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Best Bang for the Buck

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erainman

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jul 19, 2007
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Hello Everyone!

So I''m about to take the plunge! I''ve found the girl, and if I''m lucky, she''ll let me buy her a ring! After doing a bit of window shopping, I''m pretty sure what I [she] would like to get. I''m just starting to educate myself about diamonds and I want to get the best bang for my buck, especially since I''m looking at getting a round stone in the 2.00ct range.

I hate to admit it, but my lady (and I don''t think she''s alone in the world) would probably sacrfice a grade or two of color/clarity and/or a little "fire", "brilliance", "hearts and arrows", etc., for a larger stone. Getting a flawless and colorless 2.00ct round diamond is certainly a bit out of my price range, but I''d still like to get a ring that looks nice--she will be wearing forever after all, right!

Based on my research so far and the brief time I''ve spent actually looking at stones, I''m under the impression that the best value is in getting a diamond in the G-H color range and an SI1 - SI2 clarity range (i.e. no visible imperfections). I have seen the difference between a D stone and a H stone, but I don''t really see much of a difference between a F and a H stone (although a F stone is considerably higher in price), and it seems that you''re not sacrficing much in terms of clarity if you''re in the SI range. Is this correct?

I''m completely lost when it comes to the cut--analyzing the percentages is just a little too complicated. Is there a simple guidline to follow when it comes to checking this out to make sure a ring isn''t too "deep" or "shallow"?

My last question relates to the price. From what I can tell, the stone I''m looking for (2.00ct, round, G-H, SI1-SI2) will cost me around $12-15K (based on online and retail prices). Does anybody know how much of a markup this includes? In other words...if I had a connection who could sell me the stone I''m looking for at cost (or a very minimal markup), how much could I expect to spend?

I really appreciate any input you could give for a first (and last!) time buyer. Thanks a ton!
 
A well cut 2 carat G SI1 will cost you the tune of $21K. I have no idea where you got your pricing. The cut is the main reason the diamond will sparkle. If you get a well cut round diamond, you can go lower in colour too. You can drop down to a J SI2 to stretch your money.

A quick search yielded a 2 carat I SI1 going for $15K. These are online prices from reputable stores. A brick and mortar store will charge you more.

Another reminder than the price of the diamonds take a sharp hike when you hit the 2 carat mark. Another option is to get something around 1.9 carats where it looks almost the same size as a 2 carat stone but costs less.

http://www.winkjones.com/specials/sa_diamonds.php seems to have great bargains. Give Wink a call to see if he has anything that fits your criteria.
 
And let me add, there is minimal mark up on these. You would pay a lot more in a B&M for this type stone.
 
Yep, definetly look for a stone under the two carat mark!

I doubt you can find a "connection" who will sell you a stone for much less than what you can find online. I am right now looking for a pendant and cannot find a company to price match the cost of the online vendor I'm considering buying from. I am looking for a much smaller stone than you, but from what I found, B&Ms are charging double for lower color/clarity (but still ideal cut stones).

Easy way to see if the stone is well cut, is looking at an idealscope image. Many online vendors provide images, so that is one option. You can also order an idealscope for using when shopping locally. I would recommend getting one of those!
 
Ellen picked a nice one, and it is at least semi-in-hand. Here''s another possibility, not in hand, but you could make it a plan B stone; review notes below my signature...and don''t ignore the update, which talks about differences in certification.

Regards,
 
Cut is the primary consideration for BEAUTY. Don''t compromise there! The good news is that you don''t have to... you can still compromise on color and clarity. That will give you the "best bang for the buck"!

My first diamond was an AGS-0 1.53 G/VS because I was a newbie and I was nervous. I knew I wanted a *white* diamond, and I knew I wanted an *eyeclean* diamond and I felt very *safe* with that color and clarity. And it was indeed a beautiful diamond!

But I learned quick that I am a SIZE GIRL, and as I got more educated and confident I decided to upgrade to a KILLER AGS-0 2.36 J/SI2 and believe me, I could NOT be more thrilled. As a super-well-cut diamond, it faces up blazingly white (no *yellow* at all), and it is totally 100% eye-clean even at cloooooose scrutiny. And OH, the SIZE!!!
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I get so many compliments on this stone... and owning this diamond makes me feel like a very savvy shopper. I maximized size AND beauty, by compromising in areas that (in my eyes, anyway) do not "show". I love feeling like I haven''t paid for what I cannot see! And believe me, if I ever upgrade again, I''ll do the same thing again.

SO... my VHO is to definitely consider lower color/clarity diamonds. The savings are significant, and the stones can be GORGEOUS!
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(Attached is a photo of my (old) 1.53 G/VS next to my (current) 2.36 J/SI2. Not much difference anywhere except SIZE, babeeeee!!!!)
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GvsJforcomparison.jpg
 
Wow, Lynn B.! Made a believer out of me! What gorgeous diamonds you have there. Great advice!
 
Date: 7/20/2007 12:23:33 PM
Author: lizardofaz
Wow, Lynn B.! Made a believer out of me! What gorgeous diamonds you have there. Great advice!
Click to expand...
Awwww, thanks, Liz!
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You''ll definitely need to go to I or J color if you go over 2 carats. But if you do, you need to stick with ideal cut stones AGS or GIA) because the excellent cut will make the stones appear whiter as Lynn has suggested. Staying just under 2 carats is a great idea too without sacrificing much size. But you won''t find much in the 1.9 range. Look at 1.7 and up.
 
I love I-J color stones (my princess is an I)! The difference between H and I color price is huge, but the visual difference in well-cut stones is really not that significant. You can really save a lot of money by dropping the color below H. As for clarity, you can find eye-clean stones down to SI2, maybe even I1s if there's an inclusion that can easily be hidden by a prong (not sure about that though).

One thing you shouldn't compromise is CUT. A D/IF diamond can look dull and lifeless with a bad cut, whereas a J/SI2 that's well-cut will sparkle like crazy! You should focus on getting an eye-clean ideal-cut diamond as large as your budget permits.

I really like this one that Ellen posted:
http://www.whiteflash.com/round_ideal_cut/Round-Ideal-Cut-cut-diamond-65878.htm

And there's a significant discount if you pay by bank wire and mention you're a PS member...either 2% or 3% (A Cut Above stones are 5% off; ES stones have a smaller discount). Speaking of ACAs, this one is $16893.85 with the discount, which is fairly close to budget. If it's eye-clean, it could be a winner!

Here are some choices that are closer to your budget, but just below the 2ct mark (probably not a visually significant difference):
1.70 G SI1
1.726 I VS2
1.756 J VS1
 
Thank you all so much for your input! Lynn B--your input was especially valuable! I''m still a little confused. When I do a simple price search for a 2.0ct H SI1 round stone on this site (right at the top of this page), the first page yields the following results:

Carat Color Clarity Depth Tbl Lab Gdl Cul Sym Pol Flr Measurements $/Crt Price
2.00 H SI1 58.4% 61% GIA - gd vg 8.24-8.28x4.82 $6768 $13536*S
2.00 H SI1 58.4% 61% GIA - gd vg no 8.24x8.28x4.82 $6790 $13581*SP
2.00 H SI1 62% 56% GIA tn - stk no vg ex ft 8.05-8.11x5.01 $6874 $13748*S
2.00 H SI1 62% 56% GIA thn - stk no vg ex ft 8.05x8.11x5.01 $6884 $13768*SP
2.00 H SI1 62% 56% GIA thn - stk no vg ex ft 8.05-8.11x5.01 $6889 $13778*SP
2.00 H SI1 62% 56% GIA thn - stk no vg ex ft 8.05x8.11x5.01 $6897 $13794*SP
2.00 H SI1 62% 56% GIA thn - stk no vg ex ft 8.05x8.11x5.01 $6955 $13910SP
2.00 H SI1 62% 56% GIA thn-sl thi no vg ex ft 8.05*8.11*5.01 $7150 $14300*S
2.00 H SI1 62% 56% GIA thn-sl thk no vg ex ft 8.05x8.11x5.01 $7475 $14950
2.00 H SI1 61.2% 59% GIA m-tk no vg vg 8.06-8.18x4.97 $7508 $15017*S
2.00 H SI1 61.2% 59% GIA m-tk no vg vg no 8.18x8.06x4.97 $7519 $15038*SP
2.00 H SI1 60.9% 58% GIA tn-tk no gd vg 8.07-8.15x4.94 $7614 $15228*S
2.00 H SI1 61.2% 59% GIA m-tk no vg vg no 8.18-8.06-4.97 $7615 $15230*
2.00 H SI1 60.9% 58% GIA tn-tk no gd vg no 8.07-8.15x4.94 $7631 $15262*SP
2.00 H SI1 60.9% 58% GIA thn no gd vg no 8.07*8.15*4.94 $7700 $15400*S
2.00 H SI1 60.9% 58% GIA tn-tk no gd vg no 8.07x8.15x4.94 $7704 $15408SP
2.00 H SI1 61.2% 59% GIA m-tk no vg vg no 8.06-8.18x4.97 $7737 $15474*SP
2.00 H SI1 62.1% 61% GIA stk-thk no vg ex no 8.00*8.04*4.98 $7789 $15579
2.00 H SI1 63% 55% GIA vtn-vtk no gd gd 7.86-7.93x4.97 $7925 $15850*S
2.00 H SI1 61.2% 59% GIA m-stk no ex ex 8.07-8.11x4.95 $7931 $15863*S
2.00 H SI1 63% 55% GIA vtn-vtk no gd gd no 7.86x7.93x4.97 $7936 $15873*SP
2.00 H SI1 63% 55% GIA vtn-vtk no gd gd no 7.86-7.93x4.97 $7943 $15885*SP
2.00 H SI1 61.2% 59% GIA m-stk no ex ex no 8.07x8.11x4.95 $7943 $15886*SP
2.00 H SI1 61.2% 59% GIA m-stk no ex ex no 8.07-8.11x4.95 $7949 $15898*SP
2.00 H SI1 63% 55% GIA vtn-vtk no gd gd no 7.86x7.93x4.97 $8019 $16037SP


All of these diamonds are b/t $13,500 and $16,000 (sorry if my cut and paste job didn''t transfer properly). What are the most important factors to look for now that there are all these stones with the "basics"--How can I tell which one is better "on paper" than the others? Everyone seems to agree that I should make sure to get the best cut possible--Are there guidelines I should be following when looking at Depth, Table, Symmetry, etc.??

Also, how much could I expect to save if I had a connection? For example...say I knew the person selling the $16,037 diamond--how much would that diamond sell for at cost (i.e. with no markup)? I have talked to several people who want me to use "their guy" who have told me that they would sell me a stone at little to no profit as a favor. I wanted to know how much I could expect to save by buying from someone who wasn''t looking to make a buck off of me. Any thoughts?

Thanks again for all of your help and input. I reallly appreciate it!
 
Try doing a Cut Quality search. And, you will probably need to expand your parameters a bit, since the ones you pulled up here are not the best cut quality.

ETA: Here are three good ones using the Cut Quality Search 1.9 to 2.1 ct, H-I color, SI clarity.

Carat Col Clar HCA Br-Fr-Sc-Sp AGS Depth Tbl Crn Pav Gdl Cul Pol Sym Flr Measurements Lab Img IS GA Price

2.044 I SI1 0.7-EX ex-ex-ex-ex 0 H&A
ACA 60.2% 57% 34.7° 40.6° thn-sly thk id id no 8.22-8.24x4.96 AGS $18939*S

2.054 I SI1 1.4-EX ex-ex-ex-vg 0 H&A
ACA 61.1% 57% 34.7° 40.8° thn-med f id id no 8.19-8.22x5.01 AGS $19032*S

2.06 I SI1 1.5-EX ex-ex-ex-vg 0 H&A 61.7% 55% 35° 40.8° thn-med no ex ex no 8.19*8.22*5.06 GIA $15390
 
OK... not sure how this will copy and paste... but I expanded the search to include J & K stones as well... here''s what I got. I didn''t look at each cert, photos, IS, etc., but I highlighted below the one I''d look at first. Lots of YUMMY choices, though!
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All of these stones maximize budget (more BANG for the buck!) and should be KILLER diamonds.


Carat Col Clar HCA
Br-Fr-Sc-Sp AGS Depth Tbl Crn Pav Gdl Cul Pol Sym Flr Measurements Lab Img IS GA Price Source
2.00 H SI2 1.9-EX
vg-ex-vg-vg 1 62.3% 57% 36° 40.6° thn-sl thi no ex vg no 7.99*8.03*4.99 GIA $13860
2.01 I SI1 3.1-VG
vg-gd-gd-vg 4 60.6% 58% 31.5° 41.6° v thn-slightl no ex ex no 8.15*8.21*4.96 GIA $15740
2.01 H SI1 2.4-VG
vg-vg-vg-vg 0
H&A 62.22% 55.74% 35.09° 40.95° 1.77 no ex ex neg 8.13x8.06x5.04 GIA $21768S
2.025 I VS2 1.8-EX
ex-vg-vg-vg 0
H&A
ACA 61% 57% 34.8° 40.9° thn-med f id id no 8.11-8.15x5.01 AGS $20260*S
2.044 I SI1 0.7-EX
ex-ex-ex-ex 0
H&A
ACA 60.2% 57% 34.7° 40.6° thn-sly thk id id no 8.22-8.24x4.96 AGS $18939*S
2.054 I SI1 1.4-EX
ex-ex-ex-vg 0
H&A
ACA 61.1% 57% 34.7° 40.8° thn-med f id id no 8.19-8.22x5.01 AGS $19032*S
2.06 I SI1 1.5-EX
ex-ex-ex-vg 0
H&A 61.7% 55% 35° 40.8° thn-med no ex ex no 8.19*8.22*5.06 GIA $15390
2.06 H VS2 1.3-EX
ex-vg-vg-vg 0 61.1% 55% 34° 41° thn-med no ex ex no 8.23*8.26*5.04 GIA $20560
2.065 I SI2 1.4-EX
ex-ex-ex-vg 0
H&A
ACA 61.7% 56% 34.8° 40.8° thn-med f id id no 8.15-8.19x5.04 AGS $17250*S
2.09 I SI2 1.6-EX
ex-vg-vg-vg 0 61.2% 57.4% 34.2° 41° thn-med no id id neg 8.21*8.23*5.03 AGS $13830
2.104 I SI1 1.6-EX
ex-ex-ex-vg 0
H&A 62.75% 54.17% 35.3° 40.67° 2.29 no id id neg 8.18x8.16x5.13 AGS $18989S
2.16 J VS2 1.2-EX
ex-ex-ex-vg 0 61% 56% 34.5° 40.8° thn no ex ex ft 8.37-8.41x5.12 GIA $16488*S
2.183 I VS2 1.7-EX
ex-vg-vg-vg 0
H&A
ACA 61.4% 56% 34.8° 40.9° thn-med f id id no 8.36-8.38x5.14 AGS $21070*S
2.21 I SI1 3.4-VG
vg-gd-gd-vg 0 61.9% 56% 34.9° 41.2° thn-med no id id neg 8.35*8.42*5.18 AGS $16700
2.28 K VS2 1.2-EX
ex-ex-ex-vg 0
H&A 61.13% 55.15% 34.26° 40.85° 1.17 no ex ex neg 8.55x8.52x5.22 GIA $15847S
2.288 J SI2 1.4-EX
ex-ex-ex-vg 0
H&A
ACA 61.5% 56% 34.8° 40.8° thn-med f id id no 8.45-8.48x5.21 AGS $16300*S
 
Date: 7/21/2007 5:32:53 PM
Author: erainman

Also, how much could I expect to save if I had a connection? For example...say I knew the person selling the $16,037 diamond--how much would that diamond sell for at cost (i.e. with no markup)? I have talked to several people who want me to use ''their guy'' who have told me that they would sell me a stone at little to no profit as a favor. I wanted to know how much I could expect to save by buying from someone who wasn''t looking to make a buck off of me. Any thoughts?
Click to expand...
Ooops, forgot to comment on this question. Ummmm, honestly, virtually NO ONE is going to sell you a diamond at their cost (unless maybe it''s your DAD!
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) -- and really, why should we expect anyone to? We all have to make a living! My experience has been that those people who say they will sell you a stone at "their cost" aren''t being 100% truthful... and believe me, we have seen LOTS of sorry shoppers have on PS, asking for opinions about a stone they got from "a friend" or a "friend''s friend" at this alleged "great deal"... and it usually turns out that (for a variety of reasons, usually too much $$$, misrepresented or poorly cut stone, etc.) it wasn''t such a great deal afterall. I''d hate to see this happen to you.

Personally, I would stick with any of the PS vendors... you''ll generally pay a heckuva lot LESS than the local B&Ms for a heckuva lot better diamond. JMH 2 cents!
 
Hello, all.

I decided to come here to get info because I seem to be getting a lot of contradictory info in "the industry." I''m looking for the most bang for my buck as well.

I''m looking at a Radiant cut stone. (love them!) Here are the specs on one in particular. I''m not familiar enough to know for sure, but it seems fairly shallow to me. Is it? Also, what''s the REAL lowdown on girdle? Is that something you see or not? Also, I was told by a respectable jeweler that when sacrificing on color (G is what''s listed) that looking for a stone with a slight blue flour. will bake the stone whiter. I live in a very rural area and it seems like everyone is a "know-it-all". The jewelers have been in business for a long time, but I''m afraid they haven''t kept up with the times. Any help would be SO appreciated.


Shape: Radiant

Carat Weight: .089

Color: G

Clarity: SI1

Graded By: GIA

Cut Grade: Premium

Depth: 65.1%

Table: 76%

Girdle: Thin to Extremely Thick

Culet: None

Polish: Excellent

Symmetry: Good

Fluorescence: None

Measurements: 6.36 x 5.18 x 3.37

Length / Width Ratio: 1.23


Thanks in advance for any and all info!
Angie

BTW-this is to set atop a three row pave band. Will a stone get "lost" when surrounded by so much pave?
 
SomethingShiny (Haha, cute screen name!):

I don''t know a thing about radiants, but there are a lot of folks around here that do. I would suggest that you start a new thread with your own specific question/information. I think you''ll get a lot of helpful advice.

BUT, I can give you my opinion on your setting question. Personally, I truly do think that your diamond might get "lost" in a wide-ish band of 3 rows of pave. I LOVE thin bands that let the center stone *POP*, but of course that''s not everyone''s taste. There are a lot of gorgeous settings around... take your time when choosing one.
 
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