Diamond Advice

[supermsp]

Hi, Everyone

I'm new to the forum and I need some advice on this diamond (I put it on hold so it's not available to buy):

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.46-carat-d-color-vvs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-725795

Can you anyone fill me in on the positives and negatives of this diamond?

Thanks!

 

[Gypsy]

It's a potentially nice stone. Unless you are looking at such high clarity for cultural reasons you are wasting your money.

The 36 crown angle needs and idealscope to check for leakage. So if they don't get you one, it's a pass.

What is your budget?

And what type of setting do you want?

There are likely better balanced stones at other vendors with nicer setting and prong work available.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Welcome! That stone has a very high crown angle and might have leakage. We recommend asking James Allen for an ASET image for the top three stones you are considering (as that is all they will provide). That will show light return and leakage. I'd suggest searching using the information below.

These are measurements to help you stay in ideal cut territory with a GIA excellent cut stone.

table: 54-58

depth: 60-62.3

crown angle: 34-35.0 (up to 35.5 crown angle can sometimes work with a 40.6 pav angle)

pavilion angle: 40.6-40.9 (sometimes 41.0 if the crown angle is close to 34)

Well cut stones face up quite white, so unless there are cultural reasons that you want D VVS, most people here go for a lower color and clarity to get a larger stone or save money. You will see very little or any difference in an F VS1 over a D VVS. The cut is the number one factor in the diamond's beauty. If you want highest quality, then cut needs to be a major factor and you can look at the superideal cut vendors: Good Old Gold, High Performance Diamonds, Victor Canera, and Whiteflash.

 

[Gypsy]

Something like these is a better choice. I'm going to assume your budget is around 15k-20k.

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3653222.htm
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3617118.htm
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3625405.htm
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3653224.htm

E and F are EXTREMELY white. And VS and eyeclean is as high as you need to go in a round. It will be distinguishable from an IF stone to the naked eye. I have a Vs1 and I have issues finding the inclusions with a loupe.

WF has much nicer settings than JA as well. What type of setting does the wearer want?

Brian Gavin also has ideal cut stones and an even better (IMO) setting selection thatn WF. So depending on the setting type the wearer wants, they would be an excellent choice as well.

 

[supermsp]

Yep budget is around 15-20k, I was thinking vvs+ but I can see reasons why vs+ works since its eye clean. Your right, I wanted to look for a hearts and arrows cut but james allen didn't have any vvs+ stones and that would probably be out of my price range anyway. I haven't really explored whiteflash, I'm going to check it out these seem like good options.

She wanted a pave setting, I'm trying to find a pave setting with a little bit thicker band, the james allen ones are petite pave and in order to get a thicker band it would have to be cathedral type.

Interesting fact, that exact diamond on James Allen is on b2c jewels, same exact GIA number and $2000 less. But I can see some issues with the diamond, I requested idealscope images so we'll see and I'll post them when I get them.

http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-6210296-1.46-carat-Round-diamond-D-color-VVS2-clarity.aspx

I noticed on b2c jewels that the diamond sits really high in their settings, any reason why? I"m assuming the diamond shows better being high up but she would prefer something lower so it doesn't snag on things, James allen settings seem to sit right on the band. Is that something that can be requested for the diamond to sit near the band instead of in the air?

 

[Gypsy]

I wouldn't order a pave setting from any but a few vendors. Quality REALLY matters with pave (let me know if you want further reading on this).

Does she want a pave solitaire or a pave halo?

WF has several nice pave solitaires. And so does BGD. Pave halos are a slightly different kettle of fish. Not that I wouldn't buy one from WF or BGD, but there might be other options I would explore first.

Best WF pave solitaire settings:

http://www.whiteflash.com/engagement-rings/diamond-settings/legato-sleek-line-pave-diamond-engagement-ring-1120.htm This pave setting is a brightcut pave (style of pave) that is extremely durable. That setting allows a flush fit straight wedding band. And it has a very safe 2.5mm width that tapers at the head and would look great with a 1.5 carat or so stone. You should go for the platinum version if your lady wants white metal.

http://www.whiteflash.com/engagement-rings/diamond-settings/caroline-pave-diamond-engagement-ring-by-vatche-682.htm The Vatche Caroline Pave is a gorgeous ring. It has two lovely rows of pave. And it would also be a nice choice with a 1.5 carat center.

This is actually my favorite pave solitaire:
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/engagement-rings/pave-and-side-stones/legera-pave-platinum-5861p You are just fine at 1.9mm in a platinum pave shank and this will set off that center stone to perfection.
And this is the 6 prong version:
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/engagement-rings/pave-and-side-stones/legera-pave-six-prong-platinum-6649p

The Freya has the prettiest profile: http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/engagement-rings/pave-and-side-stones/freya-pave-platinum-5984p And also has the highly durable bright cut pave. And has a great 2.3mm-2.5mm width.

Classic Truth: http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/engagement-rings/pave-and-side-stones/classic-truth-sleek-micro-pave-platinum-5542p Very nice, allows a flush fit band, and has durable bright cut pave.

Lovely and durable: http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/engagement-rings/pave-and-side-stones/gaia-platinum-5983p And very affordable.

Stones at BGD:
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/1.650-g-vs2-round-diamond-ags-104082556008#!prettyPhoto[gallery2]/2/
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/1.413-g-vs1-round-diamond-ags-104086279068#!prettyPhoto[gallery2]/2/

 

[supermsp]

Pave Solitaire, your right BGD has some good options. Looks like I have more options to look at, I'll keep you updated.

Thanks for the advice!

 

[Gypsy]

Yup. Here's some additional reading:

ON COLOR:

It is important to remember is that color is graded FACE DOWN. Where there is NO light return. Not face up where there is light return and refraction. You wear diamonds set. FACE UP.

Within one color grade, even the labs can't agree on the color grades of stones and something could be a "high" H or a "low" E. So... no. Not really. Within 2 color grades it is hard. Not impossible. But very hard. And it gets harder once set. If you are talking ideal rounds, or any stone with ideal light return and no sharp corners it gets harder still because the ideal light return masks body color.

Generally we say to be conservative stay above H in a round. But MANY people have happily bought white I or even J diamonds when trying to eek out a little more size.

This is how I think of it.

Ever gotten one of those HUGE paint fan decks? Where there are literally 100s of colors of whites? And when they are RIGHT next to each other you can TOTALLY tell that one is bluer/colder and one is a bit warmer and which one is one is TOTALLY warmer. One there's one that's slightly greener. One that's slightly pinker? But really. They are all white?

Then you pick one after agonizing over this white or that white and when it's on the walls and people are like: Oh. You painted again. And it's STILL white. Great.

And you're all... BUT it's BLUE white. Or it's a WARM white now. It used to be ____ white. It's TOTALLY different.

It's like that. You are talking about shades of white. D is colder... J is warmer. But it's all white.

YES. If you have an accurately graded F and an H THAT HAVE THE SAME PERFORMANCE you are going to be able to tell them apart when you compare them. Just like you would be able to tell if you painted your walls a warm white, but painted the crown molding a cold/straight white. But both are STILL white.


I want you notice all the qualifiers thought. I'm talking about stones with the SAME performance. An ideal H will out white an F that has compromised light performance from a poor cut.

NOTHING impacts the appearance of a diamond as much as cut. CUT is king.

You want the shinest whitest and brightest diamond out there: Cut is King. No other factor, not color or clarity or anything else impacts how white bright an shiny a stone is.

ON CLARITY:
http://www.goodoldgold.com/4Cs/Clarity/SI/ and http://www.goodoldgold.com/4Cs/Clarity/VS/ Generally we say that eyeclean SI1 and VS2 are as high as you need to go with round brilliants, have your vendor check the diamond for this. VS1 will always be eyeclean, but they do cost more and an eyeclean SI1 and a VS1 or even an IF will look the same to the unaided eye.

 

[supermsp]

What's your experience with Brilliance.com? I was looking on their website and put super ideal cut and followed all the perecentages and put d,e,f color and vs1 and above and the price were dramatically cheaper than any other website I saw. Sounds questionable. They did say I can request aset images for any of the diamonds, because now I realized I definitely want a "Hearts and Arrows" diamond.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

What's your experience with Brilliance.com? I was looking on their website and put super ideal cut and followed all the perecentages and put d,e,f color and vs1 and above and the price were dramatically cheaper than any other website I saw. Sounds questionable. They did say I can request aset images for any of the diamonds, because now I realized I definitely want a "Hearts and Arrows" diamond.

If you want a hearts and arrows diamond, you can shop at Whiteflash, Good Old Gold, High Performance Diamonds, Brian Gavin, and Victor Canera. You might be able to get a nicely cut stone (but rarely at the H&A cut level) through other vendors with virtual listings, but I would not shop at a vendor that does not have photos of the stones.

 

[WinkHPD]

deleted

 

[Kay]

That Freya setting from BGD is gorgeous!

I am a big fan of blue fluorescence in diamonds. I have 2 colorless diamonds (D and F) with medium blue fluorescence, and they look very icy white. (The appraiser said my D looked whiter than most Ds and very "crisp.") Some people see fluorescence as a negative factor, so it reduces the price of the diamond. I just mention this so you consider a stone with blue fluorescence because I think you get more bang for your buck that way. (I am currently hunting for a new stone with medium to strong blue fluorescence.)

Brian Gavin Blue is a line of super ideal hearts & arrows diamonds with blue fluorescence. These stones are all within your budget and 1.5 ct or higher:

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...1.604-f-vs2-round-diamond-ags-bl-104083068014
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...1.764-h-vs2-round-diamond-ags-bl-104086693013
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...1.500-g-vs2-round-diamond-ags-bl-104086279067
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...1.500-g-si1-round-diamond-ags-bl-104069928025
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...1.538-h-si1-round-diamond-ags-bl-104083536013

I am also a huge fan of eye-clean SI stones -- I don't like to pay extra for a factor that does not enhance the non-magnified appearance of the diamond.

 

[Gypsy]

BGD is a fabulous vendor. They have beautiful hearts and arrows super ideals. I have owned 5 of them, happily. I also love fluorescence and would happily have a BGD Blue Line stone. That said, BGD's Blue line is not guaranteed hearts and arrows.

 

[supermsp]

Okay so I took your advice on whiteflash, I got it down to two diamonds which you suggested but which one? One was expert selected and another cut above, the expert selected is larger and same price. Will I tell a difference between either of these diamonds is the questions?
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3625405.htm
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3653222.htm