Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F up?

[Tekate]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

As a Jewish woman, I can tell you that this has sporadically happened on Temple walls and some people's houses way before Trump even declared his candidacy. Nothing new here.

A heavily populated Jewish area in my home state a few years ago had hate mail put in their mail boxes. It happened way before Trump, so they obviously did not need his candidacy to do it.

Bigots and racists did not start with Trump. They have always been here rearing their ugly heads.

Absolutely not on this level Ruby and this is a whole street.. The state of CT said hate crimes were up.

 

[katharath]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

Several posters asked how we know that racist and anti-Semitic incidents increased as Donald Trump began his run for the presidency. I can only say that there are several respectable groups that keep statistics on hate crimes. One of them is the Southern Poverty Law Center. I am posting a link to their most recent report (on 2015). It is sufficiently complex that it does not just come out and say, "hate crimes increased in 2015". It is a pretty sophisticated analysis of what is going on in this country. If one wants a simplistic analysis, he should look elsewhere. The Anti-Defamation League also keep track of hate crimes and The NAACP posts about incidents and about pending legislation that affects them. It is not impossible to track hate crimes.

Link...https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/intelligence-report/2016/year-hate-and-extremism

AGBF

Oops sorry Deb, was writing as you posted.

I am never sorry to see you posting, katharath. It always lifts my heart.

Deb

Thank you!!! Back 'atcha

 

[ruby59]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

Read my last post. I can only speak of my community and what I observe there.

I am Jewish. I wear a Star of David and a Chai around my neck. I can only speak for myself.

I personally have not seen an increase in my community or the areas I visit.

Sorry, ruby, but this made me laugh out loud.

Have you personally seen Budapest? How about Ecuador? Geneva? No?

Well I guess they don't exist either.

That's hilarious . . .

No, I have not been out of the US. And I do not follow those countries.

I guess I am not as well versed as many of you here.

But I do not pretend to be either. And that is why I am speaking of my experiences only.

As a Jewish woman do I feel less safe since Donald Trump became elected.

And the answer is No.

There have been no incidents at my Temple or with the people worshiping there.

But does anyone think something bad should happen to prove your point?

Some of you sound like some of the MSNBC reporters asking about the first Trump visit to the White House. Even after it was announced that it was gracious some asked over and over again disappointed that it was.

If some of you want a large disaster to happen to prove your point that the Deplorables screwed up. Go right ahead.

My blood pressure and I prefer to remain optimistic.

 

[sstephensid]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

Read my last post. I can only speak of my community and what I observe there.

I am Jewish. I wear a Star of David and a Chai around my neck. I can only speak for myself.

I personally have not seen an increase in my community or the areas I visit.

Sorry, ruby, but this made me laugh out loud.

Have you personally seen Budapest? How about Ecuador? Geneva? No?

Well I guess they don't exist either.

That's hilarious . . .

No, I have not been out of the US. And I do not follow those countries.

I guess I am not as well versed as many of you here.

But I do not pretend to be either. And that is why I am speaking of my experiences only.

As a Jewish woman do I feel less safe since Donald Trump became elected.

And the answer is No.

There have been no incidents at my Temple or with the people worshiping there.

But does anyone think something bad should happen to prove your point?

Some of you sound like some of the MSNBC reporters asking about the first Trump visit to the White House. Even after it was announced that it was gracious some asked over and over again disappointed that it was.

If some of you want a large disaster to happen to prove your point that the Deplorables screwed up. Go right ahead.

My blood pressure and I prefer to remain optimistic.

How did you jump from crimes have increased to we all want a large disaster to happen to prove our point?

Why do you ignore proof right before your eyes?

For the record I'm glad you haven't experienced violence. It doesn't mean no one else has. I don't seem to recall DJT targeting Jewish people, but it doesn't mean his supporters won't. It seems as Muslims and Mexicans first and foremost and "the blacks living in inner cities" were stereotyped. But sure if you weren't targeted I'm sure the rest of the u.s is safe and sound.

 

[kenny]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

I can only speak of my community and what I observe there.

I am Jewish. I wear a Star of David and a Chai around my neck. I can only speak for myself.

I personally have not seen an increase in my community or the areas I visit.

So you must also deny that WWII happend, WWI, Mt. St. Hellens erupted, 9/11.

You didn't see it, so it didn't happen.
Nice.

 

[Ellen]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

Ruby, thank you (sincerely) for using the quote feature when you are responding to someone. It really does make it much easier to read and follow.

 

[ruby59]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

I can only speak of my community and what I observe there.

I am Jewish. I wear a Star of David and a Chai around my neck. I can only speak for myself.

I personally have not seen an increase in my community or the areas I visit.

So you must also deny that WWII happend, WWI, Mt. St. Hellens erupted, 9/11.

You didn't see it, so it didn't happen.
Nice.

the Holocaust?

 

[ruby59]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

Ruby, thank you (sincerely) for using the quote feature when you are responding to someone. It really does make it much easier to read and follow.

That is the standard for the other message board I frequent. And when it gets heated, sometimes I use the other way by default.

But I am trying to remember.

 

[OreoRosies86]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

Sadly, this is what we've seen before. Trump wants to stop and frisk, soon he will want Muslims to identify as being Muslim on their clothing. He will want black citizens to have a curfew. Oh it's only the beginning.

 

[Bonfire]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

I can only speak of my community and what I observe there.

I am Jewish. I wear a Star of David and a Chai around my neck. I can only speak for myself.

I personally have not seen an increase in my community or the areas I visit.

So you must also deny that WWII happend, WWI, Mt. St. Hellens erupted, 9/11.

You didn't see it, so it didn't happen.
Nice.

Why are you twisting the meaning of her words? She's not denying, she's only stating what she has personally observed In her community.
This behavior is not making your case. Why don't you hop over to Gypsy's Gofundme and help her out? Maybe that would be the positive action that would make you feel better. If you already did...

 

[ruby59]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

From my home state -

Some snots at Brown University took a bunch of US flags for Veterans Day and tore and broke them and threw them in the garbage?

Why?

 

[lovedogs]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

I can only speak of my community and what I observe there.

I am Jewish. I wear a Star of David and a Chai around my neck. I can only speak for myself.

I personally have not seen an increase in my community or the areas I visit.

So you must also deny that WWII happend, WWI, Mt. St. Hellens erupted, 9/11.

You didn't see it, so it didn't happen.
Nice.

Why are you twisting the meaning of her words? She's not denying, she's only stating what she has personally observed In her community.
This behavior is not making your case. Why don't you hop over to Gypsy's Gofundme and help her out? Maybe that would be the positive action that would make you feel better. If you already did...

I think my problem with what she is saying is that she tends to act as though her feeling afraid in her community because of protesters somehow "balances out" the fact that DJT literally just appointed a white supremacist to serve on his cabinet. And then when we talk about an increase in racist/hate crime behavior since DJT she is quick to say that she doesn't see it. I'm not invalidating that she has not PERSONALLY seen it, but saying "I haven't seen it in my town at my temple" doesn't prove that it doesn't exist. I just find it narrow minded and silly. I also have not personally seen hate crimes in my town in southern CA, but that doesn't mean they don't exist, or that I'm not really upset by the other reports of them happening in less tolerant places.

 

[OreoRosies86]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

I just have no idea what months and months of saying "Well that never happened to me/I don't do those things/I don't see those things" adds to the discussion during a time of uncertainty. Just because you might not be experiencing it doesn't make it not so. It's like when we say "Oh man all these terrible things are happening to the black community" and one person rolls in with an anecdote about how a white guy got beat up too. Start a thread called Injustices Done to White People, but it adds nothing to the discussion at hand, a very serious conversation we all need to be having considering Bannon's appointment.

 

[kenny]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

I just have no idea what months and months of saying "Well that never happened to me/I don't do those things/I don't see those things" adds to the discussion during a time of uncertainty. Just because you might not be experiencing it doesn't make it not so. It's like when we say "Oh man all these terrible things are happening to the black community" and one person rolls in with an anecdote about how a white guy got beat up too. Start a thread called Injustices Done to White People, but it adds nothing to the discussion at hand, a very serious conversation we all need to be having considering Bannon's appointment.

It's broken thinking, and broken 'arguing'.
When wrong some people feel they just have to say something ... anything to defend an indefensible position.

There's no point continuing a discussion with such a person.
No point.

 

[azstonie]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

I subscribe to my local Phoenix paper (awful), The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, Atlantic, The New Yorker, and all the chick rags like Town & Country, W, Vogue, etc. I do this because I love good prose and I GET MY NEWS FROM MULTIPLE SOURCES rather than one account. If I were Jewish, I'd sure as he## be reading what's going on around the world to other Jewish people because Evil Starts Out Small and it usually piggybacks in on whining about jobs/economy/money (hello post WWI Germany).

 

[Bonfire]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

I can only speak of my community and what I observe there.

I am Jewish. I wear a Star of David and a Chai around my neck. I can only speak for myself.

I personally have not seen an increase in my community or the areas I visit.

So you must also deny that WWII happend, WWI, Mt. St. Hellens erupted, 9/11.

You didn't see it, so it didn't happen.
Nice.

Why are you twisting the meaning of her words? She's not denying, she's only stating what she has personally observed In her community.
This behavior is not making your case. Why don't you hop over to Gypsy's Gofundme and help her out? Maybe that would be the positive action that would make you feel better. If you already did...

I think my problem with what she is saying is that she tends to act as though her feeling afraid in her community because of protesters somehow "balances out" the fact that DJT literally just appointed a white supremacist to serve on his cabinet. And then when we talk about an increase in racist/hate crime behavior since DJT she is quick to say that she doesn't see it. I'm not invalidating that she has not PERSONALLY seen it, but saying "I haven't seen it in my town at my temple" doesn't prove that it doesn't exist. I just find it narrow minded and silly. I also have not personally seen hate crimes in my town in southern CA, but that doesn't mean they don't exist, or that I'm not really upset by the other reports of them happening in less tolerant places.

Thank you for explaining your thought process lovesdogs. I think judgement is coming down awfully harshly on ruby, who wanted to share her personal experience as a Jewish woman who has experienced hate crimes in her community. She prefaced her comments stating only what is going on in her community. There is so much "reading into" and "twisting" words. Seriously, accusing a Jewish woman that she must think the holocaust didn't happen is extremely incendiary.

 

[lovedogs]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

I just have no idea what months and months of saying "Well that never happened to me/I don't do those things/I don't see those things" adds to the discussion during a time of uncertainty. Just because you might not be experiencing it doesn't make it not so. It's like when we say "Oh man all these terrible things are happening to the black community" and one person rolls in with an anecdote about how a white guy got beat up too. Start a thread called Injustices Done to White People, but it adds nothing to the discussion at hand, a very serious conversation we all need to be having considering Bannon's appointment.

It's broken thinking, and broken 'arguing'.
When wrong some people feel they just have to say something ... anything to defend an indefensible position.

There's no point continuing a discussion with such a person.
No point.

Which is why I used the phrase "troll-ish" yesterday. But I can't stop myself from responding because it's just too ridiculous.

 

[lovedogs]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

I can only speak of my community and what I observe there.

I am Jewish. I wear a Star of David and a Chai around my neck. I can only speak for myself.

I personally have not seen an increase in my community or the areas I visit.

So you must also deny that WWII happend, WWI, Mt. St. Hellens erupted, 9/11.

You didn't see it, so it didn't happen.
Nice.

Why are you twisting the meaning of her words? She's not denying, she's only stating what she has personally observed In her community.
This behavior is not making your case. Why don't you hop over to Gypsy's Gofundme and help her out? Maybe that would be the positive action that would make you feel better. If you already did...

I think my problem with what she is saying is that she tends to act as though her feeling afraid in her community because of protesters somehow "balances out" the fact that DJT literally just appointed a white supremacist to serve on his cabinet. And then when we talk about an increase in racist/hate crime behavior since DJT she is quick to say that she doesn't see it. I'm not invalidating that she has not PERSONALLY seen it, but saying "I haven't seen it in my town at my temple" doesn't prove that it doesn't exist. I just find it narrow minded and silly. I also have not personally seen hate crimes in my town in southern CA, but that doesn't mean they don't exist, or that I'm not really upset by the other reports of them happening in less tolerant places.

Thank you for explaining your thought process lovesdogs. I think judgement is coming down awfully harshly on ruby, who wanted to share her personal experience as a Jewish woman who has experienced hate crimes in her community. She prefaced her comments stating only what is going on in her community. There is so much "reading into" and "twisting" words. Seriously, accusing a Jewish woman that she must think the holocaust didn't happen is extremely incendiary.

I might be acting more harshly than I realize because tempers (including my own) are running high. I just get really frustrated with that logic of "well it's not happening to me.....", especially when there are threads that have nothing to do with any one person's experience but rather are talking about disheartening happenings overall. But yes, I would agree that accusing a Jewish woman of thinking that holocaust didn't happen is unkind.

 

[Bonfire]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

I can only speak of my community and what I observe there.

I am Jewish. I wear a Star of David and a Chai around my neck. I can only speak for myself.

I personally have not seen an increase in my community or the areas I visit.

So you must also deny that WWII happend, WWI, Mt. St. Hellens erupted, 9/11.

You didn't see it, so it didn't happen.
Nice.

Why are you twisting the meaning of her words? She's not denying, she's only stating what she has personally observed In her community.
This behavior is not making your case. Why don't you hop over to Gypsy's Gofundme and help her out? Maybe that would be the positive action that would make you feel better. If you already did...

I think my problem with what she is saying is that she tends to act as though her feeling afraid in her community because of protesters somehow "balances out" the fact that DJT literally just appointed a white supremacist to serve on his cabinet. And then when we talk about an increase in racist/hate crime behavior since DJT she is quick to say that she doesn't see it. I'm not invalidating that she has not PERSONALLY seen it, but saying "I haven't seen it in my town at my temple" doesn't prove that it doesn't exist. I just find it narrow minded and silly. I also have not personally seen hate crimes in my town in southern CA, but that doesn't mean they don't exist, or that I'm not really upset by the other reports of them happening in less tolerant places.

Thank you for explaining your thought process lovesdogs. I think judgement is coming down awfully harshly on ruby, who wanted to share her personal experience as a Jewish woman who has experienced hate crimes in her community. She prefaced her comments stating only what is going on in her community. There is so much "reading into" and "twisting" words. Seriously, accusing a Jewish woman that she must think the holocaust didn't happen is extremely incendiary.

I might be acting more harshly than I realize because tempers (including my own) are running high. I just get really frustrated with that logic of "well it's not happening to me.....", especially when there are threads that have nothing to do with any one person's experience but rather are talking about disheartening happenings overall. But yes, I would agree that accusing a Jewish woman of thinking that holocaust didn't happen is unkind.

HUGS!

 

[LLJsmom]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

I subscribe to my local Phoenix paper (awful), The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, Atlantic, The New Yorker, and all the chick rags like Town & Country, W, Vogue, etc. I do this because I love good prose and I GET MY NEWS FROM MULTIPLE SOURCES rather than one account. If I were Jewish, I'd sure as he## be reading what's going on around the world to other Jewish people because Evil Starts Out Small and it usually piggybacks in on whining about jobs/economy/money (hello post WWI Germany).

AZ, that is smart to read from so many different sources. Excellent plan.

My family just recently saw a local theater production of The Diary of Anne Frank, and it was a humbling reminder and experience.

Kenny, I don't feel like giving up. I'm just going to channel my energy and resources where I feel I can make a bigger difference. I understand how you feel though.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

We need a Chinese Prez.!...

 

[AGBF]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

My family just recently saw a local theater production of The Diary of Anne Frank, and it was a humbling reminder and experience.

My father's aide and I watch movies together perhaps three or four nights a week. We have seen his favorites that I had previously refused to see ("Sybil", "Flowers in the Attic", "Imitation of Life", "Whatever Happened to Baby Jane?") and favorites of mine that he had never seen ("Bringing Up Baby", "My Favorite Wife", "Watch on the Rhine"). We watched "Selma" together and "Milk" (I did not mention that my friend is black and gay, but he is. "Milk" is about San Francisco's first openly gay councilman.) We have also seen a number of films on World War II and the Jews. We saw "Schindler's List", which I had never seen, and one of my favorites about resistance, the true story, "Defiance". A night or two ago we watched "Operation Thunderbolt". (We had already seen the Hollywood version of that story, "Raid on Entebbe".)

I need to an "Operation Thunderbolt" more than I need to see an "The Diary of Anne Frank" right now. The message is that the Jews were going to rescue the hostages being held by terrorists themselves because nobody else cared enough to do it. And the leader of the mission died. But all the hostages from all countries, of all religions, except three, were saved. True story.

My point is that Jews and other groups against whom a larger society discriminates need never be victims again.

 

[wetsawblade]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

I just don't have the energy to post/argue/battle much.

That 47% of US voters chose Trump after all he's said and done means there truly may be no hope for America.

The only light at the end of the tunnel that I see is Trump will, of course, fail to "Make America Great Again".
He just said all that shit to con gullible low-IQ people so he could get the ultimate ego-power-job.
It worked.

But in 4 years what the F will be left of America ... yea the world?

I don't think I'm being Debbie Downer.
I think I'm being accurate.

It's just all so depressing.

I'm someone who's been a lurker for years, registered a long time, but almost never posts because I reject a large internet presence for many personal reasons. But before this thread is locked, please accept my sincere thanks for your many forum contributions: thoughtful, thought-provoking, intelligent, heartfelt, beautiful, inspirational, and very humorous. You're a treasure to this site and America. I won't give up because of people like you: thanks again.

Gosh.
Thanks.

You really should post more.

[derail w/ apologies] Thanks, kenny, & u got me to log in again My problem is once I start commenting, I have a tough time shutting up, so would prob dox myself!

I'm also (selfishly) looking to help my kid buy an engagement diamond very soon, so hoping the wonderful ppl here will assist on RT [end]

That said, my small office has really been torn apart this past week, with some very long relationships perhaps irreparbly ruined. I'm the "good cop" of the office, but wow it has been tough to experience these deep divides and hold my personal opinions while trying to be impartial and keep the peace so that customers are comfortable.

And side note: DF, did I read it right (this or another thread) that you're from Davis, CA? Just so happens, I have a link to there and why I should slap my hand to stop myself from posting lol.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

And side note: DF, did I read it right (this or another thread) that you're from Davis, CA? Just so happens, I have a link to there and why I should slap my hand to stop myself from posting lol.

My grandfather own/ran a Chinese restaurant in Davis from 1958-1967.

 

[telephone89]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

I thought this was relevant.

 

[House Cat]

Re: Am I the only liberal who feels like just giving the F u

I thought this was relevant.

This is so perfect. Thank you