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Feeling gloomy - advice about where to get ring made

CalliopeCladdagh

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Hi everyone,

After finding out about AVCs on here, I now have my heart set on one for my engagement ring.
I was hoping to buy the diamond from August Vintage and have it shipped to me, to be set in a custom made ring at a local jeweller.

This was for 2 main reasons - import duty is lower on loose stones than on completed rings (I live outside the US), and having it made locally meant I could take it back annually for checkups and they would do all that kind of aftercare for free and with a vested interest in looking after the ring. Also I like the idea of supporting local businesses.

Today I went to a couple of jewellers, my first and second choices. They both 'fully' hand make/craft their jewellery, no casting involved, which is what I would like.
Essentially they both said they do not normally work with stones purchased elsewhere but could potentially make an exception seeing as it would be a particular brand, but they would not be willing to work with the specs I desire - particularly colour! I would like an I or J colour to maximise my budget, and they said they would not handle anything below H as they have a reputation to uphold!

All in all my reception was not great and I feel sad, but also annoyed - I am the customer literally trying to GIVE them my money and they make it feel like a chore.

I'm not sure what I want out of this thread really. Partly a place to vent. But any kind of advice around what I should do, suggestions, opinions, or experiences with buying diamonds or completed rings overseas, would be very welcome.

I should add that I have expensive taste but am constrained by budget which also limits my choices. If I had the funds I would just get someone like Erika Winters, whose stuff I LOVE, to make it and get the AVC sent directly to her and pay the extra in import duties etc. I am looking at around US$3000 for the diamond and US$1500 max for the setting.
 

distracts

Ideal_Rock
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If you are looking at $1500 max for the setting, I would not bother with handforged. Just get a cast setting. For that price you likely aren't getting complicated pave so it won't matter. I don't know what kind of setting you want but you could save money by getting a stock solitaire and a larger diamond.
 

SouthernElle

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I’d think they would change their mind after seeing an AVC, given Jonathan’s impeccable reputation and amazing work. Any jeweler should be proud to set one of his stones. I’m seriously rolling my eyes right now, I’m sorry they are being snobs. If budget wasn’t any consideration, I would have gotten an oval from him in a heartbeat.
 

CalliopeCladdagh

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I’d think they would change their mind after seeing an AVC, given Jonathan’s impeccable reputation and amazing work. Any jeweler should be proud to set one of his stones.
You'd think, right?! I brought up the website, showed them some diamonds including the AGS reports with the ASET to demonstrate the cut quality...didn't make any difference...
 

CalliopeCladdagh

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If you are looking at $1500 max for the setting, I would not bother with handforged. Just get a cast setting. For that price you likely aren't getting complicated pave so it won't matter. I don't know what kind of setting you want but you could save money by getting a stock solitaire and a larger diamond.
Thank you for your reply, no not planning any pave. It's more of a 'mind clean' thing about it being hard forged. This will be my forever ring (no upgrades) and I really want to be happy with it. I might have to give that idea up though?
 

monipod

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I’m not sure where you are but as an Australian diamond lover, I will only buy stones overseas as in spite of our poor dollar, I get way more value for money. I actually wasn’t charged extra duty for a full ring through James Allen, but I ended up just buying a stone on its own recently with view to getting a local jeweller to set it in a semi bezel ring. Ouch... so expensive... First quote was 3K AUD for a solitaire (and not a very generous gold buy back) and they didn’t even see my stone (m color!). They might have rejected it too. I finally found a jeweller headed by two young guys who were super enthusiastic about working with my stone, congratulating me for finding her. Their quote for a solitaire was under 1K AUD and they love recycling old ring gold!
I think you just have to hunt around for more innovative jewellers who will do what you want!
 

rockysalamander

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If you want to share your general location, maybe we can help you find a vendor.

Are you sure you need a custom setting? Is what you want so unique that you can't find stock? That would work in your budget better.
 

Bron357

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I’m in Sydney Australia and can recommend my Jeweller.
Its awful how some stores treat potential clients, part of it I think is that if they supply the diamond that’s more $$$ for them. My jeweller is not only happy to create a setting, they listen to you. It’s certainly not cheap getting it made here in Australia because rents, wages, etc are higher but don’t be discouraged.
 

CalliopeCladdagh

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Thanks everyone! Apart from anything else, it's just really nice to be able to moan about my wants to people who understand, haha. My partner wants me to be happy, but just thinks diamonds are small expensive rocks and doesn't really understand my depth of feeling!

Are you sure you need a custom setting? Is what you want so unique that you can't find stock? That would work in your budget better.
Not especially unique I don't think, essentially a main stone with two accent diamonds on a platinum band, but I'd like to incorporate elements of rings I've seen and am very picky on details eg. Shape of prongs, milgrain... I would also still really like it to be handforged.

I am in New Zealand.
 

Snowdrop13

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Can AV not produce something that would suit? Might cost a little more but surely the easiest option, you don’t have to worry about insuring the stone while it‘s being set.
 

foxinsox

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Thanks everyone! Apart from anything else, it's just really nice to be able to moan about my wants to people who understand, haha. My partner wants me to be happy, but just thinks diamonds are small expensive rocks and doesn't really understand my depth of feeling!


Not especially unique I don't think, essentially a main stone with two accent diamonds on a platinum band, but I'd like to incorporate elements of rings I've seen and am very picky on details eg. Shape of prongs, milgrain... I would also still really like it to be handforged.

I am in New Zealand.
Where in NZ? I’m in Christchurch and may be able to suggest a couple of places. Tho depending on your aesthetic, you honestly may be better having it made overseas by someone who gets it. Possibly send the setting separately to the loose stone and get a local to set it (tho there’s risk there in the setting)
 

MollyMalone

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I’m sorry to say, @Whisper89 , that I think $1500 USD is an unrealistic budget for a wholly hand-forged ring in platinum, designed to your specs & with additional side stones, millegrain, etc. Although I’d be happy to be proven wrong.
 

sledge

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Using the JA tax & duty calculator, it appears a loose diamond is around 16% VAT. If you elect to do the setting in the US and ship back as a diamond e-ring then the you get charged close to 22% VAT & duty. So a difference of around 6%.

So roughly: $3,000 diamond + $1,500 setting = $4,500 x (22%-16%) = $270 difference

For that small of a dollar difference I'd tell the local guys to go pound sand, and order what I really wanted.

My wife had similar concerns as you, and thought buying local was best. I did the opposite. Bought a BGD stone from Houston, and had her a custom setting made by DK in Los Angeles. Shipped it back home to us where both vendors are at least 8+ hours away.

Stumbled into a local Diamonds Direct one day when looking at wedding bands for me. Me and the manager had a conversation about her stone and setting. Thought he was going to offer me a job, lol. Anyhow, we now use them for deep cleans and minor things -- always FREE of charge. We've had to do some minor repairs (due to self inflicted things) and I sent the ring back to DK to fix for free. If needed, I'd be okay with paying a small fee to DD for their maintenance type stuff they offer us for free, or even a minor repair if we were in a pinch.


CaptureNZloose.PNG

CaptureNZring.PNG
 

PreRaphaelite

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they have a reputation to uphold!
A reputation for not understanding cut quality and how August Vintage often faces up higher than H due to optical performance. I’m sorry they made you feel bad. Some businesses just don’t get it. It sounds like other jewellers may be able to get you your dream ring.

Have you looked at antique settings? They’re a great match for the AV cut, and cost a whole lot less than new, sometimes. Often the quality is very high, and sometimes the setting can be tweaked a bit to suit a stone. It just takes a bit longer to find exactly what you want but it’s quite satisfying when it happens.If you found the setting first and had it shipped to Jon at AV, he could give you a selection of stones to choose from, and then send you the final ring.

At any rate, good luck and don’t let snobby shop staff get you down!
 

marymm

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Yes, I also suggest you ask Jon which stock Stuller solitaire settings would best fit your AVC's dimensions, then choose one in your preferred metal, and have Jon ship out a complete ring to you.

At some point in the future, should you still want a different setting, your local jewelers should be more amenable to work with you since you will be bringing in a complete ring rather than a loose diamond.
 

arkieb1

Ideal_Rock
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Send the diamond to David Klass, get a quote from him. I'm an Aussie and I've used his bench for multiple things without drama.

Also check out Victor Canera's new Antique cuts if you purchase a stone from him you get a small discount on the setting.
 

bludiva

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If the import duty is a big problem, perhaps you have the stone shipped inset, with the setting as a separate item or in a separate delivery, and have it set locally? Stuller as mentioned above is a good & cost effective option.
 

distracts

Ideal_Rock
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Thank you for your reply, no not planning any pave. It's more of a 'mind clean' thing about it being hard forged. This will be my forever ring (no upgrades) and I really want to be happy with it. I might have to give that idea up though?

Well while I know it sucks to compromise, with your budget and the rejection of these jewelers, you will have to compromise somewhere. Your setting budget is unrealistic for what you want. It may be doable with a cast ring, maybe. David Klass could probably get it done at that price in a cast ring, depending on the details you want, but a lot of jewelers wouldn't be able to. eta, coorrection: A lot of jewelers whose work we'd actually consider good enough wouldn't be able to. The vast majority of jewelers produce jewelry that wouldn't meet PS expectations of quality. If going custom locally, be sure to see as many examples as possible of their work and ideally rings very close to what you want.

Can you share more precisely what you want the setting to look like, with pictures or drawings? Then we may be able to direct you to who best could get it done or if any stock settings exist that are already like it.

Also re: ring checkups at a local jeweler and such - at least in the US, every independent jeweler I've gone to is happy to do prong checks and clean the ring for free while you wait, to promote your relationship with their business. Stone tightening comes at a cost everywhere that isn't where I got my ring but it's very inexpensive and usually not needed anyway. I wouldn't make that a factor in where you get your setting.
 

CalliopeCladdagh

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Also re: ring checkups at a local jeweler and such - at least in the US, every independent jeweler I've gone to is happy to do prong checks and clean the ring for free while you wait, to promote your relationship with their business. Stone tightening comes at a cost everywhere that isn't where I got my ring but it's very inexpensive and usually not needed anyway. I wouldn't make that a factor in where you get your setting.
This is reassuring, thank you.

I’m sorry to say, @Whisper89 , that I think $1500 USD is an unrealistic budget for a wholly hand-forged ring in platinum, designed to your specs & with additional side stones, millegrain, etc. Although I’d be happy to be proven wrong.
Funnily enough I was quoted the equivalent of US$1200-1600 for the setting. Although that was a quick estimate without doing drawings etc, so if anything would go up. I think, although I'm only guessing, that most of the high cost of jewellery here comes from mark ups on loose stones and that's where they really make their money.


Using the JA tax & duty calculator, it appears a loose diamond is around 16% VAT. If you elect to do the setting in the US and ship back as a diamond e-ring then the you get charged close to 22% VAT & duty. So a difference of around 6%.

So roughly: $3,000 diamond + $1,500 setting = $4,500 x (22%-16%) = $270 difference

For that small of a dollar difference I'd tell the local guys to go pound sand, and order what I really wanted.
I think you're right. I should just forego the tax problem.

Have you looked at antique settings? They’re a great match for the AV cut, and cost a whole lot less than new, sometimes.
No I haven't, do you have any suggestions for good places to look?

Also check out Victor Canera's new Antique cuts if you purchase a stone from him you get a small discount on the setting.
I've seen those but I've assumed he would be too expensive!

Can you share more precisely what you want the setting to look like, with pictures or drawings? Then we may be able to direct you to who best could get it done or if any stock settings exist that are already like it.

Also re: ring checkups at a local jeweler and such - at least in the US, every independent jeweler I've gone to is happy to do prong checks and clean the ring for free while you wait, to promote your relationship with their business. Stone tightening comes at a cost everywhere that isn't where I got my ring but it's very inexpensive and usually not needed anyway. I wouldn't make that a factor in where you get your setting.
Thank you, that's also reassuring.
I will see if I can put together some pics that illustrate what I want.



I feel like this is a silly thing to be so sad about. I mean, talk about first world problems, right?!
But this is the nicest thing I will ever own. Living costs in Auckland are very high, we live very frugally, but this is important to me. I'm in my 30s and I've saved and saved for this. I wanted the whole process to be joyous.
 

distracts

Ideal_Rock
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It's not a silly thing to be sad about. It's a big purchase that is very symbolic and that we all go into planning and hoping to wear it every day for the rest of our lives. Is there anything else you wear every day? For me there certainly isn't. But the reality of getting the right ring is that it's less joyous and more work, with questions and planning and numbers and setbacks along the way. For me, at least, the process is not necessarily "joyous" but it is rewarding - and even more so when you have the right thing on your finger.
 

CalliopeCladdagh

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It's not a silly thing to be sad about. It's a big purchase that is very symbolic and that we all go into planning and hoping to wear it every day for the rest of our lives. Is there anything else you wear every day? For me there certainly isn't. But the reality of getting the right ring is that it's less joyous and more work, with questions and planning and numbers and setbacks along the way. For me, at least, the process is not necessarily "joyous" but it is rewarding - and even more so when you have the right thing on your finger.
Thank you for understanding!
I wear a plain claddagh ring on my right hand, that's my only other ring (apart from a couple of inexpensive silver rings acquired in my twenties that I no longer wear). I'm just dying for some sparkle!!

I will attempt to attach some inspiration photos below. These have been poached from other threads, so I apologise in advance to the owners - I hope it's ok to do this.

This is essentially my dream ring! If only! So picture this, but scaled waaaaaaaaaaaaay down - ie. 0.8-0.9ct centre stone, 0.1ct each side. Claw prongs - can just be one in each corner do not need to have the 'top' and 'bottom' centre prong.

top.jpg

This kind of thing with the swoopy bits connecting the prongs (basket?), doughnuts in the band (I think these are the correct terms but I am no expert?!). I like the way the two side stones sit kind of lower than the centre stone.

side.jpg

basket.jpg

On a platinum band ideally with milgrain around the edges of the band. I would like the band to be approx 2mm and taper in towards the side stones.

Nb: I am planning an engraved platinum band for my wedding ring, no diamonds.
 

distracts

Ideal_Rock
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Ok so the first thing here is - if you are getting an AVC, do you want the sidestones to also be antique stones? You will either need to source them yourself or work with a jeweler who can source nice antique stones. Many jewelers are going to have trouble with that, and I'd imagine that might be exacerbated in NZ where it is probably harder to call in a lot of diamonds at once. If the jeweler sources the stones, you're going to want to make sure they can pick ones with good light performance and faceting patterns that will go well with the AVC. I don't know if August Vintage sells tiny stones currently - at one point in time they did so it's probably worth asking. If you want proportions similar to those of the other ring, you might want .2ish each for the sidestones... I worry .1 will just be too small.

The other thing you need to worry about with what you're asking is finding pictures of what you like with only four prongs on each stone - you're saying you want four prongs but every single image you shared has way more than that! You're risking what the jeweler makes being way, way different than what is in your head with that. Are the swoopy parts you like going to translate in ways you like when the prongs are farther apart? This is actually one of the strengths of CAD versus handforged - you'll be able to see it before it's made and figure out whether or not you like it.
 

sledge

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FWIW, my wife's e-ring was done in CAD and then cast by David Klass (DK). I used their WG palladium alloy and cost for the setting was around $2k USD. Granted her design was different than most and had pave and channel set stones.

I'd think hand forged would be 1.5 to 2x that amount.
 

MollyMalone

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If you’ve not visited the website recently, you may not know that August Vintage Cushions are currently on sale; perhaps there’s an AVC in inventory that will capture your fancy: :))

Even if Jonathan doesn’t have any melee-sized AV diamonds in stock, he’s based in NYC, where he should be able to source some old cuts to use as side stones - and you can be confident that he won’t try to sell you “frozen spit“.

For an idea of Stuller prices (Stuller is a wholesaler who does not insist that retail jewelers sell Stuller merchandise at the manufacturer’s suggested retail price & different jewelers don’t all charge the same for Stuller mountings; Jonathan may give you a bit of a discount when you buy the center stone from him), spend time with this online catalog posted on the Love Affair Diamonds website:

Be sure to make all selections possible from the drop-down menus for each listing. Stuller’s prices are very “dynamic”, will vary according to your ring size, size of center stone, and of course your choice of metal.

Stuller’s online images are also a useful visual aid, for they change according to the choices you make re, e.g., shape and size of the center stone.
 

josieKat

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Here is an AVC I for under your diamond budget. (There is a K that is a bit bigger and about $300 more, but I wasn't sure you would go down in color that far.) I'd ask Jonathan if he has any small AVCs to go along with it - the extra diamond budget could go towards that. And then see what he can do for you in a three stone setting. Could you wrap your head around having a setting that is close-enough for now as you save up for the ideal hand-forged setting in the future?

 

CalliopeCladdagh

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I was planning on asking Jonathan about making the side stones for me as mini AVCs. I saw once someone on Instagram asked him about making 0.2ct AVCs and he said it was possible. If not, hopefully he could source some diamonds for me that have antique style faceting.

The prong pictures were more for the general idea of shape/vibe that I'm after. I think because my diamonds will be so much smaller, it will still translate ok with only 4 prongs per stone.

I will have a look at Stuller, thank you.

It seems my best bet is to get the whole thing made in America.
 

josieKat

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I know he's done smaller AVCs and AVRs. I just bought 20 pointer AVRs (from Good Old Gold) and I've seen 20 (or 30) pointer AVCs I think in some recent 3 stone rings he's done. If you are buying through him I'm betting he could have those made even if he doesn't have any currently.
 

CalliopeCladdagh

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Here is an AVC I for under your diamond budget. (There is a K that is a bit bigger and about $300 more, but I wasn't sure you would go down in color that far.) I'd ask Jonathan if he has any small AVCs to go along with it - the extra diamond budget could go towards that. And then see what he can do for you in a three stone setting. Could you wrap your head around having a setting that is close-enough for now as you save up for the ideal hand-forged setting in the future?

I think that's the exact one I brought up to show the jeweller here! You see that central facet that is reflecting yellow in the picture? The guy pointed to that and told me the whole stone would look that colour in real life :liar:

I am not sure how I feel about upgrading later on. I know it's common in America, but it's not really done here. I would really rather have one engagement ring that I have forever, with all its built up sentimental value and memories.
 

arkieb1

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I think Jon now does settings as well...... you could ask - it might be easier to just get him to make the whole thing for you.
 

josieKat

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I think that's the exact one I brought up to show the jeweller here! You see that central facet that is reflecting yellow in the picture? The guy pointed to that and told me the whole stone would look that colour in real life :liar:

I am not sure how I feel about upgrading later on. I know it's common in America, but it's not really done here. I would really rather have one engagement ring that I have forever, with all its built up sentimental value and memories.


What an idiot. There is yellow in the environment showing in the stone (Jonathan wearing a yellow shirt that day? sometimes they show blue or grey or red so I always wonder who was wearing what on the day the video was taken). If you want to try to convince them, you could find some videos of stones that GOG does in daylight. But I think you're better off getting everything done at the same time and place.

Here is a D next to an I. Both show yellow facets in the first part of the video! Yes, there is more body color, but especially viewed face-on it isn't a drastic difference. You could poke around and find a comparison from the side as well.

I wasn't suggesting an actual upgrade - for me changing the setting to the ideal one wouldn't be upgrading my ring the same way, but I totally get if it feels that way to you! I'd ask Jonathan about the cost for doing something cast that is what you want if you can't find a ready-made setting. (Or get a quote from DK as it would be quite straightforward to ship the stones there, and then have the finished ring sent to you.)
 
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