Bling Sellers Please Beware

[luv2sparkle]

Slick, everything you said about Loupe troupe is also true of Ebay and even Etsy these days. They side with the buyer no matter what the listing says. My son is an ebay seller and he has had multiple problems with this often 2 months after a sale. The buyers lie, and don't return the merchandise. Ebay charges his account no matter what. It is very close to not being worth it anymore.

 

[MillieLou]

I wonder if she was trying her luck for a discount, eg seeing if you would immediately offer x dollars off, rather than go to the trouble of accepting a return. Now that you've made a clear that it's either keep for the full price or return, she might well have decided to keep it and will drop off the radar.

I am fussy about ring sizing but that's why I don't buy unsizeable items unseen with no return policy! People need to realise there is a huge difference between buying from a private seller and a shop with full return policies.

 

[Slickk]

Slick, everything you said about Loupe troupe is also true of Ebay and even Etsy these days. They side with the buyer no matter what the listing says. My son is an ebay seller and he has had multiple problems with this often 2 months after a sale. The buyers lie, and don't return the merchandise. Ebay charges his account no matter what. It is very close to not being worth it anymore.

@luv2sparkle Oh goodness. Thank you for sharing. That’s just awful and I am sorry for your DS! I thought I was being scammed as soon as she received it and was questioning the size. I think this will be the last sale for me unless I ‘know’ the person. And I will definitely share the username to warn others.

@MillieLou good point, thank you. I do wonder if she was looking for some discount or concession, but I believe the item was already fairly priced and a loss for me already. (I did say in the listing that it couldn’t be sized, or sizing beads could be added and seriously, we’re talking about 1/4 difference if any anyway). Plus I offered a refund. There comes a price point where I say, “I’d rather keep it than take that low of a price.” Mostly because I sell to just spend on different bling and really don’t need the money.

 

[MillieLou]

Definitely the right thing not to play into her hands, if that's what she was angling for. It seems a common tactic on eBay as some sellers will just roll over and offer a discount for a quiet life.

 

[mrs-b]

I haven't commented before now, @Slick1, but I've been holding my breath along with you! I was glad to hear the comments from PP, but I'll feel way better for you when you have the ring in your hand!

Sending you a mountain of positive fairy dust that this resolves to your liking - and fast! I think I'll have a new rule at this point - sales to known PSers only..

 

[Slickk]

@mrs-b Thank you so much for weighing in and for your good thoughts I’ll feel better when I have the ring in hand as well. I think that’s a good policy to only sell to known PSers unless accepting friends and family on PayPal. This has certainly put a bad taste in my mouth for what supposed to be a fun hobby.

 

[whitewave]

I would send her a very formal email that is dated and “electronic signature” and if you know a lawyer, CC the lawyer etc.

Make it sound lawyerly etc and that she has 2 days to provide proof of shipment back to you, etc.

Play hardball. (Within the law of course).

Have you googled her name and address to get her cell number? I’d call her also. Hound her.

 

[Slickk]

I would send her a very formal email that is dated and “electronic signature” and if you know a lawyer, CC the lawyer etc.

Make it sound lawyerly etc and that she has 2 days to provide proof of shipment back to you, etc.

Play hardball. (Within the law of course).

Have you googled her name and address to get her cell number? I’d call her also. Hound her.

Oh goodness, do you think I should do that just yet or should I let PayPal deal with her? It’s actually a him according to their PP account. I do have his name and address. PP is expected to rule on the claim around 12/21.
Having spoken to PP yesterday, I am feeling a little more confident that they won’t release the funds back to her until I receive a package. Now what’s in the package is making me a tad nervous. I will videotape the opening of it in case of a switch. They also told me that size is not a protected coverage. It’s not far enough off, IMO, to warrant such drastic actions against me. I may just win!

Praying this works out before I have to do anything aggressive. Thank you for your thoughts though. It’s a little like a roller coaster of thoughts I am having...

 

[elle_71125]

This must be so frustrating and stressful for you. I’m sorry.
It‘s weird that the buyer went radio silent, especially since you offered a refund. That would make anyone nervous. I’ll be following along and sending buckets of good thoughts your way.

 

[Slickk]

This must be so frustrating and stressful for you. I’m sorry.
It‘s weird that the buyer went radio silent, especially since you offered a refund. That would make anyone nervous. I’ll be following along and sending buckets of good thoughts your way.

Thank you @elle_71125 thank you! Yes, right?!!! That radio silence is what gives me great pause in thinking this will be easy. I don’t understand what else I could have possibly done! I’ll come back with results of the PayPal claim.

 

[Bron357]

I would just sit tight. The buyer either doesnt know what they doing / what they want or are just plain weird.
As I said earlier, PayPal is aware that there are buyers who try and rort the system. The dispute process is supposed to firstly be a venue for communication between buyer and seller with the intention of a mutually agreeable resolution being reached.
Disputes should only escalate to a claim, where PayPal adjudicates, when an agreement can’t be reached.
There is evidence of you offering a refund if they return the item which should be what they want.
Maybe they just changed their mind and hope by raising a claim they can return it without cost.
Maybe they have changed their mind about the dispute and hope by ignoring what they started it will just end without any further input from them.
Paypal will let you know in due course.
buyers need to be aware that PayPal does keep a tally on people who lodge disputes / make claims. PayPal can, at its discretion, close PayPal accounts if they suspect there is nefarious activity occurring.

 

[Slickk]

@Bron357 sage advice and I thank you. I had wondered if she/he has changed their mind (it really is pretty ring) but who knows. You’re right. I’ll sit tight and wait for PayPal to advise. I just abhor unresolved issues but I guess at this point I have no choice.
I also suspect that if they behaved this way with me there is a good chance they’ve done this before. If so I would think PayPal will recognize that fact and the fact that I have never had a problem as a buyer or seller. I am pretty confident that the ring or my response should not cause that much angst for them that they would be so angry.
I do so thank you for sharing your experience and offering sound words of advice.

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

Oh goodness, do you think I should do that just yet or should I let PayPal deal with her? It’s actually a him according to their PP account. I do have his name and address. PP is expected to rule on the claim around 12/21.
Having spoken to PP yesterday, I am feeling a little more confident that they won’t release the funds back to her until I receive a package. Now what’s in the package is making me a tad nervous. I will videotape the opening of it in case of a switch. They also told me that size is not a protected coverage. It’s not far enough off, IMO, to warrant such drastic actions against me. I may just win!

Praying this works out before I have to do anything aggressive. Thank you for your thoughts though. It’s a little like a roller coaster of thoughts I am having...

Lets just keep our fingers crossed she/he just wasn't fussed on the ring for what reason and has no alterier motive other than they want out of the sale

 

[MamaBee]

@Slick1 I would call Paypal again to let them know the buyer has gone silent and you don’t know what that means. I would tell them that you will be videotaping the opening of the package if she decided to send it back. When you do...make sure you show all sides of the package to show it’s sealed before you open it up. If she’s gone radio silent even after opening a claim... and you keep calling PayPal because you’re worried......It’s pretty clear who the bad guy is...It doesn’t hurt to call again...That‘s what I would do..

 

[Tekate]

@Slick1 This is apalling, I am sorry, I hope Paypal does rectify this. It's basically why I have a lot of junky jewelry, I'm too scared to sell it! Merry Christmas

 

[kgizo]

I had one experience with a PP dispute. It was a F&F payment and a friend didn’t recognize the way it came thru on her CC statement so it was a complete accident. She immediately told PP and her CC that she was made a mistake and to release the $$ to me. She sent me an email saying she made a mistake so that I could include that in my response to the dispute. PP sat on it and didn’t release the funds and close it out for close to 60d. Only mentioning this to give some context to the buyer going silent. She may have responded to PP and PP is sitting on it like they tend to. I would take screen shots of any communication you want to keep a history of bc PP deleted all comments and history once they closed it. It sounds like you’ve done everything right and I’m sure it will be resolved in your favor, it just sucks to have to wait for PP’s super slow process.

 

[Slickk]

Thank you @Bayek , @MamaBee and @kgizo ! Ugh so frustrating to hear that it could take that long!! And in the meantime anything could go wrong with this. I am hoping they resolve it by 12/21 as promised because I hate things hanging like this. So maddening.
I have never had a problem and have many happy buyers and sellers. I’m done after this too @Bayek
I will screenshot the pp claim, thank you @kgizo. I will also videotape the opening of the package in case it’s not in there or is a different ring. Ugh!!!
I will call again @MamaBee but tonight we have an award ceremony to attend! I thought my call on Saturday was very productive. I felt so much calmer but now I’m uneasy again.
ETA She never responded to my three private emails to refund her! Super shady IMO

 

[Austina]

This is really scummy @Slick1, I hope PP will sort it out for you and you get your ring back. It sounds as though you did everything you could to describe the ring accurately, it definitely sounds like a try on from the buyer.

I honestly don’t know what more the buyer could reasonably expect from you, you’ve been totally fair in dealing with them.

 

[Slickk]

UPDATE:

PayPal has decided that the buyer must send the ring back to me at their expense for a full refund. Which does mean that I am out ~$30 in fees and shipping, and I am out of air for selling online!
As @Austina pointed out, I too believe this was a "try on." I am sure that this ring fits as a 7.5 and not an 8, as an experienced ring wearer and buyer.
I am not disappointed at all as this is what I offered anyway and it's a pretty piece that I will now likely keep. What does give pause for me and others who sell via LT and DB should be that no matter what you state in your listing (ie, Final Sale etc), a buyer has the right to return?
Now to ensure that the package I receive in fact includes the ring. This makes me a bit anxious. What I don't understand is that Paypal is requiring me to update this claim by 12/18 but I am doubtful I will have the package by Friday...The only option in Paypal for my update is that I have received the ring back...hmm...I guess I will have to call later after work to ask why I need to respond by Friday when I probably still won't be in possession of the goods.
Thank you all for your knowledgeable advice (especially @Bron357's PP experience) , comments and support. But seriously, stick a fork in me...I am done!!
Have a great day all!! Stay safe! We are waiting for ~18 inches of snow tonight!!!

 

[missy]

UPDATE:

PayPal has decided that the buyer must send the ring back to me at their expense for a full refund. Which does mean that I am out ~$30 in fees and shipping, and I am out of air for selling online!
As @Austina pointed out, I too believe this was a "try on." I am sure that this ring fits as a 7.5 and not an 8, as an experienced ring wearer and buyer.
I am not disappointed at all as this is what I offered anyway and it's a pretty piece that I will now likely keep. What does give pause for me and others who sell via LT and DB should be that no matter what you state in your listing (ie, Final Sale etc), a buyer has the right to return?
Now to ensure that the package I receive in fact includes the ring. This makes me a bit anxious. What I don't understand is that Paypal is requiring me to update this claim by 12/18 but I am doubtful I will have the package by Friday...The only option in Paypal for my update is that I have received the ring back...hmm...I guess I will have to call later after work to ask why I need to respond by Friday when I probably still won't be in possession of the goods.
Thank you all for your knowledgeable advice (especially @Bron357's PP experience) , comments and support. But seriously, stick a fork in me...I am done!!
Have a great day all!! Stay safe! We are waiting for ~18 inches of snow tonight!!!

Yay! Glad they decided in your favor. It was the only decision that made sense.
And yeah same here re the snow. As long as we don't lose power I will be happy. It's always very pretty when it first comes down. Like a fresh beginning and just in time for Christmas cheer.

 

[Bron357]

If you ask for Family and Friends payment the buyer can do nothing, even if you send the buyer an empty parcel! That’s the risk for buyers, no risk at all for sellers.
So my advice is only buy from people with a presence on Pricescope, that way you can believe you won’t get an empty parcel! but sell to anyone as long as they pay Friends and Family.
you can put in your listing “returns ok BUT buyer pays for both shipping’s - shipping to them, shipping to return”.
However this is tricky now because PayPal changed their rule about fees. Previously if a sale was “null and void” ie a return, Paypal returned the 3% fee they’d charged the seller. Now that 3% fee paid to PayPal by the seller (it’s deducted from the proceeds before you receive it) is kept by PayPal.
so if a sale falls through, the seller is out of pocket 3%. This is why some eBay sellers are saying that if you want to return an item, the “return fee is 3%”
Reasons for returns according to PayPal are limited but the “not as described” reason is much open to interpretation. The buyer, with a supposed ring sizing discrepancy, can argue that they wouldn’t have bought it because it’s an additional cost to them to change the size so they can wear it.

 

[mrs-b]

Still traveling with you on this, @Slick1. Waiting for your postal delivery each day and hoping for a box with a ring in it!

Fingers crossed!

 

[Slickk]

Still traveling with you on this, @Slick1. Waiting for your postal delivery each day and hoping for a box with a ring in it!

Fingers crossed!

Thank you @mrs-b ! I’m so anxious! It’s on its way back as I write. I will update as soon as it arrives! Thank you for the support!!
@Bron357 the PayPal policy of keeping the 3% is quite annoying and I feel bad for vendors that have to pay that even when an item is returned. Seems PayPal isn’t very seller friendly.
I will be so relieved to have this ordeal end. It certainly hasn’t been worth the stress.

 

[Slickk]

Ugh ladies. So the package was misdirected to a NYC PO and now has been returned to sender?!?!
Can I catch a break with this?! So frustrating!

 

[missy]

Ugh ladies. So the package was misdirected to a NYC PO and now has been returned to sender?!?!
Can I catch a break with this?! So frustrating!

@Slick1 hang in there. This could be wrong. I’ve gotten notices like this too and so far I’ve always received the package. The notification system can get messed up. Don’t stress. Either way you will be made whole. (((Hugs)))

 

[MamaBee]

Okay..Can someone clear this up because I find it confusing. I have a credit card attached to my paypal account because my husband doesn’t want me to use our bank account. We keep too much in there...So...When I sell something I take a hit of a percentage...I think it’s 3%..For a small purchase it’s not bad but if it was in the thousands it would obviously be much more. If I were to buy something through PayPal..Does the seller get a hit because I have a credit card attached? Do I also take a hit for purchasing it? Can I even buy something with Friends and Family with just a credit card attached? TIA

 

[Slickk]

@MamaBee You only pay the fee when not sending f&f. I have never been charged extra for using my CC. I have sent f&f using a credit card and seller received whole amount. Hope that helps.

@missy I do hope you are correct as I am supposed to respond on Paypal by today and can only respond that I received it. Well, if I haven't received it, what to do? I am on hold with Paypal messenger because I am working... ugh

 

[missy]

@MamaBee You only pay the fee when not sending f&f. I have never been charged extra for using my CC. I have sent f&f using a credit card and seller received whole amount. Hope that helps.

@missy I do hope you are correct as I am supposed to respond on Paypal by today and can only respond that I received it. Well, if I haven't received it, what to do? I am on hold with Paypal messenger because I am working... ugh

What I’ve done in the past is message the mail carrier online system and they can actually track it more accurately and perhaps find it’s still heading to you. This happened to me. It said sent back to seller and I messaged on the online mail system and they found it was on its way to me. I got it that day. Hope that’s true in your case too.

 

[missy]

I just want to add a caveat. I only send f&f when it’s actually a friend or family member. Remember you have no recourse should the f&f deal go sour.

 

[Slickk]

I just want to add a caveat. I only send f&f when it’s actually a friend or family member. Remember you have no recourse should the f&f deal go sour.

This 1000%.

I wonder if I can call since I am not the sender. Also, being at work, online with my students, and having a dr appointment, I have no time to do this.