Female Mccain''s VP pick

[miraclesrule]

MW, I need to check out that show you mentioned. I have never heard of it.

So, back to our thread. I don''t know how I ended up on this site, but I did think this was an interesting article regarding Palin. As we get more information, it is easier to connect the dots. One article I read likened her to "Regina on Mean Girls". I won''t post that because I thought it was snarky, but then again....it did give me pause. I just attended my 30-yr reunion and it brought back memories of the beauty queens vs. the not so beautifuls. So, now I can''t shake the image. I guess I have to go with the more political commentary. Although this is an editorial piece, I think it''s provocative.

Published on Wednesday, September 3, 2008 by TruthDig.com
Palin’s Alaska Reaps the Windfall Profits McCain Decries
by Robert Scheer

Welcome to the People''s Republic of Alaska, where every resident this year will get a $3,200 payout, thanks in no small measure to the efforts of Sarah Palin, the state''s Republican governor. That''s $22,400 for a family of seven, like Palin''s. Since 1982, the Alaska Permanent Fund, which invests oil revenues from state lands, has paid out a dividend on invested oil loot to everyone who has been in the state for a year. But Palin upped the ante by joining with Democrats and some recalcitrant Republican state legislators to share in oil company windfall profits, further fattening state tax revenue and permitting an additional payout in tax funds to residents.

No wonder she is popular with voters in a state whose residents pay no income or sales taxes but are blessed with state coffers rolling in cash at a time when all other states are suffering. Indeed, when the oil companies pay more taxes to the state of Alaska, they get to write that off against their federal tax obligation, leaving the rest of us to make up the shortfall.

The state of Alaska owns most of the oil-producing land and was getting upward of 85 percent of its budget from the oil companies that lease the fields, even before Palin helped increase the state''s cut. While other states fire schoolteachers because of the economic downturn, Alaska has, as Palin indicated in accepting John McCain''s offer to join him on the GOP ticket, more money than it knows what to do with. In a display of plucky arrogance at her coming-out press conference, Palin boasted deceptively that if Alaskans wanted that infamous bridge to nowhere, "we''d build it ourselves."

She originally had supported having U.S. taxpayers finance that boondoggle, before McCain and others in Congress blasted it.

Not that I blame Palin for wrangling for her state a bigger cut of oil company windfall profits; it''s just not an option that will work wonders for states without oil. Of course we can remedy that by having a federal windfall profits tax of the sort that Barack Obama dared propose, and which McCain and his fellow congressional Republicans have managed to quash. Their argument, rejected quite pointedly by Palin for Alaska, is that it would discourage oil companies from investing in boosting oil field yields.

McCain derided Obama''s call for the windfall profits tax, saying it would "increase our dependence on foreign oil and hinder exactly the same kind of domestic exploration and production we need." I am far more interested in how McCain handles the contradiction between his and Palin''s position on windfall oil profits than whether he properly vetted her on her family-values commitment to the abstinence-only teenage sex education program.

Why is it a good thing for the folks up in Alaska to get a cut of exorbitant oil company profits, but not the rest of us, if we are all part of one nation? Didn''t taxpayers from across the U.S. buy the place from the Russians? Isn''t it our federally collected tax dollars that have been subsidizing Alaska more lavishly than any other state, both before and after the bonanza of oil?

Just witness the success of Palin, who, as mayor of the hamlet of Wasilla, hired a big-time lobbying firm intimately connected with the state''s now-indicted Republican Sen. Ted Stevens and thus obtained $27 million in federal earmarks during her tenure. As The Washington Post calculated in a devastating report on Mayor Palin''s assault on the federal treasury, her home town of Wasilla (with about 6,000 inhabitants in 2002 when she was mayor) received $6.1 million, or $1,000 per resident in earmarks, almost as much as Boise, Idaho, got this year with a population that is 30 times larger.

It obviously helped to have Alaska''s now-indicted senator as chair of the Senate Appropriations Committee. And despite McCain''s claims that Palin distinguished herself by breaking with Alaska''s discredited Republican establishment in February, the governor sent Stevens a request for $200 million to support various state projects. With representatives like that, it''s no wonder that Alaska, despite its oil boom, is still at the top of states subsidized by federal dollars, receiving $1.84 back from Washington for every $1 that Alaskans pay in federal taxes. (California receives 78 cents for every $1.)

Unfortunately, looking to Palin for advice on helping the rest of us during the oil crunch, as McCain has promised, is a bit like asking a Saudi oil minister or Russia''s Vladimir Putin to provide a model for our nation''s economic woes. They hardly feel our pain at the pump.

 

[Anna0499]

I don't know how I feel about Alaskans being given dividends by oil companies who drill in their state...on one hand it would be nice if they shared, but on the other hand thoughts of federalism are zipping through my mind. I would assume that drilling in Alaska would lower our gas prices, giving all Americans a benefit but if Alaska is forced to share dividends collected from its natural resources, will other states be forced to do the same? I'll have to think about this a bit more...

 

[Linda W]

The check would be nice to receive, especially with the $9.00 a gallon gas they have to pay. Yikes.!!!!!


Linda

 

[HollyS]

"It would be nice to get the hell away from America" ??????

Maybe you and Michelle Obama can find a cozy little socialist enclave somewhere where you two can be free of the country neither of you can be proud of.

And we can be free of you.

 

[diamondfan]

I love to travel but America is my home. It is not perfect but to me it is the best place to come back to.
Many places you would not even be allowed to post what is being posted here so I at least feel we can try to have reasonable and fair discussions/analyses of these people who have chosen to put their lives under a microscope so they can lead our country. On one hand I say God bless them as to me it is a thankless and terribly difficult role. (but I am not into power so I am not a good one to ask!)

I also feel personally sickened that elections become about who raises the most (in hundreds of millions), who "looks" better and who gives the media the best sound bites. AGAIN, just to be very clear, I am not thrilled with either candidate. Each one has issues that bother me. Each one has intelligence (even if I think it is misdirected!) and each one has skills, maybe I can do a Dr. Frankenstein and parse out what I like from each one and make ONE good candidate and ONE good VP. I can dream...

I am NOT a staunch ANYTHING. I am for freedoms, personal growth and responsibility, government assistance and accountability...but MAN oh man, the bias of some of the media is just insane to me. Obama admits he did coke and considered heroin and no one blinks but a VP's bhubby got a DUI TWENTY years ago and THIS is NEWS? Sheesh. A friend of mine said if they examined all our lives that closely NONE of us would pass the test. No one is perfect. No one is without something in the past they wish would stay there. Some of this stuff gets so petty and picayune I cannot imagine being in their place and reading a newspaper or listening to the television.

 

[Jelly]

Date: 9/6/2008 6:42:56 PM
Author: joflier

Date: 9/6/2008 6:18:21 PM
Author: Dancing Fire
if Obama wins he will tax the corporations to death causing a crash in the stock market.what do you think will happen to your 401K and IRA holdings ? yep,go down the toilet,so you better think twice before you vote for Obama.

Not to mention small business owners (like dh and I) There''s no way that we, or many of the other local small business that we know, could really make a go of keeping our businesses profitable with the capital gains taxes he wants. That means ALOT of jobs down the toilet!

This is from http://www.barackobama.com/issues/economy/#small-business

"Provide Tax Relief for Small Businesses and Start Up Companies: Barack Obama will eliminate all capital gains taxes on start-up and small businesses to encourage innovation and job creation. Obama will also support small business owners by providing a $500 “Making Work Pay” tax credit to almost every worker in America. Self-employed small business owners pay both the employee and the employer side of the payroll tax, and this measure will reduce the burdens of this double taxation."

 

[stone_seeker]

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0708/11670_Page2.html

Under Obama’s plan to let the scheduled 2011 tax rate hikes occur, and his plan to raise the self-employment tax on those making more than $250,000, the S corporation rate would rise from 35 percent to 39.6 percent. The sole proprietor and partner rate would rise from 37.9 percent all the way up to a staggering 50.3 percent. Many Democrats in Congress have proposed making all small businesses (including S corporations) pay this 50-plus percent rate. A small business tax rate that high would be the highest marginal rate faced by them in nearly a quarter-century.

What would a world look like where two-thirds of all small-business income would be taxed at a 50 percent rate? The economic law that “taxing something more and getting less of it” would apply. Fewer Americans would be interested in opening or expanding small businesses. Tax evasion and legal tax avoidance would spike, as tax shelters would once again become a booming industry. Since small businesses create a majority of jobs in America, Main Street closing up shop will have a direct impact on the family budget, as well. Plants and equipment will go unused. Despite the misguided opinions of static scorers in Washington, federal tax revenues will likely decline as the economy staggers into a full-on recession.

 

[stone_seeker]

http://bostonherald.com/news/opinion/columnists/view.bg?articleid=1116043

Can John McCain win? Look, I’ve never cared for the guy. He wasn’t my guy in this fight and I’ve never made any secret about that.

But now I’ve got to be with him - even though the odds are still against him, although not nearly as long as they were awhile ago. What will tip it? This election all depends whether the “victims” finally outnumber the non-victims.

There’s an old saying in politics. If you rob Peter to pay Paul, you can always count on Paul’s vote. Barack Obama doesn’t know much, but he’s figured that out. The question is: Are there still more Peters than Pauls (all of whom feel entitled, because they are, of course, victims)?

Consider the Democratic convention. Even Joe Biden, that shameless buffoon from America’s newest twin city, Scranton-Wilmington, tried to stake out his own personal turf in Victim Nation.

You see, Joe Biden stuttered as a youth. The introductory video told us that. Then his son repeated it. Then the great man himself c-c-c-c-copped to it.

In Victim Nation, nobody ever got a break, even if they’ve gotten nothing but free rides their entire lives. No graduate of Harvard Law School can credibly claim to have been oppressed by a “mean” nation. So in their speeches, Barack Obama, Michelle Obama and Deval Patrick all just ignored the inconvenient truth about where they picked up their second Ivy League degrees.

It’s amazing. These biographical rewrites are like a Witness Protection Program for Harvard Law grads who want to change their identities in order to pass themselves off as victims in good standing.

The whole Democratic convention was like that ancient TV show “Queen for a Day,” in which three weepy housewives would each try to top the others with tales of domestic woe.

The faux bathos in Denver was what made Sarah Palin so refreshing on Friday. When she started listing her kids, you cringed if you’d read about her infant son with Down syndrome. After four nights of Rocky Mountain Queen for a Day, you just assumed she’d Biden-ize the story.

But when she got to her infant son, she said nothing about his affliction. Then she introduced her husband, not even mentioning that he has Inuit blood. That makes the Palins, gulp, multiracial. Imagine any Democrat in Denver neglecting such a perfect opportunity to play the race card. You can’t.

Todd Palin is someone who actually works for a living, as opposed to the Democrats’ “working families,” many of whom don’t really work, and whose taxes Barack promised to cut, which will be difficult, considering most of them don’t pay income taxes to begin with.

By contrast, Todd Palin has two real jobs. He’s no “community advocate” or some paper shuffler in “HR.” The guy is a commercial fisherman and he also works in the oil fields. Naturally the Beautiful People scoff.

The Democrats and their mainstream-media minions are keeping a close eye on the Weather Channel this morning. It’s no secret what they’ll do if Gustav lands a direct hit on New Orleans. It’ll be all victim, all the time, all week.

Remember Stutterin’ Joe Biden’s acceptance speech, in which, to no one’s surprise, he invented a whole series of imaginary kitchen-table conversations, one of which involved “Mom” moving in with her kids “now that Dad’s gone”?

Wouldn’t it be great if Sarah Palin points out in her speech that one reason Mom can’t afford to live in her own house anymore is because her property taxes have tripled to pay for the salaries and benefits of avaricious public-sector union members?

Talk about the real victims in Victim Nation. It’s the people who are going to have to pick up the tab if Barack wins - the taxpayers.

 

[stone_seeker]

Interesting article from the Herald on Palin:

The Beautiful People just won’t let up on Sarah Palin.

It’s become a regular “60 Minutes”/Texas Air National Guard feeding frenzy of bogus reporting out there. The whoppers about Palin are piled up so high in the moribund mainstream media that the wrinkly newsreaders have taken to blaming their most scurrilous, sexist screw-ups on those nefarious unnamed left-wing “bloggers” - you know, like Brian Williams.

Why do the pampered poodles of the elite media loathe Sarah so much? Let’s go down the list.

She’s only 44 years old. She’s just not seasoned enough - and if you don’t believe me, just ask Gloria Steinem, age 74, or Barbara Walters, age 78, or Sally Quinn, age 67, or Eleanor Clift, age 68, or Andrea Mitchell, age 61, or Gail Collins, age 62.

Why, up on the stage, it has been noted that you can distinguish Sarah’s ankles from her calves. She’s never had a Botox injection. The hags of the Hamptons speak as one on this issue. Snow White Palin must be stopped. Anybody got a poisoned apple?

How can she be qualified when she doesn’t have a single $1.2-million-a-year lobbyist in her family? How can she relate to “lunch-bucket” Americans the way lunch-bucket blowhard Joe Biden can?

She admits smoking pot as a teenager, which sets a terrible example for the youth of America, unlike Barack Obama, who admits smoking pot as a teenager, and whose “refreshing candor” is a breath of fresh air after eight years of Cheney-Bush.

She went to multiple colleges as an undergraduate, which shows how flighty and immature she is, unlike Barack Obama, who went to multiple colleges as an undergraduate, which shows the inquisitive nature of his intelligence, which has been such an inspiration, at least to everyone who was born with a silver spoon in his mouth.

She has been known to put out a flag - an American flag, of all things - on the Fourth of July.

The pregnancy and impending shotgun marriage of her teen daughter, Bristol, sets a terrible example for the youth of America, unlike the pregnancy of the teen movie character “Juno,” who sets a wonderful example for the youth of America by refusing to marry.

Sarah Palin is so stupid that on Friday she called the Penn State football team the “Nittaly Lions” - oh wait, scratch that, that was Barack Obama, who again proved his intellect by showing he has much weightier issues on his mind than college football. And who even cares about Penn State anyway, it’s not an Ivy League school.

She’s a member of the Alaska Independence Party - correction, she isn’t, it was The New York Times [NYT] that printed the flat-out lie that she was, in a story that, so said the Times, “called into question how thoroughly Mr. McCain had examined her background.”

You must understand printing lies about Republican candidates is OK. It’s called “vetting.” Printing the truth about liberals - that’s called “swift-boating.” From career MSNBC jock sniffer Keith Olbermann to Barney Frank’s favorite publisher Jann Wenner, the verdict on Palin is unanimous.

The naysayers run the gamut of the political spectrum, from A to B. Sarah is a heretic on everything they gullibly believe in, most significantly global warming. For that blasphemy alone the PC Inquistion insists on the traditional penalty: She must be burned at the stake!

Twelve years ago, she considered banning books at the Wasilla Public Library, which is a chilling assault on the First Amendment, unlike Barack Obama, whose campaign 12 days ago tried to shout down an appearance on Chicago radio of an investigative reporter looking into ties between Barack and rabid terrorist Bill Ayers. But that mob of Barack brownshirts besieging WGN can in no way be compared to what Palin did because well, uh, um, it just can’t be, if you know what’s good for you.

And finally, we return to the real reason they hate her. She’s younger than they are, and better looking. Good looks is a deal breaker with this crowd, and if you don’t believe me, just ask Diane Feinstein, age 75, and Nancy Pelosi, age 68, and Hillary Clinton, age 61, and Barbara Boxer, age 67, and Barbara Mikulski, age 72.

Beautiful People indeed. In this case, the phrase is meant figuratively, not literally.

 

[HollyS]

Now that was a diatribe worthy of Ms. Palin herself! Thank you, stone seeker, for instilling a breath of fresh air into this tired thread.

Obama is a socialist ass unaware of his own foibles, because his ego is so big he can't see his foibles. He's the hand-picked empty suit of the Dems, who might have a lovely demeanor, but he has nothing else to offer. In the words of Hillary, "he gave a pretty speech, once". Now he's given several. Doesn't change the fact that he knows absolutely nothing. Including whether Russia is a member of the UN Security Council (apparently none of his advisors know this, either).

Biden is a fraud. Plain and simple. He isn't everyman; he never was. He plays by the book, right along Party lines, never having an honest opinion. Well, he had an honest opinion when he ran against Obama. He was telling the truth then; but the truth has a way of changing for those in the DP. Situational ethics is the name of the game for them. The truth is relative. Dangle a VP slot under his nose, and suddenly Biden has nothing but praise for Obama.

For those reasons alone, we should reject this pair. But there are numerous other factors, to include how ridiculous The Zero's tax plan is, or his idea of health care, or his thinking we can 'create' new power sources out of thin air because he's opposed to the energy that will produce more electricity for his planned 'electric car in every driveway'.

Could I site dozens of internet sources that might refute what I just said? Well, duh. But the truth is, real experts (not pundits, media types, and bloggers -- real experts) in economics and science have told us that Obama's ideas won't translate to working models. They haven't been thought out; they aren't based in truth.

Now some of you may want to blather on all day about how we need change. Zero isn't the change we need. When the Dems find a standup guy, without the baggage of a wife who needs the Jackie Kennedy makeover to make her play in Peoria, who has done his time in the trenches, who has a clue about national security/foreign policy, who has had a class in basic economics . . . maybe we will have something to talk about. Right now, we don't.

 

[vespergirl]

I just have to comment on the negative connotation the word "elite" has received, in the contexts of "elitist media" or "Washington elite." Since when is being a member of the elite a bad thing? Personally, I would like our president to be a member of the "eilte" - the definition of the word is "a group of persons who by virtue of position or education exercise much power or influence." After reading Ayn Rand''s Atlas Shrugged, one would argue that America would not have become the capitalist powerhouse it is without elite members of society using their talents and skills toward excellent results. I have no interest in mediocrity in the White House - other Americans voted for our "Average Joe" President Bush, who is of below average intelligence, and that has turned out to be a disaster for our country. I would much rather have a member of the educational elte running the country - someone who is more intellectually qualified to analyze problems, create solutions and make decisions. The phrase "Hockey Mom" does not connote any exceptional intellectual or problem-solving ability. If Palin wanted to be taken seriously as a politician, then she shouldn''t have introduced herself as such.

 

[diamondfan]

I think any politico knows to get up there and say WE NEED CHANGE. If things were great, no one would need to do it, but usually things can be improved. From healthcare to the environment to the economy to alternate energy sources to the war...what DOESN''T need to be improved right now? It does not take a genius to say the word CHANGE. And mean it, but really not be able to produce it in any time frame that is reasonable. And, a lot of these changes are costly and require huge tax increases, which will really serve to make things worse on one level, the more you take from someone''s pocket they have to make choices about what they can spend their money on. More optional things get pushed aside.

To me, all politicians want to get up and say these sweeping and wonderful things. Who doesn''t want those things to be a reality? But there is so much hypocrisy in this whole process. For every article praising Obama I can find one which reviles him, and the same for McCain.

You can package up the message with a nice bow on top and you can deliver it in a jazzy way, but that does not make the likelihood or reality of it coming to pass any stronger. If it did, I would be thrilled and likely be casting a vote for Obama. But if it is flash and pageantry but not much backs it up, I just think we have to look deeper than the surface this time.

 

[MoonWater]

Date: 9/7/2008 12:30:38 AM
Author: HollyS
'It would be nice to get the hell away from America' ??????


Maybe you and Michelle Obama can find a cozy little socialist enclave somewhere where you two can be free of the country neither of you can be proud of.

And we can be free of you.

There you go making ASSumptions again. It's posts like the above that makes me laugh at you when you claim I am being insulting.

 

[HollyS]

Date: 9/7/2008 9:54:31 AM
Author: MoonWater

Date: 9/7/2008 12:30:38 AM
Author: HollyS
''It would be nice to get the hell away from America'' ??????


Maybe you and Michelle Obama can find a cozy little socialist enclave somewhere where you two can be free of the country neither of you can be proud of.

And we can be free of you.

There you go making ASSumptions again. It''s posts like the above that makes me laugh at you when you claim I am being insulting.

I''m not making assumptions. I''m taking you at face value -- the face you choose to show to us here on PS. I didn''t misquote you.

Wait, you mean, you didn''t mean what you said? How Democratic of you. I''d say you are in the right party.

 

[MoonWater]

Date: 9/7/2008 10:06:42 AM
Author: HollyS

Date: 9/7/2008 9:54:31 AM

Author: MoonWater

Date: 9/7/2008 12:30:38 AM

Author: HollyS

''It would be nice to get the hell away from America'' ??????



Maybe you and Michelle Obama can find a cozy little socialist enclave somewhere where you two can be free of the country neither of you can be proud of.

And we can be free of you.

There you go making ASSumptions again. It''s posts like the above that makes me laugh at you when you claim I am being insulting.

I''m not making assumptions. I''m taking you at face value -- the face you choose to show to us here on PS. I didn''t misquote you.


Wait, you mean, you didn''t mean what you said? How Democratic of you. I''d say you are in the right party.

I''m sorry, was your post in line with the rules? Should you be reporting yourself to Ali now? I never claimed you misquoted me, I said you made assumptions. Do you know the difference? I meant exactly what I said, what''s funny is that you don''t know the reasoning behind it.

 

[Anna0499]

Date: 9/7/2008 9:15:09 AM
Author: vespergirl
I just have to comment on the negative connotation the word ''elite'' has received, in the contexts of ''elitist media'' or ''Washington elite.'' Since when is being a member of the elite a bad thing? Personally, I would like our president to be a member of the ''eilte'' - the definition of the word is ''a group of persons who by virtue of position or education exercise much power or influence.'' After reading Ayn Rand''s Atlas Shrugged, one would argue that America would not have become the capitalist powerhouse it is without elite members of society using their talents and skills toward excellent results. I have no interest in mediocrity in the White House - other Americans voted for our ''Average Joe'' President Bush, who is of below average intelligence, and that has turned out to be a disaster for our country. I would much rather have a member of the educational elte running the country - someone who is more intellectually qualified to analyze problems, create solutions and make decisions. The phrase ''Hockey Mom'' does not connote any exceptional intellectual or problem-solving ability. If Palin wanted to be taken seriously as a politician, then she shouldn''t have introduced herself as such.

There is a difference between being a member of the "elite" & being "elitist." I don''t have a problem if our poltiical leaders are in the former category, but I certainly don''t want anyone in the latter category running our country. Elitism is the "1. belief in concept of superiority: the belief that some people or things are inherently superior to others and deserve preeminence, preferential treatment, or higher rewards because of their superiority; 2. belief in control by small group: the belief that government or control should be in the hands of a small group of privileged, wealthy, or intelligent people, or the active promotion of such a system; 3. control by small group: government or control by a small, specially qualified, or privileged group." I think most Americanas have a problem with anyone they consider "too much" of anything - too pretty, too smart, even too savvy. Politicians have to walk that thin line between being considered highly intelligent but not out of touch to the everyman, being considered savvy but not crafty, and being considered pretty but not too much of a "babe" to be a VP. It''s quite an interesting paradox. Some mothers might disagree with your statement about "Hockey Moms," and most analysts have agreed that her mention of that in her speech was a good thing. I wouldn''t dismiss anyone that calls themselves a "Hockey Mom" as one with just average intelligence or problem-solving ability...candidates on BOTH sides are constantly making references to how much they are like "everybody else" (& I remember Hillary did this all the time too). It obviously works, because, although some might consider Bush "below average intelligence," perhaps he''s the smartest one of us all to have been elected president for 8 years.

 

[miraclesrule]

Date: 9/7/2008 12:30:38 AM
Author: HollyS
'It would be nice to get the hell away from America' ??????

Maybe you and Michelle Obama can find a cozy little socialist enclave somewhere where you two can be free of the country neither of you can be proud of.

And we can be free of you.

I know that it is very difficult for opposing sides not to come into this thread and "defend" their position.

I stuck around PS because I truly believed it to be a supportive environment in the spirit of "INforum"ing" yourself and others. This is usually based on informatin of a more factual basis that allows one to make a more informed decision. The experts and posters on this forum are invaluable for those looking to educate themselves. I can understand why it's done for diamonds and large purchases, but believe it to be even more important for the next President and potential President should they need to step in and govern. I don't understand why that same support is impossible in this thread. Is it indicative of why America is in the current rut?

Maintaining the status quo by posting "Spin Opinion" articles that are clearly part of smear campaigns and posting caustic remarks to a fellow PS'er such as this one I just read from Holly S make me feel sad because we all have a need to be heard and be understood. There is a way of being supportive and to respectfully disagree. There are also times when one should be capable of biting their tongue if their post is merely intended to insult, as I believe this post was. This is not in the spirit of Informing yourself or anyone else. We are capable of so much more light.

 

[E B]

Date: 9/7/2008 7:43:49 AM
Author: stone_seeker

The pregnancy and impending shotgun marriage of her teen daughter, Bristol, sets a terrible example for the youth of America, unlike the pregnancy of the teen movie character “Juno,” who sets a wonderful example for the youth of America by refusing to marry.

Oh, please. How is not making the snap decision to marry because of a pregnancy setting a "terrible example" for the youth of America? The 16-year-old girl in Juno knew she wasn't ready to a) raise a child and b) marry a friend she'd accidentally conceived with, so she found a wonderful, loving home for the baby and went on living life as a teenager. What a foolish, immature decision.

Attention, youth of America: If you find yourself pregnant, you should do the 'right' thing and marry the father, regardless of your maturity level, the length of time you've known the father, or your feelings about him. This makes your decision to have premarital sex okay, because now, you're a part of a holy union. Now, put on that wedding dress and smile- it's for Jesus!

 

[galeteia]

Date: 9/7/2008 11:48:48 AM
Author: miraclesrule

Date: 9/7/2008 12:30:38 AM

Author: HollyS

''It would be nice to get the hell away from America'' ??????


Maybe you and Michelle Obama can find a cozy little socialist enclave somewhere where you two can be free of the country neither of you can be proud of.

And we can be free of you.

I know that it is very difficult for opposing sides not to come into this thread and ''defend'' their position.

I stuck around PS because I truly believed it to be a supportive environment in the spirit of ''INforum''ing'' yourself and others. This is usually based on informatin of a more factual basis that allows one to make a more informed decision. The experts and posters on this forum are invaluable for those looking to educate themselves. I can understand why it''s done for diamonds and large purchases, but believe it to be even more important for the next President and potential President should they need to step in and govern. I don''t understand why that same support is impossible in this thread. Is it indicative of why America is in the current rut?

Maintaining the status quo by posting ''Spin Opinion'' articles that are clearly part of smear campaigns and posting caustic remarks to a fellow PS''er such as this one I just read from Holly S make me feel sad because we all have a need to be heard and be understood. There is a way of being supportive and to respectfully disagree. There are also times when one should be capable of biting their tongue if their post is merely intended to insult, as I believe this post was. This is not in the spirit of Informing yourself or anyone else. We are capable of so much more light.

Well said. I feel the political threads are an embarrassment to PS and I feel that they are presenting an inappropriate ''face'' to the public. That is why I have stopped posting in them. This kind of behaviour is not appropriate for a diamond forum that the Admins have characterized as ''friendly and helpful''.

It is also futile; our discussion here will not decide/affect the election, but it will be divisive, create hurt feelings and resentment between members, and clutter up the forum with unnecessary posts.

This kind of thing makes me ashamed to recommend this forum to diamond seekers, knowing that these threads are eclipsing the other topics at the moment by sheer number of posts, and these threads are what they will base their opinions upon the forum as a whole. If I was new to this forum and stumbled across these threads, I would run.

 

[luckystar112]

All I know is that it''s going to stink if Ali really does decide to pull these threads. It''s a shame because I''m sure that we''ve all learned a lot so far.

 

[FrekeChild]

...sigh...

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 9/7/2008 12:18:13 PM
Author: Galateia

Date: 9/7/2008 11:48:48 AM
Author: miraclesrule

Date: 9/7/2008 12:30:38 AM

Author: HollyS

'It would be nice to get the hell away from America' ??????


Maybe you and Michelle Obama can find a cozy little socialist enclave somewhere where you two can be free of the country neither of you can be proud of.

And we can be free of you.

I know that it is very difficult for opposing sides not to come into this thread and 'defend' their position.

I stuck around PS because I truly believed it to be a supportive environment in the spirit of 'INforum'ing' yourself and others. This is usually based on informatin of a more factual basis that allows one to make a more informed decision. The experts and posters on this forum are invaluable for those looking to educate themselves. I can understand why it's done for diamonds and large purchases, but believe it to be even more important for the next President and potential President should they need to step in and govern. I don't understand why that same support is impossible in this thread. Is it indicative of why America is in the current rut?

Maintaining the status quo by posting 'Spin Opinion' articles that are clearly part of smear campaigns and posting caustic remarks to a fellow PS'er such as this one I just read from Holly S make me feel sad because we all have a need to be heard and be understood. There is a way of being supportive and to respectfully disagree. There are also times when one should be capable of biting their tongue if their post is merely intended to insult, as I believe this post was. This is not in the spirit of Informing yourself or anyone else. We are capable of so much more light.

Well said. I feel the political threads are an embarrassment to PS and I feel that they are presenting an inappropriate 'face' to the public. That is why I have stopped posting in them. This kind of behaviour is not appropriate for a diamond forum that the Admins have characterized as 'friendly and helpful'.

It is also futile; our discussion here will not decide/affect the election, but it will be divisive, create hurt feelings and resentment between members, and clutter up the forum with unnecessary posts.

This kind of thing makes me ashamed to recommend this forum to diamond seekers, knowing that these threads are eclipsing the other topics at the moment by sheer number of posts, and these threads are what they will base their opinions upon the forum as a whole. If I was new to this forum and stumbled across these threads, I would run.

I completely agree.

After months of being buried in raising a newborn, I'm excited about this election and learning more about the candidates and hearing people's views. I posted in the other thread that PS political threads are simply not fun. I don't mind reading all the spin articles on both sides because I just like reading. But oh my god, the insults here...it's not a wonder that more PSers are not on these threads.

Not to mention that religion keeps getting mentioned on these threads and that is a topic that is banned on PS.

I'm still reading because I still like to get opinions. But it won't surprise me Ali/Andrey shut these threads down (and no, I haven't reported any of these threads because I am still hoping we can discuss politics in a civil fashion - which I can IS possible as there are members here who have been polite and open minded on BOTH sides). The vitriol in these political threads is disgusting.

 

[E B]

Date: 9/7/2008 12:54:10 PM
Author: TravelingGal

Not to mention that religion keeps getting mentioned on these threads and that is a topic that is banned on PS.

Really? I didn''t know. I''ll refrain from mentioning it again. Though, I can''t imagine it''s easy to discuss the election without discussing religion.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 9/7/2008 1:01:34 PM
Author: EBree

Date: 9/7/2008 12:54:10 PM
Author: TravelingGal

Not to mention that religion keeps getting mentioned on these threads and that is a topic that is banned on PS.

Really? I didn''t know. I''ll refrain from mentioning it again. Though, I can''t imagine it''s easy to discuss the election without discussing religion.

Yup. #8 on the list at https://www.pricescope.com/idealbb/faq.asp?mode=policy

"Discussing religion or racial/ethnic issues are not allowed. It includes posting links/references to other sites/sources dedicated to religion or ethnic discussions."

And this one...

"Inflammatory, rude, arrogant and obnoxious behavior will not be tolerated from anyone. Should anyone use inappropriate language, start a personal attack, or engage in hate speech, they will be banned from all further discussions."

 

[TravelingGal]

btw, before anyone screams out "net nannying", it''s my simple belief that if you want to play in someone''s yard, you play by their rules. This isn''t an "out there" wild wild west forum. This is one with guidelines for its members.

 

[luckystar112]

I think we should move on to the more pressing issues of this campaign. For example, Are Palin''s glasses the new pantsuit?

 

[stone_seeker]

McCain now leads Obama by 3% in the latest Gallup poll. Best showing since May.

Palin must be working. McCain was down 8% a week ago.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/110050/Gallup-Daily-McCain-Moves-Ahead-48-45.aspx

 

[Linda W]

OMG!!!! What has this thread turned into??? Indygirl, types ONE paragraph and all hell breaks loose.


Linda

 

[ksinger]

Date: 9/7/2008 11:48:48 AM
Author: miraclesrule

Date: 9/7/2008 12:30:38 AM
Author: HollyS
''It would be nice to get the hell away from America'' ??????

Maybe you and Michelle Obama can find a cozy little socialist enclave somewhere where you two can be free of the country neither of you can be proud of.

And we can be free of you.

I know that it is very difficult for opposing sides not to come into this thread and ''defend'' their position.

I stuck around PS because I truly believed it to be a supportive environment in the spirit of ''INforum''ing'' yourself and others. This is usually based on informatin of a more factual basis that allows one to make a more informed decision. The experts and posters on this forum are invaluable for those looking to educate themselves. I can understand why it''s done for diamonds and large purchases, but believe it to be even more important for the next President and potential President should they need to step in and govern. I don''t understand why that same support is impossible in this thread. Is it indicative of why America is in the current rut?

Maintaining the status quo by posting ''Spin Opinion'' articles that are clearly part of smear campaigns and posting caustic remarks to a fellow PS''er such as this one I just read from Holly S make me feel sad because we all have a need to be heard and be understood. There is a way of being supportive and to respectfully disagree. There are also times when one should be capable of biting their tongue if their post is merely intended to insult, as I believe this post was. This is not in the spirit of Informing yourself or anyone else. We are capable of so much more light.

And to the end of fostering harmony in these threads, I shall be removing myself from them completely. While I do realize I have been something of an incendiary presence here at times, I find I have reached my personal limit. I bow to those of greater skill and thicker skin. I sincerely apologize to any and all I have offended and for my "tone" at times. I do feel that not all of the misinterpretations of my intent have been due to my writing, but enough of them to warrant an apology to all. I hope that any offense given has been offset somewhat by a preponderance of posts that have been at least reasonably supported and informative.

I probably will be taking a large break from PS in general also. I have done this in the past in one or two forums where I found I was becoming too involved, for whatever reason. I find it usually results in leaving the forum entirely, in the end. And I''ve got a lot to do here in the real world. I spend too much time in front of a computer! And hanging out here has been BAD for my wallet, my ever-backlogged reading list, and my needlework.

So to all, I wish you well. Of all the folks I''ll miss, Moon, and Miracles, I''m gonna miss you both the most I think. Moon, for your enviable ability to let it roll and the fact that we and our men seem to read the same books, and MiraclesRule, for your non-saccharine sweetness all mixed up with tough and intelligent. If there was some way I could figure out to keep in touch with you both, I would. Oh, and also AGBF, Our Lady of Zen. Amazing person.

Best to all in all your endeavors and I hope everybody gets/stays happily married (that want to) and gets lots of pretty sparklies!

 

[iheartscience]

Date: 9/7/2008 11:48:49 AM
Author: EBree

Date: 9/7/2008 7:43:49 AM

Author: stone_seeker


The pregnancy and impending shotgun marriage of her teen daughter, Bristol, sets a terrible example for the youth of America, unlike the pregnancy of the teen movie character “Juno,” who sets a wonderful example for the youth of America by refusing to marry.

Oh, please. How is not making the snap decision to marry because of a pregnancy setting a ''terrible example'' for the youth of America? The 16-year-old girl in Juno knew she wasn''t ready to a) raise a child and b) marry a friend she''d accidentally conceived with, so she found a wonderful, loving home for the baby and went on living life as a teenager. What a foolish, immature decision.


Attention, youth of America: If you find yourself pregnant, you should do the ''right'' thing and marry the father, regardless of your maturity level, the length of time you''ve known the father, or your feelings about him. This makes your decision to have premarital sex okay, because now, you''re a part of a holy union. Now, put on that wedding dress and smile- it''s for Jesus!

So true, EBree! (Insert internet high-five here.)