Find your diamond
Find your jewelry
shape
carat
color
clarity

Harriet please help me prioritize what stones to buy

Status
Not open for further replies. Please create a new topic or request for this thread to be opened.

sparkles

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
May 24, 2002
Messages
662
Hey Harriet,

Felt I was guilty of highjacking the other thread so started a new one. I started out absolutely loving a blue sapphire, always have. But you know how the story goes....I started lurking and that was it...I''m finding colored stones so hard to buy online especially as I don''t have a relationship with a vendor I can trust. I''ve been tempted to pull the trigger a few times but chickened out. I have bought a book on gemstones and researched the sites here on what to look for in a particular gemstone.

My wishlist

1. Pad Sapphire
2. Blue Sapphire
3. Tsavorite
4. Red Spinel


Harriet, what do you think of the order of the wishlist please? Also, if you had to buy 1 stone, what would be your preference.

Do you know of any dealers in Singapore that hold gemstones to help me with viewing please.

I have seen a few stones , but mostly in retail stores here. I do have a trusted jeweler here but he fed me a line about most stones being heated and it being virtually impossible to find unheated. I could see all the questions I was asking were wasting his time and he politely ended the conversation and ushered me out the door - new he wasn''t going to get a sale I guess.

Why is it every time I want to get a decent piece of jewelery I gotta get on a plane to do it?

Most of the stones I see here are not well cut and the attitudes match...sad as most of the stones come from this part of the world.
 

Harriet

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jul 7, 2006
Messages
12,823
Hi Sparkles,

No worries. I don''t mind threadjacks at all. I''m glad that you''ve done your due diligence and are holding out for a vendor whom you can trust (crucial).

If the list is your preference ordering, then follow it! That said, if you want one of each at some point, I''d go with a red spinel first. This is because red spinels have become rather scarce, especially in the larger sizes.

Unfortunately, I don''t know any gem dealers in Singapore. That''s hogwash about unheated stones! Tsavorite, for one, is never heated. What a sad state of affairs back home!

Do let me know if you need more help.
 

sparkles

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
May 24, 2002
Messages
662
Harriet,

Just wondering if there was a reason you had bought from Pala and Paraiba and not other vendors. Was it the availability of stock, pricing or something other reason please.

I wanted to contact you and have left a message with the administrators to let you know my email - but from memory I don''t think they let you pm anyone on ps.

Thankyou
 

Harriet

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jul 7, 2006
Messages
12,823
I did buy my red spinel from Pala because of availability. But, I have bought from other vendors, including Richard M. I've also had a stone cut by Jeff White. Do let me know if you have any more questions. This is fun.
 

sparkles

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
May 24, 2002
Messages
662
Thanks Harriet,

It is fun.

Would you rather have a blue sapphire or a blue spinel?

Can you please give me some advice on who to work on my behalf at Pala.
I''m going to work on the Spinel first.

Would you describe your Spinel as deep red or bright red please.

Thanks
 

Harriet

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jul 7, 2006
Messages
12,823
Uh oh. Did I corrupt you? I'd like a blue sapphire and a blue spinel. However, the latter is hard to find and I've all but given up. At some point, I'd love a Kashmiri-type sapphire. As for Pala, try Richard M. of www.artcutgems.com. I bought my very first stone from him and he's taught me a lot (he's still teaching me). My spinel looks different depending on the lighting. It's bright red in daylight and darker in fluorescent light. What size would you like?

P.S. After the red spinel, I would look for a tsavorite.
 

sparkles

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
May 24, 2002
Messages
662
Thanks Harriet, I just finished lurking on that site.

Looking for stones around the 9mm length, looking at either oval or cushions.

Cherrypicked is annoying to no end as all their stones are listed as sold. I like to browse and find something, guess it doesn''t happen without actually contacting the vendor and asking them to source something. It just locks you in that way...Cherrypicked seems to be a bit on the high side in terms of price.

I found these

the first one looks too pink
http://palagems.com/php/db_search.php?action=gemdetail&inventory_number=437

this looks too narrow
http://palagems.com/php/db_search.php?action=gemdetail&inventory_number=425
 

sparkles

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
May 24, 2002
Messages
662
Also at pala


http://www.palagems.com/php/db_search.php?action=gemdetail&inventory_number=2421
http://www.palagems.com/php/db_search.php?action=gemdetail&inventory_number=13870
 

sparkles

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
May 24, 2002
Messages
662
Harriet,

Why are all their spinels from Burma. Where is the fantastic Vietnamese stuff I have been reading about?
 

cofor

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jan 7, 2009
Messages
132
Date: 1/31/2009 8:53:40 PM
Author: Harriet
Hi Sparkles,

No worries. I don''t mind threadjacks at all. I''m glad that you''ve done your due diligence and are holding out for a vendor whom you can trust (crucial).

If the list is your preference ordering, then follow it! That said, if you want one of each at some point, I''d go with a red spinel first. This is because red spinels have become rather scarce, especially in the larger sizes.

Unfortunately, I don''t know any gem dealers in Singapore. That''s hogwash about unheated stones! Tsavorite, for one, is never heated. What a sad state of affairs back home!

Do let me know if you need more help.
Harriet, today you can not be sure about the tsavorites anymore. AFIK pale green grossular has been found diffusion treated to make stone more green and adding chromium lines. Almost any kind of gem can today with the right equipment and reciepe be diffusion treated. This is a increasing problem for the trade as it is not always known. I read an article about this somewhere and will try to find it again.

regards, Conny
 

chrono

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 22, 2004
Messages
37,579
I''ve seen some fantastic Vietnamese spinels; in fact, I''m having a cutter recut one for me right now. It''s a dead ringer for a Burmese stone and even fluorescences pink! It should be ready by the end of the week.

Vietnam is also producing excellent blue spinels but these are harder to find. I recommend an unheated blue sapphire instead because to find a blue spinel with an open blue colour is extremely difficult unless you enjoy the "hunt". I''ve been looking for several years now and am still looking.
 

sparkles

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
May 24, 2002
Messages
662
Chrono. You tease. spill it, is it in the size I am looking for. Are the Vietnamese stones priced more reasonably than the Burmese.
 

chrono

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 22, 2004
Messages
37,579
I'm sure it's too small for you. It's only a 2 ct plus stone. It took the poor guy a few months to find because I am so picky. I almost bought a Mahenge spinel too while I was looking. Those stones have unbelieveable colour!
 

Richard M.

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Feb 17, 2004
Messages
1,104
Date: 2/2/2009 6:25:40 AM
Author: cofor
Date: 1/31/2009 8:53:40 PM


today you can not be sure about the tsavorites anymore. AFIK pale green grossular has been found diffusion treated to make stone more green and adding chromium lines. Almost any kind of gem can today with the right equipment and reciepe be diffusion treated. This is a increasing problem for the trade as it is not always known. I read an article about this somewhere and will try to find it again.


regards, Conny
I am very skeptical about diffusion treatment of tsavorite. Unsupported rumors about diffusion of a number of gems are currently circulating and they''re creating quite a row in the gemological community. Please post the source of the article you read when you find it. I''m very interested in learning about the researchers, what methods/instruments they used to detect the alleged treatment, etc.

Richard M.
 

simplysplendid

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Nov 19, 2006
Messages
1,772
Hi Sparkles,

If you are looking for fine gems, I find it hard to say that "I will look for type 1 first, then followed by type 2..etc". More often than not, a fine gem that you are not looking for turns up and you are just "forced" to consider it because if you let it go, you might not find one in the same colour, shape, price again. This is especially true for me so while I am on the lookout for certain gems, I do not prioritise them in order and many a times I side track (not good for the wallet I know). I let a over 3ct fine tsavorite go two years ago because I wasn''t looking for one then and I am kicking myself till this day.

If you are interested in tsavorites, I last saw a fine green 7 ct tsavorite certified vivid green by GRS, for approx SGD40K at canary
. I am not sure if it is within your budget and whether it is still available but you may want to call to find out. Alternatively, you may wish to give them a call and more often and not they can find out something. They have found their clients rare gems such as 6ct, 8ct untreated certified pigeon blood red rubies, red diamonds and blue diamonds.
 

cofor

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jan 7, 2009
Messages
132
Richard M, I have not stated that it is common practice to enhance garnet by diffusion. I merely want to keep up the guard when it comes to stating there is no danger of heating or diffusion treatment to any gemstone. If it is possible to make a fast fortune by not disclosing the nature of a "unknown" treatment there are always a few unscrupulous people around to do it before the awareness of gem merchants and jewellers has caught up.
For a starter read this article and judge it as you wish.

http://www.colored-stone.com/stories/jan09/gem-diffusion.cfm

regards, Conny
 

cofor

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jan 7, 2009
Messages
132
Sparkles, I beg your pardon for hijacking your thread and turn it into a diffusion discussion.

To get back on track. I suggest you aim for a nice red Burmese Spinel. Beautiful and underestimated as superb gems for too long.

regards,
Conny
 

Harriet

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jul 7, 2006
Messages
12,823
Date: 2/1/2009 11:07:42 PM
Author: sparkles
Also at pala


http://www.palagems.com/php/db_search.php?action=gemdetail&inventory_number=2421
http://www.palagems.com/php/db_search.php?action=gemdetail&inventory_number=13870
Sparkles,
I''m afraid the first will be too dark, as well as dead in certain spots (extinction). The second is promising, though.
 

Harriet

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jul 7, 2006
Messages
12,823
Date: 2/2/2009 4:47:50 AM
Author: sparkles
Harriet,

Why are all their spinels from Burma. Where is the fantastic Vietnamese stuff I have been reading about?
No clue. I know someone who has the Vietnamese material, but he won't let me name him online. Tanzania had beautiful red/pink stones a while ago. Look at: www.swalagemtraders.com.

Simply Splendid makes a good point. While it is prudent to have a priority list (and I still think that red spinel takes precedence), if you see a stone that you absolutely love, don't let it go. Spessartites weren't even on my horizon last year, but one popped up and turned out to be one of my best buys yet.

Chrono mentioned custom cutting. You might find this thread informative: https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/native-cut-stones.96917/
 

sparkles

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
May 24, 2002
Messages
662
I appreciate that everyone is trying to look out for me and tell me about the possibility of treatments within a particular stone.

Harriet....you can''t keep on mentioning your supplier and then say you can''t mention him online. Thats teasing, and not nice
especially as I have no way of contacting you other than this forum. I don''t think I can make it all the way to NYC for the get together just to ask your source.

Thanks for the link to Swala....

I''m off to lurk
 

Harriet

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jul 7, 2006
Messages
12,823
Rumours abound about treatments (Conny, please don't think that I'm calling you a "rumour monger") -- first andesine, then Paraibas and now tsavorite and hot pink spinel. Moral of the story? Know who you're buying from and/or use a lab.

How about I tell you more the next time I'm home, Sparkles?
 

Richard M.

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Feb 17, 2004
Messages
1,104
Date: 2/2/2009 12:49:59 PM
Author: cofor

For a starter read this article and judge it as you wish.


http://www.colored-stone.com/stories/jan09/gem-diffusion.cfm


regards, Conny
Conny,

Thanks for posting the source; I''m familiar with it. I don''t wish to hijack the thread either. If anyone wants to start a new thread on this topic I''ll try to add some comments. At this point I''ll only say there have been 2 or 3 high-level rebuttals of information in the Colored Stone article and I''m sure more will come after the Tucson presentation. From what I know of the matter (which is more than a little) I''d advise people to let the dust settle on this before coming to any hard and fast conclusions. James''s allegations are VERY controversial.
Richard M.
 

BlueSea

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 18, 2008
Messages
38
Chrono, you made me curious. Could you post some examples of the Vietnamese spinels that you thought were excellent, please? I''m just wondering how they look like in colour. Thanks!!!
 

LtlFirecracker

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Feb 29, 2008
Messages
4,837
Sparkles,

I just want to say, my dream list is almost like yours. Except I want a ruby as my red stone. You have good taste. I got the blue sapphire first, but if I had it to do over again, I would have started with lower cost stones. I think I really learned about gems after having one for awhile, and I have a better idea what to look for. I got my tsavorite second, it was a fraction of the cost of my sapphire, and it is a great color, cut, and clarity. My sapphire is a killer color, and if I had it to do over again, I would still end up with that stone, but the clarity is not quite perfect in bright sunlight. Just something to think about.
 

colormyworld

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 30, 2005
Messages
1,172
While I am not chrono. I can post a couple of pictures of spinels that I bought as from Vietnam. I have no lab report though. Just the word of the person I bought the stones from. Both stones have very good color. ( more red and less pink looking in real life.) The squarish one is very clean with amazing cutting. The oval has some inclusions and could be cut much better but I enjoy it all the same.

IMG_4058_1.JPG
 

beaujolais

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 4, 2007
Messages
2,205
Chrono:

Re: blue spinels -

What about this one?

http://www.gemrite.com/cubecart/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=40

Asking as you love spinels, were looking at blues and I want to learn from your knowledgeable self, an opinion of it.

I love that spinel, however am not an oval person. I am in love with it on all other counts, though.

Thanks, Sonoma
 

Harriet

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jul 7, 2006
Messages
12,823
I am not Chrono, but that stone looks steely. However, if that floats your boat, then so be it.

People,
Sparkles was polite enough to start her own thread so as not to threadjack Iamdanny's. May we extend her the same courtesy?

Sparkles,
I'm glad Colormyworld has joind the discussion. He is the resident spinel expert.
 
Status
Not open for further replies. Please create a new topic or request for this thread to be opened.
Be a part of the community It's free, join today!
    Upgrade to Five-Stone
    Upgrade to Five-Stone
    Elizabeth Taylor's Diamond Heart
    Elizabeth Taylor's Diamond Heart
    Tips for Black Friday Engagement Ring Shopping
    Tips for Black Friday Engagement Ring Shopping

Need Something Special?

Get a quote from multiple trusted and vetted jewelers.

Holloway Cut Advisor



Diamond Eye Candy

Click to view full-size image.
Top