Find your diamond
Find your jewelry
shape
carat
color
clarity

Diamond comparison for 0.3cts-0.4cts size

Wombats

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 12, 2016
Messages
136
Good Morning

I'm interested in your opinions on what you think is a better diamond in the 0.3cts -0.4cts size, for a 5 stone ring. Assuming all are Ideal Cut, with similar parameters and just focusing on colour and clarity:

* Colour I Clarity VS2

Or

* Colour G Clarity SI

Would you assign a premium if one was a Hearts and Arrow cut versus a standard round brilliant cut?

Thanks so much for your assistance.
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
56,283
How about splitting the difference and go for H VS2? If that is not an option, I'd go with the G stones if they were totally eyeclean. I usually try to go with VS2, though.
 

Wombats

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 12, 2016
Messages
136
Thank you, the reason I ask, is that in Australia I'm being told to aim for better colour over clarity. And am generally being offered D-G/SI1 stones. However the online quotes from the US are generally offering I / VS1 stones. Obviously, I need to get like for like quotes, but I was wondering what people's preference was - colour or clarity.

Thanks so much
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
I'd go G Si1 (eyeclean) all day long in that size. In fact I had five .3 range (4.4mm) G SI1 BGD signature diamonds in this band (when I owned it):


diamond-wedding-ring-dreamer.jpg

You can see more pictures here: http://www.pricescope.com/blog/jewel-week-new-home-ps-pre-loved-diamond-ring

No hesitation for me. BUT those are superideals. They are ideal cut (truly, not just some 'claim' by a random vendor) AGS0 BGD signature diamonds. So basically they rival Hearts on Fire stones.


So, make sure you go to a Hearts on Fire Dealer (leave your wallet at home) and spend an hour letting them teach you about diamond cut.

I'd take an ideal cut J Si2 (eyeclean) over a poorly cut G VS1. Cut is that important.
 

Wombats

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 12, 2016
Messages
136
Thanks so much Gypsy for your feedback. That is a lovely ring!

I spent time at a jeweller yesterday and looked at a genuine HOF 1.5cts TCW 5 stone ring. I nearly fell over when given the price...a A$25000 /US$17500 ring! Over twice our budget and twice other quotes for similar colour and clarity ideal cut round brilliants. Is the HOF cut that special that it demands a premium of that size?

I have a quote from BGD for 5 x 0.3cts I VS2 signature stones in the Nightingale setting, at US$620 / A$790 per stone. I have a 4.75 finger and want a comfortable everyday ring and think this suits. The setting is more than I wanted to spend and I'm not 100% sold on it yet.

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/wedding-and-anniversary-bands/eternity-bands/nightingale-18k-yellow-gold-5394y18

We've looked at BM jewellers here in Australia and have been offered Canadian mined diamonds triple ideal, displaying hearts and arrows E/SI 0.3cts A$1400/ US$980 per stone.

Alternatively, in Australia we've been offered excellent brilliant cut diamonds in F/VS uncertified or G/SI certified for around A$1200/US$820 per stone.

So it seems buying in the US is better value for us. Even when taking into account 10% sales tax and exchange rate. We estimate we're around US$1500-2000 better off buying online.

I'm still waiting for feedback from ID Jewelery and White flash. And have also contacted Jewels by Grace.

I am chasing this look:

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/i-d-jewelry-5-stone-ring.142391/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/i-d-jewelry-5-stone-ring.142391/[/URL]

Anyway enough rambling from me! Thanks again. I'm just learning about all of this and trying to get my head around a once in a decade purchase! [SMILING FACE WITH OPEN MOUTH]


Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
Okay so. Make sure you send a follow up to IDJ. Did you send it to the "Info" address?

I am planning (eventually) to get a 7 stone band. And I will be working with IDJ for it. Yekutiel really does a fabulous job for Pricescopers (you should tell I referred you). And for the quality you get the price is normally fantastic (which is why so many of us use IDJ for bands). And he has very good custom benches if you want a custom setting (I would be getting a custom 7 stone bar set setting from him).

I am pretty sure they will ship to Australia too.

As for the look. 35 pointers should be a great look for you. I would go for H VS-SI (eyeclean) from IDJ. I would expect that to cost about 600-650 a stone plus the setting cost. That's for GIA graded stones. If you don't need stones with lab reports, it might be less.

As for Hearts on Fire. We call them Wallets on Fire for a reason. If you want Hearts on Fire you are best off with a second hand piece because, as you have discovered, they have a ridiculous mark up.

And no, there isn't that much of a difference. BGD is comparable (I've actually worn a Hearts on Fire right on the same finger next to that Aurora Band) and so is WF. And so is Infinity.

The stones IDJ get for pricescopers are excellent cuts, but they aren't super ideals. Honestly though, in a band you don't really need it. And that's coming from many picky pricescopers.

I do personally LOVE BGD. Truly. I have only the BEST experiences with them and know you will get an amazing product with them. But if costs are a concern (as they are for many of us) then you can see what other vendors have to offer.
 

Wombats

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 12, 2016
Messages
136
Thank you so much Gypsy. I'll wait to hear back from IDJ and go from there.

I'll even consider a pre loved ring, if it has the right look.

It will be interesting to get some quotes in. I'll report back before we make our final decision.

Cheers

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
 

fair75

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 28, 2015
Messages
87
BGD and IDJ are both good vendors and your final decision will most likely depend on the cost and/or if you prefer super ideals or not. However, if you are comfortable picking ideal-cut diamonds yourself, you will most likely get whiter diamonds at similar prices if you shop at vendors like James Allen. I am in the process of creating a five-stone pendant with 0.30 ct diamonds and I am the kind of person who doesn't mind spending some time and effort choosing diamonds. I already bought two E, SI1 0.3 ct diamonds that are eye clean from JA. I basically put in my preferred ideal proportions to search the stones and look at the videos and GIA/AGS certificates to determine if they meet my criteria. Depending on the 4Cs and other factors, costs may vary. I paid about $535 and $607 (US dollars) for both diamonds (pre-tax) and they are E color! Of course, nice ideal-cut I color diamonds will be white if you set them in white gold or platinum setting. But if you put them next to the D or E color, many can see a difference. I just quickly searched the JA site for diamonds that are 0.3 ct, triple Ex, D-G and SI1, and there are quite a few of them that are between $600 and $680. You can also get a discount if you tell them you are a pricescope member.

Based on my experiences and what I know, the differences between super ideals (Hearts and Arrows with precise ideal cut) and well-cut ideals (near H&A but the cut is not as precise as H&A) at 0.3 ct size will be very minuscule. I think the majority of the diamond shoppers will not be able to tell the differences. The two diamonds I bought are super bright and sparkly, and their idealscope/ASET scope images are great(I have the scopes to verify the light performance).

Of course, this route is not for everyone. You need to be patient and personally look at all diamonds and the certificate numbers to decide if the stones will look similiar in size and color. For me, it's worth it because I can get diamonds that are significantly whiter (assuming cut, clarity and weight are the same). It just happens that I prefer icy white diamonds (G diamonds are good too when they are ideally cut), especially when they can be bought at similiar prices as I or H colors that are offered by many vendors.

Buying branded/non-branded diamonds and setting together at reputable vendors can save you a lot of time and effort, not to mention the peace of mind you get. If you don't want the headaches of selecting diamonds yourself and having the setting made separately, going with WF, BGD, IDJ and other good vendors will be your best bet. But for me, I like the idea of paying similar prices for ideal-cut diamonds that are D, E or F.
 

Wombats

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 12, 2016
Messages
136
Thank you fair75, for your detailed response. You are of course right.

However I'm not sure if I am confident to select the diamonds myself, particularly in the area of assessing the cut and looking at the scope images, to match the diamonds. I will take some time to read more about this.

There is a real risk that I enjoy the process and create a potentially expensive hobby [WINKING FACE]

Thanks so much [SMILING FACE WITH SMILING EYES]

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
 

Wombats

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 12, 2016
Messages
136
Thank you for thinking of me, however I'm after diamonds the same size, with a yellow gold band / white gold claws.

Cheers

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
 

fair75

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 28, 2015
Messages
87
Wombats|1468710021|4056176 said:
Thank you fair75, for your detailed response. You are of course right.

However I'm not sure if I am confident to select the diamonds myself, particularly in the area of assessing the cut and looking at the scope images, to match the diamonds. I will take some time to read more about this.

There is a real risk that I enjoy the process and create a potentially expensive hobby [WINKING FACE]

Thanks so much [SMILING FACE WITH SMILING EYES]

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

Selecting diamonds based on certificates and photos/videos online without ideal scope/ASET scope images isn't easy and requires some knowledge about the 4Cs. I can share my experiences buying online and what I know about diamonds. Hopefully, it will help you if you do decide to pick the stones yourself.

In my opinion, if you aren't buying super ideal diamonds (H&A with precise cut and excellent ideal scope/ASET scope images), then shopping at vendors like James Allen would be a good idea, assuming you are choosing diamonds yourself. Having access to high-definition photos and videos is crucial. The following advice is largely based on selecting diamonds from JA, although a lot of information can be used to help you choose on other sites.


1. The most important factor in picking diamonds is the cut. You probably already know that after your research and reading posts on PS. The advantage of insisting on GIA triple excellent/AGS triple 0 ideal-cut diamonds with ideal proportions is that they will have the best possible brilliance, fire and sparkles. Moreover, these diamonds have the benefit of making diamonds appear whiter than their actual graded colors, especially H or lower colors. They can also help mask inclusions and make lower-clarity diamonds appear eye-clean. This is one area you DO NOT want to compromise. Now you may ask, so what ideal numbers should be used to select ideal-cut diamonds? The following is what I use to select diamonds for myself, which may be slightly different from other PS members.


Ideal Cut
Size (personal preference)
Color (personal preference)
Clarity (personal preference)

Table: 53 - 58% (54 - 57% preferred)
Depth: 60 - 61.9%
Excellent Symmetry
Excellent Polish
GIA/AGS


After you set the parameters using the criteria listed above, you will see some diamonds on the screen. Then you will have to pull up the certificate for each diamond individually and look at the stats to see if they fall in the ranges below.

Crown angle: 34 to 35 degrees
Pavilion angle: 40.6 - 40.8 degrees
Lower girdle length: 75 - 80% (75 to 77% would have bold fire while 80% is optimized for pin-fire)
Star length: 45 - 55%
girdle thickness: Thin-Medium


The main reason why I prefer crown angle between 34 and 35 degrees with pavilion angle between 40.6 and 40.8 degrees is that GIA numbers are averaged and rounded. Without access to ideal scope/ASET scope images (as of now, it seems JA only provides ideal scope images on their True Hearts diamonds) to evaluate light performance, it is safer to be strict on the angles. Of course, you can put in the numbers that are outside the ranges for more search results, personal preferences or to meet your budget.


Assuming you have narrowed your selections down to a few diamonds, it would be time to look at optical symmetry. Here you would want to select the ones that have dark and distinct arrows. In addition, you want the ones that have great arrow patterns.

Ideal scope/ASET scope images: In case you have access to the images, you can either post them on here and some PS members would most likely help you interpret. Or if you want, you can learn more about these images by going to these sites.

https://www.pricescope.com/journal/what-aset-reveals-ideal-scope-does-not
http://www.whiteflash.com/about-diamonds/diamond-education/idealscope-overview-and-examples.htm
http://highperformancediamonds.com/education/performance-tutorial/


2. Color: For example, if you chose D-F color diamonds, they will face up icy white, assuming they are ideally-cut. G color diamonds are popular because they can look very close to icy white (when ideally cut) and are priced lower than D/E/F stones. But what you want to pay attention to is the body color in the video. As the diamond is rotating in the video, look at the body color and see if it's low, mid or high color. What this means is that a graded color is a range. For example, three diamonds can be graded G, but they may have different body colors. One may be closer to an F, or can be closer to the H when you view it from the side or the bottom. Some could even appear grey or brown. Naturally, I think most people will choose the ones that are closer to white.


H or I color diamonds would appear white in white gold or platinum setting, although the yellow tint is usually visible if you view them from the side. Diamonds with H/I colors can be good bargains and a compromise to meet people's budget. But if you prefer icy-white diamonds, then you should avoid them.

Depending on your preferences, you may elect to choose whiter or warmer colors.



3. Clarity: In addition to the guide(s) on PS about clarity, there are also some sites that offer detailed explanations about clarity and how to choose eye-clean diamonds.

https://www.diamonds.pro/diamond-clarity-scale-chart/
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond-clarity



Different people have different requirements of clarity. Some people are ok with diamonds that are eye-clean, but others may want high-clarity diamonds for personal/cultural reasons. This will also depend on your preferences.


4. Carat: Again, this is a personal preference.



5. Fluorescence: Generally speaking, avoid medium, strong or very strong fluorescence on colorless diamonds (D,E,F) unless independent professional gemologists or in-house gemologists at reputable vendors can determine that these diamonds don't look hazy/milky. However, medium fluorescence usually can make H or lower color diamonds look whiter.


I hope the information in this post can help you make informed decisions when you are ready to purchase diamonds. Like I stated before, buying diamonds and settings together from reputable vendors would most likely be a good idea if you want the peace of mind and convenience. But if you find satisfaction in selecting diamonds yourself and are comfortable and confident in doing so, you could potentially get whiter diamonds at similar prices. There is no right or wrong way to do this. It is all up to you. Good luck on getting the diamonds of your dream! :angel:
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
Good post fair, that said the specs are a little too narrow, and will rule out many lovely stones.

If you can get an ideal scope image these specs are what I use:
Table: 60 or less
Depth: 59-62.3
Crown: 33.5-35.5
Pavilion: 40.6-40.9 (GIA 41 on with shallower crown)
And the crown and pavilion angles must be complimentary, which is what the HCA checks for you.

Avoid thin and very thin girdles.
 

Wombats

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 12, 2016
Messages
136
Thank you so much for taking the time to take me through this. After searching based on your parameters, I honestly found the process overwhelming! Perhaps it would be different with diamonds in front of me that I could practice on.

In the end, think I'll stick with someone doing the selecting for me.

I have a quote back from IDJ, so will look at that closely. What is the etiquette on the forum? Are we allowed to discuss price details? Or is this rude?

Finally, a question on the setting please: It will be 18ct YG band. Do people prefer white gold or platinum claws? I've been told by different jewellers this week that both are stronger and more suited to low shared prong settings and I'm not sure who to believe??

Thanks so much again.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
Hi. Just saw this update. Yes, you can discuss pricing.

As for prongs for a shared prong. I don't know. You might want to post a separate thread asking the bench jewelers.
 
Be a part of the community It's free, join today!
    November’s Jewels Of The Weeks
    November’s Jewels Of The Weeks
    Upgrade to Five-Stone
    Upgrade to Five-Stone
    Elizabeth Taylor's Diamond Heart
    Elizabeth Taylor's Diamond Heart

Need Something Special?

Get a quote from multiple trusted and vetted jewelers.

Holloway Cut Advisor



Diamond Eye Candy

Click to view full-size image.
Top