Evaluating jadeite (feicui)

[Crimson]

Dear friends, I need your help. My microscope arrived and I have been having fun with it! Thank you, @MMtwo.
With the microscope I was able to look more carefully at a jadeite necklace I bought rather impulsively on Saturday. There are several pieces of jadeite on the necklace. They are all intense green. In the shop, I noticed a little whitish cloud on one of the pieces. I thought perhaps it was just a “cotton” inclusion in the Jadeite. Because I was shopping with friends and chatting I forgot to examine it with a loupe.
When I got home, I opened my newly arrived microscope, and the first object I examined was the piece of Jade with the little white cloud. This is how it looks under the bright light. What disturbed me was that the whitish patch was near the claw of the setting. I noticed that there was another such cloud near a lower claw.
It doesn’t look like cotton to me. What do you think it might be? I read that Jade can be damaged and whitened by‘ a jeweller’s setting torch. So I’m wondering if this is heat damage. I didn’t spot such patches on the other pieces.
Apologies my photos are not very clear - somehow the SD card didn’t fit nicely so I just took pics off the microscope screen.
I would be very grateful for your thoughts!
Thank you.

 

[Bookwyrm]

I was waiting for @Crimson to answer this, but I'll jump in. They are different, in both the physics and the appearance. Full disclosure: I have moonstone but not jadeite.


(Left - jadeite earring; Middle, Right - moonstone.)

The glow of the jadeite earring is caused by scattering (random deflection of light as it passes through the stone). But it has to be the right sort and amount of scattering. The glowing patch and crescent at the lower left are basically reflections from the back of the cab, with the edges softened by scattering. With too little scattering you would see hard reflections. With too much, the stone would lose contrast and you would see a boring uniform grey. Goldilocks is what you want.

The glow of moonstone is adularescence. It's the result of optical interference caused by thin layers (thickness similar to the wavelengths of light) with alternating refractive indices. It's usually bluesish and shimmery, in the front of the stone, sometimes appearing to float above the stone. The glowing patch moves with the tilt of the stone, the viewing angle, and the angle of the light.

Which is glowier? Well... they are different. The glow of moonstone is fascinating when you see it. But the lighting and the stone have to be at the right angle. IMO, the glow of good jadeite is more reliable.

Wow, thank you for your explanation! You're so knowledgeable about all this! I would love to see some good moonstone and glassy jadeite and be able to appreciate the glow in person some time.

This is a bit random, but I love the star sapphire in your profile picture! My birthstone is sapphire, so I definitely have a soft spot for blue faceted sapphires and also star sapphires. Star sapphires are so so hard to find, at least in Sydney. I saw one ring with a light grey star sapphire that had multiple stars, and my friend was quite interested in purchasing it, but the next time we visited that tiny antique jewellery shop, it was already sold! I still remember the way the stars moved when the ring was tilted - absolutely magical!

 

[Starstruck8]

Wow, thank you for your explanation!

Thank you, @Bookwyrm.

This is a bit random, but I love the star sapphire in your profile picture! My birthstone is sapphire, so I definitely have a soft spot for blue faceted sapphires and also star sapphires. Star sapphires are so so hard to find, at least in Sydney.

I don't want to derail @Crimson's thread too much, but... Yes, star stones are fascinating. They are hard to find, but it's not impossible. I'm in Brisbane, which is hardly the centre of the jewellery world, but I have accumulated a fair collection. See this post:

This, shown before, is not quite complete:
It's next to impossible to make the stars align in a group photo...
Here are the others:

I bought all but one through a local jeweller. In effect, I have a standing order - they know my interest, so they keep a lookout whenever they or their dealers get new stones in or go to trade shows.

This is the expensive way. (Don't throw me off PS!) If you want to do it this way, you will have to find the right jeweller. You will have to ask directly - jewellers don't routinely stock star stones. You will have to demonstrate that you are serious (i.e. that you will actually buy a suitable stone if they find it). Your expectations will have to fit your budget - star stones come in a huge range of prices and qualities. (You will notice that none of my stones are top quality, though some are pretty good.) But it can be done. Good luck!

 

[Crimson]

I think I’ve found the answer to my question about the white patch, after trawling through sources in Chinese.
Apparently, there are different kinds of cotton. They have rather fanciful and yet descriptive names, such as white pin, white dot, ringworm, flower, thread and brain.
What showed up under my microscope was not heat damage, but rather, a cotton flower. Thank goodness it is wasn’t a cotton brain or ringworm.
Attaching a pic below for fun. The types of cotton are, from left, Cotton dots, cotton threads, cotton, flowers, and cotton brain.

I’m still in two minds whether to keep the jadeite necklace. It is made up of 8 pieces of intense green, highly translucent jadeite in different shapes - saddle, marquise, gourd, oval, round. It looks just a bit too similar to another necklace that I have. So perhaps I’ll return it and look for something different.

 

[Crimson]

Thank you, @Bookwyrm.

I don't want to derail @Crimson's thread too much, but... Yes, star stones are fascinating. They are hard to find, but it's not impossible. I'm in Brisbane, which is hardly the centre of the jewellery world, but I have accumulated a fair collection. See this post:

I bought all but one through a local jeweller. In effect, I have a standing order - they know my interest, so they keep a lookout whenever they or their dealers get new stones in or go to trade shows.

@starstruck Such fun! Wow, a standing order. It is like a subscription. Um, to relate it back to jadeite, the Qing court had a standing order for all jadeite.
@Bookwyrm I am in a star sapphire craze too. Couldn’t resist trying all three on the other day. this was a hurried shot in diffused light so I didn’t quite capture the stars.

 

[Starstruck8]

I am in a star sapphire craze too. Couldn’t resist trying all three on the other day. this was a hurried shot in diffused light so I didn’t quite capture the stars.

Wow! The colour and transparency of the top two are excellent. With the multiple lights, I can't comment on the quality of the stars.

The four rays (clear in the lowest picture) are interesting. I'm guessing from the two light reflections that it's a single 4-ray star with two lights (as opposed to a double 4-ray star, or an extra star caused by reflection from the back). Is this correct? A 4-ray star is unusual in sapphire - it could be that one set of needles is missing.

Are you close to buying these (or some other) star stones?

 

[Crimson]

Wow! The colour and transparency of the top two are excellent. With the multiple lights, I can't comment on the quality of the stars.

The four rays (clear in the lowest picture) are interesting. I'm guessing from the two light reflections that it's a single 4-ray star with two lights (as opposed to a double 4-ray star, or an extra star caused by reflection from the back). Is this correct? A 4-ray star is unusual in sapphire - it could be that one set of needles is missing.

Are you close to buying these (or some other) star stones?

 

[Bookwyrm]

Thank you, @Bookwyrm.



I don't want to derail @Crimson's thread too much, but... Yes, star stones are fascinating. They are hard to find, but it's not impossible. I'm in Brisbane, which is hardly the centre of the jewellery world, but I have accumulated a fair collection. See this post:


I bought all but one through a local jeweller. In effect, I have a standing order - they know my interest, so they keep a lookout whenever they or their dealers get new stones in or go to trade shows.

This is the expensive way. (Don't throw me off PS!) If you want to do it this way, you will have to find the right jeweller. You will have to ask directly - jewellers don't routinely stock star stones. You will have to demonstrate that you are serious (i.e. that you will actually buy a suitable stone if they find it). Your expectations will have to fit your budget - star stones come in a huge range of prices and qualities. (You will notice that none of my stones are top quality, though some are pretty good.) But it can be done. Good luck!

Oh my gosh, your collection is amazing Your jeweller must be a miracle worker! I will definitely pass along all your tips to my friend - thank you!

When I find the time, I must look through that star sapphire thread

Just curious, how strong does the light need to be for the stars to show up? Do they show in normal daylight where there's no sun?
Are star sapphires with a single star rarer than those with multiple?

 

[Bookwyrm]

Um, to relate it back to jadeite, the Qing court had a standing order for all jadeite.

Keeping the thread educational! <3

@Bookwyrm I am in a star sapphire craze too. Couldn’t resist trying all three on the other day. this was a hurried shot in diffused light so I didn’t quite capture the stars.

I love that purple one! Such a pretty colour My friend is actually from Singapore; I'm not sure if you're looking to buy any of those, but if you're willing, can you please share some jewellers in Singapore that might have star sapphires? She only recently got into jewellery so I don't think she knows many jewellers in Singapore; I still feel so bad that the grey star sapphire she was eyeing sold so fast - I'm trying to help her find another one that she likes!

I'm still so jealous you live in Singapore! You find the most FABULOUS jewels to share with us!

I'd love to add a star sapphire to my collection someday too, but I think right now, I have a bunch of other projects I need to get started on or finish. I also just purchased two brooches kind of on a whim so I should probably row myself to ban island until I get to visit the US and pick up my pink marquise...

 

[Starstruck8]

Oh my gosh, your collection is amazing Your jeweller must be a miracle worker! I will definitely pass along all your tips to my friend - thank you!

When I find the time, I must look through that star sapphire thread

Just curious, how strong does the light need to be for the stars to show up? Do they show in normal daylight where there's no sun?

Thank you, @Bookwyrm! Yes, the star sapphire thread is very useful - it covers the range of sizes, types and quality. You have raised a very important point: Stars only show in hard direct light (i.e. from 'small' light sources). Direct sun is ideal. Some overhead lights can work. But you will never see a star under an overcast sky, or in shade on a sunny day, or in soft indoor lighting. You must bear this is mind if you are considering a star stone. Choose a stone that looks attractive even when the star is not showing.


@Crimson, is something missing from your reply?

Thinking about it a bit more, I'm suspecting that the 4-ray star is basically a 6-ray star with the 'long' rays (i.e. that would have been oriented to the length of the stone) missing. Reasons: this is consistent with the quite broad angle of the visible rays; at the extreme left there appears to be a trace of a long ray; there appears to be some subtle zoning running across the stone, which would be consistent with the orientation of the 'missing' long rays. Why might the long rays be missing? I have no idea.

 

[Crimson]

Thanks, @Starstruck8. I accidentally posted a blank message. I had some WiFi problems. Apologies!
Glad you like the star sapphires. Their translucency makes them look quite magical.
The pinkish-purple one is over 11 ct, from Sri Lanka., It has a lower dome and a bigger face.
The blue one is over 14 ct, from Burma. It resembles a body of water. The dome is almost 1 cm.
Perhaps it is because of the transparency that it shows stars in all sorts of ways(?)
It doesn’t need much light to produce an effect. Just a bit of sunlight will do. Sometimes only the more prominent four rays appear, but as doubles. Most times, there are six rays - the centre two are thinner than the other four. Sometimes I see eight because an inclusion at the centre becomes an extra set of rays. It’s a mischievous star sapphire and I love it. Below is a pic from the gem report.
When the jeweller told me the stars had arrived, I rushed to the store and bought the blue one. My BFF went there later and snagged the pinkish-purple one. The jeweller was delighted. He didn’t expect to sell them in a jiffy.
I must go to Ban Island for the rest of the year.

Turning back to jadeite, Classic Jade posted this big, yummy lavender cab today.

 

[mellowyellowgirl]

Omg omg omg I want that bangle

I would wear the heck out of it I’m a bangle girl!!

 

[Crimson]

Keeping the thread educational! <3
I love that purple one! Such a pretty colour My friend is actually from Singapore; I'm not sure if you're looking to buy any of those, but if you're willing, can you please share some jewellers in Singapore that might have star sapphires? She only recently got into jewellery so I don't think she knows many jewellers in Singapore; I still feel so bad that the grey star sapphire she was eyeing sold so fast - I'm trying to help her find another one that she likes!

I'm still so jealous you live in Singapore! You find the most FABULOUS jewels to share with us!

I'd love to add a star sapphire to my collection someday too, but I think right now, I have a bunch of other projects I need to get started on or finish. I also just purchased two brooches kind of on a whim so I should probably row myself to ban island until I get to visit the US and pick up my pink marquise...

Ooh, I love brooches! Hope you will share them on PS.
My BFF and I bought the star rings… sometimes people call us the Little Twin Stars and now we are! Below is a pic of us rushing to the store.



I don’t come across star stones often but will keep a lookout. The biggest one I have seen in Singapore was at Vihari which has since closed its showroom. You can see the star ruby in this video.

Star Ruby - In The Know Singapore

The Star Ruby by Vihari Jewels is the largest untreated Burmese rubies in the world, and reflects light shone on it in a star pattern due to asterism.

sg.style.yahoo.com

The pendant Is from Asiatique Fine Jewellery. It might still be available!

 

[Crimson]

Omg omg omg I want that bangle

I would wear the heck out of it I’m a bangle girl!!

Haha I am sure you would! Is the cab big enough for your liking?
15.2mm x 13.2mm x 8.2mm.
Shall I ask them for the price? I am curious too, hehe.

 

[Bookwyrm]

Thank you, @Bookwyrm! Yes, the star sapphire thread is very useful - it covers the range of sizes, types and quality. You have raised a very important point: Stars only show in hard direct light (i.e. from 'small' light sources). Direct sun is ideal. Some overhead lights can work. But you will never see a star under an overcast sky, or in shade on a sunny day, or in soft indoor lighting. You must bear this is mind if you are considering a star stone. Choose a stone that looks attractive even when the star is not showing.

Thank you! I will pass this advice along to my friend

 

[Bookwyrm]

Ooh, I love brooches! Hope you will share them on PS.
My BFF and I bought the star rings… sometimes people call us the Little Twin Stars and now we are! Below is a pic of us rushing to the store.



I don’t come across star stones often but will keep a lookout. The biggest one I have seen in Singapore was at Vihari which has since closed its showroom. You can see the star ruby in this video.

Star Ruby - In The Know Singapore

The Star Ruby by Vihari Jewels is the largest untreated Burmese rubies in the world, and reflects light shone on it in a star pattern due to asterism.

sg.style.yahoo.com

The pendant Is from Asiatique Fine Jewellery. It might still be available!

Oh my gosh that is so adorable! Will your boyfriend be wearing the purple star sapphire ring? I would love to hear the story behind your nicknames - 'Little Twin Stars' is so cute! My friend from Singapore and I both love celestial themed jewellery. She just purchased a starry antique bangle and she's over the moon about it!

I'll let my friend know about the pendant - thank you! <3

 

[Crimson]

I was waiting for @Crimson to answer this, but I'll jump in. They are different, in both the physics and the appearance. Full disclosure: I have moonstone but not jadeite.


(Left - jadeite earring; Middle, Right - moonstone.)

The glow of the jadeite earring is caused by scattering (random deflection of light as it passes through the stone). But it has to be the right sort and amount of scattering. The glowing patch and crescent at the lower left are basically reflections from the back of the cab, with the edges softened by scattering. With too little scattering you would see hard reflections. With too much, the stone would lose contrast and you would see a boring uniform grey. Goldilocks is what you want.

The glow of moonstone is adularescence. It's the result of optical interference caused by thin layers (thickness similar to the wavelengths of light) with alternating refractive indices. It's usually bluesish and shimmery, in the front of the stone, sometimes appearing to float above the stone. The glowing patch moves with the tilt of the stone, the viewing angle, and the angle of the light.

Which is glowier? Well... they are different. The glow of moonstone is fascinating when you see it. But the lighting and the stone have to be at the right angle. IMO, the glow of good jadeite is more reliable.

I have finally taken some moonstone vs glassy jadeite pics for @Bookwyrm.
The first photo is in dimmer light. The two other photos were taken by the window in the early evening. In dimmer lighting conditions, it is harder for the moonstone to show its adularescemce. However, the jadeitr seems to glow in the dark and looks interesting in dim lighting;

 

[Bookwyrm]

Ooh, I love brooches! Hope you will share them on PS.

I'm actually going to pick up the brooches from New York at the same time I pick up my marquise. I still haven't planned that holiday yet, but will probably be around 3 months or so from now...the wait is hard! I'm very excited to visit the jewellery district in New York (and really hoping the US doesn't get any crazier...)!

These are the vendor pics of the Tiffany brooches - the leafy one was made in the year I was born (so cool!) and the butterfly I'm guessing is much older because the the engraving at the back seems hand-carved rather than stamped. They don't come with any papers or anything, and I have zero clue how to go about authenticating them, but I'll try to figure that out after I collect them (and I should probably consult all the vintage/antique experts on PS too)! I looove the detail on the butterfly!





And uhhh, to insert some jade into our conversation, here is a super pretty jade butterfly brooch, and an AWESOME jade parrot brooch (that seems imperial green)!

 

[Bookwyrm]

I have finally taken some moonstone vs glassy jadeite pics for @Bookwyrm.
The first photo is in dimmer light. The two other photos were taken by the window in the early evening. In dimmer lighting conditions, it is harder for the moonstone to show its adularescemce. However, the jadeitr seems to glow in the dark and looks interesting in dim lighting;

Oh wow - thank you so much for sharing comparison pictures! I don't think I've ever seen good glassy jadeite or moonstone in person...I really MUST visit Singapore some time - just for the jewellery!

I'd love to see that glow in the dark effect in person. I think, knowing what you just shared, I might prefer glassy jadeite over moonstone, but that blue sheen of moonstone is beautiful! Glassy jadeite is now firmly on my jewellery wishlist!

 

[Crimson]

It is a long weekend in Singapore so of course I went to a jewellery store.

I'm actually going to pick up the brooches from New York at the same time I pick up my marquise. I still haven't planned that holiday yet, but will probably be around 3 months or so from now...the wait is hard! I'm very excited to visit the jewellery district in New York (and really hoping the US doesn't get any crazier...)!

These are the vendor pics of the Tiffany brooches - the leafy one was made in the year I was born (so cool!) and the butterfly I'm guessing is much older because the the engraving at the back seems hand-carved rather than stamped. They don't come with any papers or anything, and I have zero clue how to go about authenticating them, but I'll try to figure that out after I collect them! I looove the detail on the butterfly!





And uhhh, to insert some jade into our conversation, here is a super pretty jade butterfly brooch, and an AWESOME jade parrot brooch (that seems imperial green)!

Ooh! I love them! The older brooches appeal to me. I think it is the craftsmanship and the fact that they have stood the test of time… I like botanical motifs very much. The swirl of the leaves is so pleasing and the butterfly wings - there is so much energy in the texture.

I am excited for your US trip. I hope you will enjoy every bit of it. It is a long way from Australia… will you stop by Singapore? Hehe.

 

[mellowyellowgirl]

Haha I am sure you would! Is the cab big enough for your liking?
15.2mm x 13.2mm x 8.2mm.
Shall I ask them for the price? I am curious too, hehe.

Yes please!!!!!! I would love to know!

 

[Autumn in New England]

I have finally taken some moonstone vs glassy jadeite pics for @Bookwyrm.
The first photo is in dimmer light. The two other photos were taken by the window in the early evening. In dimmer lighting conditions, it is harder for the moonstone to show its adularescemce. However, the jadeitr seems to glow in the dark and looks interesting in dim lighting;

The jadeite is, of course, incredible. But that moonstone in the ring! Finest I've ever seen in the blue flash material! Set with opal, diamond, and emerald?

 

[Crimson]

The jadeite is, of course, incredible. But that moonstone in the ring! Finest I've ever seen in the blue flash material! Set with opal, diamond, and emerald?

Oh my gosh that is so adorable! Will your boyfriend be wearing the purple star sapphire ring? I would love to hear the story behind your nicknames - 'Little Twin Stars' is so cute! My friend from Singapore and I both love celestial themed jewellery. She just purchased a starry antique bangle and she's over the moon about it!

I'll let my friend know about the pendant - thank you! <3

Haha, we are best friends forever. He cannot wear the purple star ring , it is a women’s style ring, so… yay for me!
Btw just a note re: glassy jadeite, if and when you look for it, think about lightbulbs. Some have a warmer, yellowish light and some have a pure white light. Those with the white light are considered more desirable and cost more. They should have that open and shut eye effect. Ideally, they should glow without any help from metal backing and you should be able to see through them

 

[Crimson]

The jadeite is, of course, incredible. But that moonstone in the ring! Finest I've ever seen in the blue flash material! Set with opal, diamond, and emerald?

So glad you like it! I had to get it because it is doubly phenomenal ring. The opals complement the moonstone so well. You are right, the moonstone is lovely. It is very clean and clear. The green gems are tsavorites. The ring was designed by a local jeweller. He called it the White Sakura.
I do have another super blue moonstone. It has been made into a simple pendant.

 

[Seastheday]

So glad you like it! I had to get it because it is doubly phenomenal ring. The opals complement the moonstone so well. You are right, the moonstone is lovely. It is very clean and clear. The green gems are tsavorites. The ring was designed by a local jeweller. He called it the White Sakura.
I do have another super blue moonstone. It has been made into a simple pendant.

I love the color and shape; it’s like a magical drop of moonlight! Would love to see the finished product!

 

[Seastheday]

@Crimson Inspired by @MMtwo and her amazing microscope, I did the same with my jade drop earrings:



I’m assuming what I’m seeing are dye lines? Again, these drops did not light up at under UV.

Should I assume these are dyed only? Or should I out of curiosity send to Mason Kay for a report? Or maybe for $2000 purchase price, prob not worth the time/cost for a report if likely they are already dyed?

I’m happy with how they look on me so really not a huge deal to me either way. Just fun to learn!

 

[Crimson]

Hi @seas

@Crimson Inspired by @MMtwo and her amazing microscope, I did the same with my jade drop earrings:



I’m assuming what I’m seeing are dye lines? Again, these drops did not light up at under UV.

Should I assume these are dyed only? Or should I out of curiosity send to Mason Kay for a report? Or maybe for $2000 purchase price, prob not worth the time/cost for a report if likely they are already dyed?

I’m happy with how they look on me so really not a huge deal to me either way. Just fun to learn!

@Seastheday, yes, @MM_two has got us going with her microscope!
For some reason, I cannot see your first few photos, only the last two.
I am attaching some photos for you to compare with.
The photos below show Type A jadeite color roots. Note that the roots are visible, but even under magnification they do not present as clear lines. Instead, there’s a gradual shading.

The photos below show treated jadeite.
This photo shows the places where dye has collected. You can see how there’s a clear concentration of dye in the lines where there are spaces or tiny cracks.

This photo shows the web-like effect on treated jadeite.

 

[Autumn in New England]

So glad you like it! I had to get it because it is doubly phenomenal ring. The opals complement the moonstone so well. You are right, the moonstone is lovely. It is very clean and clear. The green gems are tsavorites. The ring was designed by a local jeweller. He called it the White Sakura.
I do have another super blue moonstone. It has been made into a simple pendant.

It's so glassy with such an ethereal blue!

Also, the tsavs in the ring are super fine... could've fooled me!!

 

[Crimson]

It's so glassy with such an ethereal blue!

Also, the tsavs in the ring are super fine... could've fooled me!!

@Autumn in New England So happy to hear this! I shall let the jeweller know - he’ll be thrilled. I was too busy to see the ring when it was finished. By the time I got there I assumed it had been sold but it hadn’t. What a pity! Apparently, some customers deemed it too large. As we and @mellowyellowgirl know, there is no such thing as a “too big” fabulous ring so I bought it!
Speaking of fab things, here are some jadeite pieces I visited over the weekend.
@Starstruck8 the third photo is of some Chinese Deco inspired pieces.

 

[Seastheday]

@Crimson Thanks so much! I see now how color roots are supposed to look!