Being a lawyer and a mother

[decodelighted]

Seems less about being PARENTS and actually PARENTING & more like *breeding*. After all -- there's amazing, brilliant Law-school caliber DNA at stake!

ETA: I'm glad you shared the thread w/your FI ... people have been quite generous with insights & advice. The more you know, the more you can prepare. And then be prepared to be surprised. Hormones are powerful stuff. As is the maternal instinct.

 

[Amys Bling]

Find a compromise that results in you guys living together and raising your child. No one ever dies wishing they had spent more time at work and less time with family.

well said amc.

yes- very well said!

 

[MissStepcut]

Alright Deco. No need for the snark. I never suggested my genetic material was special.

I don't think it's totally fair to criticize me for decisions I haven't yet made, knowing I was pregnant for all of 5 days. I came here for honest advice about the situation and have been absorbing it all. The accusations strike me as a bit unfair. Yes, it's true, I didn't come here having already made major changes to "the plan." Thank you for pointing out the weaknesses.

 

[Circe]

Woah, Gyps - normally I agree with you on a lot of things (see also, how unfair it is that its generally the woman's career that gets the shaft), but I think it's overstating the case to say that ambitious parents, or hardworking parents, are less loving or less important to their kids. I think it's EASIER to say that to somebody going into a lucrative profession than it is to say it to somebody who is supplementing their foodstamps to put a roof over their kid's head ... but law school loans being what they are, the big salary is kind of a necessity to buy financial security for said kid in the future. It's not like it's a trade of Mommy's love for the miniature motarized car from FAO Schwartz: it's more like trading some of Mommy's time at the outset when kiddo won't remember it to allow for an easier life twenty years down the line when it will make a huge difference in terms of starting the kid out in life.

So long as the kid is loved by someone and has someone to love, even if it's not in the traditional American nuclear family model ... I don't see a problem for him/her. The question of how it impacts Ms. Stepcut and future Mr. Stepcut, on the other hand ....

I've been reading this thread, but I haven't chimed in yet, 'cause I'm basically the other side of the coin: my career got torpedoed when we went the family route, and I have mixed feelings about that. But three months post birth, I WILL say that all of the maternal feelings (which other people have covered) aside, the kid thing is surprisingly exhausting. Hell, for that matter, pregnancy was exhausting. I think you're making the right call in rethinking the long commute/long distance elements, as per your last post: my advice, for whatever it's worth, would be to try to keep things as simple as possible.

And, "things?" They include your expectations of yourself. You know the saying how perfect is the enemy of good? I think it applies in this case. Just ... take it one day at a time, you know?

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Others have pointed out that you can't imagine your feelings for your baby yet. A normal mother has this feeling of being totally and completely in love with this amazing miracle! The thought of leaving a baby or child of any age for 12 hours a day is just incomprehensible to me. What about when the baby is sick and needs YOU? What about when they have a special program at pre-school...can you take off from biglaw to be there? Then they go to elementary school...can you go join your child for lunch and be there for parent/teacher meetings?

I am encouraged that you and your fiance are now seeing that you need to be located in the same city in order to have a family. But really, it sounds like from some of the posts on this thread that part-time in law is still a 12 hour day.

One thing I wasn't clear about...you said you'd be free for 10 months after the baby is born. Did you mean you'd be finished with school and not working at all for 10 months? That would certainly help for that period of time.

 

[MissStepcut]

One thing I wasn't clear about...you said you'd be free for 10 months after the baby is born. Did you mean you'd be finished with school and not working at all for 10 months? That would certainly help for that period of time.

I worked very hard so I would be done a semester early. I will have a winter break, semester and my bar prep summer to spend at home. Depending on my start date, that might even be the whole first year. Which is a lot more "maternity leave" than I would get at almost any job in America, in law or otherwise.

 

[neatfreak]

IMO there is a HUGE difference between being an ambitious, hardworking mother and being a mother who never sees their child.

I have a PhD. I have a great job I love and I'm successful at it. And I have two kids. But I also only work 9-4:45. And I work from home two days a week.

I RARELY have to work past 5pm or on weekends, but when I miss my kids going to bed, I hate hate hate it. I don't think I would be an effective mother OR an effective worker if I felt the push and pull of work and home all the time--it's bad enough as it is and I know I have a good work situation!

I'll tell you what, I ALSO couldn't do it without my DH who is a great father and has a flexible work schedule. We just couldn't do it. He has a great job that happens to allow flexible schedules, but there is no way I could do it without his flexibility or something more needing to give on my side. My coworker is in a similar work position as me, but her DH is an in-house litigator and well established in his career. Even now he is constantly away on trips, working late, etc. and she needs to juggle the kids, her job, and their nanny at the expense of her own career. She went to law school too (top 10) and now can't imagine working for a firm after having kids. She did the biglaw thing in NY for a few years prior to having kids and she just said she cannot fathom doing it with kids.

I'm all for women being ambitious and having a job they love, just not at the expense of the kid(s) KWIM? You need to make the decision that's right for your family even if that means waiting to start a family.

Anyway, just my 0.02 from someone who is in the trenches now!

 

[decodelighted]

I don't think it's totally fair to criticize me for decisions I haven't yet made

I kinda thought this whole thread was "look at this plan - tell me any hiccups you see!" I don't intend - or want - to be mean. For some reason the scenario is really weighing heavily on me, so I might not be very objective. And, it worried me a great deal that your perception of the situation & what would be reasonable was SO VERY FAR from the reality most of the posters on this thread have been predicting.

After reading some of your latest posts, I'll take comfort in the fact that you both HAVE had high pressure jobs before - so AT LEAST you're not having to totally predict what *working* AT ALL will be like when making these hard decisions & seemingly infinite series of plans.

 

[sillyberry]

Gypsy, me thinks you're projecting a wee bit much... And diamondseeker, "normal" mothers feel a certain way? Really?

This is turning into a garden-variety "why working mothers are the worst" thread. Gross.

MSC, I'm glad to hear the two of you are rethinking things. It sounds like you both have more thinking to do, but you recognize that. As I said before, I really do feel for you. For you both. I honestly can't imagine being in that position. I really think the best suggestion I've heard is trying to defer graduating law school for a year (assuming you can defer your loans). I'm not sure when exactly you're due, but if you could (for example) take off spring semester and fall semester, graduating in 2014, having a buffer of a year would be invaluable. I know that changes your career plans, but it might actually allow you to change them less in the long run. I would talk to your Dean ASAP.

ETA: the biggest issues I saw were the (1) living in different cities, (2) ridiculous working hours, and (3) long commutes. Try to mitigate as many of those as possible, which it sounds like you're doing.

 

[Krissie]

I have only a few moments to post my thoughts (8-week twins chomping at the bit to ... chomp ... you get it).

Something's gotta give. DH and I are both lawyers; both worked in biglaw internationally in good and bad economies. I left biglaw after 6 years, and there's no way I could juggle new motherhood and being a big firm lawyer; you can have it all, I guess, but I think one or both would suffer. And I think being a parent is a lot more important than having a successful experience as a first-year lawyer.

I worked for a partner who was answering e-mails hours before her c-section; that same mom was forced into a "part-time" situation whereby she was working from 9 am to 7 pm with expected e-mail access for 24 hours. That was an EQUITY PARTNER who had proven herself time and time again for years. Her clients didn't care she was a mom, nor did her partners.

Life throws us curveballs and we make the best of it. And there's a time and a place for everything. I say, one of you has to be there for your child.

Rant over. My brain is fried. Today I couldn't even remember the word for "pitcher." I called it the "water poury thing."

 

[monarch64]

MissStepcut, I really feel bad for you for the beating you've taken in this thread. I remember what you posted in the 24 hour thread and that someone responded to you to say that they had been in your shoes or knew people who had been and that they had tips/tricks for you to navigate this situation. I realize that's why you started this thread as a spin-off. I don't think that opinions of what kind of parent you'd be were solicited. I do believe what you were after was SUPPORT.

I want to wish you the best of luck, you and your boyfriend are in a tough spot but you won't be the first couple to go through something like this. Take care of yourself.

 

[Gypsy]

This is turning into a garden-variety "why working mothers are the worst" thread. Gross.

No. It's not. There is nothing in mine, diamondseekers, or deco's posts that says that. Maybe I'm projecting, but whoa... I think you might be too. All we're saying is that she can't realistically have it all and has to consider compromises (which she is, thankfully). That's not a judgement about working moms in general: it's a reality about parenthood (either maternal or paternal) and working at law firms as first and second year associates. Specific to this case.

As Neatfreak said: there is a HUGE difference between being an ambitious, hardworking parent and being a parent who never sees their child. And the life of a first and second year associate is of the later NOT the former. And my posts are trying to prepare her AND her husband for that. And that starts with understanding defining what being a parent means, and deciding NOW what kind of parent (if any) they are going to be. Together.

As point of fact, if you look at my post I define a parent as:

"A parent is a caretaker: is the person you run to when you fall and who holds you in their arms and gives you a feeling of unparalleled safety, the person who holds your hands in theirs giving you the confidence to take your first scary steps, the person whose ears are tuned to your baby talk so well that when others think you are babbling KNOWS you are really saying "I want my truck please", who takes the time to understand WHY you are throwing a tantrum instead of just yelling at your for not being quiet or punishing you because you are a 'bad kid'."

Guess who I was talking about? Who I have seen demonstrate this in their daily life? Neatfreak. PhD, full time employee, mother of TWINS, and wife to her husband who also works full time. And fortunately, my friend. (Sorry if I embarrassed you NF, but it's true you are a great mom, working or not).

So don't you TELL ME that I don't admire and APPRECIATE working moms. I DO. I appreciated my own mother's sacrifices, and I feel sorry she was forced into the decisions she had to make. My POINT with my projecting was that, MissStepcut isn't a singlemom and her husband isn't a singledad they JOINTLY, as parents, have to adjust their thinking to taking into account what is right for their kid and to make compromises.

ETA: Monarch has a good point. You are still reeling from the news MissStepcut, and you are ASKING for opinions and that's a great start. And you are also listening. And sharing with your spouse, who is your baby's father. All great things.

 

[sillyberry]

This is turning into a garden-variety "why working mothers are the worst" thread. Gross.

No. It's not. There is nothing in mine, diamondseekers, or deco's posts that says that. Maybe I'm projecting, but whoa... I think you might be too. All we're saying is that she can't realistically have it all. That's not a judgement about working moms, it's a reality about parenthood (either maternal or paternal) and working at law firms as first and second year associates.

As Neatfreak said: there is a HUGE difference between being an ambitious, hardworking parent and being a parent who never sees their child. And the life of a first and second year associate is of the later NOT the former. And my posts are trying to prepare her AND her husband for that. And that starts with understanding defining what being a parent means, and deciding NOW what kind of parent (if any) they are going to be. Together.

As point of fact, if you look at my post I define a parent as:

"A parent is a caretaker: is the person you run to when you fall and who holds you in their arms and gives you a feeling of unparalleled safety, the person who holds your hands in theirs giving you the confidence to take your first scary steps, the person whose ears are tuned to your baby talk so well that when others think you are babbling KNOWS you are really saying "I want my truck please", who takes the time to understand WHY you are throwing a tantrum instead of just yelling at your for not being quiet or punishing you because you are a 'bad kid'."

Guess who I was talking about? Who I have seen demonstrate this in their daily life? Neatfreak. PhD, full time employee, mother of TWINS, and wife to her husband. And fortunately, my friend. (Sorry if I embarrassed you NF, but it's true).

So don't you TELL ME that I don't admire and APPRECIATE working moms. I DO. I appreciated my own mother's sacrifices, and I feel sorry she was forced into the decisions she had to make. My POINT is, MissStepcut isn't a singlemom and her husband isn't a singledad they JOINTLY, as parents, have to adjust their thinking to taking into account what is right for their kid and to make compromises.

I was one of the first to say that MSC's position was untenable for a whole host of reasons I listed. I still believe it is.

But I think you went FAR beyond saying that. If your child is in daycare or with a nanny, how can you be the person who is always there to be the person to whom they're running? It fundamentally doesn't work. Of, if you're the sole breadwinning parent, are you less of a parent because your spouse is the one who primarily fulfills that role for your child?

If you were not intending to indict all working parents, then you were less than clear in your word choice.

 

[Gypsy]

Sillyberry, I think you misunderstood my words to mean that I think that parents have to be the 'exclusive' providers of these things for their children. I don't think that at all, and know it's not practical nor is it a failure of parenting because you miss moments of your children's lives, that's reality. But, to me, good parents do SEEK to provide all that I've listed above, as often as life allows. That doesn't mean that they can't take a vacation without the kids, or get a sitter for a 'date night' or even have the grandparents take the kids for a summer. There is a difference between DESIRE and what you can actually achieve, in anything and parents need breaks too. Again, that's reality. BUT I DO think that good parents WANT to be there all the time for their kids that they can be. I believe that WHEN a parent has to rely on childcare or parents because they CHOSE or HAVE to work that's just reality, but that they avoid having it negatively impact the children as often as possible. They don't run away from their child to work happy they've escaped and relieved that someone else is raising their child. As Deco pointed out: that's breeding, not parenting. A good working parent, IMO, does what November posted about doing-- takes pride in their work but understands how it impacts their children and makes certain to spend time with their kids and makes sure it's quality time. Because they value their children. It's about balance and I do understand that. And it's about finding the right balance FOR YOU. But it's a HECK of a lot easier later on in your career than it is at the beginning because, as you stated, the entire industry of law isn't geared toward allowing that balance to either parent: mom or dad.

If I didn't make that clear before, thank you Sillyberry and Circe for asking me to clarify.

 

[charbie]

I'm just going to add this.
As a new parent, you have to be prepared for ANYTHING and EVERYTHING. You may have everything "planned" perfectly, that you'll work thesem hours, DH will work these other hours, babysitter will be there other hours, but even the best plans will probably have wrenches thrown in. And you'll want to have flexibility in that plan, whatever you decide.
I feel so lucky to work in a position that allows me time off to be with my child as she needs me. She was born with a heart defect that required open heart surgery at only 3.5 months. Granted, this isn't the norm, but I needed to take off an extra 6 weeks after I already had my initial maternity leave when she was born. She also has many other doctor's appointments for other health concerns.

The thought that my child may have special health needs never once crossed my mind when I was pregnant. In fact, until she was 2 days old, I had no idea what we were in for. And then after her surgery, we found out there would be a lot more follow up needed for the rest of her life. I am eternally grateful for the opportunity to be at every appointment, and when she needs therapy, ill be able to attend those sessions as well. Life has changed 100% from what I imagined. Even from what I imagined life as a working mom would be like- my kid had other plans and I simply cannot have the traditional working mom role I planned before her birth even if I wanted to because her health comes first.

 

[sillyberry]

I still don't understand where MSC ever stated something like the following:

They don't run away from their child to work happy they've escaped and relieved that someone else is raising their child. As Deco pointed out: that's breeding, not parenting.

Have her words been wildly naive about the realities of working parenthood? I think yes (sorry, MSC -- I don't want to jump on the pile, but I think that's true). But I'm not seeing the malicious intent you are in what she's said. I think she wants to make it all work, and has been smacked around enough here over the past 24 hours to say "uhh..." about what she thought feasible, both professionally and personally. At least I hope that's the case.

At any rate, the other night I was having drinks with three women with kids -- all three work. One of them said "I love my [18-month old] son more than anything, but that doesn't mean I'm not happy to say 'bye-bye sweetie, have fun at daycare!' as I head off to work." It never occurred to me to think she was a bad parent.

 

[decodelighted]

Right now, I can't say I find the idea of letting my MIL and nannies and daycare providers have a big role in the child's upbringing too terrible an idea, particularly after I've spent 10 months home with the baby. But then, that's what my childhood looked like, so maybe it's just a lack of exposure to other ways of raising a family.

I think this is the quote that made Gypsy think MSC is, *even at this early point*, already thinking of "running for the hills" after a full-time taste of motherhood.

 

[sillyberry]

Right now, I can't say I find the idea of letting my MIL and nannies and daycare providers have a big role in the child's upbringing too terrible an idea, particularly after I've spent 10 months home with the baby. But then, that's what my childhood looked like, so maybe it's just a lack of exposure to other ways of raising a family.

I think this is the quote that made Gypsy think MSC is, *even at this early point*, already thinking of "running for the hills" after a full-time taste of motherhood.

Fair enough. I read it as "I will have had 10 months of bonding time, so going to work won't be too terrible for my child." Obviously those different interpretations will color our views.

 

[Gypsy]

Sillyberry, I've given you the benefit of the doubt but it's clear you are not interested in affording me the same. You last post was just plain ridiculous and I can only think that you WANT to start a fight. I don't want that, I respect this topic too much to turn it into mud flinging. So I'm done wasting my time explaining myself to you.


MissStepcut, I don't want to see you or your husband resenting your child for the sacrifices you might have to make in your career goals/plans to accommodate him/her in your life and to give them everything they deserve. I imagine it's so hard to plan your life daily and having to only answer to yourself and your partner, and all the sudden have this helpless being dependent on you with a 'voice' in your life even though you can't see or hear them and even though they didn't even exist for you until a few days ago. Please remember, that your child is not choosing to be born. YOU both chose to have sex and YOU both are choosing to have him/or her so any sacrifices you have to make are results of your decision and are your responsibility, not the child's. I also get the sense that you think that if you are smart enough you can make this work somehow. It's not a matter of being smart enough or a question of control. It just is what it is and you can't out smart or out control it. And I think that unless you are both honest about your reasons for having this child, and honest about what you expect from yourselves as parents AND from each other as partners you and/or the child are going to be in for a world of hurt. I wish you all the very best though.

 

[sillyberry]

Huh? I...okay. This discussion clearly wasn't going anywhere to help MSC, anyway, which was the point of the thread.

Miss StepCut, I'm sure you have many resources at school, but I'm not hard to track down elsewhere if you want to talk at all about being a first year associate.

 

[MissStepcut]

I also get the sense that you think that if you are smart enough you can make this work somehow.

that is the second time you have unjustifiably put words in my mouth. Why are you doing that?

 

[Gypsy]

I also get the sense that you think that if you are smart enough you can make this work somehow.

that is the second time you have unjustifiably put words in my mouth. Why are you doing that?

It's my overall impression from your comments about having worked in demanding careers before and being in your late 20's. If you say that it is an incorrect impression... well, you would know wouldn't you? I'm sorry. I'm bow out of this thread.

 

[Mara]

Find a compromise that results in you guys living together and raising your child. No one ever dies wishing they had spent more time at work and less time with family.

well said amc.

I'll thritto this. And ditto the other ladies who have already said that you won't know how your life will change until things have already changed. I've been lucky enough to modify my schedule so that I can spend more time with my son than I would in an otherwise very competitive environment. This means I work more at night after he goes to bed, but I wanted more than 2 hours a day with him and I got it. I never wanted to look back on this experience, and ever feel like either of us 'missed out' because I was working too much. It's something I think about all the time and I often try to do gut-checks to make sure that it's not getting out of wack. I really hope you can work something out.

 

[distracts]

I am glad to see you and your S/O talked and realize you need to make changes to your plans. Honestly, I'm not that fussed about the kid growing up taken care of by other people. It'll turn out fine, as long as its caretakers are fairly steady so that it CAN get a sense that people love it no matter what.

The two things I'm worried about are these:

1. That you may not fully understand the biological THINGS that happen to you to make you gaga over your child. That you have a ten month time at home with it (which I saw that you clarified but wasn't clear from your first several posts) makes me feel MUCH better. That will also give you a cushion of time to adjust work plans if necessary, and by the time you go to work after taking the bar, you should be mostly over the most intense part of wanting to be with your child. Still, if you have friends who have kids, you should talk to them about the urge they felt to be with their child. I have lots of friends who are successful professionals who were taken aback by the sheer animality of their feelings - people who had time off but would be wracked with grief and sob at the thought of leaving their child alone to go to a seminar or dinner party for several hours. Most of my friends said this SUPER EXTREME bit lasted six months to a year and then after that they desperately wanted to start spending parts of their day without the kiddo and so were eager to go back to work (though I don't think any of them have the kind of schedule you will have). I think ten months is plenty of time off, but I just want you to think further on those feelings so you're as prepared as you can be for them.

2. The thing I am most worried about is your relationship with your spouse. I just... I have seen enough relationships that are long distance fail, and enough relationships between two people with intense jobs fail, that I can't see how you living in a different city with your baby while your partner continues his life baby-free in another city, rarely seeing you guys, will be successful. Not a single person so far has mentioned that you guys might be setting your relationship up to fail. I'm not saying it's necessarily headed for a mistress-in-the-city kind of situation, but living in separate cities while both having crazy work schedules AND a baby seems like a situation specifically designed to maximize resentment. I think that is the number one thing you need to work on.

(I will also say that because of the way you're wording your posts, I have been picking up on the same "ah! I am popping out a kid and then abandoning it to nannies, hurrah!" sort of vibe other people are. I don't think that's what you're intending to say, and multiple reads and your subsequent clarifications have helped, but I do see why people are responding as if that's what you're saying.)

 

[mlk]

Miss Stecut, I am not a mother, but I am a lawyer and am currently TTC. I am located in Sydney, so things may be a little different here, but I work in a mid tier firm, so my hours generally range from 8-6 with the occasional long night/early morning or weekend work. My husband also works similar hours (not in law) but has a longer commute (up to an hour). Even with those relatively short hours, we are both exhausted. Taking your child out of the picture for a minute, what is living in seperate cities/working 100 hour weeks going to mean for your relationship?

One perspective I am going to offer is that you cannot depend on your MIL to be the life saver. My mother was a stay at home mum, she never worked after the day she got married. She was very against childcare and was adamant that when the time came for me to have children, that thos children would never go into day care, that she would look after them everyday I would be at work. Well, that plan did not work out, my mother died when I was in my late 20's so am faced with the question of whether I work full time, part time or SAH when I am blessed to have a child. Like I said, things can change in the blink of an eye. My world did (and not just the fact that my mother would've looked after a child, but losing a parent (2 in my case) and wathcing them suffer for months in hospital was very hard while being a lawyer, my firm even made me take a day of annual leave for my mother's funeral as I was only allowed 2 days and her funeral was on the third day. Those type of people are who you are dealing with in a law firm, especially big law.

I grew up only ever wanting to be a lawyer, I would now give it away in a second. Until you and your SO get into a law firm, you have no idea what you will both be in for, so I would encourage you to consider your options and look into a smaller firm. I have worked in a small firm and a medium sized firm and can tell you I have so much more hands on experience thatn any of my counterparts in big law.

Wishing you and your SO all the best in whatever decision you come to, just make sure that you live in the same house together, I cannot imagine what living in seperate citieis would do to your relationship and your child's relationship with the absent parent.

 

[PrincessCath]

MissStepCut, congratulations!

I had been working at big firms for a few years before my son was born. The only solution with the hours you have to keep in such places to reach your billables (2,000 a minimum, 2,200 preferred) was for me to hire a live-in nanny. No daycare in my area (LA) was going to stay open until 10 pm and on week-ends, and I had no family close by to help. After a while, I realized that my son would be raised by the nanny, with occasional glimpses at me.

So I opened my own practice, with shared office space, and found a decent preschool. I was able to bring my toddler to the office whenever needed, where he became great friends with my lovely receptionist and learned which secretaries stocked the best candy. He even learned to greet clients. No more live-in nanny, and we got to spend our evenings and week-ends together at home, even when I had to work. This is life...

Fast forward: the ex-toddler is ready to enter college. But he is still friends with my receptionist...

So I don't want to sound like a downer, but, based on my experience, motherhood and work in a big firm don't mix. Motherhood and the practice of law in other settings work perfectly well, though.

 

[Enerchi]

I can't offer you any experience juggling a law career and children, as I'm an RN, but I am a mom. We moved 5 hours away from family and friends while I was pregnant with #2. We had no jobs, no friends, no family in the area. I was going to be a high risk delivery for #2 due to the bad events of #1. We had only bought a house in a city we knew not much about. (OMG - how STUPIDLY crazy were we back then???? ) Just saying that as background for being alone, but my DH was there with me.

Jobs eventually fell into place and we then had 2 little boys at that point (1 of which was a high demand/non stop devil that we were 'fired' from babysitters over!) and I worked PT. We needed the extra income and I wanted to be as much of a SAHM as possible. Nursing had the flexibility to go part time, so I was lucky.

But now, along with our daughter, they are all grown up (23, 21 and 1 and I REGRET soooo much the times that I was not there for them. I missed some things, not all and I feel like I let them down by not being there at night to read a story or tuck them in or go to school events or field trips etc, but I just wish I'd had MORE time with them. They are little for so short a time. You WILL be hormonal, you WILL resent someone else caring for them and how they respond to that other person, you WILL feel guilty about moving forward with your career/schooling, you WILL get resentful of your boyfriend living what you will perceive as a carefree life in NYC while you are here with baby/school/internship/FMIL.... Not trying to be nasty at all, just putting an "old mom's spin" on things. It is hard. We all make choices in life and have no idea if they will be the right ones or not. Everyone has 20/20 hindsight! There isn't a soul on the planet that probably hasn't said at some point ' woulda/shoulda/coulda' done something differently.

You say you are 5 days into discovering this pregnancy, and you are personally searching for answers. I hope you find what works for you. I will now face the controversial stoning of my life on PS... and speak what has only been alluded to by others above... but.... what if you did not continue with this pregnancy? You are an intelligent woman with goals that seem very high pressure (to observers). Advice seems to be that it CAN be done but at a price. Other advice seems to be to wait for a family. Would that be worth considering in this case? Only YOU can make that decision because, no matter what modern conveniences and supposed 'support systems' are out there, YOU are the main #1 sole provider for this little one from conception thru to the first few months (and if you are breast feeding - even longer) so others may say they will be there, but the bulk of care is mainly "mother driven" for the first while and it has to be a decision you can live with - no matter what direction you go with this pregnancy.

I only wish the best for you MSC. It is a bit daunting when you put it all down in words, isn't it? I only wish the decisions run smoothly for you and you come to the solution that works best. ((HUGS)) thru this challenging time.

 

[MakingTheGrade]

It sounds like the OP realizes the hours and big law thing likely aren't long term tenable things in addition to a two lawyer household. If that's the case, that the hours would be nutty for 3-4 years, then as long as it doesn't bother her, I don't think her child would suffer as long as there was a consistent and loving caretaker.

My dad didn't lay eyes on me until I was 3, my mom left me in the care of my aunt a few months after I was born. My parents were busy building a life in America and knew I'd be better taken care of if left in China with my family. After a few years they settled into jobs and felt like things were controlled and reliable enough to have me join them so I did. Neither parents were there for walking, talking, or those early firsts. But we had the rest of my life to bond and honestly I was terrifically close to them growing up since they were loving and present parents. And my spouse was adopted by his family around the same age and is very close to them. So if these crazy big law hours is a temporary thing in order to guarantee parental happiness and a good life for the family down the road, then I think it's reasonable to want. And there's a cultural norm aspect as well. Nobody batted an eyelash that my parents left me under my aunts care for three years without seeing me. It's not at all unusual for young time consuming babies to be primarily looked after by extended family while young parents build a solid career for a few years.

Personally I don't even remember that far back. As far as I know my parents were always around. The reason I'm not close to them currently has more to do with growing apart due to differing ideologies and clashing of personalities, and not to them not being there when I was learning to talk. I'm sure it was a hard choice for my parents to make, but I know they did it to provide me with the comfortable upbringing that I had, and after I arrived my parents had plenty of time for me and I never wanted for attention or affection.
In hindsight the decision bothered them more than it ended up bothering me since my parents sometimes regret missing those milestones. I was a happy kid though, and now a well adjusted successful adult.

My hubby is 29 and eager for kids, and I wouldn't be surprised if we had a baby during my residency. I'll need a loooot of help from family no doubt, but as my attendings like to say, there will likely never be a "perfect" time for a baby in a career woman's life. So if you're waiting for that, you might be waiting an awful long time and waving your second child off to college when you're in your fifties.

 

[missy]

<snip>

It sounds like the OP realizes the hours and big law thing likely aren't long term tenable things in addition to a two lawyer household. If that's the case, that the hours would be nutty for 3-4 years ,then as long as it doesn't bother her, I don't think her child would suffer as long as there was a consistent and loving caretaker.

I don't think this is the case if MSC is bent on being a high powered attorney in a big law firm. The hours are very demanding way past the first few years. In fact, the women I know who are high powered attorneys in top law firms and have a child(ren) have a stay at home dh..either the husband works at home or is a full stay at home dad. Just saying that it's not like pay your dues for 3 years and then you have it made.

I also want to share the perspective of the child having a stay at home mom. I feel very fortunate in that my sister and I had the luxury of having my mom home with us full time. She put her career on hold until my sister and I were off to college and while I know most do not have that option today it meant the world to us. It was a secure,safe, loving and warm environment having my mom there for us all the time. We had friends who were raised by nannies and there was a (big) difference in our childhood. Not going to go into details (unless asked to) but I was happy to be where we were and not where they were.


Having said that life is not cut and dry and sometimes we have less control over things than we would like but after reading through this thread I have to say that if you plan on having 2 high powered attorneys in the family something's got to give and that sounds like the child's upbringing will have to be compromised(not defining compromise as good or bad btw). I'm not saying that is good or bad it will just not be the same as if both parents were doing the majority of the parenting during the critical time period. After all, there are only 24 hours in a day and you need to use some of those hours to sleep and reboot. It's one thing to work full time (let's say for the purpose of this discussion 9-5) and quite another to work FULL TIME (read aiming for partner in big time law firm 60 hours plus a week). Compatible with raising children if both parents are doing this...well, I guess if by raising children you mean someone else is raising them. Again, I am not making judgments but just sharing from the perspective of the child. The song Cat's in the Cradle resonates with me in this discussion.

I'm also not saying that you cannot have a happy and secure childhood without a stay at home parent but just saying it won't be the same as having one of the parents there for a good part of the time. Again full time can vary wildly with working hours and I think it is way more doable if full time is not crazy big law firm partner track full time...

 

[NovemberBride]

Others have pointed out that you can't imagine your feelings for your baby yet. A normal mother has this feeling of being totally and completely in love with this amazing miracle! The thought of leaving a baby or child of any age for 12 hours a day is just incomprehensible to me. What about when the baby is sick and needs YOU? What about when they have a special program at pre-school...can you take off from biglaw to be there? Then they go to elementary school...can you go join your child for lunch and be there for parent/teacher meetings?

I am encouraged that you and your fiance are now seeing that you need to be located in the same city in order to have a family. But really, it sounds like from some of the posts on this thread that part-time in law is still a 12 hour day.

One thing I wasn't clear about...you said you'd be free for 10 months after the baby is born. Did you mean you'd be finished with school and not working at all for 10 months? That would certainly help for that period of time.

Wow DS - This is post is so judgmental. I sometimes/often am away for my daughter for 12 hours days when you factor in commute and work. Guess what - I am totally and completely in love with my amazing miracle. And I don't cry myself to sleep at the thought that I am away from her during the day. I am sorry that thought is "incomprehensible" to you, but it is indeed a fact. To answer your question, yes, when our daughter has a program at pre-school, either my husband or I are there. When she is sick, either her father, I, or on occasion my MIL stay home with her. We waited to have her until we were farther into our careers to allow for that flexibility. But there are very few 9-5 jobs these days, and even less that are professional jobs. Your post seems to suggest that any woman who continues one of these careers and by extension works a lot after they have their child can't possible love them the way you (and your DD do). That is simply wrong and insulting. Most of my friends are professionals (lawyers, doctors, engineers) and they are all amazing moms. Posts like yours are why there is so much friction between working and stay-at-home moms.

I think there is a vast difference between situations where both parents work full-time and the OPs original situation where they were going to be long-distance and both just starting out in their careers.