are you gonna watch the you know what tonight?

[JulieN]

I and my friends thought Biden killed Ryan. So embarrassing for a young man like Ryan who lies about his marathon time to be shown how its done by an older, alpha statesman!

I never watch more than about 10 minutes of debates because I find them really distasteful, but last night was riveted by Biden's skillful performance.

 

[zoebartlett]

I got home really late from work so I missed the first part of the debate. From what I saw, Biden did well. I think he did what his advisers wanted him to do (come off stronger than Obama). His demeanor didn't bother me but I can see how it could bother others.

ETA: He definitely could have been more respectful towards Ryan, but I guess I chalked it up to that's how he IS -- kind of rough around the edges. Not that that's right, but just how I saw it. If I go back and watch it from the beginning, I may amend my answer.

 

[AGBF]

Anyone who thinks that Ryan beat Biden wasn't listening. People should go back to listening to debates by radio so that they can actually hear what the debators are saying.

I felt that Mr. Ryan held up well for a young man under tremendous pressure, but folks...Joe Biden was not only a Senator all his life, he was Chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee! When he was asked why the US should intervene in Libya and not in Syria his answer was so quick and so detailed, it would have put any professor of Mideast Politics to shame. He could be the Mideast Policy advisor to Obama. He knows far more than Hillary Clinton about foreign policy because while she was a generalist throughout her career, he was a foreign policy expert.

Paul Ryan isn't stupid, but to say that he could or did compete with Joe Biden is ridiculous. And yes, Joe Biden should be coached on what to do about his facial expressions since the debates are televised. But Americans are terminally stupid. They should just shut their eyes and listen.

AGBF

 

[minousbijoux]

Anyone who thinks that Ryan beat Biden wasn't listening. People should go back to listening to debates by radio so that they can actually hear what the debators are saying.

I felt that Mr. Ryan held up well for a young man under tremendous pressure, but folks...Joe Biden was not only a Senator all his life, he was Chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee! When he was asked why the US should intervene in Libya and not in Syria his answer was so quick and so detailed, it would have put any professor of Mideast Politics to shame. He could be the Mideast Policy advisor to Obama. He knows far more than Hillary Clinton about foreign policy because while she was a generalist throughout her career, he was a foreign policy expert.

Paul Ryan isn't stupid, but to say that he could or did compete with Joe Biden is ridiculous. And yes, Joe Biden should be coached on what to do about his facial expressions since the debates are televised. But Americans are terminally stupid. They should just shut their eyes and listen.

AGBF

I don't disagree with anything you're saying, Deb, its just that I also believe our leaders should lead by example. Smirking and mugging to the camera? Really? That's what my teenagers do. I wish I had listened to it instead of watching it. Then I wouldn't have seen Biden behaving that way. But you're right about Ryan. He did a very good job for a first time debate, and definitely seemed to have the upper hand in terms of maturity level , but they must have told Biden to take no prisoners, so that's what he did. Ryan held his own and was a good example of professionalism.

 

[Dancing Fire]

don't listen to the liberal medias.. lets call it a draw..

 

[ClassyRocks]

Good post, CherryBlossom! I only watched 45 minutes of the debate before I gave in and went to bed. I was looking forward to it but as Kaleigh said, it was a snooze fest. I expected more from Obama. I'm an Obama supporter but it was frustrating to see him lay low and not jump all over Romney for the things he has said lately (the whole 47% fiasco, etc.). What was up with that?

I'm looking forward to the next debates though. Hopefully Obama can pull it together.

He was slow and tired, that's true BUT in many ways it could have been worse. I think Obama is just running out the clock now, the #s just look bad for Romney, he really has no solid way of winning. Obama could have made some gaffs and honestly if you think about it the domestic debate is the weakest area and Romney could have really hammered him on it. But I think overall he held his own although he didn't go after Romney very hard... true.

at this point i think the Obama team is overconfident. the race is closer than most people think,if Obama is re-elected he will become the second President in history to do so with an unemployment # above 8%.

DF,
I just read this thread, and I couldn't agree with you more!

Thank You

 

[Dancing Fire]

i got couple of my liberal friends on the hook for some ...they are scare now after watching Obama laid a big goose egg...

 

[Abril]

Reagan didn't make any excuses when he took over Carter's mess...he just got the job done.

LOL, really? please show me how he did that? was it with leaving us more in debt than Carter did or was it by deregulating Wall Street... which eventually got up with us and caused the 2008 financial crisis?

How exactly did Reagan get the job done? I hear a lot of folks on the right say this but they can't actually articulate it. Reagan oversaw one of the largest expansions of the federal government along with major deficit problems

the US economy goes in cycle no matter which party is in office,but we should be producing a lot more jobs at this point of the cycle. in 1981 when Reagan took office unemployment was over 10%,then in 1984 alone real economic growth boomed by 6.8%, the highest in 50 years. Nearly 20 million new jobs were created during the recovery, increasing U.S. civilian employment by almost 20%. Unemployment fell to 5.3% by 1989.

DF, reason for the economic cycle:
Republicans screw things up. Democrats fix them.
2-term Republican = bust (see George W. Bush)
2-term Democrat = boom (see Bill Clinton)

 

[Abril]

Better yet, why not just PS dust the economy?

 

[ksinger]

The thing that I find most amusing about this is, remember back before the Obama/Romney debate? The conspiracy/persecution-complex wing of a certain party was bleating loudly about how "the polls are SKEWED!!" Now that their boy is bringing up the rear, do you hear that? Nope. Nary a peep. Now the polls are MEANINGFUL and spot-on and we should all pay attention.

I guess all those evil conspiring supposedly liberal-leaning pollsters all had a massive change of heart, saw the light and started polling an entirely different group of people all of sudden.

 

[Sparklelu]

I agree if you listened you might have thought Biden won, that is if you could hear Ryan over the cackle& and other noises.
I think he was rude and disrespectful , but then that's a tactic both Biden and jay carney use, laugh and act bemused when faced with questions... The Saul Aulinksy rules for radicals

I and my friends thought Biden killed Ryan. So embarrassing for a young man like Ryan who lies about his marathon time to be shown how its done by an older, alpha statesman!

I never watch more than about 10 minutes of debates because I find them really distasteful, but last night was riveted by Biden's skillful performance.

Ryan "lied" about a marathon time? What say you about this?

This about Biden:
He then went on to say that he ''went to law school on a full academic scholarship - the only one in my class to have a full academic scholarship,'' Mr. Biden said. He also said that he ''ended up in the top half'' of his class and won a prize in an international moot court competition. In college, Mr. Biden said in the appearance, he was ''the outstanding student in the political science department'' and ''graduated with three degrees from college.'' Comments on Assertions

In his statement today, Mr. Biden, who attended the Syracuse College of Law and graduated 76th in a class of 85, acknowledged: ''I did not graduate in the top half of my class at law school and my recollection of this was inacurate.''

As for receiving three degrees, Mr. Biden said: ''I graduated from the University of Delaware with a double major in history and political science. My reference to degrees at the Claremont event was intended to refer to these majors - I said 'three' and should have said 'two.' '' Mr. Biden received a single B.A. in history and political science.

http://www.nytimes.com/1987/09/22/us...anted=2&src=pm

The scholarship was partial and need based!
I think lying about education is far more repugnant than lying about a race time.

 

[lulu]

Everyone seems to have forgotten about Joe Biden and the plagiarism.


http://www.nytimes.com/1987/09/18/us/biden-admits-plagiarism-in-school-but-says-it-was-not-malevolent.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm

 

[HollyS]

Everyone seems to have forgotten about Joe Biden and the plagiarism.


http://www.nytimes.com/1987/09/18/us/biden-admits-plagiarism-in-school-but-says-it-was-not-malevolent.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm

I haven't forgotten.


There is no excuse for Biden's behavior during this debate. NONE. Because of his demeanor, he made a fool out of himself - again - and his boss - again.

He is, and always has been, in addition to being a "statesman of tenure", a jackass. Regardless of what he said. Regardless of whether he was right on anything he said. He came across as a jackass, and it will cost them.

I can't even begin to imagine pinning my hopes for this country on two smirking, laughing buffoons.

Geez. As if there were anything about our economic or foreign policies to be snarky or gleeful about. As if we weren't almost completey effed now.

Obviously, we just can't see the humor in our situation. Maybe we all need a snootful of laughing gas. Or we need to buy the world a Coke or something. We just need to lighten up already.

 

[Dancing Fire]

[quote="Abril|
DF, reason for the economic cycle:
Republicans screw things up. Democrats fix them.
2-term Republican = bust (see George W. Bush)
2-term Democrat = boom (see Bill Clinton)[/quote]


were you around during the Carter years?

 

[HollyS]

[quote="Abril|
DF, reason for the economic cycle:
Republicans screw things up. Democrats fix them.
2-term Republican = bust (see George W. Bush)
2-term Democrat = boom (see Bill Clinton)

were you around during the Carter years?[/quote]


I'm thinking they haven't been alive for very long.

Besides, DF, we all know it is Bush's fault. All of it. Every last dollar in current debt. Every stupid move we make in foreign policy. All of it. I say we tar and feather him. It's the least he deserves.

Kids today. They've got all the answers. We just need to consult them. That'll fix everything.

 

[Dancing Fire]

[quote="Abril|
DF, reason for the economic cycle:
Republicans screw things up. Democrats fix them.
2-term Republican = bust (see George W. Bush)
2-term Democrat = boom (see Bill Clinton)

were you around during the Carter years?

I'm thinking they haven't been alive for very long.

Besides, DF, we all know it is Bush's fault. All of it. Every last dollar in current debt. Every stupid move we make in foreign policy. All of it. I say we tar and feather him. It's the least he deserves.

Kids today. They've got all the answers. We just need to consult them. That'll fix everything. [/quote]


they'll know better when they get to our age..

 

[AGBF]

There is no excuse for Biden's behavior during this debate. NONE. Because of his demeanor, he made a fool out of himself - again - and his boss - again.

He is, and always has been, in addition to being a "statesman of tenure", a jackass. Regardless of what he said. Regardless of whether he was right on anything he said. He came across as a jackass, and it will cost them.

I can't even begin to imagine pinning my hopes for this country on two smirking, laughing buffoons.

...and, for another point of view (with which I happen to agree) see my good friend Maureen Dowd's column (link below).


"NOW you know what Thanksgiving with my family is like.

A donnybrook with Irish Catholic uncles and nephews interrupting one another, mocking one another, arguing over one another, bombastically denouncing every political opinion except their own as malarkey.

The loser of the vice-presidential debate was, of course, Barack Obama. In contrast to the pair on the undercard slugging it out, the president’s limp performance the other night was even more inexplicable and inexcusable. The president was no doubt warned not to sigh, but his entire demeanor was a sigh."


http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/14/opinion/sunday/dowd-an-irish-catholic-wake-up.html?ref=maureendowd

Deb/AGBF

 

[beebrisk]

But Americans are terminally stupid. They should just shut their eyes and listen.
AGBF

Hmmm....
Stupid? Really?

I wouldn't never call Americans stupid, but I will say it took a lot of them over 4 years to wake up to what's going on.

Somehow I managed to keep my eyes open AND listen (both senses work quite well simultaneously as they send their messages to the brain for critical analysis, thank you) and came to the conclusion that with his condescending manner and snark, Biden didn't really do his boss any favors.

But here's my bigger issue with the Joe Biden Show. Let's just imagine for a moment that it was Mitt Romney--or ANY other contender--sitting at one end of that table and Obama sitting in Ryan's seat. Had the Republican opponent sneered, snarked, rolled his eyes, addressed him as "my friend" and otherwise carried on in such Biden-esque fashion while embroiled in a debate with the current president, wouldn't that person have been portrayed in the media as the world's most despicable racist?? Not in a million years would behavior like that be tolerated. He would have been eviscerated on the spot and his political career would have come to a screeching halt that night. And rightly so.

But VP Veneers pretty much gets a pass because being wildly disrespectful and patronizing to a young, white, Republican man is apparently fair game. Just "politics", you know.

 

[justginger]

[quote="Abril|Kids today. They've got all the answers. We just need to consult them. That'll fix everything.

they'll know better when they get to our age..

Broad strokes. So youth = stupidity? Erroneous. Some people are born wise, while others are still ignorant at 100.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Reagan didn't make any excuses when he took over Carter's mess...he just got the job done.

LOL, really? please show me how he did that? was it with leaving us more in debt than Carter did or was it by deregulating Wall Street... which eventually got up with us and caused the 2008 financial crisis?

How exactly did Reagan get the job done? I hear a lot of folks on the right say this but they can't actually articulate it. Reagan oversaw one of the largest expansions of the federal government along with major deficit problems

the US economy goes in cycle no matter which party is in office,but we should be producing a lot more jobs at this point of the cycle. in 1981 when Reagan took office unemployment was over 10%,then in 1984 alone real economic growth boomed by 6.8%, the highest in 50 years. Nearly 20 million new jobs were created during the recovery, increasing U.S. civilian employment by almost 20%. Unemployment fell to 5.3% by 1989.

DF, reason for the economic cycle:
Republicans screw things up. Democrats fix them.
2-term Republican = bust (see George W. Bush)
2-term Democrat = boom (see Bill Clinton)

1 term Democrat = bust (see Barack Obama)
unemployment at 7.8% (closer to 13% here in Ca.)
added $6 trillion of extra debt.
gas prices near all time high.
more Americans are on food stamps than ever.

 

[HollyS]

Deb . . . Deb . . . Deb

No one should be a good friend of Maureen Dowd.

 

[HollyS]

[quote="Abril|Kids today. They've got all the answers. We just need to consult them. That'll fix everything.

they'll know better when they get to our age..

Broad strokes. So youth = stupidity? Erroneous. Some people are born wise, while others are still ignorant at 100.

The young also cannot take good natured teasing.

 

[AGBF]

Deb . . . Deb . . . Deb

No one should be a good friend of Maureen Dowd.

Hi, Holly. It feels like 2008 to me, Holly. Glad to see you, Holly!


Hugs,
Deb

 

[HollyS]

Deb,

Just to be crystal clear:

No matter which side of the fence I happen to park my hiney, I do not want to see - - FROM ANYONE -- mocking, laughing, sneering, snarking. Not when the issues are so bad. Not when we are fighting to stay afloat.

And this opinion goes back to Reagan and his "There you go, again!" mantra in 1980.

I don't think that's too much to ask of our candidates and elected officials. What we are engaged in, in our democratic society of a republic, when we choose and vote for our leaders, is supremely important; it is no laughing matter, and it damn sure is not a Comedy Central Roast of each other.

However, I know, in this day and time, civility is a thing of the past. Gone forever.

That's why I choose to ignore a huge chunk of the blah, blah, blah. Most of it isn't real facts, just snippets and snarkets of what "the other guy" is wrong about. Would that someone could actually be informed, run a clean race, and get his/her butt elected. Perhaps it is simply too much to ask for.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Deb . . . Deb . . . Deb

No one should be a good friend of Maureen Dowd.

Hi, Holly. It feels like 2008 to me, Holly. Glad to see you, Holly!


Hugs,
Deb

it feels more like 1980 to me (Reagan vs Carter) the liberals are getting nervous. ..

 

[AGBF]

Deb . . . Deb . . . Deb

No one should be a good friend of Maureen Dowd.

Hi, Holly. It feels like 2008 to me, Holly. Glad to see you, Holly!

it feels more like 1980 to me (Reagan vs Carter) the liberals are getting nervous. ..

I think you are being deliberately disingenuous, Dancing Fire. Obviously I meant that it felt warm and homey here on Pricescope-just like good ole 2008-what with Holly and and me being able to talk politicks. Thanks for the leeway you've given us, Ella and Andrey.

Deb, sworn political enemy and good friend of Holly

 

[lulu]

I was very impressed with the level of civility in the presidential debate!

 

[justginger]

[quote="Abril|Kids today. They've got all the answers. We just need to consult them. That'll fix everything.

they'll know better when they get to our age..

Broad strokes. So youth = stupidity? Erroneous. Some people are born wise, while others are still ignorant at 100.

The young also cannot take good natured teasing.

Well played. Though I am no longer as firmly rooted in the youth category as I once was. However I've not progressed to the 'old and jaded' category quite yet either...

 

[Dancing Fire]

round #2 tonight.Obama will come out swinging.

 

[Mayk]

round #2 tonight.Obama will come out swinging.

I hope Romney is swinging too for the fences baby...for the fences!!!