my answer and
gets your attention... I'm of italian origin..so that's why)
For example, 1.5ct+ stones are pretty rare in Europe.
It's not because you're rich that you have to spend 50000$ on a e-ring.
This is pure stupidity for me and it reflects the sadness of our
society. I'd like to remember people reading these lines that
an e-ring has to be beautiful by itself no matter what is the size
of the diamond... some ring designs look gorgeous with 1ct stone
while others doesn't need more than a 3/4ct to look beautiful.
When you're buying a ring, it must look good on your fiance finger...
of course a .10ct solitaire won't make it.... in such a ring even
the prongs are bigger than the diamond.... so if you're planning to
buy a 0.25 ct for example, go with a nice sapphire instead or
and eternity ring....
but and I'd like to say it again, if you think that because
your future husband is not giving you THE diamond you want he is not
loving you enough, well, I'm pretty sure that your wedding is going to
end up pretty soon in divorce....
Long lasting relationship are not built on carats of diamonds, but
on love, trust and everything related PERIOD.
Trichrome (yes, I ate 100% pure American beef this morning).
Size of diamonds are in NO WAY related to the way or the amount
of love you have for your sweety. This is simply bull****.
Americans are known for their desperate attraction for material stuff.
(yes, i love to generalize... it put some spice in my answer and
gets your attention... I'm of italian origin..so that's why)
For example, 1.5ct+ stones are pretty rare in Europe.
It's not because you're rich that you have to spend 50000$ on a e-ring.
This is pure stupidity for me and it reflects the sadness of our
society. I'd like to remember people reading these lines that
an e-ring has to be beautiful by itself no matter what is the size
of the diamond... some ring designs look gorgeous with 1ct stone
while others doesn't need more than a 3/4ct to look beautiful.
When you're buying a ring, it must look good on your fiance finger...
of course a .10ct solitaire won't make it.... in such a ring even
the prongs are bigger than the diamond.... so if you're planning to
buy a 0.25 ct for example, go with a nice sapphire instead or
and eternity ring....
but and I'd like to say it again, if you think that because
your future husband is not giving you THE diamond you want he is not
loving you enough, well, I'm pretty sure that your wedding is going to
end up pretty soon in divorce....
Long lasting relationship are not built on carats of diamonds, but
on love, trust and everything related PERIOD.
Trichrome (yes, I ate 100% pure American beef this morning).
aljdewey
Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Nov 25, 2002
- Messages
- 9,170
Jim: Glad to see the info I gave was of some help. The HCA helps to identify which stones will perform the best, and anything under 2 is good. You ask why would someone want a 1.5 if they could get a .05? Because once you get under 2, it becomes a matter of preference. Do you want more brilliance with a shallower crown/deeper pavilion, or do you want more fire with a steeper crown? Bottom line: any stone under 2 should perform fabulously.----------------
On 4/30/2003 65:57 PM jlim wrote:
Though I'm neither American nor Japanese, I'm of Asian heritage. I value quality over quantity so to speak. For the same price, I would get a higher quality stone over a larger stone EVEN IF you can't tell the difference bet.
Anyway, I feel a 0.5ct will look nicely on my gf's finger. In fact, I've been looking for slightly bigger stones. My criteria now is bet. 0.6-0.7 ct. D/E/F & IF/VVS1. From the responses I get from online vendors whom I'm been contacted or contacted, it seem my choices are getting smaller due to the $4500 (up from $4000 since I've also decided on the setting) cap.
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With respect to your comment above, I would ask this: If you are unwilling to sacrifice quality for quantity....if quality is of paramount value to you...then why would you be willing to sacrifice quality over a *name*....Tiffany's? (I don't say this to bash Tiffany's at all; for those to whom a name is more important than quality, by all means buy at Tiffany's.)
BUT....you said quality is most important to you. You've already mentioned that your initial online inquiries have led you to expand your budget to $4500, and that will get you a stone of approx .60 to .65 in the E, VVS-1 range. With the Tiffany's markup, you can expect to pay approx 7500-8000 for that same stone in Tiffany's. If you truly want a top-of-the-line stone, and you don't want to sacrifice color/clarity, then don't even bother calling Tiffany's.
With respect to Fire & Ice's comment: "But, it really doesn't matter what *you* want. *She* will be the receipient who will be *wearing* it."
Truthfully, I respectfully disagree. The e-ring should be about what BOTH want. A man gives a ring as a token of his love and his promise. Yes, what the woman wants is very, very important, and she will be wearing it. But he will be looking at it everyday too, and he wants to take pride in his selection.
Jim, I really recommend that you talk to your girl and confirm that what you think is what she thinks. If they match, great! If you have differing opinions, then find a mid-point you can both live with and go from there.
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On 5/1/2003 119:17 AM aljdewey wrote:
I thought I would catch some flack for my comment. I appreciate the respectful way you disagreed. Thing is - I am in total agreement with you. It should be about what *both* want....and a "midpoint" that both are happy. That's what a marriage is all about. I am a firm believer in purchasing items for others from *their* frame of reference NOT *mine*. The mindset in this case is clear.
Tric, you have to be a guy. The guys & the girls seem to be split on this. PC has been round & round about this discussion. Love=diamond . Right or wrong, women (not all) see the size/quality of a diamond as a sign of love. This is not a moral discussion of whether *that* should be the case or not. It should not; but, we have been indoctrinated w/ this diamond=love.
All that said, Diamond=Love is situational. The size/quality of a diamond should be representative to budget & desire of both parties.
I would think very unkindly upon this situation:
1. man has much disposable income.
2. women has strong desire for nice & substantial diamond.
3. man chooses to ignore this fact.
I would be heart warmed by this situation:
1. Man has only 2k (insert any amount here)to spend.
2. Man carefully selects the best stone which meets the parameters that he has gleaned from his future "to be". Or man involves women in decision making to assure he can buy what she wants.
Also unkindly,
1. Man has limited resources.
2. Women must have x size stone without any regard to what man *can* spend. Women insists man go into debt to get her what *she* wants.
This is not really about the diamond (although as stated - the diamond transends other material possessions). It is an effort to please & understand what the *situation* is. And, subsequently, respond to it.
The reason for looking at Tiffany's is because I believe she as well as 90% of the American population will equate Tiffany with quality. So, how bad can it be, right? It is like the age old speaker debate. Let me ask all of you this. If you know absolutely nothing about speakers other they make sounds, and someone tells you he or she bought a set of BOSE speakers or HT system, what's the first thing that come to mind in terms of quality? Because of the clever marketing of BOSE, most people think BOSE speakers are really good. But if you ask a true audiophile what they think, they'll tell you the cheapo Optimus system you buy from RadioShack for $150 will sound better than the $3000 you spent on the Bose system.
I bought a HT system last year and I am not an audiophile. My ears aren't sensitive enough to tell me what is good and what's not. Bose sounds good to me, but the more I learned, I realize that Bose woofers are made out of cheap paper cones and some of their speakers do not even have tweeters builtin. The so-called Accoustimass is not even a sub-woofer. And if you sweep from 20hz-20khz, you can hear a drop off because there's a gap bet. what the speakers are capable off and what the sub-woofer is capable of producing.
Why am I bringing this up? Well, Tiffany about the same as Bose. Bose do produce good quality speakers other than the dimunitive speakers that most people are familiar with. But the highest profit margin is made from those who gotta have the little cube speakers. Tiffany to me is the same. Although I haven't been to the store, I believe they do have very very good quality stuff. But because of the name recognition, it will go for more. How else are they going to maintain the fancy store design and all the marketing cost? But because for an uninformed person that I was (still am), buying a relatively inexpensive Tiffany e-ring for $4500 is the same as buying the HT system Bose sells for $3500. I can't tell the difference but because of the name, the majority of people will think it is good. Now, you might ask me why is it important what other people feel? It is not to me, but we live in a real world and people are emotional. If your loved one buys you the same quality ring as one that is sold online but pay 40-50% more because it is fom Tiffany, wouldn't you be happier? Assuming of course he can afford it w/o breaking the bank. All the ladies here who say they don't care for Tiffany, let me ask you this. If your bf. at that time had bought you a 2ct (I sense a lot of people seem to think my 0.5ct is too small) D/FL from Tiffany instead of one from a vendor here, wouldn't you be happier to *show off* your ring to your other girlfriends and every so discreetly mentioning the Tiffany name? Sweet Home Alabama should be banned! They should have shown Reese Witherspoon (ex-)husband calling up one of the vendors here, buying a 0.5ct, ok a 1ct. D/IF ring for $8k and she throws the $50k 2ct. stone back to Tiffany.
To get back on topic. To answer your question aljdewey, I know I cannot get the same ct. same clarity and color from Tiffany. I've to either sacrifice ct or clarity/color.
If I decide to get a 0.5ct H&A E/IF from a vendor here, I might have to settle for a 0.25 ct Good Cut H/VS1 from Tiffanys. Or get a 0.5ct Average Cut I/SI2 from Tiffanys and maybe pay $5000. Sure, it is buying the name. No different from women buying LV bags over Coach.
But for me to be able to make a good comparision, I've to nailed down exactly what I can get here and then w/ the figure amount, head over to Tiffany's and see what they have to offer which I'm sure won't be much for $4500. So, if I tag on a 50% premium, that'll put me around $6700. I'll see what I can get for that price.
Thank you all for being so helpful.
Oh yeah, to reply Hest88, I'm sure she'll love a bigger stone but definitely not more than 1ct. Knowing her, she'll be too self-conscious to wear it. I've seen around 0.5-0.6ct on other similar size Asian women (in fact slighly bigger frame than her) and all I can see from maybe 5 ft. away is the stone sticking up their finger. That's why I think around 0.5ct is a good size. Btw, do you have any friends who are not AB(C/K/J/etc). It could be the American culture influence. But that's not to say all of them are like that. But if I ask a question to any women here, which do they prefer. Getting a 0.5ct D/IF stone or a 0.8ct H/VS2 stone? I believe you cannot see the difference in color and inclusion through the naked eye with the two I listed. I suspect a majority will choose the larger stone. I, personally, would choose the 0.5ct because 1) I prefer quality over quantity 2) 0.5ct is not very small in my opinion. Now, if you say choose a 0.5ct D/IF over a 0.8ct F/VVS2, I would have a problem if both are the same price because they are pretty close to each other not to mention these are still small stones. So, the differences are even more minute compared to if they were larger stones.
And Hess, do your group of AC(insert here) friends buy LV/Gucci/Prada etc. That might explain why they think 0.5ct is small.
I live in the Detroit suburbs and I've seen women (co-workers and aquantainces) wearing large diamonds on their finger and they do believe it looks great. But it looks so out of proportion to me. You also see a lot of people wearing 14k chain hanging from their necks or sterling silver. But being Asian, you probably know, no Asian women (if they can afford it) will wear anything less than 18k gold. Most will only wear 22k if not 24k cause their skin get rashes wearing inferior gold.
I wish I can include my gf. in my quest, but I truly want it to be a surprise. I could ask her what size she thinks it is appropriate or maybe what she thinks about Tiffany's but she's too smart and will know what I'm up to.
I bought a HT system last year and I am not an audiophile. My ears aren't sensitive enough to tell me what is good and what's not. Bose sounds good to me, but the more I learned, I realize that Bose woofers are made out of cheap paper cones and some of their speakers do not even have tweeters builtin. The so-called Accoustimass is not even a sub-woofer. And if you sweep from 20hz-20khz, you can hear a drop off because there's a gap bet. what the speakers are capable off and what the sub-woofer is capable of producing.
Why am I bringing this up? Well, Tiffany about the same as Bose. Bose do produce good quality speakers other than the dimunitive speakers that most people are familiar with. But the highest profit margin is made from those who gotta have the little cube speakers. Tiffany to me is the same. Although I haven't been to the store, I believe they do have very very good quality stuff. But because of the name recognition, it will go for more. How else are they going to maintain the fancy store design and all the marketing cost? But because for an uninformed person that I was (still am), buying a relatively inexpensive Tiffany e-ring for $4500 is the same as buying the HT system Bose sells for $3500. I can't tell the difference but because of the name, the majority of people will think it is good. Now, you might ask me why is it important what other people feel? It is not to me, but we live in a real world and people are emotional. If your loved one buys you the same quality ring as one that is sold online but pay 40-50% more because it is fom Tiffany, wouldn't you be happier? Assuming of course he can afford it w/o breaking the bank. All the ladies here who say they don't care for Tiffany, let me ask you this. If your bf. at that time had bought you a 2ct (I sense a lot of people seem to think my 0.5ct is too small) D/FL from Tiffany instead of one from a vendor here, wouldn't you be happier to *show off* your ring to your other girlfriends and every so discreetly mentioning the Tiffany name? Sweet Home Alabama should be banned! They should have shown Reese Witherspoon (ex-)husband calling up one of the vendors here, buying a 0.5ct, ok a 1ct. D/IF ring for $8k and she throws the $50k 2ct. stone back to Tiffany.
To get back on topic. To answer your question aljdewey, I know I cannot get the same ct. same clarity and color from Tiffany. I've to either sacrifice ct or clarity/color.
If I decide to get a 0.5ct H&A E/IF from a vendor here, I might have to settle for a 0.25 ct Good Cut H/VS1 from Tiffanys. Or get a 0.5ct Average Cut I/SI2 from Tiffanys and maybe pay $5000. Sure, it is buying the name. No different from women buying LV bags over Coach.
But for me to be able to make a good comparision, I've to nailed down exactly what I can get here and then w/ the figure amount, head over to Tiffany's and see what they have to offer which I'm sure won't be much for $4500. So, if I tag on a 50% premium, that'll put me around $6700. I'll see what I can get for that price.
Thank you all for being so helpful.
Oh yeah, to reply Hest88, I'm sure she'll love a bigger stone but definitely not more than 1ct. Knowing her, she'll be too self-conscious to wear it. I've seen around 0.5-0.6ct on other similar size Asian women (in fact slighly bigger frame than her) and all I can see from maybe 5 ft. away is the stone sticking up their finger. That's why I think around 0.5ct is a good size. Btw, do you have any friends who are not AB(C/K/J/etc). It could be the American culture influence. But that's not to say all of them are like that. But if I ask a question to any women here, which do they prefer. Getting a 0.5ct D/IF stone or a 0.8ct H/VS2 stone? I believe you cannot see the difference in color and inclusion through the naked eye with the two I listed. I suspect a majority will choose the larger stone. I, personally, would choose the 0.5ct because 1) I prefer quality over quantity 2) 0.5ct is not very small in my opinion. Now, if you say choose a 0.5ct D/IF over a 0.8ct F/VVS2, I would have a problem if both are the same price because they are pretty close to each other not to mention these are still small stones. So, the differences are even more minute compared to if they were larger stones.
And Hess, do your group of AC(insert here) friends buy LV/Gucci/Prada etc. That might explain why they think 0.5ct is small.
I live in the Detroit suburbs and I've seen women (co-workers and aquantainces) wearing large diamonds on their finger and they do believe it looks great. But it looks so out of proportion to me. You also see a lot of people wearing 14k chain hanging from their necks or sterling silver. But being Asian, you probably know, no Asian women (if they can afford it) will wear anything less than 18k gold. Most will only wear 22k if not 24k cause their skin get rashes wearing inferior gold.
I wish I can include my gf. in my quest, but I truly want it to be a surprise. I could ask her what size she thinks it is appropriate or maybe what she thinks about Tiffany's but she's too smart and will know what I'm up to.
fire&ice, if your bf has only $4k to spend (like me), would you rather he gets you a 0.5ct E/IF from an internet vendor here OR he gets you a 0.5ct I/SI2 from Tiffanys? Or a 3rd. choice, get a 0.25ct F/VS2 from Tiffanys?
And yes, I'm being serious. I really want to know because I don't know what my gf will choose.
or #4 from an internet vendor. F/G VS stone in about 3/4 to .80 points. She will LOVE the attention a larger stone attracts. Women love it when people go ga-ga over their rings. It's a passage of life. And, she doesn't wear a sign that says D/IF. The size of the stone is evident. I'm not saying the I/SI is for you. But, in these smaller size stones, color & clarity are harder to see differences between d/if & F(G)/VS. I really believe that you need to involve her some way, especially if you don't know which she would "pick". The men on this board can advise you better on how to go about this. Some of them were quite cleaver in their sneakiness. Others enlisted the aid of her friends & family.
I would go with the best quality (give & take for size) at the best price I can find. PERIOD. It would absolutely make no difference to me where it came from. BUT, I make my living off of my eye. I am perfectly comfortable with the lovely handmade leather purse made by a local craftsman (with no label). I'm very confident with my choices. I am quite picky. In my business, certain names are associated with a certain level of quality. But, it can't be the "final" judge of quality. I am *very* familiar with Tiffany & Co. The name carries a premium. They indeed maintain a level of quality. That very same level can be found elsewhere for less. I would be quite touched by the fact that my to be researched & took time to find my perfect stone. Going into Tiffany's a forking down extra money for less quality/smaller stone seems easier.
Without hesitation & without a doubt, I would go else where w/ a larger stone. I would seriously feel your "to be" out on size. 1/2 carat is small. 4k is a very nice healthy budget. In this size, a G VS stone will look the same. Actually, 3/4 is a nice size.
Curious, how old are you. When I became engaged I was in my early/mid 20's. 3/4 to 1c was the norm for my group. I am middle aged now & still small. My 3c does not look too big on my finger. It would have looked dopey in my 20's. My niece (20) tried my ring on. She has long beautiful fingers. But, once you look up from the fingers, it looked quite silly for her age.
I think this current craze w/ Tiffany's is all about Sweet Home Alabama. I have to ask you this question - *WHO* did Reese end up with? I rest my case.
Good luck. As an aside, I wouldn't tell people that the ring came from Tiffany's. It would seem like bragging.
fire&ice,
You know what? I watched Sweet Home Alabama with my gf. but we didn't finish watching it! So, I don't really know who she ended up with.
Well, I'll be 31 and she'll be 27 this year. So, we are not youngster so to say. Of course I do not expect people to go around saying, look at my Tiffany ring, or my Gucci sunglasses or my LV bag. But when you carry or wear these things, when someone ask you, I'm sure you'll beaming with joy telling them. Someone ask you "Wow, your ring looks so beautiful. It's just gleaming in your eye. Is it a Tiffany?". And you said "Oh, thank you for your compliment. I love my ring and yes, my husband bought it for me from Tiffany's for our 10year anniversary". I can guess what your answer is more or less if it is from a *bad* store like K-Mart of Walmart
I guess you are bent on a larger size diamond thus your choice #4. Hmm.. I might have to get her sister to take her out w/o me tagging along to some jewelry store and see what she setting and size she's comfortable with then. Just that I want this to be bet. me and her, and also hundreds of anonymous people here on the web
You know what? I watched Sweet Home Alabama with my gf. but we didn't finish watching it! So, I don't really know who she ended up with.
Well, I'll be 31 and she'll be 27 this year. So, we are not youngster so to say. Of course I do not expect people to go around saying, look at my Tiffany ring, or my Gucci sunglasses or my LV bag. But when you carry or wear these things, when someone ask you, I'm sure you'll beaming with joy telling them. Someone ask you "Wow, your ring looks so beautiful. It's just gleaming in your eye. Is it a Tiffany?". And you said "Oh, thank you for your compliment. I love my ring and yes, my husband bought it for me from Tiffany's for our 10year anniversary". I can guess what your answer is more or less if it is from a *bad* store like K-Mart of Walmart
I guess you are bent on a larger size diamond thus your choice #4. Hmm.. I might have to get her sister to take her out w/o me tagging along to some jewelry store and see what she setting and size she's comfortable with then. Just that I want this to be bet. me and her, and also hundreds of anonymous people here on the web
Mara
Super_Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Oct 30, 2002
- Messages
- 31,003
This whole topic is so hilarious to me. I love a good brand name...I buy LV, I buy Juicy Couture, I buy Fendi..Prada..etc. I even buy Tiffany (small stuff). But NOT a Tiffany engagement ring. Why you ask? What's the difference?
Here is my logic..call it chick logic, call it whatever you want. But forgive me when I say that a diamond engagement ring is NOTHING remotely even remarkably close to a BOSE speaker system or something similar. Nor is it similar to a pair of $150 jeans vs $25 jeans. The difference is in the quality of the created product. Diamonds are created in the earth....so Tiffany is not enhancing their real value (note I said real and not imagined) by plunking a brand name onto the metal and selling it for 2ce as much. The diamond inside is just the same as if it were bought originally by an internet vendor and sold online for 1/2 the price.
I pay for expensive jeans because they last longer and look better on me than other jeans. I buy expensive purses because I am a purse nut and I just love expensive purses. But AGAIN...I do feel that the quality of an expensive purse is superior over a lower price purse. I have had some of my purses for years and I take very good care of them. Again--they were man-made...and the higher quality in my eyes is real. The stitching is tighter, the material treated, the minute details to me are obvious.
Sure you can say...well the REAL Tiffany setting just looks so much more polished than the fake ones or the replicas. Well great. But what is the heart of the ring? It's the stone. And again that goes back to my point that the diamond, wherever you buy it, already has its real value, its not going to change and/or get more valuable or better quality just because Tiffany sells it.
Oh and to answer Jlims question on what sort of diamond I would want from options 1/2/3..I agree with F&I. I would want the .75c G VS2 stone ACA or H&A unbranded or branded or SuperbCert that have AMAZINGLY stunning pictures posted all over Pscope. My girlfriend got a Tiffany ring...and while I'm very happy for her..I gloat inside because I know *we* were smarter. We didn't buckle under marketing and branding pressure and get a smaller ring or an I/VS because we got suckered in. Would I take a Tiffany ring? Sure if it was FREE..and that means neither of us had to pay for it. Or if we were rich and slept on money...sure. But otherwise? No way. Not when I have seen the quality (and real quality...not imagined) of what you can get online for so much lower priced. I don't even want to buy jewelry in a B&M store anymore. I want to do it all online, custom made all the way baby!! I'm spoiled now...and I think that my little sparkler of a ring with its custom made setting is way more special than the overpriced Tiffany stock, because NO ONE ELSE HAS MY RING. Period.
That's just my two cents..or $10....
Oh and lastly....I would NEVER ask someone if their ring was from Tiffany. It would really just never occur to me. Hardly anyone I know would buy a ring from Tiffany. I have lots of friends who get presents from Tiffany, but they go elsewhere to purchase an e-ring, either online or a family friend or a B&M jeweler they know and trust. I would also be insulted if anyone ever asked me if my ring was Tiffany...rings are very personal and I wouldn't want to make any assumptions about what someone is wearing on their hand. Nor make them feel as though their ring didn't measure up in my eyes because it wasn't ...or even put them in that position to have to say 'No actually we got it at the Maul'.
Here is my logic..call it chick logic, call it whatever you want. But forgive me when I say that a diamond engagement ring is NOTHING remotely even remarkably close to a BOSE speaker system or something similar. Nor is it similar to a pair of $150 jeans vs $25 jeans. The difference is in the quality of the created product. Diamonds are created in the earth....so Tiffany is not enhancing their real value (note I said real and not imagined) by plunking a brand name onto the metal and selling it for 2ce as much. The diamond inside is just the same as if it were bought originally by an internet vendor and sold online for 1/2 the price.
I pay for expensive jeans because they last longer and look better on me than other jeans. I buy expensive purses because I am a purse nut and I just love expensive purses. But AGAIN...I do feel that the quality of an expensive purse is superior over a lower price purse. I have had some of my purses for years and I take very good care of them. Again--they were man-made...and the higher quality in my eyes is real. The stitching is tighter, the material treated, the minute details to me are obvious.
Sure you can say...well the REAL Tiffany setting just looks so much more polished than the fake ones or the replicas. Well great. But what is the heart of the ring? It's the stone. And again that goes back to my point that the diamond, wherever you buy it, already has its real value, its not going to change and/or get more valuable or better quality just because Tiffany sells it.
Oh and to answer Jlims question on what sort of diamond I would want from options 1/2/3..I agree with F&I. I would want the .75c G VS2 stone ACA or H&A unbranded or branded or SuperbCert that have AMAZINGLY stunning pictures posted all over Pscope. My girlfriend got a Tiffany ring...and while I'm very happy for her..I gloat inside because I know *we* were smarter. We didn't buckle under marketing and branding pressure and get a smaller ring or an I/VS because we got suckered in. Would I take a Tiffany ring? Sure if it was FREE..and that means neither of us had to pay for it. Or if we were rich and slept on money...sure. But otherwise? No way. Not when I have seen the quality (and real quality...not imagined) of what you can get online for so much lower priced. I don't even want to buy jewelry in a B&M store anymore. I want to do it all online, custom made all the way baby!! I'm spoiled now...and I think that my little sparkler of a ring with its custom made setting is way more special than the overpriced Tiffany stock, because NO ONE ELSE HAS MY RING. Period.
That's just my two cents..or $10....
Oh and lastly....I would NEVER ask someone if their ring was from Tiffany. It would really just never occur to me. Hardly anyone I know would buy a ring from Tiffany. I have lots of friends who get presents from Tiffany, but they go elsewhere to purchase an e-ring, either online or a family friend or a B&M jeweler they know and trust. I would also be insulted if anyone ever asked me if my ring was Tiffany...rings are very personal and I wouldn't want to make any assumptions about what someone is wearing on their hand. Nor make them feel as though their ring didn't measure up in my eyes because it wasn't ...or even put them in that position to have to say 'No actually we got it at the Maul'.
aljdewey
Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Nov 25, 2002
- Messages
- 9,170
----------------
On 5/1/2003 127:30 PM jlim wrote:
The reason for looking at Tiffany's is because I believe she as well as 90% of the American population will equate Tiffany with quality.
Tiffany to me is the same. Although I haven't been to the store, I believe they do have very very good quality stuff. But because of the name recognition, it will go for more.
Jim, I hear what you're saying, but I respectfully disagree. The appeal of the Tiffany's name is not quality, it is EXCLUSIVITY. Only the ultra-rich can afford to shop there, and people who purchase at Tiffany's are purchasing the status of the name. True, Tiffany's does carry very good quality merchandise, but the quality does not surpass that of other vendors (brick and mortar or internet) that carry ideal/superideal-cut stones. Tiffany's suppliers are the same suppliers who deal other vendors.
Moreover, Tiffany's doesn't even provide documentation to support the contention of top-quality. They provide no documentation regarding crown/pav angles, and in fact don't provide certs AT ALL on diamonds less than 1 ct. What that means is, you have no way to verify to exactness of the cut or the quality of the grading. So, it is entirely possible to buy an average cut diamond from TIFFANY'S and it will actually be inferior in quality to a super-ideal diamond backed by reputable documentation from Goodoldgold, Whiteflash, Nice Ice, etc.... In short, you can't even prove that you're getting the "quality" that you're paying more for.
So, the question becomes, do you want to truly purchase quality or do you want to purchase the ILLUSION of quality. That's your choice, and only you can make it. You say you care about getting the highest quality (even if it cannot be seen by the eye), and you note that many in your culture won't wear inferior quality jewelry. If you really mean that, I have a hard time understanding how you can purchase at Tiffany's and sacrifice the very thing you say is important.
Bottom line: on a fixed budget, only one of these statements can be true. A) Status is the MOST important factor to you, and if this is true, then you should buy what you can afford within your budget at Tiffany's even if you take a hit on quality. B) Quality really is the MOST important factor to you, in which case, you'll buy the best-cut ring within your budget from one of the REPUTABLE vendors (brick/mortar or online). In order to stay within budget, one must be more important then the other.
True your girlfriend can SAY it's from Tiffany's. Big deal. I guarantee you that if the diamond doesn't sparkle because it isn't excellently cut, it won't get the kind of raves that another woman's well-cut diamond will.
If I decide to get a 0.5ct H&A E/IF from a vendor here, I might have to settle for a 0.25 ct Good Cut H/VS1 from Tiffanys. Or get a 0.5ct Average Cut I/SI2 from Tiffanys and maybe pay $5000. Sure, it is buying the name. No different from women buying LV bags over Coach.
****
fire&ice, if your bf has only $4k to spend (like me), would you rather he gets you a 0.5ct E/IF from an internet vendor here OR he gets you a 0.5ct I/SI2 from Tiffanys? Or a 3rd. choice, get a 0.25ct F/VS2 from Tiffanys?
And yes, I'm being serious. I really want to know because I don't know what my gf will choose.----------------
You said you really want to know, so here it is. I would rather receive the .5 E/IF stone from the internet vendor. Source isn't as important as quality to me. You mistakenly assume that buying from the internet means buying "cheap or discount"....nothing could be further from the truth. In fact, quite the opposite is true. There are more quality stones to select from on the net than any other place. If you really want the best, this is place to get it, and several people have shared that with you.
jlim,
Please come here in Canada and you'll discover that the name
Tiffany is pretty unknown here... Birks is our canadian Tiff type of store.
You have to know something... Tiffany's diamonds are EXACTLY
the same diamonds coming from the earth.... mined maybe by debeers
then cut then sold to importers, etc....
same thing... no way different.... only difference : the NAME. quality difference ? NO nothing.. no difference.... so why buy Tiffany
when YOU feel that you have to SACRIFICE color or clarity???
it makes no sense for me.... go get that H VS 3/4 ct for the
same amount of money... you'll be more than happy.
I'm not saying that 0.5ct is too small... but I see that you're
trying to buy good quality stuff.... believe me, there's good
stuff and excellent jewellers out there not working for tiffany!
Trichrome.
Please come here in Canada and you'll discover that the name
Tiffany is pretty unknown here... Birks is our canadian Tiff type of store.
You have to know something... Tiffany's diamonds are EXACTLY
the same diamonds coming from the earth.... mined maybe by debeers
then cut then sold to importers, etc....
same thing... no way different.... only difference : the NAME. quality difference ? NO nothing.. no difference.... so why buy Tiffany
when YOU feel that you have to SACRIFICE color or clarity???
it makes no sense for me.... go get that H VS 3/4 ct for the
same amount of money... you'll be more than happy.
I'm not saying that 0.5ct is too small... but I see that you're
trying to buy good quality stuff.... believe me, there's good
stuff and excellent jewellers out there not working for tiffany!
Trichrome.
Looks like I'm not getting any real work done here at work if this keeps going
aljdewey, you don't have to convince me. I'm more than happy to buy a 0.5ct E/IF that I found. Actually 0.58ct. BUT (always a BUT right) I care about my gf. w/o asking her directly, I cannot assume what I like is what she likes. But I'm sure since she's as uninformed as me (well, I'm slightly more informed now), she *might* prefer a Tiffany ring coz' of _____ (insert all other reasons here). That's why I'm not ruling out buying from Tiffany. If I just go with what I want, I will buy the absolute best diamond out there (quality wise) and worry about the ct. size last. So, if it is a D/FL 0.3 ct for $4k, I might just buy it because it is flawless.
And Mara, I assume you are a woman. Well, you got to understand the point of view of the man. We see buying a diamond ring almost as useful as buying a snow blower in Texas. We do not care about diamonds. Ok, not all man, but a majority. We rather buy good quality speakers, HT systems, cars, electronics, gadgets, watches etc. If it were me, I'll buy her (and myself) a Omega watch instead. Mechanical one at that that will cost me $400 to be serviced every 3 years.
Buying speakers is like buying diamond. Bose name is well known but it is not as good as B&W speakers for example (for mass market comparision). You were comparing the heart of the ring, which is the diamond and it is the same as another vendor out there. The heart of a HT system boils down to a couple pieces of wood, paper, cloth, aluminum for speakers and a bunch of electronics for the amplifier. It is all the same components. How it is put together and marketed is what makes a company like Bose succeed. It is easier to distinguish diamond coz' of the 4c. It is harder to distinguish electronics and engineering.
Maybe here's a better example. When you buy the same specs computer from 2 different companies, why does 1 perform better than the other? Same CPU, same amount of RAM, same motherboard etc. Back in the days, why do IBM computers cost more than the rest of the world? Why is it now, Dell and Gateway cost slightly more than the other not so well known computers. They use the exact same parts made or assembled in Taiwan and China. But do you buy the Dell/Gateway or do you buy Tiger or some other funny brand?
I know this is going wayyyy off-topic. No one has to convince me that the diamond I'm buying from Tiffany for the same price is inferior. I know that. If it all depends on me, and all I care about is what I do, I'll just buy the 0.58 E/IF a vendor directed me to and be done with it.
Let me share my speaker buying experience with you. I know I didn't want Bose. So, I was looking at KEF, DefTech and another company. No B&W coz' like her I wanted small speakers as well. We ended up going for KEF coz' her criteria was, no square looking speakers. It may be hard for some of you ladies to accept but most men care more about some little $10 led light thingy from Sharper Image compared to a diamond ring.
Don't let me bring up comparing Monster Cable products (speaker wires, component video cables etc.). It'll just open up another can of worms. For the record, Monster Cable to me is like gold plated lawn mower. I tried a $40, $80 and $150 3m. component video cable. I'll let you guess which one I kept.
And find me 1 lady in this forum who give a hoot what cable is running bet. the speakers and receiver in the HT system.
And Mara, you are telling me a $600 LV handbag will last longer than a $300 Coach bag or a $50 Esprit bag?? It probably will cause you do not use it as often and you probably care for it more.
But LV bags to me looks cheap. Simply because their design are copied more than others and their leather, frankly speaking, looks a lot like vinyl, feels like vinyl and other than a shade of color difference and poor stitching, looks like a $5 one that could be bought from Asia. Imitation of course. Unlike in US, where a fake LV purse, say for $400 actually sells for $100-$200 in US. I've compared the fake $5 from Asia to the real thing for about $350 and the color was off a shade and the zipper is different. But if I close my eyes and touch the leather of the LV, it feels the same as the vinyl of the imitation.
aljdewey, you don't have to convince me. I'm more than happy to buy a 0.5ct E/IF that I found. Actually 0.58ct. BUT (always a BUT right) I care about my gf. w/o asking her directly, I cannot assume what I like is what she likes. But I'm sure since she's as uninformed as me (well, I'm slightly more informed now), she *might* prefer a Tiffany ring coz' of _____ (insert all other reasons here). That's why I'm not ruling out buying from Tiffany. If I just go with what I want, I will buy the absolute best diamond out there (quality wise) and worry about the ct. size last. So, if it is a D/FL 0.3 ct for $4k, I might just buy it because it is flawless.
And Mara, I assume you are a woman. Well, you got to understand the point of view of the man. We see buying a diamond ring almost as useful as buying a snow blower in Texas. We do not care about diamonds. Ok, not all man, but a majority. We rather buy good quality speakers, HT systems, cars, electronics, gadgets, watches etc. If it were me, I'll buy her (and myself) a Omega watch instead. Mechanical one at that that will cost me $400 to be serviced every 3 years.
Buying speakers is like buying diamond. Bose name is well known but it is not as good as B&W speakers for example (for mass market comparision). You were comparing the heart of the ring, which is the diamond and it is the same as another vendor out there. The heart of a HT system boils down to a couple pieces of wood, paper, cloth, aluminum for speakers and a bunch of electronics for the amplifier. It is all the same components. How it is put together and marketed is what makes a company like Bose succeed. It is easier to distinguish diamond coz' of the 4c. It is harder to distinguish electronics and engineering.
Maybe here's a better example. When you buy the same specs computer from 2 different companies, why does 1 perform better than the other? Same CPU, same amount of RAM, same motherboard etc. Back in the days, why do IBM computers cost more than the rest of the world? Why is it now, Dell and Gateway cost slightly more than the other not so well known computers. They use the exact same parts made or assembled in Taiwan and China. But do you buy the Dell/Gateway or do you buy Tiger or some other funny brand?
I know this is going wayyyy off-topic. No one has to convince me that the diamond I'm buying from Tiffany for the same price is inferior. I know that. If it all depends on me, and all I care about is what I do, I'll just buy the 0.58 E/IF a vendor directed me to and be done with it.
Let me share my speaker buying experience with you. I know I didn't want Bose. So, I was looking at KEF, DefTech and another company. No B&W coz' like her I wanted small speakers as well. We ended up going for KEF coz' her criteria was, no square looking speakers. It may be hard for some of you ladies to accept but most men care more about some little $10 led light thingy from Sharper Image compared to a diamond ring.
Don't let me bring up comparing Monster Cable products (speaker wires, component video cables etc.). It'll just open up another can of worms. For the record, Monster Cable to me is like gold plated lawn mower. I tried a $40, $80 and $150 3m. component video cable. I'll let you guess which one I kept.
And find me 1 lady in this forum who give a hoot what cable is running bet. the speakers and receiver in the HT system.
And Mara, you are telling me a $600 LV handbag will last longer than a $300 Coach bag or a $50 Esprit bag?? It probably will cause you do not use it as often and you probably care for it more.
But LV bags to me looks cheap. Simply because their design are copied more than others and their leather, frankly speaking, looks a lot like vinyl, feels like vinyl and other than a shade of color difference and poor stitching, looks like a $5 one that could be bought from Asia. Imitation of course. Unlike in US, where a fake LV purse, say for $400 actually sells for $100-$200 in US. I've compared the fake $5 from Asia to the real thing for about $350 and the color was off a shade and the zipper is different. But if I close my eyes and touch the leather of the LV, it feels the same as the vinyl of the imitation.
----------------
On 5/1/2003 1:34:58 PM jlim wrote:
fire&ice, But when you carry or wear these things, when someone ask you, I'm sure you'll beaming with joy telling them. Someone ask you "Wow, your ring looks so beautiful. It's just gleaming in your eye. Is it a Tiffany?". And you said "Oh, thank you for your compliment. I love my ring and yes, my husband bought it for me from Tiffany's for our 10year anniversary". I can guess what your answer is more or less if it is from a *bad* store like K-Mart of Walmart
----------------
As someone already mentioned, no one is going to ask if it came from Tiffany's. I have never been asked where my stones have come from except from people in the market. I have yet to be asked what the specs are on my 3c stone. I was never asked the specs on my .70 or my other stone for that matter. I have been asked on all three - What size is it?
As you can probably guess, Reese was not sporting that Tiffany ring at the end of the show.
I think going w/ her sister is a good idea - just make sure she has her sister's interest best in heart. If she is the same size - great. Go look at rings/stones. Shrinkage will happen real quick.
Let's say there is a room full of women. One women shows her 1/2 carat very nice stone. This women exclaims it's from Tiffany's. Ohhss & Aahhs abound. Another women walks in the group recently engaged. She is sporting a one carat equally as nice (perhaps even better) stone. Do you think *any* women would say BUT her smaller stone is from Tiffany's. I would be absolutely be more impressed w/ the larger stone. I now know how pricey Tiffany rings are from this forum. Before this forum, I would assume the 1c was more expensive.
POLL. Which women in the room would you like to be? The .50 Tiffany women or the 1.00 non Tiffany women? Saying that the stones are indeed apples to apples. As someone mentioned, Tiffany does not cut their own stones. They buy from the same vendors as the net.
Geez, I must be a geeky old women - what is L/V?
aljdewey
Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Nov 25, 2002
- Messages
- 9,170
Jim: There is the crux of it. You aren't 100% sure what she wants, but you don't want to ask her.
Let me suggest this: go with what nearly every woman on this board has told you, and get the absolute best color/clarity you can get within your budget at the .75 carat range. It will be notable but still modest. Get it from wherever you feel most comfortable buying....I'd highly recommend goodoldgold, whiteflash, superbcert, niceice....all have exceptional reputations for QUALITY. You seem to like the 4-prong, so go with that. If she'd rather have the 6-prong, that's a minor alteration that any jeweler can make for you after the fact.
Most importantly, you CAN make sure she likes her ring without having to ask up front in this way: make your purchase from someplace with a generous (30-day) return policy. When you present the ring to her, tell her that you didn't want to ask her preferences up front and ruin the surprise, so you choose based on what you thought she'd like most (and with input from 20+ other women!), but that you want her to be happy and if it isn't what she would have selected, it's okay to return it and pick something she wants.
My prediction: she'll be bowled over by the proposal, she'll LOVE the ring, and she won't want to return it.
Good luck.
fire&ice - LV = Louis Vuitton.
I was thinking getting her sister to go out with her and report back to me
Not me and her sister going out to shop. If that's the case, I'm pretty sure I'll end up at Tiffany's getting the same carat, same quality etc. except my wallet will be 40-50% lighter.
I like your question. But if I may modify your question a little.
I assume the majority of the people outside are not as well informed as the ones here. I only know of the 4c before I came here and was least knowledgeable about cut.
So, if I may, can I ask this question. Ladies, do you prefer a 0.5ct Tiffany e-ring OR a 1.0 ct. K-Mart ring.
I know you probably disagree with my choice of K-Mart. So, maybe we can make up some name of a non-existence vendor or use some of the vendor names here. good old gold, superbcert, whiteflash etc. But when you judge, please please remind yourself that you are the average consumer and you do not know about this site nor the vendors mentioned above.
aljdewey, unfortunately the vendors here only have a 10 day return policy unless I go with Mondera or BlueNile. Also, I believe the 10day return policy vendors, if I have the diamond set in a ring (I'm planning on at least getting a Vatche since it too is brandname), that price is non-refundable and the ring cost $950.
Isn't it ironic we condemn Tiffany for their high price but some of us are willing to shell out at least $950 to get a Vatche ring. *gasps*, could it be the inferior diamond from Tiffany with a superior setting (as some pointed out the classic tiffany setting still looks the best coming from Tiffany rather than a copy), service and reputation commands a higher price?
Oh yeah, am I sensing most ladies are telling me a 0.5ct (I might get either a 0.58-0.66) is too small then?
I was thinking getting her sister to go out with her and report back to me
I like your question. But if I may modify your question a little.
I assume the majority of the people outside are not as well informed as the ones here. I only know of the 4c before I came here and was least knowledgeable about cut.
So, if I may, can I ask this question. Ladies, do you prefer a 0.5ct Tiffany e-ring OR a 1.0 ct. K-Mart ring.
I know you probably disagree with my choice of K-Mart. So, maybe we can make up some name of a non-existence vendor or use some of the vendor names here. good old gold, superbcert, whiteflash etc. But when you judge, please please remind yourself that you are the average consumer and you do not know about this site nor the vendors mentioned above.
aljdewey, unfortunately the vendors here only have a 10 day return policy unless I go with Mondera or BlueNile. Also, I believe the 10day return policy vendors, if I have the diamond set in a ring (I'm planning on at least getting a Vatche since it too is brandname), that price is non-refundable and the ring cost $950.
Isn't it ironic we condemn Tiffany for their high price but some of us are willing to shell out at least $950 to get a Vatche ring. *gasps*, could it be the inferior diamond from Tiffany with a superior setting (as some pointed out the classic tiffany setting still looks the best coming from Tiffany rather than a copy), service and reputation commands a higher price?
Oh yeah, am I sensing most ladies are telling me a 0.5ct (I might get either a 0.58-0.66) is too small then?
aljdewey
Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Nov 25, 2002
- Messages
- 9,170
Jim.....first, see the reply I left on your Price Stat question.
Second: You keep bringing up Kmart and discount vs. Tiffany's. You are dealing in extremes. No, I wouldn't want a 1.0 carat diamond if it's a piece of crap. If the only diamond vendors were Tiffany's or Kmart, then I'd absolutely want Tiffany because the quality is CLEARLY SUPERIOR.
BUT....there's a HUGE MIDDLE RANGE between your two extremes. There are vendors out there who sell exceptional quality stones (which are the SAME STONES sold to Tiffany!!!).
Maybe it will make more sense to you this way: if you take a pair of designer jeans...say Calvin Klein....and rip the label off, did the quality of the jeans just go down? No. They are still made of the same material and workmanship as they were just before you removed the label. Only now, you can buy them for $20 less because they don't say Calvin Klein. In that instance, I WANT THE ONES WITHOUT THE LABEL!
You keep asking everyone to tell you which they'd prefer (the smaller Tiffany or the larger EXCELLENT quality non-Tiffany). Everyone keeps telling you the same thing....the non-Tiffany. No matter how many times you ask, you are going to keep getting the same answer....the non-Tiffany. You can either ignore that or go with it, but there is no way anyone can give you more advice than you've already been given.
Good luck.
Hest88
Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Jan 22, 2003
- Messages
- 4,357
Well, I know my older female relatives well enough (most of whom can barely speak English), and they're bowled over by sparkle, not by qualities that they can't see. Would they choose a smaller, sparkier stone over a larger dull stone? Yep. Would they choose a smaller sparkly IF stone over a larger sparkley VS2. Nope.
But see, here's the real crux of the issue. Do you care more about what you want or what she may want. I knew a guy who thought this Porsche was really cool so he bought one for his wife. She hated it because it was completely impractical with two kids--she'd wanted a sedan--but she was forced to drive it. But that's the way some guys think: if I think it's cool it must be cool and since I know better than she does what cool is she'll just have to like it.
I know you want it to be a surprise. The way some guys have done it is ask their GF's sisters or friends or moms to ask the GF and report back. Your GF *may* want that blue box above all else; she *may* want a .5--the point is, is it more important that you hold on to your abstract principle of quality or that you give her the rings of her wildest dreams? Don't risk making a $4000 mistake. Find out what she wants, or find out as much as you can, then go make your purchase.
Fortunately this will be my last post for the day.
Let me use this analogy. Hardly any designer makes mass-market clothes anymore.
Say you know for a fact a factory (diamond mine) in China (South Africa) produces jeans (diamonds). Based on who buys it from them, the design (diamond cut) is slightly different and the label (ring setting) is obviously different. Now, say the one jeans (diamond ring) ends up in an upscale mall or boutique (Tiffany) and the other pair of jeans ends up at Costco/Kirkland brand (insert your internet vendor here). The pair of jeans in Costco cost $20 where as the one in a upscale mall/boutique cost $80. Which one do you buy?
The situation you presented is very different. I could buy $25 CK jeans or $15 or so Kirkland brand (Kirkland is Costco storebrand) at Costco every single day of the year compared to $60 in the mall. I can buy my favorite Omega watch in Costco for $1300 compared to $2000 in the mall store. In that case, of course I'll buy from Costco.
However, I digress. Your argument has a merit because the diamond and the ring can be separated. It is not like I can take the movement from a Timex watch and put it into an Omega.
Ok, the general consensus is stay away from Tiffany and get around 0.75ct.
Now, let me find www.ilovetiffany.com forum
Just kidding of course
Let me use this analogy. Hardly any designer makes mass-market clothes anymore.
Say you know for a fact a factory (diamond mine) in China (South Africa) produces jeans (diamonds). Based on who buys it from them, the design (diamond cut) is slightly different and the label (ring setting) is obviously different. Now, say the one jeans (diamond ring) ends up in an upscale mall or boutique (Tiffany) and the other pair of jeans ends up at Costco/Kirkland brand (insert your internet vendor here). The pair of jeans in Costco cost $20 where as the one in a upscale mall/boutique cost $80. Which one do you buy?
The situation you presented is very different. I could buy $25 CK jeans or $15 or so Kirkland brand (Kirkland is Costco storebrand) at Costco every single day of the year compared to $60 in the mall. I can buy my favorite Omega watch in Costco for $1300 compared to $2000 in the mall store. In that case, of course I'll buy from Costco.
However, I digress. Your argument has a merit because the diamond and the ring can be separated. It is not like I can take the movement from a Timex watch and put it into an Omega.
Ok, the general consensus is stay away from Tiffany and get around 0.75ct.
Now, let me find www.ilovetiffany.com forum
Hest88
Ideal_Rock
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- Jan 22, 2003
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- 4,357
Expand your horizons.
Anyway, here's what some of us are talking about. 0.75, Ideal cut, sparkly as hell, within your price range, and, because of all the measurements he's providing, not even the rock bottom of what you could pay.
http://www.goodoldgold.com/0_751ct_e_vs2_h&a.htm
Or here, same guy, larger stone, lower color (but probably no one could tell the difference), also sparkly as hell.
http://www.goodoldgold.com/0_78ct_h_vs1_h&a.htm
Anyway, here's what some of us are talking about. 0.75, Ideal cut, sparkly as hell, within your price range, and, because of all the measurements he's providing, not even the rock bottom of what you could pay.
http://www.goodoldgold.com/0_751ct_e_vs2_h&a.htm
Or here, same guy, larger stone, lower color (but probably no one could tell the difference), also sparkly as hell.
http://www.goodoldgold.com/0_78ct_h_vs1_h&a.htm
I had to second that. You keep asking the question. We keep telling you what we think. Given the choice of Tiffany vs non-Tiffany provided the stones were equal & the same size. I think you may have an argument there. But, the price is not the same - not even in the same ball park. We have all stated - as fact - that many diamonds on the net are equal if not better quality than Tiffany stones. Given the choice between a Tiffany 1/2c stone & a non-Tiffany equal quality stone of 3/4c to 1c. That is a no-brainer. *This* is the choice.
The "Tiffany" stone would not make up the fact of 1/2 over 1c.
I can assure you that the best stones are *not* set aside for Tiffany. Quite frankly, I would put more stock in someone who hand picks/cherry picks each & every stone that *they* buy & represent - not some big dopey conglomerate like Tiffany's.
As I stated, before coming to this forum, my unknowledgeable mind would have thought the bigger stone would have definitely been more expensive than than a 1/2c from Tiffany's. It is only through this forum that I realize how ridiculously overpriced Tiffany is.
Tiffany sources are the same sources that many of these vendor have access to. They are not sent the *best* stones.
Let me ask you this question.
Let's say store x sells Bose speaker model 123.
Store y sells Bose speaker model 123.
Store x has a more recognizable name & has a rep for selling higher end model speakers. They have plenty of employees that can help you. They offer this same model 123 speaker at $4000.00
Store y is smaller & has less overhead. They offer model 123 at $2000.00. In speaking w/ the very knowledgable store owner (who is the one helping you make your selection), he can get you the 456 model (w/ bigger woofer - greater sound - and the model everyone's been talking about) at $4000.00.
Would you still choose to purchase at Store x? BTW, if you decide on the 456 model Store x's price is at $8000.00.
Knock yourself out if you still choose to purchase from Store x. Me, I'll either pocket the extra 2000.00 or trade up to the better/bigger model at 4k. Then, I will have the better stero than you.
Geez, can't guys get beyond the stereo thing?
I have been reading this thread and will throw in my 2c since everyone else has.
I will be celebrating 20 years this June and I do not think my diamond purchase of so many years ago had a whole lot of influence. When I decide to ask LOML to marry I was pretty much dirt poor but I scraped (and borrowed) all that I could afford and bought a Tiffany "style" mounted (trying to remember here).27ct VS1 and I color engagement ring. I must have gotten lucky because it still sparkles nicely today! Anyway, she loves the ring because she knows I sacrificed a lot for it. I know she would like it to be larger but it is very meaningful to her. I also know she does not want to "exchange it" for a larger one. So I am going to give her an anniversary ring for her right hand. After all these years I am still not very wealthy so once again I am going to have to work within a budget. (at least it is a bigger now) My first stop was Tiffany's. Wow, a real, honest to goodness "Tiffany" ring would be something. They had beautiful rings...but I was dissappointed on what I could afford. Then I found this place, compared what I had found at Tifs and started thinking I could "do better". So now what I am going to do is select my own diamonds, in the quality I want, and get much larger total cts and much more "fire" for the same budget. I also am working with a local jeweler who is designing a custom setting with me. Something that will be one of a kind and personal. I know she will love it, no matter what the size of diamonds, because she will know it came from my heart. Just like the little engagement ring twenty years ago.
I will be celebrating 20 years this June and I do not think my diamond purchase of so many years ago had a whole lot of influence. When I decide to ask LOML to marry I was pretty much dirt poor but I scraped (and borrowed) all that I could afford and bought a Tiffany "style" mounted (trying to remember here).27ct VS1 and I color engagement ring. I must have gotten lucky because it still sparkles nicely today! Anyway, she loves the ring because she knows I sacrificed a lot for it. I know she would like it to be larger but it is very meaningful to her. I also know she does not want to "exchange it" for a larger one. So I am going to give her an anniversary ring for her right hand. After all these years I am still not very wealthy so once again I am going to have to work within a budget. (at least it is a bigger now) My first stop was Tiffany's. Wow, a real, honest to goodness "Tiffany" ring would be something. They had beautiful rings...but I was dissappointed on what I could afford. Then I found this place, compared what I had found at Tifs and started thinking I could "do better". So now what I am going to do is select my own diamonds, in the quality I want, and get much larger total cts and much more "fire" for the same budget. I also am working with a local jeweler who is designing a custom setting with me. Something that will be one of a kind and personal. I know she will love it, no matter what the size of diamonds, because she will know it came from my heart. Just like the little engagement ring twenty years ago.
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On 4/30/2003 65:57 PM jlim wrote:
I'm of Asian heritage. I value quality over quantity so to speak. For the same price, I would get a higher quality stone over a larger stone EVEN IF you can't tell the difference bet. a D/E/F & IF/VVS1/VVS2 over a G/H & VS1/VS2 through the naked eye. Maybe it is a cultural thing.
---
So am I. But I value both. "Ying-Yang", baby.
I believe quality does not necessarily have to do with the brand.
So maybe it's not a cultural thing. Let the gal decide!
On 4/30/2003 65:57 PM jlim wrote:
I'm of Asian heritage. I value quality over quantity so to speak. For the same price, I would get a higher quality stone over a larger stone EVEN IF you can't tell the difference bet. a D/E/F & IF/VVS1/VVS2 over a G/H & VS1/VS2 through the naked eye. Maybe it is a cultural thing.
---
So am I. But I value both. "Ying-Yang", baby.
I believe quality does not necessarily have to do with the brand.
So maybe it's not a cultural thing. Let the gal decide!
Hest88
Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Jan 22, 2003
- Messages
- 4,357
Ah Dave. That's so sweet. Your wife is a lucky woman, upgrade or no upgrade.
I knew a high level corporate executive who still wore her engagement ring 30 years later. It was, as I recall, something like .2 carats. I always thought it was the loveliest thing because she could look at the little chip of a stone and think about how far they'd come together.
I knew a high level corporate executive who still wore her engagement ring 30 years later. It was, as I recall, something like .2 carats. I always thought it was the loveliest thing because she could look at the little chip of a stone and think about how far they'd come together.
Mara
Super_Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Oct 30, 2002
- Messages
- 31,003
F&I...the speaker thing..the cable thing..the car thing...the every-other-excuse-known...lets all get beyond it.
The bottom line here is that almost none of us will tell you Tiffany. Almost none of us will tell you KMart. What we will tell you is...Don't be a sucker for marketing.
You say that you know that the stones are the same...that the average joe appreciates Tiffany over Kmart. Sure of course..I agree. You tell us to think like the average consumer who knows nothing, and then take a choice. Why should we have to pretend? None of us on here are the average consumers...NOR ARE YOU. So you can't hide behind the ignorance of others, when what really matters is how you are making this choice. Who cares what the countless scores of other people who see your girlfriend's ring are going to think or ask about. Are you buying this because you want your girlfriend to be able to say to that 1 person out of 1000 that its a Tiffany ring? Or are you buying it to get the best possible diamond and ring possible without breaking your budget? It sounds to me like you have your priorities influx right now. You really don't remotely know what you want. Because if you want a Tiffany ring, you do not want the best possible ring ever. The two don't equal each other, regardless of the branding or the brainwashing, or the Sweet Home Alabama movie or WHATEVER.
All of these comparisons to cars, cables, jeans, etc really don't mean much. The bottom line here is that this stone in this ring you plan to purchase is the SAME stone whether its sold by Tiffany or another vendor. The difference IS the markup. The difference is also in the setting. Now is that 6 prong setting worth enough to you? It may be and if that is the case, we have no argument here. I totally agree. But that isn't what you are saying. All of your posts are...I think this is what my girlfriend wants vs. this is what I would want to get her.
Here are the facts:
--You don't know what your girlfriend wants, you are only assuming
--You think a .5c stone would look very nice on her tiny hand
--You think that a Tiffany stone of .25c D/IF may be of a higher value to your girlfriend than a .75 G/VS stone
--You know what you would do with the money if you didn't have to buy a ring (speakers/stereo/cables/omega)
How does any of this equal priorities set in place or even an inkling of which direction you are going in? Have you even seen any stones in person yet? If not, you are wasting everyone's time with this discussion. Things start to solidify in your mind as you start to look at stone after stone and website after website. You have only just begun this search it sounds like. It may take months for you to complete it to your satisfaction. Or long enough to walk into Tiffany like a typical ignorant consumer, plunk down the Amex Gold and say...take me for all I am worth.
BTW I think that the monogram LV bags ARE vinyl backed with leather. Precisely why my FI will not ever buy one for me...he refuses to pay $$ for vinyl bags. Hee. Oh and yes the $300 LV bag will last longer than the $50 Esprit purse, I've tried it. AND I do wear my LV bags all the time, as in daily for a year at a time (I get attached). You'd be amazed at how well vinyl backed leather holds up. And LV also guarantees their bags for life. So if something happens to it, I take it in and they fix it. Kinda worth the extra $$, can't tell you how many cheaper bags I've had fall apart on me--I'm not a delicate girl. Difference between a $600 LV bag and a $300 Coach? None..they are both pretty high quality.
The bottom line here is that almost none of us will tell you Tiffany. Almost none of us will tell you KMart. What we will tell you is...Don't be a sucker for marketing.
You say that you know that the stones are the same...that the average joe appreciates Tiffany over Kmart. Sure of course..I agree. You tell us to think like the average consumer who knows nothing, and then take a choice. Why should we have to pretend? None of us on here are the average consumers...NOR ARE YOU. So you can't hide behind the ignorance of others, when what really matters is how you are making this choice. Who cares what the countless scores of other people who see your girlfriend's ring are going to think or ask about. Are you buying this because you want your girlfriend to be able to say to that 1 person out of 1000 that its a Tiffany ring? Or are you buying it to get the best possible diamond and ring possible without breaking your budget? It sounds to me like you have your priorities influx right now. You really don't remotely know what you want. Because if you want a Tiffany ring, you do not want the best possible ring ever. The two don't equal each other, regardless of the branding or the brainwashing, or the Sweet Home Alabama movie or WHATEVER.
All of these comparisons to cars, cables, jeans, etc really don't mean much. The bottom line here is that this stone in this ring you plan to purchase is the SAME stone whether its sold by Tiffany or another vendor. The difference IS the markup. The difference is also in the setting. Now is that 6 prong setting worth enough to you? It may be and if that is the case, we have no argument here. I totally agree. But that isn't what you are saying. All of your posts are...I think this is what my girlfriend wants vs. this is what I would want to get her.
Here are the facts:
--You don't know what your girlfriend wants, you are only assuming
--You think a .5c stone would look very nice on her tiny hand
--You think that a Tiffany stone of .25c D/IF may be of a higher value to your girlfriend than a .75 G/VS stone
--You know what you would do with the money if you didn't have to buy a ring (speakers/stereo/cables/omega)
How does any of this equal priorities set in place or even an inkling of which direction you are going in? Have you even seen any stones in person yet? If not, you are wasting everyone's time with this discussion. Things start to solidify in your mind as you start to look at stone after stone and website after website. You have only just begun this search it sounds like. It may take months for you to complete it to your satisfaction. Or long enough to walk into Tiffany like a typical ignorant consumer, plunk down the Amex Gold and say...take me for all I am worth.
BTW I think that the monogram LV bags ARE vinyl backed with leather. Precisely why my FI will not ever buy one for me...he refuses to pay $$ for vinyl bags. Hee. Oh and yes the $300 LV bag will last longer than the $50 Esprit purse, I've tried it. AND I do wear my LV bags all the time, as in daily for a year at a time (I get attached). You'd be amazed at how well vinyl backed leather holds up. And LV also guarantees their bags for life. So if something happens to it, I take it in and they fix it. Kinda worth the extra $$, can't tell you how many cheaper bags I've had fall apart on me--I'm not a delicate girl. Difference between a $600 LV bag and a $300 Coach? None..they are both pretty high quality.
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On 5/1/2003 44:12 PM djgaloot wrote:
I also am working with a local jeweler who is designing a custom setting with me. Something that will be one of a kind and personal. I know she will love it, no matter what the size of diamonds, because she will know it came from my heart. Just like the little engagement ring twenty years ago.
----------------
Wooooooow! Now's THAT'S what it all means!
Mara, you are just such a sweetie, and right on the mark! Sure remind me of a girlfriend I have in the Bay area (she is also in the Marketing field).
You know, I leave for a day and re-discover the 'TOPIC THAT WOULD NOT DIE'. Heeeee. I just loved reading all of the posts. But I do so much agree with all of the women on this one, especially Mara's last post.
I really does seem that we all stick together on the quality of the stone part over the 'Brand name - status symbol' part of it. As far as the setting, I think that a lot of us love the DVatche setting for its pure simple lines, as well as the real Tiffany setting, not for the brand name again.
Since my stone was quite pricey, I guess I don't shudder quite as much at setting prices...but I always seem to prefer custom work, cause I am soooo very picky. That's one of the reasons I upgraded from the 1.50 J SI2 (eyeclean, mediocre cut) to 1.90 F VS2 (very well cut). To my annoyance, it doesn't look any whiter, no matter how I turn it, but the sparkle now just blinds me!!!
I did go into Tiffany's (Bellagio in Las Vegas) two weeks ago to see how it compared, and it did better than most of their stones (yay, haha), and I was not subtle about trying them on the same finger next to each other. One of the hoity-toity salesladies actually asked which designer had made my ring.
My $2, again.
You know, I leave for a day and re-discover the 'TOPIC THAT WOULD NOT DIE'. Heeeee. I just loved reading all of the posts. But I do so much agree with all of the women on this one, especially Mara's last post.
I really does seem that we all stick together on the quality of the stone part over the 'Brand name - status symbol' part of it. As far as the setting, I think that a lot of us love the DVatche setting for its pure simple lines, as well as the real Tiffany setting, not for the brand name again.
Since my stone was quite pricey, I guess I don't shudder quite as much at setting prices...but I always seem to prefer custom work, cause I am soooo very picky. That's one of the reasons I upgraded from the 1.50 J SI2 (eyeclean, mediocre cut) to 1.90 F VS2 (very well cut). To my annoyance, it doesn't look any whiter, no matter how I turn it, but the sparkle now just blinds me!!!
I did go into Tiffany's (Bellagio in Las Vegas) two weeks ago to see how it compared, and it did better than most of their stones (yay, haha), and I was not subtle about trying them on the same finger next to each other. One of the hoity-toity salesladies actually asked which designer had made my ring.
My $2, again.
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