HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be G/H

[TXNewbie]

As a newbie, I thought you could get great deals on diamonds....turns out, you really can't and the diamond represented to be a steal of a deal G/H turned out to be an M color per the GIA grading report we got AFTER the fact......I warned you I was dumb, right?! It's big at 2.5 carats which we love and has medium fluorescence that really does hide the color but isn't it still better to get a smaller G/H/I color excellent cut, polish and symmetry for the same price......sacrifice size for better color especially since it will be set in platinum Tiffany type setting? I'd prefer a refund so I can purchase elsewhere, perhaps get a Brian Gavin stone instead, but I may be stuck with trading it out with the original seller.

 

[doubledouble]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

Woah. So the seller outright lied about the color grade?

 

[TXNewbie]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

well, we were told that a GIA trained appraiser person looked at it and told the seller it was a G/H but it had no report as it was a trade-in / upgrade from another customer. We got the report after making the purchase so we'd have it for ourselves, insurance purposes, etc. and found out per the GIA it is an M.

 

[Niel]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

Well first its not "better" to have a smaller h than a bigger m. I, like many here, like stones in an M range and might not consider a smaller G a better stone.

Now cut of course matters, and I don't know how well cut this stone is. But if you liked the color before the grading, why not like it now. You're allowed to like an m colored stone.

But of course. If you were overcharged and lied to, that's really the issue.

Owning and loving an M colored stone is anything but an issue. Worse case. Look at in in a rose gold or yellow gold setting? Maybe unplated 18 instead of platinum

This is if you keep it. I would first try to return it if it was truly misrepresented. The important thing is you're getting what you paid for. Whatever it is. But again, if she likes a 2.5 ct m over a 1.5 ct g, flaunt that baby.

 

[Mico]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

How do YOU feel about the color? Do you like it?

This forum has loads of people who like creamy colored diamonds, you need to make up your mind about the color before deciding what to do. I personally would be very unhappy with an M when expecting a G/H. In fact, sometimes when jewelry shopping and a higher colored diamond competes with my I, I wonder if I should've gone higher -- she's usually white as can be otherwise. But, I'm pretty color sensitive.

 

[LaraOnline]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

An interesting option which you may or may not want to consider is having the stone recut so that it appears as a chunkier faceted antique style cut.

You may lose only a whisper of weight. If you've ever the chance to look at antique stones, you will see that the lower colours grace them very, very well indeed.

Here is a thread that shows how little weight was lost from such a recut:

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/rb-to-oec-recut-before-and-after-pics.177547/

 

[Hera]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

A stone being advertised as a G/H and then coming out to be an M is flat out sellers misrepresentation. They need to give you a refund! If they don't, then you need to start a ebay buyer's protection case. If that somehow doesn't work for you, then you need to also contact paypal and your credit card.
Btw, what type of stone is this? Is this a modern cut or an old cut?

 

[swingirl]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

Do you have the option of getting a refund? Did you notice any color when you thought it was a G?

 

[Hera]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

If the buyer is within 45 days, then they can open an ebay buyers protection case. First, contact the seller first and ask for a refund even if it says no refunds or you're out of the return policy time.

 

[TXNewbie]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

okay, I'm really feeling dumb now....

I posted two separate replies to these comments but where are they???? they aren't showing up here???

 

[canuk-gal]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

HI:

Points of clarification: did you send the diamond to GIA for a lab certification or did you obtain an appraisal? Were the other details of the diamond reported (by GIA) to be the same as your verbal report upon purchase....e.g. clarity and weight/dimensions. In other words, was color the only discrepancy?

You stated you loved the size and from your post you implied you also liked the price. Can I surmise you like your ring? Do you feel you received good value for your money and have a nice product?

cheers--Sharon

 

[Niel]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

okay, I'm really feeling dumb now....

I posted two separate replies to these comments but where are they???? they aren't showing up here???

Pricescope can occasionally eat your your posts. So dont feel bad.

 

[LaraOnline]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

Does the seller have an appraiser's certificate?
Unfortunately it seems many appraisers are pressured by sellers to give 'generous' appraisals.
There really is no substitute for grading at a respected lab such as gia unfortunately, but if the appraiser has supplied documentation that might be enough for the seller to successfully argue the diamond was in fact sold as represented.
I'd be interested to hear what others have to say on this.

 

[TXNewbie]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

UUUUUGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!

It happened again!!! I keep typing long posts, press submit button and they just disappear or are eaten!!! what's going on!!!

Looks like I'm jinxed with all things diamond.....even forums!!!

 

[Mico]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

If you take too long, pricescope will eat your post. Just copy your response before hitting send, and paste it if it eats it again.

Or write in word and copy/paste here when ready

 

[LaraOnline]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

Can you just press 'back' and recover your form?
Sometimes that works for me, depending on the forum / form....

 

[TXNewbie]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

Thanks for that Word suggestion....guess I'm either too long winded or type too slowly!

I have not seen any appraisal paperwork from the seller. All representations or should I say misrepresentations were made orally. We sent it to the GIA in California for the grading report. Other misrepresentations were made but not as bad as the M vs. G/H.

We were told it had triple excellents but the GIA report shows only VG cut, Ex Polish and VG Symmetry. I just ran the HCA tool here and it came out a 2.2 VG.

We haven't pushed for a refund yet as we are trying to figure out what to do. The seller so far has only offered to apply what we paid toward an "upgrade."

We saw a much whiter 1 carat smaller G and were told it was much more expensive. At that time, that didn't raise any red flags but now I see that it should have and we should have questioned that reasoning.....boy, this makes me look even more stupid!

We'd prefer a stone in the G/H/I color range with an excellent cut. If a refund works out, what are your suggestions? Brian Gavin, Good old Gold, ??? We can't take getting burned again!

 

[canuk-gal]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

Thanks for that Word suggestion....guess I'm either too long winded or type too slowly!

I have not seen any appraisal paperwork from the seller. All representations or should I say misrepresentations were made orally. We sent it to the GIA in California for the grading report. Other misrepresentations were made but not as bad as the M vs. G/H.

We were told it had triple excellents but the GIA report shows only VG cut, Ex Polish and VG Symmetry. I just ran the HCA tool here and it came out a 2.2 VG.

We haven't pushed for a refund yet as we are trying to figure out what to do. The seller so far has only offered to apply what we paid toward an "upgrade."

We saw a much whiter 1 carat smaller G and were told it was much more expensive. At that time, that didn't raise any red flags but now I see that it should have and we should have questioned that reasoning.....boy, this makes me look even more stupid!

We'd prefer a stone in the G/H/I color range with an excellent cut. If a refund works out, what are your suggestions? Brian Gavin, Good old Gold, ??? We can't take getting burned again!

HI:

Does the vendor have a website with a written return/exchange policy? Does it state "NO" refunds? Is there a time frame?

cheers--Sharon

 

[Mico]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

Most vendors on PS you can't go wrong with. I personally have experience with ID jewelry in NYC, and had a great experience

 

[Hera]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

Ah, it sounds like a modern stone? Just go for the return. Most anyone trained by GIA should know the difference between a G and an M so I wouldn't trust them any further. Then go to a PS vendor or at least buy a stone with a GIA report.

 

[slksapphire]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

UNLESS the seller has a clear no refund policy (check your receipt and any other documents they gave you carefully), (in which case you may be out of luck), i would nicely but firmly demand a refund. you do NOT want to do business with this seller related to an upgrade as it is clear that he/she is not trustworthy.

if he/she refuses, i would threaten legal action. a word of warning, though: you are skating on pretty thin ice. the item has been misrepresented but do you have anything on paper that states that it is G/H? no one can guarantee a color grade other than GIA itself; that's why in-house appraisals are only worth the paper they are written on.

i am so sorry you are going through this experience -- it is so disappointing that there are so many unscrupulous sellers out there. as for where to go, any of the vendors recommended here are trustworthy.

good luck.

 

[Hera]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

Oh dear, I didn't read close enough. As Gem was asking, did you buy it on ebay or by another seller?

 

[GemFever]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

Was it an ebay purchase or a local jeweler? Good luck either way! I hope you can get a full refund.

Don't feel too dumb about it, these things happen (even to people who should have known better... ahem *me* ahem). Just do everything you can right now to get a refund.

 

[msop04]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

UNLESS the seller has a clear no refund policy (check your receipt and any other documents they gave you carefully), (in which case you may be out of luck), i would nicely but firmly demand a refund. you do NOT want to do business with this seller related to an upgrade as it is clear that he/she is not trustworthy.

if he/she refuses, i would threaten legal action. a word of warning, though: you are skating on pretty thin ice. the item has been misrepresented but do you have anything on paper that states that it is G/H? no one can guarantee a color grade other than GIA itself; that's why in-house appraisals are only worth the paper they are written on.

i am so sorry you are going through this experience -- it is so disappointing that there are so many unscrupulous sellers out there. as for where to go, any of the vendors recommended here are trustworthy.

good luck.

This.

 

[AN0NYM0US]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

A stone being advertised as a G/H and then coming out to be an M is flat out sellers misrepresentation. They need to give you a refund! If they don't, then you need to start a ebay buyer's protection case. If that somehow doesn't work for you, then you need to also contact paypal and your credit card.
Btw, what type of stone is this? Is this a modern cut or an old cut?

Not really. The seller called it a g/h and it still is by the sellers standards. There is no universally accepted standard for grading. If you bought a stone with a EGL report and then sent it to GIA and it received a different grade was the seller lying? Is EGL lying? No it's just different standards. This is why it is important to buy a diamond already graded by a reputable lab.

 

[GemFever]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

A stone being advertised as a G/H and then coming out to be an M is flat out sellers misrepresentation. They need to give you a refund! If they don't, then you need to start a ebay buyer's protection case. If that somehow doesn't work for you, then you need to also contact paypal and your credit card.
Btw, what type of stone is this? Is this a modern cut or an old cut?

Not really. The seller called it a g/h and it still is by the sellers standards. There is no universally accepted standard for grading. If you bought a stone with a EGL report and then sent it to GIA and it received a different grade was the seller lying? Is EGL lying? No it's just different standards. This is why it is important to buy a diamond already graded by a reputable lab.

Interesting perspective. I personally have faith in GIA's authority and accuracy. My impression is that most people in the industry recognize GIA in the same way. Though when I bought a stone represented (mounted) as K color and GIA graded it (loose) S-T, the seller's position was that GIA made a mistake and the stone can't be that warm. So I guess there are people out there who will argue with GIA.

And yet, I think most people in the industry accept and respect the GIA cert. If this was an ebay purchase and the buyer filed a claim, I think ebay would side with the GIA cert over "the seller's standards." There is some science to the color grades after all, no?

 

[TC1987]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

It it on a credit card? If so, just dispute the charges and return the stone.

Otherwise, if you are stuck with it, did you overpay for a stone of its cut/clarity/color? You are certainly not the first person to ever get a diamond appraised and find out it's not as-expected. We have threads on here about EGL lab graded diamonds being 2 grades off in both color and clarity. That's not as bad as expecting G/H and getting M.

Erica of Jewels by Erica Grace has had several larger diamond rings in the M/N/O color range. This is one of my favorites. it is an M, and 2.3 cts or something, in a platinum setting by Singlestone. This is an Old European cut, with the chunky facets. A modern cut tends to make the color paler, like maybe the L range of an OEC would look. I don't think M color looks "bad." But it is definitely in the light yellow range, when viewed from the side. Seeing it and being bothered by it are two different things, though. This is one of my favorite vintage rings. There are lots of larger diamonds out there in the K/L/M range, too. Warm colors are not "bad." I also like L/M in a modern H&A cot, too. Wink at highperformancediamonds sometimes get them, because Infinity is one of the few companies that sell very well-cut warn color H&A diamonds and also some well-cut I1 clarity diamonds.

 

[AN0NYM0US]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

A stone being advertised as a G/H and then coming out to be an M is flat out sellers misrepresentation. They need to give you a refund! If they don't, then you need to start a ebay buyer's protection case. If that somehow doesn't work for you, then you need to also contact paypal and your credit card.
Btw, what type of stone is this? Is this a modern cut or an old cut?

Not really. The seller called it a g/h and it still is by the sellers standards. There is no universally accepted standard for grading. If you bought a stone with a EGL report and then sent it to GIA and it received a different grade was the seller lying? Is EGL lying? No it's just different standards. This is why it is important to buy a diamond already graded by a reputable lab.

Interesting perspective. I personally have faith in GIA's authority and accuracy. My impression is that most people in the industry recognize GIA in the same way. Though when I bought a stone represented (mounted) as K color and GIA graded it (loose) S-T, the seller's position was that GIA made a mistake and the stone can't be that warm. So I guess there are people out there who will argue with GIA.

And yet, I think most people in the industry accept and respect the GIA cert. If this was an ebay purchase and the buyer filed a claim, I think ebay would side with the GIA cert over "the seller's standards." There is some science to the color grades after all, no?

GIA is accepted because of their consistency. That is irrelevant to this situation.

The point is I can sell a diamond. I can call it whatever color I want. Grades are opinions. The seller didn't lie. In their (or who ever graded it) opinion was it was a g/h colored diamond. Now if the seller said the diamond was a g color based on GIA's standards then op might have a case.

 

[GemFever]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

GIA is accepted because of their consistency. That is irrelevant to this situation.

The point is I can sell a diamond. I can call it whatever color I want. Grades are opinions. The seller didn't lie. In their (or who ever graded it) opinion was it was a g/h colored diamond. Now if the seller said the diamond was a g color based on GIA's standards then op might have a case.

Maybe in a narrowly legal sense, this is true. Also if the difference in color was one or two grades, this could also be an argument (just difference of opinion). But a jump from G-H to M is significant. It really seems to point to intentional misrepresentation.

 

[denverappraiser]

Re: HELP! dumb newbie bought M color round represented to be

M is a color, not a defect. If you love it per your above post, we’ve got a feature here, not a problem. You’re just haggling over the price. That's ok, haggle away, I'd be ticked about the way it went down too, but understand where you're coming from. You're fundamentally happy with your ring and that's a good place to be starting.

That said, you’ve got easy grounds for a misrepresentation claim if you can show where they represented it to be G-H and that what was delivered is materially different from that. The second piece is easy enough, that's what the GIA is for. The first is harder. If the original claim was all verbal and they don’t now agree that they said it then you’ve got a weak case. Go through the ads, the receipt, the 'appraisal' they gave you, etc. and find as many instances as possible where they've made this claim.

The defense that someone said it was G who happens to use different grading standards but uses the same language doesn’t hold water by the way. For starters, THEY promoted their guy as GIA trained and that’s why you should rely on them. It’s a reasonable expectation that they would use GIA standards given that promotion. Since they didn’t show you this grading report during the sale, and apparently STILL haven’t, it s again reasonable for you to assume that they were using GIA grading standards.

Assuming you want to push for a refund, the first step is to ask for it. Politely and soon. Send them a copy of the GIA, tell your story, and see what they have to say. Step 2 is to demand it, in writing, and to spell out exactly what you see as the problem and exactly what you want to do about it. Step 3 is to bring it up with the credit card company. There is a credit card company involved, right?